interesting, sounds plausible to me

You be suprised how much time I was spending on this.

Thank you for spending time on this! I mean, your logic is flawless, really. I'm so happy someone put this in writing. THANK YOU!

There's a part two of this: but its more like a neutral perspective.

i read that... i like this better lol

Personally I like this one better eventhough I was falling asleep on it. XD

That was just new ideas I didn't hear yet and a little rant about people claiming to be smart about hacking. XD

Okay, or until a DA mod goes public with JE's IP records up to the time of the incident, everything regarding the validity or motive of the alleged hack is mere speculation.

While I will acknowledge that the reasons listed may be reasons why someone would hack JE's DA, the reasons listed why the 'hack' was a hoax is just as valid, if not more valid considering I can point out reasons why the hacking looks fake, and you cannot point out very convincing reasons why the hacking was real.

Theory is something not proven yet untill it's true or not. I fully awair that the main person to really prove this is a DA mod. I also know that the hoax idea is valid as well, but like I said: this is a theory on this and the only time line I trust is the Wikifur talk feed of JE they had, so I based it off of wikifur and some on ED.

Also, by reading your journal, you clearly know nothing about IP addresses and 4chan.

What is with noobs and the belief that the IP address is the social security number of your online identity? Guess what; I have your IP address right now. Everyone does. The site, the users, everyone. You know what I can find out about you with it? NOTHING. Except the state you live in. ONLY the FBI or your ISP has the access to get any of your personal information from your IP address. I'm almost at a disbelief that you actually think that by using an IP scanner tool, you can hack someone's dA account. I know hackers; they all say that's not how hacking works. What they do is steal your password by tricking you into giving it to them, or by figuring out it was something stupid like "asdfghjkl", then with your email account, they change your password and access it. Your IP address has absolutely nothing to do with it, so please kindly slap yourself for coming to such a conclusion.

And finally, I know for a fact that you do not know 4chan, because anyone who regulars 4chan knows that 4chan cannot hack. Anyone. Ever. Their "raids' only consist of spamming, DDoS'ing by pinging the servers of sites or rapid-refreshing, and when they do ANYTHING, they brag about it like no tomorrow. You would have seen them bragging about it all over 4chan or ED. If you've seen anything on the internet, you know how that works.

You really didn't think any of this through. You think it was a hack because all of your reasons show that you simply don't know the basics of how the internet works, and you only go by over-droned myths about a site full of bullshitters and their once legendary past.

Dude, I never said your IP Address was a socail security thing. And from other comments here: 4chan apairently has hackers in their group.

And don't forget that the internet can easily lie as well.

Also, it wasn't "ED's IP scan". The info we got all came from the admin Arshes.

http://forums.furaffinity.net/threa.....-a-wet-weekend

Read up before guessing next time.

Like I said, "Theory".

Also anyone can LIE ON THE INTERNET. ED has enough power to do that. Also the other Wikis there are.

I love how you shoot down theories with your "Everyone on the internet can refuse to lie", but you refuse to think JE is lying despite the mountain of evidence against her, because again, "everyone can lie on the internet!"

Oh everyone except JE, I'm sure.

... *face palm*

You don't know the deffinition of Theory don't you?

And you don't know the definition of "ignoramous who is shooting down other peoples' theories with 'ANYONE CAN LIE ON THE INTERNET, ALL THE PROOF COULD BE FAKE' and defends her theories with ill-witted claims about things that, by the very nature they described the potential attacks, they've thusly proven that they don't know squat about how what they're claiming to know, works"?

Give it a rest already. This is a theory and will be a theory untill I'm on the right track or you on the right track.

Alright, you know what? Fair enough. Let's just leave it at that. I'll even apologize for making a scene and for my crude nature about it. I'll just give it a rest and let you do what you do, then when one of us gets an obvious amount on the right track, I'll come right back here. Till then, I wish you a lovely evening and the best of luck in the future. I gather you'll really really need it in life.

Ok then. Good day to you too. Nvm the messages after this post you made. :)

Neither do you. Theories have some amount of proof. Your hypothesis does not.

That's why I have reference links at the begining, like every theory does. :3

Also Steven Hawking's evidence for the black hole seems not complete as well.

I've been doing some very deep and extensive digging of my own and while there is proof that she lied about who she was (and yes I've asked questions about Camerella and what she's said), there are so many other areas that are left blank which people seem to be filling in with nothing but assumptions that they give no proof to support. The hack occurred on July 9th. However, there was a huge spike in her pageviews the day before on July 8th, from the usual 2-3 thousand per day to over 18,000. Followed by 32,767 views per day for the next two days (both days show the exact same number of views...). Why the sudden, massive influx of viewers just the day before the account supposedly got hacked? This doesn't make sense.

Her formspring.me account is gone, I don't know how long this has been so since I didn't follow it. A majority of works done by her that were posted on Gelbooru have been deleted while all of them have been deleted from Danbooru. e621 remains completely untouched however.

People continue to argue that it wasn't 4chan or Anon because the journal posted on DA "got the motto wrong." However, looking around at places like urbandictionary, they apparently got the motto wrong too... Talking to one of my friends about it, he did a search for the motto and came across a forum that discussed a group of hackers (I can't remember what the name is) who appear to exhibit the style shown with JE's DA account - posting a few disturbing images, saying the motto backwards, and taking no credit for what they do. They also have someone who goes by Anonymous but it is not the same Anonymous that 4chan refers to. They like to target people they don't like or that other people don't like and they are usually very popular people too. Maybe someone else can remember what the name of this group is.

Speaking of groups, 4chan and just about everyone flaming JE seems to think that all hackers are part of the same group and all follow the same standards and procedures which is complete BS. A hacker does what they want, how they want. If they want to be associated with 4chan's version of Anon then by all means, but they don't have to comply with the so called Anonymous' rules of the internet to be part of Anonymous because so long as you lurk on the internet, you are pretty much ANONYMOUS - no name, no face. You can be whoever you want to be.

People say that she has given people porn pics in exchange for commissions. Where is the visual and/or documented proof by commissioners? People say that JE's IP traces to some guy in mexico. They say that JE's Paypal has the name of some Mexican on it. Again, where is the proof that goes beyond words? Also, how can they prove that the IP's location hasn't been made anonymous by the ISP? I've done traces of my IP before and seen it come up in a lot of places and it's always been somewhere other than where I actually live - other townships, counties, even in the middle of a field in the state of New York when I live in central Indiana. Sure some things that have been shown prove that she has lied (which I've also actually witnessed, but didn't take notice of until all the drama broke out) but that doesn't mean that everything is a lie and people seem to be using it as a reason to support the idea that everything is false.

Really, all I'm waiting for right now is to see if she pulls through on her promise to get all her commissions finished within 60 days. And I will know because she owes me 2 of them.

Well someone said that she'll explain evertthing within a week and so far she finished 8.

I'm sure she'll get to it soon. Don't worry :3

The proof is by an administrator on this website confirming it. Let's see here; you believe in what a user is saying, but you won't believe in what an admin says they found to be true through their IP records?

All I saw is a text quote on ED about that, no screens to visually prove that such a conversation took place between someone and said admin. Even more, they didn't say which admin it is. Why would they not cite the admin unless there was something to hide? It gives other people nothing to confirm.

The influx of views could be a simply chance occurrence or it could be a post on a forum somewhere that there was going to be a hack and to watch her page for it. No way to tell really what happened there. Also her forum spring account (both of them) haven't had her respond to anything in two months. Not sure if she just got tired of the questions, found that it was boring and moved to something else or couldn't deal with the distraction that it provided so stopped going. Really anyones guess until she says something about it.

There was a massive spike of page views before the hack because of a journal she posted, there was a LOT of conflict on that journal and it got 2k+ hits.

Also the reason you could have gotten a strange hit for your IP is if you were using a proxy without knowing or if you were taking it off a router. I think... I'm not -that- tech savy

er replace "hits" with comments.

It's possible that the proxys can do that.

No, that's not it, you would refresh the page on that journal and at least 5 new comments would pop up, there was no point in using proxy's when you stirred up 4.5 million page views worth of fans reading those comments constantly and refreshing to get more points of the story.

So we are dealing with an enterference here then.

What? no, no. She was LITERALLY getting that many page views per day, there was several hundred comments per day, and for every one comment there's usually at least 50 views (For deviant art that is). There WERE legitimately that many page views per day, no tom foolery, no lies, no hacks, no proxys, just a crap ton of people fighting in her comment box

Oh. I thought you talking about how the viewer's IP Addresses may affect then scan. Sorry for that. ^^;

Oh my god. I have to go get drunk now, you're unbelievably dense.

And why you sticking arround when you getting butthurt because I' defending a theory ans a theory.

I honestly don't know for sure anymore. I mean you just keep getting more and more ridiculous by the minute, I just want to see how far this craziness goes. I mean you've already reached the part where you tried "proving me wrong" by telling me I failed to think that DA had a part in it and didn't realize that we all have to wait for the DA admin to get back with IP records, even though that was the absolute first thing I posted in your journal.

Honestly, I think you're being a troll now. You've been acting this whole time just to make me go nuts, and it worked flawlessly.

This is why you should explain more carefully so people don't be trolling you for not explaining enough.

Oh no, the problem wasn't on my end. It was all there, I just didn't realize that unless I drag something out for a novel-and-a-half, you won't understand what I'm saying.

This is probably the best explanation I've heard and it's close to one that I've come up with on my own. Being a "hacker" (please note that I build firewalls as a side job which means that I have to know how to hack them to figure out weak points) it's not impossible to do what you described. The real question is if her login information for FA is that much different then the DA account or if it was a hacker form /b/ even thought of coming to FA to trash the account here.

Either way a nice way of showing that it might be just what it looks like, a pissed off customer or a /b/tard trashing a good artist.

OHO, you're a "hacker", are you? And you think an IP address gives you access to anything useful?

Try again.

Yes, it can. You can use an IP address to find your way to their computer if you are smart enough.

Try putting on the trollface first before you talk. :D

Prove to me that what you said right now isn't completely stupid. I want to see what logic you have behind trying to explain something you know nothing about.

Tracing someone's ISP will give you the location and ISP of the connection as well as information in regards to how to contact the ISP should the need arise. Knowing someone's ISP can let you do the following. If you have a mass of spybots at your disposal you can direct them to send torrents of junk data to that IP address for a Denial of Service attack which can effectively "take" the connection off the internet until you choose to stop it (or unless their router is set to not listen to pings from the WAN port). This is usually done against web hosts and not individual (home) connections though.

With someone's IP address you can manually connect to and "hack" into a poorly configured (or heaven forbid, completely insecured) router. If someone neglects to change the default passwords for most mainstream routers a hacker can look up the factory key off the manufacturer website and gain access to the router, where they are able to do as they please, ranging from blocking computers with certain MAC addresses from accessing the network, turning off the firewall, and even planting malware (yes, this is actually possible do not argue it) into the RAM of the router. The malware can be used to monitor and intercept all traffic (passwords, search habits, personal information, etc...) that passes through the router up until the point that the user figures out that something is wrong and performs a factory reset of the router (provided the router has a physical button that allows them to do this) which clears the RAM and thus, the malware. Sometimes these hacks are completely automated and most people don't even realize their router has been compromised, there are tens of thousands.

With someone's IP address you can direct probes/spikes at the network and take advantage of open ports in the router's firewall as well as the user's system firewall if they even have one. From there one can exploit vulnerabilities in the operating system's underlying code in order to gain partial or full access to certain parts of the system. This however, is very difficult to accomplish (but not impossible) especially if the user has both a physical and software firewall in place. Also in order to target a specific system on a network you would need to have the internal IP address of the system assigned by the router's DNS server (which is not the same as the external IP that everyone else sees). The internal IP usually remains the same based on how the network is set up and how often IP addresses are renewed. IP addresses can also change based on given factors like a system being wireless and getting assigned a different IP because another system got assigned it.

The most common method of hacking (which isn't really as hacking as the other methods) is simply spreading some infected media around the internet and waiting for some unsuspecting anon to contract it. From there it's whatever you programmed the bug to do. You can hold the owner's system hostage, you can remain under the radar and have it be another spybot machine used for DoS attacks against a site you don't like, you could have it spam them constantly with advertisements, or you could have it collect sensitive information from the user that would be used for malicious acts like identity theft.

Thanks for the agree. My mom was a hacker in her early life and I know some people did it with some problems, but manage to get through. I thought about this and notice key point's where a hacker can do damage since I took a comorsal computer repair class at my high school in junior year. :)

Did you take Computer Science III as well? I mean, if you did, then cat's out of the bag, you're definitely a pro hacker for sure, and I officially apologize to the mighty hacking prowess of you and your mom.

You are a troll and don't seem to get the meaning of the title here.

Awe jeese, I'm rather annoyed with having to continue to be an informant.

Ok, First off it happened in this order:

(skipping some stuff I don't know)
-JE had been posting her pictures around on different sites, including /b/ and /s/.
-JE posted article about having made false claims of identity, and said that she actually knew the model and they were on good terms.
-The model was contacted and said she didn't know a JE and was simply asked to do some stuff with sketches and signs that were signed JE.
-People start to dig up stuff about some of JE's past, mainly her lack of communications with commissions. Things were also theorized about her being someone who was completely different from what she said (namely a Mexican, Arden or even secretly the model)
-Drama continued to ensue in her journal for a couple days or so
-her account was "hacked"
-more stuff is coming out of the wood works showing that she might have quite a lot of commissions on backlog.

Information I've gathered: ED, /s/ and /b/ have all denied hacking her account, which goes against what they would normally do. The raid was, upon what I've heard, WAY to tame for 4chan or ED, missing many key pieces and getting the phrase "never forgive, never forget" wrong, not even newbies get that wrong. Point being: it doesn't LOOK like a raid by any of the suspects. I will admit, there WAS in fact a thread on /s/ about a raid on her account, but it was taken down promptly (10 post promptly) and most every single post on it was "don't care" or "not your personal army." ED would have posted goatse. /b/ didn't care. Also, along the lines of hackers, all of her DA artwork was put into storage, NOT DELETED, why would a hacker do that? Finally, why is all her other accounts untouched, only the account with all the drama happening on it was deleted.

Other people have been exclaiming that JE gave nude photographs in place of commission pieces. I haven't seen anyone come out and say that's what has happened to them (I've heard she gave private content to some people, but that's different) so I don't know if this is true or not.

I'm not trying to sound like I'm attacking JE, I would like to say this was stupid crap, but the logic in my mind is telling me this is all to close of a connection.

Theory time: It's been reported before that the only way to get commissions from JE moving is to post bad publicity about the long delay in your art. Trust me when I say that the thread attached to her journal on DA had a large amount of that. I'm going to say that I believe JE faked the hacking as a cop out to delete that bad publicity ASAP. There were 2k+ comments on that, to wade through and hide all the ones with bad publicity would look suspicious and take way more time than possible. And once people would start seeing comments being hidden about the commission info, more probably would have been posted. If she faked a hack she got several things, 1. a cop out of talking to people who know her only through DA (I've personally talked with several) 2. Sympathy 3. Redirect attention from her lack of speed on commissions to some other source.

Opposite theory time: A lot of people have been saying most everyone complaining about her is just butthurt because of her lying about her boobs. To some extent this could be true but I doubt it, simply because /b/, ED and /s/ have more boobs and entertainment than they know what to do with. The more viable explanation I could see was there were a TON of "it's ok *pat pat*" comments on her journal, which it wasn't because she took and posted someone else work without permission (though I assume she paid for it.)

There is some other information trying to connect her to Arden or some guy in Mexico, I find this info pointless and only useful to heap another lie onto the pile.

There's a whole bunch of other info out there, and right now I can't remember anything else that would make to big of a difference... I might later depending on the responses I get...

Also: I'm begging you not to delete or hide this, I'm simply stating what I've observed, my conclusions/theories and what others have said. so far JE's shout box has been deleted to be about one sided, and I think it'd be good to hear from the other side for people so they can make up their own mind. Finally: I'm waiting for her next journal to see what comes out of the wood works.

I'm not going to delete this.

Some this I didn't even know about and I thank you of giving me a counter reply than a bashing reply.

Since your point-of-view is impressive to me, but I have something little to tell you about hackers. My mom was a hacker, but she just did it to see if she can do it and if she can hack a government website, which she did.

Also, you have to think why a hacker is doing this or that. They may are creating a lie or just screwing arround. You never know. :3

Thanks again for being a good counter attack repersentative for the other side. :3

Cool story, my mom's an FBI agent and my dad's a ninja, but he did it just to see if he could assassinate the Taiwanese prime minister, and he did.

Dude, if there wasn't a possible hack here: This wouldn't be in existance for you to be simple minded and me an unprofessional doush bag.

Please tell me you have aspergers. I want a legitimate excuse for why you're so hair-brained.

I'm just pointing out possible hacks here and you don't seem to have taken science class because you seem to not understand what THEORY means.

I'm starting to think you are in of this mess we have now.

And I'm telling you that there ARE no possible hacks through your IP address, which is how you got to the whole "hacking theory" in the first place. I don't give a shit about what you say your mom could do, your lying won't make up for you being absolutely wrong about what you're saying. I mean honestly, are you just trying to get me to call your bluff, or do you ACTUALLY believe in the stuff you're saying? Quit lying about your mom being a hacker, quit lying about knowing about hacking, you're not fooling me and you're acting stupid. I honestly was going to give you some slack and say that 'if it WAS hacking, those could be reasons why, but definitely not how', but that was only beforeI realized you're an idiot who won't stop lying about knowing things you clearly don't know ANYTHING about. I'm simply dumbstruck by how badly you're pretending to know anything about hacking yet still try to convince others you're onto something. Jesus christ.

And you didn't think that DA has a role in this as well.

If a DA mod notices an IP Address that was unusual to JE's IP address, then the mexican thig is out of the window.

That was the FIRST thing I said in response to your journal, how the hell did you think I missed it? I was the one who said it!

You said how they possibly got it.

You said how they possibly got it.

"Okay, or until a DA mod goes public with JE's IP records up to the time of the incident, everything regarding the validity or motive of the alleged hack is mere speculation."

How is that explaining how they got it? Got what? I told you flat-out in plain english "Until an admin checks the IP records, we will not know whether or not it was a real hack, therefore this is all useless speculation". And then I told you that There is more proof of it being staged than it was being legitimately hacked, because until you check the IP records for a change in IP's at the time, you have no proof.

Ok, That is what Theory means: unproven.

If you got that on the first strike then you wouldn't be staying here.

I was just trying to show your flaws in your theory. Because if she really DID get hacked, the way you said she got hacked wouldn't be anywhere close to how it really happened.

Looks like you pretend as well. One thing about technology that you can't ignore is that if there is a way, someone will find it. And so long as it's not some government agency or large corporate conglomerate, there is no such thing as impossibility when it comes to hacking. And even then they themselves are still vulnerable. I shouldn't have to remind you that people HAVE hacked the Pentagon and Department of Defense before. And in order to hack something you need a destination, which is an IP address. It's the only way computers are able to communicate on the internet. It's how one system knows where to send information to another system. Given enough time, patience, and unchanging conditions an experienced hacker can get into any system connected to the internet. So really an IP address has a lot to do with hacking.

You're absolutely right. Terrorist organizations hack the pentagon all the time. People who have dedicated their lives to misusing technology for their own selfish reasons.

But pardon me for thinking that the people with the immense skills it would take to do the feats you described would rather do that to rob a bank or commit fraud, and not hack an art gallery in the least-damaging way possible but still have the decency to store her art rather than delete it all.

Not everyone is a hacker to the degree you described, and you don't persnally know anyone with that skill. Those people are being chased by the FBI for being cyber terrorists.

Or so the system wants you to think. Anyone who is against the current ever further corrupting system of government is considered a "terrorist" or "extremist" in the eyes of the government and they will abuse that to make the rest of the people turn against them. Think of it as that our forefathers were extremists and terrorists to England before we declared ourselves independent. And I can agree with the selfish reasons part of hacking, but knowing such things does have it's advantages...

I only stated what I did because you said "there ARE no possible hacks through your IP address". Which I just explained, isn't true.

As I stated in another post, hackers do what they want, how they want. Not everyone is out for money or to do as much damage as possible. I know humanity well enough to know how much people like to spite and get jealous of each other. It's our nature to have wicked hearts.

I have noticed what people have said about JE's deviations being put in storage (and I've seen it myself) and I am pending an inquiry to the DA help desk in regards to that specific detail. For now I still judge that there is a good lack of information on certain aspects of the matter. I haven't spent 15 hours scouring the internet for more information for nothing.

EXACTLY. A fucking raid from 4chan wouldn't have included someone putting all of her pics in storage and then posting a few meagre pictures from Google Image search. They would've deleted the entire fucking gallery and put up some of the craziest shit they could come up with on /b/. And then? Then they would've gloated about their raid on ED and /b/. Instead, there was NOTHING. Not a peep. Just a few people chuckling about JE's meltdown and sad attempts to drum up sympathy.

Only reasons I can see for a hacker to attack JUST her DA account (which none of these actually make enough sense to me):
1. They're butthurt about JE lying
2. They were pissy about all the "it's ok *pat pat*" that were coming out of the woodworks with that journal
3. They did it for the lulz

I really don't like 1 and 3 because I really, REALLY don't think they fit. Creating a lie about what? What is there to lie about, just to double fake everyone out? They're doing a good job if that's the case. I don't see any motivation outright to illicit an attack.

I see you point. They must have a good cause in the first place.

Still the other two can be possible as well.

Whilst Squiddy^3 is being rather antagonizing and childish in his responses, there are some things I can say in regards to his responses.

The issue with the IP-hack stuff is that it's complete nonsense. Of course, I won't just leave it at that. Having the IP address of a person's computer will in theory (yea, so I'll use that word since you seem to love using it) allow you to connect to the person's computer. And if that computer has the right software running on it, then you can do whatever you want. However, this is irrelevant to the "hacking" of JE's DA account. Hell, I don't even like calling it hacking cause it is far from it - "cracking" would be more appropriate.

If JE's IP was used in some hacking incident, this would only imply that her computer was compromised, allowing the intruder to gain access to her DA account that way. The only issue with this is there is no evidence of any hacking of any kind - if it were a 4chan/ED/whatever-IB then they would do more than trash her DA page given access to her system - they would find whatever evidence they need to prove JE's identity.

Long story short on that point, there was no magic IP address hacking or whatever you want to call it.

Hopefully that's more enlightening for you than the rather crude responses by Squiddy^3.

P.S I'm a graduate Software Engineer (BE) who has done a course on Cryptography and Security. So while I wouldn't "advertise" this, with the rather childish "Oh I did COMP SCI III" crap going on, I thought I'd share some credentials.

Thanks. You said what I said, minus the acting like a faggot.

I said computer repair... @@

Plus what if an DA moderater spotted the sudden IP address that she didn't have before?

Then we bring you to the point I made when I first replied.

If there was a foreign IP address at the time of the incident, then congrats! You have a hacker.

If there was no change in IP addresses at the time, then congrats! It was staged.

Again again again again, until you get those IP records, there is no way to know.

"Theory"

Then you have a horrible theory backed by broken logic. Congratulations, you made a bad theory.

Don't pollute my thread with this :p

But what Squiddy^3 is trying to say is that the basis for your theory is incorrect.

Regardless if you come to say your theory is yet to be proven, if the basis for your theory is wrong, then your theory can equally be wrong.

This is obviously since theories are derived either from known facts and/or observations.

Think of it like a maths theorem. With maths theorems, they're based on some assumptions or other known mathematical rules. But if the assumptions or rules are incorrect, then the theorem is impossible to prove - while this doesn't exclusively say the theorem is wrong, if you know the basis is incorrect, then you can say that the theorem is flawed.

Seriously, I should just pre-rant to you and let you translate. You're like a beautiful controlled version of everything I want to say.

What difference does that make?

The DA moderators are more interested in keeping the integrity of DA which means keeping images/posts out. If JE did it herself, then ban the account so it can never be used for those purposes again. If someone else did it, then ban the account as it has been shown to be compromised - even if they know JE wasn't behind it, there's no proof that such a compromise will never happen again, so keep it banned. That's how security should handle it and that's what they did.

Still though, there may be evidence too.

Oh, and it doesn't matter if the IP addresses were different.

If JE did it herself, to help it look like it was done by someone else, she could have used a Proxy to perform the attack - one second you're with an IP from Mexico/California/Wherever and another you're from some place in Europe or where ever you please.

Additionally, the above could've been done by a would-be attacker.

Therefore, IP access records do not prove anything (unless you pull a full forensic operation, which is NOT worth the effort).

Well, they "do not prove anything" if the IP access logs show suspicious activity. If the IP access logs show it was all from JE, then it does prove something :p

Lawl, yes, you get the point. See? We need to check, because there IS a small chance that it can be proved. And really, I don't think JE would've thought to use a proxy. I'm willing to bet on that.

And then Miss Iceland, if the records DO show what there is an inconsistency at the time of the event, then that's good news for you! Then you have all the more backbone to your theory!

You know I'm a guy right? O_o

But your side could have more back bone too if my theory was wrong. Don't forget you may have the lead too. XD

Yes, it doesn't, but the whole reason why I'm willing to make that risk is because while differing IP's can mean one or the other, if it shows up that there was only one IP the whole entire time, then there is undeniable proof of what happened. If they're differing IP's, then hey, whatever. It'll be just one big "Schrödinger's cat" ordeal that could mean one or the other. But if they do check the records and they DO show that it was her the whole time, then the dispute is over and this can all be put to rest.

So yes, IP records CAN prove it was a hoax if the records show consistancy.

Yah, that's plausible.

I still like the 'Jessica IS Camerella and is denying it to save her job' theory though, it also fits and it's more fun!

All I know for sure is this: Jessica is still an amazing artist, the photo's are still hot, therefore NOTHING has changed.

Even assuming Jessica made a mistake, it's nobody's business but her's, and she still has my support.

Bad rep for being evasive? I don't care.

Possibly a man? Call a 6 foot tranny a man one too many times, then count the teeth you pick up off the sidewalk, if someone identifies themselves as female, you call them miss, weather or not they have a penis. Even the American courts respect this. I don't care.

Jessica Elwood not her real name? Please... Artists use pseudonyms for a REASON. You think John Wayne was his real name? I don't care.

Jessica may have used Camerella's pics after commissioning them? Show me the difference between this and Johnny Cash singing 'Hurt', or Jimi Hendrix singing 'All Along the Watchtowers'. I don't care.

Bad rep for being slow on commission? That's a risk whenever you commission a semi pro artist. I don't care.

Point of fact I don't care about any of it, other than the fact that I see a fellow artist taking a whole load of bullshit she doesn't deserve.

I don't care if they hack my computer and delete all my porn, I'm NOT backing down!

Lawl, you embody everything in the quote "As long as they get the fapping materials, they don't care about any of it".

But hey, keep defending her from the people she owes money even though you didn't lose a single cent to her and reap the benefits of those who did every day, whatever.

Wait, no. I was leaving now. Don't bother replying, it's pointless anyways.

Too late

I love the assumption that CAN fap.

I've gone ten rounds with this kind of thing before, you think porn matters?

Intelligent beings are we, not this... nude matter!

I was gonna stay off of this one, cause frankly you don't care but I'd like to point out you just went from "I like porn and have it on my computer" to "I don't care about porn" in 3 seconds flat. Also: what are you not backing down from. You've taken a "I don't care" stance so what does any of this matter to you?

Political pratice? :3

Ok, that's fair.

I LIKE porn, point of fact I THRIVE on porn! You can't get a disease from it, and porn won't get you pregnant!

but porn has nothing to do with why I'm defending Jessica. I do enjoy her porn, but I prefer darker stuff than she does, and if you notice my gallery, I don't get into furries that much. Furries aren't my thing, but quality art IS!

When I say 'I don't care' I mean I don't think these things are excuses to do what the 4fags have done. For every 'charge' I can think of half a dozen artists that have done the same and aren't getting half the treatment. The 4fags (and I mean the people from 4chan as well as everyone being led by the nose by their bullshit) see someone they can pick on easily and are doing it, just like all the high school bullies picked on them.

As for being burned on commissions, yah, I have been burned on commissions. but as an artist who has, in the past fed their children with money from commissioned art, I know that these things happen. I've been waiting for a project from David Wong for 4 years now. it's a risk you take when you commission an artist. Period. Mozart was once 2 years late on a commissioned opera. It happens.

I hope that clears some of this up.

Yes, but if you hire a professional to do something and pay them in advance, I would hope you expect that commission get done ASAP.

Also: 4chan and ED denied all affiliation with the hacking, which is the exact opposite of their personality. I fail to see where the "bullshit" comes into play, there's hard evidence showing that JE has lied before. And yes the JE is Camerella is a feasible theory, but Camerella is fairly vocal about JE being a fake and apologized to everyone who may have bought pictures of her through JE.

About the professional work: Granted. I'm not saying it's all groovy, the people who are still waiting have every right to be pissed. I'm saying it's not an acceptable reason for this kind of F5 shitstorm. I'm also saying that it wouldn't stop me from commissioning something from Jessica, even knowing I may not ever see it. She DOES complete commissions, just not always within a reasonable time limit. The only thing that stops me is that her prices are way out of my range.

4chan and ED can deny anything they want to, about the hacking, I don't know enough about computers to make an opinion one way or another about that other than to say that both sites are proud of their status as some of the web's most vile sites. I will say that even aside from the hacking, ED and 4chan have still blown this so far out of proportion that it's surreal. On 4chan it's so bad that even the 4chan mods are deleting the threads as fast as they can.

Also, please forgive my cussing, I'm at the end of a 6 day insomnia streak and am having trouble being polite. If it wasn't for auto spell check, none of this would be readable lol

Intelligent beings are we, not this... nude matter!

ROFLMFAO!
Oh that's great, I gotta remember that one.
I wasn't going to reply to this since it too has goten wildly out of hand right quick, but I had to at that statement.
Thank you very much for the laugh.

Amen to that!

Don't forget Socail Distortion's "Ring of Fire" as well.

It's alway's sad when you see someone fall that had a slimarity with you, even if you didn't know each other.

There's a huge difference between doing a cover song and posing as someone else. Social Distortion was claiming to be Johnny Cash.

I know that. Seeing if she agrees with that or not. :3

I'm still checking up on that... I haven't heard of this before today... My music mojo must be slipping

It's in Socail Distortion's name album.

Oh I've heard it now. I like it better than the original. I looked it up after you mentioned it.

From what I can tell, yah it's the exact same thing.

Besides one doesn't say like the other. For example: Christain rock bands. All of them sound so closely together that they might be plajorizing everyone and them selves. XD

No, it isn't. A cover is taking a song and making it your own, putting your own unique spin on a previously known song. 'Jessica' took someone else's photos are flat out pretended to be that person. One is an homage, the other is flat out theft.

Exept that those photos are a collaboration. Just like milli vanilli.

Camerella even admitted to such. She had the drawings, deliberately set up the white backdrop, provided photos AND videos of herself with Jessica's artwork and signature saying helo to Deviant art AND 4chan.

Maybe she's telling the truth when she says she doesn't know who Jessica is (I don't buy it) but she knew very well what they were for. That's NOT theft. That's collaboration.

Just like Frank Farian wrote songs, had Charles Shaw, John Davis, Brad Howell, and Jodie and Linda Rocco record vocals, then had Fab Morvan and Rob perform the on stage work for the group Milli Vanilli. Everyone involved knew exactly what was happening, and none of it was illegal or immoral.

Nothing about deliberately deceiving people as to your identity is immoral? Well, shit, nice to know. As long as I have conspirators, it's okay to lie to people.

Not when you're a public entertainment figure, no it's not. Star's do it every day.

They make up fake names, portray a fictional character to the public and hide themselves away for their own protection.

Authors do it even more frequently. You would be stunned if you knew how many books were written, published and corresponded under completely fasle names as well as author's pictures.

It's a fact of life in the entertainment industry, which professional artists are a part of.

Get used to it.

Or better yet, don't. Come at Stephan King or Alan Moore with this crap and see what happens to you.

Hm. I read "The Outsiders" and even when it souned like it was written by an man cause it's about a group of guys who get in trouble a lot, But it was written by a girl. She just Breviated her First and Middle name and let the last name full.

Yah that happens all the time.

That's why I keep my real life gender a closely guarded secret. If I'm thought of as a guy, people will assume I'm a pig, if I'm a woman people assume I'm a hormonal bitch because of the kinds of things that happen in my stories. It's better people just don't concern themselves with my gender.

Bullshit. There's a difference between using a pen name and using someone else's identity to get extra attention. That's what pisses me off about this. A talented artist, even if they use a nom de plume, that's okay. Using a cam whore's pictures to get attention from horny fanboys, that's grotesque.

I disagree.

I mean, if she WAS stealing the pics, yah, but since Camerella was in on it, I can't get upset. Together they helped create a fantasy, which is what the goal is anyway. It's not like they were making public appearances and signing record deals falsely.

But that's just my opinion.

She wasn't in on it. Her Facebook said she had no idea she was being imitated.

Oi... I'm getting tired of pointing this out, I should just copy this so I can just paste it.

#1 Camerella SAYS she wasn't in on it, yet she set up the white backdrop to hide her room, she posed with someone else's drawings, she signed Jessica's name with greetings messages. Camerella WAS pretending to be Jessica Elwood, she knew she was pretending to be Jessica Elwood. The fact that she's claiming not to know what it was going to be fore is flat out not true. Maybe she didn't know who Jessica Elwood was exactly, but she knew she was pretending to be her.

#2 Camerella is a woman who has a long history of non reliability, flexible interpretations of the truth and flakiness. For people to buy into her claim that 'she didn't know' in the same exact conversation in which she admits to posing for them in the same conversation is pure stupidity. It's like believing a drug dealer that admits to selling an 8ball to a college frat but claims he didn't know what the kid was going to to with it.

#3 Camerella has to protect her job and her life. If she admits she knew what was going on she could lose both. This isn't proof that she DID know, it's just a VERY strong reason to question her word.

I'd get tired of explaining it when it's so incredibly thin, too.

JElwood has a history of non reliability, be it through falsified history (Her(?) being a Mexican when she claims to be American springs to mind), YEARS worth of unfullfilled commissions and faking her appearance repeatedly.

Every point you make about Camerella can be made about Elwood and more.

You're absolutely right.

The similarities between the two just keep piling up don't they!

Except the Mexican part. That is still just hearsay, and racist hearsay at that.

Actually, it's because Elwood's Paypal info and IP addresses, according to FA staff in fact, were based out of Mexico.

The IP adress thing, I can't say much about other than I know for a fact that IP addys can, and often are, bounced. My last ISP did that as a matter of course to protect their customers. They kept everything on fine in case the FBI did n investigation or something, but if you had traced my IP at the time, it would look like I was from Hong Kong, Canade or maybe even Miami, depending on when they shuffled the IPs.

As for paypal, we already established that she was using a dummy PayPal account, so...

I will admit that assuming the Admins are telling the truth, that's pretty solid.

But again, what would it matter?

You don't advertise who you are and where you live, yet you want Jessica Elwood, who is some measure of Celebrity, to leaver herself open for net and real life stalking?

No, but there's a difference between not giving information and giving FALSE information.

One is protecting yourself, the other is fraud. One is legal, the other isn't.

Yeah, the paypal thing was established, and on it's own may have been harmless, but altogether with the rest of the information, it doesn't exactly seem as harmless.

I disagree.

Even with the IP addresses pretty much proving that Jessica is posting from Mexico, I still don't see the problem.

You're not posting your real address, and all the trolls with their fake names and dummy accounts sure aren't publishing who they really are, so why should Jessica suddenly have to tell the whole internet where she really lives? Especially not with all the hard core anti Mexico sentiment that is encountered in the south western US.

(NOTE I'm not accusing all USA citizens of being anti Mexican, but those of you who live here know damn well that anti Mexico sentiment is a fact, however insane that kind of attitude is)

You know, it just occured to me, maybe my opinion on the matter is so different because I grew up inside the entertainment industry...

My father was a musician (not a very famous one at all but he did have 1 album out) and he my mother naturally brought me up in their profession, so I learned of all this stuff as a child like I imagine you learned about baseball or carpentry.

To me it's nothing and no big deal for this kind of thing to happen, I could fill this page with the names of artists, writers, painters, playwrights, actors, musicians etc that all do the exact same thing as Jessica did, the only difference is they make a shit ton of money doing it.

I dunno, maybe it's just me. Either way, I hope that helps you to understand my position on the matter.

I think also the this camgirl though if they were asking if they knew a JE(as in real name, not user name) useing her piccs as her's.

some peoples name's can sound like real names.

I would agree, except Camerella worked together WITH Jessica to do the pics, so it pretty much IS the same.

Kinda like when it came out that Milli Vanilli were just the face for the singing duo that were actually SINGING the songs. They had an agreement. Camerella was Jessica's...well... breasts, not face... just as Milli Vanilli was the face for Fab Morvan and Rob Pilatus.

If Camerella hadn't up and said that she did, in fact, pose with the drawings and with Jess's signature, that would be different. But she did. Which is my strongest puzzle piece for buying into the 'Camerella IS Jessica' theory. At the very least Jess's claims that she is friends with Camerella seem very true.

Nice.
I like it.

No actually it isn't, Camerella said that she never knew anything about her photos being posted anywhere. And, she did not know who JessicaElwood was.

This of course seemingly brings up the "how did she get Camerella to pose with pictures and things signed JE then?" Easy answer: Money, Camerella is a camgirl, you pay them, they do stuff, holding up a sign that says "JE" on it or a couple of pictures that someone sent to you via scanner or even holding up a blank sheet of paper (it is not hard at all to photoshop a sketch onto a blank sheet of paper) may seem like a strange request but heck to a camgirl, money is money.

In short: Camerella denied all affiliation to JE except that someone had asked her to make some signs and pose with drawings.

Yes, Camerella has said she doesn't know who Jessica is, but this is a very important point. Adult industry performers HAVE to keep their identities as secret as possible. There are very VERY few exceptions to this. Camerella has to protect not only her person and property, but also her JOB. All this could very well end her career if it comes out that she was doing this with Jess, or even IS Jess, especially with the 4fag's penchant for stalking.

I have a saying: Never trust something who has somthing to gain from your loss, or a vested interest in keeping you in the dark. That's not to say I'd judge Camerella if it came out she's lying, I COMPLETELY understand. but I also have reason not to trust what she says in this case.

But I admit, you're right about the camgirl's doing things for money, it very well could be that my theory is completely wrong and I'm being altruistic.

It's already "known" that Camerella is "Jessica Gabrielson"

http://www.myspace.com/jgurly

Make what you will of it, but one suspicion is that it's the origin of the "Jessica Elwood" pseudonym. But, since "Jessica Elwood" has had a presence since 2005, I'm not exactly going to take a dive into finding out when Jessica Gabrielson/Kayla/Camerella started out doing camgirl stuff.

Yes, you are correct. And Elwood isn't Jessica's real last name.

According to my theory (and this is JUST a theory mind you) Jessica Colanari was her pen name wayyyy back (some of her art in her gallery still has that name on it), this very well could have been a pseudonym as well. Point of fact Jessica Gabrielson could very well be a pseudonym. You ever know.

Someone posted a really REALLY old pic done by her, very possibly one of the first ever posted by Jess with what looked like a sig saying Jessica G. this pic has since disappeared, so I can't confirm that.

Either way it's all just fun speculation, it doesn't really matter either way. My only point to that line of thinking originally was that all of 4chan's 'evidence' against jessica could mean many different things, not just the one outcome they're trying to violently shove down our throats and that thinking for ones' self is good. Even if it does taste a little like hemlock...

RE: "Jessica G."

Yes, I saw that pic as well - but it was more a case of reading too much into something little.

It was just a stylised big "e". Terrible idea for a font to use large lower-case letters for their upper-case representations.

Very well could be. But still, it's within the realm of possibility, which is my point.

yes, as far as I can tell, also just like 'Ring of Fire'. From what I've been able to find (this sis still wierd that's I've NEVER heard this song covered by them...) it's their biggest selling song, and its not even their IP.

These kinds of things happen all the time in the art world, it's part of the culture.

It's usually only a problem when people try to lay IP claims down, like when Vanilla Ice tried to claim the bass beat from 'Under Pressure' as his IP.

Also, have you ever heard of someone famous, Picaso for an example, come back from the grave to sue someone 200 years or so later of their death?

Art is origonality, but most of it is ideas we get from other's and and make up our own rules of art.

Sadly, yes. The eternal search for the original idea...

Besides Obama of course, but he just like an advrage joe here. XD

The world is too small... @@

*sniker* very true...

WAY too small...

Obama is a whole other can of worms... A can which I am getting less and less enthusiastic about swallowing.




And I LOVE swallowing!

I think the responce to the oil thing jst killed hi presidentiness.

He still has a chance.

He can still order the public annexing of all of BPs resources, declare Eminent Domain and then get serious.

I don't think Eminent Domain will apply to a foreign company.

Dang... good point.

We'll have to annex them then!

What amaze's me about this whole thing is the mass of people who beleive the stuff posted on ED. I will grant them the photo comparison thing as that is rather compelling evidence but then the whole deal about JE being some guy in mexico is bullshit without the proper evidence.

Then there is the fact that ED is a fucking wiki which EVERYONE and their dog can add information too, whether it is false or otherwise. Secondly JE is getting a literal fuckton of crap and hate from people because of her photo 'scandel.' If and I repeat IF her account being hacked was something she (give me actual evidence that she isn't a girl or kindly shut up) did to herself as a way to gain sympathy, and it was revealed that it was a hoax, then even more people would be pissed which would of course cause a massive wave of people no longer trusting her. Plus with her art style (which I have NEVER seen any art not belonging to her with a similar style) being so recognizable she would never get away with creating a new account because everyone would recognize her style.

Long story short....while I don't deny the possibility that her account being hacked might be a hoax, the way I see it is that there are too many risks for her doing that.

Oh you brought out another idea that this is a hacker's job here.

The Ardon thing linking to JE is weird by what you are saying. Ardon left the same day as JE came along and if Ardon is JE: why people saying their art is very slimiar now when they could've said that back in 04 or 05.

And also to the IP address thing, only a DA mod can solve this. They have the ability to check the IP addresses and call the shots.

RE: similarities to Arden

There is at least one place where "Arden" and "Jessica Elwood" accounts were active at the same time. During this time there was at least one instance where Arden supposedly gave tips to JE (well, it was regarding the way to colour the hair on the character). This was also during the sonic-style method in JE's art.

On the assumption that Arden and JE are not the same person. And given the supposed tips given to JE, then it would not be unusual for the art to be similar back then.

It's just coming into light now since 5 years ago is a long time - a long time for people to forget.

The problem with the Arden the Black argument is that no one can find Arden the Black.

It seems likely to me that this Arden was an art thief himself. Jessica usually puts her sigs in out of the way places, east to erase and put your own if you want.

That happens on online galleries literally every day.

Pictures and artwork of Arden's work can be found readily.

I don't see why the heck you're calling Arden an art theif, people are simply saying his and JE's style are a lot alike. Arden came before JE so there wasn't even a way for him to steal her work in the first place.

Yes, but there's nothing RECENT and no one can get hold of him.

I wasn't accusing him of being a thief, I'm saying it's a strong possibility. The pictures I've seen of 'Arden the black's work are all exact pics of Jessica Elwood's just with the signature reversed, however, I did see them posted on 4chan in some of the 'burn jessica' threads, so I have no way of knowing of those are real or not.

Maybe you could help me out and post a link to some Arden the Black galleries? I can't seem to find any.

That's because he left the web, Please learn the history before you start accusing him of stuff.

*sigh*

That would be why I said that he's unavailable, isn't it.

And, again, since you didn't seem to have read it the first two or three times, I'm not accusing Arden the Black of art theft. I'm saying it's very possible and therefore shouldn't even be getting consideration.

Art theft happens LITERALLY every day. even my art, which is fairly crappy, winds up on other people's websites all the damn time. Now, is that proof that I'm a man, or Chinese, or a woman or anything else these art thieves are? Of course not. The fact that Jessica's art was found on the pages of someone who posted a few pieces then disappeared entirely means either nothing, or everything, and we can't tell which till Arden the Black comes forward.

Arden the Black never posted any pictures of Jessica Elwood's work, no one ever said they did (if I'm wrong please tell me with links and such). Yes art theft happens, but the reason people are saying that JE and Arden are the same person is because their art is so similar. There's also reason to believe this because Arden had supposedly gave JE tips on her art style, and the same thing happened with the Kayce and JE sock puppet account.

Point being, you may not dirrectly be saying "Arden is a thief" but you sure as heck are implying it. Again, Arden did not post JE's work.

Also: Please keep track of your own posts.

"The problem with the Arden the Black argument is that no one can find Arden the Black.

It seems likely to me that this Arden was an art thief himself. Jessica usually puts her sigs in out of the way places, east to erase and put your own if you want.

That happens on online galleries literally every day."

Then you go and say:

"And, again, since you didn't seem to have read it the first two or three times, I'm not accusing Arden the Black of art theft. I'm saying it's very possible and therefore shouldn't even be getting consideration."

If saying "Arden was an art thief himself" isn't accusing, I donno what is.

Yah, try reading instead of inferring. You'll see a whole world of difference.

I did read, I've read nearly every single post you or anyone has made towards the JE topic. The two quotes I had? Both are yours and they are on two different ends of the spectrum.

No, they really aren't.

Supposing someone is theoretically an art thief is not the same thing as leveling an actual accusation.

Saying "I wonder if Tiger Woods is secretly a submissive furry" or "I have a theory that Tiger woods is a submissive furry" is a completely different thing than saying "Tiger woods IS a submissive furry".

http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/...../#cid:13043970

Comment where you say "It seems likely to me that this Arden was an art thief himself."

http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/...../#cid:13068646

Comment where you said you never accused him of art theft. Saying "It's likely that X did Y" is not the same as "I have a theory that X did Y."

More directly as to why I'm trying to point this out. It makes you look a lot more credible when you don't talk in circles and stick with one story.

Same story the whole time.

And I'm sorry, no, that's not an accusation.

Still though. If I see if one is very slimair to the other, things would be different now and maybe this won't be happening.

Which is something they will never reveal to the general public. However I do know that the DA mods are currently investigating this whole incident and hopefully something will be revealed the next few days.

Also in response to the many people claiming it's a hoax because all her art was put in storage instead of deleted. Considering how much art is posted in her gallery...or was in her gallery it would take FOREVER to delete each and every single pic. Now from what I understand about hackers is that they want instant results and it would be a whole lot simpler to move the art into storage than to delete each separate piece.

That and if you go onto her DA account and read the comments whoever is currently in control of the account (JE or a hacker) actually mentioned what I said here as a response to a comment made there...only shorter.

If something happens: The mexican guy in mexico would be thrown out of the window and happily ever after to her or instant comspiracy.

I never thought of that. The hcker was just in a hurry and did store cause it just blocks the art, whick is facter than deleting the whole thing.

Admitadly yes, but frankly I've seen it where multiple posts pop up per second, same thing could be applied through deleting deviations probably. Plus if you start from the back end of her collection then it would be easy to do without anyone noticing until you got to the front.

Also, while it is easier to store pictures, it's more obvious on how to delete them. If someone from an outside site came onto JE's site (assuming the had little contact with DA) They might not readily know how to put the pics into storage.

Point being: A troll would have deleted them probably, and posted worse pictures than what was posted.

O_o

I would have posted something but had a brain aneurysm from the ridiculous stuff being said here and hit post.

-Camerella has no idea who JE is. Has said as much in twitter and she isn't hard to reach since she freely posts her myspace, facebook and every IM address she has. She has admitted to doing fan shoots however and that she has no idea what people do with them afterward.
[It's questionable that JE used commission money to get these fan sets (who needs materials?) or that because people are crazy enough to commission pictures for her own fursona as a gift she got some other idiot to do it.]

-if it were 4chan or ED why post only shock images that take 10 seconds to search for on google? (The 4 suicide pics are on the first page of google search so that's not even 10 seconds) and where is the goatse pics?

-Why was the only JE thread that day in /s/ which had no idea there was any kind of raid?

-4chan isn't mad. They don't even give a (you get the picture) all the drama was on the dA page and an ED page. Lulz.net has thought JE is an idiot for years and they didn't care either.

-the dA page and ED, wikifur and lulz.net the only places that could aggregate hatred against JE were either cut off, vandalised or spammed. That goes against the 'how to' of raiding.

-Why remove the dA journal with 2000+ posts that would be the reason for any kind of raid?

-[Questionable theory] Isn't it more likely that people bombarded dA with reports of JE using another models pictures without crediting the model herself as the reason for the permanent ban? That JE (as a 4chan lurker and occasional poster) wanted to go nuts before the account was shut down?

Again the reasons for it being faked are far more glaring than reasons it would be a hack. Politicians have used scapegoats to escape bad press for years. It's the oldest trick in the book.

Also if JE does come back to dA they could always use their other account: AmoreNerezza.

And you watching her last time I checked, which would be Server Local Time: July 13th, 2010 02:20.

Like I said: this is a theory and chatted to people who posted here(on this journal) that we'll not be sure untill a DA mod does something.

Well, you can be sure now: A deviantArt mod has now banned him (Jessica) for impersonating Camerella.

I mean they may check IP addresses just to make sure.

They've closed out their case. So, if you're keeping tally:

* Alleged impersonation of Camerella (YES: Proven by deviantArt AND Camerella herself)

* Alleged skipping out on commissions (YES: Proven by Jess herself)

* Allegedly lives in Mexico (YES: Proven by Arshes Nei)

* Alleged sockpuppet of KaceyWyandotte (YES: Proven by Arshes Nei)

* Alleged sockpuppet of Arden the Black (LIKELY: Need more info from Enigmawing about the site admin who allegedly has proof of this claim)

* Allegedly male (INCONCLUSIVE: Not important, but posing as a female increases sales)

* Alleged hacking (INCONCLUSIVE: The alleged hack does not have any of the normal things one one would notice if it were a legitimate hack. Proving that it was a real hack is nearly impossible.)

There's still room for bizarre conspiracy theories such as she's been using a proxy in Mexico all her life, but barring very, very unlikely circumstances, the above is 99.9% accurate.

Hope this helps! :)

Look at  JeremyNalsi's on part two of this for why DA still can change it all.

http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/1550589/

Again, screen shots aren't proof.

Arshes Nei can post any kind of screen shot he want's, it's still not proof. I once saw a screen shot of Patrick Stewart blowing Wil Wheaton on the deck of the enterprise, dude swore it was from a blooper reel from TNG. Doesn't mean it was real, at all.

I could take Arshes Nei's supposed proof and post it 'proving' that Jessica Elwood is my rooomate, wouldn't mean anything.

That's the crux of this entire shitstorm. It's all based on the utterly fragile 'proof' posted by a bunch of angry 4fags who are relying on people's hunger for drama to give it power.

The only hard facts in this entire thing are that the pics Jessica posted were posed for by Camerella and that Jessisca is late for a few comissions.

Other than that it's all speculation, hearsay and screenshots.

Arshes Nei is an admin of Fur Affinity.

So you're saying that after FA's stance on privacy, one of the admins is handing out people's IP addresses?

The admin is handing out a location, not a specific IP address, because this is an issue of fraud.

But otherwise, yes.

Post a link to this info.

Elwood lives in Mexico:
http://forums.furaffinity.net/threa.....=1#post2029321

Elwood uses sockpuppets:
http://forums.furaffinity.net/threa.....=1#post2029688

Kacey (sockpuppet) has same IP address as Elwood:
http://forums.furaffinity.net/threa.....=1#post2030046

Another old sockpuppet of Elwood:
http://forums.furaffinity.net/threa.....=1#post2030607

There's other posts in that thread too. Enjoy. :)

Mexico issue: Maybe you posted the wrong link, but that doesn't say anything at all about weather or not she lives in mexico =/

Sock Puppet Issue: Oh THAT's what you mean by sock puppet... I use a sock puppet account for pay pal transactions as well. So what?

Kacey Issue: Again, so what? Kacey could be a boyfriend/girlfriend whatever. I'll refer back to an earlier post, so what if Jessica is a girl? Does it matter? It's not like you're going on a date with her.

Amore Sockpuppet issue: I'm sorry here, but I don't care if Arshes Nei is an admin or not, posting old accounts with no art on them with no proof is just that, no proof. That account could belong to LITERALLY anybody. I'm not saying Arshes Nei is lying, I'm just saying I can't make an opinion based on that since it gives me no information whatsoever. As for the animesuki art clip, I can't see the signature, but having a piece that is similar to Jessica's style also isn't proof. That would be like someone accusing <a href="http://name-b.deviantart.com/art/Jo.....">this guy</a> of claiming to be Joe Maduriera(?) because their styles are similar.

lol I fail at HTML

Why are you trying to defend Elwood so much anyways? "She" your best friend or something? Screen shots mean nothing then no evidence you guys have can really be useful either.

No she's not. She's not even my favorite artist. But I know a witch hunt when I see one, and I think it's important for her to know that not everyone turned against her on 4chan's say so.

I'm also trying to reach as many people as possible to get across the idea that just because the 4chan crowd says they have all this proof, doesn't necessarily mean what they are telling us it means. Point of fact, when one considers that they've been falsifying info since the beginning of this, you can't trust hardly anything they say on the matter.

The ultimate point being: Think for yourself, research the situation yourself and draw your own conclusions.

Uh-huh...so in otherwords you want to believe in Elwood though there's been nothing on "her: end really stating if it was staged or not, no posted proof of a screenshot which by your logic could very well be faked so even then it wouldn't help your case.

Seems like someone's had a little history with 4chan before, and it's not like they wouldn't take credit if they didn't do it. People brag about hacking people a lot, someone would have said SOMETHING about it. That's how trolls work, got to Youtube, it's still the same. And all this not long after someone called Elwood out on this crap.

Why are you dodging the issue of STOLEN identity? You don't believe 4chan, ED, Carmella, FA admins, or anyone and find Elwood as some high perfect person that cannot lie. What if Elwood is the big-ass liar here? Where's your facts now.

Sure, those COULD be the cases, but that's a LOT of coincidences. Do you really think multiple, unrelated people are bullying Elwood?

Do you really think all those people who complained about commissions not getting done are liars?

Do you really think the site administration of Fur Affinity are liars?

Do you really think Camerella is a liar?

Do you really think the alleged hacking was real, and that the vandal intentionally made it look like a fake hack to discredit Elwood?

Let me know, thanks!

After all this, you're REALLY gonna ask these two those questions?

No, I think this is all the result of one group of people that saw an opportunity to attack someone who was down and also doing somthing stupid (IE admitting her wrongness about the commissions and posting pics of Camerella), then a whole community of people jumped out to get their feelings hurt so they could be part of the new 'bash Jessica' in crowd.

I think that easily more than %70 of the people complaining are jumping on the bandwagon and lying about not getting a commission. This is a known psychological phenomenon, particularly common with heinos murders. Fun fact: Over 700 people 'confessed' to the JonBenet Ramsey murder.

I don't think the admin are liars, I think that their claims with no proof are just that: Claims with no proof. My whole point is that people are running around half cocked withonly two or three scraps of proof, then making up the rest and running with that. It's like a giant game of telephone.

Yes, I do think Camerella is a liar. All anyone has to do is research Camerella and you'll see why I think she's a liar.

No I don't think the hacker made it look like a fake hack. I think someone figured out her password and did as much damage as he could before the DA admins caught him and banned the account.

> I think someone figured out her password and did as much damage as he could

Ok, then why did this person you speak of put all of Elwood submissions safely into storage (where they could easily be recovered), instead of just deleting them outright (which would do damage)?

I am getting very tired of explaining this, I'm going to copy it this time and just paste it in.

On Deviant Art, you can't just delete a submission. You can FLAG it for deletion, at which point an administrator will come around at some point and delete it for you. Deleting her art would have not only not shown up on her account for a very long time (sometimes up to six weeks) but would have alerted the Admins right away and possibly gotten themselves caught in the process, depending on how on the ball the admins are that night.

Okay. Next question: Do you find it strange that only the deviantArt account was targeted? Fur Affinity, email, everything else was left untouched. No personal details or private photos were exposed, either.

When someone doesn't use the same password across multiple sites, it becomes very hard to crack an account. A website with proper prevention against dictionary attacks makes it impossible. How, then, was the only account accessed/defaced Elwood's deviantArt account?

I'm very interested to hear your answer to this one.

Not at all. Password hacking is a daily reality. Jessica very likely uses a different password for each website, as we all should. So it's no surprise to me at all that one site got hit and another didn't. Between email embedded keylogger viruses, encryption software and good old fashioned guesswork, it's actually pretty easy to get into someone's account these days.

Thanks for making it very clear that you have no idea what the current security landscape looks like.

But hey, I'll give you one chance to redeem yourself. If it's pretty easy to get into someone's account (like you said), then get into my deviantArt account. I'll even give you my username: SeppelSquirrel.

You have 18 hours (the approximate amount of time between Jessica going public that he was a dude and the time of the alleged hacking).

Good luck proving that the hack was real!

Yah... Thank YOU sir for making it painfully apparent that you have no idea what you're talking about.

Do yourself a favor so you don't embarrass yourself next time, do research of key logging, phishing and password hacking.

Don't embarrass -myself-? You're the one who doesn't have my dA password. Remember, you're supposed to be proving that the Elwood hack was real.

FYI, the term you're looking for is "password cracking." Password hacking is an entirely different thing. ;)

I'll give you another 18 hours to crack my dA account, since I'm such a nice guy. :)

I'm not stupid enough to break the law to prove to some troll what password hacking is.

You know what it is, I know what it is, everyone knows you know what it is.

Stop being a tool.

I grant you, Werecat, permission to access my devantArt.com account for the next 18 hours.

There. Enjoy. "Hack" away.

Or, since you are implying you know how, I'll accept you telling me your method instead of you actually doing it. ;)

Remember, your faith in Elwood is on the line. :)

It has nothing to do with my faith in Jessica (I can't have faith in someone I've never met).

besides, I don't need to prove anything to you in this regard, least of all how inept I am with computers. =D

We all know how password hacks work, ESPECIALLY those of us who play World of Warcraft.

Oh, you play World of Warcraft.

I'm sorry.

I don't play World of Warcraft... i HATE it...

Sadly though I do WORK World of Warcraft. I have to play it for my job.

On the up side, I get payed to play video games... can't really get much better than that...

I get paid to defend my country.

Then you should be defending it here and now, defending rational, thought and evidence, not siding with the 'I heard it from bob who heard it from paul who said...' folks.

If you're willing to kill a man to defend the constitution then you should bloody well not be siding with a mob who are ignoring all evidence to further their good old fashioned lynching. The constitution guarantees a FAIR trial by an impartial judge and a jury of one's peers, as well as the right to fair defense, yet here you stand attacking those providing fair defense and ignoring anything that points to Jessica NOT being the villain the mob is trying to make her out to be.

Siding with a mob? What mob? What the hell are you talking about?

The 'jessica is the villain' mob that has been attacking her with anything they can. The ones that tried to prove she was a man with a certain video of her actually drawing her art, saw she was actual a woman then ignored it and continuing calling her a man anyway. The mob that keeps insisting she's a thief, then when directed to the places where her clients have indicated shat she has actually completed their commissions IN ADDITION to refunding their money simply ignore that too. The same mob who, when the DA admins came strait out and said that YES, Jessica's DA account was, in fact, hacked, simply ignore that AS WELL. The same mob that when faced with not only proof of, but an admission from Camerella herself that yes, she did pretend to be Jessica Elwood on camera for a fee, still insist that Jessica stole Camerella's identity.

Jessica is guilty of being late for commissions and using a bought and paid for body double. And for this, she has been hounded off of galleries and lost her job and continues to be harassed. And you, a man who was given a gun in exchange for the OATH to defend of the land of the free and home of the brave, are joining in this.

I have not joined in any attacks. I've been doing research to determine if Elwood is a reliable person to do business with. The number of complaints about late commissions and refunds not honored, as well as Elwood's business conduct, is very unprofessional. And while I understand that pretending to be a curvaceous girl is a very reliable method to increase sales, it is unprofessional to lie to a business about a real name and address.

Link to the DA admin statement, please?

There's more than one way to defend the country, btw. :)

Back to being an informant:

1. No people are not ignoring the videos, ED has backed off of saying that she's a man. There are rumors still floating around she and Arden are still the same.

2. So far I've seen betawolf's drawing, care to post links to other people who've gotten their part of the deal? Outside of the 2 year man and Shukivengeance (especially this one seeing as the LJ is several months old).

3. Arshes has made a statement about there being an anomaly on JE's FA account during the hacking, namely a different IP from the original one. http://arshesnei.deviantart.com/journal/33750266/ Several people who have been talking to her since the incident have confirmed that she was on FA at the time too, along with IM's, this is linked in Arshes' journal.

4.Camerella never stated the exact words "yes I was pretending to be Jessica Elwood". In fact, she said the opposite.

Yeah. All these people are just bashing Jessica because of things they know nothing about. She might have a perfectly good reason for stealing at least $1950. Maybe her mother is ill or something. Maybe she needs medicine. Why do people not think there could possibly be a legitimate reason to defraud so many people? Honestly, people these days.

"There's more than one way to defend the country, btw. :)" Ok you got me there, I made an assumption and I'm sorry.

The DA statement is somewhere in this thread, I hope you'll forgive me but I am a little too tired of looking up links for people only to have them ignore it. I'm not saying that's what you'll do, I'm saying it's left it's toll on my nerves.

Agreed %100, her conduct has been very unprofessional with regards to her commissions, but I don't know if I can say it's unprofessional with regards to hiring Camerella as a body double. It may be a little underhanded, but it's pretty normal for the entertainment industry (if you don't believe me, PLEASE look it up for yourself, start with typing BODY DOUBLE into the search at IMDB.com for the names of a few companies who specialize in such). If people were hiring her for her body that'd be one thing, but her commissions and her jobs on carious art sites go back to before she started the Camerella thing.

Now Arshesnei says she has a reputation for spreading around other false photos and claiming them as herself, I don't know anything about that so I'm not defending it or condemning it.

I'm sorry for the flaming earlier, I lost my temper and that was wrong.

1. A LOT of them are. I continue to get notes with things like 'you know jessica is a dude right?' and even some delightfully intelligent 'dude, martha is a man'.

2. There's http://community.livejournal.com/ar.....re/308198.html , i'm not sure if that's one of the ones you're talking about or not. The others I don't have links to, they're scattered around in various galleries and websites.

3. I've seen that article. Sadly I don't know enough about computers to understand or try to formulate any kind of theory about it. All I can do is trust th DA admins when they said they found the evidence it was a hack.

4. No she didn't say those words. Her exact first words on the subject were, and I'm quoting here, "No, I've never seen Blues Brothers", this was in response to someone asking her if she was Jessica Elwood AFTER some of the photos and videos of her posing with Jessica Elwood's signature hit the net. She went on later to deny that she was in those photos, then later admitted those photos were her then finally admitted that she posed for them as a commission. That's called lying and changing your story, I don't know why she would lie, but she did. Therefore Miss Camerella's word cannot be trusted. So trusting in neither Jessica NOr Camerella's word, we look at the photos and videos. There she is saying hi to people with Jessica's signature, holding Jessica's artwork, deliberately covering any identifying marks that mark her as Camerella. You're right Camerella never SAID she was pretending to be Jessica. She just completed a job to do so.

Yah, exactly my point.

All these people are reacting to their first kneejerk response to being lied to (I had that response as well) then simply letting the bandwagon take them wherever it wants to go.

Any thought or research proves most of these accusations to be baseless or greatly exaggerated.

She didn't steal anything. She accepted money for commission for which she is late. Those people she is late in serving have been getting their commissions + bonus commissions + a full refund. What part of that is stealing?

When a person is commissioned for ANY kind of work there is a possibility of being late.

Are you going to accuse McDonolds of theft when you have to wait 45 minutes for them to fix up a new batch of patties, then give you a free drink as an apology?

1. Those people are stupid, set them strait by sending them to ED or something. But ED and everyone I've seen are calling her Martha, not a man.

2. That was the one I was talking about, it's several months old if you look at the timestamp on when it was last edited.

3.Basically it's saying that there was a different IP on JE's FA account during the hacking. But her FA was not hacked, and people confirm she was on her FA at the time. Basically it's saying JE was probably using a proxy at the time. Thus if she did the DA fiasco herself, it would look like a normal hacking.

4.She's supposed to remember every single client? I can't remember every single person that comes into Gamestop off the top of my head. Example: if you said "do you know if XXXX came in yesterday" I'd probably say "no idea", if you continued on to say "they're tall, are skinny and have short brown hair with a beard" then I might be able to remember. The thing is the first comments she got were "do you know JE?" Not exactly the most descriptive thing if you ask me.

Yeah, stupid people not receiving their commissions. It's their own fault for having money to burn. But at least they got some free photos that jessica bought from a camwhore. That totally makes up for it.

Except they are receiving their commissions AND their money back and in several cases extra commissions.

You people keep deliberately ignoring that so you can keep the trolling up.

2. And yet that's the one people keep linking to to prove that she stole commissioner's money.

3. That may be, I don't know. When it comes to computers, unless it has to do with how fast you can level a WoW character I have no idea what I'm talking about. I just have to trust other people and in this case I think it's prudent to trust the DA admins.

4. She can pull up every single transaction in Pay Pal ever, along with the notes the person should have sent. Even if they didn't send a note,, when a person sends a paypal payment they also automatically leave their email. She can easily contact them and find out what they wanted via email.

Prove it. You keep insisting that people are getting their commissions. Prove it. So far one has surfaced, and it was a single image, which the person had paid $750 for several. He got one. So where are all these wonderful commissions then?

I have posted the one link over and over and over and pointed out other places and given key words for people to search themselves, I'm not doing it any more.

If I have learned anything from all this it's that if you people had any shred of decency you'd have already looked up the information yourself and found exactly the same info, even if you drew a completely different conclusion at least you wouldn't be ignorantly attacking a member of your own community, so, no, I'm not going to do your footwork for you only to have you ignore it and insult me anyway.

Sorry dude, you don't get to attack someone without any proof then suddenly demand proof when that person is declared innocent. That's not how the country I live in works.

Wrong, actually.

It's documented that a lot of money has gone to JE. There is no need to prove that. We all know it.

Your claim that people are getting their commissions is what needs verifying. You are the one making the unsubstantiated claims, so the onus is on you to prove the proof to back up your claims.

2. Link to comments about these people please? I've yet to see one. People are saying she's taken commission money, and no one's heard a peep from her since. Also http://community.livejournal.com/ar.....re/344270.html this is the one that supposedly started the commission fiasco, I think.

3. The person stating that the IP had an anomaly during the hacking on FA is an FA mod. Namely Arshes, whom you've talked with many times before. Also I would like to see some screen cap or something where the DA mods are saying it was a different IP please.

4. Her paypal is under the name Martha, not Jessica Elwood.

Do it yourself.

You stood by while everyone accused her of everything they could think of and ate up the drama with no proof (and no it hasn't been documented how much she owes in commission, just a lot of drama flakes shouting 'oh yah, she owes me too'), you scoffed at me and attacked me too when I posted the links to the proof, follow them yourself.

2. Sorry, I'm calling bullshit. That link has been smeared all over the place.

3. Yah, I know that. I like Arshesnei very much. That does nothing to help me understand what all of that means, so I'm sticking with what I consider the better judgment: trusting the people who actually have all the info and get paid to run the site. If you think that's not the better idea, fine. I'm sure you have your reasons for nat wanting to trust the people who have the actual log of all the information going into and out of the site.

4. So what? If she has the password and access tot he account she can still get all the information for people she owes work. Y can have my paypal under the name Elmo Fudgerbutlig it will still keep all my transaction records. Jessica Elwood is a nom de plume. We have all known that since the first time she changed it from Jessica Colenari to Jessica Elwood. Don't tell me you seriously think everyone uses their real name in their art and business.

2. So you're calling bullshit that this is another closed case of JE's work, that she in fact came through with another commission MUCH more recently than the one you keep throwing around. Even though there are screen shots of the entire event?

3. Ok, I guess I'll simplify it even more. Arshes is saying that when JE was logged onto her FA account, during the hacking. She was not logged on from a Mexican IP address, like she normaly is. What does this mean? JE was using a program to hide her normal IP address and use a fake one. Essentially if she WAS logged on DA during the time of the hacking, she would have had a different IP address as well. Meaning it would look very much like a hacking. Also: thanks for ignoring my request for the DA admin screenshot/info.

4. So you're telling me that Camerella can tell that Jessica Elwood did transactions with her, and somehow psychically knew the Martha was actually JE.

Actually, the running total is around the $2000 mark. Dragoneer has been getting claims from people, and only counting those with records to show a transaction was made. So no. Again, you are whiteknighting for someone who has apparently taken a large sum of money, and not bothered to provide product. Or has provided some product after threats of legal action, but only stuff well under the value she charged for it or a fraction of the quantity promised.

So yes, she has effectively been scamming, you've sent me no links and have shown none either, other than other people going on about how innocent poor Jessica is oh no nasty evidence, I refute you.

Really? It's up to that much? Well just wait a few more days for a few more people to claim she owes them a few more commissions, it'll go up more.

Considering how many condescending, judgmental and flat out insulting messages you've left people in this issue, I think you can do your own research in this area.

If you can condemn someone on the say so of 4chan, you can bloody well earn your own knowledge. Besides, my point from the beginning has been for people to look for themselves before casting judgment, I'm sure not going to spoon feed you. Think for yourself.

Although I will give you one big piece of info for free, since it's no longer available. Those good, honest, hard working simple folk at 4chan who just want to see justice done went and deleted their links to the various places websites after the giant holes in their accusations were pointed out using their own links. So finding the info might take you a little effort.

Apologies for the wall of text, apparently my long windedness is insulting to some people, I do not mean it to be.

2. No, I was confused at what you were saying... I thought you meant you had never seen the link you just posted. I'm sorry.

3. Well with that explanation there could be many reasons she wasn't at her usual address. The place she lives (according to the IP Arshesnei showed me) isn't that far from the US border. You don't say what country that IP was from, so I'm assuming the USA. Jessica could easily have been back in the US, visiting the US any number of reasons. I log into my accounts from all over the place, I'm very certain I'm not unique in this.

Also, I didn't ignore it, I've said it's in this thread and after all the footwork I've done in this only to be mocked and scoffed at for bothering to think for myself I'm not up to digging through this whole thread looking for it again. Yes I should have written it down someplace, but I didn't. This is nothing personal, please realize I am almost completely blind (as it says in my bio on DA), I can only stand to look into my screen (I need to be literally 3 inches from this thing to see it) for so long at a time. I'd rather use that time drawing than hunting for that link AGAIN. (In case you're wondering I type looking at my keyboard, not the screen.)

4. No. I'm saying that (in Camerella's own words) she doesn't deal with that, her manager does. I don't trust that Jessica knows Camerella, and I don't think any one else does either, but Camerella knew what she was doing and what it was for when she did it. Her manager was the one who took the request and made the transaction. I don't know if Jessica had an explicit contracted permission to do what she did, but considering that Camerella's boss had her set up the special set and specifically hide Cmaerella's identifying features, there is not a doubt in my mind that he knew what they were for, even if no contract was signed. When you consider that entire talent agencies exist in the entertainment biz (easy links below) specifically to provide Hollywood and other industries with fake body parts body doubles, of which Camerella IS a part, it all makes perfect sense.

Link to what you can find in 10 seconds. Imagine what you will find when you actually research it. Here's a preview: it will blow your mind to find out just how many and which people you thought were really them, but aren't.
http://www.imdb.com/keyword/nude-body-double/
http://www.imdb.com/company/co0115764/

You must be thinking of someone else. I've not insulted anyonein this journal, despite you claiming that 3 or more times. You seem quite insistent on that one. I've been sarcastic a few times, but I'd imagine if you can't tell the difference, you probably should look it up. Or do you count disagreeing with you as insults?

Now, funny that you should go off on the whole 4chan thing again. You have this impression that 4chan is all trolls and bad people. That is /b/. Thats like going to a news website and calling it crap because you didn't like the attitude of the weather presenter. /b/ are the troll ones, most of the other channels are a hell of a lot better. Some of the info came from them, but once things started to happen, it was us doing thae majority of the footwork. For a long time, it was one of our threads on the FA forum that was doing the bulk of the investigating and working things out.

It's also interesting that you claim you are telling people to think for themselves. I've been saying that from the start, however, I've been telling people to look at ALL the evidence out there and make their minds up. You seem intent on striking out various reams of information on the basis it might come from a certain website. That is not making your mind up, that's picking and choosing facts to suit you.

And of course the thread is gone from 4chan. Do you not know how those boards work? Nothing gets saved. As new threads appear, older ones fall off the end of the boards. Often a thread lasts only a few hours. It gets pulled back to the first page if someone comments or adds to it, but if it goes quiet, it'll disappear soon enough.

2. It's cool, I've seen the link, I've seen nearly every link on the subject. Heck I even did as you so suggested and did a search for "JessicaElwood" and "Jessica Elwood" in the FA search box, of course I sorted by date as well because, yaknow that's kinda important. Betawolf's drawing is the only drawing posted.

3. The reason I can't tell you what the IP address was, is because Arshes has not told anyone what it was, simply that it was an anomaly. Also: your statement form the DA admins is hearsay, by definition. No one but "JessicaElwood" (supposedly) was told about the DA IP address, who supposedly told Neocloud88 right here http://comments.deviantart.com/5/33.....607/1568176267 (this is actually a reply post but i has all the info and links. So far that's the only link I've seen regarding any sort of DA statement on the matter. I read/skimmed over this entire thread and found no link to where the DA admins said anything.

On the topic of Neoclouds statement, isn't it fishy that the DA admins gave out the location of the "hack" IP so readily?

4. Does Camerella even have a manager? Draping some fabric takes a couple thumb tacks and 10 minutes at worse. "Hiding her defining features" well obviously she didn't do that right cause JE got caught, if you're talking about the tattoo: you tell a camgirl that you paid to cover a tattoo cause you don't like it, she does. If I tell someone that they need to drape some fabric, take some pictures in certain poses, I'm thinking they arn't automatically going to assume that they are going to be used in a fake identity.

Honestly it does not "blow my mind" it makes me sick that the human race is so picky and disgusted by it's own image that we need to go to such that they need to go to such lengths just to hide who they really are. Yes, I am a misanthrope.

2: There was one more for a while. In the description he said he was only going to leave it up for a few days, I thought that was betawolf's, but his is still up and that's not the one I'm thinking of, though I could be wrong.

3: Alright, fair enough, since I can't produce the link and the one you found isn't the one I was talking about. It was a link in this forum. I hate to leave that dangling so I'm going to try to find it after this.

On the subject of Neocloud's statement. I don't find anything the DA admins do fishy anymore. I really don't trust them and I don't think anyone else does either. I'm only siding with them on this subject because it's out of character for them (from what I know) to go through the effort of restoring her account unless they honestly found something.

4: According to her, her photographer handles all the accounting, paperwork, requests etc. That would be a manager. I believe her since she doesn't seem bright enough to me to handle a website on her own what with her shoddy rep and all. Granted it wasn't a very good job they did, and normally I would agree with you there except for the signs she was holding (which, again, she admitted to). Half assed job, yes, but still intentional.

I agree there completely. I try to have an altruistic attitude, but it's an effort to be sure, especially in the face of crap like this. I try to be nice and sweet, but I just don't have it in me lol

I'm still here awaiting my linkage, please.

I can't find it. I should have probably posted it while I still had it up, maybe it's in the DA forums, I don't know.

Fell free to completely disregard all logic and reason on the subject since I can't find a direct post to the DA admins saying they'll do something they've already done. *wink*

Thanks for taking a punch at me for no reason, such a condescending tone is not appreciated, I've been all but civil and produced links when you asked, provided info when you ask, and you tell me I'm acting illogical and unreasonable?

er I mean, "I've only been civil"

I'm sorry, I was trying to poke fun at myself for not being on the ball.

My sincerest apologies.

Incidentally, are you the same wolftherian that left the article about bees for me on DA?

I fail to see how telling me "feel free to disregard logic and reason" is poking fun at ones self.

yes I am

This right here is a blatant lie. Seconds ago I just deleted one of my deviations to test it, deleting it took me naught but 3 seconds and it was off of my gallery instantly, I checked on several different computers from the one I used to delete the deviation.

Unless you mean to delete it from the sites records, then yes, that takes much longer, but during that time, it will not show up in my gallery and I doubt that any Admin is gonna give 2 craps about me deleting en-mass from my gallery if all the reasons are "cleaning up"

Your assumptions are all based on the idea that 4chan, ED and Camerella are all honest people.

They aren't.

I'm not even going to go into the serious steaming piles of human offal that are ED and several sections of 4chan, exept to say thay both site's reputation as fine examples of all that is wrong with humanity are well deserved.

As for Camerella...

#1 Camerella SAYS she wasn't in on it, yet she set up the white backdrop to hide her room, she posed with someone else's drawings, she signed Jessica's name with greetings messages. Camerella WAS pretending to be Jessica Elwood, she knew she was pretending to be Jessica Elwood. The fact that she's claiming not to know what it was going to be fore is flat out not true. Maybe she didn't know who Jessica Elwood was exactly, but she knew she was pretending to be her.

#2 Camerella is a woman who has a long history of non reliability, flexible interpretations of the truth and flakiness. For people to buy into her claim that 'she didn't know' in the same exact conversation in which she admits to posing for them in the same conversation is pure stupidity. It's like believing a drug dealer that admits to selling an 8ball to a college frat but claims he didn't know what the kid was going to to with it.

#3 Camerella has to protect her job and her life. If she admits she knew what was going on she could lose both. This isn't proof that she DID know, it's just a VERY strong reason to question her word.

And you know all this about Camerella how? That's she's a flake and unreliable and untrustworthy? Or are you just saying this to defend "Jessica"? And also... to protect her life? Like someone is going to kill her for knowing the truth? This isn't the fucking X-Files.

I don't mean life as in kill her, I mean life as in her ability to live without people bothering her. Jeeze don't be so dramatic...

As for how I know Camerella to be unreliable info, unlike everyone who, for some reason or other, want desperately to believe that just because they saw it on 4chan it's true, I did my research.

Camerella has been fired from cam websitess twice for failing to show at her due time on multiple occasions, she also has failed to uphold her end of cam requests after saying she would, she has repeatedly stood people up for her chat dates and her record for communicating on her blog at regular intervals is spotty at best. That's all I can recall offhand now, but the information is there, if you care to look.

http://www.furaffinity.net/user/kaceywyandotte/

I guess this puts an end to the this theory then.

Not really. That person may know JE in real life and probally logged on here useing JE's computer.

If you did a an IP address search on me now: My desktop's IP address and later on You might get my laptop's IP address.

I'm not sure if this has any relavance, but my former ISP used to shuffle IP's ever half hour, so the same IP was never used twice.

True, perhaps I should have also mentioned when I asked Dragoneer about in in a PM he replied with

"Kacey W. Andotte's IP address shows they're from Mexico. Jessica Elwood's does not. I see nothing leaking both accounts together at all.

Whoever is claiming admin leak is more than likely making this up, because I see /nothing/ that links those two accounts together at all."

It would figure that Kacey's IP being from mexico would be the cause of all the blown out of proportion 'JE is mexican' stuff.

I can believe it.

I don't believe he was hacked, I believed he did it as some kind of scandal.

Whole thing IS a scandal...with the whole "I'm pretending to be a woman to get more ppl to love my art~"

Wow...just wow...this entire topic is just full of laughs. Such a fierce debate over some fury artist either being hacked or staged "her-"self into getting banned from DA or not. I find this very funny in a sad way, and I'm pretty sure any troll reading into this is getting plenty of lulz.

And I''m gonna laugh when the mst unsuspecting happens and all of you be dumb founded because every debate I'm in has gone to the minority side.

But there's a chace of this too.

You can support Elwood all you want, but personally I find "her" to be an asshole. Trying to contact Elwood repeatedly over the years proving futile and was blocked (for just saying "Hi") and often ignored for no reason. Now when the crap "she's" in now, it's sad but can't say I feel sorry for him/her. Do you really think Elwood needs support? And besides, a theory is just an idea. Nothing more nothing less until proven. If you can contact DA mods and find out about the IP address info, then you'll be able to tell or not. Or even better, allow Jess to explain "her-"self whenever "she" returns to FA.

Accually I got contacted by her when I send a note to her yesturday and she replied twice yesturday.

Here's proof: http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/.....n/Untitled.png
Just taken just now.

And I also stated this is a theory in the begining. What you think why I choosen this journal idea?

Well, aren't we a special one then~ Least to "her." But so what? Is there anything in there that explains what's been going on or what happened? If not, then this doesn't prove anything aside that "she" is around on FA still.

That was just proof that she isn't on here since the ban on DA.

Also ask  neocloud88h, he's basically JE's right hand man for your questions. :3

Don't really care about Elwood enough to do so. After this passes people won't care so much about it...hopefully.

By the way...you ever try to focus on the REAL issue? The "I pretended to be a girl, sorry for lying gaiz" bit about Elwood or whoever he/she really is? You seemed so transfixed on the alleged "hacking" that it doesn't seem to be a concern to you.

How you know it is really real or not? Most of the nnews on the internet can be half truths and full lies. Anyone can put anything up here.

But Jess said this "her-"self...it didn't come from someone else's account journal, but "her's."

Which can be hacked too if you like it or not.

So you're saying just at random "she" was hacked before then, blah blah...any proof to back this up aside from your "theory?" Because from what you and werecat here are saying, it's the same damn thing "it's only theory!" to excuse the FACT you have no real facts to support the hack as legit. If you know this right hand man of Elwood so much, why don't you get the info from him about it? Or ask Elwood "her-"self since bitch will actually reply to you. Isn't that what you did and showed me that screenshot of her noting you? Or was it just staged?

Because I don't want to go into epole's ow buissness and don't really care if everyone ands a awnswer from her now when she's doing commissions for the people she owes for two year?

Um...type clearer please. Your anger is showing.

Shut up. I have a wireless keyboard here that I forgot where the charger is untill now.

Because I don't want to go into people's own buissness and don't really care if everyone wants a awnswer from her now because she's doing commissions for the people she owes for two year?

Don't want to go into people's business..*facepalms* Why did you make these journals? And not care of an answer!? You must be the attorney for Elwood then...yeah, way to go. Make a journal offering theories and crap yet not even ask the person about what happened because "she" is too busy working on 2 year old commissions?

Yeah, I think I'm done here.

Dude. I'm just sideing and giving possibilities here. Also if I was her attorny, I would've convinced her to tell now.

Like I said...I'm done here. You only give possibilities, but nothing to really support it. You could try and get more info from the person, but you don't want to. You don't want to be in someone's business but that's all this journal is, about Elwood's business on DA from the alleged hack. You deny anything that's said to call it a hoax without much knowledge, Werecat will discredit any source that's not Elwood saying it...and if it's admitting to it being staged then Werecat would say it was the hacker.

For all I know, you could've just pulled this out your ass and been like "I think Elwood is innocent and nothing you say is more logical since nothing else is known!" And that is why I've been keeping up with this journal. Trying to get somewhere on your end only to find yourself being too lazy on facts over a serious issue towards someone's image. I made a journal long time ago about how artists and fans are getting further and further because of drama crap, and there I give my reasons and examples why. Here, it's just word of mouth, there's no real point in continuing anyways since again, no one knows how it really went down and you're certainly by the sound of it not trying to find out. So good night.

If you done here, then why continue on something you don't want to?

Plus if I did try, she most like not talk about how this happen anyways with very short messages I got, which not going to give because I'm pretty much done on this issuee and now on my car's shifter issue and if you think I'm being her Attorny here again: you must be very bored since you even bothered to continue after you said you are done.

And stop Trolling please: If I'm giving you an head ack over this, then save yourself and stop than trolling. Thank you. :)

Yes, she does.

I know I'd want it if this crap had happened to me.

Being aloof doesn't equate to being an asshole.

I'd call it dodging and lying.

not answering your messages and putting you on ignore isn't lying, nor is it dodging. It's not wanting to talk to someone.

Saying you never blocked the person when you did, and for no particular reason does seem like lying to me. And the fact whenever I tried to get in contact, she'd have some sort of excuse why she couldn't then stopped replying to my messages at all when I just try and contact "her" on friendly terms.

And don't you think the main issue here isn't being addressed? Like, the whole taking pics of several women on the internet and pretending to be them to gain more attention. So why care so much about the hack? "She" is on FA still and whatever so what's it matter?

Jessica Elwood has a reputation (weather it's deserved or not, I don't know) for being aloof. As I understand it she doesn't like talking to people.

If you walk up to someone in real life who doesn't want to talk to anyone and keep saying 'hi!' to them in an effort to be friendly, eventually the person will call the police.

I don't know how many messages you sent her, but have you considered the possibility that you were making her feel harassed, even if that wasn't your intention?

Then why she BSing about "loving her fans" or had any reason to lie to me? I introduced myself and tried going on from there. Then again, what would make you or Ice here so damn special to "her" anyways?

If the bitch couldn't say they felt threatened, then she can just fuck off because that's "HER" deal...I hate fucking bitches that do that, they pretend to be nice and friendly when you contact them but then talk about you like shit to others. Seems highly mentally unstable insecure crazy or elitist bitch, take your pick.