huh seems very interesting indeed I live in Florida ironically enough

me too :3 just outside orlando :3 East orlando :3

far from there I'm on the panhandle x3

same here! :O woot panhandel furs! :D

x3

Tampa!

Wow, those pictures... I can now show my mum, "Hey at least my rooms not that bad."

Ironically, my girlfriend is living in Florida right now......

It sounds less like taking "back" control of ones life and more like trashing an ex for the sake of trashing an ex.

Props to you for having the courage to change your life! Most people just have a "better the Devil you know" attitude to their hardships, and it's inspiring to read about someone who took the initiative.

Damn...

And this be the reason I myself have been single and celibate for the past 6 years

Sure it is, lol...

Celibacy is not a temporary thing, it is a livelong thing. So you can't be "celibate for 6 years"; you're either celibate your whole life (or from the point of taking a vow of celibacy) or not at all.

The correct term is, "I ain't been gettin any action."

Celibate , single , 6 years. whats your story?

SoooOooo glad I am single. Love it. 7 years of freedom.
And she reminds me of some room mates I had to live with for months before I finally found my own place - some people you just DON'T go well along with!

the worst my roommate has done is buy a sponge bob shower curtain lol even my 1SG was like WTF

damn dude that was bad....it's good you got her out and you do make an amazingly simple yet powerful point

I'm single, and I'm happy with it, though for different reasons. I personally just don't find any need in a relationship right now. It just simply doesn't benefit to my life at the moment.

I see a lot of people talking about how happy they are to be single, and you all have seemed to miss the part where he's a lot happier in a better relationship.

Relationships can be hell, as he has clearly proven, but relationships can be just as uplifting and wonderful as they can be horrendous.

Well, for the sake of anyone clinging to an unhealthy relationship for a fear of being single, it's not a bad thing to talk about how being single isn't bad.

That's true, but I think the fear of being single is more of fear of not being able to find a healthy relationship instead. I find it more encouraging to emphasize and encourage people to try and find better relationships in addition to breaking unhealthy ones. I think that keeps in line with the "improving yourself and your situation" ideal, yes?

I don't think a relationship has to be a goal, like that of improving yourself. A relationship is dependent not just on your own effort, but the effort of another person. Improving yourself is entirely within your power. A relationship relies on another.

Of course, I agree completely. Relationships are joint efforts. That doesn't mean that you can't improve yourself by improving your relationship.

I feel that extolling the virtues of being single undermines the benefits of being in a happy stable relationship. While I think that someone can be perfectly happy being single, and that people ought to leave unhealthy relationships and take control of their lives as you said, I also think that being in a healthy relationship is good for all involved.

In other words, a relationship isn't something that necessarily needs to be strived for, but not something to dismiss because of a bad one.

A third person observer will tell you whats really going on, and friend will do it even when you don't want to hear it. Sometimes you're mind and heart lie to you.
Also; metric ton of crap, just wow. How did you put up with that messy of a place? I'd be trashing stuff daily. "wheres my shirt? you the one with such and such" "Oh yea, I donated it to good will yesterday, you didn't want it, it had been lying on the floor for three days."

Seizing control of one's destiny is one thing, but to dismiss hoarding as simply "laziness" is another. For some, yeah, that's all it is, but for others there are real issues (often as a symptom of depression). I've seen both types of cases personally.

Doesn't mean one has to put up with it. It also doesn't mean the hoarder has to lie about how they'll clean up. I've known depressed people who have the mental cognition to know when they are symptomatic. They don't use their mental condition as an excuse to wallow in filth. They mentally understand it's filth, despite their emotional condition. Enabling isn't helping. Excusing isn't helping. When someone embraces their psychosis, it is laziness.

Typically people who hoard have some form of OCD. They realize they have an issue, but they're unable to let go of things. Different people handle different situation differently. No, I'm not saying we should coddle hoarders, but calling them lazy is inacurate.

There was more to her than hoarding. Whether it was a physiological or not it isn't anything anyone deserves to live with. Not even the saps defending her.

I'm not defending her. I just don't think a hoarder should be described as "lazy".

Granted, but but anyone who dries themselves with a towel soaked in cat piss is most definitely lazy and gross.

Jesus tap dancing Christ...that place looks like a pig pen, I don't see how you could deal with it. Most women I know are messy, why I have no idea...hey is that a thong hanging from your white cube boxes? :o

I comend you for being able to get rid of her the way you did. In most relationships its really hard to get rid of someone so easily, I use the term easily lightly because it took a little while for you to get her after much prodding and prying to get her to clean everything up.

I am a very understanding individual and I love helping people out when I can, but when someone really doesn't listen to me about their problem I get annoyed. I can't stand it when I see the solution right in front of me and they find someway to work around it and say "You don't understand". For me, its a complete waste of time even trying. But alas I guess you can't change years of growing up with a problem within a couple of years.

Sorry to rant in your ear, bad relationships hit a kind of chord with me. It strikes my fancy that even famous people whom actually have a head on their shoulders end up with bad people. I have to say you definitely deserved someone better and you found her =^^=

Well, it was somewhat easier than I thought. For a while I really feared I would have to roll up my sleeves and start tossing stuff out.

That's how I feel when I watch the Hoarders shows.

I lived w/ a woman in fl once. ;P

I miss Sara. :CCC

God damn...I don't know which is worse, the situation you went through or the fact that it feels like the behavior of most of the people around me.

Jesus. I cannot thank you enough for sharing this, as ugly as the experience is.

Jesus.. I dunno how you could put up with that kind of nonsense. I do have to ask though, was she a furry and I'm gonna assume she wasn't.

Thats funny how you mention her being in the paper, I remember reading through alot of those articles, I by chance coulda ended up reading hers.

You mentioned she was a stripper, which place did she work at? One in Melbourne or over in Cocoa Beach?

That was a pretty nice read. And quite a fine attitude you took. I'm glad you managed to get back to your own life after all this ^^

Despite currently being in a very comfortable and satisfying relationship myself, this is encouraging. And whether or not one has been there before, it's a perfect example of what not to be. It was a great read. Makes me feel like posting my own bit about mind-warping, internet stalkers. Perhaps another time. And even though there was a happy ending, the gushy side of me (which could be any side =P) wants to hear the unabridged fairy tale ending. |3

When I looked at the mess... I thought, Dear GOD.. and I thought one of my roommates was bad!

All things mentioned could have been dealt with, including the cats disobedience and filth well within whatever time frame I am sure you gave her. Looking at the state of the room, I am sure it could have been done with one days hard work, and likely a friend who could help. I assume that if she would have asked you to help her, and just worked one full day on it (assuming she put just as much effort forth as you), you would have given it to her. I like tackling big messes [like my garage] with my BF. I think its great to strengthen a relationship, and you both get the satisfaction of a nice clean house. Nothing like that serene feeling, like you feel as clean as everything around you.

Either way, its good you got out of that, stood up for yourself, and had her leave. Not only was that taxing on you mentally, but I am sure that it was not healthy to be around the filth. Cat mess alone can make you ill if you do not take care of it properly.

Thanks for sharing, and also, very well written.

i just got out of a three year relationship with an alcoholic we had a child together and im just trying to keep my self from taking him back

A lot of single mothers catch hell, but I think a kid is better off without a father than with a bad one.

my apartment used to look worse then those pictures you showed in your journal i just couldn't keep up with his mess ....he lives in another state now it was him being farther away that made it easier to leave him ....i'd rather be a single mom then be and alcoholic's wife

IT IS DELICIOUS HATRED
I MUST EAT IT

SAVE ME SOME

I read that top to bottom. All of it, every last bit, is true, and I'm really glad you're trying to point that out to people.

Good job.

one thing I love listening to and reading are stories.

Yeah, I'm glad you got out of that. i've been through that alot myself. and i see you said you were in Sattelite Beach:) it is a beautiful place. I lived there as well off Berkeley St. had a canal in my back yard, took me five minutes to Walk to the beach. Glorious indeed!

Balls, really? I was right off of Berkeley and 1. Shore View Apts.

yep i know those apartments. pink or blue kitchen? hehe

Fairly normal kitchen. I moved in when they were blue. They painted them cream or something right before I left.

haha Awesome. too bad i didn't know you were there. i'd have hung out. hehe

I, too, lived with this woman in Florida once.

I married her. Three years later the judge signed the decree, and ever since I celebrate June 12th.

There's a reason I dubbed her The Evil Succubus.

Psh, those photos. You call that a mess? That chick's a neat freak compared to some people I know. That room just looks unorganized; I know people whose entire homes are just truly revolting. You ain't seen nothin, man.

Psh, those photos. You call that a mess? That chick's a neat freak compared to some people I know. That room just looks unorganized; I know people whose entire homes are just truly revolting. You ain't seen nothin, man.

Heh, my mothers best friend lived in a house that was bug infested, mold everywhere.... and dog shit on every inch of the floor, though she did have 31 dogs... DX It was truly horrible ,_,

Well damn . . . I've been one-up'd. I mean sure there was mold and rotten food, and bugs, but dog shit? The worst I've seen is an unmaintained litter box.

Well, don't ever come to North Carolina. It is a horrid place and a lot of people live that way :S

wow man... well, you did well in stepping up.

and... you know, oddly enough... I'm renting a room where I have my own convenient space for me and whatnot, the house is practically divided by my space (which includes part of the kitchen for me to use)

interesting fact is that the son of the landlords is... lazy... like... VERY LAZY... and his girlfriend is just as lazy... simple example... the trash can has a bag and is next to the bar so trash goes in there right away.

I don't say anything for how well they treat me and the excellent price for my place, I just end up removing the little containers and wrappers before they accumulate that even his girlfriend leaves when she comes around... on the bar...

I've been saving some money due to this, I'm intending to move out of the place to have my own personal space.

After a while I don't care for tiny garbage since I remove it with enough time before it accumulates... but you know, having your own space means not having to clean someone's else trash would feel kinda nice. Not like I have to remove loaded bags or such.

Definite eye opener.

Ow wow, you've met my ex obviously.

One in four people become mentally ill at some point in their lives.

Consider that before you characterise mentally ill people as Lazy, Craven or Disgusting; because some day you might be the one who needs help and has to face abuse like that from people who know nothing about mental illness.

Hoarders do not choose to be sick and you have no right to denigrate them for being sick. Whether someone is mentally ill, learning disabled, physically disabled or otherwise requires help to live their life to the fullest, they have a right to not be abused for needing that help.

There is nothing craven about people who admit they need help, it's the biggest step in being mentally ill and in recovering, that you dare to characterise them as craven in your post is nothing short of ill informed bias in action.

Regardless of what your issues with your Ex are, the bigoted comments you make in the post are absolutely disgusting and completely uncalled for.

And pathetic enablers like you only make things worse, and cause the lazy to self-diagnose to avoid responsibility for their actions.

Don't use my journal to self-aggrandize about whatever pet issues you have regarding the mentally ill. Not interested.

Jesus Christ Jay! the Enemies you make!

where do these people find you?

While I agree that it isn't right to belittle the mentally ill, even doctors are saying these days a lot of people who believe they are mentally ill are really perfectly healthy. Any depression becomes clinical depression requiring an anti-depressant, and trouble losing weight becomes obesity, and problems in quitting drinking becomes alcoholism.

People these days watch shows like Intervention and Hoarders and think that they know what to do when a person has a "mental illness" and immediately say they should go to rehab. But what people forget is that on Intervention, the producers pay for the rehabilitation, which costs an arm and a leg. Most people don't have the tens of thousands of dollars required for quick fix to their problems. It's usually going to take a lot of work and long term commitment.

Secondly, from Jay's account, it doesn't sound like she was mentally ill, it sounds like she was lazy. She didn't claim to have any attachment to these things, she just found it easier to let the junk build than throw it away. I've worked and lived with autistic people, and I've seen people clinically diagnosed with autism who often have had problems keeping a clean living area because the mess sometimes becomes part of a world they have to control. Then again, there are autistics who keep very clean rooms and will have a bad reaction to any mess. Being a pack rat doesn't necessarily equate to a mental illness, and in this case it seems very unlikely the girl was anything other than lazy.

Even if she was mentally ill, you're not obligated to commit yourself to someone with that problem if it isn't something you can live with. It isn't fair to you to have to deal with someone else's problem if you're not prepared to live like that, it isn't fair to them to be supported by someone who will likely come to resent them for their disability. Having lived and worked with disabled people, I can tell you from experience that even direct family members can have a LOT of resentment toward a disabled person. I appreciate your sympathy for the disabled, but I think you're jumping the gun a bit here. :)

Oh, please...
If I were ill, I'd want to feel better, to be healed from my illness, being it physical or mental; she obviously didn't want that.
If I didn't want to heal myself, while this behaviour would be odd, I would at least have the decency not to drag people I claim to care for (and anybody else too) into the dephts of my illness. Noone can stop me from living in hell if I want so, as well as noone has to live my hell just because I want so. I would totally deserve the disrespect of someone I wanted to drag down with me.
If I were affected by this Hoard syndrome (and maybe I am, I am fond of things I don't need anymore, beyond the level my personal space allows) and a friend of mine would do a thing such as Fisk did... sure, I'd be pissed off at first, but then I'd thank him, because his message, while being strong, it would be a discreet mean to try to shake me off of my bad habits, even if this wasn't intended.
But anyway... have you read it? Have you seen those photos? That's not hoarding. There is some much stuff, yeah, but most of it, there is the total lack of will to try to keep it a little tidily... Come on, cat's piss on clothes and furnitures, and denial of their instincts? Stinky towels in the bathroom? Lies? That's plain laziness and stubborness. I'd say Fisk has been polite in his description.

While I still think what I wrote here above, I realized that I wrote it on the wrong assumption that subversive-imaginati wrote something against Fisk's experience instead on replying to the implicit insults Fisk wrote on his journal about a whole category of hoarders. I am referring to the "I was reminded of this while watching "Hoarders: Buried Alive" on television, where The Learning Channel has made a television show out of craven laziness masquerading as a mental disease." comment.
I couldn't see that show, but I think Fisk should apologize for that comment. Having an opinion about a category of people is fine, but insulting them is not. Human mind is complicated and work in ways that are hard to comprehend for the specialists in that sector, and harder for those who are not. I think that, about hoarding, it's hard to tell the difference between "craven laziness" and a mental illness. Surely I don't have the title to tell the difference, and I guess Fisk has not as well; but mixing them is insulting, as well as if it was said of black people that "they're disgustingly filthy, masqueraded as black people", of if it was said about someone who is affected by leprosy that "he's an unholy person punished by the Lord, masquerated as a poor ill guy". We're in the 21st century, we know better.
I hope Fisk will apologize soon for that. Illnesses of any kind are a touchy matter, we shouldn't deal with them through insults, especially if we're not extremely well sure about what we're saying.

Maxwell Atoms said it best: "Never date a stripper."

Great to hear that you got out when you did. Relationships like that tend to alienate your friends and family, taking you blindfolded in the passenger seat, down a lonely and ruinous road.

I've seen some hoarding... that wasn't hoarding. That looks more like simple laziness and a self-destructive denial of responsibility. Even if it was mental illness, there's nothing anywhere that says you have to allow yourself to get dragged down with her.

Glad to see you're on a better road.

I'm so glad that ended. I was wondering if I needed to kidnap you and the loaf to save you.

That logic also works for house guests and friends. I ended up running a few friends out of my house because of their habits.

Urf. If that was just the bedroom, I'd hate to see some of the other rooms. I'm a bit of a pack rat myself, but I will never ever be that bad. Or I hope I won't. :/

A lot of people point out that hoarding could be a symptom of a lot of things (depression, OCD, laziness), but there is no reason that a person can't buckle down and get clean it up when it needs to be cleaned up. THAT is laziness. We're currently in the middle of adding on to our house and my family is using that as a reason to go through closets, under beds, through the garage, basement storage, everything and throw out or donate or sell whatever we can. It's really not that hard to find a reason to do it - and she should've done that before moving in with you or before moving to wherever she went afterward. If she didn't, there's nothing that can help her.

Man, if I could have taken that advice a decade ago. I bet I would have ignored it though, thinking the problem was me and blaming myself, and so desperately wanting to work things out. :P

Wow, you moved fast with that gal, and disturbingly so at that. She must've been very appreciative in the sack for you put up with her craziness for so many months. I doubt I'd have done anything you did in the same situation with my experience.

"their hatred tastes delicious." *omnomnomnomnom*

Cool story bro.

thank you Fisk. I read the whole thing. and though I have never come across anything like that in my own life. it helped me realize a lot of things about myself and the life around us. no i am not a slob or one of those people. but it taught me a lot of what to look out for and what are the consequences. thank you.

I live with my brother, and he can be quite the pig. Never does the dishes, leaves food boxes laying on the counter. His room, cant even see the floor. unwashed and unfolded clothes on the floor.
Sometimes it is best to be alone, or with someone that you can get along with, and actually cares about their environment and the people in it (meaning he living space)

My wife passed away from cancer two weeks ago. I am now left single and terrified in a cold hostile world. Yesterday was our 38th wedding anniversary.

I actually just moved out of Florida to Montana, visit Florida once in a while for family. Moved to Montana chasing a relationship. Which ironically its leaving me for Germany.

Don't be a stranger.

Was she beautiful ? Do you have a picture of her ?

Heh, I feel sad for looking at those cluttered pictures and feeling that it was clean compared to how I lived when I was with my family. We could spend weeks cleaning everything up and it'd be destroyed again in a day. I'm really glad I moved out.

Also thanks for posting such an inspirational message, I know a lot of people out there need it.