some examples of 'coloured sketch' may help :D

It would probably also help if he didn't put "Reserves the right to sell prints for $12" with nothing about giving a little to the owner of the character copyright. Though that is if someone agrees to the deal. I might still consider it myself but I need to see.

Sorry, don't know how I read that wrong. It just says "Dragoneer reserves the right to sell any artwork created as prints. "

Great price on the sketches though I will admit.

Hey, if someone wants to buy a picture of a giant green kangaroo, go right ahead. I doubt there's much of a market for that.

i do it :3 buying the sales rights to be an image is WAY more expensive afterall if the commissioner wishes to do that

I have never had an artist sell a print of something that was my character without asking my permission... ever. Like I said, a good deal but some people might not go for that. Though you are right, at least he says upfront he will do that if he wants to instead of just up and doing it.

If an artist was selling a print/something of me without having been up front or information I gotta say I'd be a bit peeved. I don't care if they /do/, but for the love of God... just let me know.

You are cool Neer. Thanks for being upfront ^^.

But but how else is he gonna afford a new super powerful TF2 server ?

Oh wait...

:D

Haha, I don't have any TF2 servers. =P

if you want i can make one, just need a good hoster for it.

But i got somthing better

Killing floor

Much better and much more teamwork orientated.

And my brother has already got one going i just need to setup the config file.

I havent started drawing anything myself cos work has pretty much taken over everything and my "amazon Kindle" addiction lol

On both my computer and my Android cellphone hehe.

Once i source a good enough tablet unit, i will see what i can do.

You can't copyright characters, I wish people would research and learn this.

You need to trademark a character to protect it's design and that requires a lot of work.

Not so much work as it is money. Thankfully no one gives a shit about my ideas :P.

Money isn't the issue, it's the secondary requirements for protection that people often fail at, registering it is the easy part, using it for cross state commercial enterprises however is a whole different kettle of fish and often is what people fail to do.

When I did research and try to learn about this in the past, there were quite a few articles from lawyers and law firms saying you could copyright a fictional text character or a graphic character, including citing some precedents. Here is one example:

http://www.publaw.com/article/prote.....ic-characters/

Of course you can trademark them too, with the protections offered by each differing and there are, potentially grey, qualifiers needed for copyright to apply.

That's mostly characters being copyrighted as part of a -whole- ie something like buffy is copyrighted as part of the whole series, so it's not just what she looks like but also her position and influence in the "buffy" world, most of the "copyright" people talk about on character's refers only to their design which has to be trademarked.

Fact is the vast majority of characters do not meet the requirements to be protected under either law.

Except some of these lawyers have claimed precedent seems to show more and more in favor of being able to protect just the looks of the character. The article I linked cites one case where it was just name and exact looks. I vaguely remember another case involving a plushie being made of a cartoon character that was considered infringing based on looks alone.

My point being not that claims to a copyright on characters on FA are true, just that, "You might need to consult a lawyer for any certainty about character copyright based on your specific body of work," "Character copyright gives you less protection than you might think," or just, "Character copyright can be tricky," are a long way from saying, "Character copyright doesn't exist."

Precedent doesn't make laws though, it just affects how the law is interpreted in future IF the judge in the case decides to use the precedent. There literally is no legal term known as "character copyright", some characters might be protected due to meeting some fairly difficult to meet guidelines but mostly they're not coyprightable in and of themselves.

There's a difference between "some designs may be possible eligible for protection under current laws" and "character copyright" the latter does not exist, not as a legal definition.

I should have been more careful with my wording. While the term "character copyright" might not have a legal definition, I am speaking colloquially and not in legalese, e.g. the word "effectively" could be crammed into a lot of what I posted. I actually agree with your Buffy example because that is how I usually think of character copyright. Although some furs do have a decent collection of works with their character in it (visual, writing, or other). The question of whether copyright is applicable to characters in those situations, in the conservative sense or possibly broader senses, seems to not be answerable by a clear-cut, or knee-jerk, answer either way. In specific cases, that question is something to ask an actual lawyer about, or for a court to actually settle, but in general the answer I've found from people seeming to have much more background than either of us is, "Possibly, you should try for every kind of reasonable protection anyway."

Also to possibly clarify, I've mostly read about US copyright law and advice, I don't know copyright as well in the UK or elsewhere.

(And I possibly agree with something you posted below in a sense, that a lot of the precedent involves large companies and may be near impossible to parallel on a smaller scale. I view this as mostly theoretical anyway, in the sense I would expect very few, if any, of the various potential problems involving furry art to actually ending up involving a lawyer or court for a variety of reasons. So what actually legally works is moot.)

Indeed, so really when you get down to it, we're both technically right, we just approached it from slightly different viewpoints. There is no defined copyright for characters, just a loose collection of cases where copyright has been extended onto characters for one reason or another which aren't necessarily going to always apply or fly in court. So while a character may be protected by copyright, there isn't any defined way to copyright them because the few precendents are legal anomalies.

The problem is it's a murky area at the best of times, even a lawyer can't necessarily know the outcome in most cases, it's like fair use, often it's a case of getting it into court before it can stand or fall.

While I think the purposely murky nature of copyright law could potentially be beneficial (common law vs. civil law arguments aside), it can take a lot of the fun out of arguing on the internet.

Indeed it can

Or maybe you don't want to be proven wrong. Fyi has a very good point! And if it's YOUR original character, product, etc. you have every right in the world to protect it. It is your own. People can't use it without your permission. If they did, it is theft and can be viewed as a federal crime.

Or maybe I understand that a term doesn't exist just because a in a mere handful of cases involving large business entities with clearly deliniated trademarked properties those properties also received protection under copyright law due to their unique nature.

FYI may have a point that some characters can be protected under copyright but at the same time, A: It's only ever applied to some, B: character copyright isn't a legal term in copyright law, it's a precedent driven interpretation of current copyright that covers a very small number of cases and C: Most characters are not eligible for any protection in that way.

If you know SOOOOOOO much, why don't you get a life and be a lawyer

Got one thanks, I'm training to be an artist, hence actually learning this stuff so I know when and how my stuff is protected best.

As for why I'm not a lawyer? Because then I'd have to deal with all the braindead furries who think that their derpy looking blue fox with giant balls is worth something and bawww furryfourballs totally stole their idea by having a derpy green fox with four giant balls, quite frankly there isn't enough alcohol for me to put up with what I'd end up listening to.

Being an artist isn't a career... It's a hobby.

People don't have to be braindead to have feelings! I doubt you would be very happy if someone stole one of your ideas. You shouldn't care about the shit that other people go through. Maybe if it actually happened to you and you could relate, you could talk but you cant bash someone for something that you know nothing about.

So who do you think does all the artwork you see every day in your life? That's right, Artists. It's definitely a career.

People have pinched some of my stuff in the past, but there's a difference between actual violation of an artist's rights and the usual drama crap that results when the braindead think that someone can steal or for that matter would want their genericass characters.

http://painting.about.com/od/career...../artcareer.htm


So, being an artist is no a career, huh? Go back to school.

Wow you can calm down...
I'm in school dumbass

Sure coulda fooled me.

You have absolutely NO reason to be a dick to me. You don't fucking know me so don't be a dick. I really should report you to admin... even though we are on THE OWNER'S PAGE!!!!!
The fact that you have guts enough to be an asshole on Neer's journal is outstandingly stupid...

Sorry i'm too busy laughing my ass off to concentrate on your reply.

PS: Copyright violation is a civil crime unless it if of sufficient scope in a district that has a felony version of copyright violation. The average furry is unlikely to have something stolen and profited from enough that it would rate a felony.

PS: I meant theft in general. Civil, federal, whatever the case may be, it is still a crime and will go unexcused in any society.

Doesn't work that way sorry, theft of a character counts as violation of civil rights, not actual straight theft.

Doesn't fuckin matter. Stealing is stealing. Violation of civil rights is even worse! (theoretically)
You don't want to lose rights. No one does. Laws can be broken and all is forgiven after a fitting punishment. But violating someone's rights is just a pointless, low, immature thing to do.

They're completely different in legal terms.

My point still remains, it still isn't a felony.

Hmm, I may sign up for that if I manage to get employed soon. :3

i'd love to get to be a "iron artist" but i'm worried i'd have to pay <:(

Wrap yourself in aluminium foil. XD

WIN^

*insert awesome face here*

What are the prices?

12$ o.o

Just saw and paid :3 $12 is nothing

hehe awesome sauce

i send 12$ and filled it out =3

Do we fill out two separate forms if we want two slots?

Ugh I wish I had knew the answer to this before they all filled out :\ Too bad I guess

Signed up. Yeee!

paid too, probably should mention that part XD

pfffttt go figure the day i change banks and have to wait for my damn card to come so i can use paypal. hopefully you have some slots later lol

Tabula rasa. Very nice!

i would like to take one but i would like to see a example how a colored sketch lookslike dragoneer befor i do
would you save a spot for me till i see one?

Check the journal now.

i hope i made it in time...
allways bad to wait even a minute for a reply when it is YOU x3
so many people... woar
so full the list o.o
good luck on the challenge!

done....annnnnd done^^

Cant right now, commissioning others right now but if there are open spots next week, then yes I will

Sent mine! ^.==.^

are there any examples?

I would like to see an example of how the colored sketches look as well, before I fork over money to get one. ^^

You mentioned during Sciggles stream that you had a lot of art to get through. I emailed your furaffinity address recently wondering when you're going to start the commission from the auction I won. If you have trouble raising what you need for the merchant aggreement, I can contribute

Yeah, I'm raising money for FA. =/

I sent $55, minus whatever fees they'll take out. the paypal address is the same as the one I emailed you from regarding the commission you owe, please reply letting me know when I should expect progress.

I'm not interested in the iron artist offer itself

I'll take two homes!

Make that 4! HAHA! money/form sent!

Woot! Filled out the form and sent my payment!

Filed and sent.

Form completed, payment sent! Can't wait to see what you do with it.

#7L845941V87846747

I will have money next Thrus. and when I do I'm buying one!

I do have one question though. Are you willing to do copy written species (i.e. pokemon, digimon, ect.)? Because if you're willing, I'd love to get one of my Koopa girl.

man ._. I don't get my taxes soon enough xD;;;; T_T *whine*

*inserts baww comment about not having money*

Done and done! Thanks. ^^

Filled out the form, do I have to wait for confirmation before I send the payment?

Nvm XD did it anyways

wow I cant wait to see it.

I DON'T QUALIFY FOR ANY OF YOUR BODY TYPE PRESETS D:<

Might I suggest HULK SMASH

ARE YOU MAKING FUN OF THE VOLUME OF MY VOICE?! I'LL HAVE YOU KNOW THAT THIS IS A VOLUME CONTROL PROBLEM!

You're right, he doesnt have any provisions for eggs.

*Hops on this one :P

Did and done

Might want to disable the public viewing of responses though :)

Not quite sure what I make of this whole 'pay up front before I know my idea's even approved' thing, but... Eh, I'll give it a shot. n.n

Ohwait, single character, yeah that makes more sense then. c.c

VORE YOURSELF

MMMMMM

doing it wrong xp

1 character only

self noms is the only way to go

unless half a character + half a character = 1 character ?

:P

*rubs the word "joke" on you* '.=.' but think of a snake noming itself and someone saying what i said x3. of course i knew it's only one character XD.

A good idea indeed :B

Signed up and money sent.

Filled out the form and sent the payment!

I'll take one :)

Sweet, payment sent and form filled out.

jeez how the heck do you have time for this

I'll be taking one! :3

these are going to fill up fast!

Submitted, and payment sent. <3

I sent my desc to you, sending money now with my Username.

Is it too much to ask you to join a part of my .hack//Digimon Project for that price? Meaning you draw me in any .Hack//'s Classes, examples below

http://www.furaffinity.net/view/4789965/
http://www.furaffinity.net/view/4789837/
http://www.furaffinity.net/view/3746025/
http://www.furaffinity.net/view/3830579/
http://www.furaffinity.net/view/3719959/

I'd still be interested either way But I thought i should ask first :x

I have a feeling he won't have time to answer any questions. I'd fill out the form and pay ASAP before they are GONE.

Yeah i just ended up saying "Meh do whatever you want" xD

Before you fill the whole list Dragoneer you missed me? D: i was the first to post that i paid and sent one but im not on the list?

He'll get to it. I'm sure there was others that submitted before you. =) Be patient. That's allot of notes to have to look through for names.

yea i sent him a note because i don't want to wait for a commission right now that's why i posted right away and im seeing people who posted 30mins after i did getting before me so.

I think I just jizzed a little

Damn 'Neer!
Here come your FA funds for the month xD

sent the money and the form :3

I shall send the form posthaste

OMGawd it's Mirri ringfox x.x I swear, when are you guys going to implement some kind of name change service :P Everybody gets mine wrong. I use Mirriwah everywhere else, since Mirri seems to be quite the popular name for some reason.

Bet this fills up fast, $12 seems almost too cheap, like... As if you don't value your time or skills much D:

Still, I'm sure no fans will complain :P

OMG IMG TAGS.

Yay! Money and form sent. :3

filled and paid =)

Sorry if my descriptions was simplistic, I wanted to make sure to get in yet have something you could draw from! Also I'm not sure if you allowed characters to be mixed up?

And money was sent

Now I think on it, I should had attached a couple more references too

*waits for name to show up* UG, I didn't make it on first 50. Damn that went fast! I typed so hard too! XD

Money and Information sent...

awesome, been a while

I got one sent, Payment too! :3 I hope you have fun with mine. ^^ Go all out if you wish :3

Sent > 3>

jesus christ, talk about filling up slots in 10 minutes.

Geez! I want one! I'll send the form and payment asap! I just wanna comment here so I don't miss out! XD

i know slots will be filled up by the time i get an answer...but two questions.

1) need to fill out two forms for separate characters being that they are one character a piece?

2) doing this again? (obvious question due to "oops ran out" factor)

Form sent, payment sent :3

... holy faku that filled up fast.

BOUGHT :D

OH. I was expecting to be number hundred, but that's fine too. :3

Also, what if I've got some minor tweaks to add to the form I sent, could I contact you for those or is it final out?

I think I may have sent something the second you closed it lol

Neer: Remove that link to the forms or people will just keep sending them to you despite your please that it's CLOSED!

You know i'm right. :P

I know, was trying to handle it as fast as I could.

Ahh..sent it too late. Should've known it would fill up so quickly!

What? You didn't fill out 1 to 100! There are an infinite number of numbers between 1 and 2 alone, let alone 1 and 100!

XDD Joking, joking.

That should be a nice bit of money for you though. :3

well, I guess i sent it too late almost half an hour ago...
Refunds?

TY Neer

Yep, sending them out as quick as I can.

Shiiiiit, I step out of the house for an hour and I miss this? :P

Hun I was here and missed it.

Haha.. I think I was too slow. I filled out the form and sent the money, but you closed out while I filled it out, lol.

Sorry, dude.

Eeeek.. just made it! <3

oO sucks to have to sleep or have a real life and miss out on oppertunities like this all the time :(

Yeah, I got my form in and money paid before it closed but missed out anyway. Sadragon ;.=.;

Refund was nice and swift though, thanks <3

Sorry about that. =/

Nahhh, it's cool! Sh

You had a massive response to your posting, should have expected you to fill your quota that quickly. Just need to watch out for when you open for real commissions or if you take on another iron artist after this one!

And the speed of your refunds was awesome, I was expecting it to be next day at least!

: /

Dammit... *glares at people who bought multiple spots*

So if we submitted and payed we are in then right.

Jesus fuck. Damn I wanted one of these :(

ffff ive wanted art from you for ages, im kinda ive missed this chance

Thanks for refunding ASAP, Dragoneer.

will you also be taking up this opportunity of inspiration to draw out the long standing art trades you owe?

Yes.

*laughs* 100 slots filled in an hour. Nice!

Hrr, you still owe me one. I will always remember. :)

Too bad I missed out on this thing, would've joined otherwise.

Accursed pathetic body and your biological need to sleep! FOILED AGAIN D:<

Damn . those went quick

Damn, knew I should've jumped when I first saw this... I'll offer $50 to be #101...!

Shit, make $100.

Hahaha. What? =P

I'm a crazy sum bitch. I'll offer between $50-100 (you choose =P) to be #101 (or whatever, just added to the list of awesomeness).

Please find professional (or at least financial) help.

Haha $100 is chump change for us lol. :P

...bloddy hell

only 2 hours and its already full

You opened up when I was broke. Sad that I missed this.

wait.. what? Aah, missed it.

Holy hell! I saw this in class and waited till I got home. Wow. Should've grabbed it them

Awww wish I had seen this earlier. I would love to have done a piece with you. I've loved your work for years and know I've told you so. Maybe I'll catch you next time.

...freakin' dammit! I hate my job sometimes! >.<

Well I for one have missed seeing your art.

Wow filled up fast o.o

How in the hell did i miss out on this? damn. mayhaps next time

Laaaaaaaaame D: I've always wanted a drawing from oo~ :c

FC Kept me occupied

Damn, missed my chance ;~;

How annoying to have missed out. Ah well! You're probably the most popular person on FA, so go figure

What the tit-raping cockshit, I first saw this journal like four hours ago and [CLOSED] was already in the title.

ahh curse you time zones X3
be good to see you submitting art again anyway

Hey, Did you get my Note? I updated with who I am.

ahhhhh I was too late >< oh well

missed ! good luck with your new stuff i hope there are some cool digis aswell?

Missed it as well... It's was late at night here :(
And actually I'm annoyed by people who claim 5 or 6 slots for themselves, but well, that's life on FA xD

Awuuhh...I mised it *pout*

shoulda made a limit of 2 per character :P look at all those bulk-orders. Sheesh X3

Saw this on twitter this morning.

Decided to be lazy.

Damn it.

Is "others" one with me? O:

Aww man, how did I miss something as big as this? Dragoneer doing (a lot of) art again is huge news!

Good luck with this by the way - it's a huuuuuuuuge undertaking no doubt.

It's unfortunate people got multiple slots, as I'm sure thousands want Dragonner art. But I'm way late and would have never gotten one anyways.

Great to gear you'll be doing more art, Dragoneer! I'm hoping we can meet someday since I'm in NoVa too!

Doh! Missed the boat on this one

Still - this means more 'neer arts! Woo! Recognise a few names in that todo list, so will be looking forward to seein those appearing! n..n

beyond all of this, can you still put your old stuff back up eventualy, even if it's only in scraps?

Whoa, totally missed out on this one. Bummer! On the other hand, it's good to hear that you're doodling art again! 100 pieces, that's something to look forward to! :-D

9 drawings in 6 months, good work man! Only 90 to go...

It's the people near the bottom of the list I feel sorriest for. I am lucky in that, ya know there is some hope that I might get my pic before Christmas.

I want one D: * makes grabby paws*

haha, you're on number 17!!

wooo...!!