FA+
Shop
IMVU, Content & You
10 years ago
🏳️🌈💖Enjoy the site? Please consider supporting us via the links below!💖🏳️🌈
⭐ FA+ ⭐ SHOP ⭐ KO-FI ⭐
Journal Start
Thank you all for raising the concerns about products you have seen in IMVU's catalog. Its important to remember that IMVU's shop has over 16 million items and all of them are user-generated (not created by IMVU). Products are submitted to the catalog and reviewed by peers before they are made available for sale. Of course as with any UGC (user-generated content) situation, this means inappropriate or copied content may get through.
IMVU community has a large segment of customers who like furry-themed products - avatars, furry outfits, posters etc. Some of their creators have accounts on FA as well and may be selling their own artwork on both sites. Some of the content may be copied. Do note that the content being there is not related to IMVU's acquisition of FA and has not been added to the catalog as a result.
There is a process to deal with this that is followed by IMVU. It is called DMCA process and details of that process can be found in their TOS toward the end. IMVU must comply with the DMCA process exactly as it is specified and therefore all required information is needed before products can be taken down. Do remember that the original content must be yours before you can initiate a DMCA takedown request - you may not file it on someone else's behalf.
We may have stated before that you can flag and report products if you believe them to be copied from you, however, that is not correct information. DMCA is the only way to request action on such content.
We have heard your concerns about not being able to view content that is AP-rated in IMVU's catalog and therefore not available for viewing to the general public. FA is currently with IMVU to figure out a solution for that issue.
We understand and appreciate everyone is reacting to the news and there is a lot of information going around - facts as well as rumors. We are doing our best to monitor your feedback and concerns, respond to them and sometimes work with IMVU to get you the appropriate response.
IMVU community has a large segment of customers who like furry-themed products - avatars, furry outfits, posters etc. Some of their creators have accounts on FA as well and may be selling their own artwork on both sites. Some of the content may be copied. Do note that the content being there is not related to IMVU's acquisition of FA and has not been added to the catalog as a result.
There is a process to deal with this that is followed by IMVU. It is called DMCA process and details of that process can be found in their TOS toward the end. IMVU must comply with the DMCA process exactly as it is specified and therefore all required information is needed before products can be taken down. Do remember that the original content must be yours before you can initiate a DMCA takedown request - you may not file it on someone else's behalf.
We may have stated before that you can flag and report products if you believe them to be copied from you, however, that is not correct information. DMCA is the only way to request action on such content.
We have heard your concerns about not being able to view content that is AP-rated in IMVU's catalog and therefore not available for viewing to the general public. FA is currently with IMVU to figure out a solution for that issue.
We understand and appreciate everyone is reacting to the news and there is a lot of information going around - facts as well as rumors. We are doing our best to monitor your feedback and concerns, respond to them and sometimes work with IMVU to get you the appropriate response.
This is not the best moment to "durr hurr, dildos, hehehehe so random"
very dildos
wow
such shibe
very comment
"dank meme"
?
All this over some dildoes.
Also, none of this has anything to do with the buisness of selling dildos. Contraversy is usually a bullshit tactic to stop somebody's buisness by playing on somebody's emotions.
Just cause somebody is nice or a complete dick dont mean shit. Like I said before.. the devil disguises himself as the angel of light.
Also, I dont want no part of the drama that comes with this response. Anybody who feels the need to say something can waste their time if they want to, cause I won't be responding.
just a couple of red cents for ya.
Oh well. At least I have kamo registered on a couple places that he hasn't gotten to first. Kinda too late for me to go back and pick a new name now. :<
It's like people got it ass backwards.. that's not how the evidence system is supposed to work. And by then, the false accusations or misinformation will already have done it's damage. Plus people who just want to avoid the controversy are no better than people who are spreading the misinformation because they're still allowing what they think they know to affect their judgement. It's like they're letting people get away with it by Not being involved. It's also just an unfair situation.
Like you said... it's like calling all anime and manga fans, a bunch of scat-licking, sexist, child raping, abusive, emotionally disturbed, tentacle raped japanese teenagers. There's a whole lot of dirty, kinky, unsensitive things out there in the anime/manga/hentai/yaoi (whatever) world, but there are just as many that have little or nothing to do with sex, let alone extreme or hard-core porn, but here people are... judging the lot, instead of the accused.
Like I said though. The internet is full of people that think it is amuzing to ridicule, and "troll", and no matter what anyone with any sense has to say about anything valid or meaningful, the masses are collectively too dumb to care. We're all wasting our time talking about this.
"I wish it mattered"... -.-;
Thank you for posting that.
"Asshole" is a major understatement. I felt physically ill while reading it.
(This is what I posted):
I post all of my submissions (art, stories, etc) over on SF, and have had the best experience on that site. I have my doubts about continuing on FA, though the only thing that has kept me from bailing a couple of years ago has been some of my favorite artists are on here. I know nothing about IMVU (heck, don't even know what that stands for), and the above notice sounds like if any of my stuff should pop up on that other site, it's going to be a royal pain to remove.
Am I an "asshole" just because I've had a much better experience on SoFurry than I've had here on Fur Affinity?
That wasn't directed at you- I've NO idea why it posted as a reply to you, but that message I posted was intended for the person who posted the link to the livejournal regarding the owner of BadDragon and his allegations regarding rape, bestiality and manipulation.
Trust me, I rarely use FA because this site is buggy enough as it is. No way in hell I'd blame you for using another site (I do too, mostly).
Case and point: this exact situation.
That said, even if it was the best coded site and had a great community, due to the baggage that Bad Dragon carries, I wouldn't join any site that was directly affiliated with them. I probably wouldn't have joined the fandom if that was where everyone was, since having them run it emphasizes the most controversial of the material we cover.
Writing happens.
Or use journals as an alternate submissions source if you're a writer.
Damn... its... its pretty much like my country's governement D:
Their avatars are "(pre-)teen humans with an airbrush-accident".
In theory, especialyl for porn-loving furries, this is so wrong on so many levels that my head aches.
The moment they try to extort money from me I have to bow out - since I have little as-is; and I think many furs are in the same boat for different reasons.
Both gamers as well as porn-lovers don't need to fear the "pokemon-levelizer"-banhammer of IMVU...
*shudders*
I don't see that there's much point in worrying about it. The die is cast; IMVU will do what IMVU does and it will probably be bad; the fandom will go elsewhere or it won't. There's actually not a whole lot of point in wasting breath or brain cells over it.
An important subject like how it's pretty shitty to use the word "retard" interchangeably with the word "stupid"?
If you want to be taken seriously, maybe consider the method in which you address people.
You guys are the best :3c I love you all
Snowballing the attention and getting as many people involved as possible will invariably impress and entertain whoever starts the attention avalanche in the first place.
I believe the more common phrase for this condition is "someone's easily entertained."
Especially when their platform is the most useless for the purpose aside of , maybe something like The Sims - For which I saw furry-Mods that actually looked a LOT better than IMVU avatars...
But also, yes I agree. We shouldn't be using words like that
Can you all just stop with the stupid "dildo" comments when people should be discussing something that is extremely important and may be affecting a large number of people in the community?
And to say something like: "In all honesty you invalidate your opinion by being unable to express yourself intelligently, so your attempted barbs miss your mark." is just childish and annoying. - Just because they used the word "retard" doesn't mean that their opinion is invalidated, they still have an opinion and rights to both have and express this opinion. You, however, have no right to invalidate anyone's opinion.
Not to mention you're the one saying that they are "unable to express [themselves] intelligently", when you are the one joining-in with the pathetic and annoying dildo comments.
Just grow-up and actually take this situation seriously.
And don't respond with one of those "I'm probably older than you" comments either. Just because you're older physically, doesn't mean you're older mentally, so act your age if that's the case!
I'm getting fed-up of having to scroll past hundreds of dildo comments just to read comments that are actually useful, important and relevant to the situation at-hand.
It's the fact that, instead of posting something useful about the subject such as: a question, some information, etc. they are posting random crap in the comments section because they think that it makes them look funny.
But it really doesn't, to be honest, I don't care what word they post at the top of these important discussions - if it's not related to the topic and it's just attention seeking, then it's going to annoy me and many other people.
Wouldn't you agree?
But if there was no one telling them to stop, then they might just think that it's okay to post these annoying comments. Though going straight for the "you're an idiot" response is not the way to do it, no matter how annoying they can be.
I pretty-much said the same thing, and so did they.
And something I did just find amusing.... our own conversation has been relatively off-topic here too XD
But at least we aren't spamming the chat!
Also, if you're worried that your art or someone else's may have been put on IMVU without consent? - let me know, I have an old account with Access Pass, so I can view all the adult content and be able to see all catalog items
I do agree with you, though.
not saying the use of the word is appropriate, just that you're as much of an asshole for this response as he is for acting like that
If this bothers you, the best course is to simply not act like you're retarded, so you won't be called it.
Bold words coming from a babyfur.
> Is into vore
You can be even more hypocritical if you put more effort.
> Is artist who draws vore for customers.
Speaking of effort, you would have known that if you read the user info.
People might run out of burndaids you know. Easy there.
Speaking of, I fail to see how it's appropriate to suggest that someone being a babyfur is comparable to being a retard, and then simultaneously suggest that the fetish which involves characters devouring each other for sexual pleasure isn't worse up on the list.
???
WHEN YOU WISH UPON A STAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAR
Also you technically "took the bait" by replying despite replying to say that you aren't going to reply.
> bites the hand of possible customers
How are your slots going? :^)
> I don't take commissions for babyfur work. Or from whiny, obnoxious people.
They're currently full, I have to decline people, as I often have to do. I usually have galleria and exhibitions on the side as well, so I keep busy. Thank you for your concern :)
Keep commenting bruh :^)
My two cents. :p
Yeah I blocked you, because you're being an insensitive prick. It's super cool to belittle others. Have fun.
If I'm going to be perfectly honest, wouldn't it have been better to not reply? - that way there'd have been no heated argument that just ends-up annoying people?
Not to mention, you guys have just filled a large section of the comment space on an important topic with your argument.
And I'm sorry but I agree with Kuro, if you're willing to act "retarded" as they put it, then you do deserve to be treated as such because that's clearly what you want.
But no, I would never agree to insulting people with actual disabilities, and I don't think Kuro did either.
To get straight to the point, you should take it easy... calm down a little. - after all, don't you find all those "dildo" comments annoying too?
At least we can all agree on that, am I right?
I mean, sorry to say it, but if this site is your main/only source of art income, you've fucked up bad.
I personally don't give a single shit if someone comments anything about dildoes. If I'm going to be perfectly honest, wouldn't it have been better to not reply? - that way there'd have been no heated argument that just ends-up annoying people?
Why didn't you take your own advice and just not comment?
You've taken what I posted and shoved it right back at me...
The reason I said about not responding was because of the "retard" incident, there was clearly no lashing-out at people with disabilities and no hint towards it either.
But you just had to jump-in and make it look like there was an issue with that. - THAT is where you shouldn't have replied.
Replying to the guys making "dildo" comments to get them to stop is just fine.
And saying I should "take [my] own advice and just not comment" just makes it look like you're lashing-out at me when I was only trying to calm the situation and be helpful.
At this point you're just dragging this out. I was done with commenting earlier, but you felt some righteous need to reply and show me the error of my ways or something. If I were you I'd just stop now and leave me be? Since I'm not changing my mind about this.
Alsoooo by replying you're just lengthening the useless argumentative threads that you said you disliked in the first place.
Here you are stating that you're offended by something, and in doing so you accuse me of doing something that I'm not doing and offend me in the process. - That makes you no better than what you're arguing against.
And I wasn't "trying to show you the error of your ways" read comments properly before replying to them and lashing-out at people.
I was only trying to point out that the word "retard" was NOT being used to insult people with disabilities.
And once again, if you read my comments properly, you would also see that I even said something to the extent of: "I don't like people using the word retard either".
I was actually agreeing with you on that, but also pointing-out that the other person wasn't trying to offend you, they were just annoyed with the spammers.
So please don't get angry at me and treat me like shit, I'm only trying to be helpful.
And if you think I'm not being helpful? Say so calmly and don't be a dick about it, or you'll just upset people who meant no harm. - And seeing as you're complaining about being offended, then offending other people just makes you a hypocrite.
And you must be reading more into my comments than I'm putting because I'm not huffy or raging or whatever you think I'm doing. I'm being relatively calm. You are assuming things as well, you know.
I'm really, really done with this. I don't have anything more to say. If you reply I really won't read it so I wouldn't bother wasting your time.
But if you do: it's only to say "sorry for assuming things".
So anyway, now that this is all over... no idea what time-zone you're in so: have a good night/day
:^) Or did you want to avoid finding out that I too have autism, so your little "muh autism" thing is moot?
Also, I definitely made sure to say "act like they have SAID deficiency," meaning that if you act like someone who has the most extreme form of down syndrome, then you deserve to be treated as such. I wouldn't suggest that autism is as crippling as down syndrome. If you want to get huffy and puffy, go right ahead, but thinking clearly may be a better course of action for you in the future.
Notice how I just treated you like you're 6? :^)
So for a lot of people this can leave a bit of a scar on their psyche. IMO since it's a slur for the mentally disabled it really shouldn't come to neurotypicals to tell us how we should feel about the usage of a word. I have always come to experience it being thrown at people who never deserved to be bullied for it.
But the thing that is troublesome appears to be that you compared people being silly with people with mental deficiency and said that people who behave like being mentally deficient deserve to be treated as such. So, this implies that mentally challenged people deserve to be treated like people being silly, involving name-calling. I don't think this is what you wanted to say at all, but it could be interpreted as such, which certainly isn't anything positive or a justification for hurling insults around at all, no matter who started it.
People who have normally functioning brains but behave like they have a mental deficiency are retards.
There is zero difference between the word and "dumb," "stupid," "moron," "idiot," etc. because guess what all of them meant at one point in context?
Dumb is in reference to the disability of being unable to speak due to being deaf.
Stupid means that you're just lacking knowledge, which can come about by mental disabilities.
Moron was used to describe someone who had the logic and knowledge of an 8 to 12 year old.
Idiot, in medicine teams, means "mentally handicapped."
That's right. Every single word you want to use to replace "retard" are all in reference to someone who has a legitimate disability, mental or physical. "Lame" is someone who is slow because they were mentally handicapped.
All people are trying to do is replace one word with another word of the exact same meaning and then try to pretend like it's any different, then they throw a hissyfit when people don't share in their delusion.
Yes, there are PC terms. I would not call a black person a "nigger."
I would not call a gay a "faggot."
I would not call someone with a disability a "retard."
I would however call someone who ACTS like they have a mental disability despite having a perfectly functional brain a retard, just like I'd call them an idiot.
Those words are invented purely to be insulting. The other words were invented to describe someone for medicinal or psychological use. There is a difference.
you don't get to define what offends people and what doesn't. "R****d" has been used as a pejorative term against the mentally atypical for fucking years if not decades. it's STILL being used that way. Just because you "don't mean it that way" doesn't mean you're not reinforcing the negative connotations of the word and insulting those with developmental issues.
god. fucking babyfurs, every time.
You want to sit here and cry at me about a word being hurtful and how it's rude to judge someone like that and use offensive language when describing them, as if you're just a ton more moral than I am, and then you go about with "fucking babyfurs. every time." That's kinda cute.
You want some kind of hugbox where people agree with you and only you and people who disagree with you get the pitchfork. That's not going to happen, buddy. People will talk as they please whether or not it bothers you, and you have two choices: Ignore it or reply and get angry. Why choose the one that negatively effects you when you could just choose the option where nothing effects you at all? I'm not understanding the logic here.
it's always the fucking babyfurs, every goddamn time.
just putting in my two cents but you were offended by the way somebody's grammar was yet when somebody else was offended by yours you turn and lash out at them? In all honesty the word retarded shouldn't have been used, idiot would have sufficed just as well. People will get offended by the term because it's how they were raised. I know I wouldn't call somebody who acts silly and or childish a retard but that's just me. You can get all huffy at me for pushing myself into this situation and get offended by my own grammar but I just find this entire thing childish and did we really need to fight over grammar when as you said "if it offends you, then look away".
I'm not offended by your grammar but attacking people for theirs defeats the purpose..
You said "People who act like they have a mental deficiency deserve to be treated as though they literally do have said deficiency.", basically saying that people who behave like they are mentally challenged, should be treated as if they were. That means that you basically put people being silly on the same level as mentally challenged persons, which has the unfavorable side effect that it implies that mentally challenged people should also be treated in the same way as people being silly.
If combined with the statement "If you act like a retard, you deserve to be called one, especially if you have no actual disorder. If this bothers you, the best course is to simply not act like you're retarded, so you won't be called it." that basically adds something negative to the former statement where you basically compared people being silly with mentally challenged people.
You said, people who act like they have a mental deficiency should be treated as really having it, which leads to the conclusion that it is kind of the same thing for you, because you would treat them the same. When you add then, that you find it justified calling people names, some might conclude that you would find it justified to call mentally challenged people names, because you previously said you'd treat them the same. So if you treat them the same and throw insults around, people might think that you also would like to insult mentally challenged people.
Which obviously isn't what you really meant by that. Your statement "I would however call someone who ACTS like they have a mental disability despite having a perfectly functional brain a retard, just like I'd call them an idiot." showed it more clearly. I know that you meant "If people behave stupid, I call them stupid", which is fine by itself. It's just that the way you expressed it earlier people could easily draw the wrong conclusions from. I just tried to show you where the misunderstandings would stem from, I wasn't asking you to find less offensive insults for people who might deserve to be insulted.
I do have trouble with wording things, I expect more people to understand that something isn't literal when I talk. But seriously people really shouldn't get bent out of shape for something they could just scroll past and then forget about 3 minutes later. They bait themselves into replying and then get stuck in a loop where they're getting angry and demeaning themselves with the same insults and aggressive that they accused me of having, all the while I'm enjoying the hell out of myself because it's ridiculous.
Dumb is in reference to the disability of being unable to speak due to being deaf.
Stupid means that you're just lacking knowledge, which can come about by mental disabilities.
Moron was used to describe someone who had the logic and knowledge of an 8 to 12 year old.
Idiot, in medicine teams, means "mentally handicapped."
stu·pid
ˈst(y)o͞opəd/
adjective
adjective: stupid; comparative adjective: stupider; superlative adjective: stupidest
1.
lacking intelligence
Knowledge- the fact or condition of knowing something with familiarity gained through experience or association- Knowledge is something learned.
I guess ignorance might be both. There is ignorance as in lack of knowledge like you said, but there is also willfully ignorance as in refusal to learn or get facts straight. There is that saying "ignorance is bliss", meaning that the absence of possibly troubling knowledge is more comfortable and therefore easier to live with, than the knowing of possibly unsettling facts. So at least ignorance is natural, since no person knows everything, but also can be a choice if someone refuses to check facts or getting additional informations. Therefore ignorance also is someone who doesn't learn, either because he can't or willfully refuses to.
Or you would be willing to call someone who ACTS like a homosexual despite being perfectly heterosexual a faggot.
After all if you're going to be arbitrary about one offense, why be dedicated against any others?
May I interest you in an Acme catalog?
People who have normally functioning brains but behave like they have a mental deficiency are retards."
I agree with you. What in the hell do you do though when there's a person who has a mental deficiency and they're not a retard or stupid, but they act like it anyway?
If they are close friends, then yeah, gloves come off when you're pals with someone. Unless they actually do have a problem with it, then I case, because I'm not friends with the person to be unfriendly to them. They're more than just a random person that I'll never meet replying to me on FA.
Even more-so, the people who are using "fag" and "retard" don't use it in the traditional context, like you claimed. When you get upset at it, it's ridiculous, because you're taking it out of context from what is being said and turning it into a personal deep attack on your lifestyle that, by the way, no one would even know about or care to know about because you're just another random face on the internet.
When I say "this is retarded" and someone jumps in to go "UMMM I HAVE AUTISM" it's, quite frankly, retarded. The word isn't used in that to be a personal attack, nor is it directed at anyone specifically, and it's used in a way to mean something that doesn't even resemble the original use of the word.
People spend far too much time scouring the internet for things to be offended at, and they are far too hasty to get angry.
Feeble-minded came from the Latin word flebilis. It means, "to be lamented." It referred to people who were not profoundly disabled, but still required intervention and care.
Retarded comes from the Latin retardare. This means, "to make slow, delay, keep back, or hinder." The first record of the word "retarded" in relation to developmental delay was in 1895. The term retarded was used to replace terms like idiot, moron, and imbecile. This was because it was not a derogatory term at that time. However, by the 1960s, the term became a word used to insult someone.
Just adding in some historical facts about words. Don't mind me. :3
A not unfair point, in all honesty. So many people are making a huge fuss over this IMVU business by appealing to what the community deserves and how it should be respected, while all this spamming seems to indicate the opposite.
Seeing that character breakdancing and firing lasers from the soles of his shoes would be freaking awesome as well.
Are you happy now?
Would this be a form of pictoral dyslexia?
So Yea.
Dildos.
I was offered 2k credits if I bought butt cream.
I mean
Ilu2bb
//not surprised
Yay! ^^
" ... But not Neer."
Oh god dammit, you were talking about names D:
And no matter how anyone puts it, nobody truly knows everything, so we are always a moron in one way. Hence, we are all morons.
Do you think you sound intelligent or witty when you post these kinds of messages?
Please stop doing it.
Yes they replied to the post, but that's because they are actually concerned with this issue and are, like many others, fed-up of random people posting crappy comments to fill the space where we should be discussing the topic.
Was it really that hard to do?
But still, I wish people would just stop with the spam as soon as something important shows-up.
And one thing I know for sure: IMVU is very quick at banning spammers from my experience there.
So if IMVU come and get involved only to find all these dildo comments, we may even see all those users are suddenly banned one day, but obviously that depends on how much control IMVU has over FA now.
Besides, with all this drama going on, I got my new record for journal comments. 22.
OR
New record of comments that you have posted yourself?
(just curious)
Seriously, this entire chain of responses is superfluous but still, it appears that it is inevitable. People like to make their voices heard, even more so if they think they are rightly angered about the comment they respond to. In the end, it just gets silly. Dragoneer did something people deem questionable, the community reacts in response with humor or anger to the topic, that's to be expected, even more so, when running gags turn into memes, something rather common in contemporary internet-habits of many people.
The best reaction is to ignore those, like newbies are always told never to feed the trolls. But still, it appears that nobody ever wants to learn. That is the true reason while the chain of responses grows out of proportion. Complaints always add to the mess, they never reduce it.
I do 100% agree with it, but when there's a topic as important as this that can heavily impact the entire furry community as a whole? - I just can't help but get angry when all people want to do is post the first comment or just fill the comments section with useless crap.
I guess we can just look forward to the next one. At the rate Fender is making new journals I wouldn't doubt that we would see a new one in a couple of hours. But I doubt that it wouldn't contain the word "Dildo" in one of the first few posts and also I wouldn't doubt that people will complain about it again. Because that has worked so very well before...
Though the quantity of people posting them seems to have risen quite rapidly as though they are attracted to the idea of being annoying (a.k.a. a dildo troll)
I love you so much right now
Just take a break. Write anything building.
the madness begins anew XD
well played *golfclaps*
I'm so happy
Furries are not mainstream which is a wonderful thing! My biggest fear is that someday Furries will be co-opted by the mainstream entertainment industry, driving out real Furries out, replacing us with a corporatized, sanitized and watered down impostor. If Dragoneer truly loves FurAffinity and his fellow Furry Community patrons, he certainly has alienated us with this latest move. FurAffinity cost money to operate I get it, I really do. But he should have come to us openly and honestly explaining the situation so that a reasonable solution could have been found. There is always a better option to the one you choose in a crisis, it may not be easy but amicable. To sell out FurAffinity and it's user base to an external non Furry entity that could easily shut this site down over purely business related motives is just ridiculous. In order to save FurAffinity, we have to kill it, that's the signal being sent. How can we honestly trust Dragoneer at this point? Also, if he loves FA and says how he has hung on because this is his baby, why in the hell would he hand the keys to the kingdom over to a non Furry outsider? I'm sure many financially and technologically savvy Furs would have gladly bought him out. Was it ego then? Now that IMVU own FurAffinity, Dragoneer has lost all real control over the fate of his work. He is now an employee of IMVU which means that they can fire him. Why would Dragoneer (so far as we understand it) open himself up to that vulnerability? Sure things might be good now, money coming in for new equipment etc but FurAffinity is no longer the property of Dragoneer/FA. It all belongs to IMVU. This makes no sense at all. Either Dragoneer is lying about his love for FA/Furry Community or he is fatally misguided and delusional. IMVU can take his baby away at any time and there is nothing Dragoneer and by extention US can do about it. I hope he has considered all of this.
...just wait for IMVU's Kublai Khan to die. We can stage rebellion.
anyways we have been going downhill and mainstream fast and honestly it was better when we were a secret. like Illuminati :O
Dongle
FIG NEWTON BALLSSSSSZZZZZZZZUH.
Dagnabbit.
That is to say:
Elected representatives of the people congregate together on meetings to debate, and adjust rulings and law.
A parliament is the leading, or singular source of legistlations(called a legislature, but i don't expect you to know that word) and a lobby for all matters of law outside of justice rulings.
Don't act so smug if you know nothing of the subject, your only accomplishment will be embarrassing yourself.
It's bad when youtube commenters make more sense.
Parliament (n.)
[snip]
synonyms: legislature, legislative assembly, congress, senate, chamber, house, convocation, council, assembly
They loooove to cheat and/or scam people.
But then FA is a different story.. soon enough the artist will have to pay to have there personal work put on this site, i forsee many leaving because of this, who want to pay for uploading there own art, when for many years they have been coming together to a free place to upload there stuff. ~shrugs~
OH WAIT.
i heard that the 'gofundme' donation page was shut down by the company its self and the donations returned.
You can either give sources for your claims, or no one will believe your claims. I'm fine with it either way
Also, figures. Blocked by
This guy thinks I'm "new" here.
This guy thinks a shit list MEANS something.
This guy thinks blocking me means something.
This guy's gonna unblock me and reblock me to further "enlighten" me on how much of a special snowflake he is.
Watch me predict the future. It's magic.
Buuuut you seem to be into them, and you replied...
Close 'nuff.
And the dude getting angry just for a coment its worse than that...
Report me if you like. See what good it does.
Also, funny that. Still blocked.
Get over it. You aren't some special snowflake that gets to demand who does and doesn't mention you. /blocked because karma.
lol about kitty_yildiz's ~mysterious informants~ tho.
http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/6311970/
and that's the proof. OH WELL can't win with all the sycophants and ass kissers ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
get your facts straight before you try and talk about anything. misinformation helps nobody.
I just recommend for you the calm the fuck down, as if there's anybody screaming and being a general jerk-off, it's you.
You're not a moderator. If you can't take the heat of people correcting you: Don't fucking post.
inb4 blocked because im not kissing ass.
SOMEONE CALL THE WAAAAABULANCE. WE GOT A SEVERE CASE OF BUTTHURT.
I'm going to believe the word of the people who donated, especially since their words corroborate with what Dragoneer is saying about the funds. I think your source is flawed. Also, it's fine to be wrong but maybe if you didn't act really rude off the bat to everyone just because a friend of yours said something, you could have a conversation about this instead of just insulting and blocking everyone who's presenting facts about the situation.
No one is going to believe the words of a random person, especially when some of the people talking to you are people who didn't GET refunded for their donations. I honestly don't believe people have been refunded from the Gofundme either, because Dragneer still raised a lot of money, is giving out a ton of rewards, and people are claiming they didn't get any money back. also, Dragoneer has frequently said "the donations from the Gofund me campaign" when referring to the donations. And they couldn't accept donations through paypal, and didn't have any other pages set up as far as I am aware (I was paying attention to all the happenings every now and then as they happened). And the donation page was reported only after the funding happened, as I recall. People complained they could no longer see it or how high it was once it was removed. As far as proof out there, it seems pretty likely there were hardly any refunds, if there even were any.
*edited for a typo
Dragoneer was totally right in selling it, but I'm kinda peeved that he didn't give his own website the chance to offer up money to be stock or shareholders in it, or give them the opportunity to put things together to buy the site, and instead gave it to IMVU. So I care just because I worry IMVU is going to ruin the site worse than it is. Hopefully all our fears are just remnants of all the BS from the past, and the future actually turns out well. I like using this site, all its bug and terrible administration aside.
I honestly don't think he would have taken any other offers, even better monetary ones, from furries because they couldn't have offered him the chances IMVU did. Hell, I probably would have taken the same offer, even though I'm still peeved Dragoneer sold it to them. All we can do now is wait and see.. I dare to be hopeful while being skeptical and preparing for the worst.
Just keep your eyes on IMVU if you can, check every once in awhile and maybe just put a watermark on the corner of your art (if you don't already), and let people know you won't be posting to IMVU and to report to you if they see your works there.
Just thought I'd reply to this point. Yukai wasn't even PART of the discussion to begin with. He came to his mate's defence and attacked me, then blocked me. So Yukai is pulling the victim card and claiming everyone else was rude to start with, when in reality, he wasn't even part of the initial discussion, and he just came charging face first into it with an arrogant attitude.
People who do that really piss me off >.>
I've been doing voluntary community management for years. I'm used to random and unexpected backlash from people.
Like water off a duck's back, as they say.
I never received a refund for my GoFundMe donation. :\
Yes.
Cause all of FA will charge at IMVU
So your statement is invalid. When I mean charge. I meant people will get Angry
Like Believe that FA is owned by IMVU
So... eh...
It's also a nice distraction focusing on this IMVU catalog content topic rather than the actual issue which can be seen at the bottom of each FA page. Hint: it involves the © symbol :P
They have the copyright on the page, but of course not your art.
From what I've heard IMVU is a rather proper company, able to get things straight and Dragoneer is still the person in power, with the only difference that he has also a financial responsibility now in front of the people from IMVU. So I think the community and the page itself can only win!
I'm pretty sure the only reason he took this deal is because he could stay "in power", and was either greedy and short-sighted, or between a rock and a hard place financially.
Why not all of the above? Short-sighted, greedy and in a bad place financially.
Also what did you do to your nice icon D: :P
Though it's true, 'Neer has provided us with many short lived memes over the years.
Also, you damn well know what I did to it xP
:P
Dragoneer has gone from owner to IMVU employee. His power will only go as far as IMVU deems desirable.
FA has gone from being independently owned to being acquired as property by IMVU, as wolfbeast said.
Result: the community and the site are at the mercy of what IMVU decides to do with it in the future, and I don't think they have any reason to REALLY provide continued support for FA unless they have specific monetization plans for it.
I hope Dragoneer at the very least got a good chunk of money for handing us over to them. If he agreed to anything less, then he's been totally stupid.
Like they said, I think IMVU just hopes to unite the fandoms in a way, causing people from FA to spend more money on their main site. Perhaps they will even make it easier for people to post art cross-site or similar.
In every case, I doubt they will do anything like forcing FA members to pay for able to view adult art or anything like that. They surely know that that's not how FA worked over the past couple of years.
Instead of hoping that Dragoneer got a lot of money, I rather hope he came to a fair agreement of what IMVU's plans for FA are for the future :)
They have been known for things such as selling your previously purchased username on a separate list, forcing you to buy it again so someone else doesn't, creating a gallery show-off competition that allows people to directly steal your art, and not refunding you the price of an item when they delete it for whatever issue they have.
Definitely not a friendly company.
Able to get things straight?
Like the broken coding?
The non-usable outfits?
Or the Stolen artwork? (Not just art from here but art from other creators on IMVU, yes Creators ob IMVU steal from each other)
Or maybe how they stopped the entire "Scammers/Hackers" from infesting IMVU?
I highly doubt we speak of the same IMVU.
Sorry if I sound like I am raging at you, I am not, but I've been apart of IMVU for a looooooooong time and I've seen and experienced all that I have listed above.
I still have an outfit someone bought for me that can not be used or put on and I can't flag it because the content creator hid it from view, I created tickets asking for it to be removed, not at all interested in a refund, and they still do nothing.
I've seen the phrase "16 million user generated items blah blah blah"
It's not like there's 1000 items and they're just lazy. It's far too much stuff to pursue copyright protection concerns blindly without direction.
As if that's at all meaningful and not just inflationary attention-grabbing misinformation...
And concerning transparency, the journals are still very opaque, no matter how many we get. People care to know what exactly will happen to FA, their accounts and their artwork, to which we got this answer: "FA is run independently of IMVU, and will continue to be a furry site RUN by furries. The only difference you will see is IMVU will add some unobtrusive third party ads and, with their financial help, the site will improve. You get a better site in the end."
Most people don't buy it, because there is reasonable doubt that a whole website is being bought just to run "some unobstrusive third party ads". Doesn't really make sense to most people.
Also they are wondering how the site will be "improved".
We also got: "They get to use our site for advertising from their third-party partners who are interested in engaged users like ours who share a common interest - art. In addition, IMVU has a rather large furry segment which benefits from FA, and likewise, FA members can benefit from IMVU’s offerings."
People wonder how IMVU will benefit from FA without forcing people to participate in IMVU related activities. Also people fear that the benefit from IMVUs offerings might be mandatory and also wonder what those offerings are in detail, something that hasn't been explained in detail or at all as of yet.
But that's about all the information we get. More interesting informations are withheld of course, because: "Business documents like terms of sale are not shared publicly and this is not an exception to that standard. It falls under under NDA (Non Disclosure Agreement)."
Also people worry that "FA is run independently of IMVU, and will continue to be a furry site RUN by furries." and "IMVU does not own, have any rights, take commission from etc for any of your art shared/sold here. It is business as usual, and there are no changes planned in regards to that. You will not be required to sell your content as part of IMVU’s catalog, nor will IMVU have access to use your content as they see fit." and "IMVU's [Terms of Service and content policies do not apply to content shared/sold on our site. There is not going to be any banning of content/users. FA's site policies that are currently in place will continue to be applicable. While there are minor changes (mostly clarifications) to the AUP coming next week, IMVU has not suggested, nor requested, any changes be implemented to the site other than some upcoming advertising changes." are subject to change, since FA now belongs to IMVU and they might turn it in any way around as they see fit.
So, as you see, we got quite a few bits of news, but those aren't exactly transparent and look more like appeasements that many people won't swallow.
As for the NDA, if people understand that that is in effect, why are people still whining about it not being disclosed in the beginning? Seriously, i wish i could bitch slap half the fandom at once. You could explain the legal issues until you're blue in the face and they still wouldn't get it. Because we all know that the world revolves around each one of them, and it's something they don't like so they don't want to really understand the entire issue. "Dragoneer's a sell out of MY site," Dragoneer's only thinking about himself, even though it's actually ME being selfish." Not one of those retards (yeah i said it) would think twice about how something of this magnitude could affect someone mentally (what with all the bitching) and financially.
I definitely understand the concerns though. but bitching and moaning about it isn't going to do anybody a damn bit of good. We don't know what will happen. I don't like that this happened either, i think something else could have been attempted. But it is what it is.
...Though, i'm not sure why you went into detail about all that, It was a good summary of stuff i understood already but it wasn't really necessary with the topic at hand. thanks though, got to vent off of it.
Of course some people think this is about them, when in reality it is about the whole community. But the community is composed of individuals who fear that all they once adored about FA might be in ruins now. Not just the people who create and sell artwork, doing commissions, making YCH auctions or selling adoptables, but all people who are passionate about their art. Since the Webpage went corporate, people fear that IMVU could change the rules and just aquire all rights on uploaded artwork retroactively to monetize it. Even if we are told this won't be the case people don't feel assured about that.
Also the Website going corporate means that if it proves unrentable, not generating enough profit it might end badly. The worst thing that might have happened in the past was the closure of the page. People donated money to keep the site running and independent. They might feel betrayed by the turn of the events. FA isn't independent anymore and people fear the aquisition of user data, not an unreasonable fear if you ask me.
About Dragoneer, well, he was in charge of FA for 10 years now, he often got flak for his decisions, I don't worry for his mental health, because I think someone who leads a community for a decade must have a thick hide by now. If that wasn't the case he would have been crumbled way earlier.
Still, his decision proved unpopular and is up for criticism now. And since it appears to be an irreversible one, people just vent their anger about it now. I guess this is just natural.
ok.
Also, being that you said the acquisition was not researched, i suspect you must have been directly involved to know this information! ...Oh, what's that? No...? What a presumptuous accusation, in that case!
Preparing a professional statement would have been nice, I agree. But perhaps the details are not all ironed out yet to do so. That may have not happened yet!
Oh my, this was many more words you have to decipher compared to my original message! I hope it doesn't melt your poor brain...
**Next time, understand what the person is saying before replying if you are trying to infer that the person is stupid. It just makes you look stupid otherwise. Good-day!~~
The snark doesn't look good on you, friend. Try another look.
you have the avatar base which you create skins for, 3d meshes are mainly heads and accessories but for skins are just added to a base avatar, there are a few "mesh" full avatars though
but imvus main catalog is texture not models ect, does that make sense? im not great at explaining ^^;;
but sl has a much better selection for avatar freedom i think
He now works to them as this site Administrator.
IMVU is giving professional coding and hardware to the website, but now they own this and will host their own ads on FA it seems.
Then there is a lot of honest concerns and possible problems that this creates
Specially since this was kept secret for 2 months.
Neer talked a lot about transparency and then we get this dick move.
Also the donation drive last year was moot since they just sold the site and got money from that (apparently very close to when stuff was bought).
And now Neer has only as much control of the site as IMVU staff decides he has. So they can really screw up the site if they want, or worse.
Basically the biggest hub in the fandom is not in the hands of the fandom anymore.
It's in the hands of a for-profit organization that admittedly bought this site for the reason of 'making money', so you can expect a lot of **** moves on their part to try and milk people over here.
IMVU provides the servers, he provides the staff.
Also, how could IMVU sell the site if it's proven to be a failure even when monetized? Who in their right mind would buy it?
And no... "all FA funds are out of my hands at this point."
Heck they could outs him while 'cleaning house' whenever they wish.
Actually selling to your employer brings up some serious conflict of interest problems with all this a well.
YEAH...
I wouldn't think that Sega would do all these mistakes they have been doing for over 10 years.
I wouldn't think that Microsoft would push tablet interface on users.
I didn't think that EA and Ubisoft would make so many mistakes with their users.
I didn't think that people actually believed that focusing business on cellphone mill machines was a good idea (hey Zynga)
Companies are dumb. They do things for marketing and jump at the thought of making some easy money.
They think that they can get more money than they are investing on this website.
If time proves that they are wrong they can do WHATEVER THEY WANT with this website.
He has control... FOR NOW.
Since they are the guys that own the website and are putting money and effort in it right now, IMVU and it's staff can change that whenever they feel like it.
There is nothing that protects Neer's position right now.
Even if the contract he signed says so that he can keep being the admin of the website or anything there is always leverage for loopholes. Like not specifying the powers of an admin, not saying that he has the power to veto whatever IMVU wants to add to the website and things like that.
There is nothing protecting the website from IMVU. Especially since Neer already said that now he gets a paycheck and is an employee of IMVU.
Employees can always be fired...
FA was sold to a non-furry for-profit company. What exactly did IMVU receive in this deal? Servers and hardware? FA does not have very many servers. Technology in the form of programming or patents? Don't know of any that FA held.
So what did IMVU gained? Mu guess is the user database. That is the only thing of value FA held. User database is mostly used for advertisement. Don't believe me, go look at Facebook.
You have to remember, INVU only obtained FA to make money. So if we want to speculate, lets think of how the company will make a profit from buying FA.
If neer gets kicked to the curb he has no one to blame but himself. For being about the community he has acted extremely selfisley, then again he always has.
Not love love but you get the idea. :>
Great. Unwatching, thanks.
In summary: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LuKzt7p-MnM
Remember me.
*goes to find someone who can carve "Ikey-Butt" onto a tombstone for you with a straight face...actually, this is a very awkward joke, don't worry about it!*
They wouldn't, but hypothetically...
I'm frankly curious to see how this entire situation plays out.
FA'stheir server.Personally, I don't care who has my stuff - as long as it stays free and they aren't profiting from any of it. I put stuff up for people to enjoy freely, but I want no part of anyone charging for, or making money off of anything that is mine. I never signed an agreement with IMVU, so any attempt by them to profit from anything of mine, directly or indirectly won't make me happy. That includes even hosting my stuff on the pay-only portions of their site. I know quite a few artists who feel the same. If I decide to pull my stuff off of FA, because of IMVU, then I most definitely want it off of IMVU's servers as well. They specifically have zero rights to my stuff. I probably won't discover any infringements, unless someone calls my attention to them, since I won't join their site, but I'll be pretty darn mad if it happens.
I'm ore worried about he add space that is no going t be open to 3r party people. So many are like "just use ad block". Yeah that stops ad's, even the ones that are relevant. Some people do make their livings here. So we're choking out those that are actually using the service with hard earned dollars to give space for.. anyone else?
The only thing we know so far is what Dragoneer announced, and that it that they will be placing their 3rd-party malware-infested spammy ads here. I can tolerate that, because I have IMVU listed as untrusted in my NoScript, and can block all the ads with AdBlock the moment they start to become irritating. By default, no third-party scripts run on my machine, but I specifically blacklisted IMVU. I still have ads here turned on - for now. By staying here, I have accepted as much as Dragoneer said they would be doing so far. Making money off our art is not part of the deal presented to us yet.
If possible, I'll still leave furry ads enabled, while blocking anything else. I doubt that IMVU will like that or make it easy, so I may be forced to simply block all. It's likely that very few furs are going to be letting third-party non-furry ads come in. They'll be lucky if one percent of the users even see them. They could turn mean and make viewing art here conditional to seeing their ads. I'll be on SoFurry and Inkbunny the moment they pull that though.
Now suddenly we are getting new daily system messages concerning IMVU like it was a bad idea or something.
Now we've gone from zero information to daily messages concerning this. If it was just drama and nothing more, then they wouldn't be giving it any attention and just outright ignoring it and go forward.
Basically, tons of people are trying to get the majority to jump ship to somewhere "better", which I really think is appalling. :/
He disclosed the info with all of us the moment he legally could. That's all there is to it. No conspiracy. No wool being pulled over anyone's eyes.
Some people in here just want to imagine they're being taken advantage of so they can act out the dramas they've always wanted to. :\
It's not just people acting out for the sake of Drama, it's also because it's been so many years of this BS now, that nothing seems believable anymore.
Change you're supposed to believe in...oops the site has been sold to someone else.
Now it's this twisted hope that the site doesn't change and that IMVU doesn't meddle too much or at all with the site other than this unrealistic belief that they handed over an undisclosed amount of cash and just want to do it out of the goodness of their hearts. :P
Getting worked up over a transaction that is NONE of our business to know the details of is just a waste of your time.
That's right, it's none of our business. Or, has everyone forgotten that this was a PRIVATELY OWNED webspace that was developed into a gallery area for people to come in and use at no charge, just like deviantArt, Yerf!, FurNation, SheezyArt and a couple o' dozen others?
As a good number of those sites (not all, but most) faded away, their users did, in fact, survive and live on to tell the tales from other websites that then shortly thereafter ALSO failed, went under and left countless users homeless but otherwise unscathed. They found a home here. And, so far, are STILL here.
BS or not, it is not THEIR place or YOUR place to tell the owners of this site what they can, could, would or SHOULD do with their website. His goals are to help. If you don't believe that or you don't like how things are going down, there is not a single person here holding a gun to your head. You can leave whenever.
But, until things have changed in a way that WARRANTS an angered reaction from their users, it's all just needless speculation and all it's doing is drumming up drama where it doesn't need to be drummed up.
For the record, I'm not telling you all of this to tell you to shut up. I'm telling you all of this to just try and take a step back and to take a few deep breaths. Nothing bad has come of any of this yet. Nothing has changed about the way we as its users can move about this site and use it. Until that time, you should try not to take any of this too seriously. It is, after all, just a website.
It's also knowing all the stuff that has gone on with FA that wasn't drama, that was real, tangible things that happened. This latest IMVU thing isn't OMG what have they done, this is terrible. It's more of the well, it's not surprising, this has come down the line from a long list of other crap that has been announced that wasn't in the best interest of the community.
If you truly followed things from the very beginning, I highly doubt you would believe the goals were to help, but as you say, it's just a website, it doesn't matter. It would be nearly impossible to believe someone is there with the goal to help when you've seen their track record for the last 11 years :/ It's been about as long a time that I've been hearing new exciting things for FA are just around the next corner, they're almost here, just have to wait a little bit longer. :P
I'm not gonna defend him over promises made and not followed through on. But, I honestly doubt it's as malicious in nature as people seem to think. This site is a lot of work, and people can either work on it on their free time, or they can sleep 'cuz their day jobs take up too much of their time otherwise.
Personally, I work 11 hour days right now, soon to be 12, Mon through Thursday. Fridays 9-5, soon to be 8-6. Saturdays are free currently, but soon to be 9-12. So, in other words, right now, I work 52 hours a week, soon to be 61. Most of my commissioners have been EXCEEDINGLY understanding with me about the art that I've owed them for an excessive amount of time. I do try to keep people posted. I even try to livestream from time to time to let people check in on progress, of which there's very little.
'Neer DOES post progress reports from time to time. But, people seem to gloss over that. Now, all of a sudden, he's a bad guy again because of this, and all the things he promised he'd do but never did are reasons why. He's a human being too, y'know? They all are. Work gets in the way an awful lot of the time. So, more often than not, they can't do more than the basic maintenance to keep it running. Maybe this will actually make that possible now? Who knows?
That is, at least, the hope.
Many times I saw people get admin/mod status on here that that I had personal experiences with that one would never put in a position of control, and yet there they were, given that very position of control. On FA all you had to do at one point was troll submissions and report people left and right and you actually got somewhere.
I just find it hard to hope for anything bright for FA's future when most of your own personal experiences have been quite negative. Kinda like my father. He always says he will mow is lawn, always talks about getting it done, and how tomorrow he will finally get around to it only to hear complaints from others on how long the grass is getting. It doesn't make my father a bad person, his intentions are good, but good intentions doesn't get the lawn mowed.
I just never felt that things extended beyond just a bunch of good intentions.
Ahwell, c'est la vie.
Truly thank you!
The transparency thing has not really been an issue, I don't think. Because I KNOW you're still hanging on to the whole thing about him saying that, then not telling anyone about the transaction until 2 months later. So, you should really read my first response again if you've forgotten that quickly. You can only be "transparent" on things like that WHEN IT'S LEGAL TO DO SO.
The people he's hired, he probably hired thinking he had a better understanding of what their intentions were and how well they'd be able to handle their jobs based on their skills. He made mistakes. If he wasn't willing to own up to them, even a LITTLE, he wouldn't still be running this place after so many years.
The new UI... Is the current one that awful to work with? What makes it so horrible? And, are you aware of exactly how easy/difficult it is to encode a new one? I'd be lost in the fucking woods if it were up to me. : P
I disagree that people aren't just acting out for the sake of drama. At face value, there are users who have donated money in hopes it would help get the site back up and running properly. They obviously didn't read the posts detailing what he used the money for, because that's exactly what the money WAS used for. Instead, they look at the money they sent, see the news about the sale and equate the whole thing to "sell-out".
Nice. Way to show exactly how fucking selfish you can all be. (This is NOT directed at any one individual. Only those who are making blind accusations without having a shred of common sense when it comes to business.)
He shelled a good fucking deal of money out. More than any of you EVER will to making this site work for YEARS both before and after the donation drives, and all you can think is how he "sold out" to a corporation. None of you have ever even run a business or have next to no business experience at all to speak of and you think you know all the details now because a corporation is involved. I don't profess to know all the details either. But, I DO know that it's simply not as cut and dried as everyone seems to believe.
Do NOT get me started on internet so-called "reviews" of IMVU's business practices, either. If one more person spouts out about the Better Business Bureau I will lose my fuckin' mind. Unless there are literally THOUSANDS of bad reviews about them, they wouldn't be worth the paper they could be printed on. You think there aren't jaded users who, just because they couldn't get what they wanted, would post some horrible story about how they were abused and/or mistreated by admins?
I've no doubt there are legit stories. Every company has them. But, getting it from the reviewer's perspective means you're only getting half the story, and if you're not willing to do 100% of the work to find the story, you will never be in any kind of place to call the shots like you think you are.
Either way, the BBB is the PUREST of BULLSHIT organizations. In order to be listed, a company must pay a monthly fee. Bet you didn't know that.
If that company falls behind on their fees, regardless of their standing with their customers, their rating drops. Usually from A+ to A or A-. But, if they have even a single bad review, despite how many good and loyal and happy customers they may have, that A+ rating will immediately drop to an F. I know this because it happened to the company I work for when they fell behind on their monthly fee by 2 months. They weren't even aware until they got a call. Turned out the credit card that was on file had expired.
In the meantime, a single jaded customer (out of over 4500) complained to the BBB. Only he didn't stop there. He posted 2 further complaints. UNDER 2 DIFFERENT NAMES.... And, it gets better...
ONE OF THOSE NAMES WAS MINE!! ... That's right. For no reason, this maniac posted a complaint pretending to be an employee of the company he was complaining about! Suffice it to say, it's been 2 years and the company is STILL fighting to get those reviews taken down. And, I'm STILL pissed about it.
It seems to me that if a company review board requires membership fees in order to display how good or bad their rating is, it is their OBLIGATION to REMOVE that company's listing if they fall behind on fees. The very fact that they continued to display their info and dropped their rating to an abysmal F tells me they are nothing but a scam from top to bottom.
Now, seriously, in case my comment from earlier never seemed to be explained in all of this, it seems to me that all anyone is thinking is that they're being taken advantage of. So, if I'm reading it right, a guy who's put his name out there, represented this site from EXTREMELY early on and made plenty of public appearances to show his support of the site and the fandom is now somehow trying to get away with something as if he thinks nobody will notice or care? Or, is it more that because he's done this, people think he's just that cold and callous and just no longer gives a shit what anyone thinks?
Because, either way, if that's truly what you believe, why would you stay?? You DO realize there are a ton of other art sites out there with a pretty good number of users, right? Users who may not even know you or, if you're an artist, that you even exist yet? Why devote your time to a site that you seem to think doesn't care anymore?
Hey, personally, I'm not leaving. I still like it here. Admittedly, I'll keep my eyes open. But, for now, I still like it here. Besides, I've got galleries at most of the major sites. Some are a little better maintained than others. Not gonna lie there... : P But, if this site goes down... *shrug* Won't be the end of the world or anything.
He has never owned up to his mistakes, he still runs furaffinity largely because he's done his best to keep it entirely under his control at all times.
He has shelled out a great deal of money, largely because the site is run so inefficiently that it has hemorrhaged money when it shouldn't need to do so. Instead of paying a professional programmer to redo the site, he's patched the buggy code with upgraded hardware. It would have been cheaper to hire a full time IT staffer, but that would have meant giving up control.
There seems to be this notion either Neer is an angel or a devil, rather than what he is which is a deeply flawed administrator who could badly do with more education and a well picked support team who actually know what they're doing.
As the owner, he got to make the calls. What I'm getting at is that all these reactions that people seem offended by all of this makes no sense to me. This is not THE HAVEN for all things furry. If it ends up disappearing because it gets so badly mishandled by Neer and/or IMVU then whatever. It's not like there aren't other options, or that there won't be another, better place for us all to go sometime down the line.
Don't misunderstand, I'm not saying not to care. I'm saying not to act as if you (the community) are being taken full advantage of when, in reality, most of us have nothing to lose. If you're worried about art/music/stories/photos or what have you, and you're not cool with the direction it's going, it probably would be in your best interest to pull everything from that gallery and start over elsewhere. :\ It's NOT an ideal suggestion. And, I'm honestly not trying to be snarky in saying it. I'm suggesting it because people seem so upset about it and it would make more sense for you to do what will most make you happy. Getting worked up over some announcements on a website just seems so time and energy consuming. :\
Who needs the high blood pressure? : P
It might be his website, but when he makes a balls up, the users are still entitled to have an opinion about it.
I think the issue might be more that this is one of the most central sites, other sites have lower user rates. If it goes down, users will either have to wait for the community to pick a new central site or spread themselves over multiple sites.
I didn't say I cared, I'm saying that some of the things you are saying are not even remotely close to factual. The notion that he's still mod because he's somehow good at the job, is ignoring the fact that short of him selling the site, he's had full control and thus whether he's bad or good at his job has nothing to do with it.
That this is currently one of the most central sites is possibly the weakest and laziest assertions I've heard yet. ANY site could be a "central site" if enough users migrated there. What you're basically saying is, "Awww, I'm comfortable heeeerrrreeee... I don't wannnnnaaaaa moooooove!" *foot stomp*
If it DOES go down, the whole "users will have to wait for the community to pick a new central site" argument is monotonous at best. The users ARE the community. They'll figure out for themselves where to go. The inconvenience begins with FA. There's no arguing that. But, once that shock has passed, it's up to the individual to do what's best for themselves. The community will live on wherever they go. This place is not THE HAVEN.
*I* didn't say YOU cared, either. I said "you" in the broader sense of the community. And, let's talk about "factual" for a second here. First of all, *I* never claimed that I had inside knowledge of this. I just know how business deals work. So, tell me, exactly how is it YOU know there wasn't an NDA of any kind? Because that would be extraordinarily unusual with a business transaction such as this. ESPECIALLY considering it's corporate nature.
MY statements are based on experience, and I fully admit they're open to speculation. But, since you're speaking from some sort of prior knowledge, I'd love to hear what you know now, since major details still have yet to have been disclosed, which is what seems to have everyone most up in arms about.
Potentially for some people that is the case, if the fandom scatters, then they'll lose many customers.
No, I'm simply saying what it is, much like how although deviantart has so many issues, it's still the biggest art site out there despite that.
I didn't say there wasn't an NDA, but legally NDAs usually are negotiated between individuals and usually cover internal details, not the fact the site has been sold. The statement that it wasn't legal for him to say anything is erroneous. The decision not to say anything must have been undertaken by him and IMVU.
I simply have experience in this sort of business, and what I'm hearing from Neer is a lot of weasel wording that isn't reassuring, I can understand why people are upset and worried. Neer doesn't seem to get people.
That's always been my understanding in transactions like this. I may be off on a detail or two. But, that's how it was handled when ownership of the company that I work for passed hands. I had been aware of it before anyone else only because my desk was right outside of the offices of the owner and the Branch Manager, which is who the ownership was being passed to.
It was a pretty ugly thing, overall. Still kinda is. : P
Regardless of what exactly is going on, I think we can all agree that Neer should not be in charge of PR. Many of the questions he keeps updating on could have been anticipated and covered in the very first announcement.
Dragoneer was looking for a room to attend FC2015. FC2015 ran from the 15th->19th of January 2015. Dragoneer says that the NDA prevented him from talking about it for two months. So exactly two months later after Further Confusion concluded, an announcement is put up on March 19th, 2015 concerning this IMVU contract.
There is something unnerving about the idea of making such a deal as this one at a furry convention. This just all seems to be thrown together with no real thought to it, and a bunch of system announcements almost daily like nobody thought that people might react this way. People just stumbling about finding things left and right and bringing it to the attention of others and then up goes another journal trying to explain that issue away.
WHy can't people understand this shit. God damn. :U
infact you're probably one of the few who "doesn't give a shit" (though simply by contributing, you're kind of bein hypocritical, but eh. )
I would not count that as a sign of great concern or care...
I know that there are some people on IMVU with 50 just for themselves, whether they forgot the password or whatever doesn't matter. - it still goes towards the user count.
so that "16 million users" ? yeah, it's not true at all
Allowing them to brag about a "high user-count" for popularity, and in a way they aren't lying because the number is displayed, but it is avoiding the truth.
But what I don't like is how, even when the admins etc. know about people with multiple accounts, they go ahead and keep them in the "total user count".
Anyways, I've had enough of ranting... and all this IMVU business is just getting on my nerves.
I'm going to stick around and wait it out, and only abandon ship if it actually starts to sink...
(And I'm concerned that it will, IMVU admins/Staff can't even handle their own community let alone a whole new community that seems to hate them right from the get-go)
"Vocal" - Obvious.
"Minority" - Clearly, because despite the moaning and the whining, the site traffic, and number of accounts, submissions, and pretty much anything positive that can be statisticized is constantly going up with little to no change in the rate.
"No reason other than to be upset" - There have been little reason given, much less valid on why this is perceivedly a bad thing. The most idiotic of furries love drama, they will make drama out of anything and everything.
Anyone who loves drama is a worthless idiot with such an empty life they need to force other peoples' actions seem worse to make their insignificant existence seem better.
Anyone who loves drama also creates it on purpose.
The rest is bollocks.
Also, I'm not arguing with you anymore. I've already said what I'm going to say, so kindly piss off.
This is exactly why nobody with a lick of sense, or the site administration takes the vocal, whiny minority seriously, or bothers enough to engage with them. You are a brilliant shining example, because you just blocked me, instead of acting like anywhere close to an adult person.
It's a sorry state when Youtube has more mature and informative commenters, isn't it?
While there seem to be very few issues that are directly changing concerning the end user (if any), a new owner means they can potentially change their desires and push the site and its terms of use in a different direction. This can include anything from the simple look and feel of the site to the Acceptable Upload Policy to potential premium accounts and more obtrusive advertising.
None of these are happening right now. But unless it is stated as such in the contract which we cannot get details on for legal reasons, there is no guarantee one or more of them won't happen. There's definitely no guarantee they will, but there's no guarantee they won't.
All we know is they are bank rolling the site and its resources in exchange for ad space and control over ads and such.
Get out we can't have those.
(Hi Jouva how you doin <3)
They can't see the big picture. A complete lack of perpective.
Yeah, RIGHT NOW nothing may change.
RIGHT NOW 'Neer might still have control of what goes around here.
But what about later? In a couple of months when this website gets less users, the whole issue settles and and IMVU staff start to see that this might have been a poor investment?
What if at some point they decide to discard Neer and pup someone from their team that know nothing about artists or furries?
We now don't have any claim to this website. No control. If we decide to go left and they want us to go right we have no damn choice anymore.
This site will be whatever IMVU wants it to be. Whatever they NEED it to be.
So if they need this to be something that will give them more money than they are investing...
Well, all I can say is that the money that go through this website should go to artists, not a for-profit organization.
When artists stop getting money here...
Welcome to capitalism, guys. Nothing is free. You can't have your cake and eat it too.
Oh, right, his check.
I mean, when a company offers to pay your bills in exchange for advertising time and nothing else (from what we've been told), you generally take it.
Big difference between offering a company ad space and offering the company full control over your website.
Now, you can continue to doubt that if you like. But, without proof to back up your doubts, they're simply speculation and have as much place in this conversation as those crying "sell-out".
IMVU is a for-profit company, they have no reason to take a pretty big loss to maintain FA if their monetization fails.
However, it would be a pretty foolish practice on their part to make a move like this and then boot the person who best understands it just so they can then make changes to it all. Why buy a website out from someone when they can simply buy their own and put whatever they want on it?
I can see why you guys are feeling nervous about this. But, I also still think there's a good helping of overreaction to it all.
That means: IMVU is the sole owner of this site and can do whatever they damn well please with it unless a contract written says otherwise, along with Neer no longer having any say if his boss wants him to do this or that, unless he wants to be fired and have someone else put in control of the website.
However, it would be a pretty foolish practice on their part to make a move like this and then boot the person who best understands it just so they can then make changes to it all. Why buy a website out from someone when they can simply buy their own and put whatever they want on it?
I can see why you guys are feeling nervous about this. But, I also still think there's a good helping of overreaction to it all.
Second: They don't need to remove Neer to do anything to the site, if they want to make changes Neer cannot unless its something in NDA or something else, do anything about it. He like the users can only voice his displeasure but he either have to do it or be fired.
And most people on FA aren't overreacting, we're voicing displeasure and our worries, along with asking hard hitting but legit questions to get as much information we can out from everyone possible. Because the more we know, the more solid information we have, the harder if need be, we can hit them and hurt them.
You know the fandom. We're on big family. Hurt one... You hurt all.
It's not that looking out for each other is a bad thing. I'm certainly not trying to imply that. But, saying that we're a family and all that implies ownership, or at least some kind of personal stake in this. The majority don't hold a stake in this site. Sure, if it were to go down and a mass internet migration followed, the inconvenience of needing to reconnect would be the biggest thing. But, aside from that, all it is is a website. There are plenty of other sites to use. I'm actually more worried that people are placing such a large amount of time and energy into something that should not hold as high of an impact on their lives as this seems to be.
It's a website. This isn't a retirement plan or a means of sustaining a basic quality of life. We can ALL live without it. That's not to say you shouldn't care. But, working yourselves up on the inner workings of a privately owned site in which none of us have a say in how it's operated is pretty maddening in the long run. And I worry more that people will simply become more jaded and cynical towards more and more business deals as time goes on until they're all sitting huddled in the corner somewhere suspecting everyone of doing something just to get at them. No more trust anywhere. Because they weren't on the inside during those business holder meetings.
Having a say in how this site is run is not for us to call. We don't own it. Its a site made for public use by the owners. Your concern is that the new owners bought it just to fuck with us, but that seems like a real waste of money and time. If they DO change the rules and you or anyone else doesn't like it, it's not like they can force anyone to stay. They'll have wasted more money emptying out an existing website than they would have just setting up their own with whatever purpose they may have originally had in mind.
All I'm saying in the long run is that all this speculation does is make people needlessly nervous over something that hasn't happened yet. It breeds mistrust that is not founded on anything because there are parties that haven't been involved before, and all you're doing is working yourselves up over what could very well be a massive boatload of nothing at all. It COULD be something. I'm just suggesting that even if it is, it shouldn't be taken as anything more than an annoyance. Because if you make it more than that you risk actually being HURT by this.
And you should NOT let a website affect you like that. It doesn't matter how much you enjoy its content.
If something actually happens it will be to late.
Damage will be done and then people will already have moved on.
We speculate to try and avoid possible problems that might happen.
Your logic is flawed and is basically the same as saying that because nothing is exploding right now, it's okay to light a fire on a gas station. When it does blow up, then you can complain.
That's completely misconstrued. This entire situation equates to the gas station changing hands, and you making the wild assumption that the new owner is going to blow the gas station up. Based on absolutely no evidence whatsoever. It's speculation.
Like changing out the pizza for a more subpar pizza but keep it at the same price, remove or add things they wish...heck they can fire the whole staff and get new ones...
You, yourselves, have been complaining in every single journal, always, every single one before all this imvu crap, that dragoneer is a horrible admin, that he should leave and that the staff should change.
Why do you act like if discarding dragoneer as admin was bad now?
Damn people swapping the side of the jacket depending on how the situations look in each case.
Keep complaining, keep leaving and keep returning in one week. All you're doing is just trying to get bad smell from poop that's dry since years ago and speculating. If IMVU really starts to destroy this site, then (and only then) artists will fly to sites that suit them better. Options exist: Babypornbunny, SJWeasyl, SlowFurry, ChildrenTART... No option is perfect; people will find the one they like.
If IMVU suddenly fired him and replaced everyone with more competent people, then I'd be happy, but that isn't going to happen because FA won't be able to pay for that staff.
Anyway, I get the whole idea about hoping for the best and expecting the worst. But, this is ridiculous. If a company like IMVU wants to buy a furry site to promote themselves and have more furries join their site, why would they put a person who doesn't understand it in the slightest in charge when the site already HAS someone in charge that gets it all?
You're equating a lack of promised site changes to bad performance. You DO realize that he works a full time job apart from FA, don't you?
You ALSO realize that a lot of the promised changes are things that take a SHIT TON OF TIME. Which, as it happens, is something that he and the admins are fairly short on because of the aforementioned full time jobs.
The money that they are being afforded to run this site just might take some of the pressure off on repairs and site maintenance so they'll be able to focus more on these changes and improvements that they've been wanting to implement for so long. It's understandable that you're feeling cynical and nobody is saying you shouldn't be.
But, come on. Don't be one of those people shouting into a bullhorn saying, "WAKE UP PEOPLE!" That just makes you a conspiracy theory nutcase that no one will take seriously. :\
Nothing has happened yet. And, even if it does, guess what? The end result will be that you'll have to go to another website. It's annoying. But, your life is not affected in any other way. If you think it is, that is a damn good sign that you need to go outside and expose yourself to some solar radiation a bit more often.
Admittedly, I am white as the background I'm typing on right now. But, even *I* get outside ONCE in a while. : P ... My job kinda requires it, since I have to drive there. : P
People from all over the world have voiced they would like to help, FOR FREE, with coding, trouble tickets, moderating etc. People have come forth time and time again, to donate money or even outright bought them the hardware they wished for.
Neer did this because he thought of everything but the site first. The site would't have had the issues or bad reputation when it comes to the staff it have, if Neer would have listened and thought before acting.
People were more than gracious in offering to come in and take it over at no charge. But, that still leaves him in a financial black hole that he would never have been able to dig himself out from. Plus the fact that he simply didn't WANT to give it away. I'm not saying he made wise choices here. I'm not trying to defend him from wrongdoing. I'm just trying to say that there is more than one perspective to see this story from. But, all the masses seem to want to do is view it from their narrow viewpoint: This affects ME. How DARE he??!
And, don't try to tell me that's not how people are seeing it. Don't try and convince me that they're doing it "for the community", because THAT is "utter bullshit", too. There is no stake in this at all for 99.9% of the users on this site. The other .1% tried to help and now feel they've been dicked over because he made this business decision in an attempt to keep the website afloat without it costing him his home and future in the process. My God, what a selfish prick.
I'm afraid we'll have to disagree on the whole idea that he acted in his own interests first, with no fucks given toward the site. I just can't see someone being associated with this site the way he has been, yet not caring about it at all. It makes no sense. Why devote that much time and money into it? You think the site existed purely through the donations and that he wasn't putting any money of his own into it? I seriously doubt he got THAT much in donations.
But, y'know what? If you know enough about how much was put in and you feel the ethic or the care still isn't there after seeing it from all angles, I will pose the same question I asked earlier:
Why are you still here?? If you're feeling used and cheated by the staff and the previous owner of this site, why do you continue to stay? Now, personally, I've never invested a dime into this site. So, it doesn't affect me the way it may have affected others. And for those people, I honestly do feel sympathy. :\ Because, to be completely honest, IF I had been affected that way, I WOULD have moved on. But, I also know people who have invested and either felt they'd done the right thing, or were simply happy with what they got in return. So, I really have no reason to think it's all scum and villainy.
But, I'll keep my eyes open. If I see anything, I'll sound the alarms right alongside the rest of you. For now, I just don't see a need to.
I don't think it's as simple as you think it must have been.
And, it's also quite possible that some of these people were even LESS trustworthy than people thought HE was. There's more than one side to things.
You've posted in all these journals as well. If you really don't think it's an issue, why participate? Like you said, it'll go away. But... you're not?
It's a repeating of exactly the same thing that happened the last 96 times. It gets boring and extremely annoying for the people who actually like this place. If you (plural) are going to leave that's fine. Leave. But don't come to bother the others, over all after you'll be back in a week like nothing happened.
What is the quantity of 'MANY' people caring verses the people not caring? Percentage please.
Not running away, not super concerned, but not saying I'm going to ignore this either
Then they feel like they are the ones who know it all better because FB is evil to begin with.
In the end noone is right. Be it the ignorants or the hysteric ones...
Keep cool people. Draw consequences when things acutally happen.
If nobody cared we would go back to the days where we don't get an update for months (until when we do, and then find out what terrible decision was made by the admins this time).
I will keep that in mind now.
Check onesself before throwing accusations and at least make sure they're reasonable eh?
On FA, because we work so closely with the people who create the art, we tend to remove it at the artists request if we can verify the theft. We still honor valid DMCAs, and take appropriate action.
This, seriously. There are a TON of popular furry artists out there, who don't share their "legal" name.
While I may not be popular, and don't give two shits on whether I am or not, having to do DMCA is not in my best interests, or any furry artist's interest, if they don't want to have their legal name etc connected out there somewhere with their art. Invoking legal bureaucracy, instead of just having the artist show their personal site/gallery/other proof that the art was stolen, is lazy and endangers the online anonymity of the artists involved.
By that same token, the whole "you have to pay to see adult work/products" to see if your work has been stolen at all, also connects you with your legal self, with your furry persona....and no, that isn't cool either. So even without filing the DMCA, you're already giving IMVU your legal info, potentially connecting you with your artwork/porn habits? Yeah, no thanks. I'm ditching this crazy train before it falls apart and takes me with it.
I was already getting disenchanted with the furry "community".... and this stupidity, is just the nail in the coffin. A box of roaches has more sense than most of the people in the community these days. They at least know to leave if a light gets shined on them.
IMVU has shady business practices. No way in hell they aren't going to sell your info to everyone.
This is a good question to pass up to IMVU, and one to ask the higher ups since it involves a particular set of circumstances that's not quite the norm. So, in short: I don't have a great answer to this one given that the DMCA is the legal method to remove copyright content, but I'll try to get an answer for you.
While I can sympathize with your selling the website for whatever reason. It's a part of change but you have to weigh in more on whom it goes to. At some point people were going to find this out and obviously its a bit much to swallow and people have a right to be worried. Problem is now I don't think this site will actually survive much more in this aspect. Many are freaking out to that exact thing. You might have a top position now but if money doesn't come in it will be inevitable that there will be premium accounts, etc and they might toss you aside. You're expendable like us now and that's the sad reality, since you don't exactly own the site anymore. Which will translate to more leaving. I don't see the acquisition without anything coming in the form that money has to be made and it's going to take more than ads for that to happen. People don't buy sites out of the goodness of their heart, it's all about investors, profit for business.
There will be premium accounts, etc coming in the near future there's no denying that.
NOW I CAN BLAST IT MORE
Only thing I can think of is giving said artists an account they don't have to pay for in order to view it while still limiting it somehow that it doesn't confer the other things that come with it. But then there's the whole inadvertently ending up with FA users having no choice but to be a part of their site if the want to police their own work.
Oh my god, IMVU IS FA 2.O!!!!!
DUN DUN DUNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN.
Not really, I don't see many good works such as those with similar quality to Zaush there and they have a large SJW following there. I should add that I was a Weasyl user before the SJWs moved in.
(I hope you were referencing this or else I will look too dumb)
MY ASS! You have done nothing but avoided most of the questions. And most of the Important ones.
Cool story bro, then how come IMVU shop is FILLED with stolen art from other sites?
Then the peers either are blind or they are instucted by Imvu to allow stolen content.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/4hm1rp0g2.....eeeep.PNG?dl=0
Leaving that sort of enforcement in the hands of users is short-sighted because the vast majority of people on the internet are misinformed idiots.
How do you differentiate between stolen and original?
This is the original submission by Tartii:https://www.weasyl.com/submission/203797/selfies
This is the same image cropped so the watermark is not seen, and they sell it as if it was their property: http://es.imvu.com/shop/product.php.....ts_id=22067666
Want more?
If I upload the same piece of art to each of them, then does that mean all of the accounts have stolen artwork except one?
And what if my search DOES turn up stolen artwork? The most I could do is track down the original artist and wait for them to deal with it, or talk to the imvu account that submitted the product and demand that they stop making money off of other people's work (good luck getting them to take it down)
And have you ever even tried using a traced image to find the original if both have been colored differently? Google image search by image searches by pixel relations and colors. Simply changing the hue of an image can make it impossible to image search successfully that way.
This is the same image cropped so the watermark is not seen, and they sell it as if it was their property: http://es.imvu.com/shop/product.php.....ts_id=22067666
Want more?
It's not rocket science.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/lqk30901a.....i/Bl2.PNG?dl=0
Tell me, how does that title help me find the original artist?
There are many holes in the IMVU Peer Review system. I will attempt to name just a couple that directly concerns your question.
- The first and most glaring problem is that every time you vote on a product you earn in-game IMVU gold/money called Credits. This unintentionally causes an incentive to click "Pass" (or "Fail" if you are a troll) as fast as you can with as many items as you can in as short of a time span as possible. Whether a product was accurately rated or not is of little concern to many of these types of peer reviewers as they are there solely to try to grind for the in-game gold.
- Then there is the problem of identifying if a texture on a 3D model or mesh is an original piece or is copied from another site. There are many picture frame meshes on IMVU and many times those frames get a piece of artwork attached to it that may not be the developer's original artwork. For those peers who actually take the time to make sure a product is on the up and up, it is almost impossible for them to find out if the piece of art is original or taken from another website. The user reviewing a product is allowed to see the product page of the newly submitted item and is granted access to a preview of the 3D object in-client. But, (and I know this is going to sound funny to you) in an attempt to keep mesh/model files (XMF) and texture files (JPG, PNG, GIF) from being stolen by peer reviewers, IMVU restricts peer reviewers from seeing these files directly. I think at most the peer reviewer might be able to see the file name of the texture placed upon the mesh or model, but therein lies another problem. If a person will go out of their way to crop out a watermark from an image, it is very likely when that person saves the cropped image that they will change the file name to something like "furry.jpg" Getting back to the reviewer, you begin to understand how difficult it would might be for the reviewer to back trace an original owner. Especially if we are talking about a piece of furry artwork with a reviewer who has never heard the term furry before.
You must understand that many of these peer reviewers do not go on IMVU in their spare time solely because they are uber excited about going through endless pages of products and by doing so fills some empty void they were missing in their life. Pretty sure most people don't consider Quality Assurance to be a hobby. Many peer reviewers have the mindset you find in a typical jury: "Doing this because I'm bored." "Could be doing something better, but hey it is giving me credits so w/e I'll do this for another couple minutes." "Thought it could be fun, especially to see some of the crap that is getting submitted."
This is what you're saying. That they actually don't care about copyright any further than they have to.
Filing a DMCA takedown request is long, tedious, and not guaranteed to get anywhere if you're not a US citizen. Not to mention that much of the content on the store is hidden behind a paywall to begin with.
I've already tried, & everytime it redirects me back to the main "log in " page.
God help you if you have an actual IMVU account, because I've been this route. After you submit 3 flagged items, they first warn you that you have reached your limit of flags, then in about 24hrs, your account gets deleted with the typical boilerplate generic email that they seem to send out all the time.
If you don't have an account, it still prompts you to log in.
Also, DMCA is very different from flagging. DMCA does not require you to log in and does not involve any IMVU account you may have. IMVU is legally required to act on a DMCA; they are not required to do anything if you flag infringing content (and have good reasons not to).
a) Finding a lawyer willing to take a case involving pornography
b) Finding a way to NOT get your identity leaked in the process that could get you fired from your job, or something similar
c) The cost of filing for the suing
All three of these are likely to be of issue with artists from here.
This is porn we're dealing with.
The DMCA's will not be honored, or at the very least will be very difficult to fully enforce without leaving the person pursuing it exposed and possibly damaged.
This is the risk. Furries and Porn are not mainstream. People can be fired over it (regardless of "protections"), and people can be looked at with a stink eye over it. Even if costs weren't an issue, the possibility of cultural suicide outside the fandom still exists. This being tacked on with the difficulty of filing something like a DMCA outside of the US is primarily what is concerning people. There's a lot of non US citizens on here you know.
IMVU is not all-knowing. You're implying that they actively identify and target DMCAs which are filed by people who do not want their name to be revealed in a lawsuit, so they trash them. Where's the logic in that? How would IMVU know that? What if the artist couldn't give a shit one way or another?
A single copyright lawsuit could wipe out their entire net income for the year if they just ignored a single DMCA submitted by an artist that doesn't care if their name is out there. IMVU is not run by that stupid of people to expose themselves to that level of risk.
Right, because one comment per month constitutes active posting. Now you've made me bump it up to two comments per month, you sick fuck.
u sound mad
But YTers still use Youtubes :I
I can't calm my tits Dx
giggity
That'd literally be 'molten' gold!
Not even all the trolls in history have trolled FA as hard as Dragoneer did by selling the site to people who are against adult art, pro art theft and pro overcharging.
that's my conclusion
Though the reason people are hating neer is he betrayed us for money. simple as that. He never asked anyone what they thought on selling FA to IMVU. Reason being is pretty obvious. No one would agree to it. He kept it in secret for a few months before just throwing it down on us. We have every reason to hate on him. He cant admit he fucked up and continues to try to "convince" in the most half assed way possible with a "I dont give a shit" attitude. So yes, people have a damn good reason to be pissed off at him about it.
Don't get me wrong I'm not knee jerking at the announcement but I'm hella skeptical about it
If what they say is true, and that IMVU simply bought FA out of the kindness of their hearts then all will be fine and dandy.
Everything however is just WAY too suspicious to believe anything without extreme skepticism
I wouldn't be surprised if this was bad press advertising for IMVU, too. Make them look bad and then people will make an account to report things, but then they get hooked or something, but that's just my inner conspiracy theorist speaking, hah. :P
Pretty sure 'Neer `hopes` that the community here isn't completely beyond the ability to use logic or rational thought.
Every time I see one of these walls of tumblr style comments in full-tilt derp though, it makes me lose a little more faith that this site can recover from society as a whole changing into something uglier by the year.
BAN HIM
Account has been closed for BEING A POOPIE HEAD
(TL;DR: Asinine comparison to Nazis is asinine.)
Here's how you solve the AP issue. Everyone with an FA account automatically gets an IMVU account. As a side issue, if IMVU does something so stupid as to require an IMVU account (Google+ anyone?), all prior users will already have one and only NEW users would need to sign up to IMVU.
If you so much as say that now to have an FA account you must (or 'will', if you'd like to use that term) have an IMVU account, people will just leave this site completely.
The buy out was supposed to help artists, not force them to go around yet another website to see if their stuff is being sold by someone else.
If you force people to have an IMVU acc, you're basically making a ****ty move to get people to join their site/community, and that is exactly what people don't want.
They don't want to have anything to do with IMVU whatsoever.
As Neer said on the Q&A, this buyout 'doesn't affect' us users here. And it should be kept that way.
The moment it starts to affect us... Well... This site won't last very long.
There's even some stuff from 2013 on there without consent.
So I'm still trying to get my head around this... (Even though the possibility of banning adult content exists later on) What has actually changed to cause this uproar? other then speculation and coincidence?
I'm not picking a side, just genuinely trying to figure this all out.
Here is how to deal with it:
Furaffinity users stop treating IMVU users like shit.
Everyone works together to form some type of anti-art-theft group where IMVU users (both with and without AP) check new products on IMVU and if they see something that doesn't belong, they can contact the artists.
If an artist, for some reason, is okay with their art being sold on IMVU, they can put themselves on a list that says so.
If an artist has an IMVU account, they can be put on a list that includes their IMVU username, so people do not contact and artist who is only uploading their own art.
So much this
Good point.
Fuck guys. Two announcements in a day about this, one with wrong information and this one without a lick of ACTUAL information/links. You guys sure are showing us you care.
How inefficient can you get :|
By mail
IMVU, inc.
Attn: DMCA Administrator
PO Box 390012
Mountain View, CA 94039
By e-mail
DMCA[at]imvu.com
Was that so hard?
Or are you implying Fender is lazy and not exactly competent?
I can be insulting and leading too! SO EDGY!
I'm trying to coalesce facts and solve problems as I find them instead of either 1: covering up what I don't agree with, or 2: making up problems with no actual basis, or 3: pointing fingers at tasks left undone without at least attempting to do them myself.
A second rate chatroom for teenagers.
Your new overlords.
But since dragoneer works at Imvu irl... you might imagine why he ended up selling to them.
See, it’s really a clever way of banking, maintaining some amount of power (the extent of which is unknown; the length of which is unknown), and being able to use the word Partnership rather than Acquisition.
Think of it like this, right?
I have something worth, say, $50,000. Which I could, indeed, sell for that amount and retain a sizeable amount of control, even. Or! I could sell it to another party, say for $40,000 with the promise of a reliable job, a title that ought to imply power, and a wage of $25,000 per year. So long as I’m guaranteed one year’s wage (well, technically 21 weeks would suffice), I’ve increased my profits by playing the long game over the short. Incentives make the world go ‘round.
See, he’s turned IMVU’s acquisition into a sort of annuity. One could call it a proper job – and perhaps it is, I suppose. However, I do really have to ask: if you had two months of waiting during an NDA, wouldn’t you have had oodles of time to prepare a proper announcement and FAQ? One does not actually have to wait until the NDA is over to prepare for when the NDA is over. Then again, it could be ‘Neer thought IMVU was preparing all this; it may be that Dragoneer thought it’d be a do-nothing job and IMVU thought otherwise, thus simple miscommunication or unmatched expectation; or, of course, it could be the ball simply got dropped.
Mind you, these numbers and structures are just examples; I have no reason to expect them to represent reality. Nor should one consider that if true, this would be a case of Dragoneer doing this solely or primarily out of self-interest; he may well have thought this the right direction to go.
I could not possibly disagree more.
Ultimately, I am simply trying to show that there are rational, predictable avenues that a corporation, such as IMVU, could tempt an owner to sell other than agreeing to a higher buyout price. After all, it’s hard to be a proud owner of the fandom’s hub when you’re struggling to pay your bills; and the prospect of a steady, secure job along with any benefits that may attach (life insurance, health insurance, etc), it would be as tempting to most as a Thanksgiving feast would be to a starving, homeless man. I don’t fault the fact that it got sold, nor do I loathe the seller; I do, however, profoundly regret it wasn’t kept in the fandom, communicated so that a counter-offer could have been attained, and question the judgment of both parties involved.
FA is my silent home. I don’t panic; I don’t post. I’m a lurker and I’m too stubborn to turn tail at the first sign of trouble, no matter how big the sign may be. I did not own it and until the prospect of it possibly being set up to fail (unintentionally, mind you – I doubt IMVU wants to tank their investment), I never realized how much of a home it was. Maybe I’m just a sentimental dragon?
It’s that sort of realization that really stings, though. Had I known, perhaps I could have added to that consortium and sweetened the deal? I haven’t much, but enough to buy at least 1%.
Anyway, I hadn’t meant to go on long. I just wanted to say, that’s one possible way that a lesser single payment could end up being a sweeter deal. Life isn’t just about the short game – there is a long game, too. I don’t think Dragoneer such a fool that his options weren’t weighed; I simply have trouble believing I’d come to the same conclusion. (Yes, in fact, I am aware that I haven’t the least bit of standing; it doesn’t stop me from wondering, questioning, and analyzing the facts, even if it is an utterly fruitless endeavor.)
I genuinely hope I’m wrong. I’m not leaving until I’m proven right, but I do think it wise that folks back up their art, find their favorite folks on the alternate sites, and be ready. The time to prepare for trouble is before it occurs, not after. Hope for the best; prepare for the worst. It’s the only way forward I can really see.
OR have an account registered to flag it as stolen.
There should be a simple reporting mechanism, like an email address, Twitter account or web-form.
They should hire someone full-time to deal with reported art thefts.
Look at the source, look at the thief's item. If it's a patently obvious case of theft, issue swift and brutal punishment. If it's ambiguous, work it out between both parties.
I'd advise everyone in this community to keep an eye on that "MissHarleyQuin" account on IMVU to see what happens. This person has stolen a huge amount of art.
The account hasn't been banned yet. Why's it taking them so long to respond?
They even stole art from some of the most popular furry artist. How are they getting away with this???
http://es.imvu.com/shop/product.php.....ts_id=16211166
Yep. Lol.
Fake edit: By the way, you post a lot of things that make a lot of sense everywhere and I appreciate it. c:
If it's a blatantly obvious case of theft, they should just act on it swiftly.
From their TOS:
"IMVU may, in appropriate circumstances and at our discretion, terminate service and/or access to this Site for users who infringe the intellectual property rights of others."
So if you use their service, steal someone's art and they ban your account for it, you haven't got a legal leg to stand on in suing them for damages.
Then again, I'm a little paranoid in the first place here. I have a pretty severe distrust of companies that, until recently, blended together into one big blob of banner ads that I've long since blocked. For some time I was trying to figure out if IMVU was the same company with the "~*come play, my lord*~" ads with scantily-clad women everywhere, and when I learned that it wasn't, I struggled to remember what exactly did have those ads until I had to Google it.
Then do a DMCA letter/fax instead to their offices and just follow the legal requirements on what information to provide. If you don't like it, get your lawyer to do it.
We're shy.
Later.
"So a lot of people's artwork has been getting stolen - here's how you file a DMCA."
Also the DMCA with 'all that personal information' is literally just a name and address... I really thought it'd be more inclusive if it was so hated and despised. Take a long time quite perhaps, I can't shed light on that, but this is almost frighteningly easy to complete.
It goes a little something like this:
1) FA shall never provide an on time report with a serious concern, General's orders.
2) FA Users are all dumb enough to believe staff, fact!
3) Reassure users with useless crap and shameless product placement, they'll never tell the difference~
4) Dragoneer is best living, breathing being, or else...
5) Why fix stuff, we got plenty of duct tape and know how to beg for money, so send a donation today!
6) IMVU owns U, remember that, (It's got 'U' right in the name.)
7) Rape is taken seriously. Nope, just kidding, we fully endorse it!~
8) Banhammers are the most effective tools to deal with the pop up weasels, I mean furs...
9) We like butts, put them EVERYWHERE!!1!!
10) Should anyone rise against us, we will kill them, dig them up and then stuff them in a fursuit, kill them again! (Ring a bell...?)
This has been the TOS F.A.T.A.S.S. report,
Thank you for looking, and good night~
If you go out of your way to look for conspiracy, you will always find it. (Or contrive it.)
There is only two types of theft. Char theft and art theft. Char theft is someone stealing your char and playing it off as their own. Art theft, someone stealing your art and claiming it as their own(or selling it as their own).
If u18chan was selling the pieces, that'd be a whole new ball game. Reposting isnt "theft" its just going against the artists wish to not repost if they wished it.(even more so if they have a link to the source of the original)
Every place I've been to that has art theft as such(which are art sites, SL, gaia, ect) If you mention it straight to them with proof, they'll remove it without question. If the proof is "lacking", then you offer more to help it. Anyone can steal art but all you have to do is get the word from the original artists sent over and so on. Like for example. If someone stole my char(which they have) and put it on flist. I just tell them to remove it and link to my char(and quite a few pictures of said picture I own). Easy and done. If someone is selling on SL you put in the complaint to get it removed. Depending on the picture you will have to contact the artist to have them mention to the staff they didnt approve. It gets removed. Simple and done.
Why should IMVU be any different? Reason being, is they make money off the content and why they allow it and give no shits if you put in reports and only jump on it when you put in a DMCA report, because if they dont do anything about it. the shit hits the fan for them.
Like I said dont try to defend laziness.
No, see, here is where you are wrong. Reposting is very much theft, in many cases. Sites like U18 take art off of paid sites (like HardBlush, Patreon, etc.) and repost it where anyone can see it for free - so people are getting something for free, that they would normally have to pay for, without permission. That... is pretty much the definition of theft. (If it's from a public site like FA, where anyone can see it just by joining the site, then no, that's not theft. But that's not all that happens.)
If u18chan was selling the pieces, that'd be a whole new ball game.
This is a very common misconception. Intent to profit actually has very little to do with copyright infringement. People often think "Oh, I'm not selling it, so it's not copyright infringement." Yes, it very much is. Intellectual property laws apply regardless of profit/monetary intent.
If you mention it straight to them with proof, they'll remove it without question. If the proof is "lacking", then you offer more to help it. Anyone can steal art but all you have to do is get the word from the original artists sent over and so on.
Eh, this has not been my experience. I've had my character impersonated (and my art reposted without my permission) on F-list, and nothing was done about it. (In point of fact, regarding my art, the moderator actually told me I would have to file a - you guessed it - DMCA notice in order to have the art removed.) I've had my art stolen on DeviantArt, and when it was reported, the moderators ignored my report (they didn't tell me I was "lacking proof" or anything; I simply never heard back and nothing was done about it). Granted, these could be two isolated incidents, and they're the only times I've had my art used in ways counter to my IP rights, but that "easy and done" is simply not the case many times, even on other sites.
I agree with you that IMVU could - and should - streamline the process a little bit more, but let's not jump to conclusions and assume that they don't take it seriously. Since they DO make money off of their third-party content (and the other sites you mentioned don't), simply responding to every infringement claim would 1) likely require more staff/resources than they have and 2) have significant effects on their profit. SHOULD they be profiting off of stolen art? No. But the fact that (as we are finding out) so much stolen artwork is there means that they could significantly lose a large portion of their business - especially with the outright RUDENESS that furries have been showing them since this whole thing went down. So it stands to reason that they would want to go through the legal process.
Whether you LIKE the fact that IMVU owns FA or not, the response from furries has been despicable. They've treated IMVU in ways that are just disgusting. In light of that, why would IMVU want to make the process easier when doing so will cost them money and when furries are going to be dicks about it? That's not defending laziness; that's pointing out the obvious fact that like it or not, IMVU does own FA now - as a community, we could have reacted graciously and given them an honest chance to improve the site. But instead, we (again, as a community) acted like spoiled children and posted rude messages on their Twitter, changed icons to "no IMVU" signs (i.e. "I hate the owners of the site that I am actively using"), and just generally made them likely regret ever buying the site. I have a feeling that things WOULD have been okay, but now that we've made such a terrible first impression, I'm not as certain the new owners will be particularly gracious about things. I know I certainly wouldn't be if I were treated the way they have been treated.
Again was talking about what i said above.
This is to each their own I guess. I have had no issues getting stuff removed. On F-list, secondlife, or inkbunny. Every place I had issue with I just sent in a contact about said theft with my proof. If they questioned it(or for example secondlife asked me to get the approval from the artist. which I had to send them over to say their word on it) and it got removed. So most likely you either had a bad encounter or someone was just in a dick move that day. Experiences vary I suppose. Since my friend had an issue with F-list along time ago and they couldnt get them to even answer them for about a month. And even then they had to go through hell to get it removed(mostly because the original picture was removed by FA admins. so it was even harder and more drawn out to get the proof, which I can understand).
Well really, rudeness is well deserved on IMVU as they give the same exact attitude back.(Secondlife had a shitty phone support...I will give them that. bought some linens from them and it went to the account instead of to my char where it was suppose too. They wanted me to pay them an extra $1 to put it on my char. Which I told them straight out "no, just put it on my char like I originally did. Its not my fault you screwed it up" and I get a "Its just $1..." from the support. Which that tells you something. and Yes after that I stopped paying for secondlife and quit playing it within a week after that and wont go back. Like I said, seperate experiences.) Though IMVU I havent heard a single good thing from them and I keep hearing more and more shit from them(and this is before FA and even after FA and its from friends who use to use it. not FA drama ones). They all tell me the same thing. IMVU is money hungry scammers. They dont give a shit about anyone and all they care about is their money base. Which is the art. The only reason they wont do anything about it. The reason they point to the DMCA is because its more drawn out and more "personal" then just contacting an admin and getting them to remove it. So not many people will do it. And as long as they dont get any reports from DMCA, they can keep on trucking with that art theft. SL and Gaia I only approved because they both took it serious enough to not throw it in your face(and yes sl makes money off of the sales the same as IMVU). I cant remember gaia, I havent been on there in like 12 years, but that was pretty much the same.
I never said anything about IMVU buying FA. Im saying the reason why people are pissed about it and they have every reason to be pissed about it. Dragoneer didnt tell anyone till 2 months AFTER it happened which is a dick move on its own. Hes not answering MANY questions that need to be answered...He changed the TOS without telling anyone. He did it extremely unprofessionally(not that he was professional to begin with, so really idk why I expected different) but the fact is. This community made FA the way it is, not dragoneer.
Though like you said. We as a community have no right of opinion by your standards. We were given a large middle finger and we are just to accept it with open arms.(Your exact words) To a company that has a bad enough reputation as EA. Also to point something out, I think no one gives a shit if IMVU has bad taste towards us. We didnt exactly have good taste towards them to begin with. Anyone who's ever been on IMVU will tell you straight out its shit, and anyone who hasnt, will find out if they try it. To put it simply. This should of never happened. If dragoneer put it up to a vote before selling, I can tell you right now no one would agree. And dont say it was a money issue, there was people on this site offering up to 50k to help the site out and others even willing to buy the site from him. So him just selling it to IMVU is very fishy and seeing as dragoneer never cared about the community, this shows this site is just going to go down into the shitter. Its just hasnt reached the point yet.
Well, whatever, I'm too unpopular nor I do anthro anyways to worry too much about it.
I'll keep sitting and watch from Pixiv. This gets more interesting, how the realm reacts....
http://es.imvu.com/shop/product.php.....ts_id=16211166
You must be one of those people who think that everyday's struggle for money is also drama.
http://dogsondrugs.com/wp-content/u.....reakingout.gif
Neer, I get it, you want the site to advance and you can't do it alone, but the way this is being handled is not effective. Hell I STILL don't get how IMVU can help since all they are is a glorified chat room service. If you REALLY want to win people over with this merger (or whatever you want to call it) set up a set schedule of events and have people STICK to it. Tell us WHEN we'll get a UI update, WHEN the site gets more servers for better performance, WHAT we will be getting to have a better experience on FA (and don't you FUCKING dare put it behind a pay wall like DA did, I left that cesspool for a reason), and finally hold the people who are WORKING on those things accountable.
You say that you want this site to grow and continue fostering the furry community, I wanna believe that, but seeing is believing and right now you need to show what's going to happen and keep IMVU as a silent beneficiary. I know you care about this site and the people who use it, and actions speak a lot louder than words, so let us know what your plans are and make them happen.
Right here. Just this!
If he sold it to Imvu, is because he works IRL at Imvu, obviously the company is gonna give him something in return.
Also, LOL dictatorship. Perspective, man, perspective.
so they still wouldn't be on time even if they did make a schedule and post it.
oh, found the specific comment: http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/...../#cid:44922034
and in case it gets removed: http://i.imgur.com/vqEwluQ.png
So much for transparency and honesty, right?
Pretty much certain it's not going to be finished, and IMVU is now responsible for it all.
As for your job, if you file a DMCA report, IMVU does not give your information to anyone. If they did, you could sue them.
Honestly, IMVU has not had the best ways to deal with art theft in the past, I can admit this. However, I am hoping that with dealing with FA, they will learn some tricks and gain a better understanding of the art trade.
IMVU has been listening to users more lately than before, so I am wondering if maybe enough people were to go on the IMVU forums suggestion area and post (politely) that they would like IMVU to allow copyright infringement issues to be handled in help tickets. They might listen.
I am not sure though. Right now, I see a lot of people hating on IMVU for even having the art there to begin with. But to be completely fair, how can people expect them to know the art was stolen if they were never told it was?
I think the people on FA need to become friendlier to the people who use IMVU so that they can work together to find, and take care of, art theft.
I am also hoping that the furry community will become more welcoming of IMVU users, I know I have met a lot of people who looked down on me simply for using IMVU.
And I'm not being specific on the who's and what's cos I'm honestly fearing a ban if I do ;w;
http://es.imvu.com/shop/product.php.....ts_id=16211166
However, it was supposed to be peer reviewed to make sure it wasn't stolen, but that obviously didn't work out.
After all, are they so retarded to not do a simple google search with the archive's name?
Second Life art theft and IMVU art theft are the exact same thing.
A user of one of those two sites comes to FA or any furry art hosting site. they gather up all the popular art they can and save it. then they go into the respected market places of SL or IMVU and upload it as their own to make profit off of. Now in IMVU they get paid in IMVU credits when other users buy the art work the OP user stole. Same thing in second life, however in secondlife, the OP can take the money they got from selling stolen art work and turn it into actual useable money.
Step 2: offer it as a product in Imvu
Step 3: someone exchanges real dollars for Imvu credits
Step 4: transaction takes place
Step 5: profit for Imvu and the thief
Secondly how is the people that work IMVU supposed to know that the person that bought some credits is using them to buy stolen art work?
You just put the item into google's image search, and with that you know if it's stolen or not. That's how I noticed the stolen art from Tartii and Falvie.
1) Let’s say that I’m paid in IMVU Credit for something I “acquired” elsewhere on the Internet (Acquired is to Stole is as Partnership is to Acquisition; it simply sounds a whole lot better, even if it isn’t exactly the most accurate description.)
2) I look for a buyer of IMVU credits willing to buy directly from users (I’m betting IMVU credits are fairly anonymous once activated, but it isn’t central to the plot; just adds a layer of anonymity, unless there is a strict real name policy enforced). Bitcoins would be ideal, but I’d probably lose a significant margin just because most people feel BTC are a pain. (Given 3-C below, I’d wager I could just sell via Paypall; I honestly don’t think anyone is cracking down on this, so the disincentive is tiny and my profit margins may increase significantly.)
3-A) I sell the Bitcoins locally
3-B) I spend the Bitcoins on goods with retailers that take BTC as payment (I could use the goods, or sell them on eBay/Craigslist/Whatever for cash. Remember, the goods aren’t stolen; any gains from here are successfully laundered, and even the IRS isn’t any the wiser. True, it isn’t perfect anonymity, but no one devotes five thousand bucks solving a five dollar crime, so to speak.)
3-C) I sell BTC and have the proceeds wired to Paypal/My Bank/Whatever – it sacrifices anonymity, but to be honest, no one is chasing these people anywhere near this far.
Or I could skip all that and buy something with the IMVU points themselves; from there, I could resell any physical item or I could get things I actually desire. This has the benefit of working even if the credits are not transferable via IMVU players. (Is players the right word, really?)
Honestly, if I can figure this out on the spot, there has to be people who have done this, simplified it, and make it work for themselves quite well. Or maybe I’m quite the thief and just never had an opportunity to realize it?
As for the second part, I do not have an answer. I am, however, kind of skeptical that the peer review method is honestly designed to be useful for its stated goal. If there is no punishment for mass clicking, and if there is value to be gained in the act, then it seems rigged to favor exactly the sort of situation that exists: one where the peer review system is rendered a joke as everyone milks it for profit. To that end, given that this isn’t exactly a know-nothing group of people, I find it unlikely that this poor matching between incentive and purpose is coincidence. In that case, where there is substantial profit to be made and talent enough to know better, I am willing to put aside my “cockup before malice” philosophy.
If I'm right and could prove it, which I absolutely cannot, then Safe Harbor protections wouldn't apply.
Then again, since IMVU and FA are joined at the hip, there's a real possibility FA would get taken down alongside IMVU if I could.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5igp00MoAng
Your the worst administrator EVER! COME ON...GOOD GOD!
A: "Fur Affinity is governed by the site's terms of use, not Google's, Apple's or IMVU's." - IMVU
Rest assured, IMVU is *NOT* taking FA content, redistributing it, reposting it, using it in-game, etc. It's your content. Only FA has the right to show it if you upload it to the site. No one else.
1) IMVU's policies do not govern content posted/shared/sold on FA
2) IMVU does not have any rights to or will take a cut from content posted on FA
3) IMVU has not been given any user information from FA
Yet the community on IMVU will and has.
However, it's troubling to think the sites new business partner has such a serious issue with art theft, considering this is an art site. I hope that FA's new relationship with IMVU will help reduce the amount of theft.
And don't forget your complementary malware bundle when you're signing up!
/sarcasm
IMVU is not full of malware.
Here is how you fix this issue:
1. Furaffinity users stop treating IMVU users like shit
2. form anti-art-theft groups where IMVU users (with and without access to AP) check up on new prodcuts.
3. Users report to the artists when they can find them to have products removed
4. artists who upload their own art to IMVU can be put on a list with their IMVU names so people don't bother those who are just uploading their own stuff.
^^^ this really does not show how dedicated you are with the site on how you care about other peoples content.
http://i1026.photobucket.com/albums.....psnpfsggcn.png
^^^You should be answering questions here instead of twitter dont ya think ?
If you're an artist and your art has been stolen and posted on IMVU by one of their users,
and the thief (and incidentally, IMVU) has made any sort of monetary profit off the stolen work,
... does IMVU (or the thief) owe you some money?
Totally.
REKT
I'd say that's even shittier.
There's obviously stolen content that can't be reported by anyone except the copyright holder (good luck for them finding if their art has been posted!) sitting on that site for years, yet there's not any kind of moderation or way to protect the artist's original works. They're just sitting there until the artist maybe by any chance can find their work on that totally obscure website.
Just by clicking the "shops" and virtual items on there you can notice most if not all of the content is unauthorized reuploaded art.
Even neopets is more strict with only letting people use art that has been created by the user, and they promptly ban anyone who they notice has been using artwork without consent. Even neopets will listen to you if you raise concern about someone else's traced work.
Then there's IMVU. "You must take legal action if you want to stop us from profitting from your work (only)... maybe! if not, though luck!" Gross.
But at least they have the common decency to be mindful of copyright issues; a few weeks ago I found a piece traced from a meme (of all things) submitted to the Beauty Contest, and the staff had it deleted within two days.
Can companies that suck stop buying things? I'd appreciate it.
I bet this proves that Dragoneer should be trusted..... I think I was wrong all this time . ( link given by a friend ).
So instead of the person putting up things for sale having to prove they own it to keep it up and making money...
You'll have the artist, whose stuff they're stealing, go through all the added bother of summing up all the proof they have that they're the owner. LEGIT!
And Also - so anyone outside the US is basically "effed"?
Lastly, it's a good point people make - whether or not IMVU stole the for example image, IMVU still profits from it due to the whole thing having to happen with "currency" that they sell. Shouldn't the person whose work was stolen and profited from be compensated?
It's a dream scenario I'd say, but imagine how eagle-eyed they'd become with policing what is put up into their shop if that was the case.
They could still make it easier on the artist who was wronged.
But I guess that wouldn't be that good for them. I mean making it easier to have 99% of their store removed?! MADNESS!
Goes to show how loving and caring the hands, that now hold FA, really are.
So much love and warm feelings I'm going to gag.
OH! And they aren't owned by IMVU :D
That right now is a very attractive, shining feature.
All while having zero moderation about what goes on their virtual shop, making it incrediby hard for artists to get their work removed (only if you threat with legal action) and not compensating them in any way.
...The biggest furry art website owned by people who don't seem to give a damn about artists! Isn't it amazing? What could ever go wrong?
BUTT BUTT BUTT BUTT
That's what I did read.
We all know that IMVU is about money, money, money, greed, greed, greed, and by buying FA from him they just have another source of profit. They're the art equivalent to M$.
As a matter of fact, what is freedom on the internet?
But then again, opinions~
I cant support a place like that.
I mean, wheres all the transparency about the fundraiser? What happened to that money, with receipts?
Its fishy af especially since drags was in debt.
It is true, IMVU's store is more by the userbase for the userbase, so it's not exactly the company itself putting out work by other artists, but they are making money off of it (which now loops back around to FA getting some of it which is hilariously ironic). I think the shops shouldn't be restricted except for age, and particular purchase areas are just that, restricted to purchase if you pay a pretty penny for a shinier account.
But everyone can see what they're missing out on which COULD BE STOLEN WORKS SO IT CAN BE REPORTED OFFICIALLY WITHOUT HAVING TO SHELL OUT TO DO SO BECAUSE THAT IN ITSELF FEELS P SCAMMY.
That's just me, though.
AP is adult content. There is a reason it is not publicly visable. There are minors who use IMVU.
I'unno, still feels leery to me.
Thank you. ;w;
I keep seeing people micing up VIP and AP and thinking AP is a monthly subscription. AP is just a one-time purchase, although, you do have to verify your age first.
With the younger audience, there is no reasonable way to allow artists on FA to see AP products (and even if they did find a way, imagine how artists on other sites would react?)
What needs to happen is that FA artists need work together with the people who use IMVU. Be willing to listen to what they have to say. Then they can work together, IMVU users (both with and without AP) can try and keep an eye on new products and give the product ID numbers to the artists so that the artists can file a DMCA on it.
How the site's built and how it essentially makes particular spots "pay for access" makes it feel really... really weird. That I just can't get over, personally, but that's just me, but as long as things can be sorted out!
I do hope that'd be the case at least ;;
yeah 99% of it stolen.
Also, why are there so many people freaking the hell out over stuff that MIGHT happen. Nothing has changed yet. Wait until something actually happens before going all crazy.
It's the beginning of the end of FA.
I'm not implying it's the end of FA like some people are proclaiming. I'm just saying that we shouldn't be so quick to believe all that's being said because something is hella fishy here
It's a new direction for FA that's for sure and all people can do is wait and see.
It’s apparently too late to flail around to scuttle the deal; by all indications, the ink has been dry for a long while now. It isn’t too late to try to head off what problems we can see through whatever means we have at our disposal. (And at this point, I’m not terribly optimistic that I’ve any means at all, shy of rambling in the depths of the comment section; I really, really don’t feel like jumping in all serious-like on the dildo pile.)
Then again, odds are, anything I say won’t change anything. :P I’m as insignificant as they come, no doubts about it, I don’t even need an “about” in there to give me wiggle room. Still, though, I’ve spent days biting my tongue and have felt no better for it. If nothing else, maybe ranting at people will prove cathartic?
Little advice, assume fully what you said in the previous journal. Don't go down that dirty half-lying path for PR, people will notice and with how upset many of us are right now, that cannot help you.
If they're already blatantly stealing and reposting art from FA and have been for years, then casually lie through their teeth that they aren't/won't in the future, why the fuck should the community believe another word out of their , or 'Neer's mouth on the whole IMVU issue?
We've obviously been getting screwed by IMVU for years now and I see no reason why we won't continue being screwed in the future.
Your point sums up the reality of the situation xD
Will FA's content now be subjected to DCMA claims? I would far prefer this to the arbitrary nature of "the artist is always right" doctrine that has somehow gotten embedded in Weasyl and FA's culture.
:*)
IMVU must comply with the DMCA process exactly as it is specified and therefore all required information is needed before products can be taken down. Do remember that the original content must be yours before you can initiate a DMCA takedown request - you may not file it on someone else's behalf.
Untrue, how strict a company is about taking down copyright violations is not legally mandated. They have every right to be stricter than that. DMCA regulations are the legal minimum they must carry out. Not what they are restricted to.
If a company decides they don't want any submissions with pink in them on a site, they can remove every single one, no company is obliged to host anything at all. Ergo, that IMVU will only act upon full submission of a DMCA by the artist who owns the material is a decision they have made, not something they are restricted to.
I only did it just because I solemnly felt like it.
Those that are complacent with the situation will just agree. Those that aren't will be drowned out.
Giving that this is the first time in YEARS that multiple updates about the sights changes has been put up, ever. This sounds lie typical smoke-screening. Something's not right, otherwise they would not have to keep trying to calm the public, giving how little care seemed giving during other problematic times.
Keep backpedaling, this is amazing. <3
Yes. I am doing this to piss people off.
Dildos, dildos, dildos.
Who wants a Dildo Cheesecake?
Dildos are everywhere on your Dildo Menu.
Would you like some fries with your salt?
You just got served with logic, I don't need to give you complimentary salt because I see you're already full of it, thank you and have a nice day~
The hell does that have to do with anything?
That's what I read.
'Nope, you need to grow up, brat'.
You're getting so upset over a little joke that you can't grasp the concept of making simple sentences. Besides, you're accusing me of being underage yet you're name-calling like an underage user, yourself. Your hypocritical statements amuse me.
This is some serious issue and you are making fun out of it. I hope someday something real bad happens to you and people make fun of it.
Been made fun out of because of it all my life, and in return I just want to watch the world burn <3
Pot, meet kettle.
http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/6596756/#cid:44948436
I just find it funny how sensitive people can get over a little joke.
Then you guys get sore and rage at us. You're like a Christian against atheists. 'OMG I MUST FURCE MY BELIEFS DOWN UR THROAT OTHERWISE ULL GO TO HELL SAOPDJAAIPFHSI'
It's all completely stupid.
How can I stop doing what I do best?
I know how this affects the people that make money with FA, because it's IMVU fucking over FA users and Dragoneer.
FA userbase in a nutshell much? That's what's funny.
So again in short, there policy protects the seller of it, not the original creator of said content. Which to me is a policy that really needs to change.
FurAffinity userbase is freaking out.
What's new? Always freaking out about something. It's comical.
Yes, companies do get traded. A lot of times, these trades involve large lump sums of money taken not neccessarily in the best interest of the company, but that's another issue entirely, and not neccessarily what's going on right now. Side note: recieving large sums of money and the best interests of a company are not always mutually exclusive, while recieving large sums of money and the best interests of a person are never mutually exclusive until it involves the mob. But, back to what I was saying earlier. Sometimes those companies have a community. Transitive property; sometimes communities get traded.
Sometimes the traded company gets merged into a company with another, separate community. That community generally has little influence over the smaller one. Who it does have influence over, however, is the company it is connected to. What the bigger company wants to do with the smaller company's community happens, generally without exception. Sometimes, a lot of changes occur. Sometimes, not much happens at all. Sometimes changes occur thanks to community influence. This can go both ways.
What does this mean? It means whatever happens to FurAffinity, and, by extent, its community, happens. If nothing happens, then this whole situation with everyone freaking out was pointless (hint hint, it's why we get mocked on the rest of the internet, hint hint), and everyone involved looks stupid. Now, if something does happen, then the concern right now is justified if and only if the changes are bad, and IMVU knew they would harm FurAffinity and/or its communiy before the changes were implemented. However, I assume 'Neer was smart enough to make sure that the terms in the merger make something like that impossible. Hopefully.
Point is, we don't even know what's going to happen, if anything actually is, which may or may not be a failure of the Communications Department of the People in Charge Agency. But this freaking out over nothing, is stupid. Nothing has yet happened other than the acquisition itself, and if it actually had been in the works for two months now without any notice, by all rights, get angry at the people responsible for that mess. But, until something changes for the worse here, stop freaking out.
TL;DR innocent until proven guilty, alright?
But, as far as I'm concerned, this merger hasn't changed anything yet, so the only thing anyone should be angry about is them not telling us about it when negotiations started.
We get it kid, now go and sleep.
I couldn't care less about the updates, and merely came to this journal to see what the big fuss was about. Noticed the people raging at one person saying 'dildos' in the comments and found it really funny, and decided 'Let's see how many butthurt people will come to my comment if I post the exact same thing, even admitting that I'm trying to piss people off'.
And to be honest, I may not be a troll, but if I were, I'd be doing a pretty damn good job to be making you mad enough to keep feeding me.
Just watch, this site is gonna get DDoS'd again soon enough. Just you wait and see.
Why are you so salty
The Internet: "I do what I damn well feel like doing!"
For me, this could go in only one direction:
-"I'm on the Internet, so does that logic apply to me? Because I damn well feel like giving it to your mom again."
Flailing about is most common.
That's the game, not the prize, of course.
but it's dildos.
Is there going to be a change in cost for artist-hosted ads due to this change?
"The advertising that we are talking about is not ads for the IMVU service on FA site. We will be monetizing the FA site traffic by selling ad space to third parties - ads will be unobtrusive and targeted to the community interests. "
-Varsha - Director, Community Experience & User Safety
So I dont know if you guys have ever been on IMVU, but they can have a lot of 3rd party ads such as insurance etc. I know it says targeted to the community- but it is worrying that there could be the potential of ads that arent just artists on fa? In my opinion that sounds like more users using adblock - less interest in paying for the actual community to buy ads for their art? :/ Maybe Im under the wrong assumption on this?
"Half man, half wolf! HAS SCIENCE GONE TOO FAR?!"
"Hot local yiffers in your area!"
Dragoneer, you need to own up and admit you dun goofed with not at least asking your community on their thoughts, and putting more research into your decision.
and in my opinion, you lot are causing more drama than it's worth, make one major change or have one person say another raped someone, and ya'll get offended or pissed off for no reason and go out of you way to cause more shit.
get over it, really.
Let's say you owned FA. You find yourself $10k in debt, and then you go to work and find that you no longer have a position - it's been removed from the company. You struggle for months to keep your website on it's feet, all the while, trying not to let the community know about your own private financial struggles.
People come to you and offer to buy the site flat out - but their terms are not something you would consider.
Finally, a company approaches you and offers that you continue to run the site, but they'll pay the tab and pay you for running it.
Remember. You own FA. The $10k bill (that is undoubtedly growing) is on you, not the community or anyone else. If the site goes down you still owe that $10k.
What do you do? You've already been nailed for taking donations and are already under constant fire.
Anyone in their right mind would have sold the site under those terms. I would have.
the major topic is, how many of us are trying to boycott this so it makes everyone leave because FA is owned by another source. what's done is done, but right now it's everyone flipping their shit over something that isent THAT BAD, i honestly think it's our own community posting said pictures and product's. to try and boycott this entire thing.
as i said...we all need to get over it and go on with our business. as for improvements on the site? community focus should be the first priority.
and to Dragoneer, i aint trying to be rude about you or to you, but this is a community, we all share this space, some of us even donate to the site to help, even offer our service to keep it running and improve it. i dont blame you for selling the site, and im glad you got such good terms for it. but next time, please tell us BEFORE you do something as drastic. you know how furries are, cant have a website without a community and it's been going down hill for years. i know you have it in you to make thing's better. but you need to start involving us.
EDIT: after readin the below comment, thats your first change you need to make. that is copyright infrigment. especially if it's watermarked.
If he had come out earlier and stated that there were negotiations ongoing for selling the site people would have flipped out even more. They'd have wanted to know exactly what was going on and with whom - and that's not standard business exchange.
I completely understand what you're saying, and I've admitted before that I don't know how the donated money was spent and I won't pretend to. I didn't donate, so it's not my concern. I'm just stating that, as a current and former business owner and one who has managed many a business before, I get where he was coming from and why he did this.
It's like you say, people need to realize that the site needed funds, and now it has them. They should just hang along for the ride because no one's artwork is in jeopardy.
But.
If they were spent inadequately wouldn't it be a good idea to have someone else in charge of the funding? Someone else to watch the spending and where it was going to?
We could all pick up and move to another site as easily as he could shut this one down.
My point is, from a business perspective, he doesn't owe the users a say in if the site got sold or to whom. What's done is done. It was a wise business choice and involving every user of the site would have been Hell.
It's their's.
Extract of the current FA Terms:
" 4. Data Use, User Created Content, and Privacy
4.1 - When you upload content to Fur Affinity via our services, you grant us a non-exclusive, worldwide, royalty-free, sublicensable, transferable right and license to use, host, store, cache, reproduce, publish, display (publicly or otherwise), perform (publicly or otherwise), distribute, transmit, modify, adapt, and create derivative works of, that content. These permissions are purely for the limited purposes of allowing us to provide our services in accordance with their functionality (hosting and display), improve them, and develop new services. These permissions do not transfer the rights of your content or allow us to create any deviations of that content outside the aforementioned purpose"
What does this mean?
It means that you must now PAY IMVU to report YOUR stolen artwork. It means that, even if you have watermarks, IMVU has the rights to YOUR work--or anything you commissioned--and make money off of it as in-game skins, posters, clothing and more.
If your artwork gets stolen on IMVU you must now make an account and in many cases a paid 'premium' account for mods to even look at it as several furries have screenshotted all over Tumblr
The amount of crowd control that's happening, or the fact that so many people got angry at the fact that the first comment was 'dildos' yet again.
It made the crowd so torn apart about what to fight about again. lol
I'm still getting a few good laughs out of this regardless, however. Drama is a funny thing, ya know?
(Harassment? Keeping his identity safe? I don't know)
(and I'm also partially blind when it comes to clicking links)
As for the second part, I'm just trying to get the monsters to come out of the furry fandom, detrimental is a bit harsh for the wording. You should know I'm in support of the people that are rebelling, you and that other guy Hansfox or something? I cannot remember his name. Some posts I also do not care about as I find them irrelevant and only find it as Harassment and Aggression simply towards Dragoneer for being stupid in either wording, or trying to explain something.
(It gets hard to talk to a userbase when 95% of what you get is "you're a dumbass" or something of the sort)
But as mentioned in the first line of my post, I'd like to see the 'took back his apology' thing and maybe I'll be harsher to judge.(as I was in the past)
In all seriousness though, if the admins were doing anything that we could trust in the first place(Dem comment deletions and TRANSPARENCY), I dont think the dildo thing would have started in the first place. A joke for a joke, ya know?
Wanted to bring that up... and yes. Dildos. <3
xD That was fucking great.
Extract of the current FA Terms:
" 4. Data Use, User Created Content, and Privacy
4.1 - When you upload content to Fur Affinity via our services, you grant us a non-exclusive, worldwide, royalty-free, sublicensable, transferable right and license to use, host, store, cache, reproduce, publish, display (publicly or otherwise), perform (publicly or otherwise), distribute, transmit, modify, adapt, and create derivative works of, that content. These permissions are purely for the limited purposes of allowing us to provide our services in accordance with their functionality (hosting and display), improve them, and develop new services. These permissions do not transfer the rights of your content or allow us to create any deviations of that content outside the aforementioned purpose"
What does this mean?
It means that you must now PAY IMVU to report YOUR stolen artwork. It means that, even if you have watermarks, IMVU has the rights to YOUR work--or anything you commissioned--and make money off of it as in-game skins, posters, clothing and more.
If your artwork gets stolen on IMVU you must now make an account and in many cases a paid 'premium' account for mods to even look at it as several furries have screenshotted all over Tumblr
again the terms are very clear they can do with it as they please you uploading it here gives them the authority.
You retain copyright of your own works, and the TOS does not override that. It's there to make sure that the gallery site can portray your stuff, allow it to be downloaded by users, showcase it on the front page, and so on.
IMVU: HA HA HA! You're all fucked, we'll steal your art and your money, because we work for the government, so stealing everything you have is our job.
Dragoneer: I see no problem with this as I wallow in my cash.
But either way, IMVU and Dragoneer are probably intentionally fucking us.
Give them time to tensen up, they're a little too loose.
Hell, half the people who are making those jokes are trying to make the best out of a bad situation but your rudeness and pessimism is what kills it. Ever think you're to blame for the negativity here, not us?
Get out.
Idiot.
literally if you're going to claim people are 'trolling' you should do something everyone on the internet learned in frickin 2007 and dont feed 'teh trollz'. seriously, its 2k15. we shouldn't have to explain this to you, even if you are someone who thinks autism is an insult somehow
These kids think they can come here and make fun, I just humilliate them to show them some respect.
literally the only person you're humiliating here is yourself. calm down, honestly. take a step back from the computer and get a drink of your favourite beverage you have currently in your possession.
also important to realize: people cope with massive change in weird ways. this includes use of humour. again, if you and other people who are freaking out over the dildos posts like everyone who posts them personally hates you and everything you stand for, people will stop finding it funny. right now the entertainment value does not lie in 'haha dildos', its literally 'lets see how many douchebags i can piss off by saying something irrelevant'. you're directly contributing to the 'issue' (in quotes because there is no issue because, again, people cope in weird ways)
just like...chill. theres no need for insulting everyone and acting like neurodivergence is an insult to people. thats not getting respect or humiliating people, that's just being a giant raging dickbag
Say that to ALL the artists whose day to day income is in danger thanks to Dragoneer's stupidity.
Those who need to sell furry porn via FA to feed their families aren't laughing at this, believe me.
buddy the point is you, personally, are contributing to the spam by responding to it. you're being far too reactionary for the situation and are clearly panicking, judging by the rest of your comments, or are simply enjoying fear mongering. calm down. youre freaking out on children and spreading false information that has been cleared up several times by people who are against the buying of FA just as much as you are. it's inappropriate, unnecessary, and honestly embarrassing to watch. you are not helping me, an artist who would be affected negatively by this website going to the shitter, and youre certainly not helping everyone else by freaking out like this.
sit down, shut up, and let the big kids talk
Guess what will happen when they apply their rules and ban or restrict the adult/mature material here.
honestly though lets be real: FA's massive userbase is almost 100% dependant on the fact that it allows porn. if IMVU decides it want to completely remove nsfw art, they are going to essentially lose several thousand dollars. a paywall i can see happening because lets face it, IMVU likes money and furries really, really like porn (and no, i don't agree with paywalls like that but honestly, not the worst business decision in the world at the end of the day. just a gross one). otherwise? the chance of all porn being banned forever is so slim as to be nonexistent
That's what I read.
delete this post then they have something to hide guarantee it
That's seriously taken serious? ...
Now I'm actually worried aside from the past paranoia I had about this.
and I understand they are all jokes but an admin needs to know when things are going out of hand
At first it was an act to be funny, and it was funny the first few comments.
Then it turned into trapping and getting those that took this too seriously(and didn't have logic behind it)for lulz.
Then it turned into "What is even happening, just clean this up."
http://es.imvu.com/shop/product.php.....ts_id=16211166
I had heard rumors that IMVU stole furry art, but I wasn't sure if they were true. Thanks for showing that they are.
Why did I join this site, lol. It's a joke. Especially because they picked the name "furaffinity" and most people don't think to type .net instead of .com - Been here for years and STILL I forget it's .net, oooh just the other day I accidentally typed .com on a family computer :') That was loads of fun
Too bad I'm not one of those people who say "I'M LEAVING" and then stay anyway, I'm smart enough to know when I will or won't do something xD
srs dude....... YOU SHOULD OF KNOWN THIS EITHER ON IMVUS TERMS OF SERVICE OR CONTRACT.......
This went from something I was blindly looking at to something I'm incredibly worried about.
Then people get mad at someone saying the word retarded.
I have yet to see more than 7 questions ABOUT THE TOPIC in this journal.
Can you explain why ive seen this and why it came off as bad as it did?
https://twitter.com/Fuzzypaw/status.....045825/photo/1
Again, remember this day, the day when other people had serious problems and you just came here to laugh at them. Life never forgives.
And now I just want to watch the world burn.
What a coward.
I hate every human being because of their incompetence and their hypocrisy. And yes, I also hate myself. Because why shouldn't I? I was born.
Now run along before I continue to talk about dildos.
So dildos to you, my friend. Dildos to you.
-sigh- Im just hoping some of my questions will be answered without having to like scroll though all of the "dildo" comments and other irrelevant ones. Im a bit worried about everything, even after all of the journals.
Pathetic.
~IMVU 2015
Because, you know, stuff like telling someone to kill themselves is an appropriate and level-headed response to some joke. They certainly can't be ignored, as we all know!
Probably why they bought us in the first place.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CAq8sigUcAEY6Yc.png
Like we preach love and acceptance, right? Furries are nice, open-minded, trustworthy people? WRONG. Those comments are proof.
It's really sad actually because I joined this community because of some kind people, but I was mostly a DA fufag and then I recently began using my FA and I was (and still am) really surprised at the amount of rude comments and immaturity from the majority here. People say DA is full of drama, but I think FA is more dramatic xD And granted, drama is everywhere. Sucks for the people who hate it x-x
Overall, if you're a furry who says you're kind, open-minded, trustworthy, and/or accepting, don't go around being a hypocrite.
Jokes about dildos are unnecessary, but if it bothers you, ignore it. It's one word. Don't start more drama.
Jokes about retards and other illnesses whether physical or mental are never funny or called for either, same with jokes about race, gender, sexuality, age, and so on.
Honestly, I came here because I wanted to learn more about what's going on and more about IMVU, and I'm really disappointed at the comments. :')
and I agree with you on the second jokes.
Heres the thing tho , the site has a bad track record of handling out malware and going after the profit margins instead of the community itself. if Diviantart or Youtube was being bought out by a shady company, I think they would freak out the same way aswell .
There is one thing about being accepting and open minded, but being in denial + passive aggressive about a thing that could destroy the site is a completely different matter.
And that's true, yeah, but I don't really see concern here. It looks like most people here don't care. I'm not even an artist, but I care. Stealing art is never okay, no matter what. But there is no need for aggression towards EACH OTHER here. We can be mad at IMVU and mad at FA and mad at Neer, but taking out the panic on each other is only making things worse.
I mean I do see some people who do care about the issue at hand, but it's few and far apart in the sea of people making dick and dildo jokes. :'D
And I mean, dildos are pretty funny - but it's not appropriate right now. x_x
Yeah, let's hope :C
And I've seen things be taken down before, we just need to start linking maby someone even make a short help guide to it
http://es.imvu.com/shop/product.php.....ts_id=16211166
Came here to troll and backfired? Poor of you.
So he did just, technically, make a career out of it...
One he may get fired from if it continues to be the revenue sink that it is... but a career none the less.
I simply shrugged off all the dildo comments, because I don't give a damn about those - but leaving such a comment when a good few artists' livelihoods are possibly at stake proves that you lack empathy and are just an imbecile.
A little fun can be made of every situation, but you've definitely crossed the line there.
TOOT TOOT!
IMVU SHOULDNT HAVE FA!
many artists are leaving fa cause of this...
They always come back.
Sad ain't it?
My message is clear: this is no time for jokes or stupidity, things are gonna get really difficult for the many furries who require to sell art as means to survive.
Please understand that it is hurting not only you , but the users and the site aswell. Now I am not saying to stop with opinions just ease it down alittle
It only adds to the stench.
... and this is exactly why you are doing more harm than good. Trolling isn't fought by trolling, it only makes it bigger, specially when either or both sides are not good at trolling since they are obviously emotionally invested in it. It's annoying yes, it's rude yes, but doing the same things but on the opposite side of the conflict just makes things worse.
All smells so fishy.
I think we should test that.
FA would be written off as a loss and just shut down with dragoneer possibly being fired/without a job.
Either: FA is run down into the ground
Or: FA continues trudging along
(Your icon made me chuckle. I can't believe people are getting so anal about this.)
also on the TOS :
4. Data Use, User Created Content, and Privacy
4.1 - When you upload content to Fur Affinity via our services, you grant us a non-exclusive, worldwide, royalty-free, sublicensable, transferable right and license to use, host, store, cache, reproduce, publish, display (publicly or otherwise), perform (publicly or otherwise), distribute, transmit, modify, adapt, and create derivative works of, that content. These permissions are purely for the limited purposes of allowing us to provide our services in accordance with their functionality (hosting and display), improve them, and develop new services. These permissions do not transfer the rights of your content or allow us to create any deviations of that content outside the aforementioned purposes.
this kinda proves that Dragoneer saying that it will not be going on IMVU could most likely be a lie ( understand it is updated in 2014 but this should be a cause for alarm because that means IMVU CAN try and get the images at discretion for the reasons of new services ).
This implies that the company is not willing to move a finger about art theft until you have the federals backing you. In other words, they won't give a damn about it until you get a lawyer against them.
It's the users that steal the art, not IMVU, nor does IMVU have the right.
Copypasta'd from lilythekitsune http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/6596756/
Extract of the current FA Terms:
" 4. Data Use, User Created Content, and Privacy
4.1 - When you upload content to Fur Affinity via our services, you grant us a non-exclusive, worldwide, royalty-free, sublicensable, transferable right and license to use, host, store, cache, reproduce, publish, display (publicly or otherwise), perform (publicly or otherwise), distribute, transmit, modify, adapt, and create derivative works of, that content. These permissions are purely for the limited purposes of allowing us to provide our services in accordance with their functionality (hosting and display), improve them, and develop new services. These permissions do not transfer the rights of your content or allow us to create any deviations of that content outside the aforementioned purpose"
What does this mean?
It means that you must now PAY IMVU to report YOUR stolen artwork. It means that, even if you have watermarks, IMVU has the rights to YOUR work--or anything you commissioned--and make money off of it as in-game skins, posters, clothing and more.
If your artwork gets stolen on IMVU you must now make an account and in many cases a paid 'premium' account for mods to even look at it as several furries have screenshotted all over Tumblr
When you upload content to Fur Affinity via our services, you grant us a non-exclusive, worldwide, royalty-free, sublicensable, transferable right and license to use, host, store, cache, reproduce, publish, display (publicly or otherwise), perform (publicly or otherwise), distribute, transmit, modify, adapt, and create derivative works of, that content.
As stated here in teh TOS non exclusive world wide royalty-free.... to use, host, store, cache, REPRODUCE, PUBLISH, DISPLAY(Publicly or otherwise) PERFORM (publicly or otherwise) DISTRIBUTE, TRANSMIT, ADAPT, and CREATE DERIVATIVE WORKS OF. Now that IMVU owns it THEY already have the RIGHTS as is in the TOS of the FA already
The copyright laws for the web are fuzzy. A lot of people incorrectly interpret the laws set up by websites that allows them to function. When words like 'redistribute' and 'deviations' seem to imply to some people that they can just take artwork and claim it as they own and profit from it, but that is not what these laws mean.
In FA's ToS, the rights to user uploaded content reads:
4.1 - When you upload content to Fur Affinity via our services, you grant us a non-exclusive, worldwide, royalty-free, sublicensable, transferable right and license to use, host, store, cache, reproduce, publish, display (publicly or otherwise), perform (publicly or otherwise), distribute, transmit, modify, adapt, and create derivative works of, that content. These permissions are purely for the limited purposes of allowing us to provide our services in accordance with their functionality (hosting and display), improve them, and develop new services. These permissions do not transfer the rights of your content or allow us to create any deviations of that content outside the aforementioned purposes.
What this means is that FA has the right to STORE information of your submission - the data is physically in their database. It also means that they get to display it on the website - otherwise we couldn't browse anything because they wouldn't be legally allowed to show the content without these rights. It also means they can copy work - such as when they migrate to a new database (they are copying your uploaded information from their old database to the new one). These laws do not grant FA the right to steal artwork, claim it as their own, and try to profit from it or anything like that.
IMVU inherited these rights as the new owner. FA cannot give IMVU rights that FA did not have to begin with - if IMVU does have the rights to steal art and produce it as their own, then that would imply that FA had such rights to begin with.
Also, IMVU is a big boy business. Big boy businesses do not care about unrecognizable IP's - they are here solely for the human resources of the website. The fear that their team is going to steal furry artwork and profit from it is, frankly, absurd.
Lastly, this is the internet. If you really *really* don't want your work being stolen then don't post to the internet at all. Big businesses may not steal your work, but shithead individuals absolutely will - case in point the *user generated* IMVU store that this topic is about.
At least other furry websites you can upload?
BUT I FULLY AGREE WITH YOU.
Removal process of Furaffinity/Weasyl/Inkbunny/SoFurry/e621/AnyFurrySiteEver:
1. Register a free account on said website. (In most cases not necessary since you can usually just email the people in charge)
2. Write them a PM/note/message where you ask them to take down said infringing artwork.
3. Supply them with links to other accounts you own for proof of identity. Sometimes with a blog/journal/etc starting "Yes I am this person".
4. Because said website's entire income relies on them being on good terms with their community/users, they will take it down as to not alienate other artists/users who brings in donations/ad-revenue.
You are now done, your artwork has been removed, and in most cases the person posted it will get a warning, alternatively banned. Everyone is happy.
If this process should fail there is always DMCA, but in 99.9% of the case this will not happen because like said, main revenue is donations. Unhappy users = No donations.
Removal process of IMVU:
1. Register an account. The email you supplied is now in a database that is most likely shared with third parties. I hope you enjoy advertisements and spam.
2. Take out your credit card and pay the $15 (or whatever) required to gain access to VIP. (This step might not be necessary as I'm not 100% sure if you need VIP in order to browse webstore adult content)
3. Browse the Webstore and take note of the IDs of the infringing content.
4. Now sit down and write them a DMCA email. Be sure to include your real name, address, phone number and other personal information.
Now here's the kicker; Since they're not reliant on you, nor the furry community as a source of revenue, they may ignore or reject the DMCA you just sent.
This because they know that most people would be unwilling to go to court over what is essentially porn. I mean, would you be willing to go to a court of law, featuring your family and random strangers, showing them pictures of your porn while arguing that said porn actually belongs to you? Of course not. IMVU knows this. Therefore they can afford to ignore most DMCAs.
And even if this action upsets your fanbase, they don't have to give a shit about that either, because you, nor your fans, represents even 0.1% of their monthly revenue.
One could argue that one should upload Dragoneer's (or any of his friends) artwork to the IMVU webstore, and give him a taste of just how horrible this "removal process" he just praised, really is.
But you can't. Because Dragoneer works for IMVU. If someone were to upload his, Sciggles, or any of his best buddies stuff on the IMVU webstore, he could just pick up the phone, call his boss, and say "Boss, can you remove this or that from the webstore", and within 5 minutes all his shit is gone from the store. No question asked.
The person who just wrote this announcement, praising IMVU DMCA as a valid process, is the ONLY person who can AVOID said process when it comes to having his stuff removed.
Meditate on that.
What really astounds me is that he knew this was a risk from the start (https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CApKOlM.....-IFn.jpg:large) and he did not think of the potential risks associated with the fact we could simply not access a section where stolen art might be exposed without paying real money.
Then there's the whole DCMA process, where you know you will not be able to - or at least not without great difficulty - get your artwork taken down. No one is going to want to go to court against them. Hell, how are you supposed to when you live outside of the US? We're basically sitting ducks at this point and there is nothing we can do.
IMVU was know for art theft, shady business practice from the start and it was also well-known that they did not crack down on art theft. And, without thinking of the potential risks the staff still sold it to them.
Seriously guys?
I'm concerned as everyone else in this community about this. Just kick out IMVU.
-Artist makes art, posts it online. Might be personal, might be a commission, whatever, it's online.
-Thief sees art, saves it and creates an item for sale in the shop at IMVU without notifying the artist or even giving them a namedrop
-IMVU users buy credits with real money, then spend credits on stolen artwork
-Thief gets credits for the artwork, IMVU gets money for the artwork
-Artist gets nothing
- Dragoneer laughs
-IMVU requires artist to file a formal legal complaint (DMCA) to remove the stolen art from the store
-If accepted, the artist is not reimbursed for the money that was spent on the stolen art
-If outside the US, an artist stands to require a longer wait for acceptance or face a tougher time against counter-claims, since the DMCA is a US law
-In addition, IMVU hides adult content behind a paid service, so artists aren't able to see if their art has even been sold or not, let alone file a takedown
iit's all ok whit the comerce. Dragoneer can make whatever he want whit his page, but I relly like my fursona and the few pics that my friends gifted to me to make them comercial for someone else profit...
see you all on weasly, sofurry or wherever you wanna go...
-HUGS!-
Thanks Dragoneer.http://www.imvu.com/shop/product.ph.....cts_id=6666385
I'm worried but don't know what to do.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93JqK32LqW4
*holds out his hand*
what the shit
IMVU allows art theft and since they know not everyone can pay a DMCA, they continue to profit upon stolen art.
For IMVU: http://www.imvu.com/catalog/info/ta.....nnoticehtm.htm
Mail or fax. And it's not like this is new. This is their process from before. Still only applies to IMVU, not FA itself.
Your name
address
City, State/province/territory, zipcode
Addressee's nameaddress
city, state/province/territory, zipcode
I'm sure the mailing system would work, but for safety measure, I would put the name country the person lives in. I think you should try ging to your post office and ask them because I could be wrong.
It is pretty much taking away our creations, our creativity, and our personalities in some cases. Fursonas are meant to be a part of us. not a part of the public that people can just say "Ooh nice tits" or "I like that colour so that fursona is mine now".
so I can understand why people are worrying, I myself have had situations where my fursona
So I personally don't trust IMVU and neither should the admins for FA. no matter if you work for them or not.
Not doing so is breaking their own rules, not sure about the law but their own rules at least, and that means you can if you want to, file a lawsuit and trust me. They'd not want that because it can hurt them badly in so many ways its not even funny [For them]
http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/6596797/
Or was it kindergarten? Lord knows, I'm getting a more similar vibe... >:(
Onto business-related endeavors, then:
ADMINS TAKE NOTE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (this means you,
Will this aforementioned DMCA process directly affect writers and their ability to share/trade their own written material; personal or for others? I work with a range of literary outlets. It has, in a way, established my "furry reputation" among this fun-loving (understatement?) fandom. I'd like to be re-assured that my work won't be plagiarized and butchered by immature young adolescent fuck-tards with a fear of their own grandmas, God, authority figures, heavy drugs, prison gang-rape, herbal tea and burning after-shave.
So... can I have an answer?
Or do I have to open & file a trouble ticket to get a proper response?
...hopefully I won't be expecting a response from a chubby little old man behind a green curtain, oh great and powerful Wizard.
No offense, sorry for the hostility, I love you guys - truly I do... but I'm growing a trifle fucking sick of combing through DILDOS and OOGA-BOOGA and Christ-muffins knows what the holy houdini hell-scrotums fuck-knuckle-sock-toes buggering else to anticipate a simple answer to an otherwise simple question.
I repeat:
Will this aforementioned DMCA process directly affect writers and their ability to share/trade their own written material; personal or for others?
Will this aforementioned DMCA process directly affect writers and their ability to share/trade their own written material; personal or for others?Will this aforementioned DMCA process directly affect writers and their ability to share/trade their own written material; personal or for others?Will this aforementioned DMCA process directly affect writers and their ability to share/trade their own written material; personal or for others?Will this aforementioned DMCA process directly affect ME and those like me?
I shall await a response. :)
ROCK HARD, LIVE HARDER-MIKE/Max/Brad/MaileXP
GOD WHAT HAPPENED TO MY FA?!?!?!?!
FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFcrimony.
Thanks for providing such a prompt response!
I honestly wasn't expecting an admin/mod to reply anyways.
They seem to have their hand-paws rather full with other pressing matters! XP
Annnnywho, that's all stuff I learned while in university :P good stuff to remember
http://www.reactiongifs.com/r/2013/.....eye-twitch.gif
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wBqM2ytqHY4
Honestly though?
Judging by the
BULLSHIT
string of comments at the very, very beginning of this journal...
I can't say I blame the guy.
If I mandated a site with ^^^ that mongoloid ignorance as the first viable hint of response to an otherwise heavily troubling post involving perhaps all others who share this site equally...
I'd ignore the living breathing fuck out of all of us too.
Man... furries. *shakes head* Drama-llamas 'till the bitter-end, I guess.
I'd probably hate attending a convention... XP
*shrugs* C'est la vie!
Thank goodness I still have the 1,600 you start with.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZOyDEMTUJ38
OK +1,000,000,000 this
I needed that Laugh thank you
On a serious note, I loved that video.
GG
I can't stop laughing.
Now I would not do this just for Fur Affinity , but every other site on the web . Wesbites should not hinder to a company that has unethical values on how the site is runned. If this site is run to the ground , then it is my fault for not stopping the said issue . Also who know ? maybee they will buy out other websites and the repeated mess will cycle again
Everyone who goes on or owns a certain website needs to see all of this and take it as a learning tool to how they should handle + do business on the/their website.
Though, I do agree with you that malware DOES float around the site and chat client and the staff lack decent security, I would also like to point out to you that IMVU is NOT responsible for the ads or 'earn free credits from surveys ad offers' containing such. They are being paid to advertise for other websites and have said before that that is not their wrong-doing. However, IT IS the decision of the user whether or not to risk getting malware from clicking those links and doing the free offers and/or surveys. Most users buy their IMVU credits from IMVU, resellers or prepaid game cards to prevent this.
IMVU does have a copyright law - DMCA that offers when someone steals from another IMVU dev/creator (such as textures they've created for furniture, rooms, clothing, ect...). I will admit that I do not think it applies to pictures or artwork found on the internet at random. As I said before, art theft has been going on for years before this happened - many naive/oblivious users will find something they like on google image or any art site and make it into something. Many pictures have found their way to thousands of things on IMVU in the shop be it random images or not - many do not know where they've come from. There are also FA users that play IMVU such as myself, but I do not put any artwork from FA artists into my catalog unless it is something I paid for and have credited for personal/private use.
I do agree that art theft is wrong and should be dealt with, but with stuff like IMVU, I really don't think anything will happen as many pieces of artwork has not been claimed/credited by the artist or owner of the original character(s).
IMVU is NOT a large business, in fact it is run by a small group of people. The chat client and the website have been in BETA testing for nearly 10+ years and is still ongoing because they cannot afford decent servers, security and the proper equipment to fully release it. So, stable security, servers and even graphics are sadly limited.
Why put ads or surveys on their site when they know that its going to get a virus ? Why make a toolbar when clearly it collects users data for advertising puroses? do they care ?Malware is never " not a huge deal " IT IS A HUGE ONE . It shows whether or not they are fully trusted for the said customer or community ? and as a business they should know not to fuck over the customer.
Sure they have alot of stolen art on the said site , BUT YOU NEED AN ACCOUNT ON THEIR AND TO PAY TO EVEN FLAG THE CONTENT. They will get your information and they have gotten your money . If you do not want to do that , then there is always the DMCA option which is a hassle on both sides of the spectrum.
If it is in beta for 10+ years .............. dragoon LISTEN TO US PLEASE. Here this statement . They have SHIT. HAVE NOTHING .NADA ZIP with a website and servers worse than us. SEE ON WHAT YOU HAVE DONE.
as quoted by you just to get attention from Dragoneer and people on FA :
"
The chat client and the website have been in BETA testing for nearly 10+ years and is still ongoing because they cannot afford decent servers, security and the proper equipment to fully release it. So, stable security, servers and even graphics are sadly limited. "
t brain anymore. The wine and whiskey ain't helping either. x.x
Think of it that way.
Aside from that, I'm off to bed.
But they can afford to "buy" FA?
Can you explain that?
Hell, my boyfriend was banned from IMVU for no reason at all. He joined, he was fine for a month. Then out of no where, they banned him with the reason 'suspicious behavior on your account' which is bullshit. When he called them, they said 'oh, go to the help center online. We cannot help you over the phone.' He did what they said and simply told him 'there is nothing we can do.' (Note that I've called IMVU plenty of times over issues and they've always helped me. Why they refused to help him, I have no idea. It just seems fishy to me that they pulled that crap with him). They didn't give him a reason of his banning. So all that money he spent on there got wasted and clearly shows how much IMVU supports their users.
They have server outages quite often and it's all due to the lack of protection. Most of these server outages are caused by hackers getting into their system. Each update they pan out after that - the update notes NEVER say they've once switched to new servers or have gotten better security. It's always "oh, we've added this useless thing Get Matched!' or 'Shop together was added to VIP users.' Hell, the most recent useless thing they've added to the chat client is auto-correct on their chat client for computers (not the phones).
So, what they do with the money they like to milk from their members I have no clue about and quite frankly, I'm a bit disappointed in both IMVU and Dragoneer doing this. I would never sell my site to a small unofficial group of people that lack server quality, security and are plain assholes to their users for no reason except to get money from them. One would think that the money they get from IMVU users would be put towards what they NEED not what they WANT.
That sounds so scarely like here that I can see why they found such interest on eachother...
> chat client in beta testing for 10+ years
> they cannot afford decent servers
> yet they just bought FA
If they can't even afford their own goddamn servers, how's FA supposed to benefit from this acquisition? If IMVU can't afford to even maintain and get better themselves, how's FA supposed to benefit from all this?
Oh Wait...
And that's how content spreads, little one.
But also I'm that sick of FA that I'm posting all of my WIPs and not fully done pieces on other places like Weasyl, tumblr and twitter. It sucks cuz this place has a lot of content and user and great peeps but to be honest the management quirks of IMVU aren't meeting what I'd think of a company that would rake in a amount of cash worthy of 100,000~ users would do when getting new assets even if it is furry porn land.
so yeah I don't want to post art on a dildo site and I don't want no hustla bitch-tier second life fuckin up on me when they must have competent staff
Otherwise you are one of the things wrong with the fandom that has happened in the last 5 years.
I'm repeating my post from earlier in case you missed it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vf9wHkkNGUU
This is us trying to fight off the bullshitery hence forth.
We, the user base, are like the cat.
We really aren't accomplishing much by whining and swatting at them for this.
Install Google chrome and use ad block, if you plan to stay 100%.
If not and are moving on, Please start posting activity to another major site or
tumblur or make a your own gallery website @ a place like: http://www.moonfruit.com/
RIGHT NOW!
We don't need Furaffinity to be furries!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlUiSBXQHCw
There's a crash course in case you forgot what it was about.
:D
Depression!
Repression?!
REVOLUTION!
Sure, art thievery is going to happen with or without FA being partnered with IMVU, that's just a fact of life, but it seems as though good intentions for FA/IMVU has mostly resulted in:
1) A much greater spike of art thievery
2) gained funding to FA
3) The occasional entertainment to those who click the links.
All in that order.
My point is, if it's discovered it's going to be more taxing to FA's artist, would you consider leaving this partnership with IMVU?
Dragoneer is only employed by IMVU now. The Corporate company that is IMVU now own all rights to FA
That's just poor business practice right there. And I feel like good ol' Neer might end up fired at some point...
He still has power over you as a user, he no longer has power over FurAffinity.
Okay, he does, but only because IMVU allows him to.
In history we used to call these "puppet states". Where more powerful countries install leaders in less powerful ones.
Congratulations, you've destroyed the greatest furry site on the planet by turning it over to a company that will never comprehend it for its total worth value. It will now always be controlled as one of many files in there system; one of many of there assets.
There will never be a 'head of FA' now. there will only be employees.
the fact that people will be back in a couple of weeks isn't speculative. this isn't the first time people have fled like rats from a sinking ship only to find the ship didn't sink at all and come back. won't be the last time either. it's really more annoying than anything when people start posting "this is the last straw! I'm leaving!" every time there is a change.
Each time the amount of people that moved becomes bigger, and there's only a limited amount of times you can fix a broken glass with duct tape till it ends up a mass of plastic and sticky residue and some pieces of glass that just can't contain any liquid. People shouldn't take it as "this has always been happening, therefor it's the status quo and all be fine each time it happens", there's always the chance that it'll be the time some actual changes do happen and enough people had left to not promptly return or have this site be their main in the least.
Really being banned isn't leaving. being banned is getting kicked out. you're not supposed to come back from that. that's like telling someone everyone is leaving cause they hate you when in reality most left cause they did something stupid and were exiled.
"The chat client and the website have been in BETA testing for nearly 10+ years and is still ongoing because they cannot afford decent servers, security and the proper equipment to fully release it. So, stable security, servers and even graphics are sadly limited."
wow... she's wrong. according to users of imvu. it was out of beta back in 2012.
https://secure.imvu.com/catalog/mod.....p&t=434455
Also it's making money hand offer fist according to thsi article:
http://techcrunch.com/2010/04/30/im.....8TechCrunch%29
and that's from 2010... 2 years before it came out of beta.
so there's some crossed wires there.
and even if you are right the users on that forum are not impressed in the slightest. They all think that its all a joke . Why sign up for a site when clearly no one has hope on it and starts to abandon it like hes ashamed of what ha- OOOOOO
what toolbar? I never got a prompt to install a toolbar and as a general rule never install any toolbars because they tend to mess things up. even the mcafee toolbar does that, so it's not confined to IMVU specifically, that's all companies. and it's all so they can target you with products you would actually buy. Advertising has been doing this for centuries. before the internet they had to rely on focus groups and surveys to get an idea fo what a general age group would like. thanks to computers they can now get information on what individuals would like and tailor ads so you are more likely to buy it. It's really smart on the advertiser's part,just not so smart on the security part. so doesn't matter what site you go to they all do that. this isn't anything new and not something limited to IMVU. if you want people to stop doing that you have to change how advertising works. until then boycotting/complaining about a single site will not change things. you'd have to boycott the entire internet to change that.
it just smells rotten from the very onset. I am no fool and I know that a company does not make a decision to buy in a 30 days it takes months and months of negotiating and making offers and writing up all this stuff with law firms before an agreement is made. the drive in oct that that made 20K I have suspicions based on corporate buy outs, that make me me have my doubts because as I stated companies do not buy a website like FA in a matter of 30 days or less These kinds of decisions take months of negotiations and planning. not only that, but the fact that after it was sold not a word was said for 2 full months that shady in of itself. With all these things combined, Something does not sit right with this whole buy out.
Because, if I understand the DMCA (Title II) correctly; If a site doesn't provide an adequate response to complaints of copyright infringement, copyright complaints can be made against the site itself... and that means trouble.
Also, if I understand IMVU correctly, they're apparently in a position where they can actually benefit financially from their alleged "lax enforcement" of copyright. This is a sure-fire recipe for the sort of corruption that gets people hauled into court and their businesses shut down.
This is the sort of thing that nearly killed YouTube, and forced them to adopt super-strict policies and create automated processes (using Google technology - Google's probably the only reason Youtube still exists!) for identifying and blocking copyrighted material almost instantly. (They're so strict, in fact, that I jokingly - emphasis on jokingly! - use the phrase "Internet Copyright Gestapo" to describe their procedures.)
In short, it sounds to me like IMVU may be overdue for a major, major copyright crackdown! (And we shall call it... #IMVUCopyrightCrackdown )
- - -
So what would I consider an "adequate response"? When someone needs to file a copyright complaint, I don't believe it should be necessary to create an IMVU account, and then, if there's a paywall in the way, shell out money. Perhaps, as a compromise, we could use a proxy, someone we can trust to claim some form of ownership over all the art posted on FA (because that's required), and then use that to file copyright complaints with IMVU on our behalf. And since Dragoneer is technically an employee of IMVU now, but is still, in every way that really matters, the owner of FA, being the guy in charge of it and its content; Perhaps he could function as a liaison between IMVU and all the FA users (if any!) who have had their content posted to IMVU without permission. (Yup, more duties for Neer! Or at least his lawyer.)
Of course, what we're all overlooking is the possibility that we might not need to resort to "playing the DMCA card" in the first place. The IMVU admins might be just as cooperative if we report copyright issues using less "formal" means - such as simply politely emailing them with links to the stolen content and their sources. Why would they cooperate? Because they know that if they don't, that's when we can start using DMCA procedures. Besides, for all we know, they might not be evil people! (As for their competence, however... I won't bother to speculate.)
- - -
While I'm suggesting things, how about a policy on FA for warning, and then blocking, folks who respond to these official news posts with blatantly rude or off-topic spam? Yes, I'm talking about the "dildos" nonsense... This sort of thing does not make FA, nor its userbase, look good at all!
This shit is completely over. Neer had abandoned us and you know it.
No, I don't know that.
I'll admit that maybe Neer's an idiot in some ways. But no, he won't abandon FA. He refuses to abandon FA. FA is his baby. That has not changed, and that will never change, no matter how much the userbase begs him to put someone more competent in charge! Not even IMVU can change that; if they ever try, I can practically guarantee that we're going to see Neer put up one heck of a fight!
Until I see actual evidence to the contrary, I'm going to continue to assume that we're not nearly as screwed as the screaming masses seem to think we are. (This is a philosophy I've had for decades, and it's served me well.)
"I'm sorry to disappoint you, but the world is not coming to an end!" -- Lisa Simpson
From a site where they do not care if there users gets a virus on their site , that is not likely,,
on the way you think of it . IMVU thinks : copyright takedowns= Lose money . They would not even dare touch anything because their is no proof to the art stolen or better yet stupid people will leave their site thus, losing money .
Also shelling into IMVU will just get them more money to buy out even more websites. and as said there are no reasons to Dragoneer to sign the contract AT ALL.
IMVU has a bad lack of quality PR, they give cookie cutter responses and their mods are serious ban hammer trigger fingers. they ban first and ask questions later. one lady I knew went through a lot of this herself and finally got her account back when she threatened to sue them. the account was intact but all of hir credits were wiped clean. she put in ticket after ticket and never got hir credits back. this is the corporate business that just bought FA. Do you honestly think they bought it strictly to advertise? Are these the kinds of people that we want representing FA or the furry community? not to mention a good portion of the IMVU community is anti fur. So this buy out makes even less sense.
Creating new accounts for the sole purpose of dodging a ban is always a bannable offense. This is true pretty much everywhere. It's practically the online version of breaking out of jail for the sole purpose of harassing the judge about the sentencing, which is the wrong thing to do.
As for whether the original bans were truly justified or not, it's not my place to judge. Banning folks for filing copyright complaints - especially if they're legit - does seem rather harsh and misguided.
I'll point out, though, that IMVU is not immune to the DMCA or any copyright law. If they refuse to respond to official DMCA takedown notices, they can (and should) be sued, simple as that.
If you're worried that this kind of crap is going to start happening on FA, I don't think that's likely. Neer's too protective of FA.
But yeah, I don't think the buyout makes much sense either. We would have to see the contract itself to know what exactly is going on here... (But we know that's not happening.)
"It's not even in BETA. It's in ALPHA. I figured I'd leave this here before I go to bed. 3:30AM and I can't
t brain anymore. The wine and whiskey ain't helping either. x.x"
Dragoneer why the fuck did you buy IMVU WHEN ITS HALTED PRODUCTION
Say goodbye to Pheanox folks...
FA WILL be monetized, considering how many people are here.
As said a million times this deal is not for adspace , but for money and control. They do not care for the future of the community but they only care about MONEY.
I understand companys need it to stay afloat but atleast they try and LISTEN to customers rather than abandoned them via there own message bo.....OOPS
Thats what I find ridiculous is theyre trying to tell us that its only bought for adspace, when we know better.
Danke for this.
In closing, IMVU sucks and them buying FA will only drown both sites.
Theres a chance dragoneer wont be in charge after a while.
*fwoosh as it goes over my head*
tbh this journal is layered with so many sincere comments, sarcastic comments, sarcastic "but actually sincere" comments and endlessly looping confusion I cant say I know much of who's saying or means what nowadays o.o
Thankfully, I didn't donate.
oh....silly dragz. How wrong is he.
I understand that it is expensive , but a furry group was going to give him FIFTY THOUSAND DOLLARS for 56 percent yet he denies it because he is not in charge. That could of ACTUALLY COVER A STATE OF THE ART SERVER , but he goes for a site that has bad ethics to play pretend as Canada El Presedente ( south park joke no offence to canada luv you guys <3)
https://youtu.be/4rPMIkN5fR4?t=40s
1) Remove all artwork they do not want to see at risk of art theft on IMVU
2) Get future commissions to be uploaded on weasyl/sofurry/etc... instead if the artist has a gallery there, or ask the art not to be uploaded at all, period.
It sucks for the artists but it could prevent more serious harm.
"
We understand and appreciate everyone is reacting to the news and there is a lot of information going around - facts as well as rumors. We are doing our best to monitor your feedback and concerns, respond to them and sometimes work with IMVU to get you the appropriate response."
If thats the case WHERE THE FUCK ARE THEY
and "sometimes "? ............
I think the important thing for IMVU and dragoneer both to understand is that the reception of the news was, like, i mean, literally so low, they won't ever be able to restore the trust in their users to even reap back a fraction of whatever they may have paid to buy FA in the first place.
Admins...WHERE ARE YOU GUYS
Well, I suppose if you want to discourage any sort of art theft, you could put those huge transparent signatures over your ALL of your art.
http://fc09.deviantart.net/fs70/i/2.....ez-d60nzeh.png
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0.....rande.jpg?1041
I can't wait to see what they do tomorrow.
That would be extremely odd...
And many people have already had comments removed and shit looked into over certain things said, so... i don't want to be on the receiving end of it.
a. The artist has can afford to sue
b. The artist is inclined to sue
c. That the artist can find a lawyer inclined to take up their case
d. That the artist is an American (if they are Canadian, or Russian, or whatever, chances are they will never get anywhere)
...How very reassuring...
What the fuck?
But we're all afraid that our friends won't migrate with us, so we stay. It's a shame.
And just be kind and approachable and friends come naturally.
I just don't have time to be active on all at the same time.
It's makes you truly consider and appreciate all of the many alternatives to this shithole.
And there are plenty. Most of them are more open and faster then FA anyway.
So buh bye.
And then my heart filled with joy.
One big worry I have is what happens when IMVU goes under? And I say when, not if given how little their product has improved since 2004. Hell, no wonder 'neer was interested. They seem to have as little interest improving their product that he has had in FA over the last 10 years.
But so what happens if IMVU folds as a company? You can kiss this place goodbye.
Or imagine a company creating browser games. Suddenly artwork wouldn't be uploaded anymore, you would have put it together in the browser out of predefined elements which are basic geometrical shapes in dull colors. Anything more advances would have to be purchased by microtransactions.
Luckily our fate doesn't seem that grim, but still, questions about the uncertainty about FAs future are justified and haven't been sufficiently answered as of now.
THE POOR CANT AFFORD A DMCA
THE PORN ARTIST WONT FIND A LAWYER WILLING TO TAKE HIS CASE
THE NON AMERICANS ARE DEFENSELESS
Someone is thinking of suing . an individual who says he still owns 50 percent
Do not be in so much denial and think and read from what we have written so far ( whether positive or negative ). no use arguing when you do not know know completely anything
Dragoneer is not your savior as he is human. He does not know what he signed nor knew the website in question ( besides the IMVU table at a furcon ...). Overall , he may know nothing just like us and made a huge mistake . it is all plastered onto his twitter
art thieving already happened before imvu merged with FA but now since it merged you guys fucking complain! really!
on that note imvu is not uploading your shit.. its the users who do it so dont blame imvu for art theft
you dont need to use imvu program to use the (FA) site and vise versa. imvu is not needed to be on FA since its just a little program
and also, if you never bothered or minded about imvu then why make it a big deal right now ? really since you heard FA is sold to imvu you guys do mind imvu and before, you never did, and complain the living shit out of it.
i dont think imvu is a dick about changing policies and i dont think they will go to subscription based accounts.
and give dragoneer a goddamn break. he tries to fucking work to get the site upgraded and all you guys do is whine complain and dick about imvu and dragoneer.
and when he gives answers you guys ignore it and ask the same fucking question again and again.
( oh and btw i,m no furry or artist. just a follower of certain artists)
Also " tries to fucking work " I am still waiting for Phoenix which is about over 5 years in development with no slated release. and if he wanted improvement he would of accepted the 50k from the fur group but it was denied .
to me also , you seem to be the one complaining. and from what I see in terms of your writing style , it seems that you are pretty pissed right now .
also art theft again you guys now complain about that even tough it might already happened years back... only now imvu shows up and you guys see your art stolen, and blame them for it rather then the users who stole it. and i know they can hide behind AP passes
also maybe he didnt say something in front because of laws/rules when selling to imvu.. and he could have silensed it without us guys knowing it and we would be none the wiser even tough it happened.
1st - He should have details because he signed the stupid contract . Better yet he should of atleast idk LOOK THROUGH the website in order to make the decision instead of a blind eye?
You do not like IMVU but you want people to ignore that ? a very hypocritical statement there my friend. and the admin seat was not sold . He would of gotten 46 percent of the seat which in all honestly with a board , He still has power. He just does not like that its under 50 percent so he denied it .
People need to worry cause they are now as they call " FAMBAM" meaning whatever they do reflects on us. Furaffinity. and in this case it is not showing great light on us at the moment.
and either most of them are based upon paid content that artists actually get paid for here. The users remove watermarks on the site and credits so the artists here can lose revenue and thus , would kill off the site.
and again , if you think its not the greatest site then why bitch and moan about my criticism . Also , please write min legibly because it is very hard to understand you .
i never said imvu was crap, i said it isn't the best/greatest. ( and i used it), and with ignoring it i mean you guys ignored it before why not now ? just dont download the program and register( but now you should because art theft?) you can also use the web page of the catalog to browse it without logging in if i,m not mistaken
also how could he have known art theft was on imvu? it could have happened years back. and maybe imvu didn't know either? because you cant see if a user is also the same user on any other site. and because clearly you guys never were interested in imvu in the first place, and never looked for art theft there.
and i,m not saying you shouldn't be angry or whatever you are about this, but dont overdo it like 1000+ comments long. and dont re ask the same question 100 times in a row..
and I am making 1000 + posts to make my point based on the fact that people do not even know the slightest about IMVU is let alone its existence. I understand there is a furry fandom on their but it is very MINOR in size.
If you are PR then you are very much failing at it. You bring nothing but complaining and trying to diverse instead of bringing in actual facts / criticism / reasons onto the post . Please give me reasons on why I should ignore IMVU
also the point still stands. if imvu wanted to screw you guys over(again i aint an PR here) they already would have done that. and maybe if you guys accept the answers dragoneer gives to the already asked questiosn then maybe it wouldnt be so bad
i said ignore as in not use it. you dont have to use imvu as it isnt needed to look up FA also if peopel didnt know abouit imvu then why this fucking mess of shit?
also why the fuck are people contradicting everything dragoneer says? yes maybe he did make wrong decisions some times. dont use it against him all the time
ALSO IMVU ISNT STEALING YOUR ART. ITS THE USERS WHO STEAL IT. STOP BLAMING IMVU FOR EVERYTHING GODDAMN
again since it doesnt get trough your scullsIMVU ISNT THE ART THIEF HERE ITS THE USER UPLOADING IT.
1) some folks never heard of IMVU before now. And after they did their research on the site, they came to realize just how bad the place could be; so are - quite understandably - upset.
2) If an artist is known for their adult content and they have reason to believe that their art may have been redistributed/sold on IMVU, they would be required to register for a paid IMVU account (the 'free to browse' catalog you see only lists the G rated images; you can only see the adult content if you pay for a VIP account, which isn't cheap). An artist should not have to pay a site in order to make sure that their copyrighted material isn't being resold without their consent.
Sue is screwing Steve. In fact, Sue has been screwing Steve every other Tuesday since 2013.
Bobby just found out about said screwing and is quite upset. So, Bobby confronts Sue.
Sue snaps, “I’ve been screwing him for years and /now/ you care?!”
See, call me crazy, but I think Sue’s response to Bobby doesn’t hold water.
You, however, seem to be saying that Bobby needs to accept Sue’s answer.
I fear one of us is not accurately perceiving reality. If it should be me, then I beg your pardon kindly.
(of a material or article) allowing light to pass through so that objects behind can be distinctly seen.
"transparent blue water"
synonyms: clear, crystal clear, see-through, translucent, pellucid, limpid, glassy, vitreous More
"transparent blue water"
see-through, sheer, filmy, gauzy, diaphanous, translucent
"fine transparent fabrics"
antonyms: opaque, cloudy, thick
easy to perceive or detect.
"the residents will see through any transparent attempt to buy their votes"
synonyms: obvious, evident, self-evident, undisguised, unconcealed, conspicuous, patent, clear, crystal clear, plain, (as) plain as the nose on your face, apparent, unmistakable, easily discerned, manifest, palpable, indisputable, unambiguous, unequivocal
"a transparent attempt to win favor"
antonyms: ambiguous, obscure
having thoughts, feelings, or motives that are easily perceived.
"you'd be no good at poker—you're too transparent"
I think they did that perfectly in some definitions X3
So im worried that, okay so IMVU site bought FA, and by good info´s and commets i managed to find between everything else, that info want i hoped to find...made me worried more.
So IMVU go ahead and steal artists work (where you writer or drawer) you cant do nothing against it.
Yes there has been mentioned several times the, do account , pay remort the stolen image. But results of that are , nothing happens, stolen art IMVU page created is banned ,yet sale continues. Worry of mine growing...
Fight back with laweyer? I dont have money to fight back with lawyer, im on pension, drawing is that little i can put together when i cant work and now im sold against my will to third party who could not care less about copyright rules, OR makes it riddicilous hard to fight back, especially to person who is not from usa. So more worry growing...
Thought i want to return bit back to this court part, not ALL artist who are already (what i readet above)ripped by IMVU, even draw porn, just tiny thought about how there has been nobady goes court for their porn comment/s, so not all is porn that is stolen.
I worry for myself and other artist too..Since there is backlog about information (art ,writings) that is now at hands off IMVU. Can single person deman ALL info about me from your files? When and if( saying this as some go some dont) time comes to leave?
I have other galleries and to make it easier, in case IF there comes art theft my artist name is pretty much same everywhere where.To show that this is my art, my work, my galleries, you took it from there. Often helps clear the cases..
So leaving FA, would it still leave the work you have done still at hands of IMVU?My other galleries would not help me at all defending , this is my art, even my FA account would be empty. I feel that if leave , empty my gallery, i would loose even THAT little of defence against this new form of FA.
Im not panicking, im trying to get some sort of hold grip, about this whole matter as so far its just confusing and scrollling down alot comments that arent helping at all :c
English is also NOT my first language,so i appoligy poor writing. But would be nice to have some sort CLEAR (what i fear wont come up :c ) list of answers that whats going on.
https://twitter.com/panderp/status/.....47385976500224
https://twitter.com/panderp/status/.....61211467833345
https://twitter.com/panderp/status/.....62065549783040
This site has had barely any improvement since forever and theres only one reason for it.
I mean, itd be great to keep it int he furry community, but, if not possible a normal hooman can run a site with respect.
I mean, that could mean some trouble.
A part of me says this is too good to be true, but I want this to go down either way.
I'm going to follow this as best I can.
If you want to take down your artwork you have file an DCMA, you have to do it yourself, over an imvu account. No exceptions.
If you want to take down adult themed content, you must break through the paywall and pay for a premium account to actually be able to file the DMCA.
Is this really a post from Dragoneer or are the IMVU monkeys already in charge here?
You know what? What about we instead help Arcturus with a fraction of that money needed to sue FA out of Dragoneers filthy paws?
I'd for sure support that.
that's why people protest, get into politics and rally against things. To avoid the change that besmirches, destroys or degrades their communities or societies.
Not everyone has to be like yourself and accept changes even if we don't agree with them and don't like them.
I actually hate people who have that stance on things when it comes to things that CAN be changed, and when it comes to points where voices have to be heard for the right things to happen.
It's not a case of Que Sera Sera in communities like this one. Sorry, but it's not.
But, i was trying to make a point.
All we can really do is voice our opinions and state our objections, so telling us that we shouldn't bother worrying about it and just allow it to occur and sit on it is offensive to everyone who cares more than you do.
No, they do not.
Does IMVU reserve any right either now or in the future to cease Fur Affinity's operation?
Probably. It is theirs after all, but there might be a clause in the contract. Dragoneer should really address that.
Does IMVU have the right to change the way FA operates in the manner of adding charges to use the sites functions?
They said they would not. However, this is very different from a "Could not". If they stick to the hands-off policy, no. If they decide to get more involved than yes, they would be able to do so quite easily.
Where is all the user donated money going to now that IMVU has partnered with/purchased FA?
It goes to IMVU.
No , correction it went to FA Hardware.
March 6th https://twitter.com/Dragoneer/statu.....93166405304320
March 17th https://twitter.com/Dragoneer/statu.....14660869054464
Forgot to hit reply here the first time, hence hidden comment thats not attached lol
2-Dragoneer is just an employee now and he can be fired for whatever reason Proof:
https://twitter.com/Dragoneer/statu.....11034202619905
3- they own 100 percent of the company now so they can really change whatever they want to change. as you can see the copyright has changed and the ads for IMVU are popping up
4- Dragoneer posted a tweet saying it is going into IMVUs accounting office so yes. ( I think he deleted the tweet tho but I know someone had a pic of it . Would really appreciate if you dug it up )
As for the other points, I do agree with you.
Oh, and thanks for linking to my twitter :P
It means they raided my gallery, came looking at all my stuff, and left thinking, "Man, FYIAD ain't got shit."
That's pretty harsh, you know?
Holy hell, they came back! They took it ALL!
Now there's nothing, nothing in my gallery!
But like Dragoneer said, I should feel good about it; they only steal my stuff because they really like me.
Dragoneer releasing all those cleaning shrimp onto IMVU
to clean up the stolen art. This is just what the situation looks like
to me, and I really say that IMVU could use a little cleaning anyways.
Also the thought of cute little tiny shrimp sounds adorable...
2. IMVU owns FA. They can turn it into a desolate wasteland and no one could stop them. The only one who would have ANY say is Dragoneer, because HE is the only one who ACTUALLY KNOWS what the terms of the sale are. No one else knows because he claims there is a Non-disclosure Agreement with his now employer IMVU, that forbids him talking about the terms of the contract. Without any terms of the contract known, anything anyone says beyond this would be conjecture.
3. Unknown because the contract terms are unknown. They SAY they aren't going to change anything, but we all know they have to make the site pay off.
4. Dragoneer stated that it was used for various things including preventing DDOS attacks. At first he stated that the funds were needed to prevent DDOS attacks, but others have said the timelines don't match. Since the money was donated, he really doesn't have to account for how he spends it. What he did with the money only speaks toward his character and integrity. Personally, if he said he just paid himself back for the funds he had been sinking into the site, I wouldn't mind unless he already knew he had the site sold.
I among others want some official answers. There seems to be a vacuum of credible response. I want some "absolute" answers. Statements like, "We don't PLAN on changing anything", doesn't mean they AREN'T going to change anything. To me, that is double talk lip service. These people seem to be worse than politicians when it comes to getting a firm answer. I don't know if Dragoneer just doesn't know the terms of the contract or if he just jumped in over his head, or if he just doesn't care. He stated that there were no Furries interested in the site, yet a group of furries have come forth and stated that they had made a quite sizeable offer to purchase the site that was flatly turned down without discussion. Another fur has come forward stating that he owns 50% of the site from a previous agreement. These issues have not been addressed either. If these are lies, Dragoneer need to address them. I am not calling Dragoneer out. I just want some straight answers concerning the things he CAN answer.
What I do know is that this atmosphere of lying, uncertainty, and hidden agendas is going to tear this site apart. I wish the powers that be would just suck it up and come clean.
Politicians are often caught doing the opposite of what they say. I'd rather not be told than being told an untruth.
It's the people that don't tell you a bloody thing that you've got to worry about. If they can't even be bothered to lie, much less tell you straight, then you know things are dire indeed. It can mean a great many things, not a one of them is bound to lead to anything joyous, happy, or good.
Then again, we could wind up in a world full of daisies and violets where all is well and the bronies roam free.
It won't, but it could. :P
Please no.
> It's the people that don't tell you a bloody thing that you've got to worry about.
If Dragoneer hadn't mentioned anything, would we have noticed or even cared? No.
> Replying to: FYIAD
I realize your name stands for "Fuck You, I'm a Dragon!"
But I keep seeing it as SA's FYAD forum.
Also, that's alright; it's a step up from "Fiya" or "Feeya" that people tend to read it as. :P No one even bothers with the D, they just derail.
Edit: Also, yes. I'd care. Truly, a week ago, I would have thought not, or at least not a great deal; but it turns out that I do. Not because it's trendy or I'm into the drama stuff or the perennial exodus over some panicked reason or another; it just hit a lot closer to home than I thought it would.
Would I care now? Maybe not. I lurk; I'm not adding anything here. Hell, before this thread I think I had one public comment. Given my relative scarcity, it is almost certain that I wouldn't have realized things until later. I would once it became obvious, though.
I'm wary of the prime fandom asset being sold to a non-fandom entity.
I'm irked that Dragoneer decided to sell without really saying anything about looking to sell. (If I missed something, correct me on that.)
I'm vexed that Dragoneer didn't sell it to the consortium of furries that would have left him still as the primary power holder, requiring an unanimous vote to override his will.
It's silly and it's sentimental and that probably makes me daft on the whole, but you know what? It's how I feel about it. Surprised the hell out of me, but it is what is.
Yes, you.
Take the internets.
Take them all.
Then go.
Go and spend them on bread and pickles.
And I bought all of the bread.
And ALL of the PICKLES...
Aw yeeeeaaaaah!
"guys, its not THAT bad"
Also I never venture onto the internet without an active ad blocker and script/cookie/LSO regulating plugins, so overly-aggressive marketing techniques can't touch me either.
I won't be joining the folks who are leaving. There are people I like talking to here, otherwise I'd probably have run out of reasons to stay here years ago.
Maybe if things do go down the drain, I'll pack up and head out to pastures new, but I'll probably just stick around and quietly observe for now...
Also... Dildoes!
ALL ABOARD THE WEASYL LIFERAFT.
NEXT STOP CREATIVE COVE.
Oh lordy, I really do hope that doesn't come back to bite anyone in the ass.
im going to put this here
http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/6597056/
It needs to be seen
IMVU owns FA?
Sucks to hear about the whole issue with IMVU having a pay in section of the store o.o I can only imagine what it contains... the best I can hope for is none of its mine, and if I wanna stretch it, hope that none belongs to my friends and fellow artists *shrug*
at any rate, I still have an genuine question/concern about the advertising, if anyone knows how to get a legit answer sooner than later, let me know <3
Also,
http://i.imgur.com/YNASHQ0.jpg
Now, the trick is to make it so every second letter of a word is a letter in your real message.
Your answer will come in a reply that has absolutely nothing to do with what you originally wrote about, but every third letter will form a message that is their reply.
See, Liberty is at hand! Unless you have trouble hiding messages like that and don't normally write absurdly long posts, in which case you're really rather boned.
DMCA .com is the global leader in DMCA Copyright Infringement Takedowns. We get stolen content removed. It's 100% Guaranteed - or you get your money back.
DMCA .com can help with stolen blog content, videos, pictures, websites, games and more. Any country, any content, anywhere. This is what our team of professionals do everyday.
Professional takedowns starting at $199 and "Do It Yourself" takedowns starting at $10 / month
Copy and pasted from their site. So enjoy having to fucking pay to get your artwork removed. http://www.dmca.com/Takedowns.aspx
/Slow clapping from the side lines
DMCA costs nothing to send but may require a decent bit of work.
http://www.ipwatchdog.com/2009/07/0.....etter/id=4501/
https://nppa.org/page/5617
The bonus to that site you listed is it guarantees you or your money back etc.
Dildos
And In SL you do not need to get a premium account to find anything that might be stolen. Which is in part the reason for many peoples ire. But it goes deeper then that.
Tho I am getting tired off those that basically say, OH WELL THEFT HAPPENS. That's not productive even tho it's true.
Shit happens. You can decide to either throw a fit over it, or just move on to something more worth your time.
It's basically saying that we don't screen anything that comes in, take a cut of it. If you have problems with this, you file the report, (which if your stuff is adult you *can't* do without getting a premium account) Then hope for the best.
I'm not sure if you are a major content creator or not, but I'd probably be very upset myself if a sight I can't even see half of the stuff that is going up unless I pay them was making money off my hard work and I have no real means of actually solving the problem. More so now that said community and sight own the entire kettle of fish so there's a good chance this sort of thing will be made easier. And yet still no safeguards are up to protect said honest content creators.
Just because it dose not matter to you and you are willing to turn a blind eye does not make the situation any less important to a lot of people.
1) Nothing is changing yet, so there's no reason to panic.
2) That said, you should already have a plan B anyway. Nothing lasts forever, you know.
Tell me this all you wait and see people.
How can you fix a ship that sank? Would it not be better to fix it while it can still be fixed?
THE POOR CAN NOT AFFORD A LAWYER TO DO THAT
THE PORN ARTIST WILL NOT WANT TO HAVE THEIR PERSONAL DATA REVEALED
THE NON-AMERICAN ARTIST IS DEFENSELESS
It's not just this it's the fact you have to pay to join imvu to report adult content that was stollen, sure they allow you to report on pg without paying, but you still have to join in order to get their attention at all. So say an artist did porn for a living it pays well it's the most wanted domain, but there art is stollen and posted on imvu, oh I have to pay sub in order to access the adult content so in order to report, why should artist have to pay for there work to me taken down, imvu should be paying that said artist for rights, not the artist paying them just so they have piece of mind there work is finally taken down because they had to pay to do so... That's Damn well unfair... They in the end get more profit because the artist paid to join, imvu will feel more up to allowing art to be taken, because it will bring the artist in by droves to remove, there's their catch that dragoneer doesn't see yet we do. We get you by you having to join in ordr to report your art, they more of you join to report the more we in turn get, the more we will allow it...
This all means imvu gets founding they wanted, they themselves make fake accounts and steel art to sell for themselves, and they can without true facts they made that account they get away with art thift. Artist have to join to report and it keeps going til they have what they wanted. There's that catch your not seeing dragoneer, there it is in all it's wonder.
This will most likely be hidden, taken down ignored or I get baned, but I make a good point they get the profit they were seeking, one artist joins to report, than another, than another and it than in turn becomes an endless cycle, they get all the monies in all that, and they see a larger profit on this, and keep going with it. Sure we will remove it once you give proof, but we totally can not say it wil be uploaded again by us on a secert account were we make the money....
And no, I don't know what that means, I just figured I'd be mildly snarky...
I would feel much more comfortable hearing directly from Dragoneer in his own words not IMVU's.
THE POOR CAN NOT AFFORD A LAWYER TO DO THAT
THE PORN ARTIST WILL NOT WANT TO HAVE THEIR PERSONAL DATA REVEALED
THE NON-AMERICAN ARTIST IS DEFENSELESS
'The non-American artist is defenseless.'
So any art that isn't made by an American user is completely defenseless? So it'll be inferior compared to Americans?
Dude, all art is equally defenseless because they don't have anything to defend themselves with.
The DMCA thing, yeah, that's true.
The poor can't afford a lawyer? Perhaps, but there are a few willing to make a risk.
'The porn artist will not want to have their personal data revealed.'
Who doesn't want their personal data revealed? They's run the risk of getting hacked.
But 'The non-American artist is defenseless'? Really, you're bashing on me for talking about dildos yes here you are in the middle of a furry art site saying racist comments.
And that is why I dislike 70% of Americans. 70% because I have some decent American friends.
Grow up brat.
You're still singling out one country as a superior one and leaving all others in the dust. You aren't treating other countries equally, and thus is classed as racism.
Who's being the mentally deficient one now?
Im just stating a fact that one can check in any website, if you are too autistic to notice it then it's your problem.
Are you, like, 12?
Ok, go try to fill out a DMCA if you're not trolling.
The Fur Affinity will be mine to control!
f o o l s
"THE UNIVERSE IS MINE OT COMMAND! TO CONTROL!"
Audio RecordingThree days after the announcement that Fur Affinity, the largest and most important center of commerce and community for the Furry Fandom, was sold to a non Furry
company without our consent or consult, I am very proud to see outrage and recognition of betrayal. To have undermined the artists and creators of the Furry Fandom
without a mere mention before the sale, and to have doddled around without telling anyone until two months after, is such an agregious and downright vile offence to
our respect, intelligence, and especially our livelyhood that as each day goes by instead of this decision getting clearer and clearer it gets more and more baffling
the more we attempt to comprehend it.
The Furries of the Furry Fandom are right in their rage, their anger, their feelings of being trampled. We see through the smiling platitudes being fed to us by who
knows anymore really. The expectation that we take these reassurances on pure faith leaves us more ditrustful given the history of our faith in the announcements of
this site, and these reassurances fall in direct conflict with the past actions of the company that now claims to own the medium of our livelyhood; the gathering of
our most independant Fandom. And though I am proud, very proud, to see just how easily we are seeing and even peircing these flat assurances that nothing will happen,
everything is normal, it doesn't affect you, don't look at the pink elephant in the corner... It seems to go amiss as to whats really at stake here; as to what larger
"big picture" impact this sell-out has introduced to the Furry narrative.
This Fandom has been asked a question. This is a question we would inevitably be asked, and a question which will ripple through all corners of the Furry world across
SoFurry, Weazyl, Anthrocon, Further Confusion, your local furmeet, and right down to you, your future, and your concious.
The sale of Fur Affinity to a non-Furry company had prompted the whole of the Fandom to answer this:
"Will this Fandom, the one truely independant and free flowing Fandom, declare and at all costs maintain 100% control over its soveirenty and keep this Fandom of
Furries by Furries for Furries one in which every Furry has the opportunity to be a meaningful actor within their Fandom. Will we commit to keeping the gap between
producer and fan non-existant and maintain a Fandom which includes difference, normalizes the fringe, and embraces the outrageous. Will we keep a Fandom which harbors
the downtrodden outcast of the satus quo? Will we assert that we as a Fandom are the only ones who have the right to set the course of our Fandom and determine the
culture of our people? Or will we trade that in; accept the meddling of outside companies who want to capitalize on our accomplishments and in the process destroy our
independence, govern our Fandom for us, and create an impossible gap between the fans and our 'parent companies'. Would we do this in exchange for glitzier web sites,
cheap mass produced standardized apparel and even suits, and an Anthrocon three times the size, but brought to you by _______ who will take the income from admission
and there will be no charity. At least, that is, for the short time they can engineer a fad till it crumbles and we become an unprofitable inconvenience and we are
trashed and left to pick up the shambles and start from square 1.
We as a Fandom must have an answer to this question, because what happens here on FA in the coming months sets a precident for the next decade of the Furry Fandom.
IMVU being a small company, if we let them succeed in their goal of turning the Furry Fandom into a money making machine for them then there will be bigger, stronger,
more formidable companies that come knocking, and for them we must have an answer too. This is the next phase of the Furry Fandom in which we must defend what we have
built, and further build an infastructure, an organization that will effectively let us as a Fandom deliver our answer in the loudest was possible.
We have built a powerhouse of an economy soley on art. We normalized homosexuality 30 years before its time. We created a Fandom where anyone can contribute and their
status in the community is based on the merit of their contribution. We are not beholdent to a parent company executive behind a desk deciding what gets shipped, made,
and who sees it. We do not rely on the creation of a team of people or one man to exist, and once it stops being produced, we dissapear. We are a fandom of a IDEA, and
idea of acceptance, equality, and self discovery held within the representation of ourselves in an anthropomorphic world. Whats at stake...is the loss of all that, of
our identity, and the Fandom as WE have built it.
I'll keep this circulating and please, you can too! <3
Not underpants.
I, myself, am withholding judgement because this can really go either way. Either this really improves FA and makes it fantastic and revitalizes it, or it kills FA.
B. Anyone can do SOMETHING. Be it taking pictures, writing something, making music or to sing. No one is so bad that they can't do at least one of this things to some extent.
C. What I am trying to say is that credibility of the person is extremely important to this kind of thing and should not be ignored just because his words sound sweet. You would not follow a incompetent person to war, why would you do it on this without making sure
What about switching to Weasyl and Sofurry then?.. those are by furs for furs, if my knowledge is correct.
Anyways, the exodus from FA is rather unlikely, must i say. Because, most popular artists, i.e. rukis, sidian, kuma, sabertoothermine, etc. won't leave.
Switching helps...but what helps even better is deleting your content and your faves and turning your account into an echo of protest.
IMVU don't bought FA for charity, but make money, you're right. I'm hope to be wrong about the futur of FA, but we know what happen with company like IMVU.
I think it's time for me to see the weasyl ^w^
Now, ‘Neer turned down a $50,000 offer by saying it wasn’t nearly enough, right? (Even if he backtracks, he /did/ turn down this offer.) But let us suppose that IMVU matched that 50k figure, just for simplicity’s sake.
FA, if my understanding is correct, never sold anywhere near enough adspace to account for half the cost of keeping the lights on, much less expanding. That is why we had donation drives and all that jazz, right?
Yet by buying FA, putting $20,000 into new infrastructure, taking on the $10,000 tax debt, and the ongoing liability of a business entity that will go through a barrel of red ink with its accounting before it gets to take the cap off it’s black Bic, and ad space is going to fix this?
So, even if we say that the donation drive’s funds were unspent and thus acquired by IMVU in purchase, that’s just negates the new infrastructure. I’m still looking at a $60,000 investment, and that is before the liability of upkeep, paying Dragoneer is salary, and whatever else is might be involved. Even on the low end, it’d have to be at least $100,000 for 2015 and $65,000 next year, right?
I just cannot fathom any unobtrusive, furry-oriented ads accounting for that kind of revenue. Perhaps I am vastly underestimating the value of ad revenue here, but I just don’t believe this’ll net a profit. There isn’t a viable way of putting up a paywall that won’t at least decimate the active user base.
Maybe they intend to act as some sort of Paypal for furry commissions and force people into using IMVU credits? Unless there is a profoundly good reason to opt into that market, I don’t see adoption rates being enough to make that work out. Even if they offered insurance on the end result of trusted artists and took a mere 10%, I wouldn’t touch it. Would you?
I am profoundly wary of business deals where it seems so utterly imbalanced. I am missing something vital; it is something vital, it is something big, and I’m just not seeing it.
There is also the curious fact that IMVU can’t be seen to be peddling unrestricted access to adult material. That’d jeopardize their relationship with retailers that actually sell IMVU credits. There is a reason you can’t hit up Walmart for a Bad Dragon Gift Card; you won’t find them in drug stores, Costcos, or any other family friendly business establishment, whereas I’m told you can find IMVU ecards at exactly such places. Now, I suppose the thinking is that if they run FA as a wholly separate subsidiary, maybe that’ll bypass this concern? Yet I feel as though bad publicity would steal yield a great deal of pressure on IMVU to either dump or gut FA.
All my joking elsewhere aside, if I’m missing something obvious or if you think I’m wrong, please tell me. I keep staring at this deal and it doesn’t add up for me. It is that particular part, the fact that I’m being shown accounting that I can’t make work, that disturbs me. Why take on the liability, pay so much for a limited market, and risk a potential hellish media nightmare? (Seriously, think of it: mothers in front of cameras with the most graphic thing you can imagine lurking in a gallery here, on a monitor to the side, scrambled just enough so that you can’t /quite/ tell what that dragon is doing to that poor fox, but you /know/ it isn’t right for children to be gawking at it. All the outrage, real and faux, at marketing such a thing to children, pushed by a trust IM client! Once the story got rolling, it’s too sensational for the media to pass up, right? You’ve furries, porn, the internet, money, a potentially shady deal, and children; it’s practically an HBO miniseries waiting to happen!)
To me, it doesn’t add up. I know that I am missing far more details than I’ve got, but I can’t yet imagine how things equal out given the parts that I do know. Maybe I’m blind; maybe I’m just not seeing the forest for the trees, but I’d very much like to know whatever it is I’m not seeing.
Figured since I am done biting my tongue, I’d slip over to the conversation in the FA Forums. However, Registration appears to be broken; confirmation emails are not being sent out, and one cannot contact the administrator given that the contact admin service has been locked out.
Either this is a happenstance botchery or they’re already making moves to subtly lock out dissent – or, well, technically, it’d be an attempt to chill conversation for all, but given the discussion is predominantly negative..
Give me a pair of ruby slippers, ‘cause I’d much like to go home now; back to a place where things not working was more a matter of ineptitude or glitch than something I expect to be shady in the furtherance of censorship.
To the other points, though, no one would touch IB given that their philosophy on censorship has created a bit of a backfire on them. Personally, I think it’s silly to ban any manner of fiction, even I don’t like – so long as its tagged, no one likes stumbling into things they cannot unsee. Why not Weasyl is interesting, I’m assuming it is because the community wasn’t sufficiently large, though it may seem like easier pickings. Perhaps FA was targeted, at least in part, to the owner, as talks seem to have coincided with Dragoneer leaving his job at Amazon? (From what I hear from other Amazon people, I don’t fault him for it; but I don’t mean to digress. Again.) SoFurry, I reckon, is because it is perceived as a written work site. It isn’t exclusive, but since it evolved from YiffStar, which was primarily known for written content, they never quite shook that bias. If I were going to make a gamble, I’d go with FA. Bigger crowd, more engaged, more active users; it’s a captive audience; an owner running into somewhat dire financial straits with an asset that is costing him money; and it is not more adult oriented than the alternatives.
No, whatever they’re planning, only FA would be viable. It’s the hub, it's the heart. A parasite does better to get its hooks in core; if it was something more peripheral, it’d be much easier to trade its loss for freedom. The odds of success are higher since people (like me) are very hesitant to burn this bridge. I could much more easily leave Weasyl, SoFurry, or InkBunny; FA is home, it's the heart, you know? I just don’t grasp how they think they’re going to break even here, much less turn a profit in the next 5 years.
My hope is that we can buy it back at some point; I’m keen to be involved in any such consortium, if they’d have me. Also, hopefully I can get a voice in the forums so I can at least join in the greater conversation.
Until then, all I can do is spectate and think happy thoughts. Even that is getting increasingly more difficult, though.
Though it'd be handy if I could get people to realize the forums are broken, if it is an accident/oversight/glitch; and put pressure on its reactivation if it is intentional.
It would work like this. They receive a takedown request that uses an FA profile as the source. They then :
... 1: check the gallery: Yup. Pirated Art is in there.
... 2: Send a Note: Was this takedown initiated by you? Get note back: Yup
... 3: Take down content
Super-simple.
IMVU can quite easily be held liable for damages if they don't handle takedowns properly. If IMVU takes down non-infringing content, they can be sued for lost sales, etc. even if they did so in good faith. If they delay taking down infringing content because the reporter doesn't provide enough information or something goes wrong, they can be sued for copyright infringement alongside the actual infringer. The DMCA releases them from any and all liability as long as they process the notifications appropriately.
Handling takedowns manually can be much more time-intensive. A DMCA only requires that they check that the request is formatted properly, then remove the content. They don't have to do any verification or waste time identifying infringement themselves.
DMCA notifications are very easy to file, cost no money, and don't require an account. They work quite well.
You have a very narrow view of the term "customer". Money is only one medium of exchange. Customers in the FA context provide the community that make advertising valuable. Without the community, ad space has no value, ergo: the userbase are the customers. Try running an FA clone with advertisers and no users, and let me know how long they stick around, k?
DMCA notifications do not require that your copyrighted work be registered. If you proceed with a lawsuit, depending on the state you are in (I believe), you may or may not have to postpone the suit until the work is registered.
And no: DMCA actually have to be registered Federally if you seek damages. That is: if IMVU says its not copyright infringement, you really do have to file. Also: as we've seen on FA, systems get hacked. Data gets leaked. Do you really want you personal info out in the world linking your real identity to furry porn?
This is kinda ridiculous. They own the whole pipeline end-to-end. With a tiny bit of infrastructure its actually EASIER for them to take complaints via FA or using FA usernames. Its a no-brainer. Except for one thing: they don't actually want to remove our content from their digital store. Since they take a cut of the sale, the more high-quality content in the store the better for them, even if it is pirated artwork. The DMCA thing is a ploy to make it harder to remove content, and to make it uncomfortable because then you have to divulge your real identity on record.
As I have said time and time again, IMVU takes on liability if it does takedowns outside the DMCA. If they start processing takedowns through FA, what if someone creates a fake account, uploads art, and sends out false DMCA takedowns? IMVU would be at fault because it would be basically impossible to identify the source of that account. You can't honestly expect their IP team to do forensic analysis on every claim they get to make sure it's the right FA account and that the account actually created the work. If they take notifications without real names, they need to be shit sure that the claims are legitimate, which is something they can't do.
DMCA notifications do not require that the copyrighted work be registered. I've filed tons without registering any of my work and they all magically manage to go through. If you proceed with a lawsuit, you will have to register it, but if the claim isn't contested, you don't need to.
Actually I am in the process of forming an LLC... but I really don't think you understand what you're talking about, cuz your real identity is registered there too. Also LLC has less protection than owning an IP personally because slavery is illegal and so a court can't take ownership of you and give it to someone else. This is something people often forget.
DMCA does not take on liability if they comply. So they could receive your request, refuse to comply, force you to file it federally, and then comply when the government tells them to take it down or they'll be sued. In the meantime, they still pocket all the money from the store.
You've missed the whole point of my post. If they accepted complaints via FA, or allowed FA usernames as a contact, there would be no DMCA takedown, so nobody is sending them out. You don't seem to understand how the legal process works. DMCA takedown orders are just that: an order to take down content. There is no fee or liability associated with it. Its like a cease and desist, only specific to copyright, and with government force behind it. To comply, the site simply has to remove the content in a given timeframe.
Forensic analysis? Don't be melodramatic. The process can be almost entirely automated. That's why its so beneficial that they own the entire pipeline. Also I think you've overblown how many of these infractions they receive. But all of that is irrelevant because other sites with MUCH MORE traffic actually do personally investigate claims of impersonation and IP theft. If you make a claim on Twitter for example, a real person reviews your case. While Twitter is a bigger company, it also has half a billion users.
It doesn't take a "forensic expert" to go "Image A, Image B. Match? Yup".
You're quite the IMVU fanboy apologist. Do you work for them or something? XP
They don't, you're just not being smart by not registering a limited company to represent your interests.
But please, by all means, keep tiptoeing around the issues like so many Lego pieces on the floor. I'll be watching, with baited breath.
Linden Lab has received your notification of copyright infringement under the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (“DMCA”), 17 U.S.C. § 512.
After having reviewed your notification:
In compliance with the DMCA, the following work(s) have been expeditiously removed or disabled:
Description of work(s):
*****
Location of Work(s):
*****
Sincerely,
The IP Team at Linden Lab
[c:8795]
Easy.
However, I am still standing by what I said about the fact they won't take action until you bring the law on them being a total dick move.
Borderlands 2 GOTY is only £6.99 on Steam this weekend
If things get heated up they make a new journal, because nobody goes back to old ones.
Then people need to start the discussion from the start, and there will always be people that will say that's not relevant to this specific journal, and stuff, stuff...
That's FA's 'transparency' being applied.
but sincerely even if we report them it still is the same shit as before. it will just delay until the next time.
selling to imvu to allow fa to grow okay i get the point.
but i feel like the world i grew fond of is in the hands of a 10 year old brat now since what they can do on that world with our work.
doesn't feel fair...more...a waste
As long as our intellectual property remains ours, and that there's consequences for art/music/story theft. As long as that is still enforced, I think things will be okay. :)
but would it not make more sense in this regards to give people an opt in system or opt out system that can be done in their profile?
that way people can just automatically prevent their stuff from being used or vice versa they can tell them that they are willing for it to happen.
thats my thoughts on it anyway
Thieves don't ask permission.
They are just stealing art or copying it and selling it somewhere else.
The only way for an artists not to have their stuff stolen is to hide it.
And well, artists need exposure.
then the art will be as safe as it has always been, and more than likely just end up on E621 within an hour of it being submitted here or anywhere else
Would there maybe be a website being created for us furries that looks more appealing than weasyl/inkbunny/etc. which has nice gallery options for displaying art, and not as if a kid designed it? XD
"IT UFFENDS ME SO UR WRONG!"
By the way, paranoia doesn't help problems, just let IMVU know that we don't want them fucking things up.
Are you sure you want to trust it? Show me a single case where DMCA was used by a person against a big corporation and it helped them win a court case. I'm waiting.
Also in the case of IMVU you aren't going against a corporation you're going against the individual who posted the art through them. The fact they want you to provide the legal proof instead of taking your word on it just means they want to cover their bases in case you're lying.
Also, let's consider this case. This only favor people that have legal ownership of their artwork and registered trademarks over your content. If you don't and try to dispute, the company in question could register the art in question as their own and sue you.
As I said before. Examples.
and while we are on evidence. Give me a list of court cases where the individual should have won instead of the corporation.
Also, you seem to forget that FA is not comprised only of users of the United States and/or countries that are covered by DMCA law. Some people also have no maoney to pay in order to get their content registered and everything. Other people may just see this as a hobby and would not like the idea of their content being used without their permission. It's not a simple matter of "stop whining and register your content as yours already."
Also, you seem to forget that I didn't mention cases where the person should have won, but cases where the person was sued by a corporation and determined she was guilty before she wasn't even aware or warned of such. It's not a sittuation where the person was acting on the wrong to begin with.
For those not in the US then it falls under whatever international version of the DCMA they have. but you weren't talking about international laws only dcma so I only pointed out the dcma cause really it's a given that if you're not in America it would be govern by whatever acronym of the copyrights law your country has.
That doesn't make any since. cause in those cases the person who was right was the coporation. so the DMCA did it's job liek it was supposed to and would work just as easily for you as it did for the coporation. the only time the DMCA wouldn't work was if the individual had the legal ownership but lost.
thoug I did find about 6 examples of waht you did ask for. I googled "copyright case where individual won vs corporation" and found these in the top two links:
https://www.eff.org/wp/riaa-v-peopl.....-years-later#5
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McDona.....;s_legal_cases
the second lsits all the court cases. the one's where the individual won are : MCChina, MacDonald's (UK - Cayman Islands), McCurry , South African trademark law... that one is interesting as McDonalds lost their copyright because they missed a paperwork deadline. so anyone can use the mcdonalds name in south africa now. (which would be a good example of copyright law screwing over the original holder)
The DMCA is our go-to copyright law for the internet, yes, so corporations will use it to sue individuals. Your point? It is a multi-faceted law. Without it, us content creators would be practically helpless in protecting our own copyrights.
Knives are a very popular weapon in murder cases, does that mean all knives are bad?
I'd like to see some actual news articles about that, please. I couldn't find anything relevant.
We both know that DMCA take down notices have nothing to do with MPAA and RIAA lawsuits as he's implying.
I am only aware of it being used to subpoena ISPs in RIAA and MPAA cases, RIAA and MPAA used to subpoena ISPs before the DMCA too for people's identities (which required the step of getting a judge to approve it which had long wait times). I'm not aware of the DMCA granting 'additional rights' to sue people over in copyright law. I am aware of the DMCA making it possible to take someone to court over producing technology to circumvent digital rights management, but this is completely different to copyright infringement cases that RIAA and MPAA do.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O5zGkqAWsWE
It's been an honor.
Until it does why should they care. That is alas a very common thinking process in the world.
"It's not my problem or changes how I do things, so who cares."
We had a discussion before. You asked for proof, I gave links to holes in all this and things that do not add up. I don't know what you said, as I said I was done with you, but apparently you don't truly wish to see things that you don't with to believe are happening, that or you are one of the many 'yes' persons that have helped this sight get to this point.
I don't believe people care about what is going on, or rather not enough do. And only now as the smokescreen continues to go up and damage control has been put into full swing that propel are starting to open there eyes.
If nothing was wrong, as you like to seem to put it, why have we gotten three, *3* in as many days updates over this and content loss ect? No, don't answer that, just muse over it. I don't care much what you say cause you do not want to listen.
You apparently, honestly, don't care or you would actually see the forest for the trees rather then blindly trying to defend things in a typical nature of people that "it dose not mater to me/effect me so let's just coast and see where it goes". It's that sort of thinking that has allowed the admin structure of the sight to basically do how they have for over a decade. Even Neer has gone on record in acknowledging this fact, assured that in a few days/weeks the populous won't care anymore. And that is the underlining problem. You have been so browbeating, you being the populous at large, they just do not care, or rather not enough of it does.
There is real concern through this journal, few true answer and far more fluff. But you continue chose not to even acknowledge it. I'm honestly more surprised you don't believe they 'don't' care about you. Wake up.
I'm done with you again, talking to you is a waist of time.
and you know what your belief doesn't matter. it's the facts that matter. what you belief is wrong and I was trying to point that out. but you proved that you would rather believe in lies than accept common sense. instead you revert to trolling insults that don't further the discussion. they do prove you had no intent to discuss the matter in the first place. you just wanted to complain and anyone who doesn't believe 100% in your complaints just doesn't care. That's not true, but nothing anyone says will ever convince you of that. so as long as you want to stick to the belief that no one cares. no one will care. So until you loose the additude are are will to work with others nicely you will never have a decent discussion.
editing to add the fact I just realized you were the "I'm done with you person." I had completely forgotten about that. nice to know you haven't changed.
The last thing needed is even more sites, this isn't the pirate bay, we dont need a hydra for fursites
Having to swim threw the sea of dildos makes it a bit hard to follow everything that's going on :/
Its actually gone further than this a bit, we have a staff and payed for net space. Things are getting done!
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CApKOlMVIAA-IFn.jpg
http://postimg.org/image/4lzctts9t/
http://postimg.org/image/4lzctts9t/
http://postimg.org/image/4lzctts9t/
http://postimg.org/image/4lzctts9t/
I'm losing friends as it is...
Please... PLEASE!!! IMVU and FA... Resolve this already and get yourselves together already! I don't wanna lose anymore friends in this site! Just... please...
And well yeah he has every right to think that cause that's how it's been for a decade. People just roll over and accept it.
These are the changes we are making. Positive changes. Changes that *benefit* the community. That's all this about.
I respect your right to disagree with the sale, but must ask you do so civilly.
User-generated or not, it's clear protecting artists is not a priority to IMVU because it requires a DMCA from the original owner in order for it to be removed. In the meantime, whoever has it up is making profit off of it.
Second Life doesn't even do that, report something as stolen and if proof is provided, it's removed. No questions asked. Why is that so difficult?
I don't know, I'm just loss and torn. I'm definitely leaving art-wise here. =/
I'm just never uploading commissions/requests/gifts I get here, or art i make of my own. I will even request people don't that stuff onto FA.
So, yes, we removed your art, and we removed it because it violated the site's rules. Your post was not removed for your criticism but for art theft.
You can disagree with the sale of the site, and you know what? That's your right. But disagreeing does not give you the right to disrespect other artists, especially in a post where we discuss the very FACT that art theft is not something we accept, and in fact tell people to the steps to rectify.
Unless it's just "referenced" so closely that it is, with the exception of a limb or tail, a near-perfect trace, right? Because that apparently doesn't qualify as "modifying it" and "using it [art] without permission."
Ticket ID# 41801
According to someone who shall not be named, modifying an artist's work to where it's "not a direct trace" isn't against the rules.
Bear in mind that when I (privately) talked about this with the affected artist, they clearly saw that they'd been "heavily referenced" with no credit given or permission sought, and were upset... but said that they didn't know what to do because they didn't think anything would be done about the situation. Turns out, they were right. Nothing was done, except to verify that artwork can, in fact, be modified without an artist's permission and even sold for a profit on FA.
As long as it's not a staff member's art, at least.
Whoops
I use references for a lot of my work (obviously, since I do commissioned work and they're kind of necessary.) My work does not look indistinguishable from said references, or even bear a particularly strong resemblance to the referenced material since it's not a direct copy. And when I use stock photos for pose reference, I give credit to the photographer even when it's not necessary (as some photographers, like Senshi-stock and Marcus Ranum, don't explicitly require credit to be given.)
This was a case of outright tracing with some minor modifications made. No permission was sought from the artist (obviously, or they would have said something when I asked them about it,) and no notice or credit was given. That is not "using reference." That is theft.
"Do remember that the original content must be yours before you can initiate a DMCA takedown request - you may not file it on someone else's behalf."
What if the original content we find stolen belongs to someone that is DECEASED?
"That's not a reliable method when you think about it. It seems like a vast majority of people here are closet furries (being that their families wouldn't know about their fandom involvement), and I'm sure if something were brought up to a family member, that person wouldn't care about weird furry porn being stolen because it would likely be quite disturbing to them to think 'OMG my brother/sister/son/daughter/niece/nephew was involved in this?!' I'm not saying it couldn't happen, but given the norm around here I don't see that happening even on a good day."
Why cant it be that we see stolen artwork, provide references to the originals, and then things get taken down from there? That just seems so much easier for everyone in my opinion. I'm not trying to argue, it just seems like everything has to be done in such a roundabout way.
Unless there is a very clear statement in legalese from the deceased artist, there is simply no way to verify whether it is infringement or not without contacting their authorized agent (in this case, whoever is in charge of their estate or next of kin would automatically become their agent).
If the authorized agent doesn't want to protect that copyrighted work anymore, then tough - that's just how the copyright system works. Whoever owns it gets to decide whether to protect it.
Explain this!
http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/...../#cid:44965143
A portion of this journal copied:
"After I found my engagement picture for sale on IMVU ( http://goo.gl/71fZ1O ) I decided I don't want anything to do with this site anymore.
Part of me is sure that the user has stolen this, not IMVU, however the fact remains that IMVU does not make it easy for us to have it removed. IMVU requires the original artist (Falvie) to submit a DCMA request along with documentation ( screen cap of part of their DCMA portion of the TOS shown here: http://i59.tinypic.com/1szbsh.jpg ).
Artwork is always reposted. I understand that. I always find commissioned pieces on tumblr, e621, and other sharing sites.
This is not a simple repost. This is a matter of someone STEALING and PROFITING from artwork that not only was paid for by us, but is incredibly personal in nature. In order to purchase this item, someone would have to purchase credits from IMVU first, so even though IMVU is not the one selling, they still profit in the long term.
I am mortified, livid, and sick to my stomach over this. I want nothing to do with a site that is affiliated or owned by a website who allows this to occur. (Yes, they have a DCMA clause, but how many artists have enough time to filter through thousands, perhaps millions of items to file DCMA takedown requests on? I can't think of a single one.)"
Anything to say on this?
Regreating your move now? And yes, I will be leaving soon too as well as my mate who has just taken everything down and is deleting her account.
Good Job.
Not really.
http://postimg.org/image/4lzctts9t/
Though....I'll say. People do this shit on Second Life too. But I think it's a lot more strictly enforced. If something on the Marketplace in SL or is uploaded, is reported for theft, it usually gets taken down if proof is provided, whether it's reported by the owner or not. No DMCA required.
TERRIBLY sorry, but that'll be 50 US dollars a month, plus tax.
What's that? You don't have credits? Oh that's silly! Just fill out these spam- I mean scam- I mean malw-... SURVEYS, yes, surveys. Or, you know, you could just *COUGH* pay us up front, fifty quids, bro.
I guess it wasnt enough >.>
It might not be high quality, but most art thieves don't really care about that.
Just discovered my sona was also stolen :/
Its the comment all the way at the bottom. Anyone got this DCMA thing that I can fill out as I can't seem to comment on that thread about removing the art that I paid for? Also do I need to tell the artist about this...are they the ones that have to file the DCMA? I have never done this before....dude the art theft there is RIDICULOUS OMFG!
And it was completed....I am really at a loss...I didn't think this buy out ment much but now....I think I may leave....I am beyond upset right now....
"I don't think you can get me into trouble hunni, I only used your pic for a reference for the spots and colors, the fur I had made is completely different"
This is not true...I used to have a lighter stomach and still do for some art!
http://userimages-akm.imvu.com/user.....1802553931.png
They had it made for them...and the person doesn't even care that the art isn't there's...I am beyond upset!
They took my sona...I....I can't....I don't know if I can stay here....
Right click your images and search google for this image.
:/ found one of mine on IMVU and one on youtube...
If you are using firefox....uhhhh not sure >.>
I'll take a look thank you!
Also best of luck with your removal efforts. My thoughts are with you :(
I think they may actually do that..
inb4 class action lawsuit
That being said, IMVU is certainly not going to be the company that is the center for Furry creativity, long run. Give it a couple years and you'll have yourself a lovely little yiffstar, or F2F outta this site~
But I feel corporate influence will cause things to slow to near halting. Especially for complaints on future business ethics.
I feel as though it may become cluttered with IMVU features too.
Id be down to scope that out (Hell, I'm on most sites anyways.)
https://twitter.com/panderp/status/.....47385976500224
Right now that's not the issue. Not anymore
The issue is, we do not feel safe with our content on here, so long as IMVU is in charge and has control.
Why would we?
They CLEARLY give 0 shits about the artist or their rights. Why should the owner have to go through filing a DMCA to stop someone blatantly using their work for profit on their site? Why isn't a report with reliable evidence enough?
It's shitty all around, and we do not want these people running the site.
Not really the face of the Furry community that I think the Furry community wants.
Who would do that.
You know what I think? I think it's because every site and con that exists for furs presently has been made by furs, for furs, without any real expectation of profit. And we're not really used to anyone throwing us a bone. Even Hardblush has, itself, a bit of a reputation for charging premiums, even though it's home-grown furry content.
IMVU coming in, buying what you might call the most prestigious and recognizable entity in the fur-world, is the first act of an outsider coming in.
And it's very abrupt, and without much real courtship of the community - just of the business. And we're all really quite wary of that~
We're not sure we really want Furry to become that~
We really want Furry to be of our own creation. Because, it always has been.
I'm not a die-hard furry by any means. In fact, I mostly coast on the fringes. But it still made me really uncomfortable when places like Hot Topic started selling tails.
The rest, as in, the poor, the non american and the ones who wish to remain anonymous, are utterly defenseless against IMVU's systematic art theft.
You are giving your personal information so you can file a lawsuit only if you choose to proceed with one. Otherwise, if the company releases your personal information without your consent, you can sue them for damages. Since most DMCA receiving agents are lawyers, they are smart enough not to fuck themselves like that.
I have never received any response from a DMCA except "okay, the content was removed". I haven't been asked for clarification or told of any delays. I have never even been countered.
Actually I sent one on Friday and just got this back today. It is stupid simple to get this accomplished:
Linden Lab has received your notification of copyright infringement under the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (“DMCA”), 17 U.S.C. § 512.
After having reviewed your notification:
In compliance with the DMCA, the following work(s) have been expeditiously removed or disabled:
Description of work(s):
*****
Location of Work(s):
*****
Sincerely,
The IP Team at Linden Lab
[c:8795]
I have been able to do it without spending 199 dollars in hand and without giving personal information and I don't even live in the US. Please stop spreading misinformation.
AND SO THE SAGA OF A COMPANY BUILT ON THE DOLLARS SUCKED FROM THIEVES BEGAN.
ilu so much
Don't even THINK to encourage a new generation of Copyright Nazis, The world has too many as it is now, and it doesn't need any more- in fact, it doesn't need any. I swear to God these people make nuclear annihilation seem like a viable option to get rid of them.
Just look at how they sell Tartii's and Falvie's art without their permission and not even giving them credit as the watermarks were cropped:
http://es.imvu.com/shop/product.php.....ts_id=22067666
http://es.imvu.com/shop/product.php.....ts_id=16211166
Or when your sona is ripped and made for someone else to do GOD KNOWS WHAT!!!
:/ they took my commission from Ifus and made an avi for themselves...I am beyond upset....so yeah
No it's not. That is exactly the sort of thing that the DMCA was designed to combat.
Oh, and boo hoo, trying to get he banned from a chatsite for theft. Serves the little bitch right as far as I am concerned. You don't do this kind of shit.
thank you...I am not always the best with words and this summed it up beautifully!
Also, my husband made my sona for me...and that is pretty personal, I mean, it is pretty generic, modeled after me and my fluffy Maincoon cat (he is asleep on the couch right now). I am not overly fond of anyone else using it for art, other than him, even people who want to make gift art for him, just because I see it as an extension of me. Some of the things...that is not what I (myself) would do, there is no way in hell that this interpretation of me would do that either...not without ripping off someone's arm in the process. The point is though that this is me, true, a fuzzier and more cartoonish me...but still me. You character is you, no one has the right to use you but you.
And some people do it so damned flippantly. They don't see it as anything more than a cartoon. Hell, even if they did I doubt they would care because they are self centered little fucktards. And the fact that you have to jump through these flaming hoops, just to try to get someone to stop pretending to be you, or just fucking around with something so personal to you...well, it is bad...and the fact that the higher ups here just say "fill out this form" which will not do shit for at least a few weeks are not even trying to fix the situation. Technically they could at least ask IMVU to put a freeze on this shit. Ask them to put a hold on the things that are flagged at least until the whole mess is sorted out. But they are not.
It's Tarti not wanting their own work reuploaded.
If they say do not reupload then don't.
Conspiracy theories, and... other kinds of nonsensical bullshit.
"What were you thinking saving this stuff to the school computer. You should be ashamed."
"What were YOU thinking letting a teacher take a public school class to a christian camp?"
"....what?"
But with everything said, it just seems really minor. It's only a small minor problem getting reposted anyway because you can easily just give credit in the description. That's my main problem with Reddit, no one gives credit to the original author, they just repost their work. But i just assume that it's a bunch of kids. You know, a bunch of minors.
http://z0r.de/4963
If you can't respect the people creating the art you enjoy enough to follow their rules on reposting, then you aren't going to have many friends and plenty of artists won't feel comfortable working with you.
But to answer your question, it depends on the person really.
I don't think you know what the DMCA is.
Step 1: Nothing, because this doesn't happen.
The person "slammed" is the content provider. The content provider then removes the allegedly infringing content and notifies the alleged infringer that the content was removed and they have the option to counter. If they don't, then that's the end of it, and nothing else happens.
If you are getting "slammed" then that means you have a DMCA receiving agent on file with the copyright office, so obviously you know your shit if that's the case. In fact, the agent (being a lawyer) handles the paperwork and will communicate more informally with the site's staff to identify and remove the content.
Individuals do not get "slammed" because they aren't safe harbors. They just get sued outright.
I swear to God these people make nuclear annihilation seem like a viable option to get rid of them.
Though I am refering to IMVU SO Nuke em off the globe.
Don’t you know that you’re toxic
And I love what you do
Don’t you know that you’re toxic
I was under the impression that the burden of proof is that when you upload something to a website you want to sell your "product" on you have to proof you have the rights to it which should be easy.
but instead the owner has the prove his stuff has been stolen in a extremely long and complicated progress?
excuse my french but WHO THE HELL FARTED INTO THEIR BRAIN?!!? If someone can't provide any proof that what they upload to IMVU belongs to them then MOST CERTAINLY BECAUSE IT DOES NOT!!!
The IMVU policies unfairly restrict content owners making it harder to exercise their rights while making it laughably easy to sell stolen art over imvu even if its monopoly money -_-# ####
So does furaffinity, and always has. So does almost every other site on the entire internet.
DMCA is not a long or complicated process, it is actually fairly easy and is guaranteed to get the offending products removed.
So FA was profitable in the first place.......... so that is where the donations went.
IMVU & FA Administration,
As a rather corporation with 120 employees located in Mountain View, you should be aware and well versed with media relations, especially when dealing with your user base. As such, communication should be clear, concise and whenever possible relayed before major concerns arise. It only hurts your customers perception and your brand to provide opposing communications minutes, hours or days apart. Additionally, as a web site owner, you should make your site as easy and simple to use as possible. For example, your link on your 'Contact Us' page at IMVU for DMCA requests does not link to anything in regards to DMCA requests. Alternatively, create a form where someone can submit a link to the item they are requesting be taken down and upload a PDF of their signed takedown request form. Provide a form for them to fill out and print even, as this is an apparent ongoing trouble with sites that utilize user created content.
If the mis-communications surrounding flagging or not flagging stolen content was created by Dragoneer, he should sit down and have a discussion with his new management about who and how, media, press releases, and administrative communications are handled in the future and FA Staff and IMVU should work together and both approve of these kinds of communications in the future.
-Snala
and he is not going to do anything , if he has he would of responded about it which he hasn't. or better yet picking and choosing what to respond to
So, IMVU is not a horrible company. But they may have some people making shitty decisions.
Regardless, I am not going to read through your posts above. There is no need, I understand the perspectives on the issues at hand and what everyones feelings and emotions are one way or another on the topic. Your feelings on the topic in particular are very clear with 68 posts on this topic alone. I admire your dedication to attempting to update and keep information flowing through the use of screen captures of conversations. However, while this may have the desired effect and appearance, it does remove a lot of context from conversations and in general is a very poor way of forming independent perspective. I will perform my own research on the parties involved before coming to my own conclusions using all available evidence, not just that which is cut and pasted pice by piece.
My post is intended to communicate my thoughts, and expectations, being that FurAffinity is now owned by IMVU. It is a post directed at Dragoneer and IMVU and, although I am more than happy to to share my thoughts with all, I have no personal feelings one way or another on if IMVU ownership is good or bad. It is a, we will see and only time will tell.
Wow... so much art being sold by those who have no right to sell art by so many artists I know and look up to..
I know this isnt right... and shame on Dragoneer to sell FA without as simply saying: "Hey, that needs to cease before a transaction be finalized."
The hell... I really havent been against Dragoneer before... but not even taking a few minutes to do a simple search before selling out everyone who has made him who he is...
> From the looks of what Backdrop12 posted, anybody who donated money to Fa in January has legal standing to sue Dragoneer.
Won't it cost more in legal fees than to get back what was donated?
Hypothetically, if he declared bankruptcy because of not having sufficient funds, anyone who mortgaged their house and such as a guarantee against this for a "pay only if you win" lawsuit, will end up losing their home if they can't cover the fees despite winning the lawsuit, no?
"So let me get this straight. They allow "users" to post any crap they want without providing any form of proof that they own the content?
I was under the impression that the burden of proof is that when you upload something to a website you want to sell your "product" on you have to proof you have the rights to it which should be easy.
but instead the owner has the prove his stuff has been stolen in a extremely long and complicated progress?
excuse my french but WHO THE HELL FARTED INTO THEIR BRAIN?!!? If someone can't provide any proof that what they upload to IMVU belongs to them then MOST CERTAINLY BECAUSE IT DOES NOT!!!
The IMVU policies unfairly restrict content owners making it harder to exercise their rights while making it laughably easy to sell stolen art over imvu even if its monopoly money -_-# #### "
So does furaffinity, and always has. So does almost every other site on the entire internet.
DMCA is not a long or complicated process, it is actually fairly easy and is guaranteed to get the offending products removed.
A) Which was the total cost in USD to carry out a DMCA from beggining to end
B) Do you live in the USA
C) How many hours took you to carry it out from begining to end.
Thanks.
I live in the United states.
It took less than an hour to file the form.
It took less than 24 hours to get a response that the product was removed from the catalog.
http://es.imvu.com/shop/product.php.....ts_id=16211166
http://es.imvu.com/shop/product.php.....ts_id=22067666
(In short)
So... the only way to take that stuff out of IMVU is by making an account there and reporting the 'products'?
Wow this is amazing
Thanks tho :3
You do not need an IMVU account to file a DMCA. You do not have to pay money to have an IMVU account.
Imagine if your art NSFW is on IMVU, but you can't see it since you're a regular user.
I believe allowing us FA users to view such content will make people feel safe because we will be able to find content that was stolen.
Make sure to save all your images to your hard drives before this can possibly happen.
The difference is that you can see them! However, since IMVU restricts people from seeing them unless you pay, it will make artists paranoid and will blame Dragoneer instead.
If somehow, when we create an account, we can somehow validate an IMVU account to have Adult Content enabled with our FA accounts, then it'll give artists, some relief because they'll be able to see what most people won't yanow what I meant?
Dragoneer did not spend the donation money
Not sure how I feel about IMVU and Fur affinity, there is slight overlap, but not a ton.
Original submission:
http://www.furaffinity.net/view/7250797/
And how they sell it in their damned store:
http://es.imvu.com/shop/product.php.....ts_id=16211166
Original submission:
https://www.furaffinity.net/view/10900794/
And how they BLANTANTLY removed the watermark and sell it in their damned store:
http://es.imvu.com/shop/product.php.....ts_id=22067666
Dragoneer: Now that you are working for IMVU in efforts to make the two communities grow, will you be pushing/directing/working for clearing out the art being sold by those that are not to be selling it? You of all people at IMVU know that Botch's, Wolfy-nail's, etc's work should not be sold by others since you know the art to begin with.
""NEITHER IMVU NOR ITS LICENSORS SHALL BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DAMAGES RESULTING FROM YOUR USING, DISPLAYING, COPYING, OR DOWNLOADING ANY MATERIALS, THIRD PARTY CONTENT OR SUBMISSIONS TO OR FROM THIS SITE. IN NO EVENT SHALL IMVU OR ITS LICENSORS BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DAMAGE TO YOUR HEALTH OR FOR ANY INDIRECT, EXTRAORDINARY, EXEMPLARY, PUNITIVE, SPECIAL, INCIDENTAL, OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES (INCLUDING LOSS OF DATA, REVENUE, PROFITS, USE OR OTHER ECONOMIC ADVANTAGE) HOWEVER ARISING, EVEN IF IMVU OR ITS LICENSORS KNOW THERE IS A POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGE."
In other words F*&^ you you agree you cant sue us no matter how much we screw up
Original submission:
http://www.furaffinity.net/view/7250797/
And how they sell it in their damned store:
http://es.imvu.com/shop/product.php.....ts_id=16211166
Original submission:
https://www.furaffinity.net/view/10900794/
And how they BLANTANTLY removed the watermark and sell it in their damned store:
http://es.imvu.com/shop/product.php.....ts_id=22067666
Edit: Scratch that, you beat me to it. Nice digging.
http://s1341.photobucket.com/user/T.....edgcy.png.html
Dragoneer just admitted to taking money from the GoFundMe Donation run in a while back.
I'm done. Just.... Done. If this is not enough proof that things have gone to shit for you folks, I don't know what is.
*MY* question is this: I've heard how IMVU users are notorious for stealing artwork and trying to sell it off as their own, but is it just me, or has there been a LOT more reports the past few days of FA art being stolen (some from well known artists, like Falvie)? I'm not sure if it's just due to people noticing now that they know what IMVU is, or if it's an actual increase due to the company now owning FA. It definitely seems to be a huge problem. I feel that IMVU may need to change its policies on how stolen art is dealt with; if a user can flag/report a stolen image with definitive proof it does not belong to them, I think it would help a lot more than only the artist having to file a DMCA.
Every website that allows people to upload anything (everything from e621 to facebook to second life) has thieves. The difference is that a lot of people have blatantly ignored IMVU for a very long time. They looked the other way the moment IMVU was mentioned because they had made up their mind to dislike it. This made it very difficult for people who use IMVU to contact these artists.
The form is actually not that hard, and once you have it down, anytime you need to use it you just swap out the links and won't have to change the wording all that much.
I honestly don't really know enough about either side to make much judgement here. I do know I tried IMVU once and I COMPLETELY hated it. Either way, I just hope everything works out in the end.
Bah, hold on. I'll dig it up.
This is him lying about the GoFundMe.
https://media.8ch.net/furry/src/1427089450183.png
And this is him admitting he used the funds for his own personal gains.
https://media.8ch.net/furry/src/1427087985334.png
Follow the chains on twitter if things need to be explained further. I just woke up, and I have an absolutely HELLISH migraine.
For those of you backing up IMVU, this is it now, this is the moment. Over 24 hours and we have had no legitimate answers to our burning, serious questions. This is who owns the front page of our community online now.
After all, I believe there is a screenshot floating around of 'Neer saying that he's going to hunker down for two weeks as the whole thing blows over; and honestly, I cannot blame him for that. It seems to be have worked in all the earlier upsets, so why not this one?
I don't know, I am hoping that they are wrong. Here's the snag, though; I'm decent at figuring the odds and knowing which side to wager on, and I'm wagering on Dragoneer being right. Two weeks to a month from now, I bet FA traffic will be no less than 90% it's pre-sell announcement level and that is playing it safe -- I'd give it a better than even chance than being at 95%, and that is assuming the site hasn't already experienced a rebound. (Granted, I keep coming here and ranting; it is hard to say how many others are like me in this, just coming here to get information and communicate, not really to be a member of FA like it used to be.)
And if I were IMVU, I'd let Dragoneer draw all the ire and hate during that period; let him be the whipping boy so that IMVU's brand is shielded as much as possible from the backlash. I could be wrong, mind you, but it's what I'd do if I were IMVU; let the masses burn themselves out, and see to it that the ones that remain upset are upset at the person who no longer has any real power to change things. It's too easy not to have been thought of, right?
..or am I just good at being a villain and I just never walked that path? x.X;
On the bright side, though, I love your icon. ^.^
I'm not O.K. with art theft nor with self-representations theft (I'm sorry you got stolen,
It's a lot of work, to go through all the comments.
And a lot of stuff is being discussed in here. From the IMVU thing to where the donations really went and even the creation of yet a new furry page.
Apart from giving dildos to everyone, I came to post a nice link so you watch and relax, even if it's only for a bit... (unless you hate chipmunks... then don't watch this)
http://9gag.tv/p/a9p3qE/chipmunk-s-.....tretch?ref=tcl
and "butthurt queers " really now.....
try flagging it then . cause once I click on the flag icon it clearly says I need to log in,
Also people cannot access the adult portion of the shop until they pay 6 dollars.
As for the adult portion, you do not have to actually access it personally, all you need is a link to the product or the product ID number.
While yes, it is difficult to find the art if you do not have AP, IMVU does have a rather large underage userbase, they can not risk younger people seeing content they should not see.
If the people on FA would be willing to work alongside people who have IMVU, things could go smoother. People who use IMVU could look out for products that do not belong and bring it to the artists attention.
I have been trying to do this for a very long time. I report everything I recognize to the person who owns it. The problem is, I can't be familiar with every artist and their work. If there was some type of forum where people from IMVU could post screencaps of products and users of both FA and IMVU could look and try and find artists. But getting people to join a whole new website, even if it is to protect their art, can be a hassle. (A forum like this could be used for more than just IMVU, it could also be used for theft on Second life or any other site as well)
That I understand , however alot of websites do it so much better than IMVU and YOU DO NOT HAVE TO PAY.
This should not be the case . It should be a matter of reporting it WITH PROOF and that is that . A DMCA would only cost the individual money and time and may NOT EVEN BE ACCEPTED. Also , how can we work with you guys when most of your catalog/userbase is filled to the brim with stolen artwork ? The only way we can work with you is to get your act together on your site , but sadly your admins do not care .
I understand the issue with what your saying about stolen artwork but atleast we make original artwork that can be fantastic with no limitations unlike your site . The avatar set is limited and makes avatars on IMVU look sloppy and generic. Second life on the other hand has more options and more possibilities and THEY HAVE A BETTER FLAGGING SYSTEM.
Again, you do not have to pay.
DMCAs do not cost any money at all. A properly filed DMCA can not legally be rejected and is guaranteed to get the product removed.
You are jumping to conclusions and accusing the majority of people of being art thieves. Which, frankly, is insulting to me.
The only way we can work together is if the people on FA stop being total pricks about everything.
Our admins do care, they are just ill-equipped to handle this type of stuff. They can not personally monitor everything posted in the shop. They can not take people's word on something because they could be duped into punishing an innocent person. Filing a DMCA is the cleanest, safest way to deal with things.
You are implying that people who use IMVU can not make original art without even realizing that there are artists here on IMVU that make great, original art, that also use IMVU and make products on there.
I am trying to ask for us to work together and all you want to do is throw insults around. You insult me, you insult the work I do, you insult an entire community of people. Then you have the audacity to baw about how you can't get access to a product information when a person you just insulted could have easily given it to you.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZyHcLxILnuw
Good.
Wet willy wankers.
There's your new joke.
Now, I'll only reply to the people who are worth my time as I take off on my noble penis on a search for a decent art site.
FurAffinity's community can get butthurt over dildos, so their assholes are too loose to think straight.
IMVU works for the government, since stealing shit is their jobs.
DeviantART's staff is atrocious, much like the decision of letting IMVU run FA.
Have fun! <3
and magic Rena to me is totally going off the deep end and repeats to many of the same posts . no offence to him , but he really needs to chill when trying to express himself =p
He believes calling everyone a 'retard' is gonna get his comments through but to be honest he's being more pathetic than he is helpful.
That's what everyone read in that post of yours.
Tell that to Backdrop, who 8 hours earlier than you, posted a comment.
Good day sir, as you have been dunked with logic.
I'm starting to think who the real mentally deficient one is. I never admitted to being a troll, I just made a joke for the sake of making the joke, and you got sour with it and started to rage like some kind of sexual harassment victim.
I prefer not to use the word 'rape' since I know there may be people here who were, in fact, raped.
Besides, 'defending your fellow artists' means actually defending them from people who are being attacked by actual trolls. You're just being a cyber-bully since I have not once been trying to actually upset anyone. The only one you're trying to defend is yourself, because you got offended by the word 'Dildos'.
Go and troll somewhere else.
Grow up and shed a thicker skin, Rena, or at least get off FA. <3
Too bad that won't cure your autism.
Unlike whatever kind of disease you have that spreads arrogance like a virus.
That's what you get for mocking people in their suffering. Enjoy your permanent autism, lol
'Lol'.
Yeah. I can fight back.
Have fun raging while I delete the comments and laugh to this day. You should've known not to feed the troll, since you're considering me as one I may as well be one.
hope many of you have a current hobby or something cause you're experience is gonna suck.
Are you trying to to take a jab at me cause that's a pretty weak attempt.
Again, seek a hobby.
And just after I updated everything, guess I'll pack my bags and leave 'em by the door just in case
What IS going on and will keep going to happen, is that art will continue to be stolen from everywhere incluing FA, and users on IMVU will profit from it. Which in that case you can report them with a DMCA claim with your original work and take down the stolen pictures and ban the user.
No website is perfect as a popular image sharing board.
http://i.imgur.com/6Ny4I9Z.gif
But those who did quit, that is less competition for me lol
[EDIT] But you know, to be 100% fair, many of the newer features have been quite good.
It's entirely possible this IMVU thing will be great for Fur Affinity and there's no real reason to want to leave, yet. But don't be an "FA Exclusive Furry". You would stop us from being able to realistically relocate if things actually do get irredeemably bad like many of us fear and you would be robbing FA of any incentive to improve itself or be morally upstanding by continuing to enable it to be the"corrupt cable company" of furry sites. The "you'll come back" mentality only holds true if furs are too lazy to get off their collective asses and mirror their content.
Respect yourself and your fellow furs. Secondary on another site and enable us as a fandom to make the decision to be on the website that respects us the most now and in the future. That website might be FA soon. That's entirely possible, especially if enough people are on rival platforms as well as here. Entrenched numbers should not enter the decision making process when it comes to where we should all be. Don't be part of the problem.
I know commercial websites run worse , and free websites run better.
But IMVU is something which I have a moral ( and technical ) issue with.
When FA had its last pile of problems I copied most materials from here to Weasyl and Sofurry.
in a way positive, I now only need to sync one or two journals before being able to fry my content if I find it neccessary.
With no commercial interests myself and those relevant for me accessible via secondary channels, I think I am flexible enough to, when IMVU really show's it's colors on FA, shut up shop on short notice.
I needed to open the post and copy past the link so there are the good working ones now
Stolen
http://es.imvu.com/shop/product.php.....ts_id=22067666
Original
https://www.furaffinity.net/view/10900794/
Stolen
http://es.imvu.com/shop/product.php.....ts_id=16211166
Original
http://www.furaffinity.net/view/7250797/
It's null to everybody who joined before the edit, as we haven't gotten ANY notifications or an alert that there's been a TOS change and in order to use the site, you must agree to the new TOS. (Major sites do this all the time. It's important and it shows what's changed.)
But for people who are leaving, and not sure where to go, here's my recommendations of sites as we wait for IMVU/neer to shit the bed.
Inkbunny: Very nice layout, the content filters and tag filters are amazing. However it's full of babyfur/cub lovers (and a ton of Sonic fans) but once you place all of those offending tags into the filter, it completely hides it away from your view as if it never existed.
Weasyl: Still in Beta, It's nice(-ish) and has a tag filter as well, but community-wise it's overrun by tumblr snowflakes who if you even sneeze at them, would get offended. I just wish Weasyl had a name-change feature but it's stuck in beta-development hell.
Sofurry: It's dead. don't bother, unless you enjoy written furry porn then go right ahead.
Tumblr: If you enjoy suffering, go right ahead. Don't be surprised at someone getting offended because you used "dickgirl" as a tag.
However!
If you ever have one burning a hole in your pocket again, I wouldn't mind bumming it off of you so long as no one else is claiming it. (Seriously, though, if an artist or someone more active wants it, they have absolute priority; I won't take something that would deny that community a productive user just so my quiet self can join.)
Extract of the current FA Terms:
" 4. Data Use, User Created Content, and Privacy
4.1 - When you upload content to Fur Affinity via our services, you grant us a non-exclusive, worldwide, royalty-free, sublicensable, transferable right and license to use, host, store, cache, reproduce, publish, display (publicly or otherwise), perform (publicly or otherwise), distribute, transmit, modify, adapt, and create derivative works of, that content. These permissions are purely for the limited purposes of allowing us to provide our services in accordance with their functionality (hosting and display), improve them, and develop new services. These permissions do not transfer the rights of your content or allow us to create any deviations of that content outside the aforementioned purpose"
What does this mean?
It means that you must now PAY IMVU to report YOUR stolen artwork. It means that, even if you have watermarks, IMVU has the rights to YOUR work--or anything you commissioned--and make money off of it as in-game skins, posters, clothing and more.
If your artwork gets stolen on IMVU you must now make an account and in many cases a paid 'premium' account for mods to even look at it as several furries have screenshotted all over Tumblr
(For the record, I feel dirty saying that, but it is what it is; they're there to make a profit. In their eyes, this is ethical, it is the very reason for the company's existence.)
If IMVU is about the money, maybe they're more likely to sell the site?
Kinda like when we had that other donation drive thing. If half the people ranting about leaving were willing to make a donation towards some sort of crowdfunding thing to buy FA back from IMVU, we might have a chance.
Artists would still get to have their traffic.
Watchers get to keep tabs on their artists.
IMVU gets a sum of cash that would keep them hopefully content.
FA gets new management.
Thoughts?
Also, if any IMVU staff are scanning these posts, do you have some sort of figure range that you'd begin to consider the offer of selling Furaffinity?
This is what I've been saying; this is what I'd like to see happen.
There were furs that had offered to buy 54% of FA for $50,000. I would prefer it if they led the way, as they seem to have a head start; however, I am willing to dig deep to have a small portion of FA. Barring that, I'd consider tossing money in even without equity; I trust them a great deal more than I trust IMVU. I only wish I had heard of the offer before -- and that I had all their names so that I could read out to them.
http://40.media.tumblr.com/21508ba1.....s4jlo1_500.jpg
He felt he had to polish that proverbial turd, and that's what resulted. It is a prime example of what NOT to say; but one of the reasons it is a prime example isn't that it is so ill advised (though it is), but because it is so easy to get invested in making things look great that you utterly fail to notice how you're doing damage to your cause.
Trust me, the same thing happens to me when I'm having too much fun playing devil's advocate. You can attack a position and chase when they retreat, but the chase gives tunnel vision, and before you know it, I'm face first into a wall. It's easy to make unforced errors when you're excited and having fun, stressed, or out of your comfort zone. I'm willing to bet the latter two apply in this case.
What is far more concerning to me is the fact that IMVU hasn't had a solution to this problem.
If they were negotiating this for a while before purchase, and if this sell was completed two months ago, how the hell did they not see this backlash coming their way and have something prepared?
Or maybe that is Dragoneer playing the role they have carved out for him at IMVU; let him take all the heat and hits and quietly watch as the furryfolk tucker themselves out raging at someone who doesn't actually hold supreme authority? If we're all busy being upset with 'Neer, we'll be too distracted to accomplish something by bringing it up with the real seat of power, IMVU.
I mean, I'm just saying; if I had a quarter of a year to plan this, I could think of worse plots than letting people flog the whipping boy while I laugh all the way to the bank. (They have to assume they're banking here, right? I don't see it, but still; it'd be their plan, surely their step two isn't ???)
how about now??
I just get an Access Denied error.
http://fuckingfurries.tumblr.com/po.....ems-but-he-did
"If anything, the sheer amount of stolen artwork on IMVU is a testament to how damn popular the artwork is, and why IMVU wants furries."
For SL it was easy to just go and compile the client - but IMVU?
Plus, I wasn't aware that it was possible to sculpt proper muzzles for IMVU avatars.
Which is why I'd never would have expected furries to have any noticeable business with IMVU and it's (pre-)teen avatar, adult-pay, wannabe 3D-erotic chat stuff.
And I have an ass, and thus I am an ass.
I have a dick too, and thus I am a dick.
And I have actually been diagnosed as autistic by my doctor. And yes. The person I was referring to is trying to trigger me with insults of autism.
You know what no.
Screw that. There are a lot of issues that are NOT being handled. He should have to DEAL with them same with IMVU. The fact that you and a bunch of others are just wanting to let this brush over is franky silly.
But you know what would help you guys out? Stop looking here.
amazing. All fixed.
also dildos :Y
no your right it's so silly of me to think that these questions that they should have fucking thought about before making a deal should be replied to how sillly of me my gosh I'm so sorry! and oh my god I'm so sorry I sent more then one comment. My bad c:
then telling me you wanted a decent conversion. I'm sorry but no that's not how you have a decent conversation. Granted I wasn't doing much better by starting off sarcastically. However I'm not 'throwing a fit' by repeating things and replying to people who have yet to have things answered. That neer and the staff have yet to do to qweell the flames. Like talking about DMCA's and how you can do it for free but because of miss communication people are spreading that it's not. Instead of Neer adding one simple link to the journal people are panicking as they have right too. Or how about the fact that you can't see AP only products ? Their just working on that end. Most of these things that we need to be replied too Neer is either ignoring or posting on his twitter and that's really just dumb for lack of a better word.
He's not replying fully on donations or about 3rd part ads either. This is also a huge deal 3rd part ad's could include a ton of things like you know porn ad's that IMVU is known. Or how about the fact that we were not told about the sell? Or all the new mods that are hiding under alt accounts. Transparency issues that have been happening for years have yet to get a clear reply. You can not tell me that they just don't have the time to do it when some issues have been over 3+ years. Neer hasn't touched the fact that someone else owns a part of FA either? So there's also that too that has yet to have a response or the person he banned for off site reasons? Someone who just re-tweeted an image.
So your telling me that rising these issues at all over and over again so he cannot simply forget them is throwing a fit? Really? I'm honestly just glad I don't have to live off this site for my work , but not everyone is as lucky as me. What about the artists who donated , who support and use the site ? Or those who bought adspaces who now might have their ad's put on ad block because of the thread of 3rd party ad's.
This is alright too you? What's the point of being silent on these issues , because all that would equal is Neer thinking everything is alright and can be ignored again.
If IMVU is smart they will fire him the moment they understand that he has not done a thing good for this site or plans too. This place is broken and by the looks of it is only going to get worse. So either you can voice how you feel or stay silent. Or simply leave , and since this is the main place in furry art plenty of people can't leave even if they want, they have a right to complain as they please weather it makes you or anyone else upset or not. Weather you think it's beating a dead horse or not. They can do as they please and how they think it's the only way to get themselves heard and with FA's history it normally is the only way so no.
Sorry.
but no.
"We are doing our best to monitor your feedback and concerns, respond to them and sometimes work with IMVU to get you the appropriate response."
So to bring attention to a question that's being repeated would actually help get it answered if everyone wants to know. I find it very rude, however to call one childish for being angry, when they have every right to be. Artist's art is getting stolen, and there's nothing we can do. Your condescending attitude is not helping push anything in the right direction. I didn't mean to insult you other than your attitude, so please let's not have a shouting match at who's worse. I'm simply just stating the obvious.
I guess everything you just said is invalided :)
and tbh the only one throwing a tantrum is you...and I've never called you childish for using an emote? Where did you read that? Do you need better lenses? I've never had a conversation with you....ever? before???
Hide comments to hide the stupidity I suppose... And of course not every question asked is going to end up there, again, just the most asked ones...hence why it's called a FAQ (frequently asked questions). I don't understand why you're coming off as so passive aggressive either? I'm not trying coming off as mature but if you think that I'll take it as a compliment because this is normally how I deal with people who act like you. You did put words in my mouth assuming I called you childish...If you didn't hide your comments I would quote you directly. Maybe you need to check who you reply to before you blindingly tap tap tap away on the keyboard like some keyboard warrior until the bitter end, no matter how wrong you are. My original comment was in reply to you, a very calm one, saying that fA is reading the replies/questions of people here, quoted the journal, and now a FAQ has appeared. Why do you want to fight someone so badly?
Speaking of "dive bombing" on a conversation, bittercomplex stated her opinion and you "dive bombed" right into her conversation so? You're accusing me of something you did as well? It wasn't from a few moths ago either...the oldest comment on this journal is 4 days. This conversation is over.
You can sit here and whine about how I've been 'passive aggressive' but you have been as well. And honestly? We both look stupid. But hey, thanks for keeping me entertained at least?
Sweetheart, I didn't reply to this person because I had a grudge against them. I still hold no ill feelings for them. You on the other hand need to learn to let things go. I have no ill feelings for you either, but after your display here I've had to unwatch you. I cannot find myself supporting an artist who acts like this. Sorry.
DMCA notices are expensive to create and file, and are a considerably lengthy process, and from what I've read about IMVU, this seems to be the only takedown method that it's staff will comply with.
The way this generates concern from the community is in the above fact that most of us don't have the money to keep filing DMCA takedown requests for stolen art in an area where stolen content is already poorly managed.
Most professional services charge in excess of US$200 per notice, which often times is worth more than the entire art piece cost to commission from an artist, and even if it's taken down, another individual will likely post the same content again. What we need to know is as follows:
What actions will FurAffinity and IMVU take in order to mitigate the risk and minimize the personal expense of the community's artists, many of whom rely on the money they make here to survive? Content Theft management through expensive, lengthy legal process is a very dangerous route for a small community to have to take, and this is a policy that should be taken into serious consideration.
Unless of course, and this is the much more likely scenario, neither IMVU or Furaffinity intend on doing anything about this problem at all. FA hasn't the best track record for listening to it's community, after all.
This, also where there is a potential legal battle likely to occur in respect to the acquisition of Furaffinity, given that one individual has raised the issue that they had already legally acquired ownership of 50% of the site (This is yet to be fully verified, so don't quote me) could cause some serious problems for FA itself. IMVU are by no means obligated to stand at Dragoneer's back if this acclaimed legal hiccup is indeed the case.
EDIT: Though I agree it's a dumb process and I don't like the fact that Neer was too lazy to add that link.
One can fill forms, and it is no guarantee that anything is going to happen.
I am taking other people's word on it I have not personally worked with them. I'm not saying it works , I'm saying that it's free to FILE it via them. You can also file it for free yourself there's a few other places you can do it at if you look at higher up comment's I think others have linked it. You really need to calm down. I understand this is a touchy issue as an artist trust me I fucking know but acting like a child about it won't help anything. There are ways to do it if you google free ways to do a DMCA I'm sure you will find a few ways to do it. Stop spreading misinformation for the sake of nonsense.
1) You have no evidence (as expected)
2) You are just stating that filling a form is free. For your information, filling any form is free as it is just a piece of paper, it does not work magically, it does not grant anything, it is just the beggining of a process and not the whole process itself.
3) Given 1 and 2, then the one spreading lies is you, not me.
I heard elsewhere you had to mail it in because they had no online form to use is that true?
Sounds like you have zero experience on how the real life works. Have you considered getting out of your parent's basement?
Either way done talking to a dumbass like you wasting my time :,3
I fill a form, so what? They can simply ignore it, and they do, or they can simply shrug it off unless I proceed legally, and again, THEY DO.
Lol, this is so absurd as saying "hey, I am already a Physicist because I filled a form to be admitted in the University".
- An already mistrusting community, who will now direct their full wrath and hatred directly to the staff of it's corporation.
- A site that has, time and again, shown it's unrelenting incompetence at effective administration, failure to maintain a period of average uptime that is measurable by even the most miniscule orders of magnitude of human time, a ravenous inability to remain financially sustainable, and for having quite possibly the ugliest skinset and UI of any corporately owned website in history.
- A yet still massive backlog of reports and trouble tickets to deal with.
- A potential lawsuit at the hands of panderp.
- A magnanimously incapable and self-serving site administrator (who, granted, though rightfully so, receives a lot of shit from his community for said incapabilities, and a history of decision making so terrible that it might just be worthy of entering the Guinness book of Universal records for Most Astronomically Brainless Failures in a Single Lifetime).
- The responsibility to fund said unstable, incompetently managed, DDoS prone website.
In lieu of the buyout, though, the average community member can do little to stop it, so we'll see what happens. I'm sure many of us are still waiting for the day that the laws of physics allow for the transformation of Dog Shit into Gold.
Yes it does not seem like a smart move but in all honesty there is a lot more going on behind the scenes then people realize. a company like IMVU is out to make a profit, they will monetize the hell out of FA by adds and demanded royalties every time FA is used outside the site. cons that display FA's name will now have to either remove FA from their con or Pay IMVU to use the name. IMVU already is trying to sneak into our cons as was seen in a video posted earlier in the thread. IMVU was there and trying to make nice with all the furries. We did not know they had bought FA then but we do now. and now we know why they were there in the first place.
them owning all rights to the Name and the Site itself can monetize us and do as they please, or so they think but to be honest as more and more artists pack up their Gallery's IMVU is going to lose their **es on this deal because the fandom will relocate to a site that is not owned by a for profit corporation. FA will be stricken from cons and We will send a powerful message that IMVU is not welcome in our community. They are not going to profit and get their greedy paws on the fandom nor any of its royalties. If FA crashes IMVU will simply close it or sell it off. this whole buy out makes no sense in that they have no true vested interest in the fandom at all. Though makes perfect sense in a profit margin when it comes to ownership of the largest Websites name and all the royalties that go with it.
Public Relations! How do it work?
You want to know my thoughts on the IMCU thing?
[FLAME SHIELD UP]
I honestly could not give two flying fucks. IMCU may steal shit and rip off the government's job, but at least people will be making a profit from other people's works when they couldn't get profits from it in the first place. And if people start losing their income, big deal, I don't use this site for profit like other people. I just use this site to browse art, submit my crappy pieces once in a blue moon and +fav art that I believe are really, really good and that they took the effort to actually fucking make it. I don't make any income and my art would be better off stolen for profit, so why should I worry?
To be honest, I know the whiteknights are gonna hate on me, call me autistic, say I don't have the right for an opinion because I'm a quote-unquote "troll" and tell me to go kill myself and get off the internet... But I could say the same thing to them. <3
Have a nice day!
Besides, why help them when they should help themselves? At least getting a part-time job will get them a good income.
Now I see why your mommy hates you.
Nobody cares about you either, unenployed autistic.
And if you're attacking one person with autism, you are actually attacking the 63 million people with autism. Including 58% of the people you're 'defending'.
A majority of prople with autism are, guess what? Furries. <3
You lose this battle.
You win nothing, even if you pretend to be hardcore and "le master trole" irl you are a loser who gets bullied on a daily basis for being autistic. Karma is a bitch, isn't it? :^)
Those artists who I deffend are productive members of society, unlike you who is just a pathetic cockroach trying to mock people and failing at it.
Doing a good job at "trolling" if you're still mad. Besides, I didn't say I didn't give a damn about artists, you just assumed. I just said that I just find it funny that people get mad over such a sensitive subject. And the fact you're still trying to use autism as a joke, as well as AIDS and 'retarded' people is just as funny because you claim that I have no life when you're sat behind a keyboard trying to win an argument that you lost the moment you started name-calling. I have actually kept my calm during this battle since I could end this bout once and for all with a block and be the bigger man, which you refuse to be since you're just an 11 year old child who doesn't understand the concept of 'don't feed the troll'.
And are you sure I'm 'a loser who gets bullied on a daily basis for being autistic'? We British people are far more different from you racist and obnoxious kinds of Americans (Singling a few people out since I have American friends). I play dodgeball every Friday and participate in team tournaments with my friends in college, while learning Performing Arts, Science and Art & Design, all of which are Cambridge Technical Certificates (CTEC) Level 2.
And the artists who you are defending are yourself and yourself, because nobody asked for your inexistent help. All you've done is get up on your high horse and start bitching, complaining and crying to everyone who so long as mentions the word 'dildo' as if your asshole was too tight for one, and had to apply lube.
*Ahem* Now, all that aside, I rest my case. And if you TL;DR, I immediately win this case because you are too much of a little chicken to read the fine print in this comment. Good day.
With such a profile you are utterly useless to the problem here discussed. Although, it is my duty to humilliate you and make fun of you in order to defend people from your shitposting.
You might say you have a cool life now, but I know those are just lies, you hate everyone because you are an autistic who gets bullied on a daily basis, and you are here in a pathetic attempt to take vengeance against furries because irl you are too much of a coward to actually fight your bullies.
Im just calling you scum because you have demonstrated to be. Enjoy your autism.
-Shut the fuck up you ignorant little douch nozzle
-Go eat a bag of dicks
-Slam your head into the keyboard until you pass out
-Stop being a internet tough guy.
Follow those four steps and stop making everyone else look bad. Or you can reply to this and we can rant all day.
+1, dude, +1.
> Doesn't capitalize
Retard/10
> Calls me a retard
> Has a crayon drawing of Cleo from Clifford XXX
> Calls himself an artist
https://malayaraya.files.wordpress......job-retard.jpg
Now, I'll go back to my manchild stuff and watch Futurama with my hand down my pants. Toodle-oo!
But now it backfired and now we all know you are a sad sad lonely autistic who gets bullied and even is hated by his mommy.
Poor of you.
Do you like movies directed by Steven Spielberg? He's autistic.
And the_randomnizer: learn to read, I never adressed you in any post, all I'm doing is teaching this two brats to have some respect to the furry community whose way of life is now in danger.
You refuse to listen to reason from anyone and don't respect what anyone else has to say but your own, because you believe the world revolves around you and you lose your shit if someone says something that remotely disagrees with your opinion. <3
And to be honest, all three of us are a part of the furry community too, so your remark is completely hypocritical.
(Even though he's my favourite Futurama character xD)
Say whatever you want manchild, Ill stay here and deffend my people from Imvu and pathetic trolls such as you.
Ever take into consideration I've been taking what you say as what it is? A mere joke? I'm still laughing at you.
At least I'm not that cowardly that I resort to unoriginal insults that only 2001 generation kids make.
So much damage control :^)
Besides, at least I can take a joke.
Now if you'll excuse me, a giant dildo is causing problems. Windows is too tight so I need to apply some lube.
Keep crying.
As for that drawing, lol, its a free request I did for someone when I bought my first tablet two years ago. I keep it there for being my first tablet drawing, even when this is not my real FA account.
Its not like Im in love with those childhood characters like you :^)
Now if you want me to stop calling you a manchild, stop behaving like a child, and apologise to all the artists you mocked today with your infantile behavior.
Now, this is why you are a loser, at life. You can say whatever you want of me, but you know you are an immature manchild and thats why you fail at being a human being. Because you have disrespectd all your fellow furry artists when they did nothing wrong to you.
Night night Clifford. :3
What I said is my own personal opinion
I'm right with what I have said about my life.
That damn cake has been damned forever D:
Mreeehhhh! >Ao
I came to this site in 2013/2014 to shat and have some fun with other users and not worry about submitting art in here.
With a profile like yours, on the other hand, I suspect you're merely here for all the Renamon pics.
You assume what I say are lies, but spend a day with me, most preferably a Friday, and see that I do actually play dodgeball. Not much of a thrower, but I make up for that in catching the ball.
And to be honest, you're failing to humiliate me as much as I am succeeding to humiliate you because I have a whole Skype group laughing at you, which consists of about 12 people including myself.
Sure, I said I hate humanity, but that doesn't mean I respect those who deserve it. And from how bad your first impressions are, you don't deserve respect. I'm actually not too much of a coward to fight my bullies because I have actually insulted them AND their families, withstood a hell of a beating and walked out of it, with a few bruises and whatever, but nothing serious. What do you do that's so great?
Enjoy your ADHD, since that's what I'm assuming you have to still be replying.
no seirously I hate pretty much everyone.
(Also you will be autistic the rest of your life, lol)
Because not even a Full Restore will cure that Burn.
I was actually born in 1997. :3
I tip my hat in respect a llittle for the timing though.
I completely agree with you since Steven Spielberd is autistic, and I think even Albert Einstein was (I'm not sure if I've done my research on such a subject).
God I fail so hard XD
But to be honest I've been trying my best to get quote unquote real jobs that actually pay me regularly, but despite all the applications and phone calls and resumes and coverletters I've never even been in for an interview. Rotten luck I suppose. That's not to say I don't have experience or education as I've worked two summers thanks to an employment program, and managed 2 courses of AP English in High School.
But eh enough about my life story what I'm trying to say I guess is that even though this is a little trickle, I need every penny. ;_; Transportation went up.
Hopefully you'll be able to manage with what you're able to get, eh?
I've been saving my money up from allowance since I'm too lazy to go out and actually apply for a part-time job. Though I'm figuring in doing something like helping my friend's grandmother's shop.
That's great! I save my money in my paypal because it takes a while to move it into my bank and I dont shop online often so there's little risk for impulse buys :) That could be nice! You could put that on a resume (or you could be lazy and just ask you friend's grandma to say that you worked in their shop, like all my friends do) xD
At least your commissioners will always be able to stick by you no matter what! They do this because you're an amazing artist and that you have your needs!
Hahah, it's more of putting price tags on things and whatever. XD
"Sure, I'd love something!",
"No thanks, I don't have any money."
Or
"I don't even know you!"
Maybe I'm misinterpreting this line: "but at least people will be making a profit from other people's works when they couldn't get profits from it in the first place."
That's.....really infuruiating, honestly. So many of us artists have proven time and time again that we CAN "get profits in the first place." No, other people should not be taking profits that rightfully belong to us.
I also saw later down the line you mentioned this: "Besides, why help them when they should help themselves? At least getting a part-time job will get them a good income. "
I'd argue that most of us DO have part-time, even bordering on full time jobs in addition to taking commissions! Hell, I make MORE money doing art lately than I do in my part time job and it's seriously got me considering quitting in the near future as I sometimes end up working 50+ hours weekly due to the extra work I take on FuraAffinity.
Please try not to be one of those people who doesn't think doing art is a "real job." I work 8-10 hours on art every day of the weekend alone, and that doesn't count figuring out my own prices, setting my own work schedule, corresponding with clients, keeping products I need in stock, keeping a queue updated and organizing client information, figuring out my own taxes, and so, so much more. Just because you can draw doesn't mean that you're any good at business, and I'd argue that most of us can't afford to hire a secretary. :P When you add all of those factors in, it's definitely something I'd consider to be a job; it just happens to be something I enjoy as well.
Please have a heart and understand what you say is very hurtful to those of us that do rely on, or love doing commissions for pay. There are also quite a few of us that don't charge that much. But understand that art is not something you need...but something that is enjoyed and people want to buy. Those more popular artist have higher rates because they are in demand and art is mostly their full income now...as it paid more then a "REAL JOB."
Please keep in mind also...that the art you are faving...the art you are here for...someone either took time to make...or most people paid for...if that dies...you don't have much to fave anymore. It is a double standard there buddy. Please understand both sides and don't take this as me attacking...just showing some points from the other side.
I do believe that being an artist is a 'real job' but I was thinking at least having something in the past time, when you have a massive art block. And in all honesty, I agree with the other person who replied. There should be a +1 or Like button for these kinds of comments, as you politely gave a response compared to the others here. And I solemnly thank you for that.
OR
IMVU can give every CONFIRMED artist on FA a free adult account so they can hunt down their work in the shops.
there should be a team set aside to help artists with their stolen works. not just some extras off an admin team making artists jump through a shitton of hoops.
http://www.furaffinity.net/gallery/fleshy/
Doing DMCA's with IMVU is actually rather easy, and it costs nothing but maybe five minutes of your time. I've been doing DMCA's with them for three or four years now without any issues. You do not need to be a registered user to do it, like others claim. Non-US residents can also do it. You don't even need a lawyer. I copy-pasted my own DMCA form that I use here: https://forums.furaffinity.net/thre.....cussion/page31 Feel free to use it.
It sucks they don't provide an easier way, developers/artists on IMVU have been begging for a better theft reporting system for god knows how long. But right now it is the -only- way. If you see your art and want it taken down, file a DMCA.
also, nearly every other site out there that deals with art needs nothing more than an original link/files predating the repost.
The DMCA form I provided takes less than five minutes for me to fill out. All I do is change the date, update the link to my original submission, and the link to the thief's copy. Click, done.
So, once again, IMVU is making money money and the only way to stop them is to spend:
1) Your time, so you can familiarize yourself with the DMCA form and give up your pseudonymity; or,
2) Your money by hiring an agent, someone willing to do the paperwork and scan through the massive heap of stolen art, trying to organize who did what, who had rights to it, and if I'm an agent of said person.
All the while, the people caught can just open up a new store front and go back into business!
So, don't get me wrong, if it wasn't for the fact that I'd be harming the only part I actually care about in this mess and taking from my own community, this would be a fine business model. I mean, you can't get more secure in your work than this job; the theft is that easy, common, and rampant that I have to believe it'd regenerate just slightly slower than the speed at which people cleared it.
c.c Really not a business model I'd be keen to employ, though. It'd be accepting the role of a reverse Robin Hood, and that's just not the person I want to be in life.
Still, though! Imagine if you could get IMVU to pay, say, a nickel for each infringement to the agent who did the filling and a quarter to the artist who was wrong; that'd add up. It isn't even close to even for the artist, but IMVU really ought to be the ones compensating /someone/ for tracking, filing, and handling each infringement one at a time.
:P ..but I'm probably living in a dream world, but it's something that'd be awesome to arrange between the sites nonetheless.
equally to never happen would be if IMVU just paid the artists to allow specific pics to be used as posters or whatever in their game. like, a percentage per time the item is bought.
Here’s the thing, though. There are rules when it comes to gaining Safe Harbor protections. You have to have a system in place that actively tries to weed out fraud and abuse; you cannot sit there and be all “Golly gee, this high quality art is being claimed by five different users. None of which are over the age of 17, yet the image is dated 2010! That sure is funny, but okay!”
However, the system that IMVU has in place, where rewards are given to people performing the peer review regardless of what they vote is a system that is blatantly defective. If a user can click “Yes” just as fast as they can each and every time, rushing through a stream of votes to get as many credits as they can accumulate, then there is no incentive to do a good job. In fact, the incentive is to just vote blindly, swiftly, and often! That by itself could be called shortsighted in design, though. I mean, people are bad at designing reward systems, maybe this is just an accident?
Except that IMVU is profiting from this system. That profit is the very reason they can afford to incentivize users to swiftly and blindly vote on the review. The fact that users buying things are using IMVU credits rather than cash gives IMVU a share both on the conversion from cash to credits and whatever their cut is of purchases.
The fact that IMVU is pocketing a profit on both ends of the transaction makes for a somewhat compelling case that this system is intentionally designed to act as a sort of fig leaf. It is a system put in place, as far as I can tell from my view, which does just enough that when paired with the DMCA to show that they are acting against infringement to qualify as a Safe Harbor. Honestly, though, I feel as this to be debatable; but I am not an expert in such matters, nor have I the funding to hire a lawyer to argue the case for me. Nevertheless, to me, it seems as IMVU has made a sort of kangaroo court of a review process that it excuses them from liability while allowing them to benefit from transaction.
The fact that artists of adult work have to pay for access so that they may get the information necessary to file a DMCA request is an ironic and likely unintentional bonus; it is the icing on their cash flow cake, the cherry on the sundae that makes everything so deliciously contemptible.
Remember how YouTube used to let people upload just about anything? And how YouTube later got sued for a $1Billion by Viacom? They did not have sufficient systems in place to prevent fraud and appeared to be benefiting from the act of infringement. It isn’t quite the same, but I feel as though IMVU is a dressed up variant of the same game, but no one has the funding on hand to pursue the case. (It would not be cheap; I’d expect hundreds of thousands of dollars by the end, all while success would be far from a forgone conclusion. It is just too much content from too many people, most of which are small artists as opposed to network studios accustomed to such filings going against a company that has ever incentive in the world to drag things out until the win by default when our side exhausts its funding. ..but again, that’s just my view; again, I am not an expert and I could be wrong.)
The idea of this 'voting for credits' always sat ill with me, all the way back with GaiaOnline.. it was just stupid. yes, lets mindless spamclick for 2 bits of gold each day. woo....
It does severely piss me off that IMVU will not only buy FA (and lord knows what changes will come with that yet), but then hold artists by the balls and cry 'neener-neener, not only did we buy your site of primary business, but you have to PAY US *JUST* to be able to check and see what art was stolen by our >12-year-old userbase and slapped on our for sale page. fuck you artists, now give us our money, and spend your precious time filling out all those DMCAs that we'll probably ignore for a month then just slap the user on the wrist over. harharhar'
IMVU can afford to be a good business with good business practices, but they refuse to out of selfish greed. I find all companies that do that pretty disgusting. I mean, i know a lot of companies are like this.. but not many blatantly waggle their e-dicks in peoples faces like this.
I mentioned 2010 specifically cause I kinda got lost in that crowd and thought being mean was cool. Ugh x_X
Now the deviation pages are so noisy your art isnt even on center stage anymore.
Dannyman12 has his or her reasons and they should remain as such .
YAY for the worse admin ever!
Dragoneer, if I steal your car because it pleases me you should be happy right? If I follow your own logic :)
Dragoneer will make you an admin of FA.
Fur Affinity is © 2015 IMVU
----
To anybody reading:
If you want placation by IMVU, put some momentum behind insisting IMVU streamlines their `take-down request handling` since the #1 concern seems to be that users of IMVU are snatching works from FA. If you can't even bother to put momentum behind that, what're you even mobbing up for?
----
Its cool if everybody wants to use this journal as a safari to flamebait and troll one another endlessly, further toxifying the community and turning it more and more into tumblr, but if you want to affect change maybe you should stop the witch hunting and ditch the social justice vampires for the sake of actually putting some momentum behind something which will do something positive - like steer IMVU in a helpful direction that makes them somebody you like more as a business.
We can use calm, rational thought and tone to speak with those who have a more direct line with IMVU (Dragoneer and other site admins) in order to help them understand our point on this topic and build up the talking point so that they have a strong case they can make with IMVU if and when the topic is brought up.
With how people are acting in this journal though, I'd be tempted to just leave and let everybody burn themselves out to the point of leaving if it didn't mean that those people would be chasing the sane people off as well.
Need a like button lol
I wonder how many soulds IMVU did catch in all the years, Neers Soul whas sure one of the bigger ones
*calins*
the community is throwing itself into a fit, not neer or the mods
http://s11.postimg.org/57y5n022r/origin.png =====Original tweet from a poster
http://s11.postimg.org/doxnxx6rn/Capture.png ======= his response
The fact of just annoying us and with him being in so much of a bubble infuriates me
" I choose FA because of the staff"
Also remember what happened with project Pheanox when they said who was head .
Hell, I've never even seen anything positive from the guy myself. This IMVU bullshit also isn't positive.
I'm going to have to watermark ALL my submissions now... *sigh*
wasting time on people that isnt even in a mood to discuss or reason is a waste of time for anyone, really
if you really cared for the site what are you doing? Other than sitting here responding to everyones posts hoping that ridicule and repeating yourself over and over again will verify your thoughts and opinions?
Also you do know he cant even handle a stressfull job to keep the site up so he sold it to IMVU to have a more simpler life . Which in case he can respond to our concerns ( such as like hes doing on twitter goign out to places and the such),
Tho im pretty sure he knows your all upset, im upset too. Not because he sold it, mostly because he didnt tell anyone till now.(stuff like that just isnt cool, yo....) He said in a couple comments saying he wanted to get the site upgraded and then go" BAM all because of IMVU everyone~!" As if that was going to impress and make some people happy. But im sure alot of furs would still be upset for different reasons.
I dont really care if hes a good mod or person
But on a human side of things, Im still going to repeat myself. I personally wouldnt respond to ANY of your comments/PM or other means of communication because your not in a mood or point to discuss or reason.
Not only that, no matter what neer says at this point, would it really make you happy to know EVERYTHING? I have this weird felling it wouldnt, it would only make you more angry and ask more questions.
Right now Neer stuck himself in a spot because of his past history. Where only his actions will change minds and his words will only dig him deeper(as he still is digging himself in on twitter) Just allow him to show you.
Good or bad you have no choice now,
And wow a human wanting a SIMPLER LIFE? You say it like its a bad thing? You must enjoy having all that free time yourself to comment all day?
He works for IMVU. So long as he doesnt fuck up and get fired things should be ok. Its been 2-3 months already and so far nothings changed but banners. So really FA is just as bad off as before *shrugs*
And no he cant respond to your concerns. Cause again, even if he has a whole 24 hours to respond to all of your stuff. He would only dig his hole deaper as you guys tare every word he says apart. Hes AWFUL at choosing his words, or really just is a dick/stupid and doesnt care, no one can really tell. Makes no difference.
If hes really smart about fucking things up like people predict, they need to wait a year when not alot of people are watching. THEN fuck things up. I mean heck he sold the website under our noses, what makes you think he cant do the same with rules and updates? So yeah, if he really does wanna fuck up the site, now is not the time.
Throwing snack packs (pudding cups) against the wall in a fit, inst getting there attention nore is all the other means of communication. Its just making a mess everywhere.
Technically all you can do now is find there phone numbers and start calling them but, then that would be harassment, technically your harassing right now...but not really cause they are choosing to ignore
let it go
its already sold, the papers all ready printed and the signatures are dry with ink
Nothing you can do but scream "This isnt fair" And i would agree it was kinda a dick thing to do
But i dont know his life
i dont know why he does the things he does and for what actual reason. We can assume and even know some things as fact.
We will (as a group) always think something or someone can do somethings better than others. Regardless of whos in the seat
This is his site (disregard the supposed 2nd owner)
If he wanted to deleat the whole place right now he has a right to do that....but now he has to go threw IMVU first haha~!
Just calm yourself, talking to some one solves people problems. But the site is sold, legal documents dont care to be talked to as a person, but rather as another legal document. So unless you got alot of money to make another legal document to counter it, things are going to be, the way there going to be.
Neer doesnt want or need our input
Its his choice, you dont have to like it.
Fuck you.
Fuck. Off.
Just when I thought this couldn't get any fucking worse yet again you pull a dildo out of your hat and ram the fandom right up the fucking ass one more time.
If you're a mod from imvu reading this kindly choke on a fucking cactus you piece of shit.
And for the record, most of you are idiots.
Like I don't mind "premium" services, if it's like dA's as it comes with privileges (like changing your username!) and lil widgets. But if it's "pay 20$ just to access certain types of artwork" is gonna be the stake to the heart that kils FA, as there's many other artsites that allow you to post, and view any kind of content for free :S
give me allllll the dildoes. Shove em up my lil rabbit arse.
Says that if you disagree with him , than flat out should be removed.
"Hey, many FA artists have been finding stolen art in the catalog. If you have any art posted that does not belong to you, best delete it now or face punishment"
I think that they could do a least that much.
http://img.pandawhale.com/post-3827.....e-gif-qJC1.gif
NT ONLY IS HE INCONSIDERATE BUT HE IS ALSO A CHEAP SKATE WTF DRAGONEER
The best we can do is fight for our rights, and if in the end of the day Imvu does not listen to us, then we will have to definitively move to Weasyl.
Again, I'm more in favor of trying to rally the funds necessary to buyout IMVU's position in FA.
However! If Dragoneer comes to his senses and can confess that he wrongfully sold the 50% that didn't belong to him; or that the guy can genuinely prove his position as owning 50%, then I'm happy to do what I can to leverage that to the greatest extent possible.
"Yeah, I see plenty horrid.
I see an admin who waited two months to tell anyone about it.
I see an admin who didn't ask anyone about it before he did.
I see a non-furry business entity looking to tie themselves to the Fandom to make money off of our hard work
I see a non-furry business entity trying to undermine the artists here, treating them like they produce for the sole purpose of IMVU
I see Furries being led to beleive smiling placating garbage spewed out of the mouths of everyone trying to get us to not see the pink elephant in the room.
I see a complete lack of transparency worse than before.
I see an admin who stole 20,000$ from us to settle a personal debt then sold everything without our consent.
I see a Furry site riddled with virus ads.
I see an admin who condones art theft.
I see a bunch of ostriches who can't see whats being done to them." ~Hemmsfox
I mean, it would have been less painful if it was by someone else, but we were stabbed in the back by one of our own kind.
How sad and painful is it?
He does care about those who can amass sums of currency, though, so you know how to garner His favor.
Wryness aside, wouldn't it be great if we could crowdfund or get, say, 20-50 furry investors together and buy FA back? Maybe the betrayal is just setting up a triumph in the next act!
..I mean, it probably isn't, but look, it seems we've got ourselves a story here, right? And if one must make up a story, it may as well be a good one, right? And that's the happiest ending I can write, so if I can nudge people in that direction and kick in some money, that's what I'm going to do until something more promising comes around. (Aside from preparing to migrate from FA to Weasyl, InkBunny, and SoFurry; even Mario had a contingency plan if that Princess rescuing business didn't pan out, after all. It's why he never ditched the plumber's clothes, you know.)
It would be wise for the other sites to play a larger role. I never thought FA was vulnerable to this extent; I never had reason to expect it'd get silently sold.
As a very leak bright side, it is curious to see how Weasyl is trumping over InkBunny as a consequence of philosophical ethics. InkBunny took the position, I believe, that all fiction is permissible; whereas Weasyl went the way of echoing the same rules as FA, by my understanding, so that certain things weren't allowed. Personally, on the level of philosophical ethics, I side with InkBunny, but it seems to have damaged their brand rather severely. Whereas SoFurry seems get overlooked the most, presumably because it never shook the image of being a predominantly writing over drawing oriented site back in the days of it running as YiffStar. In any case, I digress; I merely meant to say it is interesting how things are panning out on those fronts.
Given how easily and swiftly a hub can be taken over, though, I am keen to find ways to mitigate that risk through whatever means possible. By creating user agreements that clearly define how a prospective sale will be handled; by selling/splitting shares sufficiently so that no one has sufficient power to wreck things on the down low; or through some other means. Realistically, though, at the end of the day, you're going to have to trust someone to put the fandom over their economic needs, and there just aren't many people who can deal with that. Plenty who /claim/ they can, but you never really know about that temptation until the siren comes your way, singing her sweet song.
While I like a lot of things about Inkbunny, there's some content that shouldn't allowed on that site, which is why I hold Weasyl in a much higher regard and as my current main gallery.
And I agree with you, you never know what'll become of a site. It's sad to see this one go so badly so quickly. I mean, it was shitty to begin with (let's be honest here), but damn, now? Yikes.
I love that this thread has nearly 3k comments, and NOTHING from IMVU to quell the insanity.
As for IB, I'm told that if you set up your filters to block that sort of content, it is actually quite nice. Unlike here at FA, it seems people over at IB do a good job of using the tagging system, which is the sort of thing that can make all the difference in the world. I haven't spent much time at IB, though, so I can't really speak from experience. I simply agree with the philosophy that all fiction should be allowed; there is plenty here on FA that makes me feel squick, right? I take it upon myself to avoid them, though, rather than putting limits on people's fantasy. (As a general rule, I am wary of drawing such lines; just as soon as you draw a line on what is acceptable and what is not, you open yourself up to all manners of arguments on why it should be somewhere else. If I cannot expect myself to be free from bias, then I shall act in a fashion that protects friend and foe alike by not drawing a line at all.)
I don't expect things to go downhill very fast, actually. If anything, I think it is going to be a slow decline with a long dormancy period. The longer they can keep FA users here, the more invested the users will likely become and the harder it will be to leave. Whereas if they made a radical change in the first year, they would see a migration of some extent. Their smartest move here is to go very slow, at least for the next several months.
Last but not least, IMVU doesn't want to deal with us. I am not sure if it's what Dragoneer signed on for, but right now it seems his primary role is act as a whipping boy for IMVU. So long as everyone keeps going after him, the people in power won't be endangered. To me, it seems that we haven't heard back because everything is going according to plan, not because things are going off the rails.
If you head to the FA Forum, the discussion is already slowing considerably and a fair amount of the posts are just people bickering between users; and things have slowed here as well, though a lot of the earlier stuff was a bit dildo-centric. So long as we keep our focus where we're directed to, and so long as people remain divided, then really puller of strings are able to perform all manners of magical things.
As far as the community, I am a fan of political cartoons, but I doubt they are going to be super effective here. Instead, I’d like to see some manner of campaign launched to accumulate sufficient funds to purchase FA back from IMVU; whether it is a relatively small group of furries or something akin to a GoFundMe campaign, I think that this is the best possible course of action in the immediate sense. Probability of success is low, though, so I wouldn’t get my hopes up on that. (However, political action isn’t lost; if brick and mortar retailers refuse to sell IMVU credits in their stores because IMVU is violating terms by hosting freely available pornography, then that may create an opportunity. Or it might make it so both IMVU and FA crash and burn, but I have to believe they’re wise enough to not let their empire be destroyed because they wanted to “help” FA so much.)
The long game is probably where odds are best for the community to reacquire FA. Perhaps I’m talking out of my ass, but I just don’t see how this investment is supposed to pan out for IMVU in the next three to five years. As is, FA loses money at a significant clip; as is, you cannot make any changes without scaring even more of the community away, thus devaluing the asset; and I see absolutely zero way of getting a paywall for FA up and running, even if it eliminated ads because there would be Weasyl, InkBunny, and SoFurry right there, happy to pick up their share of the fandom market. So, either IMVU realizes that they’ve miscalculated and decide to look to cut their losses and agree to sell; or, IMVU radically alters FA, the community leaves, and once IMVU has drained FA of every easily drained nickel, they may be willing to sell it off, with the money acting as a cherry on top of the fluffy sundae. The real question to me in the long game scenario is if it’ll even be worthwhile by the time the opportunity comes around; and honestly, I won’t even hazard a guess, but right now I feel as though FA is kind of home. It’s silly – in fact, to be honest, it is stupid, but it is what it is. Whether or not I can say the same when 2020 rolls around, though, is a whole other matter.
This is a great moment of pain for all the furry community. The place that during a decade we called a home, is no longer a home, but it's about to get turned into a paid motel.
We have serious concerns about adult art (that represents 70% of the furry art) getting banned, and our concerns fall on deaf ears.
We have serious concerns about Art Theft, and they just redirect us to a legal process, meaning that IMVU does not care.
We have serious concerns about Premium accounts being installed, and we get no certainty beyond empty promises.
Time to turn all this pain into anger and reject their lies. This is our only chance to save ourselves before being squeezed for every penny by Imvu.
Every one just gets pissed but no one actually goes anywhere, which is likely why we keep getting fucked.
http://www.furaffinity.net/view/16084611/
Even if Imvu does not steal, they allow their users to steal so it's the same at the end of the day.
http://imgur.com/a/FTLDL
The submission you are trying to find is not in our database.
[Click here to go back]"
Well how unexpected...
http://imgur.com/a/FTLDL
Actually, that would be pretty sweet now that I think about it. Alas, I estimate a 0% chance of seeing that happening at all, if the deal between IMVU and FA was broken at some point. In short: It's technically impossible.
Am I right?
do u ralize my horse porn will be rposted without credit?
what about my sanic go fast picture with green sanix drawn with yellow dick?/??
UMVU STEELS MY ART NOOOO
BT THTS Srs sEU THM 4 T
The prEN ISNT SAFE ANIMOAR
I'm fucking dead
However, be smart about things and prepare. Save your gallery and any art that you really enjoy here; it may be removed at some point if an artist ditches FA without prior notice. Take note of the artists you are following and track down as many as you can on the alternative hubs for the fandom, namely: Weasyl, InkBunny, and SoFurry. If there is /anything/ that should be taken as a lesson here, it is that FA should NOT be taken for granted.
Always be prepared. It ain’t just for Scouts.
If anything IMVU should be the ones being nervous. Their poor thought out buyout of FA is not going as smoothly as I am sure they hoped. The ball's in our court, and if IMVU doesn't do something soon to tame the tension furries are currently experiencing then this whole deal could in fact go south for them.
and the back-handed condoning of art theft for profit certainly doesn't help matters.
https://forums.furaffinity.net/thre.....38#post5114238
{copy/pasted)
If you're looking for stolen art, the "Wall Hangings" and "Picture Frames" categories in the IMVU catalog is the first place you should look with the keyword "furry." I've taken screenshots of these two categories with the AP (Access Pass) filter on, for those of you from FA who do not have an AP.
If you recognize anything, please contact the artist. If they wish to file a DMCA Takedown Notice, they will need the product link which I can provide (you could also ask any IMVU user with an AP), as well as a larger screenshot of the poster itself in case they aren't sure it's their work.
Picture Frames (32 pages): http://imgur.com/a/oAtuI
Wall Hangings (22 pages): http://imgur.com/a/FTLDL
Info on DMCA here: https://forums.furaffinity.net/thre.....cussion/page31
Ok guys, if they deleted that then it means they dont want people to see that. Let's spread this information like there's no tomorrow!!!
http://imgur.com/a/oAtuI
http://imgur.com/a/oAtuI
http://imgur.com/a/oAtuI
http://imgur.com/a/FTLDL
http://imgur.com/a/FTLDL
http://imgur.com/a/FTLDL
Repeating like a dead horse but ya........he did not look at the website AT ALL
If you guys ever wondered why I acted so agressive against trolls earlier, is because I want people to focus in the problem instead of getting their attention taken by irrelevant situations, that is what Dragoneer wants in order to fuck us all.
I was really hoping to jump into the FA Forum conversation, but it seems the email verification part of the registration system is broken. I've got a ticket out on it, but one wonders how long it has been down and to what extent that has stifled feedback.
Saddest part is, I keep seeing the same argument over and over again, where we ought to wait until things go sideways before we take action. At what point did being proactive stop being an option? For that matter, since when did trying to stymie the losses in an effort to try to turn things around before they got worse start being anything but the best of all possible options, shy of a Ctrl+Z of the situation?
The only hope I really have at this point is that the blow back is enough that it might encourage IMVU to consider an offer made to purchase FA back from a group of fandom investors (that I’d love to be a part of, honestly); or, that whenever things do crash and burn, that we might be able to salvage the wreckage once IMVU has had their fill. That, however, assumes it’ll even be viable when that time comes around; and that is no small assumption, is it?
1) I don't care about denying Dragoneer. He isn't anywhere on my list of objectives here. If he is on your's, that's your business, but if you've competing objectives then you really have to ask yourself which comes first: Saving FA or Punishing Dragoneer?
2) Preaching to the choir. :P I'm rallying for save FA, but I'll be damned if I play a role in IMVU's corruption of FA.
But it would look so 'furrific'!
Their unique thing is they color their plates to indicate a price tier. Orange is the 3 dollar tier.
https://twitter.com/Dragoneer/statu.....20783133593600
When are we going to demand this!
Two days of silence from Dragoneer.... IMVU is doing major damage control at this point.
http://www.worthofweb.com/website-v.....uraffinity.net
I can't fathom it being even 10% of that. To get the profit necessary to command that price, the site would have to change so radically that it would devalue itself because the majority of the active user base would flee.
FA, to my knowledge, hasn't turned a profit; and I certainly can't imagine changes that would make it radically profitable without chasing everyone to free alternatives.
Right now, the only thing keeping FA as the main hub is inertia and sentimentality. If everyone got a firm shove out the door, Weasyl and InkBunny would pick up the bulk, with SoFurry coming in a distant third. I don't think anyone would be the de facto hub initially, but that's probably for the better. Once more, though, I digress.
That would have been the best option. It is my understanding that one group /did/ offer Dragoneer $50,000 to buy it. That was the offer that should have been taken; Dragoneer would continue to have outsize control, but the risk would have been spread out enough that nothing like this could’ve happened. However, for reasons unexplained, other than saying it wasn’t near enough money, this offer was not taken up nor, to my knowledge, given a chance to counter IMVU’s offer. (Ironic, given that IMVU strips Dragoneer of all actual power; he might be Leader of FA or whatever the title is, but FA is /owned/ by others. He is the instrument of their will now, and for that he is paid but the big decisions are out of his hands.)
FA should be a community of furries that itself is owned by furries for the good of the fandom, not as means for an economic end or to boost anyone’s ego or credentials. Furry owned; furry ran; furry forever.
Given the amounts the fundraiser was able to draw in, I believe this model /is/ sustainable if done well; then again, I haven’t anywhere near enough details to say that definitively, but I have little doubt that FA would be better served being owned by members of the community than it would be by IMVU, Second Life/Linden Labs, or any other non-furry entity.
I saw so many "i stay" journals that i could throw up, sadly alot furs are pretty NOT Smart...
I don't turn tail at the first sight of trouble. This is home and I'm keen to fight for it.
That said, if I can't get FA back into fandom hands and IMVU starts mucking things up, I'm bailing.
As for artists, a lot can't just up and leave; it isn't that simple. You have to get commissions to pay your bills, and you can't get commissions if you're pitching to a crowd half the size that isn't half as active. They can branch out -- and I strongly encourage them to do so -- but ditching FA means not making a car payment, and I'm not faulting people for dodging that bullet.
Also, optimists. What can you do? :P That's why I'm telling everyone to be ready to go; save your stuff, find your artists anywhere else you can find them, and simply be prepared.
To be fair, FA is a lot of work and I have zero doubt whatsoever I'd've made blunders, that's why I am a huge proponent of keeping a board of owners. Spread the risk so no one is so powerful that they can dictate the direction or wreck things on their lonesome.
As for management, there's this bit of advice that's kind of handy: If you ever find yourself in a leadership position facing a problem you think is out of your ability, take a look around you. Is there anyone who can do it better? Not someone a thousand miles away, not someone from another time; right then, right there, facing that problem, is there anyone else who is better suited to lead? If not, then you rally and do everything you can to succeed; if so, then it is your duty to pass the baton and back that person to the very best of your abilities.
Some people never learn that and never want to take the lead because they know someone, somewhere is more qualified; some people never learn it and never pass the baton. Either way will cause problems.
If we ever do get FA back, I hope to hell the people in charge learn that lesson. Ego takes a backseat to objective completion, always.
In short, though, that motivation doesn't make oodles of sense to me given that he doesn't have a whole lot of power now -- and he's earned the disdain of many along the way, so at the very least its a bit of a Faustian bargain if true.
Plz look at this you have to roll down a bit
Not to mention there is a complete conflict between how extremely strict IMVU is about keeping everything PG and how relaxed FurAffinity is about almost everything. With that in mind, I am not sure how IMVU is going to attract FA furs over to their site.
Then there is the issue of how most FA furs are used to how SL furry avatars look and find most IMVU furry avatars repulsive. While IMVU has a lot of furry texture artists, it lacks a lot of 3D furry modelers. Which actually brings up another major issue. It is relatively simple to import meshes and models into SL, but on IMVU you have to go through a convoluted series of steps that requires you to either use older versions of Blender or an even older version of 3ds Max to be able to import meshes properly. To make matters worse they don't even have a way to import meshes from Maya. So Maya support is non-existent.
Actually I should stop thinking about this so deeply, it is giving me a headache. The more I think about it the more I realize just how poorly thought out this buyout was. IMVU wants members from FA, but what on earth can IMVU offer that FA furs don't already have? Don't get me wrong, I would absolutely love to be able to mingle with you all on IMVU, but we have to be realistic here.
Dragoneer : Hey guyz wassup. Here are IMVU Lanyards that I may have masturbated on with your donation money 8D
I'd be curious and keen as all hell to get him to a table, ply him with liquor, and ask questions. Not about how much he got for FA (well, that /might/ come up), but so that I could understand what he was thinking. How did he come to this decision, how did IMVU seem like the best possible choice?
Look, I know lots of folk are saying it was greed and/or stupidity, but stories are rarely that simple. Evil doesn't exist and motivations are complex; and this is the sort of situation where I'd love to grok a perspective so fundamentally contrary to mine.
I mean, for all my frustration, anger, angst, and fear that's resulted, my first instinct would be to try to understand the story, the narrative, the perspective, the chain of events from his view that makes this all make sense.
Besides, being upset with him doesn't buy me anything; it seems that what's done is done. The least I could do is learn as much as I possibly can from the experience.
I would probably skip taking a lanyard, though. I'd rather not get a pearl necklace by proxy, right? :P Hate things around my neck, anyway.
..seriously, though, aren't you curious?
Evil, as a motivation, as a reason for action and an end unto itself, is the laziest explanation possible for complicated happenings that society would do well to at least try to understand. It is little different than answering every “Why..?” with “God did it!” Hitler wasn’t Hitler because he was evil. Hitler was Hitler because he was a sociopath that lusted for power. Custer wasn’t Custer because he was evil; Custer was Custer because crushing your adversary is how you made a name for yourself. Do you truly think that Custer would pull his boots on in the morning and jazz himself up for all the evildoing he was going to do? In his time, in his understanding of the world and its demands along with his moral universe, he believed himself to not be the villain.
I resist the urge to oversimplify or assume that the reasons for another person’s actions are so simply described by such a rudimentary concept. Even if the actor’s inner narrative doesn’t mesh with objective reality there is something to be gained in understanding how the actor comes to believe how their actions are going to yield results, particularly when there are flaws in their system.
A brief example:
Say that Hitler was a car and his sociopathic mind is the engine; and let us say that I would like to understand how the thing, this particularly heinous example of mechanical engineering works so that I repair it, or at least try to influence the design of similar engines down the line so that they do not act in the same destructive manner.
I could pop up the hood, cluck my tongue, and call it a day saying, “Man, it’s a Hitler, of course it’s going to be messed up! Oh well, nothing to be done; it’s just evil!”
Or I could dissect everything and try to tease out why it runs precisely the way it does; to try to glean any understanding from why that particular engine is operating in such a destructive fashion; and, by so doing, to maybe, just maybe, be able to help make sure motors like this here Hitler never again leave the factory in such awful condition.
In short, it’s very difficult to effect a thing if you haven’t a clue how it works; and if you run around the world simplifying everything to Disney-esque motivations, then you may as well resign yourself to the fact your efforts to influence anything around you is going to be about as successful as Hitler was with that whole Thousand Year Reich business.
People may do terrible things, but their reasons, motivations, and aspirations in life tend to be somewhat more complex than evil for the sake of evil.
dragons
dollar yens
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6seKIOHbs4E
Meh, pretty much my thoughts on the matter.
oh yeah picture included:: http://www.quickmeme.com/img/55/556.....84f5407295.jpg
Fur Affinity, our stolen home, please do not let your screams of anger get muffled in the dust of abandon. My furry brothers and sisters, lest not forget thwt this time it is no Drwgoneer being an incompetent admin, but this is atime when he is directly threatening our culture AND our economy.
This time, he sold us to a company thwt allows massive amounts of art theft as a medium to obtain illegal money.
He sold us to a company that THINKS that a furry is merely a human with ears and a creepy rat-like appendage for muzzle.
He sold us to a company that despises the mature content, so essential in our artworks.
He sold us to a company known to charge even for the privilege of breathing.
We can not forget. We can not forgive. Dragoneer thinks that after w few days everyone wil cool down and forget what happened.
Oh beloved Fur Affinity, do not forget your rage, let it rise and fly once again to the freedom that Dragoneer stole from you!
Furries, resist! RESIST!!!!
All above is allegory and just rage speaking i do not directly condone violence, but i wouldnt mind seeing some form of.. "heated retaliation" from us furs. i think we should rebel to the last fur!!!
on a side note: Penis Cake
http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/6588405/
https://twitter.com/Dragoneer/statu.....00165376385025
Its unfortunate that this had to happen at all, they should be protecting the rights of the creator not the rights of the thief. yet the thief and IMVU are coming out on top. Every sale lines IMVU's pockets. they get a little bit of profit from every sell, they get the profit from people having to buy the credits to buy the stolen items and they get to profit on it till a DMCA makes it through the long filing process. Till now there were no issues, because no one knew IMVU even existed, and those that did never really spread the word around they were on it. Nothing wrong with being there and making friends that you enjoy talking to the ones at fault here is the corporation, the Thief, and the inspection team letting this ***t slide through unscathed. Even though most of the stuff still has watermarks on all the images.
In my journal I also link to a journal by another person who has more detailed information about filing a DMCA
http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/6602452/
At most they might say the DMCA isn't proper form, which you just have to correct yourself.
I think most of the people who are saying "IMVU ignored me!" did not actually file a DMCA and were attempting to contact IMVU through a help ticket or simple flagging.
You are correct though, if a DMCA is ignored, you could take IMVU to court.
http://i.imgur.com/md5jjxj.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/md5jjxj.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/md5jjxj.jpg
This is Evidence Evidence Evidence v.s. Dragoneer's False and uncaring promises of "nah everything is awwight, also im taking care of things, i dun need to explain anything anyways lol"
Since the anouncement of FA's selling, he has offered ZERO solid information to grant safety to artists and users, all he does is evade questions and give vague answers, we all know them, he just repeats the same useless rhetoric over and over again with no real solutions and no solid information.
Theses scat eaters
Whenever someone complains about this whole situation or tries to make a conversation on this issue, he just diverges the attention and subverts the question trying to avoid the problem.
While he is technically right that this isn't "IMVU's fault" because it isn't them specifically stealing art, it's their users' fault, pointing to that fact instead of actually reassuring users/artists or even giving a direct answer is the most shady and unprofessional way to answer.
Even if it isn't the company itself that is doing this, it's the company that is hosting and allowing this to happen.
It is the company that is getting money for the hard work of people here on this website.
Therefore since they decided to own this website now, it is questionable how they are handling an issue on their sister site.
We were told that all that IMVU wanted was ad space here on this website, yet they are getting money from the art theft anyway and artists aren't seeing a dime.
You can see how people might be suspicious or even mad at this whole buy out.
This is being handled terribly. By the answers on Twitter, Neer seems to have not even read the info that is on this very journal (not it's comments), yet he still tries to answers people with info he does not have.
Please, all I ask is for the administration of THIS website to be more concise, clear and stop answering users condescendingly, avoiding the issue at hand or with distraction tactics.
We deserve at least to hear an honest opinion and the stand of the staff on this issue.
Thank you.
It's official, he takes us for idiots.
"Any how, this entire thing hit the shitter. I also urge those whom have found their art stolen to call their customer support and demand to talk to a higher up if you get the run around. Their toll-free (in the US) telephone number is: 866-761-0975. The only local number I could find is 650-646-3244
But this entire situation is depressing. IMVU is one of the worst kinds of business models. To hand over a majority of where the fandom hung out online, to a thing like them.... Dragoneer... You pretty much slapped the entire community in the face, along with throwing away the last bit of self respect you had for yourself. You had other offers from community base to take over the site, to buy it, and support it and instead you turned around and 'sold it' for money in your pocket, and basically lifted both of your hands happily and flipped every single one off, and basically told us to go fuck our selfs with a smile on your face. So long as you made a buck right? Wouldn't surprise me to see FAU suffer in the end as well. Let alone all the piss ass angry people you'll need to deal with come convention time.
Your ethics are in question for sure. You wanted to cling onto the top title so badly, you no doubt listed in your contract you cannot be fired or something, that you remain in charge of FA, etc or some BS like that. The fact that there's this "NDA" that your also hiding behind smells like a load. You lied to us over and over, again and again. You say one thing, then do another. Sure, you've done a lot of good for the site and community but you've also done some bad. But nothing you've done so far can top this. This is bottom of the barrel. You promptly pulled down your pants, puckered up your asshole and took a proverbial shit in our cheerios.
You see the backlash, the outcry of pretty much most of FA raging against this. This is why you never mentioned it, this is why you not once brought it up to the public. More than likely a massive group of people would have gotten together, [in fact some had] to buy out FA and keep it within the fandom. But nah, you said "Fuck dat shit bro, i want to stay on top AND get paid, and hella cash!"
You made the comment that you didn't get money, or you want to brakes for your car. Bro... don't lie to us. You have plenty of money now after that sale, and plenty more from the donations. Th fact you keep avoiding things, aren't being transparent. It's insulting to any one of us with even the most basic of intelligence. You don't sell something and not turn a profit, you don't sell something and get nothing in return. And if you even try, even TRY and say "It was for the community to keep the site going".
Then you need to take a breather and seriously stop and look at things, and what you've done. Because this isn't the sort of situation you can go "oops... MY BAD" and walk away from.
We've been outcrying, outcrying I tell you. For answers to the most commonly asked questions and all you've done thus far is avoid them. You cheery pick things to respond to as well.
At least give us some honesty man, that's all we've been crying out for.
Also what happens if that guy who claims 50% of the site as his, ends up coming forth with evidence that he does in fact own 50%? What happens then?
Also my apologizes for this anger rant. But this entire situation has me upset. FA was one of very few places where I could feel like I could be ME and post my art, and feel safe about it. Now that feeling is gone."
I swear, this has to be written out in old school ink quill calligraphy and framed somewhere.
apollisoffa
Lone Wolf
A large one, especially from those whom I've been in contact with who have been keeping records of their dealings with IMVU after having filed their DMCA's and have still yet to see anything done. Also even if there is a DMCA, there are still laws protecting copy right material, and other sales laws that need to abide here in the U.S for damages. But it requires a court. Which I'm more than willing to do. I have the time, and I have the money. Had I known Neer was trying to sell the site off, I would have offered to purchase it, and bring in community investors. Sure, there would be Ad's and stuff like that, which I know a lot of people would dislike. But they would be legitimate adds. Mostly fur based. Of course with a few other ad's for like car's maybe, or soda, things like that. Food products!
But that would be going towards upkeep. Also maybe a bit of profit for the investors of course in the long run, but that's about it.
JUST WARNING AT THIS POINT
It's reaching "thanks, Obama" levels of hypocritic ridiculousness.
The real problem will come to surface when the normal clients of Imvu (a population that largely consists of 14 year old children) and their families notice that the company is pretending to merge their community with this literal hole of pornography.
Right now they promise that they will not touch anything. But they refuse to show the contract, so we cant really trust their promises. It wouldn't be the first time that Dragoneer deceived us all.
IMVU, in order to protect themselves from what is obviously going to come, will have to insert restrictions to the adult content. Perhaps a Premium membership or just plainly banning adult art.
You ask people to think, right? Well, let's do some simple math. I know artists are scared of math but I promise this is mere arithmetic.
Dragoneer claims that IMVU bought the site for 20,000 dollars with the sole and only purpose of getting money from furries getting into Imvu and the ads. However, they could have obtained THE SAME effect by simply buying Ad space, whose cost is only 1/20 of what they paid for the site.
I don't know any company willing to loose money like that, if they are investing not only in what they paid but in a team of programmers, then it would be IRRATIONAL to think that they only expect to get in return the meager gain of Ads and furries getting into Imvu. That would not even cover the original investment!
You asked me to think, here are my thoughts. Hope arithmethic does not scare you.
This protest is an act of rationality, not a mere "jump into a bandwagon".
You're making some pretty heavy assumptions based on a single short comment.
Alright, so, I read a comment and clicked the link, and that gave me an idea. We should create a music video. An angry, protesty video. I'm being really serious about it too. I do not know how to pull this off, exactly, but I do know we'll have to send in audio files to someone who'll know how to put the music and video together. What do you guys think? If you're up to making a music video, and would like to help, awesome!
the other issue is with, the fact that Varsha went to a GA site in IMVU and posted a link telling everyone to check out the great site they just purchased, In a room full of kids and adults, one said adult came over to check it out and to her surprise she was bombarded with XXX rated artwork. this was really a dumb move, it has created a serious problem because parents and adults are going to be in an uproar that there kids are exposed to SMut which will now force IMVU to step in and start putting up higher restrictions on FA. It was a really dumb move but whats done is done.
[QUOTE]Varsha would post the direct link to this site in the GA forum, knowing full well it's intended average product base. Over and over I read of how much smut and pornography is posted on this site. IMVU also discontinued use of any UFI product because they could then not advertise their gift cards in the likes of Wal-Mart and such. They wish to be seen as family friendly and by acquiring this site makes us question them now.]
this was posted in the forums by the adult that came here to see what site was bought by IMVU.
"Because dwelling on the past on what could have been is SO much more productive, as is holding grudges, spreading rumors and being forever bitter about mistakes. Okay. Learning from the past, yes, living in the past, no. We get it, people are mad, no shit, but that is no reason to keep dragging and dragging and dragging. People can't hold grudges forever, it's asinine." ~ krystalfox77
Oh, Excuse me! I'm sorry I can't find it easy to forgive a consistent liar, power abuser and scum bag. Its just like with a corrupt politician. And this comment is saying i should just forget about what the fuckers done and just hope they do better cause gods forbid living in the past is wrong. Holding grudges is how you learn from the past.
lets not forget what Tchellin has stated, this is just the tip of the iceberg, when the parents of the 12-14 year olds discover that IMVU just bought a Porn site. It is considered a porn site lets not fool ourselves, and believe that just because we have some clean art we are not all porn. The simple truth is Paypal one of the largest money brokers on the net Lists Furaffinity as a porn site and bans all Accounts that are caught buy and selling items from Furaffinity. this means that if Paypal lists us as a porn site we are considered a Porn. It does not matter the G rated art is created and sold there, the sites demographic is indeed XXX. this stands for everything IMVU is not and after Varsha Posted a link to FA in a G rated site basically full of children and some adults it put a ugly stain on this whole deal even more. the parents are going to be pissed and if they find out they are going to ban their kids from using IMVU which will then cause IMVU to have to take some very drastic measures.
Varsha would post the direct link to this site in the GA forum, knowing full well it's intended average product base. Over and over I read of how much smut and pornography is posted on this site. IMVU also discontinued use of any UFI product because they could then not advertise their gift cards in the likes of Wal-Mart and such. They wish to be seen as family friendly and by acquiring this site makes us question them now.
Case in point this Quote from Moonrivers who was a IMVU user that is also an adult that was in the room during the announcement. She had no idea what she was getting into when she logged in to see what site IMVU had purchased and was instantly bombarded with Adult content. I am sure you all know she was less then happy to see this, not to mention have Varsha announce this in a GA rated part of IMVU. This one event could trigger a back lash like no tomorrow. Nothing is resolved at this point. Because they may have to legally start implementing tougher restrictions on the site because of that one event.
What Varsh did was totally uncalled for and it brought to light what they were really buying into. It may force IMVUs hands to become tied and they will have to put stricter rules on FA or maybe even Paywalls to quell the Rage that is going to back lash from this rather careless move.
Don't support IMVU and their ways! Its not a question of drama or etc. Its do you respect your work and other people's? Do you respect yourself as an artist enough to support them? You people don't deserve one ounce of this abuse. You shouldn't take it laying down either. They hope this blows over in a week and you all forget. Don't let them push your concerns under the rug. That's not respecting you or your favorite artists. Don't make your favorite artists dependent on such a disrespectful site. They stay because of you (buyers, viewers, fans.) I wouldn't be surprised if they always wanted to leave.
Well that's how I see it all. I thought before this mess I'd move in and start up a profile. Now I'm just disappointed to be even supporting blatant theft with this account. Even theft that's protected by the way the sites works. Its sickening. Truely. I don't need much else , ignoring everything else. I don't want to support this, there good honest artists being ripped off and most of them can't do much about it.
Fade out, migrate! Even if its slow! Just slowly move to other sites. People will follow and many already are! Don't let them tell you they aren't! Don't support this madness and disrespect.
Sorry I'm just a sniffling mess and emotional. I came to this site thinking of all the furries I met. Kind loving and accepting people. Their love just being abused and it just hurts. Its good to know their are people fighting back ^^. Thank You, honestly. ^^
This is what I am after. I want to buy FA back; I want to work toward this end.
Dilute enough power that no one can wreck things overnight; but not so dilute that action is hard to take whenever decisions have to be made.
I'm also convinced that a Wikipedia-style donation drive would be very successful at raising enough money to keep FA running, especially after this who affair is fresh in everyone's minds. FA /has/ to be be sustainable. I'm not looking to invest for profit here and if dividends were paid, I'd be putting it right back into FA. I can't rightly ask for donations if I'm not willing to donate myself, right?
I just don't know who I need to be talking to in order to further this goal, but I am absolutely in.
If a Question comment or concern can not be addressed, due to time constraints, then the ones that still had questions can write them down and deposit them on a Suggestion, Complaints, or question Chat string. The Board members can go through them after the meeting and see what the community members, that did not get their questions in, wanted to ask or say. This alleviates a nightmare of Butt hurt feelings. The Board can go through them and address those issues and make notes of the ones that they will discuss in the next meeting.
This Brings the community together it gives them a voice and allows the Board to know what they are doing right and wrong. It also allows them to see what the community wants as a whole and work towards those goals. this is how a community should ALWAYS be run. The community should always feel they have a say in what is going on.
Simply leaving because they don't like what's going down would essentially be financial suicide.
You can check and compare traffic on other pages and see why we prefer FA over other art sites to get our income.
Fortunately I have my loyal customers on skype and i know they can contact me there if anything happens, but for new commissioners, in my experience, 99% of them came from FA. the other 1% came from a MMORPG, not even another art site XD
What i get on other art sites is mostly people asking for free art.
I just want to know will furries still be able to put there furry charector up from IMVU?
Quote Originally Posted by IMVU's CEO
Stolen content is bad for everybody in the community, from the author that sees their hard work being exploited to the community that misses the opportunity to connect with the author, explore their other works and even make a new friendship. IMVU wants to ensure that people only share content they have the rights to share. If stolen content is posted on the FA site, the process is likely to stay the same. If stolen art is posted on IMVU, the legal owner of the art can file a DMCA Takedown notice.
In other words we do not care, its not changing