FA+
Shop
Fur Affinity and IMVU
10 years ago
A friend of mine retweeted this open letter to Dragoneer, today: https://docs.google.com/document/d/.....it?usp=sharing
It runs through a lot of the usual issues people have with this sort of thing in this fandom, but there are a few interesting things I'd like to mention, when it comes to the letter's squeemish and unspecific revulsion to FA becoming a commercial asset.
Becoming a commercial asset that someone has a vested interest in maintaining is *not* one of FA's problems.
In fact, it could be the solution to a lot of them. I've been saying for years that the way FA looks, feels, and runs, is exactly what happens when someone has no commercial interest in their product. Admins who don't respond to trouble tickets in a timely manner. A marked air of unprofessional handling. A site code that's old, boated, and silly, with promises of change, big project announcements, and hardly any significant progress. Community projects usually end up looking like community projects, without someone having any incentive to light a fire under themselves to personally put their best forward. I've been saying for years that FA actually should try to run itself like a business. Invest in serious overhauls, leave current services as-is and offer additional features for a small annual payment, do something to incentivize maintaining and upgrading the site, that doesn't require begging for donations every time something goes down or needs improvement.
IMVU is a pretty sleezy company. Go ahead and call them out for their management practices, and how they won't lift a finger to protect intellectual property unless a creator burns precious time and calories filling out a DMCA for every instance they notice. Go ahead and call them out for making the decent thing to do an inconvenience for the people who actually create the content that generates the traffic they intend to advertise to. It's fine to worry about how their specific intentions toward FA might manifest themselves for the website. But lambasting "commercialization" isn't going to help anything. If you want to look at the history of a website run without any proper, intelligent, long-term commercial interests at heart, I present to you FA, its trouble ticket forum, its code, Project Phoenix redux redux redux, etc.
I intend to use FA's enormous traffic for my own profit for as long as I can, and I expect other artists to keep doing the same, while I cultivate other avenues, and mirror galleries, as well. My problem with the IMVU deal has nothing to do with the fact that a company wants to do with the site the same thing every profitable artist has been doing with it for the last decade.
It runs through a lot of the usual issues people have with this sort of thing in this fandom, but there are a few interesting things I'd like to mention, when it comes to the letter's squeemish and unspecific revulsion to FA becoming a commercial asset.
Becoming a commercial asset that someone has a vested interest in maintaining is *not* one of FA's problems.
In fact, it could be the solution to a lot of them. I've been saying for years that the way FA looks, feels, and runs, is exactly what happens when someone has no commercial interest in their product. Admins who don't respond to trouble tickets in a timely manner. A marked air of unprofessional handling. A site code that's old, boated, and silly, with promises of change, big project announcements, and hardly any significant progress. Community projects usually end up looking like community projects, without someone having any incentive to light a fire under themselves to personally put their best forward. I've been saying for years that FA actually should try to run itself like a business. Invest in serious overhauls, leave current services as-is and offer additional features for a small annual payment, do something to incentivize maintaining and upgrading the site, that doesn't require begging for donations every time something goes down or needs improvement.
IMVU is a pretty sleezy company. Go ahead and call them out for their management practices, and how they won't lift a finger to protect intellectual property unless a creator burns precious time and calories filling out a DMCA for every instance they notice. Go ahead and call them out for making the decent thing to do an inconvenience for the people who actually create the content that generates the traffic they intend to advertise to. It's fine to worry about how their specific intentions toward FA might manifest themselves for the website. But lambasting "commercialization" isn't going to help anything. If you want to look at the history of a website run without any proper, intelligent, long-term commercial interests at heart, I present to you FA, its trouble ticket forum, its code, Project Phoenix redux redux redux, etc.
I intend to use FA's enormous traffic for my own profit for as long as I can, and I expect other artists to keep doing the same, while I cultivate other avenues, and mirror galleries, as well. My problem with the IMVU deal has nothing to do with the fact that a company wants to do with the site the same thing every profitable artist has been doing with it for the last decade.
(inb4 dildos)
not trolling, I'm trying to ask a serious question
http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/6590833/
the only thing here on FA now is my ghost.
why bother with FA at all if IMVU is so bad?
Riiiiight
I'm not going to be leaving FA. I'll still be here to post journals, comments, faves, and reply to notes but any new art I get is going to be posted exclusively to my Sofurry page and Tumblr (which I can't link here because of stupid rules, but it isn't hard to find).
BTW ALL sites make money off you or they wouldn't be operating. Here at least we have some grip on who and how.
Seriously, just leave and shut the hell up.
Spoiler: Because he doesn't.
He may still be the lead admin of FA, but he's no longer God Almighty; until now, he essentially answered only to himself. Now he has to answer to a corporation and they could easily fire him anytime. He may say IMVU won't change anything and that the acquisition was in FA's best interest, but now if the higher-ups at IMVU say 'Jump!', the only valid answer for him is 'How high?' unless he wants to risk which is pretty much his job now.
But Fisk... FA does NOT need to do monetizing like Deviantart or IMVU, offering people premium stuff or making Adult Passes to view Adult content.
It needs ads the artists can use to both support the site, but also get word of themselves out there, and then something like patreon or another way, for people to give donations and help support the site that way if they so wish. Aside from that can anyone in the staff, if they have a job outside of the site, put towards a bit of their income towards the site, to help for anything it may need, like where the money from the ads and donations would go.
That way a site can EASILY even when it have the userbase of FA, run itself without having to offer this or that.
Hell they can even sell merchandise, have a small store where people can buy themselves shirts, pants, shoes, keychains, posters, stickers, pens, cups etc. To gain money as well and keep the site free still!
Your font color is painful.
And you did actually when you mentioned extra features for small annual payments. That's a specific business plan, much like the one DeviantArt have in place.
When people use font colour like that, I have to highlight all the text with my mouse so I can read it D:
I didn't think of it, thanks for the suggestion. =+}
Also I was on holiday for a week which is why this reply is late lol
Super depressed to be back home & going to work :(
Although I wouldn't say I'm 95% miserable lol
I have many things to be happy & grateful for :)
Whoa, sorry for the emotional vomit here, I'm under my own pressure to get done with CompTIA A+ by the end of this month in order to certify by mid May. Then I need to jump quickly into CompTIA Network+ and either chase after Cisco ICND1, ICND2, or go directly for the CCNA certification. Ugh, brain is melting thinking about how challenging this is going to be once employed. =+S
I must admit I didn't understand most of what you were explaining there though, but I hope things pick up for you soon.
I'm also sorry for confusing you with my reply before this one, would you like me to attempt to clarify anything for you or just leave all as is?
Further clarification would be me simply providing internet links to the specific items I mentioned that you didn't understand.
I'd probably still get confused even with the links lol
Well I hope it all goes well for you anyway! Best of luck :)
Since I can't do mechanic work anymore and don't want to spend four to six years of going to college, certifying in CompTIA A+ will allow me to gain accreditation of professional competence in months instead of years. Also certification is much cheaper and overall a quicker path to employment vs college. Seriously, buy a few books on the CompTIA A+ subject (normally they also come with pretest software) and you will be on the way to a entry level position of a computer technician. =+}
Then about a year later you can get out of the Help Desk computer technician position by going for the CompTIA Network+ certification. Then a year after that you can study up on Cisco ICND1, or go for the ICND1 and ICND2 combo of CCNA (highly recommended) in order to pave a path to system administrator where the big income starts rolling in. So if you are following along with me, you could in four years achieve the income beyond a grad student in half the time and for a substantially lower cost than traditional college. The big win is ZERO student loan debt, quicker employment, and more avenues of position advancement.
For just gee wiz FYI: I would suggest next step to be CompTIA Security+, then start looking at actual OS certifications, to include both Linux and Windows servers. This will open a whole new world of possibilities for you! Do a lot of research and build a career path that could lead you to a six figure paycheck every year! My mentor started off making only $33K a year, now he's up to $109K, and even better news is the IT industry is expected to grow in demand for decades to come!
Heh, I think I went overboard again on you Neeka...
Well, in good spirit I'd like to share this website with you in addition to the first link: http://www.davidlprowse.com
What you want to explore (should I have interested you in the IT industry) are at the top of his webpage, they contain links and goodies like video instructionals on the material I presented.
Gah, I really shouldn't login to any social media after a long days worth of studying!
I think the reason I was so confused is that I'm from the UK so we don't quite have the same line of qualifications etc that you have.
But thanks for filling me in on it :)
Now I'll be the first to admit that perhaps the folk from said places are looking to gain employment in the US in the near future, but there is no way for me to directly ask each individual such a question.
Finally, you are most welcome, I try to share tidbits of info with everyone willing to listen. Debt is an evil that all of us must face one day, but if I can provide a single individual with any means of avoiding such a dastardly burden I will always try to do so.
Cheers to you and best wishes to you for all your endeavors. =+D
Hope all goes well for you! :)
But the main purpose of the site, the posting of artwork for others to see, is still completely free. And unlike some sites, I can post almost any number of submissions without once running into a paywall. If FA adopted this way of doing things, it would not be the end of the world.
You'd still get people leaving, but I bet you'd see the majority give a shrug and move on, while others actually appreciate the new features they can buy. Whether they come to think them worth the money or not is another matter, but if people think buying access to more features is a better deal, it's no shirt off my back. I'll stick with free until I think I need something more.
Rather than making people pay for certain features and having no choice in the matter, instead one could set up a system where you can select individual features you want from a list of all the features available, and you get a limited number of said features for free, and if you want more features (still features you can choose from) you can pay certain levels of premiums for a certain amount more of features. That way if you're a minimalist and can live with only a set number of your favourite features, you can do that, or if you want just a little more features than what you selected free, you can do that too. And you'd be able to switch out your features at any time, just be unable to have more than the set amount of features available to you. Basically choosing your features a la cart.
It's a working business model, and I would recommend you be careful when you deviate from it. Humans can be picky and illogical creatures. What you think might be a great idea can turn out terrible in execution, all because people don't work in a way that'd support your business model. J.C. Penny lost untold amounts of revenue trying to "be nicer" to their customers by making a few changes that seemed to make sense. Turns out people like the screwy mechanisms most department stores use.
Could your model work? Certainly. However, it may turn out in the end that your userbase asks you to just put together basic "packages" of features for free accounts. Which, if implemented, would pretty much force your toward DA's business model in the end. I think you could skip the hassle and just imitate them, but I'm not an expert and it wouldn't be my website anyway. Do as you see fit; just be ready for any and all consequences.
I did not say that people would be annoyed. It may just be that they would find your business model inefficient or even pointless, and just choose a few basic features, and advise others to do the same. Then complain (how on earth did we let that become a negative term?) that they'd rather have a packaged deal. Of course, at that point, you may not have to assume DA's model at all. Just give a certain group of features away for free, things that the userbase really need to use the site, and then offer individual or packaged features for certain prices. Kinda like getting to play a game for free and then allowing gamers to purchase DLC, either one at a time or in bundles.
I think, actually, that would be what I'd recommend. Because sometimes people don't really know what they want. And it'd be silly if someone picked several extraneous features for free instead of the ones that are essential to being part of the site. Granted, some may just want to stick around in the forums instead of posting art and/or commenting on it... but I think you'll find many would want to do both, possibly for free, and complain if they can't. Or complain once they realize that's what they want, and blame your staff for everything. =P
Even so, I'm basing all this on my own limited knowledge of people, and extrapolating from there. Neither of us can predict the exact choices people will make (unless you have business or psychology education that I do not possess), so this all remains rather moot until there is an actual website and userbase to experiment with. All theories, and their criticisms, look good on paper. It's when they're applied to the real world that they're tested, and lies only live on if propped up by those who want them to be true.
I think I have said all that I can say on this matter, unless you have a counter-argument that brings up new points. I will give you the last word, as best as I am able.
As for giving features away for free, that was actually what I was saying I'd do! Here's one example:
Lets say there's 50 features total on a website (that being the maximum features available).
Lets say all said features are in addition to the most basic functions of any website.
Lets say we give out 20 of those features (by user's choice) free to any and all accounts.
Then we say pay 5 bucks for a subscription to 15 addition features. That purely offering "more at once" to users who pay for that, but not limiting any users to any specific features, as anyone can sub-out any features they have/don't want for any features they don't have/want.
Then say we double that to 10 bucks for 30 additional features. Thus for that price per month users can have all the features active at the same time and never need to sub out any features.
If all this is the case, users can do two things:
either A: pay and be lazy, having all features active and never having to sub out any features at any time.
or B: Keep paying nothing at all, and just temporarily sub out features at any time they would need to change them.
Basically users would pay for convenience, or not pay and just take the time to switch features when needed. Assuming the switching of features would be programmed in to be as user friendly as possible, it shouldn't be annoying to most people to stick with the free 20 features at most at any time, as they can switch them around at any time, and those that would find it annoying could pay to have more features active at a time. And that money spent on the features could go towards improving the hardware for the website which would allow for even more features to be added to the website (as the servers could handle more workload).
Granted, people will somehow find some ways to complain, but in my idea there the intent would be to keep it as clean a transfer as possible. All funds spent on something of that sort would go directly towards allowing the server(s) running the site to handle even more capabilities, thus allowing the users to potentially get more out of it in the long run (simplest way of explaining this would be: if servers get improved enough to make more programs capable of being run at once, or more complex programs, this would allow the subscription of features to be incremented over time as server workload permits, giving people more features for their money, or possibly even lowering the subscription price if maintaining a server becomes easier with better equipment, etc!)
Just keep in mind all numbers listed above are make believe and not actual calculations of any sort. They're just round numbers for ease of figuring things out! :P
Even so, I don't wish to discourage you. It could work. I'm just of the mind that nothing goes just as planned, so you need to expect something to break and be ready to fix it. And if you already have users at that time, and the thing that breaks is very important to them, you'll shortly come to empathize with Dragoneer on the matter of user complaints. XD It's a sad fact that there's just no convincing some people, so you'll just have to do your best to satisfy the majority and hope it all works out. Which it should.
Whatever you choose to do, I wish you well in your endeavors. You seem to have a lot of ideas and the ability to convey them in an intelligent manner. Now you must develop perseverance and courage so that when trouble comes, you are prepared to deal with it, no matter how much it hurts or bores you. Do that, and much of the world opens up to you.
Yeh nothing goes just as planned, which is why I'm not getting my hopes too much up about it. It's more brainstorming idea at the moment. :)
And thanks, I'm glad you're not just a drama fur out to get someone annoyed by continually pushing against them. Unlike that sort of person, your comments and worries do hold merit, and I appreciate hearing them since it does help to keep the mind focused on everything, rather than getting ahead of it'self with lofty goals.
This fear is only amplified when the company in question is IMVU, which is not run by members of the fandom and may implement policies that greatly inconvenience users, or, perhaps worse, let it run amok and allow for rampant art theft. You might respond that IMVU wouldn't do that, since it's in their best interests to keep FA traffic flowing, but that doesn't mean they know how to best run this site any more than Dragoneer does, especially with IMVU's track record (which you acknowledge as being lackluster at best). I believe the author of the letter you posted is not as misguided as you think; there are countless incidents where a fan base has been outraged because of a management decision made by someone entirely removed from that community. George Lucas and his constant, nonsensical revisions of the original Star Wars films while refusing to release the theatrical versions is a prime example.
So, yes, improving the management of FA is something everyone in the fandom can agree upon, and I believe there wouldn't be any issues with FA asking for revenue for certain premium services (within reason) purely for the purposes of maintaining and continuing to grow and improve the site. 'Neer's ability to rake in thousands of dollars in emergency donations is proof that the community is vested enough in FA to pay money to ensure that it's maintained. The issue is with whom has been charged with running FA.
Either way, I was defending the presence of commercialism, not IMVU, nor declaring that a commercial interest indicates competence or good judgement.
While I myself would't become a member should there be a additional purchasable premium thing, I would't be angry about the aspect of it, if I can be a free member and have access to everything on the site. Even if I miss out on this or that cool feature. I will though become angry if they do something like the Adult Pass on IMVU and cuts of something to the site like that, and put it behind a paywall.
Its also distracting... any point you try to make is very much sabotaged and blocked out by the thoughts that the font color is too bright, which is most of the feedback you're getting in this thread.
But there are other ways, and there's also people who will have trouble reading Red, Purple, Blue, Black, Pink, White, Brown etc. I can use so many colors, which unless I make them dark or then not fat text, people will have trouble reading for one reason or another. So even if I do change it, then unless its something dark or the default, two things I do not like, people will complain. I cannot unless I do something I'd not want or like to do, appeal to everyone. If the artist doesn't like the color used on their comments then they can say so, and then I have Three choices: Stop, continue it or just stop leaving comments. IF the artist really do not like it or want it, then they can block me if I continue to do it.
I agree that no ads could be a solution, but at the same time, that undermines relatively unknown artists who are using ads on FA as a way to gain exposure. I know I've found people to follow and webcomics to support only because of an ad. Of course, the ads on FA are mostly intra-site, user-created advertisements; if IMVU decides to throw their own ads up and crap that no one really wants to see (hopefully not at the expense of the website running smoothly), then I'd be fully on board with paying to have an ad-free experience.
I just don't care for green that much.
it IS easier to read than RED wording, I'll give it that. stands out from the page
That said, I have yet to see IMVU knowingly hire abusers and consistently promise UI changes and then pretend they never happened, and then repeat this process over and over. FA is highly unprofessional and it absolutely baffles me that they can't make competent people their lead designers/programmers/etc.
My frustration with this situation, and past situations, that have caused unroars on this website have less to do with FA's fault and more that the consequences from these make artists (with good reason) leave this site. There are many artists I admire that no longer post here and I rarely now get the chance to see their new work.
I mean, if they can't even do a monthly update to the banner anymore how can we expect them to answer trouble tickets?? It's literally spring and they just made it a winter-themed banner.
While in the meantime, a lot of people know who and what Bad-Dragon are, and unlike IMVU they have a good reputation and have shown they are true to their word. They're also for Furries by Furries.
As for Bad-Dragon being Sexist, I have not heard about that at all and if the issue really is as big as you say it is. I can guarantee you that that it would be out in the open on places like this or even the comments of F-List who's now either owned or then partnered with them. If its just how some people personally feel from bad jokes or them being a feminist, not saying all are bad but many of them are pretty crazy, then that's not Bad-Dragons issue or fault, but the individual person.
And actually while a site or company doesn't need full transparency. It does need to abide by the laws of the country it's headquarters are in, its own TOS and it must give users a heads up on certain changes. Like the TOS or its policies for instance. So while a full transparency isn't required, it's required by law and its own laws to tell the users PRECISELY what changes depending on them that they do.
and every time i have seen FA do a TOS change there has been a big box at the top saying this soat the end of the day it coems down to thsi you have your views and take on this drama i have mine and if you truely feel this sit ei snot for you or your that against it then your free to leave and go somewhere else
IMVU is devil to make deal with , souls has been sold and noone seen the contract except 2 people , and community was told 2-3 months after fact
if thats not shady...idk what is
I only have an IB account because a couple of artists I liked never came back to FA after the last exodus
I don't know, why someone would even bother about cub porn. It's fantasy after all.
If IMVU makes FA better?
Good on ya mates! We get a nicer site, and shit turned out for the better after all!
If IMVU makes FA worse?
There will always be new community website.
So honestly? At its very core it simply doesn't matter. None of us are honor bound or bound by contract to use FA AND ONLY FA for out furrylicious shenanigans. We can come and go as we damned well please, and if IMVU breaks FA, people are going to find other communities to join, and one community will get popular, and no more than a few months after FA turns into the internet furry titanic, we'll all have a new, better, and probably sturdier ship to sail on.
Nothing lasts forever, and god fucking damnit, FA is no different. She is gonna go down, life is gonna toss a fuck ton of curve balls, and websites are gonna lose venue, businesses are gonna go bankrupt, and terrorism attacks are gonna kill people. In the grand scheme of things, FA is a small fry, and our community will get on its feet real damned fast.
Remember...FA is not the first in this chain of events...And it will most definitely, without a shadow of a doubt, be the last either.
like damnit I was hoping for layoffs and more competent staff
I can wait for professionalism to reach this site LOL
Yet also 90% of the artists I watch have accounts here, and I don't have to jump through some of the hoops the other websites have; and I admit I'm just comfortable with FA. I'm rather against a mass exodus since I'm worried unless a proper "replacement" FA is created and traffic is directed there; said artists will lose traffic and income. I also do acknowledge those wanting to scram have legitimate concerns, I'm just leery of knee-jerk reactions.
Most of the other known furry sites have their own issues. InkBunny doesn't allow any human nudity or sex and still allows cub porn. I haven't tried Weasyl yet but I heard mixed feelings and so forth at the other places that I can't recall off the top of my head.
I don't know a solution, I just hope things sort things out, and maybe IMVU may not screw up FA further or even improve things. In worse case scenario I'd like for minds with a better grip on things work out a solution that works out if FA is doomed as some claim.
From sideloading spyware into their toolbar software to requiring victims of art theft to submit personally invasive DMCA notices, they've squandered an opportunity to prove that their acquisition of FA will ultimately benefit the fandom. It's clear they don't have any respect for the privacy of their customers. It's clear that they're a highly unethical business.
Sure, they're technically in the legal right to do this (as their apologists point out)
However, why don't they go above and beyond the minimum baseline of the law to enforce their own policies?
They claim DMCA protects them legally. So how is that different than taking art down because it's too violent/sexual? Both violate their TOS, which states they can remove content for any reason and without warning. The violator could theoretically sue them in both situations, though they wouldn't have a legal leg to stand on.
At this point I'm not even talking about what they're legally obligated to do. If it comes to their attention that a piece of artwork was stolen, regardless of if the original artist filed a DMCA or a good Samaritan happened to notice and reported it, they should remove it per their own in-house rules.
Basically, what it boils down to is that they lack the manpower to enforce their own TOS and require victims to do the legwork. So much for their promises of developing a safe community where everyone feels welcome and doesn't have to worry about their shit getting stolen. If your art is stolen, you have to submit highly personal identifying information to a sleazy, untrustworthy company. That's what upsets me the most about all this.
protect peoples intelectual properties.
I did not understand the panic either. If they change the rules about artists keeping the copyright, there is still time to remove everything and go to another site. The same for other changes they might make. I mean, even facebook needs to give you time to react to a change in policy.
By merely being ON FA, everyone agrees to be perfectly fine with EVERYTHING that happens to this website regardless of any concerns you have. By the very fact that someone comments to complain they thereby agree they are fine with that which they were planning to complain about.
For those who don't believe me, I leave you with this:
1.1 - Upon registering an account on Fur Affinity, you agree to abide by all the guidelines provided in this document and any therein, including the Community Guidelines, Code of Conduct, and Acceptable Upload Policy. By registering an account, using, or accessing our services, you agree to be bound by all the terms and conditions of this agreement. If you do not agree to all the terms and conditions of this agreement you should not, and are not permitted to, use our services.
2.1 - Fur Affinity reserves the right to change these documents at any time, without prior notice, and for any reason. You will be notified of these changes via site announcements which will appear below the Fur Affinity site banner artwork. Continued usage of the site after being notified constitutes acceptance and agreement with any changes. You are responsible for reviewing and becoming familiar with and adhering to any modifications to this agreement.
2.2 - We may ask you to review and explicitly agree to a revised version of these terms. In this case, any modifications will be effective at the time of your agreement. If you do not agree, then you are not permitted to use our services and must discontinue using them immediately. In circumstances where you are not asked to explicitly agree, but are instead notified as stated above via site announcement, then the modifications will become effective fourteen (14) days after being announced.
4.1 - When you upload content to Fur Affinity via our services, you grant us a non-exclusive, worldwide, royalty-free, sublicensable, transferable right and license to use, host, store, cache, reproduce, publish, display (publicly or otherwise), perform (publicly or otherwise), distribute, transmit, modify, adapt, and create derivative works of, that content. These permissions are purely for the limited purposes of allowing us to provide our services in accordance with their functionality (hosting and display), improve them, and develop new services. These permissions do not transfer the rights of your content or allow us to create any deviations of that content outside the aforementioned purposes.
5.1 - Our services may change without prior notice to you. We retain the right to create limits on our services at any time with or without notice. We may also impose limits on services or aspects of them or restrict your access to part or all of our services without notice or liability. We may change, suspend, or discontinue any or all of our services at any time, including availability of any product, feature, database, content (yours or ours).
If not I would strongly suggest considering doing so. Not only will that help expand your fanbase and advertisement, but will also protect you from losing all adertisement if/when a site crashes and burns.
"These permissions do not transfer the rights of your content or allow us to create any deviations of that content outside the aforementioned purposes." is the line that most seem to ignore/forget is in there.
And if your argument is that furries don't have the juice to take legal action, you're wrong. Some furries are even lawyers, and so many of us now make a living at this. And now FA is owned by a huge juicy target with millions in profits? Now it's actually worth legal action if it happens, just because the defendant would actually have assets.
So, let's just knock off the rampant insane baseless speculation.
As per FA's SA http://help.furaffinity.net/article.....eement-SA.html
"You waive FA and its staff from liability resultant from uploaded submissions or information transferred to the site. You also accept that any submission uploaded to the FA domains is done of your own volition, and you accept full responsibility for any consequences which may arise. You agree that FA is in no way responsible for monetary damages or losses incurred as a result of any submission or information uploaded."
I only think he's retarded for liking digimon, srsly
only time will tell
If it doesn't and everything stays as it was I'll just stick around using the site as I always have and if it gets improved then great :P
People make such a fuss about things before they even see what kind of effect they will have.
personally id like to see where this goes they've already said our art is safe .... im giving it a chance.Sorry, had to have my moment of sarcasm towards some of the more blind panic moments I have seen. I'm better now. :p
I'm certain there are factors holding them back from that. Factors that are holding back a lot of people from opening or awakening dormant accounts, there. Stupid, offensive, disgusting factors.
edit:
Also, that's not quite what I was talking about.
By all means. Enlighten me.
You can, however, post submissions that indicate what the material is and then post the picture (or prose, or whatever) on another site and link to it in the description. Which is often done tongue-in-cheek as "Too Hot For Inkbunny!" by at least one user I know of.
Of course, this results in a great deal of irony. You can post pictures and stories of cubs being raped and possibly even killed and tortured... but a lovely romantic piece about an anthro wolf and his human lover on their honeymoon isn't allowed. Not unless you censor the hell outta it.
Heh. Wolf. Moon.
Now thats not to say I dont think people should be prepared for the worst, far from that... pack your things but dont run off yet! Hope for the best! I think that really everyone might want to calm down and see where IMVU takes FA... hopefully they take us in a better direction... and as many have said before me, if they do not, there are other furry websites. FA is the only one I frequent myself, but I'm not afraid to start over somewhere new like Weasyl (since I have an account there already thats not so much active) or Inkbunny. From an up and coming artist perspective, since I dont have too much invested in other communities, moving may slow down my business some, but from the standpoint of someone who also purchases other artwork, It wont affect anything other than where I go to buy my artwork.
I just feel like a lot of people are prematurely picking a fight so to speak.
If you want FA to no longer be a benefit to "popufurs" the ordinary people need to stop using it, first.
I don't have all my eggs in the FA basket, so most of it's not even in reach for anyone who owns FA. But I'd be doing myself a disservice if I left FA.
I didn't put words in your mouth. You used the term "moneypig" which is a childish sneer.
It's all right. If I'm not allowed to draw my own conclusions about the situation, without being called "unethical" by you, by being labelled someone only concerned with money, by you, by being perceived as somehow the enemy, by you, that's fine with me.
I still wonder if you will look back on this a year from now, as everything sails on, and my work remains unstolen, and you wonder if you weren't a little harsh. I know you're young now. I know what it was like to be hot headed and full of gumption, and how that emotionalism gets in the way of our reason.
So, what I'm going to do is not take any of this personally, and just chalk it up to the unbridled passions of youth and inexperience. I'm going to spare you the trouble of getting in whatever last parting "digs" you have brewing, as well. But, a year from now, when we see what's really happened, feel free to drop me an email and we can discuss whether or not my work was stolen, and if you're a little more mature and have an apology handy, I'll very likely allow you to comment on my journals and submissions again.
Take care.
IMVU is STILL A THING???
(You don't need to answer this; I'm just ignorantly serious that I never expected IMVU to actually still be around after all these years since I didn't think it would last with Second Life and others around).