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yesterdays journal    

By BabyStar, 4 months ago
Thanks so much guys for the twenty bazillion responses. Ive read them all and its all been amazingly interesting learning about everyone's own little story and preferences if theres anything to conclude for the little survey is that there's a fairly even spread between those who used them in the beginnibg and those who didnt...but the other thing we can ascertain is that we are all individuals with different backstories. Not surprising really.


About the dream...theres sorta vital information I didnt disclose that probably makes the dream seem a lot clearer.
Ive been having this trust issue recently. I found out a few weeks ago from a friend that someones been posting patreon exclusive stuff up other places again. And truthfully i see the people who pledge to my patreon as friends. Theyre supporting me and my art so when whomever posts the wips and stuff up places it just feels like im being betrayed. To the point ive been seriously considering shutting down my patreon.

Money is great im really appreciative of the support...but truthfully trusting people holds a higher standing in my head than extra money. And the idea that potentially a friend could be doing this to me just really cuts me up quite deep so ive been struggling with myself and what to do about the situation to the point ive actually stopped posting wips and stuff on patreon and lost interest in the place entirely.

Obviously if i close my patreon i would have to cut back on comic pages and go back to supporting myself primarily through commissions.
So i guess ive been feeling trapped and worried that if i cut back on comic pages that people will get annoyed....i dunno...truthfully i think the dream i had yesterday is reflecting that specific problem.

Maybe im over reacting....i probably am. But this is just how i feel about the problem
43 comments

User replies

  lvx

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  People are going to post patreon images on other sites, that's just how it is with every single artist that uses patreon
To shut down everything because of one or two people is a little silly, they're always going to be out there no matter what you do
You still get subscriptions from other people right? It wouldn't be very fair to them (or good on your wallet) to close up shop because of one thief

And a patreon sub is just a bill, that doesn't mean they're your friends, you're not friends with your electric company are you?

  babystar

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  Actually most of the people who support my patreon ARE friends they're people ive spoken to and been in contact with here, people who want to see my comic and support my art.. Theyre not just anonymous people. So when i post stuff that they know is especially for them. I would hope that they would just have the common decency and respect for my wishes....i know thats an archiac out dated way of looking at things.

Maybe ill find a different way of funding the comic...like community contributions per page or something...

There must be a middle ground somewhere I guess.

  lvx

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  Well you say 'most' of the people, so if the majority is happy with the current setup enough to keep patreoning, why change because of a few bad apples?

I mean, unless you personally know every single person on your patreon, there's always going to be a skeeve or two (and even if you figure out who did it and cut them off they can just make a new account and be more driven to share what's posted, which improves nothing)

  babystar

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  This is very true. I guess im just gonna remove the WIP thing as part of my pledges. I dont mind finished artwork going around being shared. but when its half done stuff that the person commissioning it hasnt even seen, thats when it gets complicated.

  ursa-mina

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  So it was an anxiety dream! I'm so sorry you're going through a rough time, ickle sis, it's not nice to be betrayed. :(

*huggles lots*

  babystar

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  Actually if I'm being honest. Just writing that all out has made me feel better. Its been going round in my head for a few weeks and playing on my mind a lot making me feel pretty crummy. Its good now. Ive got to seriously sit down and work out how to fix this. :) yoor ace Sis! *hugs*


  ursa-mina

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  Ever welcome, sis! If I can helps in any way, let me know! ^^

  aemi

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  sadly that's a risk you take with online art. people get it in their heads that they paid for it (one way or another) and thus they can post it where ever they like. Its jerky but it does happen. :(

You just do what you feel you need to do. You know we'll stick by ya!

If it helps, even if the art gets out, SOMEONE had to pay you money for it to exist in the first place so technically you still kinda win?

  babystar

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  The thing is with WIPs its usually someone elses commission. It was highly embarrassing from a professional point of view that the first time this happened it was the commissioner who found the wip posted somewhere he wasnt expecting and contacted me asking what was going on. At that point the art hadnt been paid for.
Truthfully my patreon perks are all about supporting the comics first then getting a little extra depending on what tier they support. So WIPs are very rarely property of patreons.
I just think maybe patreon is more stress than its worth if i cant trust people to just follow a few rules and maybe i can find a happier medium funding the comics in other ways....ill figure something out :)

  citrinetopaz

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  You know you could just change your reward system and keep WIPs off the table to prevent theft and such?

There is an artist on IB who has taken down any perks from his Patreon, and he uses it to meet a goal for the next page of his comic, and his donations/comic have been pretty consistent too.

Maybe just make your comics the main reward? If people feel so entitled to your art and feel the need to try to "Robin Hood" it, maybe make it impossible to do so?

Its just a t thought, you know, like if you meet the donation goal of "X" amount you do the allotted comic pages for the month, and if you don't you subtract "X" amount of pages and post how much the donations earned?

Also I know people take your comic pages and post them to Reddit but don't know about other sites, but they link back to your page and never post it via Imgur.

  Comment hidden by its author
  rarysnowlion

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  There are jerks in this world. Some of them pretend to be nice.

Don't pass up money because of it.

  oooo

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  If it's the place I'm thinking of, where one wip was posted a couple of weeks ago, here's one post that was made in response to the leak:

"Drawing is work for Sammy. Work she loves doing, but still work. It's not unusual for any of us to want to get paid to work. I can tell you that I don't work for free. She has a set amount of time that she works on her art were she will do commissions. Patreon allows her to focus on the comic instead. It's a choice if you want to back it to have her produce it faster. She would still make the comic regardless, but if it didn't provide an income she would have to focus on commissions instead which will lead to slower progression.

Nobody wants that right?"

  oooo

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  Should also note that the person who posted the leak claimed they were justified because of supporting the patreon, but the response to that was overwhelmingly against them.

No further leaks have been posted since the initial one, so they probably got the message.

  babystar

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  Thanks for sharing that info with me. I appreciate it. I do love drawing and i would do it even if i get no money it wouldjust be a much lower priority as i would need to do other work to pay my bills and pay for the things i want to do. That wouldnt be the end of the world most people have jobs they dont like. Im super lucky i get to do art as part of my job and patreon and commissions fund that.

  Comment hidden by its author
  anondraggie

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  I never had trust issues, because I don't trust anyone until they prove to me they can be trusted. Worked like a charm for me. The downside of this though is I very rarely make new friends and that I don't like to meet new people.

  rascaldormly

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  I think I've told you about my feelings with patreon and such. Its unfortunate that I cant afford to pledge a particular amount every month [I'd go broke] If it was a one time thing where I can pay when I can afford it that would be a different story. I just think the patreon set-up kinda excludes those who cant always afford to spend money on art. Its almost like setting your commission prices through the roof [you know $200 for a sketch, $300 for line art, exc] I'm not saying you don't deserve it, just that it prevents those who cant afford it from enjoying some of your works. It also seems that since your Patreon account, all of your commission statuses were closed [though I may be mistaken, its just an observation.] Its just my view of the patreon system as a whole really, I never really liked it.


Whiney lil baby puppy aside, I think I told you my story about how I got into diapers hehehe. Was quite interesting to say the least :P

  babystar

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  Actually for 1 dollar a month you get the chance to be in a group ych and i dont think id ever be comfortable setting my prices that high.
My commissions have been closed because people keep popping up and asking to be fit into my commission queue and because im bad at telling people to go away and wait till im open i try and see if i can squeeze people in. Infact i think thats how yougotnyour last commission from me.
So actually patreon hasnt had ny impact on commissions other than the fact i get to spend a day a week doing comics instead of commissions

  rascaldormly

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  ;nodnods; Forgive me then. Last I checked your patreon [was when you set it up] the lowest amount was I think $20, so if your down to a dollar thats awesome :) As for commissions I just made an observations, though while patreon does not affect your commissions status, there are other artists that make it a requirement. As I said, I just an not comfortable with patreon itself, and its not really directed to you.

Again, Sorry if I offended you, I just really hate how the patreon system works most times is all ;offers friendly hugs;

  rascaldormly

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  Also about the people taking your wip's, Perhaps you should start watermarking them [if you haven't done so already], nothing deep or dark or in your face, but with the art theft that goes on in places like Fetlife and Facebook you don't want people claiming they have unmarked WIP's as proof that they drew it.


  babystar

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  My lowest amount has always been a dollar. I think maybe you might be confusing me with someone else maybe??

And yep watermarking wips is a really good idea. Something i should adopt. Im rubbish at watermarking most of my stuff really. Its a practice i really should be more focused on

  rascaldormly

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  well, don't watermark everything, I have seen artists kinda hide their names in the artwork for final pieces. This is pleasing to the eye while giving credit [and proof] to the artist. :)

As for mixing, yeah its possible. Working overnight kinda turned my head to mush >.<

  felixlionheart

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  I would say that maybe people post stuff early because they're excited about it, but that still doesn't excuse posting it without the artist's permission. And from the sounds of it in your case the circumstances aren't quite as simple as that.

I'd say don't let one or two people stop you from funding what you love to do <3

  lazy-leopard

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  I really don't get why folk would post Patreon specials elsewhere. If I was going to try to identify the culprits (assuming it isn't obvious) then I'd look, in the first instance, for folk who sign up and then drop out soon after, possibly before they've even paid anything. Patreon relies somewhat on trust, and, sadly, there will always be some jerks...

A reasonable compromise might be to only post to Patreon material directly related to Shine and Found (and other directly Patreon-funded stuff), and maybe even put a "funded through Patreon" banner or watermark on it...

Oh, and a pox on un-trustworthy jerks everywhere, too...

  zlug

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  I might only be talking for myself (hope I'm not) but.

I support you on Patreon (only with $2 though, don't really have money to spare) but not because of wip's and the likes, those are a nice idea but I ultimately do it because I really love the things you post her on FA for free and want to support you in doing so.

So I think maybe you shouldn't consider the things you upload to Patreon as exclusives. I'm pretty sure people will support you regardless and the random drawing thing you do is already pretty cool. I guess I'm thinking is that I don't thing that allowing people to just share what you post there will change anything other than you not having to worry about if they do.

  neneswordshorde

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  At the end of the day, you'll do what you feel is right and best for your mental health and well being.

That said, you really shouldn't let a handful of jackasses get you down on patreon. If I remember a previous journal, you said due to the donations, even after the company takes it's cut, you've been able to reduce your hours at work. People clearly enjoy helping you, do don;t let some jackass who wants to get some street cred by posting exclusive stuff to the masses get you down.

  mglitch

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  It's shameful that people will post WIP on other sites for people to see for free, sort of like people who make a pledge then delete it after seeing the art they want without being charged. Though I think enough people will see your work and want to support you so more content will come out and not look for free means of seeing your work.

  sylverfire-lilithelili89

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  *hugs*


I think the dream is reflecting that. You have every right to be upset your art is your art. For someone to post it somewhere without permission is wrong.




  soniastrummfan217

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  I've been hearing a lot about patreon, but don't quite know what it is. What exactly is it? :)

  lilrosado

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  It's a site where people can support artist, youtubers, other stuff and they can choose how much per month that is higher than a dollar. And usually the people who use pateron to get support give out rewards per how much someone donates to them per month.

  lilrosado

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  Hey don't worry about that, honestly if you shut down your pateron for one peroom then your showing them they are getting to you. I mean that is so bad that people do that and I know you see them as friends I know I'm one of your paterons.

I think the watermark idea would be the best thing for pateron

But I seriously think the amount of people that support you and don't do those things should keep you going with pateron. I mean people want to support your art as then we get more of it.

Star I hope you feel better, and I hope no other pateron does that, as it sad people do that.

Hugs :)

  luria

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  If i browse through FA i particularly search for a new comic from you.

Your Style of art is wonderful and i very enjoy the story and your thoughts in there.

You dont annoy anyone, the opposite is here.

  nazznikonanuke

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  It's ok that you feel this way, it's rather understandable because trust is very important and can be broken easily. But I would encourage you to follow your dreams, your desire, and wishes because they're will always be obsticyles, we just have to take a good leap over them! :) don't let them stumble you.
I hope you feel better real soon. My thoughts are with you. :) and I send lots of hugs!
Maybe the fantasy demo game will help those worries wash away. X3 (referring to your other journal. :)
Much smiles your way Star! I wish you a wonderful day! :)

  shytye

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  There are always gunna be art thieves, but maybe you just need to stop posting wips or maybe put a big water-mark over it so that nobody can steal it? I don't like water-marks but if people are posting it then other's have t know that its by YOU. Stay strong, people are mean and thats how it is. I'm sorry this is happening to you :(

  tiramizu

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  That's awful! I hate it when people do that with an artist's work. I can understand how you feel betrayed, who ever is doing this is doing something absolutely unacceptable! But pls don't shut down your patreon over it, you worked hard to have all these supporters and we're still here supporting you! Don't give up!!

  siclefamily

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  Hi there, yes I would hate to see you cut back on comics I am not going to lie and say otherwise. But with that being said if I were to weigh out the downside of less comic pages over that of you being used and abused I would favor you cutting back. That being said perhaps there are alternatives? There are many different ways to reward your patreons some of the things I have seen are inviting them in for streamed work. This allows them to see WIP without you actually posting it. Discounts on commissions can be made available. Private Q and A sessions without the artwork. Sure I love some of the doodles you do to answer questions but if theft is occurring and bugs you then stick to text. The opportunity to voice opinion on where you will take vacations (IE things like con A or B, or littles activity versus con) obviously you need to take vacation where you are happy but if there are multiple options you would enjoy let your patreons chime in. Obviously everyone loves free art which you do due, just make sure you don’t underestimate the value of it or try and do too much. Its extra work and only you know your schedule but I know one who offers 24hr sneak peak at things before they are free posted. Since the stuff is free posted very shortly afterwards they have had very little trouble with theft from patreon. Also never underestimate the simple value of a thank you. Taking the time to do up a personal thank you note and or doodle can go a very long way. I have loved the quick sketches you did up for me in streams and none of them seem to take you long. The advantage here is personalized stuff very quickly shows who is leaking when there is a leak.



But above all else I will support any decision you make as it is most important that you take care of yourself. Then let other things fall into place as they will.

  sarahpenguin

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  *piles obs hugs*

  jimmyarthur104

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  *cuddles close*

  vivalacony

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  Having only discovered Shine recently and become a Patreon supporter even more recently, I hope you don't close it. I'd like to support the comic while I can.

  asamikuro

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  Wow I was actually close. *blinks*

I'm very sorry someone would betray your trust like that, you are a wonderful friend Gemmy and I truly hope for the best for you.
As for patreon if you aren't feeling it right now, You can always put it on hold for a bit, we all understand if you need a breather to get your head together and sort stuff out.

  motheaten

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  I don't really know what other people do for rewards and such for their Patreon, but it seems to me that you would still have people pledging without the extra "exclusive" content if it meant supporting the comics. I'd hate to see you cut out Patreon as a source of income completely.

Getting to see more pages of Found and Shine a month is surely a reward and reason enough to pledge money, is it not? Even without any extra rewards.

  magicdiaper

#link     Posted: 4 months ago

  Is okays Star, you can do its. Just keep makin ya arts and if someones bein a jerk face meanie butt by stealin ya arts, then show em dat ya won't give ups and makes dat good stuffs. *hugs*