What did that asshat Phelps do this time?

Also, I'm not sad because of that day, nor was I sad when it happened. see, I live in canada, and unless it's something that happens in australia or japan, I don't really care.

Sorry if I'm cold.

I don't care what countries these things happen in. And stuff like this happens all over.

I care that people treat one another terribly. It doesn't matter which country.

It bothers me that many of the people in my own country don't care what happens to people elsewhere.

I remember seeing newspaper articles, even as a kid, where a plane goes down killing all 150 people on it, but the headline says "Two Americans killed in plane Crash."

I think it's horrible what happened to the people in New York. It's also terrible what happens to the people in every other country where someone decides to make their point by blowing up a bunch of people.

Well, you can blame that on our allegedly "liberal" media. A story like that supposedly affects Americans more if it involves Americans...so they automatically write that way, and yes, it DOES sound incredibly self-centered and heartless.

Maybe we ARE heartless, and that IS the only way to arouse our collective sympathies. But there are 5-6 billion people in the world and horrific tragedies happen every day SOMEwhere... It sucks, but there it is. People care most about things local to them...the further away it is, the easier it is to prioritize around it.

It is horrible what happened to the people in New York...and on those planes...and on any plane that goes down anywhere...and the everyday atrocities committed in the countries that terrorists come from...and the everday atrocities that happen right here, sometimes orchestrated by people in thousand dollar suits and sometimes over the contents of the cheapest wallet or purse.

The fact of his existence and legacy is enough to lump him in with the others. Mind you--he's only an obnoxious ass with a big mouth--Bush actually has power, and he isn't much better.

"The fact of his existence and legacy is enough to lump him in with the others. Mind you--he's only an obnoxious ass with a big mouth" me?

I agree with you on religious fanaticism, no matter which one it is.

No fucking religion in this world should preach that you should hate another man, who eats, breathes, sleeps, shits and pisses like you, just because he doesn't have the same faith.

To quote David Bowie, "Religion is for those who fear Hell. Spirituality is for those who've been through it." People are afraid of Hell today, but fail to see that it's on Earth.

This is my opinion, anyway.

Official "Me too," post.

That's an awesome quote. David Bowie rocks, and you rock for sharing that quote with us.

Thanks, dude. He's a man that's been everywhere and seen it all, as well as been through a lot.

True that.

And that's the worst thing, isn't it? The majority of "religious" people aren't spiritual at all. :[

This is why I like Buddhists.

THAT is an excellent quote! I believe in things, although not anything even closely related to any of the current organized religions, but one thing I don't believe is that I have a god-given right to fuck up anyone who doesn't agree with me. THAT you need religion for.

I agree.

I still can't believe these things happen because an old book says so.

"God hates men who love other men."

And yet, at the same time, it says "We are all God's children."

So much contradiction, and yet the only excuses are "God works in mysterious ways" or "It's part of God's plan."

two anectdotes from a christian friend i know: (though i know i'm not goign to get it 100% accurate)

"when faced with the inconsistencies of things like homosexuality, race, gender and other issues, a lot of christians tend to see it one of two ways. either god is a mean and spiteful buggar that brings causes us to sin in the world like how homosexual people are more genetic than choice (As research is starting to prove) or, the bible, the book which they've based their entire faith on... is wrong. a lot of christians do not like to have to face these kinds of questions so usually they just push it aside and say what they've been told to say with no real cognitive thought going on in their heads."

kinda why a lot of people will dodge the questions like that, especially when it comes to homosexuality.

It's amazing some would care more for a book than a living, breathing human being.

And I still don't understand why some believe being gay is a choice. If it was, then most kids wouldn't have to deal with the unimaginable stress and anxiety of having to come out to their parents and friends and dealing with their rejection afterwards.

I always want to say to people like that--do you think you could leave your spouse, or lover of the opposite sex, and go out and have the same kind of deep passionate love and committment to a person of the same sex? If not--then they are obviously mistaken and it ISN'T just a simple choice.

Better yet, how about if they were told by their church or their President that their loving relationship with that person of the opposite sex was a sin and should even be illegal. How would they enjoy their relationships being persecuted and trivialized?

Exactly.

I honestly don't know what happened to "separate Church and State."

if you are referring to the bible NOWHERE in the bible does it state GOD hates men who love other men. that is trasliterated by people that change around the menanings, not what it actually says. NOWHERE in the bible does it state homosexuality is wrong! this is a fact i have researched it, i have even proved it to several preachers who think they know what God meant on the one hand and then re-define what they want to state against homosexual love. i have an encyclopedia with about 55 phd's and master degrees stating what the bible said on this matter.
As for the president IF congress and the Democrats and Moveon.Org and the libereral media with an alternate agenda were not dimetrically opposed to anything he did from DAY ONE of his presidency, (they wanted Gore to win) then maybe things would be different had not traitors divulged secrets to the media, had not other 'people' stuffed national archives down thier pants, had not other ACLU lawyer-types not stonewalled and constantly opposed everything the USA has tried to do in this war then maybe things would be different.
What happened to those people that tried to impeach FDR in WW2? what happened to the Japanese Americans during that war? What happened to ANYONE that leaked secrets to the otherside in the cold WAR? does anyone remember?
But it is okay to do it now ...WHY?

As a Christian, I fully follow the Golden Rule, "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you". One of the ways I follow this is NOT THREATENING PEOPLE BECAUSE THEY HAVE A DIFFERENT FAITH. I'm sure Islam has a similar rule, most religions do. I don't want Jehova's Witnesses trying to convert me, so I don't try to convert atheists or Muslims(J-Wits might be fun to try to convert, though).
On the other hand, I'm technically an atheist, as I don't believe in God anyway, so I really "just associate myself with the Christian faith"(too long to type), so that makes it easier to not bug non-believers.
Hmm, although on the note of the Golden Rule, I suppose Osama would want others to make sure he stays Islamic, so he might still be following that rule. Religion has too many loopholes.

I don't think the Golden Rule is necessarily Christian, but now that I think about it, a lot of people don't follow it because they think it is religious...

And in a perfect world, after they go over the edge of that cliff, they'd land on some of these damn politicians.

I don't know what bothers me most... that people who wish to be enemies of this country caused all those deaths to further their purposes, or that people _in_ this country, who are supposed to be serving the public good, have taken those deaths to the bank, politically, to serve _their_ agendas.

Hate begets hate.

You're probably right. I'd probably better quit wishing people off cliffs, unless I want to be like them.

Sorta like Wily E, yeah lol

Ha ha! I didn't even think of that! But yes!

Bush wants Iraq's oil. He and Cheney are in the oil business. Apparently, though, there are pictures from 20 or 30 years ago of Cheney shaking hands with Hussein...they helped him get to power in the first place. The whole thing's a bunch of bullshit.

I do hope our troops come home safe, too, though. It's not their fault our government is fucked up, they're just doing their jobs and putting their lives on the line for it, and for that we should respect them.

I was absolutely against this whole mess from the beginning and couldn't believe that people were willing to allow Bush to literally START a war with another country because they MIGHT have weapons that they MIGHT use against us.

We do need a strong military, and if we are attacked, we SHOULD retaliate with the full might of which we are capable. But we should NOT just invade whatever country we happen to be annoyed with. That is fascism. We fought against Hussein once for doing that very thing!

Bush has divided the country, not to mention our military resorces, so that now, if we WERE attacked again, would we even be capable of defending ourselves? His greed and stupidity has not only squandered America's wealth and power to a large degree, but he has also permanently damaged our already strained credibility in foreign relations. He has basically PROVEN that Al Qaeda is right to fear us, which is partially what drives them in the first place.

in answer to this look this up yourself "Hussein may have been in support of anti-Western attacks by terrorists, but there's a big difference between saying you agree with something, and contributing resources to it.: - Hussien was awarding families with over 50,000 dollars for suicide attackers to hurt the united states in any way they could. Also Hussien was no longer abidding by the war he lost a few years before, remember the helicopter gunships he sent versus the shia in anbar? or the Kurdish artillery deaths from poison gas? also he was harboring Al Qaeda fighters in Iraq which bordered Afganistan. The fact that mushariff cannot control most of his contry outside the capital is why the war there is dragging on endlessly. the fact that Iran is positioning its army on the boder with Iraq is a peculiar fact lately or did you notice? Iran has been supplying Al Qaeda in Iraq with IED as well as ordinance for the last five years. i guess you missed that one...!

ibd always stated the same reasons for going into iraq, the mew tork times and the other papers as well as the leftist media kept everyone confused.

This day, this time, I was entering in a furry website for the first time in my life. Man, if those attacks really made a huge imprint in my life...

I'm glad you distinguish between religious and religious fanatic.

It astounds me so much that there are still folks who believe there is no 'justification' for the attacks. [I'm not blaming the victim. I am saying that those who launched this attack hated us for a specific reason. And it is not because we are not Islamic.]

We won WWIII by economically imploding the USSR, but WWIV won't be over for a long long time. Co-existence with people who believe that God has ordered them to kill all gays (etc., etc.) is not possible. Those who will not abandon these beliefs must be killed, preferably before they get nuclear weapons. Don't kid yourselves - that is likely to mean an awful lot of killing. Unfortunately politicians from both the Republicrats and the Demopublicans are are a big problem, as Coyote implied. It isn't just Bush. He will be gone soon, but I guarantee you that his replacement won't be significantly better regardless of party affiliation. The Federal government that was supposed to protect us from foreign enemies has long ago slipped its constitutional bounds, and is now primarily a machine for legalized robbery, not protection.

I think that WW3 was averted by the economic collapse of the USSR, but I don't think we had that much to do with it--their fascist (NOT communist) system essentially ran itself into the ground. Sure, we helped--but I think they did most of it to themselves. My concern is that we are travelling a similar road. If the political system gets any more divisive and dysfunctional, and the economic classes keep becomming more and more divergent, won't the same fate befall us?

I don't believe that it's impossible to coexist with Islam, only with the Islamic nutcases--just like it's nearly impossible to live with the Christian nutcases! It's only the extremists--who are just evil men using religion to teach and spread hate because they personally lust for power--who make things impossible.

I don't believe the parties are inherently evil--just corrupt to various degrees. Same for religious organizations. The ones that worry me are the bastards who are corrupt, evil, power-hungry, hypocrites who use these dangerous and powerful entities to manipulate the systems and ignorant or gullible people through fear and hate to further their personal goals. Yeesh...how's that for a sentence and a half! :P

I know how you feel Deathpuppy. I was in 8th grade when all this happened and to answer your question...No. Religious fanaticism has done no good for anybody, but instead has caused many wars and countless and senseless killings. But today we too also celebrate the lives of the heroes on the United 93 or 91 who fought their hijackers and crashed in a Pennsylvania field. Respect eachother's differences and don't judge them for those differences.

Exactly! Although i respect religion and everyone's opinion on it, i do not really like it when people are very extreme with it. Also, it seems that people are starting to forget about 9/11 because i was in school and usually they say something every year, but this year they didn't!

Really? Today we had a long moment of silence, but the day just kept on as normal after.

I was listening to Johnboy and Billy in the morning when the first struck.. Thought they were doing some promo thing until saw second hit on the tellie. Was... surreal and breath-taking in a terrifying manner.

I remember that day quite well for different reasons. It was my first day out of the wheelchair
I had spent most of the year in. On Jan 14 2001, I went down a flight of stairs at work the
hard way and utterly shattered my left leg. It was primary day and I was going to vote and
by damn, I was going to walk to my polling place (it was only 5 blocks) well I didn't make it,
got about two blocks and was just too tired and my leg, (still in a brace) was hurting too
much so I came home and curled up on the couch. I had just dozed off when my mate's
brother came downstairs and woke me, telling me to turn on the TV. I live in NYC and I
worked at the WTC for a little while before I got a job I really liked, at the animal shelter
(which is where I fell down the stairs) And you know, even now I find it hard to believe
in the level of hate and insanity it took for someone to conceive of and perpetrate such
an act of madness.

It was indeed an act of madness--and frankly, if there really is such a thing as true, unredeemible evil, we saw a demostration of it on 9/11/01.

There can never be ANY excuse for such a crime. Ever. Al Qaeda deserved to pay the penalty for that attack...it's a shame we decided to try and take over the entire Middle East while we were at it. If we HAD controlled Afghanastan AND Iraq--we would have had Iran in a vice grip--and I'd be willing to bet, if the Republicans were still in office, we would invade them as well. But Iraq wasn't the easy target Bush thought it would be, and because he divided our forces, we aren't even really in control of Afghanastan...so now Iran is free to do whatever they want--and their government is CONTROLLED by the very extremist religious elements who fear us most. Way to go, Mr. President. But enough about him...

I'm glad you're leg is better--are you fully recovered now? Sounds like it was a pretty nasty fall! I'm REALLY glad you didn't still work at the WTC!!!

You won't get any objections from me, Sir Deathpuppy. Personally, if they're all so willing to die for their Maker, they can go ahead and do it. Just one problem...when these guys go, it won't be quietly. If these guys are going to die for God or Allah or whatever they believe in, they're going to pull as many people as they possibly can down with them. The 9/11 attacks (and what happened in their aftermath) are perfect illustrations of such fanaticism.

6 years ago: I was going from the dorm to my musical repair class at Keyano College, and there were televisions in the hall showing what was happening.

I felt that Bush had a golden opportunity to prove himself a president of the likes of Wilson, Roosevelt, and Lincoln. I can only look back, and gape at how he blew it.

sigh... okay here goes "I felt that Bush had a golden opportunity to prove himself a president of the likes of Wilson, Roosevelt, and Lincoln. I can only look back, and gape at how he blew it.

Wilson allowed the french and the British generals to command Pershing in WW1, FDR had a long string of generals and disasters before he found Macarther and Eisenhower, lincoln went through all of the top generals before going with a lesser known one star named Grant. Bush has a guy now named Patreaus. he looks more promising. look at history show me any war where the attacked country HAD the best guy in command at the start! There are none!

i know i might get flamed big time for this. but.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7E3oIbO0AWE

either greed is a terrible thing, or religions should die if people would do that for no reason other than sheer bigotry...its pathetic....

but, its how the world has gone, millions of people have died in the name of some god

Interesting...but a bit too "Conspiracy Theory" for my tastes. I think alot more happens by accident or coincidence in this world than by design. Why are conspiritors always so omnipotent with the conspiracy, but so stupid about running everything else, or about keeping the secrets?

accidents do happen but sometimes it just gets bullshitted. was 9/11 planned, i dont know, i feel for the families who lost friends and loved ones at the hands of our government or terrorism. either way...its both corrupt.

as for people running the conspiracy, they just want to make it seem like they are not capable of planning such a thing. so they act like dumb asses (DUBYA) to draw attention away from them

Hanlon's Razor comes to mind: "Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity."

(The corrollary generally runs "but don't rule out malice" or "but keep your eyes open". It is quite possible that someone being opportunistic was involved... just probably not to the degree that most conspiracy theories suggest.)

Actually--that was probably the best thing he's DONE as president...if only he had continued to do things like that instead of deciding he wanted to be "a war President".

I'm sure he did investigate it all fully. I'm sure they know a lot more about what's going on behind the political scenes of those countries than any of us will ever know. But he still pushed his personal agenda over the protests of half the world. He still VASTLY underestimated the hornet's nest he was shoving American forces into. And he is STILL, to this day confident that his personal morality and beleifs are better than anyone elses and that he should be allowed to do whatever the fuck he wants--without question.

We're fortunate that our government is set up so that it's difficult, if ot impossible, for a single individual to take over and set himself up as an emperor, because if he could have--I'd be willing to bet, he WOULD have.

That's why I say that sitting in a classroom, pimping for the cameras was the best thing he ever did as President--because at least while he was doing that--he wasn't using a horrific tragedy to further his personal and his party's political goals.

a fact you do not know, bin laden is born in Yemen not saudi arabia. Yemen for centuries has been the haven for breeding pirates and other land (caravan) terrorists. Also ALL of the top people have their loved ones living in San Deigo california, Why? because they are safe here away from the carnage of war in the middle east. another little known fact, don't believe me, take nothing i say as real look it up yourself, then find out it is true!

why do we even remember the day, it was tragic and saddening, the only thing coming from remembering this day that i see is nothing good. it's my friend's birthday, and i'd rather celebrate the birth of my friend than a day many people died

No one's actually celebrating, dude. We remember BECAUSE it was horrible. If people block out the bad and only remember the good, then it breeds ignorance. Ignorance isn't bliss, it just causes more pain...to remember is to better prepare yourself in case it happens again.

And also, we remember out of respect for those who passed on this day six years ago. Their lives should not be forgotten just because those lives were ended in tragedy.

i don't know what i did to provoke that attitude, but i'm sorry. thanks for your opinion

What attitude? O_o You said you didn't understand why, and I explained why. That's why people of America do it, it's not my opinion.

never mind, you're right, sorry

It's not a day to celebrate or anything...just a day to remember that there are people in the world who are evil and cruel and should be watched and resisted. Also, the people who died deserve to be thought about and it should be remembered that for one brief day, we were all (or at least mostly) truly united by a common cause and grief.

It's Roxanne Dawson's birthday too. (Torres from ST: Voyager.) I was thinking earlier how much it would suck for your BD to be today...

oh.. well i never really thought of it like that

thanks

There was a report on TV about a child who was born on that day. They always celebrate the kid's birthday on a different day. This year, the kid's actual celebration will be this upcoming Sunday. It would be hard to hold a birthday party on such a solomn day. Some people, like me, would be more than happy to go to a birthday party on that day, but not everybody. I'm glad I don't have to share that day with anything.

yes, it would be better that, too. My parents celebrate their wedding aniversary on this day so i'm kind of pissed at Al Qaeda for yet another reason. My father is dead (3/12/88) but it was important to my mother who is still alive.

Bush is just making it worse i guess...
and my birthday is 9/11 x_x yeah it sucks cuz now everytime i have my birthday, ill see alot of mourning going on >.<

i know, i had a good birthday yesterday ^^
thanks :)

Stoopid terrorists. *kicks them and Bush, and other christian leaders for giving people like him bad names* :-P Stoopid meanies...

Yeah! Meanies suck! ^0^