*deletes the depressive portal to my soul*

This i extremely quick but:

-history highlight on the "satanic panic" of the 1990's: USA and/or internationally
-atheism vs. laveyan satanism: comapre/contrast
-the goat symbol in other cultures & what it means to laveyan

Sorry, haven't gone through th blogs so there may be repeats

Also, form your perspective as a genuine LaVeyan, I'd like you to answer some quesitons I had:

"6. Satan represents responsibility to the responsible, instead of concern for psychic vampires!" (Nine Satanic Statements)

What the hell are "psychic vampires?"

"1. Do not give opinions or advice unless you are asked." (Eleven Rules Of The Earth)

Doesn't the very existence of this account and of this religion in general contradict this? Unless you consider look at the page "asking."

"2. Do not tell your troubles to others unless you are sure they want to hear them."

Anthropologically, this is impossible for women. Not to say all do, but generally women see language as a form of socialization, whereas men see it as a task. This is why, when the husband comes home from a long day at work, all he wants to do is sit down and watch TV. Similarly, suppose a couple awakes in the morning, with the wife/girlfriend remarking something like "the gutters sure are full." She probably means nothign by it, just an observation, but the male soon responds "alright, I'll take care of it." Of course, in the former scenario, it's not unlikely that the man does care for what his wife says and the wife knows it, but how do we judge this? Also, if LaVeyanism "represents indulgence, instead of abstinence," why would one abstain from venting one's thoughts?

you bring up some very interesting points, i have always wondered about the "psychic vampires" myself, i don't know the answers to these but I applaud you for bringing these up and look forward to how others respond and answer these questions.

Thanks.

By the way, it's not like I have anything against LaVey's philosophy; on the contrary, I've recently considered converting. I think pretty much every religion, including atheism, has gray areas and wording that's innevitably non-universal, becuase we as humans are never simply black or white. Even so, this is no reason to not try to clarify things; afterall, I think, it's in our nature.

There's some other points I'm sure I've yet to make, though I'm too wishy-washy at the moment to even begin trying to evaluate these various beliefs.

I agree, did bring up some very interesting points and I applaud his courage to ask.

I believe from what I've read, a psychic vampire is anyone who has a dampening affect on the moods and social synergies of people around them. Sometimes, the effect is caused with deliberate intentions; be it maliciously or for the sake of sating one's appetite for amusement. Then there are those who are unconscious of their negative aura on others, often causing people to experience or express similar feelings of discontentment, depression, or mental weariness. These folks are often identified with personality flaws that tends to drag the over all feel of a social setting down without little to no direct interaction. They tend to be depressed themselves, thriving off of those who can relate to their pain or those who thrive off of complaining to get their emotional baggage off their shoulders.

Or at least... So I've read.

Psychic Vampires are those who drain others of their vital energy. Pretty much they're the people who make you feel bad or guilty if you were to ever leave them out of something. Or they'll constantly drop hints for favors that they'll never return; often times using reverse psychology. [LaVey, Anton. The Satanic Bible. Book Of Lucifer, Chapter 7, Page 75]
These are more commonly known as Needy or High Maintenance people. All they do is take without giving anything in return.

It's one thing to just push advice on people, especially when it's not wanted or needed, and another to have it openly available. This account is here for those who are willing to ask for it. Many people are curious but are either too shy or not sure how to ask so I am here to try and provide them with a safe environment where they can ask anything without fear of being attacked for it.
*On a side note I also believe in the rule, "You don't like it then don't look at it"

It's not about abstaining form venting your thoughts; it's about showing respect for the other person. If you feel the need to vent you should always ask someone to listen to you instead of just talking their ear off and wasting their time.

I hope I was able to shed some light and answer your questions fully.

Yep, that was pretty concise. Thanks.

I like the idea of comparing and contrasting the difference between Atheism and LaVeyan Satanism. I would need to have someone who is a full out atheist to be part of the discussion though. Unfortunately I do not know of anyone who is, if you know someone who is and is willing to discuss it let me know ok?

Well, I consider myself an atheist. YOu'd have to be more specific about "full-out" atheism; personally, while I do keep in mind there may be a small chance of some force we as humans cannot or have yet to comprehend that runs the universe/existence as we know it, maybe even one who cares about morals, I adamantly believe it is far more likely that we are simply here because we are here. That is, there is no god/s, especially one that believes in our inconsistent and impossibly varied beliefs enough for us to understand his/her/it's judgement, and while there is as of yet no way to disprove god/s, there's no evidence to support the contrary. I also don't believe in much of the spiritual i.e. souls, spirits, angels, demons, god, satan... all are manifestaitons of our fears and an attempt by humankind to explain, at least temporarily, why everything is the way it is (and why good things happen to bad people/vice-versa). The paranormal, unnexplained and extremely rare, odd occurences in life are merely things we have yet to find a satisfying explanation for; religion and superstition are the placeholders of science.

Of course, I'm also pretty anti-christian, though that doesn't have anything to do with atheist logic. I'll try not to mix the two, since it give both a bad name.

Well when I said "full out" I was merely saying that someone who is an absolute atheist and not agnostic. Most of my friends say they don't believe in "God" and that they're atheist but they'll also say that there is still a chance that there is something out there. So a "full out" atheist is someone who doesn't go back and say "well maybe there is...".

Guess I'm not what you're looking for then? Oh well.

well from what I gather, the church of satan is atheistic in nature and so from my point of view atm the church of satan seems to be atheism with a lot more philosophical concepts attached to it that deal with certain social and political hypocrisies and irrational beliefs.

Looking through amazon's reviews on the Satanic Bible... some interesting points being brung up.

A good discussion, or at least soemthign to elaborate on, is the [LaVeyan] church's position on LaVey's supposed plagiarism. Apparently a lot of this book was re-hashed philosophy from differnet sources, plus LaVey himself didn't write the book.

A more open-ended discussion, I believe, and one that needs to be tackled, is the similarities between capitalism and satanism. Both promote an idea of freedom and power gained through believing in and exercising one's own power as a human being, yet capitalism historically hasn't been all too kind to the earth or the human spirit. And in the United States where entreprenuerism is held in high regard, in combination with a roughly 75% Christian population, are the LaVeyans any better off?

-Implying that capitalism is bad.

It has potential, that's the scary thing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pin8fbdGV9Y

If true capitalism really is laissiez faire, it's more like "everybody for themselves" rather than "let it be," and because of abuse in the past of the eco system and of human dignity in general, you can understnad why I'm apprehensive to associate with something that closely resembles the capitalist philosophy. Of course capitalism also opens doors, if you can do it you'll make it i.e. the american dream yadda yadda, but while it isn't neccessary to have everyone be wealthy, it's criminal what the wealthy can get away with, and the discrepancies in basic protection cast a shadow of doubt over any "opportunity" one might have.

Of course, Capitalism isn't inherently "good" or "evil," nothing is. It's obviously worked well enough that the U.S. has been prosperous enough to spread the philosophy and help/hinder other parts of the world. However, like anything human, there's flaws to it, and the consequences of capitalism in my eye are just as serious as those of communism, the latter of which also looks good on paper but in practice has failed/is failing numerous times.

I personally am fascinated by all religions of course non-theistic ones appeal to me the most because they tend to make the most sense to me (as an atheist myself). I have looked into Taoism, Shintoism, Hinduism, Buddhism and several others, but the two that i find the most appealing are Satanism and Humanism. If at all possible I would like to discuss what makes these two distinct from one another. From what I observe humanism seems to focus on the power of humans and the welfare of mankind as a whole and Satanism seems to focus more on the individual, however both seem to advocate individual freedoms.

i wouldn't mind getting into a discussion about this too. unfortunately i don't know much about humanism and the only person who i know of who has information about it is no longer on FA.

I'm ordained in humanism.

Humanism originated in the West with the Greek philosopher Socrates, and in the East with the Chinese philosopher Kung Fu Tzu (Confucius) about 2,500 years ago. Socrates felt that in order to develop sound values people should learn how to think for themselves.

Humanism has two core beliefs, from which many important implications follow. An analogy to a court of law may help to clarify these beliefs.

In the American system of law, jurors attempt to reach decisions about the guilt or innocence of a defendant based solely on evidence. In much the same way, a good Humanist will try to find good evidence for all of his or her beliefs, including his or her religious and political convictions. This analogy with a court of law can be extended: jurors must, of course, be alert to misleading testimony. Even outside of a court of law, Humanists believe that people must learn how to sift and assess what they are told by the media, or by figures of authority, no matter who those figures happen to be. Defendants cannot always be relied upon to provide reliable, unbiased testimony. Similarly, the media, and authority figures too, often have an agenda of their own—frequently the enhancement of someone's wealth or power. And even when this is not the case, authorities are themselves often uninformed or confused. In short, then, the first Humanist core conviction is that all beliefs, no matter what sort, must be grounded in carefully sifted facts.

Humanists believe that the evidence that our values have a supernatural basis is weak; on the other hand, Humanists find compelling the evidence that our values are based in the human person. Therefore, in order to know whether a given course of conduct is meaningful or right, we can ask ourselves whether it promotes the maintenance or development of the normal capabilities of human beings, such as thinking, feeling, and physical health.


Some of the important implications following from these core convctions are:

People should try hard to get the facts before forming opinions or commiting to values.
People should base their values primarily upon the worth and inherent dignity of the human person.
The refinement of any good value system is the project of a lifetime. There is no single, comprehensive, authoritative source of truth. The idea that all people are much the same everywhere, and are equally entitled to justice and opportunity regardless of race or gender or sexuality, owes much to Humanism.

Humanism as religion

Humanism is a down-to-earth philosophical movement that represents a turn toward the satisfaction of human needs, both material and spiritual, and the fulfillment of human potential, here and now. Humanism therefore lacks much interest in the supernatural and theological, or in an afterlife.

Linking religious and secular humanists is the belief that nothing should ever be accepted on faith. There must always be good evidence for beliefs, religious or otherwise. This is the most fundamental tenet of rationalism. On the other hand, nothing specific to Humanism precludes belief in "God". Indeed, the controversy concerning the existence of "God" is far less relevant to values than ordinarily supposed.

Humanism and Science

The three pillars of rationalism are science, mathematics, and philosophy. All three are important to the Humanist as sources of trustworthy understanding. However, there are immense differences between the organic and inorganic realms. A rock, for example, has no feelings or thoughts, and therefore isn't sentient. It follows that a rock cannot have values; and we can do neither harm nor good to a rock. Human beings, by contrast, have both thoughts and feelings, and are sentient. It is from this sentience that all of our values follow.

However, one approach to science, that of reductionistic materialism, is ill-equipped to either recognize or appreciate the distinction between the sentient and the non-sentient. The vastly more Humanistic alternative is that of emergentist materialism , the view that the whole is greater than the sum of its parts in the natural world generally, and especially in the case of the human mind. Indeed, we would go so far as to say that anyone who takes exception to emergentist materialism is no genuine Humanist at all.


In summary, then: Humanism is an a fact-based philosophy, that emphasizes the importance of reason and the indispensability of both evidence and compassion for others in the formation of values. Contemporary humanistic morality judges acts primarily on the basis of their affect upon other human beings. Humanists believe that the purposes of life are found in the meeting of human needs —intellectual, emotional, and spiritual—and in the fulfillment of human capabilities, mental and physical.

As you can see Satanism shares much with Humanism in core philosophy. It is important to understand Humanism to unlock your full political as a Satanist.