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When talking about those who have deceased.
14 years ago
As a general rule of thumb - it's not respectful to talk ill of the dead, especially those who have recently passed.
However - I heard something on the radio today about an music artist who recently died (I forget the name exactly because she wasn't familiar to me). They held a moment of silence for her.
Later, a caller phoned in and said something along the lines of. "She was a drug user, it's not too surprising that she was killed."
The radio host seemed to think this was offensive and accused the caller of having a lack of courtesy.
Another caller came in and pointed out the fact that there wasn't a moment of silence given on the show to people who die innocently, and yet who are not celebrities (terrorist attacks, major accidents, ect).
I was thinking - wouldn't saying something along the lines of "He/she was old and lived a long life, it's not surprising that they died." about the same as the previous quote? Why should we consider it to be more offensive about weather a druggie dies? Why is that more offensive to say than the fact that someone lived a long life? It's merely a statement of their history as a reason to their eventual demise.
I understand why celebrities get more attention when they pass because more people connect to names in the media than say.. fred down the street. But I don't understand why stating their likely reason for death would be considered disrespectful.
However - I heard something on the radio today about an music artist who recently died (I forget the name exactly because she wasn't familiar to me). They held a moment of silence for her.
Later, a caller phoned in and said something along the lines of. "She was a drug user, it's not too surprising that she was killed."
The radio host seemed to think this was offensive and accused the caller of having a lack of courtesy.
Another caller came in and pointed out the fact that there wasn't a moment of silence given on the show to people who die innocently, and yet who are not celebrities (terrorist attacks, major accidents, ect).
I was thinking - wouldn't saying something along the lines of "He/she was old and lived a long life, it's not surprising that they died." about the same as the previous quote? Why should we consider it to be more offensive about weather a druggie dies? Why is that more offensive to say than the fact that someone lived a long life? It's merely a statement of their history as a reason to their eventual demise.
I understand why celebrities get more attention when they pass because more people connect to names in the media than say.. fred down the street. But I don't understand why stating their likely reason for death would be considered disrespectful.
And yeah, people mourned for Osama (which they should have done) but are celebrating HER death... fucked up, man.
Honestly, I see no issue with speaking ill of the dead. I say speak the truth about how somebody lived, if they made you happy, celebrate how they lived and speak well of them. If they were a scumbag, say so. Hiding the truth is silly imo.
When somebody is a mass murderer (Osama and the like), I see a celebration of their death as a celebration of life, that they won't be able to take any more innocent lives.
Anyway, that's just my general stance on attitudes towards death. Don't really know anything about this specific death so I can't comment on it.
Adolf Hitler was a megalomaniac who did terrible atrocities to the human race. But what he GAVE to the world is stuff you couldn't live without. Whether it was actual machinery like rockets, jet engines, even a higher understanding of diseases and how to treat them, or concepts for new machines, weapons, etc. Its funny to think back that one of the pushing points for Hitler to begin his hatred of the Jewish community was being rejected by a Jewish art school. Makes me wonder of the what-ifs things had happened differently. Whose name we'd be thinking of for the cause of WW2.
Don't go blowing steam that they're evil and shit. Don't spout that Osama killed for "some stupid religion." Christians have killed millions over the years since its conception because others didn't believe in "their" way. The fact is the USA did an atrocious thing as well by not giving him a burial. "Being the better man?" what happened to that? No, instead we became just what he thought of us as, asshole infidels. Yep, we've lived up to our world expectations. Congratulations every American, our country is viewed as being fat-assed, sack-o-shit assholes. So for shame sir. For shame on you for wagging the finger on a deceased person, no matter what they have done, for you are no saint yourself. Let he who hath no sin cast the first stone, hm? Never heard of it?
Celebrating life is one thing. Yay their dead no more tyranny, no more heartache, no more fear, but don't desecrate their name with slander. Sure going to be ironic to get to the Heavenly gates (whichever religion you may believe in) and hear the ill deeds and words done/said to others read back to you.
All in all. This is a bad topic and the journal removed because this will just go on and on. People have infinite opinions on things and no side will be persuaded despite real facts being formulated and presented in the opinions.
Amy Winehouse on the other hand was a human being with a career and friends and family nd wasn't out hurting people cept herself with drugs.
She did good for the world. She deserves some grievance :b
I miss her already.
Maybe if you go to Google.com and type in the search bar "Amy Winehouse" you might find some information.
I know that might not be quite the same boat, but hey, it still deals with people misunderstanding the speaker's intentions and truly believing they are insensitive or wrong for saying so. It's sad not all people can speak on the same wavelength, there'd be a lot less hate if we were.
Do people not read newspapers anymore?
I'm surprised they didn't shoot on sight
It's inhumane to kill a childkiller, I guess. I'm sure nobody would have cared if he -was- shot, though.
Remember, he's a fundamentalist Christian and had right-wing tendencies... He did it cuz of his Christian beliefs. There are others that saw him as a hero...
Killing him would only lead to more attacks. I say send him to prison for a good few years of rape.
Also, he plead not guilty, but confessed he did the attacks. He's not insane... His plead means he's not regretting his actions... Basically telling the world he doesn't care he killed 80+ children and would do so again if given the opportunity.
He even had plans to blow up nuclear power plants in Belgium because he thinks my rainy ol' country is a nest of evil.
But you are right, as is that dude on the radio.
That's my guess.
HOWEVER,
It's just a fact that she abused drugs heavily and she was on the fast track to something like this.
It's all about the tone and usage I guess though.
Then again, if it's not someone that I know, most deaths aside from major unfortunate tragedies don't really phase me, and even then I'm not entirely devastated. I had about the same reaction in regards to Winehouse as I did with Michael Jackson: "Oh, bummer." That was it. It didn't matter what they did when they were alive or how famous they were. I felt bad that they died, but I had no emotional connection to them so it didn't really phase me. I'm not that funny of a person, so I can't really make jokes, but I would still crack-wise and laugh at jokes about Michael Jackson right after his death; people got mad, but I didn't really care. He did good things, he maybe did bad things, he was popular, he was a living joke, whatever. I didn't have an emotional tie to him and therefore nothing really phased me.
I think that's why some people are willing to bite off other people's head over stuff like this. Emotions manifest over someone's death differently. The people who say that they were deeply effected by their death are culturally obligated to chastise anyone who says anything remotely 'demeaning' of the said person who died.
If someone went to my grandpa's funeral and said something negative about them, I might be tempted to usher the dude out by the scruff of his neck. If someone I don't know goes on a radio show and says something mean about someone I don't know who DOESN'T deserve it, I'd probably go, 'Aww, dude, that's not cool.' If someone I don't know goes on a radio show and says something mean yet PLAUSIBLE about someone I don't know.... Ehhh.
I think my anger lies in how much attention celebrities get in their deaths as opposed to the average Joe. Like in the instance what Sabby said up there, when a celebrity that I don't even know about dies because of her bad choices, gets MORE attention than a LOTS of INNOCENT people who didn't deserve to die. When silly media gets overblown with stuff like that is when I lose pretty much ALL of my sympathies for the dead person and, more so, their media supporters. I wouldn't've made jokes because I try to keep the moral high ground, but if something needs to be said, it SHOULD be said.
Making jokes about the dead is like obtaining the use of a copyrighted song; you can't use it until the subject matter is long forgotten, unless you feel like going against the grain.
ALL THEIR FAULT ETC
As for speaking ill of the dead, in most cases I don't see why we shouldn't. It's not like they're going to be offended by it.
The radio caller you mention is a type of person that keeps a more impartial view to something like the death of a high-profile person, but to the people that would be much more mournful of that person's passing they consider it to be disrespectful. They equate someone stating, "Well, with her lifestyle, it's not a big surprise she died" with "Well, with her lifestyle, I'm glad she died". They might keep a mindset that paints the person's passing as a tragic accident, even if they are aware of factors in their life that obviously contributed to their demise.
I guess it all really depends on the person, though. Not just the deceased, but the living ones as well.
Outright celebrating her death however is just freaking wrong. She was an arrogant idiot but not evil.
Moments of silence are mostly held in the soldiers hometown~
Soldiers dont get media time cause ppl dont make money off of their deaths, in this case.. their blasting her name and face everywhere cause the publicity makes money.
It's sad, yes, but at the same time, it's not surprising.
but I do agree... This is a really hard topic for me though to go on about though...
Just my opinion.
I think the reason that being not surprised at her death because of her drugs usage seems offensive is because it confronts them with a fault she made. I think it just kinda sounds like "That's what you get for doing drugs".
Personally I could care less. She was a drug addict, and that killed her in the end (I think it did, but I don't know the whole story). There's not much more to it than that, in my opinion.
RAAAAHHHHHHH... *pops* :<
Also the fact that people's work get's more famous after they die is kinda weird also, like all o those Michael Jackson album's that were released after his death because they weren't good enough to release while he was alive.
I feel more for the familes of celebrities that celebs myself. Just imagine how much vicious info is going to be said about Amy Winehouse that her family and friends have to hear just because she's was a celeb.
But really, no one found it surprising she died young... Realize that her first song was about how she refused going to rehab :P Realize that she showed up drunk to her own concerts, rendering her incapable of singing... Let's just say her last name is very appropriate.
And yeah, I think a moment of silence for the 80-90 innocent teens who died in some insane Christian fundamentalist terror attack in Oslo would've been more appropriate too.
First caller, not a strong point to make though. And, yeah, a bit offensive.
Second caller, much harder to ignore. I'm sure the DJ would ask for a moment silence for his mother/brother/sister if they passed, but would he have one for a murder victim he didn't know?
but the point is: during the mourning period of someone else's death, as a question of respect, one should be so cold about the dead person.
time passes and wounds heal and etc. but there is a diference between someone saying to you, "well, your grandpa was old enough anyway" the day after he died and after the wounds have healed and acceptance came and all that
in a nut-shell: call her names after people accept she passed-on, period.
I honestly don't get the reason as to why people automatically think "Drug User = Bad Person", they are after all just us, normal people, the only difference is what they chose in their decisions in life and yet rather than help those out of those decisions, we instead choose to berate them for it which would in turn cause them to keep going down the dark path their heading.
Why go to insult someone who recently died on a live Radio show? For publicity to get a point off that doesn't exist. I mean really, what was the point in this person to spread her/his moronic ideology to others only to get blasted back for not even showing at least a sign of common courtesy and respect for the recently dead. It's absurd and stupid. I may not be a religious man, but people like that are likely to be damned to a servitude in hell for their actions.
I honestly wish people would just wake up and realize what they are saying to someone in light of recent news, I know if someone spoke to me like that I'm sure they wouldn't like it if I said "When you die, you'll be forgotten and if we do remember you, it's for all the bad decisions you made in life".
Harsh maybe, but when stupidity shows itself like that, it deserves it in more ways than one.
That being said, it's sad that people die, but it happens all the time. Amy Winehouse was a nobody to me. Not in a disrespectful way, but in the fact that I have no clue who she is or what she did. All I know is that she died and apparently that's supposed to mean something to someone.
Honestly, when the media sensationalize things like this it kind of annoys me. Makes me think that they're trying to make people elicit a reaction to it. Unless there's foul play suspected then who really cares?
Just another person's opinion. :)
Things may be true about the deceased, but those who cared about them generally tend to be touchy on the matter of anything being said about them. It's true that such and such was on drugs just like it was apparrantly true that Allayna was a bitch, but no one wants to hear that in their time of mourning. Saying someone was on drugs is generally a negative thing and says that why they died is saying it's their own fault their dead. Saying someone died of old age or cancer is something beyond their control and thus can't be taken negatively. That's my thought on it...and I felt like sharing that story.