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Fandom = Industry?
14 years ago
General
Aham. Okay, I'm not a very widely known FA user, so I wonder who will really read this, but here I go anyway.
It comes to my attention that the price drawing artists charge for theirs works has been theme for long, inconclusive discussions (or drama if you prefer) in the furry fandom. And while I've already expressed my opinion in lots of places about the subject, today I found something quiiiiite interesting:
http://s3.amazonaws.com/data.tumblr.....o1_r1_1280.jpg
From:
http://bambicandi.tumblr.com/post/1.....m-finally-made
Anyway, I'll explain what the picture is/was in case you are unable to see it:
[It shows two pictures of a furry, one black and white and another colored]
Illustration pricelist
Industry standart
Black and white Illustration
Spread [3508x4961px]$500-1500
Full page [2480x3508px]$500-950
Quarter Page [620x877px]$100-350
Colour Illustration
Spread [3508x4961px]$700-$2000
Full page [2480x3508px]$500-1500
Quarter Page [620x877px]$200-$400
'Fandom' Average
Black and white Illustration
Spread [3508x4961px]$10-50
Full page [2480x3508px]$5-30
Quarter Page [620x877px]$5-30
Colour Illustration
Spread [3508x4961px]$50-200
Full page [2480x3508px]$20-70
Quarter Page [620x877px]$10-30
Stop whining.
Industry standart is based on a book illustration pricelist from the Handbook of Pricing and Ethical Guidelines by the Graphic Artists Guild edition 13.
Artists check out this book for your own good.
While I don't own such mentioned book, it seems to be true information. GAG infact has such book. While the author of the blog goes into the subject, it's briefly. So I'm going to be way more indepth with this.
First of all, if you were an artist, what would be your reaction toward these cases:
"Hi! I'd like a nice artwork to put on my bedroom wall. What's your price?"
"Hi! I'd like a nice artwork to put in the advertising of our new software we're releasing. What's your price?"
If this isn't obvious enough, these are two very different clients. One is the industry, other is the fandom. The problem that it might cause to artist is related to how he handles such kind of clients. While we see the furry part of them with the artworks posted here in FA, we might not know for sure if the same artist also works for. Moreover, we don't know how the artist get his living, if he has a job and what he does in such job.
On the other hand, we have the other side of the story, and with both parts we have "market", or economy. Let me introduce a briefly lesson about economy:
On the martket there's something that has been called "invisible hand", which is a symbolic representation that the market regulates itself, usually based on supply and demand. For example:
If the price of a soap is lower than the expected, everyone will choose to buy it instead of another soap. However, if everyone is buying it, soon there won't be so easy to find that soap, thenfore people will start to pay more for that soap just to have it.
If the price of the soap however is higher than the expected, everyone will buy ANOTHER soap. Thenfore there will be plenty of that expensive soap, so to make it able to sell it, they will try to sell it cheaper.
Okay please, this is just an example, I know economy is way more complex than this, so is this example. But you probably got the basics by now.
The "market" of drawing artists only in FA is big enough to make you able to choose between tons of different artists. While we usually like and/or want one more than others, you still have plenty of options regardless. But the same rule of the economy applies too. This results in a certain ocasion that happened to a few artists:
"Well, if they are still affording for my drawings, I'm still charging this price."
Which infact, makes sense. While some artists are looking to the wall waiting for having a commission to do, some must limit theirs commissions to a determinated number of slots. This is because drawing takes time to do! The number of slots is determinated by the artist to be able to provide a reasonable time to finish (because nobody wants to wait a drawing still being made after 5 months since paid already) and because every artist has it's own pace to finish the drawings. If the artist takes 1 hour to finish the drawing, 100 drawings would take 100 hours! That would take about 4 days if you consider that the artist can remain drawing for 100 hours straight without sleeping, eating or going to the bathroom. Even if the artist can draw that fast, some artist would take even days for the same drawing - every artist is unique.
But the main idea of this explanation is understanding that drawing takes time, and the number of slots availables affects enourmeously the time required to finish all the drawings from the slot batch. Also, that while nobody can keep 100 hours straight drawing, the ammount of time available to the artist per day depends directly of whatever he does when not drawing.
Which means, the more time the artist spends his time per day to draw, more drawings will be finished in less time, so the artist will get more money per day from the commissions.
So! If drawing is what the artist loves to do, wouldn't the artist like to spend the whole day doing it, or at least most part of it, if he/she doesn't already? Probably they would. Would them like to have that lovely time doing what they like being eaten by a hatefull/stressing job? Probably not. BUT! If they are going to keep drawing for commissions the whole day and not have a job, will the commissions with the prices sugested by the fandom sufice? Will it be enough to pay the bills, the gas, the food, the energetics, or even that Cintiq that they always dream of? Sadly, probably not.
Oh well, derp, the solution seems pretty obvious, right? Well....... no. Now comes the other side of the story, the fandom.
This is simple, I'll go thru the statistics. How old are you? Do you a have a job that pays pretty well that you can live only by it and yet have plenty of money to spend on something else? Or do you have a job that barely pays your college so you have to imagine that that cereal bar is some sort of magical food that trully satisfies your hunger and all the vitamins and stuff that the doctors says you need to eat daily? Or you're not even in college because you're too young for that so it's actually mom/dad who gives you the money since you still live with them?
SO! With all that money that you do every month/week, would you spend $100 in a black and white 800x600px image of your fursona? (Look at those pixels dude they're so cool, I think it's your fursona's eyes.) Oh, or maybe would you spend $2000 in a 3508x4961px color image that features your fursona and your friend/boyfriend/girlfriend in an awesome fighting scene with tons of details? No. And personaly I find $450 already too much! *bitch-invisible-slap*.
This is, of course, based on statistics, what is preceieved from the fandom. After all, while the fandom exists by over 30 years, most of us heard about it only on this millenium. So most of us just won't be able to afford any price not even near of what the industry sugests AND PAYS for. (And yes, they pay that ammount) Most of us probably wouldn't even if we had the money infact, since there're things more important spend money on, like food, gas, college, etc..
So this is what led to so many confusion about it. After all, the fandom is not the industry. If you, artist, would like to make a living out of the drawing, certainly, at least for now, the fandom won't be enough. Not in this way. Like I said, supply and demand. The fandom can't supply the demand that a normal living cost requires, thru only by drawing commission means.
Don't you agree? So if we're whining, that's a good thing then, we're helping tha artists, we're giving feedback.
&TL;DR - Well, stop whining and start reading the wall. If I could put in less words and still be easy to understand, I'd've done that. Learning takes time and sometimes even effort. So you either work for it and become smart, or be lazy and keep being dumb. Your choice. XP If you do read all that and still don't learn anything new, your reward then will be my compliments - Congrats, you're wise!
It comes to my attention that the price drawing artists charge for theirs works has been theme for long, inconclusive discussions (or drama if you prefer) in the furry fandom. And while I've already expressed my opinion in lots of places about the subject, today I found something quiiiiite interesting:
http://s3.amazonaws.com/data.tumblr.....o1_r1_1280.jpg
From:
http://bambicandi.tumblr.com/post/1.....m-finally-made
Anyway, I'll explain what the picture is/was in case you are unable to see it:
[It shows two pictures of a furry, one black and white and another colored]
Illustration pricelist
Industry standart
Black and white Illustration
Spread [3508x4961px]$500-1500
Full page [2480x3508px]$500-950
Quarter Page [620x877px]$100-350
Colour Illustration
Spread [3508x4961px]$700-$2000
Full page [2480x3508px]$500-1500
Quarter Page [620x877px]$200-$400
'Fandom' Average
Black and white Illustration
Spread [3508x4961px]$10-50
Full page [2480x3508px]$5-30
Quarter Page [620x877px]$5-30
Colour Illustration
Spread [3508x4961px]$50-200
Full page [2480x3508px]$20-70
Quarter Page [620x877px]$10-30
Stop whining.
Industry standart is based on a book illustration pricelist from the Handbook of Pricing and Ethical Guidelines by the Graphic Artists Guild edition 13.
Artists check out this book for your own good.
While I don't own such mentioned book, it seems to be true information. GAG infact has such book. While the author of the blog goes into the subject, it's briefly. So I'm going to be way more indepth with this.
First of all, if you were an artist, what would be your reaction toward these cases:
"Hi! I'd like a nice artwork to put on my bedroom wall. What's your price?"
"Hi! I'd like a nice artwork to put in the advertising of our new software we're releasing. What's your price?"
If this isn't obvious enough, these are two very different clients. One is the industry, other is the fandom. The problem that it might cause to artist is related to how he handles such kind of clients. While we see the furry part of them with the artworks posted here in FA, we might not know for sure if the same artist also works for. Moreover, we don't know how the artist get his living, if he has a job and what he does in such job.
On the other hand, we have the other side of the story, and with both parts we have "market", or economy. Let me introduce a briefly lesson about economy:
On the martket there's something that has been called "invisible hand", which is a symbolic representation that the market regulates itself, usually based on supply and demand. For example:
If the price of a soap is lower than the expected, everyone will choose to buy it instead of another soap. However, if everyone is buying it, soon there won't be so easy to find that soap, thenfore people will start to pay more for that soap just to have it.
If the price of the soap however is higher than the expected, everyone will buy ANOTHER soap. Thenfore there will be plenty of that expensive soap, so to make it able to sell it, they will try to sell it cheaper.
Okay please, this is just an example, I know economy is way more complex than this, so is this example. But you probably got the basics by now.
The "market" of drawing artists only in FA is big enough to make you able to choose between tons of different artists. While we usually like and/or want one more than others, you still have plenty of options regardless. But the same rule of the economy applies too. This results in a certain ocasion that happened to a few artists:
"Well, if they are still affording for my drawings, I'm still charging this price."
Which infact, makes sense. While some artists are looking to the wall waiting for having a commission to do, some must limit theirs commissions to a determinated number of slots. This is because drawing takes time to do! The number of slots is determinated by the artist to be able to provide a reasonable time to finish (because nobody wants to wait a drawing still being made after 5 months since paid already) and because every artist has it's own pace to finish the drawings. If the artist takes 1 hour to finish the drawing, 100 drawings would take 100 hours! That would take about 4 days if you consider that the artist can remain drawing for 100 hours straight without sleeping, eating or going to the bathroom. Even if the artist can draw that fast, some artist would take even days for the same drawing - every artist is unique.
But the main idea of this explanation is understanding that drawing takes time, and the number of slots availables affects enourmeously the time required to finish all the drawings from the slot batch. Also, that while nobody can keep 100 hours straight drawing, the ammount of time available to the artist per day depends directly of whatever he does when not drawing.
Which means, the more time the artist spends his time per day to draw, more drawings will be finished in less time, so the artist will get more money per day from the commissions.
So! If drawing is what the artist loves to do, wouldn't the artist like to spend the whole day doing it, or at least most part of it, if he/she doesn't already? Probably they would. Would them like to have that lovely time doing what they like being eaten by a hatefull/stressing job? Probably not. BUT! If they are going to keep drawing for commissions the whole day and not have a job, will the commissions with the prices sugested by the fandom sufice? Will it be enough to pay the bills, the gas, the food, the energetics, or even that Cintiq that they always dream of? Sadly, probably not.
Oh well, derp, the solution seems pretty obvious, right? Well....... no. Now comes the other side of the story, the fandom.
This is simple, I'll go thru the statistics. How old are you? Do you a have a job that pays pretty well that you can live only by it and yet have plenty of money to spend on something else? Or do you have a job that barely pays your college so you have to imagine that that cereal bar is some sort of magical food that trully satisfies your hunger and all the vitamins and stuff that the doctors says you need to eat daily? Or you're not even in college because you're too young for that so it's actually mom/dad who gives you the money since you still live with them?
SO! With all that money that you do every month/week, would you spend $100 in a black and white 800x600px image of your fursona? (Look at those pixels dude they're so cool, I think it's your fursona's eyes.) Oh, or maybe would you spend $2000 in a 3508x4961px color image that features your fursona and your friend/boyfriend/girlfriend in an awesome fighting scene with tons of details? No. And personaly I find $450 already too much! *bitch-invisible-slap*.
This is, of course, based on statistics, what is preceieved from the fandom. After all, while the fandom exists by over 30 years, most of us heard about it only on this millenium. So most of us just won't be able to afford any price not even near of what the industry sugests AND PAYS for. (And yes, they pay that ammount) Most of us probably wouldn't even if we had the money infact, since there're things more important spend money on, like food, gas, college, etc..
So this is what led to so many confusion about it. After all, the fandom is not the industry. If you, artist, would like to make a living out of the drawing, certainly, at least for now, the fandom won't be enough. Not in this way. Like I said, supply and demand. The fandom can't supply the demand that a normal living cost requires, thru only by drawing commission means.
Don't you agree? So if we're whining, that's a good thing then, we're helping tha artists, we're giving feedback.
&TL;DR - Well, stop whining and start reading the wall. If I could put in less words and still be easy to understand, I'd've done that. Learning takes time and sometimes even effort. So you either work for it and become smart, or be lazy and keep being dumb. Your choice. XP If you do read all that and still don't learn anything new, your reward then will be my compliments - Congrats, you're wise!
