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Another view on dance comps, and it's been a good run :)
12 years ago
Hey everyone, JD here!
Normally I’d have posted a con report journal here at this point, so here is quick summary of non-dance comp stuff: every dinner was super special to me <3, best con parade experience ever, and I FINALLY got to suit during the con and at dances and have fun walking around as other critters (thank you to those who gave me the opportunity!) and all that jazz!
But I know talk is abuzz around the dance competition, about people’s feelings and opinions on the dance community in general. It’s no question this is all near and dear to my heart, and I’m always happy to discuss more detail in a more private forum (some of you have reached out to me already). But I wanted to share some facts about the dance competitions and dance community that I hope will echo and resonate well with those who wish to read through.
Many ways to showcase dance
The first fact I want to share is conventions offer many avenues for dance and performance that individuals can take advantage of, whether it be showcase competitions, freestyle battles, free-for-all dance circles and cyphers, group choreographies and videos, dance workshops and panels, and incredible evening- and late-night dances. If there is something that you don’t see that you wish to see, the best way to get it to happen is to go to the convention’s panel/programming registration site and make it! I know that’s what Theome and I did when we wanted to have a dance competition very similar to So You Think You Can Dance or America’s Got Talent at AC 2008, and the show has grown in interest over the years. Those that wish to see a dance exhibition show can surely do the same thing at any convention by going to their website and looking up how to get their event on the schedule!
Different cons, different comps
The second fact I want to share is that different convention competitions elect to use different systems for judging during prelims and/or finals, and that variety is intentional for those that favor one style over another. As long as the judging system is consistent across all performers and enables judges do accurately compare competitors against each other, whether they are side by side or hours/days apart, and the system isn’t inherently flawed, then it is a fair system. The judges themselves may have their personal opinions and have them reflected in their marks/placements, but it is an organizer’s responsibility to get a diverse and competent panel of judges to level out any biases, and many conventions seek to establish a rotation of the panel, be it a GOH, convention staff, organization team, or dancers themselves. This ability is dependent on the pool of individuals that are available and willing to take on the role of a judge, and every convention team tries their best to get a system that works for them.
Celebrating dancer achievements
The third fact I want to share is that there has been a variety of finalists in 2013 alone, including people who have seen a finals floor before as well as those who are new to the scene. Members of the community were gracious enough to assist me in putting together a (hopefully) accurate history of those who have placed in previous competitions: http://en.wikifur.com/wiki/List_of_.....tition_results . Organization teams have certainly requested the help and assistance from those who have been consistently strong performers to make room for others to earn the title, but many leave the option to compete for those who haven’t won that convention’s competition in the previous year. There is a lot of talent in the community that deserves to be showcased and celebrated.
Always trying something new
The fourth fact is that competition organization teams are consistently striving to improve their competition experience for everyone involved, the competitors, the audiences, and their own team members, some of which will work, some of which won’t, but they’re all out-of-the-box ideas to try to improve the event. At FC, the freestyle division was implemented in 2012 to support those who do seek a separate competition for that avenue of dance. At FWA, after an attempt to run it in 2013, there will be a group act competition in 2014 separate from the solo act competition to differentiate the two approaches to dance, since they did not allow groups to compete previously. At AC, the audience text vote was implemented in 2012 two years ago to help get the audience involved and to play a role in the results. At RF, the notion of not holding preliminaries for everyone to participate was exercised since its inception in 2011. At MWFF, the Novice category was introduced in 2013 to make the competition accessible again to beginning and growing dancers, and to promote a community of growth and support. Please continue to offer your feedback and practical ways to implement the ideas, and I’m sure that you will see different conventions trying out more and different things!
Time to pass the torch
The last fact that I want to share is that after 2014, I will be resigning as one of the co-leads of Anthrocon’s dance competition, and that a resignation for Midwest Furfest’s competition is also impending, date TBA (being a younger comp). It’s been an incredibly exhilarating ride to have been there from the dance comp’s inception year, and I’m happy to have been able to help shape and grow the competitions I support with new additions and features that I hope keep the shows fresh and the events accessible to all who wish to participate. A lot of great feedback has been shared over the years, and I’ve tried to balance the considerations of the different points of view to enhance the competition experience. At this point, I’ve brought everything I could to the table and it’s time for me to pass the torch.
I’ll always be more than happy to support any convention’s competition and dance events, and offer my insight or assistance where requested, as backstage manager, as MC, as judge, as a coach for the overall lead, as a panelist, or as a competitor, as I’ve played all of these roles. As always, I’m up for chatting about this kinda stuff since I care about it a lot, so feel free to reach out. With some people already raising their hands to say are eager to help, the stage is set for me (and others if they wish) to spend the next year sharing valuable knowledge and experience, and then to sit back and enjoy seeing where else the show will go and grow. It could be a continuation and evolution of existing themes, or it can be a complete overhaul of the event to something entirely new and different. Either way, let’s give them one hell of a show - I can’t wait to watch! :)
Much love to all,
~JD
Normally I’d have posted a con report journal here at this point, so here is quick summary of non-dance comp stuff: every dinner was super special to me <3, best con parade experience ever, and I FINALLY got to suit during the con and at dances and have fun walking around as other critters (thank you to those who gave me the opportunity!) and all that jazz!
But I know talk is abuzz around the dance competition, about people’s feelings and opinions on the dance community in general. It’s no question this is all near and dear to my heart, and I’m always happy to discuss more detail in a more private forum (some of you have reached out to me already). But I wanted to share some facts about the dance competitions and dance community that I hope will echo and resonate well with those who wish to read through.
Many ways to showcase dance
The first fact I want to share is conventions offer many avenues for dance and performance that individuals can take advantage of, whether it be showcase competitions, freestyle battles, free-for-all dance circles and cyphers, group choreographies and videos, dance workshops and panels, and incredible evening- and late-night dances. If there is something that you don’t see that you wish to see, the best way to get it to happen is to go to the convention’s panel/programming registration site and make it! I know that’s what Theome and I did when we wanted to have a dance competition very similar to So You Think You Can Dance or America’s Got Talent at AC 2008, and the show has grown in interest over the years. Those that wish to see a dance exhibition show can surely do the same thing at any convention by going to their website and looking up how to get their event on the schedule!
Different cons, different comps
The second fact I want to share is that different convention competitions elect to use different systems for judging during prelims and/or finals, and that variety is intentional for those that favor one style over another. As long as the judging system is consistent across all performers and enables judges do accurately compare competitors against each other, whether they are side by side or hours/days apart, and the system isn’t inherently flawed, then it is a fair system. The judges themselves may have their personal opinions and have them reflected in their marks/placements, but it is an organizer’s responsibility to get a diverse and competent panel of judges to level out any biases, and many conventions seek to establish a rotation of the panel, be it a GOH, convention staff, organization team, or dancers themselves. This ability is dependent on the pool of individuals that are available and willing to take on the role of a judge, and every convention team tries their best to get a system that works for them.
Celebrating dancer achievements
The third fact I want to share is that there has been a variety of finalists in 2013 alone, including people who have seen a finals floor before as well as those who are new to the scene. Members of the community were gracious enough to assist me in putting together a (hopefully) accurate history of those who have placed in previous competitions: http://en.wikifur.com/wiki/List_of_.....tition_results . Organization teams have certainly requested the help and assistance from those who have been consistently strong performers to make room for others to earn the title, but many leave the option to compete for those who haven’t won that convention’s competition in the previous year. There is a lot of talent in the community that deserves to be showcased and celebrated.
Always trying something new
The fourth fact is that competition organization teams are consistently striving to improve their competition experience for everyone involved, the competitors, the audiences, and their own team members, some of which will work, some of which won’t, but they’re all out-of-the-box ideas to try to improve the event. At FC, the freestyle division was implemented in 2012 to support those who do seek a separate competition for that avenue of dance. At FWA, after an attempt to run it in 2013, there will be a group act competition in 2014 separate from the solo act competition to differentiate the two approaches to dance, since they did not allow groups to compete previously. At AC, the audience text vote was implemented in 2012 two years ago to help get the audience involved and to play a role in the results. At RF, the notion of not holding preliminaries for everyone to participate was exercised since its inception in 2011. At MWFF, the Novice category was introduced in 2013 to make the competition accessible again to beginning and growing dancers, and to promote a community of growth and support. Please continue to offer your feedback and practical ways to implement the ideas, and I’m sure that you will see different conventions trying out more and different things!
Time to pass the torch
The last fact that I want to share is that after 2014, I will be resigning as one of the co-leads of Anthrocon’s dance competition, and that a resignation for Midwest Furfest’s competition is also impending, date TBA (being a younger comp). It’s been an incredibly exhilarating ride to have been there from the dance comp’s inception year, and I’m happy to have been able to help shape and grow the competitions I support with new additions and features that I hope keep the shows fresh and the events accessible to all who wish to participate. A lot of great feedback has been shared over the years, and I’ve tried to balance the considerations of the different points of view to enhance the competition experience. At this point, I’ve brought everything I could to the table and it’s time for me to pass the torch.
I’ll always be more than happy to support any convention’s competition and dance events, and offer my insight or assistance where requested, as backstage manager, as MC, as judge, as a coach for the overall lead, as a panelist, or as a competitor, as I’ve played all of these roles. As always, I’m up for chatting about this kinda stuff since I care about it a lot, so feel free to reach out. With some people already raising their hands to say are eager to help, the stage is set for me (and others if they wish) to spend the next year sharing valuable knowledge and experience, and then to sit back and enjoy seeing where else the show will go and grow. It could be a continuation and evolution of existing themes, or it can be a complete overhaul of the event to something entirely new and different. Either way, let’s give them one hell of a show - I can’t wait to watch! :)
Much love to all,
~JD
And it's people like you guys, the ones that are so encouraging and helpful that make people like me, newbies to the fur dance scene want to get out there and join in!
You speaking out about this is really valuable, because you're behind the scenes almost all the time.
I really appreciate this.
Also I'll be sad to see you stepping down next year, but I understand why.
Much love ♥
It's great to see people working on their dance and how to show it! That's part of a dance competition right?! Busting your ass to give people an entertaining show and to hear feedback on your own performance from the judges!
I think as I've seen you and Theome working a lot for MWFF's dance competition and how to make that work out the best with judging, prelims, finalists and everything... it seriously it's a tough job and sadly you can't always keep everyone happy.
As in my opinion I don't think you can find a better solution so fast on what you've already given us ;)
As I wanna return much more to the US I want to see this working out as it worked out with the recent other competitions :)
If you don't make it in... then practice and try better next time ^^ Maybe I'm on level in Europe but you guys in the US amaze me so much and my mouth flings open every time a move get busted so hard!
JD - You thought me also a lot and helped me whenever it was needed =D
If you pass the torch... stay as awesome as you are now =)
Back at AC 2012 before I even had a suit I watched the Dance Comp and sat there and thought "I could do that, I could dance better than a handful of those dancers." I had no dreams of winning and no dreams of becoming the best around. I found out pretty quickly once I had the ability to start trying that two things stood in my way. 1, I wasn't known within the dancers and 2, with every passing second the field got better and better. I'm a fursuiter who wanted to try dancing, NOT a dancer who wanted to try fursuiting. With the Novice category I really felt like this was my last chance to try to squeak into a final and maybe inspire a few people out there with more talent than me. I'm proud of myself for making it to the very last round of the Novice preliminaries, but now I can't help but look back and think maybe I took some key YES votes from other people. The feedback idea was great, but honestly my mentor had nothing good to say. I made it really far, I did lots of things right. I looked at my sheet and saw circles on top of checks for nearly everything.
I had a good time and met really cool people, and that is what counts. I will also be looking forward to the future of dancing at fur cons as I seek to spend my time in other areas in which I have more natural skill. You've done a great job JD!
This journal is a wonderful and valuable perspective.
I definitely agree with a lot of things you said. There's definitely no sure fire way to represent talent in the community through one show only. I think we all forget sometimes that we can do something about it, like make that future panel happen! When it does, it opens new perspectives.
Going from attending a few panels to then helping teach/run panels, it's a lot harder than I expected and I can begin to understand what an organizer has to go through. It is however, incredibly exhilarating to see it pull through and pay off with positive vibes in the end.
Nonetheless, there'll still be salty eggs in any event but that passes just as time passes. Achievements should be celebrated! For those who are inspired and empowered to be the next generation, more power to them! To those who are feeling bitter or jealous, they can continue to do so but that's no way to live!
It's so incredibly easy to deem a generalization of a judging process to select the winner... But what you said is truth, not every system is the same. We obviously have an overarching similarity to the judging process because it works. Just like cliches, they are cliches because they have been successful in conveying a message.
We tweak it little by little and this is a community effort. We all learn from each other, there's no reason to attack how our judging processes have worked or not. Sometimes things can happen, and our feelings can get hurt, but we all still love each other in the end and we are all doing the best we can. While it may not have been the smartest or best choice at that time, people are always going to do their best, their intentions are true.
At MFF this year, there was so much success in the dance competition. There were 6 winners when we would usually have 3... You can't tell me that's not positive. And those winners all earned their ranks because they worked so damn hard and we all saw it. I feel like novice category and veteran category solved so many problems that previous dance competitions have not, making room for new dancers. One person who has never even danced before in a suit or on a competition environment made it through veterans finals. Two folks from countries outside of the US, not as well known as some of the other dancerfurs, have made it into the finals and placed.
We've moved incredibly far from judging based on popularity. Thanks to the community, we can now give credit where credit is due.
Sometimes we will see the same winners but why? It's easy to say, popularity! But popularity is not always a bad thing. Popularity can be through support from hard work, we know who they are for a reason. These winners that keep showing up have worked hard to earn their talents.
But what can we expect in something coined the term 'competition'. Stress, anxiety, excitement, such an adrenaline rush, achievement, disappointment, etc. It's all part of the package of what makes an experience an experience. Whether or not someone views it as positive or negative is up to them.
There's always change, always a possibility, always a future for everything. Positivity and negativity exists in everything, it just depends on how hard you look for it :3
JD, you have done so much for this community and it is really a blessing to have something to work off of that is so successful.
I don't intend on taking on a different position at conventions, and hope to be able to enjoy them as a regular attendee again once the switch occurs :)
Bringing up the fact that new panels and events can always be created is a huge point. There are so many wonderful ideas that need to be shared and expanded, and thank goodness convention paneling allows for that! Of course organizing and running that panel will prove to be a hard task! Not everyone will like it, some might even voice why they don't, but in the end it is our right to have our own opinions and as long as we are civil about any disagreements, all will be well.
Judging... although I have never judged an event at any convention, can be incredibly difficult and always will. Your friends might be up there and you have to ignore that and be the unbiased fair judge. Every performance could be first place worthy, but you must narrow it down to the top three. I do not envy the job of a judge. It is nice that many conventions have different types of judging prelims and finals. Variety is the spice of life after all!
As for who places every year, sure some people have placed more than once but there are ALWAYS new people placing, as that chart we made shows. There's always new faces in comps as well! And when I first expressed interest in dance comps, just over a year ago I was encouraged and welcomed in with wide arms. the dancers of the furry world are a very supportive family!
As I have told you many time and will continue to say so, you've done so much for everyone in the furry community with your continued effort to push conventions, programming and events to be the best they can be. You've inspired me to not only try and do more at conventions, but all over my life. When I see someone lead with such pride I tell myself I wish to do that! That is why since I joined furry I began hosting panels annually at FurFright, am the cohost of the MA Furbowl and have many leadership roles outside the fandom. You inspire me JD, and you always will. When you step down at Anthrocon, I'm going to cry. You know very well that I will.
But cheers and thanks to you! Thank you to everyone in the dancer community! We will continue rocking on for a long time to come!
I also wish I had a better understanding of what happened and what is going on..I've only seen this journal and Duke's and while I think I get what happened I still feel kind of in a bubble.
*hugs!*
I look forward to seeing you working less and dancing more at future cons. ;) Work is hard, and can be stressful and contentious. You've done an awesome job for MANY AWESOME YEARS, and I think its good that you've granted the community a chance to fill your shoes in the judging capacity. <3
Thanks for all the efforts in being who you are JD. Without it, the fandom's dancers wouldn't be where they would be. Nowhere near as close.
The trouble I find with any contest the fandom usually has is VERY quickly it becomes a bad example of popufur syndrome, and we all know sadly that usually never resolves well :/. It is even worse when a actual prize is offered but I base that on decades of other gamecons where prizes ended up with the worst players at times beating the best because of utter underhanded tactics that squeak them by. I left a few events because of seeing how bad this could get and want to do as much as I can to avoid it happening at our convention. Human nature loves a spirit of competition but some folks will do anything to win, and when you see chairs go through windows over a large cash prize it tends to make you fear offering anything larger then a medal or a tv dinner for any competition.
I hope the fandom can find in itself ways to keep such a diverse event from getting locked into popufur hell ;/. granted at my age I have seen a lot of good and bad in my various cons so one hopes we see more good coming along. Folks like you make that happen and even if you step down you will be around to help cons like ours learn, grow, and prosper.
Gaia bless and look forward to talking
Pakesh_De
Chaircritter for Furnal Equinox
Thank-you for doing it
Folks do not see a lot of what happens behind the scenes. The running around, ensuring the music ques correctly, the order in which the competitors appear, working with AV, and the judging system.
I hope by doing a side step (yes pun intended) you will be able to enjoy more cons and events without feeling the obligations of a "job" even though its one you enjoy.