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Controversial topic: style inspiration/copying/stealing
10 years ago
General
(I will most likely not answer to every comment below, but feel free to join in on the discussion! Just keep it civil, thanks!)--- whatever you want to call it. I just figured I'd do a rant on this as I keep getting asked about styles and particularly how do you develop one/how I developed one and especially what my views are on what seems to be a controversial topic around the art-sphere; so-called "style stealing".
For the aspiring, new artists I always tell them that it is important to develop your own, distinct style. One of the reasons for that is that I believe that people are very interested in buying art (if becoming a freelancer is one of your goals in art) if said artist has a very distinct, interesting or unique style. I'm like that myself. The very few commissions I've actually had the money to splurge on I got because the artist had a style I, personally, found original or unique.
K.I.S.S (Keep it simple stupid)
What many young artists believe is that to get a unique style you have to do most, if not everything, different from everybody else, which is actually not the case. You can if you want to of course, but choosing a couple of things that you want to experiment with and "do different" is a lot more effective than doing something that is all-together new and haven't been done before.
Me, for example, chose to be inspired by Leyendecker with how I do my eyes; I draw shiny eye-lids and dark, often black, heavily framed eyes and eyebrows. Thats my "thing". I also focus on rendering, and how you choose to color/render is often a thing that people neglect trying to do differently. You can do very textured renders, psychedelic color schemes or very simple, clean and shiny renders.
You could say I stole the idea from Leyendecker and made it my own. The thick, dark eyebrows was also inspired by another artist I greatly admire called Phobs.
And the styles on FA (just to keep the topic more grounded to the fandom) that are well known are because they are doing one or two things differently. I bet if I cropped away the eyes on my drawings and posted just the render (for example) you could see striking similarities to many artists here. I bet if you took away the renders on many artists and compared just the lineart they would bear striking resemblances to another. But because they are doing one, two or even three things a bit different, big or small, they look different.
Everybody "steals"
"Good artists copy, great artists steal". A quote I bet many have heard in the past. Now, I am not saying you should "steal"; I'm more of a person that feels that if I see something I like, I try it out with my own art and spices it a bit up with my own style/tastes, and then decides to include it any further or not.
-- and why you should not
Kinda contradictory, wouldn't you say? I just told you that everybody "steals". Well, there is a thin line to be considered here, and one that should not be crossed too often if it can be avoided. Why? Well, there are several reasons as to why that can be discussed, but I'll try to keep my focus a bit more narrowed
People buy styles
As said above, people tend to buy art if it's done by an artist that has a style that they like. I know I might be stepping on a few toes when I say that I see many young artist getting heavily influenced by popular artists, some to a point where the resemblance is so striking that it's hard to tell them apart.
But then again, this is a good way to get noticed and get followers, as that artist is most likely a very popular artist to commission due to the fact that their style is in demand, so, in short, people like it, and if you do the same, they will most likely like you too.
However, and I see this a lot, there is a point where you will be more recognized as being *insertpopularartistnamehere*s lesser good version, than actually being demanded for your own version/style, if you get what I'm trying to say. And in the long run, you will end up getting known for the "lesser good version" than actually your own version, which in turn is not a good way to build up self-esteem and confidence in your art.
And some people dislike that people are heavily referencing/stealing/copying (whatever you feel like calling it) other people's styles, some people dislike that a lot. However, this being FA and FA has always had a flair for drama (but I still love you guys<3), I do believe we see it more here than other places. Some dislike it so much that they start white-knighting for the artist and are blaming that he or she is copying, and for a young artist trying to find their style that can be a terrible blow to your self-esteem, one that is often pretty low to begin with when you're starting out as a fresh, new kid on the block.
You'll always feel like the lesser good version
And this is the sad truth. Again, I see it all the time with artist that heavily influence their style from just one or two other artists; people compare the artist to the copied artist style constantly, to a point where it gets annoying and your not getting valued for your art, youre getting valued for the other artists style. Kinda sucks, and if that were me I would feel rather shitty after getting comment number 100 telling me "oh you draw just like *insertname*/your style looks just like *insertname*" instead of "oh your style is really unique/love your art, it's really original". So yeah. Consider that <3
Style stealing - a compliment?
However, I firmly believe that most artists actually find "style stealing" to be a compliment. I know I would if it were to happen to me, and frankly I don't really give a shit if they are making money on my style. I have gained followers and commissioners for my own style that I also have a great customer or friendly relationship with, so I'm perfectly happy with what I have gained.
And if somebody wants to follow me down the road I paved, I have absolutely no problems with it, because I know that even though I am being copied, they will never be me.
I am also not trying to get known only for my style, but for being a nice person and portraying myself as a kind and generous person too. I also try not to take art too seriously, have more fun and interact with my fans in a way that they find enjoyable, and that also gets noticed and spread around.
Summa summarum
So yeah - if you see something you like, try it out! It might work, it might not. If your goal is to get famous, you gotta stand out, but I think many famous artists have no problems that you are walking down a more easier path by following them for some of the way. Just remember that you should also try to pave your own, and that style is not constricted into how you draw your lines; it can be something as simple as eyebrows or something as complex as rendering or how you apply colors.
Have fun, try stuff out, and remember that people are more often well known because they have been nice, helpful and just generally kind people (even though that isn't always the case, but that happens in every aspect of life), than just having a unique and original style.
//END RANT
**
A little end note; I know that many artist has gained followers for drawing porn and not because their style is amazingly unique, which is true, but I wanted to mention it because many of those who ask me "how do I get famous" always feel incredibly pressured to draw porn because they see how it gains followers, but they don't feel like doing it, but see no other way and end up feeling very torn between the two.
Never EVER draw porn unless you are certain you'll enjoy it, and if you are uncertain, experiment by yourself and see how it goes. Sometimes the more intense porn you draw, the more comments/followers you'll get, but then you are drawing for the wrong reasons and I can promise you you'll end up regretting it later. Yes, comments and feedback is good, but do not draw to please others, draw to please yourself.
And I always believed that its how many friends you have, not followers, that matters in the end <3
Sort of like your art Mithril, you say Disney is a big inspiration of yours-but there must be dozens of other influences in there as well, because your style doesn't look like it's "stolen" from Disney at all. You've created your own "recipe" from the "ingredients" around you :) which is something I think few people would have a problem with, as far as I can tell it's when people literally copy a style directly, it's just uncomfortable when that happens.
I have told this before in my stream, and a couple of stream watchers (especially young artists) have experienced the same. I didn't start using references until recently, as I felt so threatened not to do so, and still, I think many younger artists feel that way because many are being told that referencing/tracing is stealing, and that is very wrong. Everybody uses references and let themselves be influenced by others, even the great masters did, so that references is stealing, is very, very wrong.
Having had those experiences I was always terribly afraid for many years to actually get too influenced by others, which is why I have become a very restricted artist and haven't had the confidence to try out new stuff that others have done until very recently (drawing on paper, trying out new techniques etc).
I also think that is why my style is said to have such a weird mix, it always falls between categories; its not all Disney, but not all realistic because I've been consciously trying not to copy/get too influenced (whatever people feel like calling it haha) by other people because of my experiences in the past.
I guess I'm telling this because I do believe that many young artists, such as myself, give up when people tell you that something is wrong. I've seen two artists at FA quit drawing because they were very influenced by a more popular artist, and people were blaming them for stealing.
Therefore I don't really care if people are very influenced by my style, because we all gotta start somewhere :D
I mean, I hardly even know my position on this because it is SUCH a grey area, but there's one thing I do know for sure-people get irrational about these subjects, and the fact that you and countless others have felt this is just horrible. The power that people with a few overly dedicated followers have is frankly frightening. I know I didn't even want to "get out there" because I was terrified of this happening to me. You are seriously brave for coming back at all, it's not an easy thing to do. And I whole heartily commend you for being so open minded of this all, the fact that you would open your style up to everyone because of what those other people did is amazingly generous. I won't lie-you're one of my influences too! And I think that your style consistency, and you talking about staples of your style is what helped me find, focus on and develop my own staples!
So you just keep being you, because your a role-model to a lot of people, and you deserve every single fan you have.
Please teach me your ways senpai.
Such a good point, everybody has at some point been influenced by others. Aaaand yes, the "sparkledog" dramallama on DA a few years back got really, REALLy out of hand.
"The power that people with a few overly dedicated followers have is frankly frightening."
^ This. SO MANY times this. I've even had to stop somebody at a couple of instances for taking it upon themselves to defend me against other people; its always been for a good intention, but it can so quickly get out of hand and do a lot of damage. And yet still there are plenty of artists that just lets them go at it, and, as it did with me, it goes out of hand. People told me to go hang myself and that my art sucked and so on, I think the road to bullying to straight up lynching is frightingly short sometimes. But I did learn a lot about myself and others during that period, and especially how to handle bad people on the internet. So I lost some and gained some I guess :D
Aww, thank you! That means a lot actually, it was very scary to come back and give it a second try, but I am really, really glad I didn't let them take me down. And I also try to use my small fame to do some good and be very transparent about my thoughts and views as an artist, because I always felt there are just a few roads to take (for example; do porn, don't do porn) instead of nuances of what you want to achieve (dont do porn, pinups, erotica, tasteful nudity, porn, hardcore, softcore and so on) and that it is OK to change your mind after trying something out and that it is OK not to do what everybody else is doing.
Lots of the young artists that ask me for advice often feel pressured (and I mean REALLY pressured) into doing things a certain way, and are always a bit taken aback when I tell them its ok to do things the way you want it to, and that it is ok to try out something and later change your opinion about it ^_^
And I am thrilled to hear that I could help you with your style development as well, yay!
AWW NOW I'M ALL GIGGLY AND FLAILING AND STUFF <3 Thank you for being you, you are such a kind and respectful human being! :D
Teach you, I shall young padawan <3
It is really sad to be honest, because for the most part I don't enjoy doing it and I won't keep it up for a long time anymore.
I've been trying to get feedback ever since I started drawing in 2009 and while getting more conversations on here than back in the day when I was on deviantart I still get barely any comments.
I'm not quite sure what I'm doing wrong, but if you could give me some tips on how to get more response other than simply being a god at art I would be immensely grateful.
It's rather sad, but it works.
Sex sells =P
I dont think youre doing anything wrong, I think youre in a phase were you might feel that youve stagnated a bit, and that is something I feel several times a year. Often it is because I have reached a level in the things that I am working on; anatomy, rendering and expressions (I always work at improving 3 things at a time), that I cannot imrpove further on. Then I just change up one, two or even all three things, and continue working on that.
However, one friendly tip that you dont have to follow at all, but as you can see in my gallery, most of my porn work is rather tame. It is more pin-up like, and the comments I get are more of an artistic focus than the actual theme of the drawing itself. Many people have actually told me that they like that I do stuff this way, because (their words, not mine) most people that draw porn on FA draw porn with capital P, not erotica as I do, if I were to categorize the two.
In a way I am maybe making my art more desirable because not many draw porn the way I do? Maybe I have, without knowing it, by doing something a bit different, have made my porn art more in demand because tame/pinup porn is less drawn?
I have tried out more explicit stuff, but that didnt get the same appreciation for the artistic effort put into it as the tamer stuff, which is kind of a downer if youre an artist, but a completely understandable response if youre the audience/onlooker.
Another tip is that fame, if that is what you are seeking, comes slow, and then it just skyrockets. I have worked my fucking ('scuse my language) ass off to learn how to draw, and trying to find what can make me stand out has been such a tedious journey that I actually have given up several times. I didn't get "famous" until late 2014, which is not even 2 years ago. It takes a while, and if you are setting your goal too far up the road, it will drain you out. So, set shorter goals that will benefit you; learn how to draw hands, draw eyes, render hair etc. Don't set your goal at becoming "popufur", because that is too far up ahead, but will happen if you work hard enough!
And one last tip that I hope you will take to heart (but can be a bit frustrating to hear) if you draw for comments, fans and faves, you will quickly feel so extremely malnourished and understimulated as an artist, because you draw for the 10 second rush from reading a comment or seeing a fave. We all have been there, even I, but I quickly understood that if I can find something that gives me a more lasting rush, I will feel more inspired and draw more. For me, that is being helpful and making people happy, or having fun in streams :D
Good luck and sorry for the wall of text haha, I like being helpful :>
And reading through all of it you are absolutely right.
I have to admit, I don't like the way my gallery looks at all right now. I even despise it at times. There is no consistency in either type, style or effort and I feel like there should be.
The few pictures I actually do like are the ones I drew because I wanted to draw them, not because I thought my audience would like them. And those are also the ones with the most reaction. I suppose you can really see the emotion put into artwork, vs bland and boring art just trying to fish for comments and faves.
I definitely do feel like I am stagnating and of course it takes a toll on my mindset. I feel like I'm stuck and not moving while everyone else around me is improving in giant steps. I thought about that a lot and to improve in different parts of art I picked up on landscape painting, which I actually found quite enjoyable and relaxing. Plus it looks nice and got me a ton of positive feedback :)
I guess all I can really do is practise practise practise.
Again I can only agree on the part about tame "porn art". I only ever did explicit porn when I was in dire need for money, but I realized now that I don't want to have that connected to my art at all. I don't want to be ashamed to show friends and family my artwork.
So I decided to keep this clean, except for tasteful pin-ups and the like and made a separate "porn-account" just for science. Curious how it will go.
I have to admit, I do strife for fame. I'm a bit ashamed of it, but I'm not really sure if it is just for fames sake, or to have the security of "When I offer commissions, they will be taken". For which I definitely need a larger audience. I suppose it is just comfortable knowing that you can sort of rely on a stable income. (Even though I know as an artist you don't have a 100% sure income)
I don't think I really want to be a popufur, because I simply don't have the personality for it. I'm not outgoing or anything. I just like small conversations and helping people whenever I can. I love getting questions and answering them to the best of my ability.
And this last tip is just THE thing I need to keep in mind.
Thank you soooo much for opening my eyes!
Whenever I upload something I check my fA every few minutes, just to see a fave or comment, but the feeling, like you said, is over very quickly.
I'm not sure what it is that inspires me/drives me to draw, but I hope I can find it soon.
Again thank you so so much for your time, I will hold your advice dearly!
Yes, and I just want you to know, like REALLY understand, that porn is amazingly difficult to draw with emotion, so it is not just you! Perhaps due to the way porn is portrayed in xxx-movies, perhaps some other reason that I cant think of right now. That is why the best porn artists here are considered the best because they are able to put emotion into their work, and not just fucking, the character has some kind of personal connection and interact. That is my opinion though haha, but, especially for me, realizing that was such a huge relief and then I started to appreciate my pornographic work a lot more, because I used to draw just what I though would be most sexy for others (huge dicks and jizz EVERYWHERE). By doing so, you lose the most vital point of doing art (once again, personal opinion) which is to tell a story.
But realizing this yourself must be a really, really tough blow, at least it happened to me when I realized I were drawing for comments and faves and not to show other a story that I wanted to tell. I felt a bit.. hmm.. A bit narcissistic in a way? So I really had to dig deep and find another motivator to keep on drawing, and for me, that was making people happy. I make my commissioners happy by giving my best in each drawing I do, because effort gets appreciated. Sometimes not even by the person you hoped, and sometimes things you expected to get the least appreciation gets the most, and vice versa. People are funny and interesting that way :D
I also try to make my streams a lot of fun for other people, because, again, I get a lot of happiness when I'm able give people a good time from something I'm doing.
Not saying this is the way to go, but it sure has worked a lot better for me than drawing for comments and faves :D
I'm really happy to hear that you found some new motivation! I hope it helps to hear that we all experience that; I do it aaaall the time, but I guess its not something that is so openly discussed.
Sadly, yes, all you can do is practice, but if you manage to make that enjoyable (I do a lot of streams for example) you wont feel like youre practicing just for the sake of practicing :D
I'm the same there on not being ashamed to show it to friends and family. I even talked to my parents about doing so before I began, and they were very supportive! Though they have only seen a few pieces, they find it to be very tasteful (even though I can see that they dont quite get the furry aspect of it and feel a bit weirded out haha xD).
ABSOLUTELY nothing to be ashamed of! Not at all! As long as it doesnt go to your head, striving for fame is nothing to be ashamed of. And you have a very valid reason as well, but as I've noticed the past two years, fame does come with more downsides than positive. At least in my experience. I liked to know most of my fans by first names, and following them and seeing their process and give feedback and such, but now theres just so many to keep track on, that I eventually just had to give up and tell them to come to me for feedback instead of me coming to them. Which has worked out great, but I do miss that personal relationship.
I actually have a lot of syndromes that makes me function pretty badly in social settings, but I'm more of a "fake it 'till you make it" with most aspects in my life haha, but it can be very tiresome to deal with so many people at times. But you do need a certain personality type and really thick skin, and to those that werent that fortunate and got famous it went really downhill with. Which is very sad, but you see that in Hollywood as well, so it is kinda doomed to happen to some I guess :/
Aww, you are most welcome! :D And that will probably take a while, or you can find it tomorrow. But the fun part is trying to find it I! Many thinks that is the most tedious part, but if you look at it in a more positive light, it makes a huge difference to how you perceive and think about your art ^_^
Again, you are very welcome! I'm happy to be of assistance :D
Personally I like to develop my own thing but it's hard in this era where people get easily catched by super bright colors and stylized anatomy (I'm even gluilty because I love those styles too).
Why do you draw? Are you a professional, or is it just for fun? If it's the latter, why not do what you actually enjoy? Brightly coloured, super stylized anatomy still needs a basis in realism and anatomical knowledge to look good IMO, a good example would be Airu or fabercastel.
Also, mentioning names like that where people are not around to defend themselves reflects badly on you. You could have gotten the point across just as well without.
Aaand good point btw! :D
Shame that artists have to resort to porn to make a living.
Your NSFW art tends to be very tasteful though, are you not proud of those as well? Because I had that dilemma for a while; I didn't like the attention my explicit stuff were getting, so I moved over to more "tame/tasteful" stuff and the comments/attention I didn't like subdued significally.
I don't mind drawing porn at all, and my parents are superduper supportive about it and I have a rather relaxed relationship with sex, but I don't know what I am going to feel about it if more people knew.
When I tell people most of them are "oh thats cool! Can I see? Wow! Youre really good!". The only bad experience from it was from my sister who found it to be super disgusting, but she is very, very narrow-minded, so IDGAF about her opinions xD
Then again, I know of many VERY well known artists that draw porn on the side, I mean, most famous, if not all, comic book artists draw porn on the side, maybe because they want to, maybe because they need too (sex sells), but it never seemed like they were doing something wrong or taboo by drawing porn.
And I kinda feel like I'm on a mission to make porn look good and gain a more artistic reputation, not sure why, but it feels like its something I would like to do.
But then again, you have a very lovely, noticeable style, and I think if you told people you would like to draw less explicit stuff, they would totally still buy art from you! Maybe give that a go and see what happens? :D People on FA are usually very supportive when it comes to people being uncertain about drawing porn, and nobody ever wants people to draw something they dont feel comfortable drawing <333
I think it's going to be something that takes time before I find what I'm happy with. On one hand, I was taught growing up that sex is shameful and I've hung on to that very tightly. On the other hand, I have zero interest in porn. That makes it very easy for me to pick whatever side is pushed on me at the time. Because I was taught that sex is a bad thing, that's usually my default position, but with such a great exposure to the internet and the open minded people that inhabit it, I've also adopted the idea that sex is completely natural and normal and not something that should be looked down upon. So, now I have two opposing views! Logically, I'm okay with it, but emotionally, I still get very flustered at times when exposed to it.
I have drawn some tasteful things that I am proud of, but it's usually in the realm of nudity rather than any sexual acts. I think at my best, I'd draw tasteful pinups and the occasional tasteful erotic art. I think I need to work on moving past what I was taught before I can be proud of it. It might also help to only offer adult art through YCH only, to control what content and positions I'd be drawing. I find that the drawings I dislike the most are the ones with the most input from the buyer.
Looking through your gallery with all of this in mind, you actually embody exactly what I'd like my adult art to look like. It's all very sensual, inviting, and just. The way I'd like to portray it. Maybe I should finally just commit to drawing only what I like and focus less on art as a job and more as a hobby again. I'd really like to be happy with what I draw. I'd also like to grow as an artist, and I feel I'm not doing much of that lately. I don't think I can do it the way I want to with commissions.
when I decided to draw animal people I wanted to create my own art style. not because of any commercial thought; I had no idea about the furry fandom until 1997, and had no internet at home until 2005. because I didn't want to copy someone.
porn or no porn, that is the question. I have some artists on my watchlist who openly refuse to do more than erotic art, and they still have many followers. one even stopped offerign adult comissions because there was no interest... then the "porn gets you attention" people, but maybe it was wishful thinking? besides, where were they when that artist opened comissions? put your wallet where your mouth is, I say. :)
However, I do feel many artists get disappointed when their value and skills as an artist doesn't get mentioned, but the sexual subject matter is instead. Some artist like and appreciate that, some people dont - me included, and which is why I chose to tame down my pornographic art a bit.
I would feel very proud of my explicit art if the time and effort and skills I put into the drawing was the focus, and not that most of the comments sexually objectified the character in the drawing. If more people would start thinking less like the latter, I think more artist would feel more proud of the porn they draw :D
interestingly enough, the few porn pics I made don't get more views, faves, or comments than my erotic or clean art (with the exception maybe of a series of ten pics involving a lot of kinks in a row, thus creating a kind of story). the most faved image shows a tigress in a black latex dress... :) I also rarely am comissioned for porn pieces.
maybe because I feel awkward drawing genitals? maybe people sense it.
Maybe it's because I am not going to live off art, but I'd rather make my style my own. For example I make it a point to try to make characters look like their species (I sometimes succeed hahaha) but that for example separates me from people who only have one dog face and that's about it.
And the porn bit, well yeah, it's true. That is how you get the most people to care about you, but it is catering to the lowest common denominator. Not that there is anything wrong with it. I have a pretty prolific porn account but I enjoy making it and I keep it separate from my more well known name.
At the end of the day make the art you want to make, make it your own and don't put unecessary pressure of popularity or greatness or whatever. Just have fun making art, honestly.
"And the porn bit, well yeah, it's true. That is how you get the most people to care about you, but it is catering to the lowest common denominator."
Ahhh such a good point wow. Well said.
Yup! Just try to have fun, and the rest will follow :D
i don't know for me a style come alone when youd raw it's your style , you are not forcing yourself to draw you "just" draw :3
even if in the beginning you have to inspire yourself with other artists art ^^ :)
Yeah! Exactly, and that is a wonderful point. When you've found your style, you just draw, it just happens, and you don't struggle and quarrel with the drawing. Or, you could, but not as much as before haha!
Nevertheless, in observing artists I've seen there are aesthetic aspects that I admire and feel like would improve what I visualize if I were to emulate.
The question there becomes, if you are borrowing (or "stealing") from an artist, even if it is just elements, are there expected courtesies (such as just telling them, "hey man, the way you do chins is bad ass, do you mind if I emulate that element of your style), or does it get to a point that it really doesn't matter?
However, being inspired/influenced by some aspects of their style, being the rendering, how they apply color, their values, how they draw eyebrows etc; in other words - smaller things, I do not think you need to tell them, because being influenced by smaller things is inevitable, and something that happens wether we like or not, or wether we notice it or not. Its about our own tastes, what we like, and if we see something we like, we will try to recreate that or incorporate it into our own styles.
That being said; I have always told people of my influence by Leyendecker, yet, not many have told me that our styles are similar. I have seen other people with more striking similarities to his style than mine, but I think that is because I am unable to "copy" his style, as I still haven't figured out what he does to make his art look the way it does. I can see that he uses heavily framed eyes and shiny eyelids, but how he paints (a very textured and "planar" like render) is something I haven't gotten around to grasping.
I think that boils down to the fact that I do believe I have been subconsciously influenced by other artists, and that has again turned into a habit on how I build up my paintings, which in turn means that I am unable to build up the painting Leyendecker does. Even though I do like his art A LOT, but I do not think I will try to mimic/get more influenced by his style more than I already have, because I like where my style is right now :3 All in all, depends on your individual taste, I guess?
Many years back when I wanted to get to an art college, I was told that my works look like they are done by three different people. I was experimenting a lot back then. I am still and it has became a habit of a kind.
Try one style, learn it as much as possible => apply it => move on to another, repeat the process => apply it ...over and over, untill I am satisfied. But I'm always taking something from each style I go through and I recommend that process to ALL people who ask me how to art.
I'm tragically screaming when someone asks me to draw him/her something in "my style". So, which one you'd like... the one from 2014? or 2010?? just????you want a landscape with that??or?
That is such a good tip though! I bet it will work for a lot of people, kind of simplifying things, I always meet young artists that have exhausted themselves because they are trying to get good art art, instead of focusing just getting good at.. I dunno, feet?
Haha, I'm getting told that from time to time, especially if I can draw stuff in Miles DF/Vagabondbastard/Wildering's style, I find it... so weird haha! I absolutely ADORE their art though, and I kinda find it flattering that they would ask me because they think I can mimic their styles, but I always give them a polite no and tell them to ask them instead xD
So I would prefer to 'steal' and make it my own than become a carbon copy of another!
I think what bothers me is the whole thing with being the "lesser of the good artist". Back in 2013 I was on the fence with stylization from an artist I heavily looked up to. I am still young, but three years ago I was 17, bordering 18. I'm going to be 21 soon, and I can say I've improved a lot from a 3 year difference.
When I was starting to really break into the artist community, I took a lot of inspiration from Dapper-owl and Sambees--I loved their linework and the flow of the figures really called out to me.
Here you can see how heavy the influence is on me:
http://www.furaffinity.net/view/11031856/
http://www.furaffinity.net/view/11043780/
In 2014-2015, I decided to direct my artistic endeavors on a more realistic style. I haven't followed any "Great Artist", but this is a style that developed from just doing realistic studies and then simplifying them with lines.
-> Comparison of my old "style" with something I developed over time: http://www.furaffinity.net/view/18735875/
Anyways; I'm very happy that you feel more at ease with your own style, even though it is still developing. And we all find inspiration from what we like, its human nature I guess :D
Aaaand if it helps, I think your style now looks very unique! :D So well done!
(I may be getting into a tangent but00)
Also I'd like to add that eventhough I can see the inspirations you draw from, your art sticks out as memorable, shows the years of hard work and mental fortitude you poured into it. I hope compliment is not inappropriate in this sort of debate. :)
I'm glad that you like my art, I was a bit worried using myself as an example being that I am young and that it can come off as arrogant! I do have a long way to go, thank you for your encouragement!
in the end it's better to gain a understanding of how to use the core elements of art such as perspective, lines, light, anatomy, ect because with each one you gain a better understanding of the more your personal style will shine through but it's more important to have fun while learning and not to care about what other people think
And thank you for such a jawdropping comparison, wow. That is quite the compliment, and I really, really appreciate that, thank you Levn!
I see many young artists struggling to realize that there are absolutely no shortcuts to art. It's like Facebook; you only see the success and not the struggle (hence why I absolutely LOVE the invention of streaming, because now people can actually see the labour put into all the drawings).
Many people does not realize that I didn't get "famous" until very recently. Being "famous" still something that I tend to forget, and sometimes that has rather bad outcomes (such as when I linked to the site that were posting Patreon posts for free and totally forgot about the followers I had).
Still, I kind of hope I will always stay like this, and that I will never ever feel ungrateful or unappreciative, because I still remember when I had to struggle for days, even weeks, to paint a picture, and when I proudly uploaded it I would get no comments.
So yeah, trying to stay humble, be kind, show my followers that I appreciate them and have fun arting! :D
I also kept my style and characters secret in case someone might copy them haha. I felt super paranoid because it seemed like people copyed my clothing style too, I wore sewn cat ears in my hoodie and suddenly everyone else did too (now I know it was a coincidence thanks to the weeaboo culture, but it felt super creepy to a teenager who didn't really follow trends - especially since they might turn down any creative ideas I had if they were similar!)
Then I came across the furry fandom... it tore my uniqueness apart, THANKFULLY. Made me realize that everything there is is already done and I should draw what I enjoy instead. So I decided to develop a style I like and took inspiration from the three talented artists I found who drew furries in different awesome styles: blotch, squeedgemonster and ajna. I wanted to blend those together somehow and I guess it worked out (I'm still improving the style that started out there!) but surprisingly enough I've only once been compared to squeedgemonster but that was because of the theme of the picture and not style when I asked the person.
BUT instead several times I've been told I copied off a style of someone else, that does kinda blow self-esteem away... but then again their styles never looked that similar to me so I'm not sure how I should react - it is a sort of negative comment still but not quite accurate? On the other hand I found awesome new artists to watch thanks to those comments (sbneko, falvie etc.). I suppose if you're going to draw animal people, to many that alone is a style already and such comments will happen. I must add: it's also somewhat awkward to start following a person you were just accused having stolen their style from o.o'
Oh wow wall of text random rambles .-.
Thank you for sharing this and giving your opinion.
And also on the porn thing, I guess experimentation works there, sometimes it's fun and sometimes it's weird. I guess going YCH with it is the best of both worlds though.
Agian thanks for your input ^^
Fuck it, do what you want, and work hard at it. Above all, always strive to learn something new, experiment, and make the mistakes that make the former possible. Critics are useful for insight and suggestion, nothing more.
A personal addendum I have is that you may also gain a lot of followers and favs by doing fanart, but just like with porn, it's hard to break away from it and still get a similar kind of response. Becomes really frustrating once you realize people follow you because of the subject matter and not because of your art.
It's something I'm struggling with currently. Makes me question my worth as an artist, unfortunately. Do I stand out in any way when I try to be original? Can I even be original? Was I ever? Shit sucks.
one thing i would say about the fandom is that is does tend to follow 'style trends' a bit, which isnt in itself a bad thing. id say newer artists may forget there is an entire world of art outside furry art, go integrate some elements of classical painting into your work and it would stand out (you mention Leyendecker, which is interesting to incorporate elements of golden age illustration into furry work).
It is amazing how useful non-furry art can be to inform furry art.
so many artists learn the polished coloring technique, but fail the underlying anatomy - if you're a "cheaper version of so-and-so", the people who can tell the difference know WHY you're "cheaper". I mean, if someone as a consumer is happy with that, more power to them. But as an artist? Neh.
Influence, interpret, adapt. Copy? no.
I actually have a style in my mind that I'm trying to work towards, and I think each time I draw I get a liiiittle closer. It's slowly forming. But still it's an amalgam of all my favorite artists' styles, with aesthetics from my favorite video games and stories and whatnot thrown in. I dunno if anything can be called "original" at that point, gahahah.
And I do share your opinion.
I'm not going to lie, in my case I've learned (still learning) to draw anthro by helping myself with other artist's drawings and styles.
Trying to find an style that is good for me yet, drawing the best I can both for personal art and commissions.
Loving to get even few comments (but almost always from friends which is the best) and favs.
At first you start wanting to get "famous", it takes it's time, for ones less than others, but it comes if you have fun with your art and don't care about it.
I'm proud of myself for not jumping into drawing porn, maybe in the future I'll draw it, but if I want to, not for the fame.
And I aspire to be like you, always kind and sweet with your watchers, replying to every comment, accessible to everyone to chat and helpful.
Allow me to add my two cents to what you have already said:
Art is a craft and every craft has techniques. Sometimes, millions of years ago a caveman drew a lineart of an animal. We can say that was his style, right? Nobody else have done it before. But today we call it a technique. Every technique was at some point done by someone for the first time, at which point it was something unique to them. If other artists never copied these things, we wouldn't have have paintings of Rembrandt, Jan van Eyck, Vermeer... we wouldn't have the sculptures of Michelangelo and Leonardo... we would have no digital art, furry art, and in general, we probably wouldn't have anything beyond caveman drawings. All the techniques and knowledge we use today for making art is something that was "stolen" from one specific artist at one point in history.
Art evolves, as it should, since evolving is one of it's fundamentals.
But then what is the difference, where do we draw the line between technique and style? I think that simply style is a unique collection of techniques.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with taking a technique from someone else - moreover, that is how you learn and increase your toolbox of available techniques. BUT... take a technique because you like it, because it looks good, or because you understand what can be achieved with that and NOT because XY artist uses it. You can eat the same breakfast as an Olympics gold medal winner sprinter and you still won't sprint any faster from that alone.
And most importantly: Intent.
There is a huge difference between copying something with the intent of look similar, or with the intent of learning from it and integrating what you learned into your own work. If given artist uses a shading technique that you think looks great, by all means, learn it and use it! But use it with the goal of looking AS GOOD as that artist, and not JUST LIKE that artist.
And finally, what I see A LOT, is beginning artists being inspired by a specific style or artist and going on to copy that blindly (just think about the millions of horse drawings that copy the style of Walt Disney's "Spirit - Stallion of the Cimarron". That's like 50% of all horse art on FA already...). This can be OK when you start out - whatever motivates you to get started. But what many do is that they stick with it, and never learn to develop an own style. And the worst about this is that the artist they copy has KNOWLEDGE, which resulted in him doing things the way they did, while those who copy have none. They don't know why that artist draws lines like that, why he uses the proportions he uses, why those specific combinations of colors... and because of that their art will never start to look good, they get stuck at trying to mimic something without ever attempting to UNDERSTAND it.
Please, OH PLEASE for your own sake, do NOT copy without attempting to understand what you are doing. Copy to learn, copy to try, copy to gain understanding, but do NOT copy just for looking alike. It will lead you to nowhere. I know people who are extremely talented and yet they improved almost nothing in several years because they stick with a copied style that they still try to copy the same things, and discard the constructive criticism given to them. Don't be like that.
NOW. Let me plant my hoof here and say: there is absolutely nothing shameful about erotic art, and it is not any less art than clean art. I agree that it is a shame if you have to do something you don't enjoy only to pay the bills, and if someone doesn't like to draw or look at erotic artwork, that's all fine! But don't look down on erotic art or artists who draw it.
What is the point of art? To tell a message? To invoke feelings? To please the viewer? Isn't erotic art doing that as well? Sure it does it in different ways than, let's say, a peaceful landscape, but it does it nevertheless.
In my eyes the only ways to measure art are quality, skill and effort. If I put the same effort, my sweat and blood into something, to make it good art, good anatomy, proper shading, good composition... if I do all my best to make it as high quality as I'm able, does it make any difference if there are dicks and boobs on the canvas or not? I don't think so. Sure, many porn "artists" have horrible, shitty quality, bad anatomy, broken compositions, horrid choices of color, and yet they sell because OMG BOOBS! But in the other hand there are artists who draw erotic stuff in a good quality, and as one who walks that path I must say, that we deserve just as much respect as any other artist.
I see no difference in my clean and erotic art: I'm equally proud of them both. I do them both under the same name, which name is just a Google Search away from my IRL identity and "real" name. I even uploaded photos of myself in my scraps. I see no shame in drawing erotic artworks, and I'm not denying it if anyone asks. All my friends know about it, even my mother does - I even showed her some of my milder pics (she said that's a bit too much for her, but regardless she respects them as artworks, and is happy when I tell her I just finished a new piece and I'm proud of it.).
I was about to link some examples but... that would be way too off topic. ;)
I've also seen an artist basically leave the fandom due to someone copying their style. It's an issue that affects people differently.
... Not sure where I was going with this.
I did once dealed with someone accusing me of referencing/stealing their style. Even though I was myself admitting it, the way they have used to make me notice it was the worse to choose and do. They first basically sent their friends on me and these was plain white-knighting, nothing more, calling me names and being mean, almost feeling great by doing it. I have immediatly felt very deppressed, because I am one dealing with some anxious problems, but I would not extrapolate on this side. In short, I got sick.
So with one, I tried to defend myself and explaining that styles in the first place cannot be owned, but that I was aswell admitting that my style was looking alike as many others and that I was not saying no to developments and e.t.c. I just got, let's say it, shitty replies with mean words and obviously I have lost my time with people just trying to 'save' their friend business.
I needed myself to reach the artist of which my style was looking alike, because they was not coming at me on their own and because their friends was just plain nasty to me(also because I was knowing it was because that the artist have 'cried' to their friends about it and that this was 'cause of this that I was suddenly being attacked by them. I wasn't stupid).
I came to them, I was very calm and they have noticed it. I said it was not necessary to have sent their friends on me, that I would have been okay with a quiet talk about the subject and figure out what was disturbing them. We discussed, explaining each others and there it was done, no biggies.
Do all the dramas and stress they have dragged on me have been necessary before? Not really. As for me, it only have thrown me into a dark pit and I have stopped to draw for a long time before feeling good enough about it. Honestly, in the first place I didn't really asked to have a similar style, it just happened to me. Everyone get influenced especially if they like something. But it don't mean it is wrong.
Still, as lessons to this, I have noticed that I was able to 'mimic' and it is a kind of detail that could get you a job even if some can't believe it or not, such in animes and mangas. Though, I personally just started to find my preferences, exploring how I was able to deal with stuffs on my own. I am seeing it is working well so far and that I am getting little by little comfortable enough about sharing my drawings to others again.
Conclusion. I just wanted to explain that, people should try at first to quietly deal with an issue, not quickly jump on the 'mean' wagon. Still I know not everyone can deal the same way in front of a 'problem'.
I do have got my own 'tracing' issues, artists just taking my arts and tracing them. As my own choices, I was getting at them privately and was calm with them. And I noticed that when you was 'calm', people was less arguing, well with me it have been the case. Maybe I have been lucky, but since I got my personal 'bad' experience, I don't wish to make them live the same stress that I lived.
Some would say; «Why you are good with your enemies? They deserve your anger», Well, no. Why enemies? They are humans right? We are all humans, we all do errors. There is no need for more evil.
In the end, you just need to keep exploring, keep advancing and that this whole 'style' subject is actually pretty tricky. Many, MANY artists have a different view on the matter, even though that in fair laws, styles/techniques cannot be owned legally. *shrug* So I wonder why artists keep at trying to defend 'their style'.
But artists are artists, we are still just in the first place stealing from nature and anyway, little thing I can add, when everyone are just drawing wolves, similarities happen a lot. As well as people using same programs, such as Paint Tool SAI. I can almost immediatly notice who use what, so another point that can allow places to similarities issues.
On my side, I just post my things that I am okay to share and that's it. Internet is public, you need to remember that when things become public, you would of course deal with these situations such as people being influenced by stuffs. If you don't want your things to be 'used' as this, just don't share or hide?
This how I see it.
Now, sorry for this big comment, but I was finding yourself brave to talk about this subject publicly and I am agree with your statements.
I just wanted to share my appreciation and thank you, you have gave me a little solace feel even if we are strangers. <3
Stay safe~