At least, as far as I know, Biden doesn't want be to lose p much every single right lmao, so I'm p happy right now

♥♥♥

Already three glasses of Champaign in. Maybe a wee bit tipsy...

That’s... a bit much. And before you block me and call me a fascist, I’m actually an independent. I’m neither Republican nor Democrat. If anything, I’m Libertarian. I didn’t like Trump. I couldn’t stand the man. But I don’t think those that supported him deserve such treatment. Be the better person. Welcome them. If they’re so intolerant of people, by blocking them and labeling them as fascists, your only stooping down to their level.

Hopefully you don’t block me. But if you feel that you must, then go ahead and do it I guess. I enjoyed watching you while I could, and it upsets me that you feel you must resort to such means.

We are supposed to work together and educate each other, we're the people, not two sides of a sports team.

Help them grow and heal, instead of throwing stigma upon them. If they refuse to, then that's their choice, that is the point that you go "Alright, you don't have to agree, but please do not bother me with it"

I am agreeing with you as an independent Socialist leaning Democrat.

The best cure for fascism is education, that's why Trump wanted to gut it. Keep that in mind.

I’m glad to see that your being civil and reasonable. Most people are so hostile when I try to speak my mind. Your response is a welcome change. And I thank you for that.

Yo, I can tell you that these people don't care about facts and that debate doesn't work and you are under no obligation to fall for their gaslighting about having to be 'tolerant' of them. Been there, tried that. Instead I decided to take advice on how to engage with them from former members of the alt-right that have since left the movement.

If fascists cared about facts and education, they wouldn't be fascists.

It starts young. Those that are lost, or you assume to be lost, can still be redeemed. You even said it yourself "I take advice from those that left the alt-right movement", they left it. Education can help.

And read what I said, -> If they refuse to, then that's their choice, that is the point that you go "Alright, you don't have to agree, but please do not bother me with it"

These people are not as powerful as you think they are, the followers that is. Don't let them try to control you either, or manipulate you into their level.

Tolerance is important to teamwork. Sometimes you have to work with that one kid who has no idea what they're doing, even if you have to do extra work.

The fact that a fascist is no longer in power is a good thing. It means some of the red hats will hopefully start falling back and looking back at the mistakes. I knew many George W Bush supporters who did the same. "Why did we vote for this man? He's an idiot." It took them over 4 years to realize what they did wrong, so do not expect instant change.

And as I said in the beginning, it starts young. Education is key. Preventative measures are better than having to make measures to deal with an already horrid problem.

Now, if you think all of them are Fascists, no, that's like saying all of the BLM people are rioters, Marxists, etc. Everyone is an individual and has their reasons. Some felt that trump would help their businesses, some felt that they were scared of something (Fear is a driving force to politics, see 9/11 for that example), Some felt that they had to or their family would be upset. These aren't fascists, these are people who are scared and need support, these are people who are misinformed and need to be taught the truth, these are not bad people.

The loudest people of groups are always thought to be the majority, but no. The vocal minority does not represent groups as a whole. An example would be if all trump voters suddenly became violent, -every. single. one- They didn't. Only a minority of them did. Most are moving on, some are regretting it, some are rethinking things. It's a learning experience. Again, education. The loud ones do not represent the group as a whole. You're a furry, you should know this firsthand with the furry fandom's representation of people doing sexual stuff at conventions, that's a vast minority of people who go to cons, but people act like -all- furries do it. It's a very unhealthy habit to judge a group based on the vocal minority of the group.

But yes, I do agree, there are brainwashed one, there are those who are actual fascists (See the Nazi and KKK supporters), I do not deny that, I am not saying embrace these people, I am saying educate them. As for republicans as a WHOLE. There are good Republicans (McKain was a prime example of one), there are politicians who worry about their people, not themselves, regardless of their side. Don't villainize them just because a few idiots are ruining it for them. That is the part I am talking about for tolerance. And the supporters who are confused and scared? Help them. Educate them. Be nice to them. Violence begets only violence, I'm afraid.

If you think I'm an awful person for these points of views, then I am sorry. I just believe humans can change for the better, for I have seen it multiple times in my family, my friends, my surroundings, even myself. And as a teacher, I have come to realize that education is the most important thing in a child's life, not just mathematics and science, but teaching them how the world works, how society works, how everything in our beautiful, if strangely connected, world is all part of one bigger picture, one large pack of animals that need each other to get along.

But... TL:DR (Since many people don't read these comments of mine...)
I am not telling you to be friends with a Nazi or Racist, I am telling you they're not the majority of those supporters, and those who are scared, confused, or misinformed should be educated, consoled, and offered friendship, not malice, so they can realize that we're not their enemies, so we can prevent them from becoming those fascists. Prevent fascism before it happens. :)

They left, it wasn't by people coddling to their beliefs and trying to find 'compromise' or some way to legitimize their positions.

Preventing fascism would be acknowledging and confronting it - not falling for its gaslighty tactics, again. Though hey - you want to join altfuck where they are currently talking about slaughtering all the 'commies' knock yourself out. Don't cry if you end up in the leaks though.

"If you're not with me, you're with them"

*sighs* You didn't read anything I said, you read what you wanted to read into.


Alright, listen here. I am a damned democrat who voted Biden. I feel sorry for those who are being misguided, misled, and abused by the fucking right.

I am telling you.

NOT ALL OF THEM ARE FASCISTS.

But you're putting your fingers in your ears and going "lalala, you're just like them, you don't agree with me"

So. Want to know a tactic the trumpers did a lot? Exactly. What. You. Are. Doing. "Don't listen to them, they do pedo parties" "Don't listen to them, they want to take our guns away" "Don't listen to them, they're our enemies" "Don't listen to them, they murder children"

I'm a SOCIALIST. I know the difference between Communism and Socialism.

But you seem so blinded by your hatred for -MILLIONS- of people, that you think they're all the same. I hate to break it to you, but each individual is different. They are unique. They are not all the same. Fuck, even Fascists aren't all the same, you got different types of those. (No I'm not saying you should befriend them. No I am not saying to tolerate them. No I am not siding with them)

*rubs temples* This is why I don't like furries in politics. All of you do this.
It's immature.

Edit. You want to know if it's gaslighting? I've had this perspective my whole life because I was taught to be tolerant of others and accepting of change. This has nothing to do with rightwing media. Especially since I do not consume such media, I don't consume leftwing media either. I take facts from all sources that are cited and make my own judgements.

Lol. I was gonna respond to Lapsa, asking what I did wrong, and to please explain. But they blocked me. XD

Civility means nothing to those that are blind to their surroundings. Those that refuse to work with one another with a matter of different opinions are generally as bad as the polarized opposite of themselves. They will try to justify their fanaticism by throwing others who do not align in the other polarized party's own doing. It's an unhealthy obsession that leads to an intrinsic desire to be the 'hero of the story' and generally an unhealthy ego.

In short, they felt they were 'better' than you and I because we didn't agree with them, so they tried to put us down... Even though we're on their side... And just want to cooperate with others who also want to cooperate. But delusional cases like this tend to be incredibly common in the fandom, especially if someone has an already predisposition of an ego from having followers and whatnot.

They also blocked me, so I blocked them. They're not quite civil... and from the comments below, they're quite... rude and don't think about others with their words... But I will hold hope that one day they will come around and accept that we, as a species, need to work with one another to survive.

If it really upset you, you'd be a better person - actions have consequences. It isn't intolerance to not want to debate whether or not we have the right to exist. Try harder, be better.

Nah, when Trump ran on a base of "fuck immigrants, fuck minorities" his fans deserve no sympathy. They need to fix their shit, we were telling them as such for years.

^^^^^^^^^

Also for the record you didn't come across as a Trumpist, so I didn't block you. You were civil, so you're chill so far.

I’m glad to hear that you feel this way. Most people just go insane and yell at, berate, and then block those that have even the slightest difference in opinion.

You've been level headed about things. You're fine. Folk that were doing the "fuck your feelings!" shit and praising trumps wall, the cages, the erosion of LGBT rights, etc. Those are the folk that need to fuck off from the fandom.

Fair enough I suppose. I personally wouldn’t treat them that way. But that’s just me. I would try to be the bigger person and treat them kindly, be better then them. Not lower myself down to their level. But your allowed to do things your way. It’s part of your rights as an American after all.

If they'd rather see me dead or gone because I'm queer and trans? Yeah, they can fuck right off. That's how I see it basically. Is it a little more complicated? Sure, but that's the gist of where I'm coming from. Because folk like that exist in the fandom and in the country.

That’s fair. Though, it may not entirely their fault. A lot of people’s views are shaped by their environment and experiences.

But like I said, it’s your opinion, and your entitled to it.

The orange man is out!! Hallelujah!!!

Orange was ejected.

Agreed, also I love Mango Mussolini XD

I just hope we can heal from his wounds on the democracy *sigh!*

What worries me is how close the damn election was, so many people are either delusional, misinformed, or outright insane in America right now. >_<

The fight isn't over yet!


Also, always funny seeing people that have posted psychotic journals and rants for the past five years about how they'd love to murder, rape, and torture those they disagree with suddenly finding some 'civility' and 'need for debate'. No one owes those motherfuckers anything. My entire introduction to them was being told I needed to be run down in the streets and leaks from the discord groups over the years should tell you all you need to know about how sincere their 'civility' calls are now.

Btw, 100% that 'democratic socialist' up there isn't a socialist. lol I'm so fucking done with these smooth-brained loons. 5 fucking years of murdering people and now NOW they want 'civility'?

My feelings about either of your opinions aside, I find it wincingly ironic that someone putting themselves forward as a bastion of lefist politics would use an ableist slur to describe someone they don't like. :/

I'm not a bastion of anything more than not tolerating the people that told me I needed to be tortured, raped, and murdered. Sorry, but that isn't changing. However if that insult is ableist then I shall stop using it!

It is indeed. It refers to people with intellectual disabilities.

Having spoken with your 'opponent' in private, what they are trying to get across isn't that you need to tolerate the worst of the human race. It's that there are going to be people who regret voting for Trump and are disillusioned with the right, and we need to be ready and willing to accept and educate those people into the left when they show up. Not 'gaslighting' or whatever else you were ranting about. The world is more nuanced than you seem to expect.

Then as I said, I'll stop using it! My apologies!

However, I'm not in the mood to be lectured about how 'close-minded' I am being (especially by someone that will block me, but befriend someone who thinks the Black community standing up for justice is 'terrorism) for not accepting people that are NOT WILLING TO CHANGE and making NO EFFORT TO CHANGE and instead simply want people to forget that they've spent the last 5 years, again, defending and excusing this shit without actually making any effort to change their beliefs. The burden is, as always, unjustly put onto the people that are often victims of their policies and violence.
'Civility', 'Centrism', 'bothsidesism', whatever you call it is always the perfect blend of attacking the left and defending the right.
https://www.furaffinity.net/journal/9514299/
If you care more about getting along with people that think your BLM charity stream was a terrorist fund than the people that actually donated to and helped BLM - I'm very much in doubt about your politics. This person didn't show up to express regret for excusing stochastic terrorism or supporting a regime that utilizes right-wing white nationalist paramilitaries and police brutality - they showed up to express how 'harsh' it was to hold people accountable for their beliefs.

If I block you it will be because there's no point continuing trying to get through to you. You heard 'tolerance' and jammed your fingers in your ears and started screaming and completely stopped listening. We are talking about PEOPLE WHO DO WANT TO CHANGE. Not making forays into alt-right nests and trying to use love and kindness to magically dissolve the hate. Not treating fascism as a valid side of a discussion. Just being willing to extend a hand to people who are ready to change and need a little help figuring out what's next. Insisting that people do not change, at all, ever, is just ridiculous. You yourself said you had talked to ex-alt-right folks; they couldn't exist if nobody was ever willing to change.

I'm not sure why you linked that journal considering it doesn't belong to my friend that you're attacking.

I'm not sure where you get off saying my friend isn't a Democratic Socialist considering the two of you haven't discussed styles of government at all, so you have no evidence either way what they do or don't believe when it comes to socialism.

I'm not sure why you think they think BLM are terrorists. But the fact of the matter is even if they did take issue with methodology, I know they support the cause, and I'm actually capable of maintaining friendships with people I'm not in lockstep with. Because I can see more to the world than 'everyone I agree with is perfect and good' and 'everyone I disagree with is an evil fascist'.

I linked to the journal because that is who your friend wanted, seemingly, to be given a 'second chance'. Also your own journal on your BLM charity says you'll block anyone who calls them terrorists or paints the movement negatively. Do the rest of us not get that luxury?

Also, with the blocking - I was referring to your friend - who blocked me (even though they now claim I blocked them first). This seems fishy, and very very bad faithy.

Your reading comprehension needs some work. Nowhere did my friend say they were talking about that other person. The only way that other person is related to the discussion at all is that their comment sparked it. And considering it's not someone either of us know, as far as I am aware, I doubt my friend dug through their page to see their journals before agreeing with them on a single topic.

Yeah, I will not put up with people denigrating BLM on my page. I don't put up with it from my friends, either. As I said, my friend supports the cause of BLM, and has never argued with me about it. You sure seem to be grasping at straws to defend why you decided to put someone on blast for making.. perfectly reasonable points? You're not even responding to what I'm saying anymore, you're just masturbating over your imagined scenario where I am apparently arguing in favor of people who hate BLM. Which.. what? I don't know where you're getting this stuff.

The only one imagining a scenario is you. You've gone off on a tirade against me and are inventing reasons as to why it is justified that do not even exist.

Your friend literally responded with 'we need to work together right now' to Wolfie936. I countered with 'no, you don't - these people do not care about actually changing'. I was told I absolutely did have to talk to and 'compromise' with these people. All the comments are literally public. Your friend literally specifically referenced and is continuing to reference Wolfie936 as the person I needed to be polite to and 'work with'. Again, this feels like some sort of weird ass bullshit and everyone can see it right now. I think if you didn't mean to say we need to force ourselves to befriend and 'debate' with people that literally think we need to be murdered and that BLM are terrorists that you should go 'Oh shit, sorry' instead of screaming at me.

https://www.furaffinity.net/journal...../#cid:57676441

Uhh, Farore did say "I'm not sure why you linked that journal considering it doesn't belong to my friend that you're attacking." when you linked to Wolfie's journal. I read that as... Wolfie is not their friend? As in, Kamaitachi is? Lapsa you gotta chill.

They did, however I'm a bit confused by that since Kam was very clearly talking to and about Wolf. I mean - I've gotten other people to come look at this. I'm not hallucinating. I very clearly made a comment that referenced 'these people', referring to Wolf and other far-righters that are currently clamoring for their beliefs to be set aside in the name of 'civility' after four years of absolute nuttery that they are not prepared to do anything more than quietly ignore until the next chance to go mask off rather than actually change.

Kam is very clearly replying to Wolf as well and I am replying to Kam - again - specifically referencing wolf, and then Kam is continuing to reply in respond to wolf after.

I refer you to this comment: https://www.furaffinity.net/journal...../#cid:57677194

While it matters very little - they also are lying about me blocking them before they blocked me. I went to respond to their second comment only to find out I was blocked.

My point being, chill Lapsa. I trust Farore, I've known them for well over a decade now, almost two. A good cat.

If you actually read, Kamaitachi is saying they agree with Wolfie that we need to be willing to accept people, and goes on to say that they specifically think we should accept people who are willing to change. At no point do they say it's Wolfie we should be accepting. Give it another read if you're not sure. You're mistaken here.

At no point have I screamed at you. I may be blunt but I am being more or less civil. Which is more than I can say for someone who goes around calling people smooth-brained loons (whether or not you were aware that's a slur). You have barely listened to a word I've said and just keep going in circles on something you think happened that didn't. You've resorted to digging on people's pages to try to find a 'gotcha' instead of just dealing with my words at face value and accepting that just maybe, you misunderstood the situation, got mixed up, and made a mistake. Every time I correct a misunderstanding you've made you either double down or start on some new equally unrelated tack. It's really not that hard to just say 'I misunderstood' and move on. And it will make you look a lot better than continuing to harp on things that never happened or that you're misconstruing.

https://www.furaffinity.net/journal...../#cid:57677194

What exactly am I misunderstanding here? Are they not saying that they believe Wolf is 'on my side'?

By 'on your side' they mean 'not a Trumper' or similar. Not that you have to make friends with them. You're jumping to conclusions.

*Fireworks in celebration* yay the fascist is gone!

#Anti-MalarkeyActionSucceeds!

Glad to see its over. Although there are still plenty of assholes who would disagree with the democratic process.

It's absolutely not over, this is just the start of things. Biden absolutely needs to be held accountable and taken to task. Harris as well, what with the whole "denying trans women medical needs and putting them into mens prison" when she was a, DA I wanna say?

Always hold your leaders accountable, regardless of who they are. :)