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Rising Dragon
Posted 12 years agoIt's been a while since I last posted here. I'm not very active on FA anymore, but I found out Rising Dragon is having an art raffle, and...well, just look at the quality of the art:
https://www.furaffinity.net/user/risingdragon/
That's some good stuff! If you're interested in a commission, these are the current prices:
$15 Sketch
$20 Inked Illustration
$30 Marker colored Illustration no background
$35 Colored Illustration with simple background
$45 Colored Illustration with complex background
Even if you don't commission, why not drop a note and say, 'Nice pic!' on stuff ya like?
https://www.furaffinity.net/user/risingdragon/
That's some good stuff! If you're interested in a commission, these are the current prices:
$15 Sketch
$20 Inked Illustration
$30 Marker colored Illustration no background
$35 Colored Illustration with simple background
$45 Colored Illustration with complex background
Even if you don't commission, why not drop a note and say, 'Nice pic!' on stuff ya like?
Rant plus thoughts on desirable traits in a CRPG
Posted 14 years agoWhile I don't consider myself a consummate gamer, I have played my fair share of computer games, and of those I return most often to RPGs. Why? Well, in part because there's that nice sense of accomplishment when you manage to complete whatever major quest there is. There's another factor though - while at their best they still aren't as good as the table top experience can be, they do provide some ability to roleplay - to choose to do the right thing without hope of gain, to help in hopes of a reward, or to be extremely selfish and try to take everything you can get.
The games that do it best add shades to these options, sometimes giving various other options based on stats. Even in these games though, there is an annoying tendency to occasionally slip up and only offer dialogue choices that amount to "be an angel" or "be an asshole" or even worse, choices like "be an asshole to group A" or "be an asshole to group B". That last one is especially annoying - if I'm playing a character with the right attributes to see a compromise and try to attain it, at least give me the choice to try! If I fail then I fail, but at least I'll know I tried to be reasonable. Yes, I'm looking at you, Fallout 3 - The Pitt!
Talk about your false dilemmas!* You have a well-meaning extremist who is using slave labor to try and build enough infrastructure so that people's living conditions will improve to the point where slave labor will be less effective than paying trained citizens to work. His wife is also working on a cure for a disease that causes people to mutate into blood-thirsty monsters called trogs. The flip side of this is to back the slaves who are tired of being forced to work and are especially unhappy that some of their number keep getting sent into the Scrapyard to hunt for steel ingots amongst the hungry trogs and murderous wildmen - people driven insane by the toxins and radiation but not mutated into trogs. Also, being a well-intentioned extremist, he will live up to the extremist part by slaughtering every slave that revolts leaving the slave population decimated and the few remaining slaves sullen and hopeless.
Obviously the slaves have a valid complaint, so they're the clear, moral choice, right? Sure...except for the fact that they want you to kill the well-meaning extremist and his wife and steal their baby since the kid might possibly be immune to the toxins that cause dementia and mutation. Also, the leader of the revolt is the former right hand man of the well-intentioned extremist who publicly claims to be doing this for the workers but really just wants power for himself. He also has no idea how to research a cure if the baby is not the hope they were looking for, he has no major plans for the future, and his methods for overthrowing the slavers also involve letting trogs into the part of the city where the well-intentioned extremist and the slavers are which will leave even fewer safe places to live. Also, some of the slavers you'd be killing are former slaves who won their freedom fighting in vicious voluntary bloodsports against other slaves for the right.
So obviously this is a completely insoluble dilemma with no right or wrong choice, right? Wrong. Heck, the designers of the DLC can't even claim ignorance of the fact because you can find a terminal where an overseer wrote that he keeps losing his best slaves to the Scrapyard and he requests some guards to send along with them to keep them alive. This is exactly the kind of compromise needed and the designers put that in there, and yet there is no way to follow up on that. You can't go to the extremist and say, hey, as someone who just clawed my way up from being a slave to being one of your slavers, I'd like to point out that working conditions kind of suck and I have some ideas that would improve things and maybe keep people from dying. See, if you tried to be reasonable and the guy turned you down, you'd feel better about shooting his face off. If you got him to make the improvements you suggest and the slaves still revolted, you'd feel less qualms about killing the ingrates. Maybe, just maybe though you could manage to make things a little better.
That is after all one of the reasons people play RPGs - to feel like they have an impact, be it positive or negative, on the world. I realize designers can't think of everything, but I really wish they'd give their writers enough time to perfect the dialogue trees. As an example, in Dragon Age: Origins, there is a frustrating tendency to have a character talk to you and be presented with a variety of choices. The character may not have asked a question, so it can appear that there is no special response to give...except there is. You see, sometimes a dialogue tree will present you with exactly one chance to say the right thing to get certain results, and if you don't choose it, the dialogue option never shows up again. Annoyingly enough, not only do the information-related dialogue options remain available after that, but if there is an option to say something that would make you look like an asshole, that option ALSO usually remains. Only the one special dialogue option disappears forever, and what is most frustrating is that there is no way to tell (barring using a strategy guide or wiki) which dialogue options are one-time only! It's frustrating to have spent skill increases to get the highest level of persuasiveness and not be able to use it to get the results you want simply because the writers give you one chance to get it right and dozens of chances to get it wrong. Considering that the other skill choices directly improve your chances in fights, the frequency of this kind of oversight and the infrequency of persuasion being useful for anything is completely and utterly inexcusable. I mean seriously, you get one chance to hand the kid his father's sword (The Green Blade) instead of keeping it and after that the dialogue option never shows up again? It speaks of yet another product rushed to the shelves without proper proofreading.
What else bothers me? Well, let's see...while I can acknowledge their utility in keeping me out of places with no plot significance and no worthwhile loot, I'm still tired of ubiquitous indestructible windows or wooden walls and doors. Again Fallout is the worst culprit with places like Big Town where large sections of the fence around it are made of wood without reinforcement yet the wall holds up against chainguns, lasers, missiles, and even micronukes! I realize that even semi-accurate physics are hard enough to accomplish (other people have ranted enough about the shortcomings of Fallout's rag doll physics, so I'll skip that) and destructible terrain isn't easy but...it's not impossible. Dragon Age: Origins has barricades that can be destroyed, for instance, and even further back in 1999, Zipper Interactive had a game called Recoil which featured a tank with a main weapon that could blow craters in the terrain. Mainly it was just a neat effect, but the point is that the coding existed to have alterable 3D terrain even that far back. Now I know some people are thinking that this would lead to game developers having to waste huge amounts of time laying out massive areas with no plot significance, but that's simply not the case. Procedural game design methods could rough out entire cities and populate them with a variety of semi-unique NPCs leaving the designers only the task of going in and tweaking things to add unique landmarks, buildings, and plot-relevant characters.
Related issues - persistent corpses are kind of neat...except when they're a little too persistent. Could I please burn the bodies or bury them once I've looted them? I still recall in Fallout: New Vegas how back in Good Springs you can save the town from a group of Powder Gangers which is all well and good except...their bodies just stay there. At no point do the people ever remark about the corpses strewn around town, never comment if you arrange the corpses in lewd poses, never suggest someone moved the bodies much less actually do it. Problem is you can't do much with the bodies either other than move them somewhere out of the way. Can't burn them to ash even though you may have weapons that would reduce them to ash while they were alive, and you can't bury them even though there's a graveyard nearby. It was rather frustrating.
What else...well, I'm tired of games where you can loot the bodies but the loot doesn't match what the target was wearing or using to attack you. The Fallout series was actually pretty good about avoiding that, but Dragon Age: Origins pretty much sucks and uses grossly outdated loot tables for enemies. Also frustrating - you get tons of loot, can build up entire sets of armor and you have no choice but to sell it or let it continue to clog up your inventory. There's no option to stash it somewhere, much less put it on display. That was another thing that could be said about the Fallout games: once you got a home, you could collect and display literally anything and everything you could carry into the place. That was a nice touch and the game designers deserve credit for doing a good job with that.
There are probably other issues, but right now I can think of only one other major issue that remains, one last detail that breaks immersion, and that's area loading. I know a lot of games do it, and it's perhaps one of the more acceptable breaks in immersion...except that again we have a much older game, namely Half-life, where there were never any area transitions. Yes, I know that implementing everything I'm talking about would likely use a considerable amount of system resources, but honestly I'd prefer game designers to focus on perfecting these aspects of immersiveness rather than lens flare, other light effects, and particle effects. That said, I must admit that pausing the game in Dragon Age right when walking bomb causes and enemy to explode and then rotating the camera is kind of a neat effect. Bullet cams and death finishing sequences are a nice touch. Neat effects though are not inherently immersive and can grow old after a while. Now the dappling of light and shadow beneath a tree - that's a nice effect that does aid immersion, and again Fallout as well as Neverwinter Nights get points for that little touch.
So as you can see, the elements of a truly great game exist out there. Someone just has to have the time and financial backing to put them all together to make it. Any takers? Please?
*It's worth noting that Fallout 3 was absolutely horrible about creating false dilemmas; not that there were a lot of them, but the other two that spring readily to mind (Tenpenny Tower and the very climax of the game in the Jefferson Memorial) were particularly infuriating examples worthy of rants all their own.
The games that do it best add shades to these options, sometimes giving various other options based on stats. Even in these games though, there is an annoying tendency to occasionally slip up and only offer dialogue choices that amount to "be an angel" or "be an asshole" or even worse, choices like "be an asshole to group A" or "be an asshole to group B". That last one is especially annoying - if I'm playing a character with the right attributes to see a compromise and try to attain it, at least give me the choice to try! If I fail then I fail, but at least I'll know I tried to be reasonable. Yes, I'm looking at you, Fallout 3 - The Pitt!
Talk about your false dilemmas!* You have a well-meaning extremist who is using slave labor to try and build enough infrastructure so that people's living conditions will improve to the point where slave labor will be less effective than paying trained citizens to work. His wife is also working on a cure for a disease that causes people to mutate into blood-thirsty monsters called trogs. The flip side of this is to back the slaves who are tired of being forced to work and are especially unhappy that some of their number keep getting sent into the Scrapyard to hunt for steel ingots amongst the hungry trogs and murderous wildmen - people driven insane by the toxins and radiation but not mutated into trogs. Also, being a well-intentioned extremist, he will live up to the extremist part by slaughtering every slave that revolts leaving the slave population decimated and the few remaining slaves sullen and hopeless.
Obviously the slaves have a valid complaint, so they're the clear, moral choice, right? Sure...except for the fact that they want you to kill the well-meaning extremist and his wife and steal their baby since the kid might possibly be immune to the toxins that cause dementia and mutation. Also, the leader of the revolt is the former right hand man of the well-intentioned extremist who publicly claims to be doing this for the workers but really just wants power for himself. He also has no idea how to research a cure if the baby is not the hope they were looking for, he has no major plans for the future, and his methods for overthrowing the slavers also involve letting trogs into the part of the city where the well-intentioned extremist and the slavers are which will leave even fewer safe places to live. Also, some of the slavers you'd be killing are former slaves who won their freedom fighting in vicious voluntary bloodsports against other slaves for the right.
So obviously this is a completely insoluble dilemma with no right or wrong choice, right? Wrong. Heck, the designers of the DLC can't even claim ignorance of the fact because you can find a terminal where an overseer wrote that he keeps losing his best slaves to the Scrapyard and he requests some guards to send along with them to keep them alive. This is exactly the kind of compromise needed and the designers put that in there, and yet there is no way to follow up on that. You can't go to the extremist and say, hey, as someone who just clawed my way up from being a slave to being one of your slavers, I'd like to point out that working conditions kind of suck and I have some ideas that would improve things and maybe keep people from dying. See, if you tried to be reasonable and the guy turned you down, you'd feel better about shooting his face off. If you got him to make the improvements you suggest and the slaves still revolted, you'd feel less qualms about killing the ingrates. Maybe, just maybe though you could manage to make things a little better.
That is after all one of the reasons people play RPGs - to feel like they have an impact, be it positive or negative, on the world. I realize designers can't think of everything, but I really wish they'd give their writers enough time to perfect the dialogue trees. As an example, in Dragon Age: Origins, there is a frustrating tendency to have a character talk to you and be presented with a variety of choices. The character may not have asked a question, so it can appear that there is no special response to give...except there is. You see, sometimes a dialogue tree will present you with exactly one chance to say the right thing to get certain results, and if you don't choose it, the dialogue option never shows up again. Annoyingly enough, not only do the information-related dialogue options remain available after that, but if there is an option to say something that would make you look like an asshole, that option ALSO usually remains. Only the one special dialogue option disappears forever, and what is most frustrating is that there is no way to tell (barring using a strategy guide or wiki) which dialogue options are one-time only! It's frustrating to have spent skill increases to get the highest level of persuasiveness and not be able to use it to get the results you want simply because the writers give you one chance to get it right and dozens of chances to get it wrong. Considering that the other skill choices directly improve your chances in fights, the frequency of this kind of oversight and the infrequency of persuasion being useful for anything is completely and utterly inexcusable. I mean seriously, you get one chance to hand the kid his father's sword (The Green Blade) instead of keeping it and after that the dialogue option never shows up again? It speaks of yet another product rushed to the shelves without proper proofreading.
What else bothers me? Well, let's see...while I can acknowledge their utility in keeping me out of places with no plot significance and no worthwhile loot, I'm still tired of ubiquitous indestructible windows or wooden walls and doors. Again Fallout is the worst culprit with places like Big Town where large sections of the fence around it are made of wood without reinforcement yet the wall holds up against chainguns, lasers, missiles, and even micronukes! I realize that even semi-accurate physics are hard enough to accomplish (other people have ranted enough about the shortcomings of Fallout's rag doll physics, so I'll skip that) and destructible terrain isn't easy but...it's not impossible. Dragon Age: Origins has barricades that can be destroyed, for instance, and even further back in 1999, Zipper Interactive had a game called Recoil which featured a tank with a main weapon that could blow craters in the terrain. Mainly it was just a neat effect, but the point is that the coding existed to have alterable 3D terrain even that far back. Now I know some people are thinking that this would lead to game developers having to waste huge amounts of time laying out massive areas with no plot significance, but that's simply not the case. Procedural game design methods could rough out entire cities and populate them with a variety of semi-unique NPCs leaving the designers only the task of going in and tweaking things to add unique landmarks, buildings, and plot-relevant characters.
Related issues - persistent corpses are kind of neat...except when they're a little too persistent. Could I please burn the bodies or bury them once I've looted them? I still recall in Fallout: New Vegas how back in Good Springs you can save the town from a group of Powder Gangers which is all well and good except...their bodies just stay there. At no point do the people ever remark about the corpses strewn around town, never comment if you arrange the corpses in lewd poses, never suggest someone moved the bodies much less actually do it. Problem is you can't do much with the bodies either other than move them somewhere out of the way. Can't burn them to ash even though you may have weapons that would reduce them to ash while they were alive, and you can't bury them even though there's a graveyard nearby. It was rather frustrating.
What else...well, I'm tired of games where you can loot the bodies but the loot doesn't match what the target was wearing or using to attack you. The Fallout series was actually pretty good about avoiding that, but Dragon Age: Origins pretty much sucks and uses grossly outdated loot tables for enemies. Also frustrating - you get tons of loot, can build up entire sets of armor and you have no choice but to sell it or let it continue to clog up your inventory. There's no option to stash it somewhere, much less put it on display. That was another thing that could be said about the Fallout games: once you got a home, you could collect and display literally anything and everything you could carry into the place. That was a nice touch and the game designers deserve credit for doing a good job with that.
There are probably other issues, but right now I can think of only one other major issue that remains, one last detail that breaks immersion, and that's area loading. I know a lot of games do it, and it's perhaps one of the more acceptable breaks in immersion...except that again we have a much older game, namely Half-life, where there were never any area transitions. Yes, I know that implementing everything I'm talking about would likely use a considerable amount of system resources, but honestly I'd prefer game designers to focus on perfecting these aspects of immersiveness rather than lens flare, other light effects, and particle effects. That said, I must admit that pausing the game in Dragon Age right when walking bomb causes and enemy to explode and then rotating the camera is kind of a neat effect. Bullet cams and death finishing sequences are a nice touch. Neat effects though are not inherently immersive and can grow old after a while. Now the dappling of light and shadow beneath a tree - that's a nice effect that does aid immersion, and again Fallout as well as Neverwinter Nights get points for that little touch.
So as you can see, the elements of a truly great game exist out there. Someone just has to have the time and financial backing to put them all together to make it. Any takers? Please?
*It's worth noting that Fallout 3 was absolutely horrible about creating false dilemmas; not that there were a lot of them, but the other two that spring readily to mind (Tenpenny Tower and the very climax of the game in the Jefferson Memorial) were particularly infuriating examples worthy of rants all their own.
Rant: People gloating about the new AUP
Posted 15 years agoFirst, this is not about the change in the AUP.
Let me say that I while I am sad that it is happening, I completely understand that sites like this do not support themselves on wishes alone, and a lack of advertiser funds would soon offline the whole site, sexual cub art and all. In the face of that kind of reality and with no alternate source of funding evident, cutting out the part that is preventing advertisers from backing the site only makes sense. From skimming the thread, it truly looks as if the admins explored all reasonable possibilities they could think of, so unless someone has concrete evidence that they deliberately ignored a completely viable option, I have no reason to do anything but thank the admins for at least trying to preserve sexual cub art.
What annoys me are those people who, instead of limiting their comments to their own journals, posted in that thread saying how glad they were to be rid of cub porn. Seriously guys? Are you really such complete jerks that you feel you have to let people know how glad you are that they are losing a place to enjoy a type of art they like? Yes, it's obvious you don't like cub porn. No one asked you to like it. You don't approve of it? That's your right, and yes, you have the right to express your opinion, but that doesn't make you any less of a jerk for saying it in the very same thread where people were learning that something they enjoyed had to be dropped from the site. Go ahead, twist the knife a little, huh?
Oh, don't even think of climbing up on your moral high horse. Let me anticipate the dead horses that will be dragged out to be beaten again.
Cubs are underage characters, and sex with anyone underage is wrong!
Very few artists and fans of cub art would disagree with that statement. This isn't really relevant to the topic though.
Yes, it is! Those are pictures of cubs having sex!
Yes, pictures as in artistic renditions, not photographs. No cubs were harmed in the production of these images. If you know differently, please don't complain here. Report it to the authorities immediately.
Well no, but enjoying the idea of adults having sex with cubs, especially cubs being raped is just awful!
The action would certainly be awful, but again, no cubs were harmed in the production of these images.
But we're talking about cubs being raped!
Okay, ignoring the cub-on-cub and cub masturbation pics that will also be disappearing, yes, some are non-photographic images of cubs being raped or tortured. Again, this is still just pixels on a screen with no living beings having suffered to produce the art unless you count the artist.
It's still wrong to show that kind of thing!
Why is it wrong?
Because it's cubs!
It's images of cubs - we already covered that. What is wrong with images of cubs being raped when the production of the image does not in fact involve the harming of anyone, above or below the age of consent?
Because it's sick to like the idea of hurting kids!
More sick than the idea of hurting non-consenting adults?
Yes!
So hurting non-consenting adults is okay?
No! I didn't say that!
Okay, but I don't see you protesting any art that depicts adults being harmed.1
That's different!
Why is it different?
Because cubs are innocent and pure, and it's wrong to want to defile that!
Sure, but then it's wrong to want to treat any other living being like an object that exists only to provide you pleasure even if it hurts and defiles them. Why does age make a difference?
Because cubs are too young for sex! Cubs are supposed to be protected by adults, not harmed by them!
Those are perfectly good reasons not to rape or torture minors, but it still doesn't address the issue of depicting minors in such situations as long as you aren't using any real life references.
There are just some lines you don't cross!
That doesn't explain why the line is drawn between adults and cubs.
Well, it's illegal!
The real life act of having sex with a minor certainly is, as it should be. Laws regarding non-photographic depictions of such acts vary from country to country. Non-photographic depictions of non-human minors are currently still legal in America, and I believe most of Europe, or there wouldn't be any point discussing this. Poor, overly conservative Australia...
You're still portraying something that would be illegal if it was real!
Yes, as is every artist that portrays rape, murder, theft, vandalism, and any number of other crimes. So?
So you're just encouraging people to do this sort of thing!
Oooh...you don't want to tread that path. You realize that's the same argument used by the extremist who protested violent video games, violent movies, and even further back, violent comics? That's the mind set that gave us the Silver Age of comics where artists couldn't even portray people punching each other, much less shooting, stabbing, running over, or otherwise inflicting harm on each other.2 If you use that logic, you'd be agreeing that any depiction of criminal acts was wrong. You can't argue that it's a matter of urges - people have violent urges but still have to chose not to act on them or else pay the penalty just the same as acting on incorrect sexual urges. Even if religion were a valid basis to argue the matter, I can't think of a religion that accepts adult pornography but explicitly forbids child porn. Most either forbid all porn, accept porn in a general sense and don't address child porn, or take no strong stance on the issue of porn.
But...I just know it's wrong!
For you, it is, and that's fine. Your convictions however do not get to determine right and wrong for the rest of the world without weight of evidence. So far, there has been no conclusive evidence linking non-photographic child porn, much less cub porn, as a cause of actual harm to any real world children. There has even been some evidence indicating that such artwork may actually reduce incidences of crimes against children, though of course that's not conclusive either or there wouldn't be much of a debate. Check out Wikipedia's discussion of the controversy concerning lolicon for more details.
Anyway, it's getting late for me, and I think I've covered all the arguments I can recall hearing, so it's time to put this rant to bed and me along with it. Some of you may feel I wasn't presenting a very believable picture of the usual sort of person that protests cub porn. Granted. There is no way I could use a single 'voice' and possibly encompass all variations on the arguments all such people have posed, all of their speech patterns, vernacular, etc. and to pick just one to emulate would amount to a personal attack. This then is a generic voice of opposition which cannot perfectly reflect any one individual. I did my best to use actual arguments and objections I have seen while avoiding the name calling and various logical fallacies that I have also sometimes witnessed. I also chose to assume this fictitious individual actually had a deeper reasoning than 'Because it's cubs!' - those people don't actually have an actual argument, just an opinion, and their opinion holds no more weight than anyone other opinion. Lastly, I left out the idiotic arguments suggesting people should just get some normal interests, as if people simply chose to have kinks that were controversial. The exclamation points were left in because this isn't directed at people who calmly and rationally discuss topics - it's about the jerks who posted that they were happy to see cub porn going away and did it where people who were disappointed by the fact would be most likely to see it. This is not 4chan, and it is not cool to post here for the lulz.
Ultra short version - The wrongness of cub porn is not a fact; it is a subject of philosophical debate. Your opinion may be valid, but sharing it at the wrong time and place still makes you a jerk.
1 Obviously I am not talking about artists like Caroo who does oppose any artwork depicting females of any age in distress. I may think it's odd he doesn't seem to acknowledge the existence of masochists, but I can't fault his desire for a world where no one wants to hurt or be hurt. I will say however that as someone who once suffered from asthma, I would rather have a needle shoved through my nipple than be tickled near breathless against my will. On the other hand, he always portrays his victims smiling, so at least he means well.
2 For anyone that didn't grow up in a country that actually went through these sort of debates, the argument was that kids are impressionable and might confuse fantasy for reality. That has pretty thoroughly been debunked despite moral guardians dragging it out with each new offense to their sensibilities. While ability does vary with age and mental development, it turns out kids are pretty good at telling reality from fiction. I believe most if not all child psychologists agree that if the parents spend time with their kids, pay attention to them, interact with them, provide good role models for them, and explain why something is right or wrong, that all of these supposed negative influences will have little to no negative affect on their moral judgment. Other people, especially authority figures like teachers, can still complicate matters if they do not agree with the teachings of the parent, of course.
Let me say that I while I am sad that it is happening, I completely understand that sites like this do not support themselves on wishes alone, and a lack of advertiser funds would soon offline the whole site, sexual cub art and all. In the face of that kind of reality and with no alternate source of funding evident, cutting out the part that is preventing advertisers from backing the site only makes sense. From skimming the thread, it truly looks as if the admins explored all reasonable possibilities they could think of, so unless someone has concrete evidence that they deliberately ignored a completely viable option, I have no reason to do anything but thank the admins for at least trying to preserve sexual cub art.
What annoys me are those people who, instead of limiting their comments to their own journals, posted in that thread saying how glad they were to be rid of cub porn. Seriously guys? Are you really such complete jerks that you feel you have to let people know how glad you are that they are losing a place to enjoy a type of art they like? Yes, it's obvious you don't like cub porn. No one asked you to like it. You don't approve of it? That's your right, and yes, you have the right to express your opinion, but that doesn't make you any less of a jerk for saying it in the very same thread where people were learning that something they enjoyed had to be dropped from the site. Go ahead, twist the knife a little, huh?
Oh, don't even think of climbing up on your moral high horse. Let me anticipate the dead horses that will be dragged out to be beaten again.
Cubs are underage characters, and sex with anyone underage is wrong!
Very few artists and fans of cub art would disagree with that statement. This isn't really relevant to the topic though.
Yes, it is! Those are pictures of cubs having sex!
Yes, pictures as in artistic renditions, not photographs. No cubs were harmed in the production of these images. If you know differently, please don't complain here. Report it to the authorities immediately.
Well no, but enjoying the idea of adults having sex with cubs, especially cubs being raped is just awful!
The action would certainly be awful, but again, no cubs were harmed in the production of these images.
But we're talking about cubs being raped!
Okay, ignoring the cub-on-cub and cub masturbation pics that will also be disappearing, yes, some are non-photographic images of cubs being raped or tortured. Again, this is still just pixels on a screen with no living beings having suffered to produce the art unless you count the artist.
It's still wrong to show that kind of thing!
Why is it wrong?
Because it's cubs!
It's images of cubs - we already covered that. What is wrong with images of cubs being raped when the production of the image does not in fact involve the harming of anyone, above or below the age of consent?
Because it's sick to like the idea of hurting kids!
More sick than the idea of hurting non-consenting adults?
Yes!
So hurting non-consenting adults is okay?
No! I didn't say that!
Okay, but I don't see you protesting any art that depicts adults being harmed.1
That's different!
Why is it different?
Because cubs are innocent and pure, and it's wrong to want to defile that!
Sure, but then it's wrong to want to treat any other living being like an object that exists only to provide you pleasure even if it hurts and defiles them. Why does age make a difference?
Because cubs are too young for sex! Cubs are supposed to be protected by adults, not harmed by them!
Those are perfectly good reasons not to rape or torture minors, but it still doesn't address the issue of depicting minors in such situations as long as you aren't using any real life references.
There are just some lines you don't cross!
That doesn't explain why the line is drawn between adults and cubs.
Well, it's illegal!
The real life act of having sex with a minor certainly is, as it should be. Laws regarding non-photographic depictions of such acts vary from country to country. Non-photographic depictions of non-human minors are currently still legal in America, and I believe most of Europe, or there wouldn't be any point discussing this. Poor, overly conservative Australia...
You're still portraying something that would be illegal if it was real!
Yes, as is every artist that portrays rape, murder, theft, vandalism, and any number of other crimes. So?
So you're just encouraging people to do this sort of thing!
Oooh...you don't want to tread that path. You realize that's the same argument used by the extremist who protested violent video games, violent movies, and even further back, violent comics? That's the mind set that gave us the Silver Age of comics where artists couldn't even portray people punching each other, much less shooting, stabbing, running over, or otherwise inflicting harm on each other.2 If you use that logic, you'd be agreeing that any depiction of criminal acts was wrong. You can't argue that it's a matter of urges - people have violent urges but still have to chose not to act on them or else pay the penalty just the same as acting on incorrect sexual urges. Even if religion were a valid basis to argue the matter, I can't think of a religion that accepts adult pornography but explicitly forbids child porn. Most either forbid all porn, accept porn in a general sense and don't address child porn, or take no strong stance on the issue of porn.
But...I just know it's wrong!
For you, it is, and that's fine. Your convictions however do not get to determine right and wrong for the rest of the world without weight of evidence. So far, there has been no conclusive evidence linking non-photographic child porn, much less cub porn, as a cause of actual harm to any real world children. There has even been some evidence indicating that such artwork may actually reduce incidences of crimes against children, though of course that's not conclusive either or there wouldn't be much of a debate. Check out Wikipedia's discussion of the controversy concerning lolicon for more details.
Anyway, it's getting late for me, and I think I've covered all the arguments I can recall hearing, so it's time to put this rant to bed and me along with it. Some of you may feel I wasn't presenting a very believable picture of the usual sort of person that protests cub porn. Granted. There is no way I could use a single 'voice' and possibly encompass all variations on the arguments all such people have posed, all of their speech patterns, vernacular, etc. and to pick just one to emulate would amount to a personal attack. This then is a generic voice of opposition which cannot perfectly reflect any one individual. I did my best to use actual arguments and objections I have seen while avoiding the name calling and various logical fallacies that I have also sometimes witnessed. I also chose to assume this fictitious individual actually had a deeper reasoning than 'Because it's cubs!' - those people don't actually have an actual argument, just an opinion, and their opinion holds no more weight than anyone other opinion. Lastly, I left out the idiotic arguments suggesting people should just get some normal interests, as if people simply chose to have kinks that were controversial. The exclamation points were left in because this isn't directed at people who calmly and rationally discuss topics - it's about the jerks who posted that they were happy to see cub porn going away and did it where people who were disappointed by the fact would be most likely to see it. This is not 4chan, and it is not cool to post here for the lulz.
Ultra short version - The wrongness of cub porn is not a fact; it is a subject of philosophical debate. Your opinion may be valid, but sharing it at the wrong time and place still makes you a jerk.
1 Obviously I am not talking about artists like Caroo who does oppose any artwork depicting females of any age in distress. I may think it's odd he doesn't seem to acknowledge the existence of masochists, but I can't fault his desire for a world where no one wants to hurt or be hurt. I will say however that as someone who once suffered from asthma, I would rather have a needle shoved through my nipple than be tickled near breathless against my will. On the other hand, he always portrays his victims smiling, so at least he means well.
2 For anyone that didn't grow up in a country that actually went through these sort of debates, the argument was that kids are impressionable and might confuse fantasy for reality. That has pretty thoroughly been debunked despite moral guardians dragging it out with each new offense to their sensibilities. While ability does vary with age and mental development, it turns out kids are pretty good at telling reality from fiction. I believe most if not all child psychologists agree that if the parents spend time with their kids, pay attention to them, interact with them, provide good role models for them, and explain why something is right or wrong, that all of these supposed negative influences will have little to no negative affect on their moral judgment. Other people, especially authority figures like teachers, can still complicate matters if they do not agree with the teachings of the parent, of course.
Because of Midnight Sonata and her eeeevil meme...
Posted 15 years agoMale side:
[ ] You love hoodies.
[x] You love jeans.
[ ] Dogs are better than cats
[ ] It's hilarious when people get hurt.
[ ] You've played with/against boys on a team.
[ ] Shopping is torture (I'm kinda indifferent)
[x] Sad movies suck (I can tolerate some, but I try to avoid them.)
[ ] You own an X-Box.
[x] Played with Hotwheels cars as a kid.
[ ] At some point in time you wanted to be a firefighter.
[ ] You used to be obsessed with Power Rangers.
[ ] You watch sports on TV.
[ ] Gory movies are cool. Oh HELL yes.
[x] You go to your dad for advice.
[ ] You own, like, a trillion hats.
[ ] You like going to football games.
[ ] You used to/do collect baseball cards.
[ ] Baggy pants are cool to wear.
[ ] It's kind of weird to have sleepovers with a bunch of people. (I...honestly wouldn't know...)
[x] Green, black, red, blue, or silver are one of your favorite colors. (Blue and silver share first with black and purple taking second.)
[ ] You love to go crazy and not care what people think.
[ ] Sports are fun.
[x] Talk with food in your mouth.
[ ] Wear boxers.
[ ] You enjoy hunting, hiking and camping
Male points total = 6
Female side:
[ ] You wear lip gloss.
[ ] You love to shop (See above)
[ ] You wear eyeliner.
[x] You have some of the same shirts in different colors. (Comes with the territory when you wear dress shirts.)
[ ] You wear the color pink.
[x] Go to your mom for advice.
[x] You consider cheerleading a sport. (There are competitions for it, and really it shares a lot in common with rhythmic gymnastics.)
[ ] You hate wearing the color black.
[x] You like hanging out at the mall. (Not so much these days, but I was once something of a mall rat even if I was mostly in the arcade or software store.)
[ ] You like getting manicures and/or pedicures. (I do like getting a haircut though.)
[ ] You like wearing jewelry.
[ ] Skirts are a big part of your wardrobe.
[ ] Shopping is one of your favorite hobbies.
[ ] You don't like the movie Star Wars.
[ ] You are/were in cheerleading, gymnastics or dance.
[ ] It takes you around 1 hour to shower, get dressed, and put on make-up and accessories.
[ ] You smile a lot more than you should.
[ ] You have more than 10 pairs of shoes.
[x] You care about what you look like.
[ ] You like wearing dresses when you can.
[ ] You like wearing body spray/perfume/cologne.
[ ] You wear girl underwear.
[ ] Used to play with dolls as little kid. (Not often enough to call it a habit, but I didn't avoid playing with them either.)
[ ] Like putting make-up on someone else for the joy of it.
[ ] Like taking pictures of yourself with your cell phone/camera when you're bored.
Female points total = 5
Androgyne / Gender neutral side:
[ ] You shop in both men and women departments for the best clothes.
[x] You think for yourself and do what you like regardless of what people say.
[x] You believe associating personality traits with gender is absurd. (Not so much absurd as it is an overgeneralization.)
[x] You are aware that colors don't have gender.
[ ] Androgyny and neutrality kick ass.
[ ] Macho men and girly girls make you want to puke.
[x] You appreciate diverse music, technology and media.
[x] You can shop and repair things with the best of them. (I'm a tech, and I can shop even if it's not something I indulge often.)
[x] Played with dolls AND hotwheels as a child
[ ] At some point you idolized an androgynous singer.
[x] You are aware that gender does not equal biological sex. (I'm aware that sexuality is more complicated than what's between your legs, but gender is not the right word for these differences.)
[ ] You become angered at intolerance and bigotry. (I'm angered or dismayed by acts motivated by those emotions, but the emotions themselves merely weary me.)
[ ] You can watch both horror and romantic comedy without being phased. (Sorry, don't like horror much.)
[ ] Hats, ties and accessories can make the outfit. (I hate having to wear a tie to work, and despite how good they look, I don't like wearing hats.)
[x] You wouldn’t care much if you were the opposite sex. (I'm comfortable as is, but after an initial adjustment period, I could probably become comfortable being different.)
[ ] You've been mistaken for the opposite sex. (Not likely!)
[ ] You can cook and play sports. (I don't do either one well!)
[ ] You've had friends of all genders growing up. (Not an even enough distribution to count this as a yes.)
[x] You think everyone should be free to express themselves.
[x] People, and not what is in their pants, is most important.
[x] You make up your own manners as you go along.
[x] Variety is good.
[ ] You regularly question outdated social customs and rules. (Not so much anymore - I'm 35, so I've already done quite a bit of my questioning and am just mopping up now.)
[ ] You use things made for the opposite sex if you feel like it without issue.
[x] You think these gender surveys are silly. (Absolutely!)
Androgyne/Neutral points total = 13
I'm honestly not surprised that I score as sexually neutral. My main fursona is a male otter, but all of my secondary fursonas - lizard, tigress, bunny, and mouse - are female as are my tertiary and retired secondary fursonas.
[ ] You love hoodies.
[x] You love jeans.
[ ] Dogs are better than cats
[ ] It's hilarious when people get hurt.
[ ] You've played with/against boys on a team.
[ ] Shopping is torture (I'm kinda indifferent)
[x] Sad movies suck (I can tolerate some, but I try to avoid them.)
[ ] You own an X-Box.
[x] Played with Hotwheels cars as a kid.
[ ] At some point in time you wanted to be a firefighter.
[ ] You used to be obsessed with Power Rangers.
[ ] You watch sports on TV.
[ ] Gory movies are cool. Oh HELL yes.
[x] You go to your dad for advice.
[ ] You own, like, a trillion hats.
[ ] You like going to football games.
[ ] You used to/do collect baseball cards.
[ ] Baggy pants are cool to wear.
[ ] It's kind of weird to have sleepovers with a bunch of people. (I...honestly wouldn't know...)
[x] Green, black, red, blue, or silver are one of your favorite colors. (Blue and silver share first with black and purple taking second.)
[ ] You love to go crazy and not care what people think.
[ ] Sports are fun.
[x] Talk with food in your mouth.
[ ] Wear boxers.
[ ] You enjoy hunting, hiking and camping
Male points total = 6
Female side:
[ ] You wear lip gloss.
[ ] You love to shop (See above)
[ ] You wear eyeliner.
[x] You have some of the same shirts in different colors. (Comes with the territory when you wear dress shirts.)
[ ] You wear the color pink.
[x] Go to your mom for advice.
[x] You consider cheerleading a sport. (There are competitions for it, and really it shares a lot in common with rhythmic gymnastics.)
[ ] You hate wearing the color black.
[x] You like hanging out at the mall. (Not so much these days, but I was once something of a mall rat even if I was mostly in the arcade or software store.)
[ ] You like getting manicures and/or pedicures. (I do like getting a haircut though.)
[ ] You like wearing jewelry.
[ ] Skirts are a big part of your wardrobe.
[ ] Shopping is one of your favorite hobbies.
[ ] You don't like the movie Star Wars.
[ ] You are/were in cheerleading, gymnastics or dance.
[ ] It takes you around 1 hour to shower, get dressed, and put on make-up and accessories.
[ ] You smile a lot more than you should.
[ ] You have more than 10 pairs of shoes.
[x] You care about what you look like.
[ ] You like wearing dresses when you can.
[ ] You like wearing body spray/perfume/cologne.
[ ] You wear girl underwear.
[ ] Used to play with dolls as little kid. (Not often enough to call it a habit, but I didn't avoid playing with them either.)
[ ] Like putting make-up on someone else for the joy of it.
[ ] Like taking pictures of yourself with your cell phone/camera when you're bored.
Female points total = 5
Androgyne / Gender neutral side:
[ ] You shop in both men and women departments for the best clothes.
[x] You think for yourself and do what you like regardless of what people say.
[x] You believe associating personality traits with gender is absurd. (Not so much absurd as it is an overgeneralization.)
[x] You are aware that colors don't have gender.
[ ] Androgyny and neutrality kick ass.
[ ] Macho men and girly girls make you want to puke.
[x] You appreciate diverse music, technology and media.
[x] You can shop and repair things with the best of them. (I'm a tech, and I can shop even if it's not something I indulge often.)
[x] Played with dolls AND hotwheels as a child
[ ] At some point you idolized an androgynous singer.
[x] You are aware that gender does not equal biological sex. (I'm aware that sexuality is more complicated than what's between your legs, but gender is not the right word for these differences.)
[ ] You become angered at intolerance and bigotry. (I'm angered or dismayed by acts motivated by those emotions, but the emotions themselves merely weary me.)
[ ] You can watch both horror and romantic comedy without being phased. (Sorry, don't like horror much.)
[ ] Hats, ties and accessories can make the outfit. (I hate having to wear a tie to work, and despite how good they look, I don't like wearing hats.)
[x] You wouldn’t care much if you were the opposite sex. (I'm comfortable as is, but after an initial adjustment period, I could probably become comfortable being different.)
[ ] You've been mistaken for the opposite sex. (Not likely!)
[ ] You can cook and play sports. (I don't do either one well!)
[ ] You've had friends of all genders growing up. (Not an even enough distribution to count this as a yes.)
[x] You think everyone should be free to express themselves.
[x] People, and not what is in their pants, is most important.
[x] You make up your own manners as you go along.
[x] Variety is good.
[ ] You regularly question outdated social customs and rules. (Not so much anymore - I'm 35, so I've already done quite a bit of my questioning and am just mopping up now.)
[ ] You use things made for the opposite sex if you feel like it without issue.
[x] You think these gender surveys are silly. (Absolutely!)
Androgyne/Neutral points total = 13
I'm honestly not surprised that I score as sexually neutral. My main fursona is a male otter, but all of my secondary fursonas - lizard, tigress, bunny, and mouse - are female as are my tertiary and retired secondary fursonas.
The Night Before Whipmas
Posted 15 years agoDo I even have to say that what follows is kinky and involves heavy S&M themes? Well, it does. Consider that a warning.
.
.
.
"The Night Before Whipmas" or “A Visit from Bitch Whip"
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Twas the night before Whipmas, when all through the house
Every slave girl was squirming especially the mouse!
The clit rings were hung by the chimney with care
Suspending twelve slave girls bound quite tightly there
The lolis were chained down snug to their beds
While visions of leather crops swished through their heads.
And Mistress and her slaves, and I, her pet cat,
Had just tightened the chains on her brand new slave bat
When out on the lawn there arose such a wailing
I sprang from the bed to check if ball gags were failing
Away to the window my bare form did flash
I opened it, leaned out, and wiggled my ass
The moon and the breasts in the new fallen snow
Were still luscious when frozen at twenty below
When what to my lascivious eyes did appear
But a dark lacquered sleigh and eight squealing chained deer
With a demon slave driver who brooked no slave's lip
I knew in a moment she must be Bitch Whip
More rapid than hoof beats her lashings they came
Her whip whistled, and slashed them, and burned like a flame!
"Now Lasher, Pain Dancer, No-Pantser, Cunt Kicking!
On, Cum Slut! On Stupid! On Blunder and Squicking!
Screw the old slave accords! Screw the rules one and all!
Now lash away! Lash away! Lash away all!"
As shy slaves that before their first whipping will cry,
When they're stripped for the spectacle, mound and ass high
So up on a swelling of torment they flew
With the demonic sleigh pulled by tightened clit screws
And then, in an ear flick, I heard on the roof
The yelping and yipping of our now well-whipped woof
As I shivered in fear and was turning around
Down the attic stairs Bitch Whip came without sound
She was bare save for fur from her head to her foot
And her pelt was the color of ashes and soot
The bundle of toys she had stuffed in her pack
Made the bravest of slave girls go stumbling back
Her eyes how they glinted, soulless and scary,
When she donned a spiked strap-on to take a girl's cherry!
Her cruel, smiling lips were drawn well back to show
The sharp fangs in her mouth were as white as the snow
The length of her whip soon extended her reach,
And the tip, it remorselessly struck each girl's peach
She swung in broad strokes, and screams rose from our bellies
Breasts shook from the lash likes bowls filled with jellies
She was sexy and sleek and infernally svelte
Yet I cringed when I saw her take out her spiked belt!
The look in her eye made me shiver with dread
As every harsh blow struck 'twixt legs widely spread
She spoke not a word as she did her cruel work
And whipped each slave cunny then turned with a smirk
And cracking her bull whip across my anal rose
Then watching me yowl and bounce on my toes
She sprang to her sleigh, her whip's swing made a whistle
And away the slaves screamed like a Hellfire missile
But I heard her exclaim as pain fogged up my sight
"Scary Whipmas to slaves, and to slaves a rough night!"
.
.
.
"The Night Before Whipmas" or “A Visit from Bitch Whip"
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Twas the night before Whipmas, when all through the house
Every slave girl was squirming especially the mouse!
The clit rings were hung by the chimney with care
Suspending twelve slave girls bound quite tightly there
The lolis were chained down snug to their beds
While visions of leather crops swished through their heads.
And Mistress and her slaves, and I, her pet cat,
Had just tightened the chains on her brand new slave bat
When out on the lawn there arose such a wailing
I sprang from the bed to check if ball gags were failing
Away to the window my bare form did flash
I opened it, leaned out, and wiggled my ass
The moon and the breasts in the new fallen snow
Were still luscious when frozen at twenty below
When what to my lascivious eyes did appear
But a dark lacquered sleigh and eight squealing chained deer
With a demon slave driver who brooked no slave's lip
I knew in a moment she must be Bitch Whip
More rapid than hoof beats her lashings they came
Her whip whistled, and slashed them, and burned like a flame!
"Now Lasher, Pain Dancer, No-Pantser, Cunt Kicking!
On, Cum Slut! On Stupid! On Blunder and Squicking!
Screw the old slave accords! Screw the rules one and all!
Now lash away! Lash away! Lash away all!"
As shy slaves that before their first whipping will cry,
When they're stripped for the spectacle, mound and ass high
So up on a swelling of torment they flew
With the demonic sleigh pulled by tightened clit screws
And then, in an ear flick, I heard on the roof
The yelping and yipping of our now well-whipped woof
As I shivered in fear and was turning around
Down the attic stairs Bitch Whip came without sound
She was bare save for fur from her head to her foot
And her pelt was the color of ashes and soot
The bundle of toys she had stuffed in her pack
Made the bravest of slave girls go stumbling back
Her eyes how they glinted, soulless and scary,
When she donned a spiked strap-on to take a girl's cherry!
Her cruel, smiling lips were drawn well back to show
The sharp fangs in her mouth were as white as the snow
The length of her whip soon extended her reach,
And the tip, it remorselessly struck each girl's peach
She swung in broad strokes, and screams rose from our bellies
Breasts shook from the lash likes bowls filled with jellies
She was sexy and sleek and infernally svelte
Yet I cringed when I saw her take out her spiked belt!
The look in her eye made me shiver with dread
As every harsh blow struck 'twixt legs widely spread
She spoke not a word as she did her cruel work
And whipped each slave cunny then turned with a smirk
And cracking her bull whip across my anal rose
Then watching me yowl and bounce on my toes
She sprang to her sleigh, her whip's swing made a whistle
And away the slaves screamed like a Hellfire missile
But I heard her exclaim as pain fogged up my sight
"Scary Whipmas to slaves, and to slaves a rough night!"
Another milestone?
Posted 16 years agoSo...just a small note, but I turn 35 on Sept. 7.
(^.^)
(^.^)
Steppenwolf - Magic Carpet Ride
Posted 16 years agoRULES:
1. Put your iTunes, Windows Media Player, etc. on shuffle.
2. For each question, press the next button to get your answer.
3. YOU MUST WRITE THAT SONG NAME DOWN NO MATTER HOW SILLY IT SOUNDS.
4. Tag 15 friends.
5. Everyone tagged has to do the same thing.
6. Have Fun
I saw this in Vixens-N-Pizza's journal and thought, "What the heck, it sounds like fun even if my taste in music is a bit dated and arguably surreal." Just for fun, I'll add commentary as if these weren't just random chance!
01) SOMEONE SAYS 'ARE YOU OKAY' YOU SAY?
Carpenters - For All We Know
Heh...I'm friendly, but I don't think I'm quite THAT friendly! I'll just assume they meant the song title, not the lyrics for this one.
02) HOW WOULD YOU DESCRIBE YOURSELF?
Heart - These Dreams
*cough* Well, I do often RP female characters, so yeah...heh...
03) WHAT DO YOU LIKE IN A GUY/GIRL?
ABBA - Dancing Queen
*grin* Okay, true, but I'd like to think I'm smart enough not to ever actually go after jailbait.
04) HOW DO YOU FEEL TODAY?
Enya - Book of Days (Far and Away)
Interesting. I did actually strain my wrist today, but I know I'll recover, so in a more immediate sense it fits, but I'd like to think I mostly maintain that attitude that I can keep pressing forwards to reach the goals that are important to me.
05) WHAT IS YOUR LIFE'S PURPOSE?
Beatles - Ob-Bla-Di-Ob-Bla-Da
Erm...the best I can manage from that is "Your purpose is to have a nominally normal family except for some possible gender role reversal" which isn't a bad purpose but it's a bit banal yet bizarre at the same time. Well, I could do worse!
06) WHAT'S YOUR MOTTO?
Royal Guardsman - Snoopy vs. the Red Baron
Hah! A song of the underdog overcoming through determination, perseverance, and wit! I'll go with that!
07) WHAT DO YOUR FRIENDS THINK OF YOU?
Enya - Ebudae
*blinkity-blink* Why in the world would I make my friends think of a Scottish waulking song? Most people don't even know I have a tiny fraction of Scottish (lowlander) ancestry. Oh well, it's more feminine symbolism...or maybe there's just too much Enya in my playlist...
08) WHAT DO YOUR PARENTS THINK OF YOU?
Steel Angel Kurumi - Kiss Kara Hajimaru Miracle (Kiss That Started a Miracle)
Heehee! Though there may be days they wonder if it's a curse or a miracle, that was actually their reaction since medical complications almost made my birth a no go. Not bad!
09) WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT VERY OFTEN?
Monkees - Daydream Believer
Heh...yeah, I'll buy that. (^.^)
10) WHAT IS 2 + 2?
Bowling For Soup - Girl All the Bad Guys Want
*snicker*
11) WHAT DO YOU THINK OF YOUR BEST FRIEND?
Skeeter Davis - Angel of the Morning
Mmmm...I think I'll stick with just the title on this one as well as the lyrics hold some unfortunate implications...
12) WHAT IS YOUR LIFE STORY?
Neil Diamond - Cracklin Rosie
WTF? I've barely touched alcohol! But...hrm...the idea of being someone that uses a substitute for a real relationship...ouch...if the net is my drug, I can't say there isn't some truth there...
13) WHAT DO YOU WANT TO BE WHEN YOU GROW UP?
Vaughn Monroe - Ghost Riders in the Sky
(o.O) I have some odd old songs in my playlist...
14) WHAT DO YOU THINK WHEN YOU SEE THE PERSON YOU LIKE?
Enya - Epona
The Irish Goddess of horses...and a fertility goddess...heh...interesting choice.
I'm glad this wasn't the answer to the last question!
15) WHAT WILL YOU DANCE TO AT YOUR WEDDING?
The Cascades - Rhythm of the Rain
Oh good lord, I hope not! (O.O)
16) WHAT SONG WILL PLAYED AT YOUR FUNERAL?
ABBA - Take a Chance On Me
LOL! See #15! Necrophilia anyone!? Can we switch this with the previous one please? Pretty please?
17) WHAT IS YOUR HOBBY/INTEREST?
Association - Windy
Hey now, I'm not a creepy stalker! Still, if I was, I could pick a worse target...
18) WHAT IS YOUR BIGGEST FEAR?
Bowling For Soup - 1985
Wow...I've never been a White Snake fan, but I will admit I miss the 80s sometimes. Leg warmers can really look sexy...mmm...
19) WHAT IS YOUR BIGGEST SECRET?
America - Muskrat Love
Yes, it's out now! I has teh luv fer hawt rodintz!
20) WHAT DO YOU WANT RIGHT NOW?
Enya - How Can I Keep From Singing
Well duh! I mean there's all these songs!
21) WHAT DO YOU THINK OF YOUR FRIENDS?
Hollies - Carrie Ann
"Hey, Carrie Ann, what's your game now? Can anybody play?" Heh...that fits...
"You're so...So!...so like a woman to me!" *giggle*
22) WHAT WILL YOU POST THIS AS?
Steppenwolf - Magic Carpet Ride
And what a ride it's been!
1. Put your iTunes, Windows Media Player, etc. on shuffle.
2. For each question, press the next button to get your answer.
3. YOU MUST WRITE THAT SONG NAME DOWN NO MATTER HOW SILLY IT SOUNDS.
4. Tag 15 friends.
5. Everyone tagged has to do the same thing.
6. Have Fun
I saw this in Vixens-N-Pizza's journal and thought, "What the heck, it sounds like fun even if my taste in music is a bit dated and arguably surreal." Just for fun, I'll add commentary as if these weren't just random chance!
01) SOMEONE SAYS 'ARE YOU OKAY' YOU SAY?
Carpenters - For All We Know
Heh...I'm friendly, but I don't think I'm quite THAT friendly! I'll just assume they meant the song title, not the lyrics for this one.
02) HOW WOULD YOU DESCRIBE YOURSELF?
Heart - These Dreams
*cough* Well, I do often RP female characters, so yeah...heh...
03) WHAT DO YOU LIKE IN A GUY/GIRL?
ABBA - Dancing Queen
*grin* Okay, true, but I'd like to think I'm smart enough not to ever actually go after jailbait.
04) HOW DO YOU FEEL TODAY?
Enya - Book of Days (Far and Away)
Interesting. I did actually strain my wrist today, but I know I'll recover, so in a more immediate sense it fits, but I'd like to think I mostly maintain that attitude that I can keep pressing forwards to reach the goals that are important to me.
05) WHAT IS YOUR LIFE'S PURPOSE?
Beatles - Ob-Bla-Di-Ob-Bla-Da
Erm...the best I can manage from that is "Your purpose is to have a nominally normal family except for some possible gender role reversal" which isn't a bad purpose but it's a bit banal yet bizarre at the same time. Well, I could do worse!
06) WHAT'S YOUR MOTTO?
Royal Guardsman - Snoopy vs. the Red Baron
Hah! A song of the underdog overcoming through determination, perseverance, and wit! I'll go with that!
07) WHAT DO YOUR FRIENDS THINK OF YOU?
Enya - Ebudae
*blinkity-blink* Why in the world would I make my friends think of a Scottish waulking song? Most people don't even know I have a tiny fraction of Scottish (lowlander) ancestry. Oh well, it's more feminine symbolism...or maybe there's just too much Enya in my playlist...
08) WHAT DO YOUR PARENTS THINK OF YOU?
Steel Angel Kurumi - Kiss Kara Hajimaru Miracle (Kiss That Started a Miracle)
Heehee! Though there may be days they wonder if it's a curse or a miracle, that was actually their reaction since medical complications almost made my birth a no go. Not bad!
09) WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT VERY OFTEN?
Monkees - Daydream Believer
Heh...yeah, I'll buy that. (^.^)
10) WHAT IS 2 + 2?
Bowling For Soup - Girl All the Bad Guys Want
*snicker*
11) WHAT DO YOU THINK OF YOUR BEST FRIEND?
Skeeter Davis - Angel of the Morning
Mmmm...I think I'll stick with just the title on this one as well as the lyrics hold some unfortunate implications...
12) WHAT IS YOUR LIFE STORY?
Neil Diamond - Cracklin Rosie
WTF? I've barely touched alcohol! But...hrm...the idea of being someone that uses a substitute for a real relationship...ouch...if the net is my drug, I can't say there isn't some truth there...
13) WHAT DO YOU WANT TO BE WHEN YOU GROW UP?
Vaughn Monroe - Ghost Riders in the Sky
(o.O) I have some odd old songs in my playlist...
14) WHAT DO YOU THINK WHEN YOU SEE THE PERSON YOU LIKE?
Enya - Epona
The Irish Goddess of horses...and a fertility goddess...heh...interesting choice.
I'm glad this wasn't the answer to the last question!
15) WHAT WILL YOU DANCE TO AT YOUR WEDDING?
The Cascades - Rhythm of the Rain
Oh good lord, I hope not! (O.O)
16) WHAT SONG WILL PLAYED AT YOUR FUNERAL?
ABBA - Take a Chance On Me
LOL! See #15! Necrophilia anyone!? Can we switch this with the previous one please? Pretty please?
17) WHAT IS YOUR HOBBY/INTEREST?
Association - Windy
Hey now, I'm not a creepy stalker! Still, if I was, I could pick a worse target...
18) WHAT IS YOUR BIGGEST FEAR?
Bowling For Soup - 1985
Wow...I've never been a White Snake fan, but I will admit I miss the 80s sometimes. Leg warmers can really look sexy...mmm...
19) WHAT IS YOUR BIGGEST SECRET?
America - Muskrat Love
Yes, it's out now! I has teh luv fer hawt rodintz!
20) WHAT DO YOU WANT RIGHT NOW?
Enya - How Can I Keep From Singing
Well duh! I mean there's all these songs!
21) WHAT DO YOU THINK OF YOUR FRIENDS?
Hollies - Carrie Ann
"Hey, Carrie Ann, what's your game now? Can anybody play?" Heh...that fits...
"You're so...So!...so like a woman to me!" *giggle*
22) WHAT WILL YOU POST THIS AS?
Steppenwolf - Magic Carpet Ride
And what a ride it's been!
BDSM and cubs - thoughts on two controversial types of pr0n
Posted 17 years agoAnyone watching me carefully has probably noticed a few cub pics among my favorites, and you'd have to be outright ignoring me not to have noticed my fondness for bondage. Since I'm in the mood to do it, I'm just going to state my views on these topics. A lot of people don't like either of these subjects due to the nastiness that can occur when trying to translate these fantasies into real life.
I'm not going to defend either type of porn because I don't see that there is anything to defend unless you disapprove of porn in general. That's a whole other debate. Porn is not about reality - it is about erotic fantasies. I'm not going to step into the mire of debate over whether fantasies can have psychological harm other than to agree that one should be cautious about what to expose real life children to. What I do plan on talking about is the allure of BDSM and cub art i.e. what do people see in these?
First of all, you either like something or you don't. Try explaining why you like one type of icecream best. You can state things you do and don't like, but the ultimate why comes down to "I just do". If you don't like certain types of porn, there is probably nothing anyone can say to change that because these feelings run deep. How deep? Well, when I was about 8 or 9 years old, before I had any clue about sex, I vividly remember being tied up by a girl and becoming aroused even though I didn't know that's what was happening. Let me repeat - this is before the onset of adolescence, before I ever looked at any porn much less wanted to. This sort of thing is an ingrained reaction in a certain segment of the population, and it is as natural (if arguably not as wholesome) as liking redheads.
Secondly, if you ask several people what they like about any area of interest they all share, you will undoubtedly get several answers which do not perfectly match up. Everyone is different and likes different things for different reasons. The best I can do is cover some of the major trends based on my own feelings and experience talking to others.
BDSM is bondage and discipline, dominance and submission, and sadism and masochism. BDSM then is actually several related fields of interest which are not all shared by everyone who claims to be into BDSM. I myself have only mild interest in D/s play (my experience being that it is either very good or very bad) and much prefer bondage. S&M for me is something to enhance the bondage experience but holds little interest for me by itself.
Bondage and discipline focuses mainly on restricting movement and removing options. It is about one person being unable to escape the fate imposed on them by an outside force. Some people enjoy being the one in control, some enjoy giving up control. Why does this turn people on? Well, for the ones in control, control is its own allure. There is a certain heady rush about knowing you can do anything, satisfy any desire and not be stopped by anyone. Obviously this is not a good thing to translate into day to day life, but then that's what fantasy is for - it is a safe, effectively harmless channel for this desire.
On the flip side, there is also a distinctly erotic effect to being placed in peril - this is actually expressed in a very wide segment of the population as an evolved method of species perpetuation. Hollywood didn't make up the notion of people becoming much more attracted to each other after coming through something harrowing, they just abused the hell out of it.
Either way, the porn either evokes one of these fantasies in the susceptible members of the audience or reminds them of (hopefully) enjoyable things they've done/had done to them. There are other reasons to like the pr0n however - some people even like bondage for the look as much or more than the above. This is why leather, latex, and corset fetishes often tie in (no pun intended) to BDSM and why one of the hallmarks of shibari is a rope pattern that is more decorative than restrictive.
Dominance and submission is about a person being physically able to act but every action potentially having a consequence which will be enforced upon them. When it comes to RL play, some people enjoy pretending to be forced while others are happier not hiding their willingness to follow orders and some flipflop between these. Again, this relates to control but comes at it from a different angle. The subject is generally not entirely helpless but depending on whether the fantasy concerns willing or unwilling submission they may not be able to avoid whatever punishment will be imposed on them.
Even in the case of willing submission, the ultimate threat used to enforce a punishment can be the threat of not playing anymore, though in healthy relationships the dominant partner(s) will at least be considering whether they are asking too much. Again, the pr0n is all about evoking those feelings - the idea being caught in a dilema, wanting to do one thing but knowing you have been told to do something else or the idea of being the one placing someone in such a situation and watching them squirm, knowing you can make them do what you want and avoid doing things you don't want.
Also, humans are naturally hierarchical creatures, and there is a certain peace of mind that comes from knowing exactly what your place is in your social group. Even being at the absolute bottom of the social heap can hold a certain comfort. Discomfort arises from not being sure whether your privileges and responsibilities will be the same tomorrow as they are today.
"Change is bad. We fear change." - Wayne of Wayne's World
Sadism and masochism is where the meat of the controversy lies because of the overall perception that pain is bad. Wait, it isn't? Certainly some people feel that way, and it's an entirely reasonable and understandable point of view. Pain is your body's way of telling you that something bad is happening or about to happen to it.
The thing is that first, bad is a relative concept. Broken bones, damaged organs, and massive blood loss are things that are unquestionably bad and thus are things best avoided. Piercings, welts, and shallow cuts and bruises are transitory injuries which offer little or no threat to your life and leave no lasting physical effects even if marks linger. Obviously there can be lasting psychological effects, but that's another matter. The point is that a body can experience pain when the organism as a whole isn't endangered.
Secondly, and this is important, some people get off on pain. The body can only handle so much pain before it starts releasing endorphins in order to be able to keep functioning. This is again a completely natural tendency developed for survival. Interestingly enough however, there may be purely psychological aspects to the pleasure gained from masochism as well. It is well known that athletes who push themselves to the point that their muscles are burning can eventually experience what is known as a runner's high. It was at one time believed that at some point their bodies start dumping endorphins into the bloodstream to overwhelm the painful buildup of lactic acid in the muscles, but this may be a purely psychological reaction to overcoming a challenge.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endorp.....unner.27s_high
If this is true, it could easily explain why a masochist would feel pleasure after being subjected not only to physical pain but humiliation (i.e. psychological pain) as well. The achievement of weathering such a trial and coming out the other side could be producing a purely psychological pleasure that nonetheless expresses itself as arousal.
Okay, what about sadists? Aren't they all bastards? No. Some are, sure. Anytime someone does something against another's will, they risk stepping over the line. I say risk because when a parent or teacher disciplines a child, they are doing something against the child's will in order to teach them about right and wrong and what is safe or unsafe. Police often have to do things against the will of criminals, and doctors may have to get orderlies to assist in restraining a patient so they can do what is necessary to help them. There is a reason why these themes show up in so much BDSM porn.
Okay, but isn't WANTING to inflict pain on someone a bit messed up? Perhaps, but everyone is at least a little messed up in some way. Some people are inclined towards laziness, some towards greed, some have no natural respect for property, some have no respect for privacy or boundries. The important part is how you deal with your inclinations, and someone that goes out of their way to find someone that wants to be hurt is channeling those desires in the most healthy way they can physically express. Someone that satisfies those desires with arguably disturbing art and paws off afterwards is certainly not hurting anyone.
Still, the whole non-consentual thing - isn't that kinda ick even as a fantasy? For some people, sure. Not everyone who's into BDSM likes the idea of non-con as a fantasy. To understand what anyone (aside from a sociopath) could see in it, you have to understand that there is a very deliberate separation between fantasy and reality. In reality, there must always be a line drawn beyond which one must not pass or else something happens that you will regret. A sub can only suffer so much, can only be left tied and helpless for so long, can only be pushed so far before something gives. Fantasy allows a submissive to be pushed further than they would dare in real life, can leave someone locked in bondage without risk of blood pooling and muscles atrophying, can inflict grievous amounts of punishment on someone and leave them still able to function. In the mind of the audience, both masters and slaves can take part in things that would be insane to try for real, and that is a rush for those with that sort of inclination.
For me personally, the S&M aspects of a bondage picture, story, or scene are there to give the bondage more substance by creating a distinct reason to desire freedom. It underscores the helplessness of the victim and makes the situation that much more intense. It isn't the only way to achieve that, but it is a very effective method for me. Other people that like S&M have their own reasons which may or may not relate to mine.
Whew! I think that covers the major points of that. On to cubs!
So what's wrong with adults that has you looking at kids? Nothing necessarily. Some people like both adults and kids, some just like kids. This sort of thing partly falls under the same banner as 'Why animalistic humanoids?', 'Why a different race?', and 'Why the same sex?' Some people simply have sex drives that are wired to seek out something other than the norm. Many people find a distinct allure in that which is exotic, and for some there is a certain draw towards the forbidden or unattainable. Children as sexual objects are both exotic and forbidden and since there are no furries yet, cubs are utterly unattainable. Of course, this means that fantasies about cubs are also quite safe since there is no chance of them being enacted in a literal way.
Okay, so let's delve into the possible root causes for the erotic appeal of cubs. First and foremost, cubs are cute. There is a nearly ubiquitous aesthetic appeal to the overall form and behavior of a young child. This too is an adaptation designed to ensure species survival since it makes people more likely to want to protect children. Obviously it isn't 100% effective or there would be no child abuse. The thing is that cuteness is a physical quality not limited to youth. People often refer to cute guys and gals meaning full adults that they find attractive for whatever reason. For some the cub's cuteness, all those traits that make you want to hug them, becomes similarly tangled up in the feelings of eroticism which are also common to such contact.
The next factor is innocence. There is something many find appealing and endearing about innocence. It is a state we all once shared and many of us long to be that way again. The Victorian era actually held the image of a nude child to be the very essence of innocence in its purist form, and it is because of this that Lewis Carroll's hobby of photgraphing nude girls was in later years interpretted as pedophilia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lewis_.....arroll_Myth.22
That said, such interests obviously can tie into pedophilia or the misunderstanding never would have occurred. For some people then, cub art is a way to touch this innocence in a harmless fashion even when eroticism is mixed in. Some want to get closer to the innocence and try to somehow preserve it while bringing it into the adult world the way they wish had happened with them. Others admittedly want to defile that innocence for much the same reason that misery loves company.
"I felt like destroying something beautiful." - Narrator, Fight Club
Still others may be attracted to the fantasy of a cub that is already less innocent than they ought to be. Again, this could be a lure of the exotic and forbidden but with less guilt when the cub is willing.
Incest is something some people really get into. Why? Well, members of your own family are known quantities. They know you and you know them, and intimacy is already present - this is just taking intimacy further. It is of course frowned on by society, so there is also a distinct air of the forbidden about it. That gets even more intense and adds a hint of the exotic when one or more parties involved is a child. In consensual situations, the feelings of trust are built upon to forge a deeper relationship than would normally exist. Non-consensual relationships rely on the inherent power of the elder parent or sibling, or in a reversal that really arouses some, threats by the child of revealing some secret the elder individual(s) don't want to get out. This also leads into the next concept.
Vulnerability is something cubs have in spades. They are smaller, weaker, and have less body mass than adults meaning that they have next to no chance of coming out on top in a physical confrontation with an adult. Furthermore society places all the power strictly in the hands of adults meaning that cubs share a lot in common with legally sanctioned slaves. The major difference is that since cubs go to school, they have more oversight than slaves to ensure that they are not being abused. Still, if any of the above reasons for liking cubs strikes home and someone also likes BDSM, cubs are a very good fit for fantasies. Likewise, for those that like role reversal, the cub as a dominant is very hard to beat, especially the idea of a small prey species cub (mice are almost iconic in this respect) dominating a large, adult preditor (often a feline to pair with the mouse).
I'll admit to falling under the category of liking cub victims in BDSM fantasies because my own submissive leanings make such fantasies particularly intense. Were there a real cub around, or for that matter if I were a cub, I would not want to see any such things happen for real. (Well, I might go find a girl cub to tie me up, but that's at least marginally innocent.) I'm not much of a masochist - just someone that likes bondage and uses the illusion of dire threats to make my experience more erotically potent. I don't desire to see real children hurt in any way. Like most who like cub art, I like kids as they are - cute, happy, and innocent - and will take pains to protect that state. This is the carefully maintained difference between the fantasies and reality.
Alright, I suppose that last bit came out a tad defensive, but when dealing with a subject that most people's minds want to instinctively recoil from, it's hard to know how much to stress a point. Besides, I've been writing for a few hours now and am a little bit out of it. Whew! I think it was worth it though. I wonder if anyone else has thoughts on this. Brief thoughts are fine - I don't expect anyone to answer in anything close to this kind of detail!
I'm not going to defend either type of porn because I don't see that there is anything to defend unless you disapprove of porn in general. That's a whole other debate. Porn is not about reality - it is about erotic fantasies. I'm not going to step into the mire of debate over whether fantasies can have psychological harm other than to agree that one should be cautious about what to expose real life children to. What I do plan on talking about is the allure of BDSM and cub art i.e. what do people see in these?
First of all, you either like something or you don't. Try explaining why you like one type of icecream best. You can state things you do and don't like, but the ultimate why comes down to "I just do". If you don't like certain types of porn, there is probably nothing anyone can say to change that because these feelings run deep. How deep? Well, when I was about 8 or 9 years old, before I had any clue about sex, I vividly remember being tied up by a girl and becoming aroused even though I didn't know that's what was happening. Let me repeat - this is before the onset of adolescence, before I ever looked at any porn much less wanted to. This sort of thing is an ingrained reaction in a certain segment of the population, and it is as natural (if arguably not as wholesome) as liking redheads.
Secondly, if you ask several people what they like about any area of interest they all share, you will undoubtedly get several answers which do not perfectly match up. Everyone is different and likes different things for different reasons. The best I can do is cover some of the major trends based on my own feelings and experience talking to others.
BDSM is bondage and discipline, dominance and submission, and sadism and masochism. BDSM then is actually several related fields of interest which are not all shared by everyone who claims to be into BDSM. I myself have only mild interest in D/s play (my experience being that it is either very good or very bad) and much prefer bondage. S&M for me is something to enhance the bondage experience but holds little interest for me by itself.
Bondage and discipline focuses mainly on restricting movement and removing options. It is about one person being unable to escape the fate imposed on them by an outside force. Some people enjoy being the one in control, some enjoy giving up control. Why does this turn people on? Well, for the ones in control, control is its own allure. There is a certain heady rush about knowing you can do anything, satisfy any desire and not be stopped by anyone. Obviously this is not a good thing to translate into day to day life, but then that's what fantasy is for - it is a safe, effectively harmless channel for this desire.
On the flip side, there is also a distinctly erotic effect to being placed in peril - this is actually expressed in a very wide segment of the population as an evolved method of species perpetuation. Hollywood didn't make up the notion of people becoming much more attracted to each other after coming through something harrowing, they just abused the hell out of it.
Either way, the porn either evokes one of these fantasies in the susceptible members of the audience or reminds them of (hopefully) enjoyable things they've done/had done to them. There are other reasons to like the pr0n however - some people even like bondage for the look as much or more than the above. This is why leather, latex, and corset fetishes often tie in (no pun intended) to BDSM and why one of the hallmarks of shibari is a rope pattern that is more decorative than restrictive.
Dominance and submission is about a person being physically able to act but every action potentially having a consequence which will be enforced upon them. When it comes to RL play, some people enjoy pretending to be forced while others are happier not hiding their willingness to follow orders and some flipflop between these. Again, this relates to control but comes at it from a different angle. The subject is generally not entirely helpless but depending on whether the fantasy concerns willing or unwilling submission they may not be able to avoid whatever punishment will be imposed on them.
Even in the case of willing submission, the ultimate threat used to enforce a punishment can be the threat of not playing anymore, though in healthy relationships the dominant partner(s) will at least be considering whether they are asking too much. Again, the pr0n is all about evoking those feelings - the idea being caught in a dilema, wanting to do one thing but knowing you have been told to do something else or the idea of being the one placing someone in such a situation and watching them squirm, knowing you can make them do what you want and avoid doing things you don't want.
Also, humans are naturally hierarchical creatures, and there is a certain peace of mind that comes from knowing exactly what your place is in your social group. Even being at the absolute bottom of the social heap can hold a certain comfort. Discomfort arises from not being sure whether your privileges and responsibilities will be the same tomorrow as they are today.
"Change is bad. We fear change." - Wayne of Wayne's World
Sadism and masochism is where the meat of the controversy lies because of the overall perception that pain is bad. Wait, it isn't? Certainly some people feel that way, and it's an entirely reasonable and understandable point of view. Pain is your body's way of telling you that something bad is happening or about to happen to it.
The thing is that first, bad is a relative concept. Broken bones, damaged organs, and massive blood loss are things that are unquestionably bad and thus are things best avoided. Piercings, welts, and shallow cuts and bruises are transitory injuries which offer little or no threat to your life and leave no lasting physical effects even if marks linger. Obviously there can be lasting psychological effects, but that's another matter. The point is that a body can experience pain when the organism as a whole isn't endangered.
Secondly, and this is important, some people get off on pain. The body can only handle so much pain before it starts releasing endorphins in order to be able to keep functioning. This is again a completely natural tendency developed for survival. Interestingly enough however, there may be purely psychological aspects to the pleasure gained from masochism as well. It is well known that athletes who push themselves to the point that their muscles are burning can eventually experience what is known as a runner's high. It was at one time believed that at some point their bodies start dumping endorphins into the bloodstream to overwhelm the painful buildup of lactic acid in the muscles, but this may be a purely psychological reaction to overcoming a challenge.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endorp.....unner.27s_high
If this is true, it could easily explain why a masochist would feel pleasure after being subjected not only to physical pain but humiliation (i.e. psychological pain) as well. The achievement of weathering such a trial and coming out the other side could be producing a purely psychological pleasure that nonetheless expresses itself as arousal.
Okay, what about sadists? Aren't they all bastards? No. Some are, sure. Anytime someone does something against another's will, they risk stepping over the line. I say risk because when a parent or teacher disciplines a child, they are doing something against the child's will in order to teach them about right and wrong and what is safe or unsafe. Police often have to do things against the will of criminals, and doctors may have to get orderlies to assist in restraining a patient so they can do what is necessary to help them. There is a reason why these themes show up in so much BDSM porn.
Okay, but isn't WANTING to inflict pain on someone a bit messed up? Perhaps, but everyone is at least a little messed up in some way. Some people are inclined towards laziness, some towards greed, some have no natural respect for property, some have no respect for privacy or boundries. The important part is how you deal with your inclinations, and someone that goes out of their way to find someone that wants to be hurt is channeling those desires in the most healthy way they can physically express. Someone that satisfies those desires with arguably disturbing art and paws off afterwards is certainly not hurting anyone.
Still, the whole non-consentual thing - isn't that kinda ick even as a fantasy? For some people, sure. Not everyone who's into BDSM likes the idea of non-con as a fantasy. To understand what anyone (aside from a sociopath) could see in it, you have to understand that there is a very deliberate separation between fantasy and reality. In reality, there must always be a line drawn beyond which one must not pass or else something happens that you will regret. A sub can only suffer so much, can only be left tied and helpless for so long, can only be pushed so far before something gives. Fantasy allows a submissive to be pushed further than they would dare in real life, can leave someone locked in bondage without risk of blood pooling and muscles atrophying, can inflict grievous amounts of punishment on someone and leave them still able to function. In the mind of the audience, both masters and slaves can take part in things that would be insane to try for real, and that is a rush for those with that sort of inclination.
For me personally, the S&M aspects of a bondage picture, story, or scene are there to give the bondage more substance by creating a distinct reason to desire freedom. It underscores the helplessness of the victim and makes the situation that much more intense. It isn't the only way to achieve that, but it is a very effective method for me. Other people that like S&M have their own reasons which may or may not relate to mine.
Whew! I think that covers the major points of that. On to cubs!
So what's wrong with adults that has you looking at kids? Nothing necessarily. Some people like both adults and kids, some just like kids. This sort of thing partly falls under the same banner as 'Why animalistic humanoids?', 'Why a different race?', and 'Why the same sex?' Some people simply have sex drives that are wired to seek out something other than the norm. Many people find a distinct allure in that which is exotic, and for some there is a certain draw towards the forbidden or unattainable. Children as sexual objects are both exotic and forbidden and since there are no furries yet, cubs are utterly unattainable. Of course, this means that fantasies about cubs are also quite safe since there is no chance of them being enacted in a literal way.
Okay, so let's delve into the possible root causes for the erotic appeal of cubs. First and foremost, cubs are cute. There is a nearly ubiquitous aesthetic appeal to the overall form and behavior of a young child. This too is an adaptation designed to ensure species survival since it makes people more likely to want to protect children. Obviously it isn't 100% effective or there would be no child abuse. The thing is that cuteness is a physical quality not limited to youth. People often refer to cute guys and gals meaning full adults that they find attractive for whatever reason. For some the cub's cuteness, all those traits that make you want to hug them, becomes similarly tangled up in the feelings of eroticism which are also common to such contact.
The next factor is innocence. There is something many find appealing and endearing about innocence. It is a state we all once shared and many of us long to be that way again. The Victorian era actually held the image of a nude child to be the very essence of innocence in its purist form, and it is because of this that Lewis Carroll's hobby of photgraphing nude girls was in later years interpretted as pedophilia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lewis_.....arroll_Myth.22
That said, such interests obviously can tie into pedophilia or the misunderstanding never would have occurred. For some people then, cub art is a way to touch this innocence in a harmless fashion even when eroticism is mixed in. Some want to get closer to the innocence and try to somehow preserve it while bringing it into the adult world the way they wish had happened with them. Others admittedly want to defile that innocence for much the same reason that misery loves company.
"I felt like destroying something beautiful." - Narrator, Fight Club
Still others may be attracted to the fantasy of a cub that is already less innocent than they ought to be. Again, this could be a lure of the exotic and forbidden but with less guilt when the cub is willing.
Incest is something some people really get into. Why? Well, members of your own family are known quantities. They know you and you know them, and intimacy is already present - this is just taking intimacy further. It is of course frowned on by society, so there is also a distinct air of the forbidden about it. That gets even more intense and adds a hint of the exotic when one or more parties involved is a child. In consensual situations, the feelings of trust are built upon to forge a deeper relationship than would normally exist. Non-consensual relationships rely on the inherent power of the elder parent or sibling, or in a reversal that really arouses some, threats by the child of revealing some secret the elder individual(s) don't want to get out. This also leads into the next concept.
Vulnerability is something cubs have in spades. They are smaller, weaker, and have less body mass than adults meaning that they have next to no chance of coming out on top in a physical confrontation with an adult. Furthermore society places all the power strictly in the hands of adults meaning that cubs share a lot in common with legally sanctioned slaves. The major difference is that since cubs go to school, they have more oversight than slaves to ensure that they are not being abused. Still, if any of the above reasons for liking cubs strikes home and someone also likes BDSM, cubs are a very good fit for fantasies. Likewise, for those that like role reversal, the cub as a dominant is very hard to beat, especially the idea of a small prey species cub (mice are almost iconic in this respect) dominating a large, adult preditor (often a feline to pair with the mouse).
I'll admit to falling under the category of liking cub victims in BDSM fantasies because my own submissive leanings make such fantasies particularly intense. Were there a real cub around, or for that matter if I were a cub, I would not want to see any such things happen for real. (Well, I might go find a girl cub to tie me up, but that's at least marginally innocent.) I'm not much of a masochist - just someone that likes bondage and uses the illusion of dire threats to make my experience more erotically potent. I don't desire to see real children hurt in any way. Like most who like cub art, I like kids as they are - cute, happy, and innocent - and will take pains to protect that state. This is the carefully maintained difference between the fantasies and reality.
Alright, I suppose that last bit came out a tad defensive, but when dealing with a subject that most people's minds want to instinctively recoil from, it's hard to know how much to stress a point. Besides, I've been writing for a few hours now and am a little bit out of it. Whew! I think it was worth it though. I wonder if anyone else has thoughts on this. Brief thoughts are fine - I don't expect anyone to answer in anything close to this kind of detail!
One Stormy Night
Posted 17 years agoHeh...it's not sexy, it's not porn of any sort, but it is a cute story about friendship. Warning, this is part 1 of 11, so set aside about 2 hours (maybe more if your download speed is slow) to see the whole movie if you like the first part.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mj3m.....JwTQE&NR=1
Of course, this movie is also filled with a lot of moments where a less than innocent mind could see tons of gay innuendo, oh and at least one scene that could have come straight from a vore fantasy except for the last part of it. A lot of scenes that were supposed to be touching had me grinning. Darn you Furrydom and your gay wolves!
;)
So how dirty is your imagination?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mj3m.....JwTQE&NR=1
Of course, this movie is also filled with a lot of moments where a less than innocent mind could see tons of gay innuendo, oh and at least one scene that could have come straight from a vore fantasy except for the last part of it. A lot of scenes that were supposed to be touching had me grinning. Darn you Furrydom and your gay wolves!
;)
So how dirty is your imagination?
No Subject
Posted 18 years agoI don't use these journal things much, but every now and then the urge hits me to share something, so...
*sings*
I want a hippogryph in chains for Christmas
Only a hippogryph in chains will do
I'm gonna have a ball with shiny vibes and toys
I want a hippogryph in chains to play with and enjoy
I want a hippogryph in chains for Christmas
I don't think Santa Claws will mind, do you?
He won't have to choose the wrapping that he'll use
Just fold her up and chain her,
That's the easy thing to do!
I can see me now on Christmas morning,
Padding down the stairs
Oh what joy and what surprise
When I open up my eyes
To see a chained up lady sitting there
I want a hippogryph in chains for Christmas
Only a hippogryph in chains will do
No foxy dommes with ballgag, cuffs, and canes
I only like hippogryphs in chains
And hippogryphs in chains like me too!
Myths say the creature would eat me up, but then
Prudence says a ring gag is your very bestest friend.
(Short Music Interlude)
There's lots of room for her in my two-story house
I'd bind her there and gag her there as silent as a mouse
I can see me now on Christmas morning,
Padding down the stairs
Oh what joy and what surprise
When I open up my eyes
To see a chained up lady sitting there
I want a hippogryph in chains for Christmas
Only a hippogryph in chains will do
No foxy dommes with ballgag, cuffs, and canes
I only like hippogryphs in chains
And hippogryphs in chains like me too!
No, I don't know any female hippogryphs who are into bondage, and my tastes aren't actually that specific, but once the first line of the song popped into my mind, I just had to write the rest.
(^.^)
*sings*
I want a hippogryph in chains for Christmas
Only a hippogryph in chains will do
I'm gonna have a ball with shiny vibes and toys
I want a hippogryph in chains to play with and enjoy
I want a hippogryph in chains for Christmas
I don't think Santa Claws will mind, do you?
He won't have to choose the wrapping that he'll use
Just fold her up and chain her,
That's the easy thing to do!
I can see me now on Christmas morning,
Padding down the stairs
Oh what joy and what surprise
When I open up my eyes
To see a chained up lady sitting there
I want a hippogryph in chains for Christmas
Only a hippogryph in chains will do
No foxy dommes with ballgag, cuffs, and canes
I only like hippogryphs in chains
And hippogryphs in chains like me too!
Myths say the creature would eat me up, but then
Prudence says a ring gag is your very bestest friend.
(Short Music Interlude)
There's lots of room for her in my two-story house
I'd bind her there and gag her there as silent as a mouse
I can see me now on Christmas morning,
Padding down the stairs
Oh what joy and what surprise
When I open up my eyes
To see a chained up lady sitting there
I want a hippogryph in chains for Christmas
Only a hippogryph in chains will do
No foxy dommes with ballgag, cuffs, and canes
I only like hippogryphs in chains
And hippogryphs in chains like me too!
No, I don't know any female hippogryphs who are into bondage, and my tastes aren't actually that specific, but once the first line of the song popped into my mind, I just had to write the rest.
(^.^)
