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Caveat: still no vocals. Just a production demo.
Well, I've been sort of hoarding this one away for a time, rolling out new song ideas and better versions of older songs I've actually had this for nearly a month, but I was more interested in gauging reactions to new material than showing off better mixes, etc. Unfortunately, many modern listeners want squeaky-clean production right out of the gate, and forget that demos are demos are demos, if you all catch my drift. However, we are getting close to a final engineering style for proper songs self-produced by the band, and this re-tracked version of our first (still unnamed) song is the closest thing we have to what you can expect from finished material.
Everything is much tighter, brighter, and more compressed sonically. The drums should be the biggest noticeable difference; yes, the drums are still recorded with microphones, and not triggered/gated, because "Drum Kit from Hell" is way overrated and too many bands use digital drums these days. That fat old-school Swedish death metal guitar style I was hinting at before is closely modeled here, although done with in-PC effects and not true Boss HM-2 or DS-1 pedals. It isn't exactly the same as those old rigs in tone, and isn't intended to be a faithful re-creation of any of those bands' guitar sound, but rather a spiritual echo of that sharper tone with some extra stuff applied to make it a little rounder; it has character of it's own. The beginning riff might sound kinda weird with this effect, but we're not done with this yet. Bass is not loud in the mix, as the final EQ/effects were not done for the instrument, and the results may make this sound a bit flatter than intended to be once it's all complete. As of this submission, all this has already been taken care of, and Jimmy still tweaks the DAW all the time to polish the sound even further, but it's just not present here.
Finally, since this is just a run-through to show off our sound, you'll notice some things like a solo that starts early and lasts longer than it will on the finished song, and as before, it's just something improvised to provide a showcase. I hope you like the sound in this. Not totally end-product, but a lot closer to the sound we want, and something more professional than what you are all used to. Please give any input you all have on this, as we love the constructive feedback. People who weren't thrilled with some of this song's structuring or themes will find that nothing has changed in the compositional department, so we don't expect those people to like this song any more than they already do (if they do). That's totally cool, since it's not the entirety of our style to begin with, as other songs have shown, and we only plan on branching outward as we go forward. For those who loved this cut, now you get to hear it in a way closer to what we want on a debut release.
Well, I've been sort of hoarding this one away for a time, rolling out new song ideas and better versions of older songs I've actually had this for nearly a month, but I was more interested in gauging reactions to new material than showing off better mixes, etc. Unfortunately, many modern listeners want squeaky-clean production right out of the gate, and forget that demos are demos are demos, if you all catch my drift. However, we are getting close to a final engineering style for proper songs self-produced by the band, and this re-tracked version of our first (still unnamed) song is the closest thing we have to what you can expect from finished material.
Everything is much tighter, brighter, and more compressed sonically. The drums should be the biggest noticeable difference; yes, the drums are still recorded with microphones, and not triggered/gated, because "Drum Kit from Hell" is way overrated and too many bands use digital drums these days. That fat old-school Swedish death metal guitar style I was hinting at before is closely modeled here, although done with in-PC effects and not true Boss HM-2 or DS-1 pedals. It isn't exactly the same as those old rigs in tone, and isn't intended to be a faithful re-creation of any of those bands' guitar sound, but rather a spiritual echo of that sharper tone with some extra stuff applied to make it a little rounder; it has character of it's own. The beginning riff might sound kinda weird with this effect, but we're not done with this yet. Bass is not loud in the mix, as the final EQ/effects were not done for the instrument, and the results may make this sound a bit flatter than intended to be once it's all complete. As of this submission, all this has already been taken care of, and Jimmy still tweaks the DAW all the time to polish the sound even further, but it's just not present here.
Finally, since this is just a run-through to show off our sound, you'll notice some things like a solo that starts early and lasts longer than it will on the finished song, and as before, it's just something improvised to provide a showcase. I hope you like the sound in this. Not totally end-product, but a lot closer to the sound we want, and something more professional than what you are all used to. Please give any input you all have on this, as we love the constructive feedback. People who weren't thrilled with some of this song's structuring or themes will find that nothing has changed in the compositional department, so we don't expect those people to like this song any more than they already do (if they do). That's totally cool, since it's not the entirety of our style to begin with, as other songs have shown, and we only plan on branching outward as we go forward. For those who loved this cut, now you get to hear it in a way closer to what we want on a debut release.
Category Music / Rock
Species Unspecified / Any
Size 83 x 120px
File Size 3.68 MB
To comment this one, I had to listen to the old version:
http://www.furaffinity.net/view/9810702/
This NEW version is indeed a great improvement!
Okay, many people say "Sure, the new version is always better"... but that's not always true. Furthermore, I want to point out WHY this version is SO F***ING BETTER!!! XD
First of all, the tempo seems to be a little tiny bit slower... that's okay but not a big deal. Still, it's hard to keep the ryhthm and pace at a SLOW tempo - but you did it well!
Just like you said, the improved recording increases the power of EACH instrument!
The steady but forceful drums... the roaring guitars (especially the bass)... it all fits MUCH better and no instrument is somehow "dominating" the other. Very nice!
Though this is an older song (before I told you to move on with different patterns... or practising the same patters to get a basic composition), the new mixing and recording makes it way better.
The first pattern is playing well and steady. Then, starting at 0:40, the tempo rises - some double bass patterns are added and even some distorted sounds. This synthetic sound... reminding me of an organ should be more vibrant and loud, though! This instrument playing 0:58-1:29... I love it. Give it more depth and power!! ;)
The next pattern playing 1:30-1:44 is quite enjoyable!
The solo starting 1:45 is still NOT fitting here, at all... XD But that's something you should consider for the next time.
BUT it'S much better starting at 2:31!! Yes, I think the guitar solo should be a rather slow solo, played with some long notes.
Here is a small suggestion:
When the drums play a slow pattern, the guitar can either play much SLOWER or double the tempo! And it works the other way, too: fast drums and SLOW guitars always sound cool!
Yeah, this solo has some compositional issues... can't put my finger on it. Maybe, because of the dissonance... hm. It's just freaking me out! XD *grins*
Maybe, that's intentional, though...
There is ONE drum sound... hitting at 0:12 and then 0:21 and then in the regular pattern... it sounds like a "metal snare" of some sort, which has been combined with a choir singing "Oh" or "Doh"! :D I just wanted to point out that THIS sound adds a great deal of depth and intensity to the regular pattern! It's the first time I shruk and had to open my eyes and ears... and I was like "Woah, cool sound!", really.
I listened to it again... it seems to be... NOT a snare, but a cymbal, eh? Anyway, great sound!
So this is my new comment! ^___^
Keep it up, guys.
If the first song version would be compared to a pea, this second version would be a watermelon!!!
Got it?
http://www.furaffinity.net/view/9810702/
This NEW version is indeed a great improvement!
Okay, many people say "Sure, the new version is always better"... but that's not always true. Furthermore, I want to point out WHY this version is SO F***ING BETTER!!! XD
First of all, the tempo seems to be a little tiny bit slower... that's okay but not a big deal. Still, it's hard to keep the ryhthm and pace at a SLOW tempo - but you did it well!
Just like you said, the improved recording increases the power of EACH instrument!
The steady but forceful drums... the roaring guitars (especially the bass)... it all fits MUCH better and no instrument is somehow "dominating" the other. Very nice!
Though this is an older song (before I told you to move on with different patterns... or practising the same patters to get a basic composition), the new mixing and recording makes it way better.
The first pattern is playing well and steady. Then, starting at 0:40, the tempo rises - some double bass patterns are added and even some distorted sounds. This synthetic sound... reminding me of an organ should be more vibrant and loud, though! This instrument playing 0:58-1:29... I love it. Give it more depth and power!! ;)
The next pattern playing 1:30-1:44 is quite enjoyable!
The solo starting 1:45 is still NOT fitting here, at all... XD But that's something you should consider for the next time.
BUT it'S much better starting at 2:31!! Yes, I think the guitar solo should be a rather slow solo, played with some long notes.
Here is a small suggestion:
When the drums play a slow pattern, the guitar can either play much SLOWER or double the tempo! And it works the other way, too: fast drums and SLOW guitars always sound cool!
Yeah, this solo has some compositional issues... can't put my finger on it. Maybe, because of the dissonance... hm. It's just freaking me out! XD *grins*
Maybe, that's intentional, though...
There is ONE drum sound... hitting at 0:12 and then 0:21 and then in the regular pattern... it sounds like a "metal snare" of some sort, which has been combined with a choir singing "Oh" or "Doh"! :D I just wanted to point out that THIS sound adds a great deal of depth and intensity to the regular pattern! It's the first time I shruk and had to open my eyes and ears... and I was like "Woah, cool sound!", really.
I listened to it again... it seems to be... NOT a snare, but a cymbal, eh? Anyway, great sound!
So this is my new comment! ^___^
Keep it up, guys.
If the first song version would be compared to a pea, this second version would be a watermelon!!!
Got it?
That's a lot of praise, and you did notice the additional keyboard sounds. It's a midi mellotron, as a real one would be really old, expensive, and heavy to move (lol)!! We're all fans of older music, but Jimmy and I especially love old Mellotrons, the old Moogs, and Ondes Martenot. A lot of that can be done through midi, which isn't quite the same, but beats a blank. Yeah, the solo is another placeholder, and just something Dave was playing with, so expect something much better in the final version. We're really proud of the production we've managed to get here, Jimmy is actually very interested in sound engineering, and everything he's done is on his own. We don't plan on making all our songs this slow, and the "doom" aspect of our music is but one side of us, there's plenty more ideas we would like to play around with, but we're just focusing on what we have before we get too in over our head with unfinished songs. I'm really glad you liked this. It's almost done.
I'm going to be performing a mixture of death growls and clean singing, although my singing voice is kinda soft and indie for this style of music, so I've been working on projection. I can hit highs too, but I don't know if that will really fit the music. We'll see. There's more stuff in my gallery if you like this, and I throw down reviews every once in a while too.
Hmmm, even ig it´s one of your heavies, and it´s clear that it is, it keeps a soft rhythm that makes the play all smooth but with the guitar it makes the music heavy. My favourite part is when it goes next of 0:57, it´s getting interesting the music from there in my oppinion, more when you get back to the first style from 1:29 I like this one in general ^ ^
Oh, so this is the first song you guys wrote? interesting. Definitly you must work a lot on it if you want that your first song its the one that identify your group ^ ^ And just imagine that more forward you can make a remake of that song in a different style, making those that hear it get amazed by the remaking work XD At least that´s how I feel when I heard the remake of a known song ^ ^
Warning: Honest, scathing review coming up. Hey, you randomly posted on my wall, so reap what you sow, lol.
I'm sorry, but the first thing I noticed is that this is really lazy, unoriginal writing. It seems both your writer and your lead guitarist need to learn some music theory (e.g. a proper guitar solo that doesn't include awkward, oddly-scaled notation) and you need to rigorously train your drummer, because they can't even stay in beat with the minimalist approach they're trying to pass off as suitable. If you guys want to do anything with this band, take some classes, or lessons, or teach yourself something about music outside of what you teach yourself. Don't get me wrong, I understand you're most likely not trying to do anything new here, and I'm a fan of Sabbath and Deep Purple and sludgier doom stuff like Melvins and whatnot, so I understand the genres. A major thing that's still lacking is some element of the new, be it in chord progressions, timbre, or note choice affecting your tone quality, so you end up with essentially a cover band that doesn't play any of the songs people know. Like a less catchier version of Wolfmother, and honestly, catchy songs were the only thing they had going for them anyway.
There are nice things I can say too, but ReptileCynrik covered them, (and I really do like the keyboard a LOT) but overall I felt like I was listening to a high school garage band - no difference. I came here hoping I'd be pleased to find a band worth spamming on random people's pages.
My suggestion is that if you have a passion, that's your greatest power. Take advantage of that passion and use it to encourage yourself to learn more, and maybe teach yourself some pointers through the web at the very least. Take a hard look at the notation of your chord charts, and if you don't have it in you to completely throw them away, then ask yourself what you can do to improve your tone and melodies across the entire board. I don't know if this is your first song as a band (what I'm assuming) or the first song you've ever written (in which case, sorry for the bluntness, but why are you posting it up everywhere if it's your first song ever, lol) but either way throw weathered ears a bone and implement some music theory.
Have your guitarist learn some classical jazz guitar, because believe it or not, you can take a lot of those things you learn about improvising over chord progressions and ornamentation and apply them to metal. And make your drummer practice with a metronome, preferably one that has the option to sound eight and sixteenth intervals, because some of those rhythms were just awful. Sometimes I run a click track through an earpiece when playing slower songs.
This place has some good sources in the sidebar on teaching yourself theory: http://www.reddit.com/r/musictheory
My goal is not to troll or discourage you, but to be that guy who you wish would've warned you before you got on stage at America's Got Talent. Anyway, if this is all just for fun, don't let me ruin that. I'm just a music dude who was asked his opinion.
Happy trails.
I'm sorry, but the first thing I noticed is that this is really lazy, unoriginal writing. It seems both your writer and your lead guitarist need to learn some music theory (e.g. a proper guitar solo that doesn't include awkward, oddly-scaled notation) and you need to rigorously train your drummer, because they can't even stay in beat with the minimalist approach they're trying to pass off as suitable. If you guys want to do anything with this band, take some classes, or lessons, or teach yourself something about music outside of what you teach yourself. Don't get me wrong, I understand you're most likely not trying to do anything new here, and I'm a fan of Sabbath and Deep Purple and sludgier doom stuff like Melvins and whatnot, so I understand the genres. A major thing that's still lacking is some element of the new, be it in chord progressions, timbre, or note choice affecting your tone quality, so you end up with essentially a cover band that doesn't play any of the songs people know. Like a less catchier version of Wolfmother, and honestly, catchy songs were the only thing they had going for them anyway.
There are nice things I can say too, but ReptileCynrik covered them, (and I really do like the keyboard a LOT) but overall I felt like I was listening to a high school garage band - no difference. I came here hoping I'd be pleased to find a band worth spamming on random people's pages.
My suggestion is that if you have a passion, that's your greatest power. Take advantage of that passion and use it to encourage yourself to learn more, and maybe teach yourself some pointers through the web at the very least. Take a hard look at the notation of your chord charts, and if you don't have it in you to completely throw them away, then ask yourself what you can do to improve your tone and melodies across the entire board. I don't know if this is your first song as a band (what I'm assuming) or the first song you've ever written (in which case, sorry for the bluntness, but why are you posting it up everywhere if it's your first song ever, lol) but either way throw weathered ears a bone and implement some music theory.
Have your guitarist learn some classical jazz guitar, because believe it or not, you can take a lot of those things you learn about improvising over chord progressions and ornamentation and apply them to metal. And make your drummer practice with a metronome, preferably one that has the option to sound eight and sixteenth intervals, because some of those rhythms were just awful. Sometimes I run a click track through an earpiece when playing slower songs.
This place has some good sources in the sidebar on teaching yourself theory: http://www.reddit.com/r/musictheory
My goal is not to troll or discourage you, but to be that guy who you wish would've warned you before you got on stage at America's Got Talent. Anyway, if this is all just for fun, don't let me ruin that. I'm just a music dude who was asked his opinion.
Happy trails.
Also, the bass was good from what I could hear, lol. You can still intertwine some new tones and melodies with the vocals. They won't save the drums or the awkward guitar solo, but as far as writing, something a slightly clever may add that additional layer which would compliment what you already have laid down. Perhaps a little calculated chaos with your syncopation and some 7th and 9th chords in there. Try avoiding the major 6th in the guitar solos, or implement it more often so it doesn't seem like an accident. While we're on the subject, that minor 2nd that keeps appearing randomly in the middle of climbs on tonic chords? Again, either use it on purpose or don't use it at all. It sounds like the guitarist is guessing which fret to finger and reeks of "I don't know what's going on."
No worries bro. I understand if the chromatic thing isn't for you, but I counter a critism of purpose with a question: since when does does dropping a link of material translate as "I'm really trying impress somebody/go somewhere with my music". Honestly, I was just trying to show what I do with my spare time, since I don't do visual art like most people here. I appreciate the criticism, however insultingly blunt it is, but writing a Julliard-worthy piece is not our goal. We're just trying to have a bit of fun with our days off and get word out there to people that are into what we're into. You're right, this is an attempt to place a humble mark on the genres we enjoy, and with that goal in mind, I think we have succeeded. For the more discerning ear, we're just not your band. Plus, this is a quick run-through, so perfection in the timing and such shouldn't be expected. Demos are just that: demonstrations of what we are trying to communicate. The solo in particular is a space holder for something better in the future. Obviouly you get the message, you just don't like what you hear, and that's ok. I enjoy a lot of finer music myself, things played in particular keys, with complex time signatures, and classic or opera can be found alongside recordings of gutter-level thrash and punk, the latter with no regard to theory whatsoever. We chose to sound like in part, and the rest is addmittedly improvised by ear, but to assume we don't know better is a bit pretentious. I thank you for the lengthy response, as you put quite a bit of thought in it, and if nothing more, I've found somebody cool to chat about bands and such with, if that's welcome. If we decide to do something less off-the-cuff in the future, with some proper theory, I'll let you know (if I remember to), but right now, we're enjoying the simple pleasure of emulating our influences and keeping it raw, as we also enjoy quite a bit of "uneducated" music that you might also be at odds with if you heard it. Cheers!
Thank you, you're right, and sorry for being insulting and pretentious! I was frustrated at other things that night and was projecting a bit too much. I actually had to delete insults as I was typing them. (Christ, it was a fucking rough day.) I personally view demos as essentially a type of audition, where I would be expected to do my very best as a musician and a producer, so apologies for misinterpreting your goals as well as your focus. I am a perfectionist, so if we're doing a "quick run-through," it sure as hell isn't going to be put on the internet and shared with strangers LET ALONE even recorded and put to tape, lol. So I viewed your actions as what they would mean if I had done the same thing - that I've done the very best I could and I would like constructive criticism. Hooray for narcissistically expecting everyone to be exactly like me.
And to Xavier, I'm not smoking anything (lately), I've just been a drummer for 14 years and get super critical over any minute issues at all. Thanks, drum corps...
And to Xavier, I'm not smoking anything (lately), I've just been a drummer for 14 years and get super critical over any minute issues at all. Thanks, drum corps...
Dude, it's totally alright. I understand, it's just I've been bashed before for doing stuff like this (no notation, going with a feel, just tracking a jam session, etc.) The few naysayers always throw method and mathematics in my face, but we're just punkin' the fuck out of this, if you get what I mean. We do want to use theory down the road, for stuff that -isn't- an homage to My Dying Bride or early Paradise Lost, imperfections and all. Sometimes though, and I'm gonna sound like a total cheeseball for this, but I like some of that sloppy shit like Sodom's Obsessed by Cruelty, (totally out-of-sync drummer from start to finish) Sacrifice's Torment in Fire (guitars speed up, slow down, come in late or early, play out of key from each other), or even the first Sepultura album where they recorded the whole thing out of tune. Anything in the early Voivod catalog, where you can hear the now-called "diminished" chords (it's a thing you know), is also delightfully dissonant to me. Maybe I just like bad music, lol.
As for why we make music, why we show it off, why we don't strive for perfection, is we all have day jobs and hectic schedules, and we just want to do -something- as an outlet, and music is that outlet. Yeah, stuff will be commercially available someday, but at the most, just being that one obscure band your "trve kvlt" metal head friend brags about knowing is good enough for us. We leave the world-shattering to bands like Dream Theater, Between the Buried and Me, Opeth, or Coheed & Cambira. ^.=.^
As for why we make music, why we show it off, why we don't strive for perfection, is we all have day jobs and hectic schedules, and we just want to do -something- as an outlet, and music is that outlet. Yeah, stuff will be commercially available someday, but at the most, just being that one obscure band your "trve kvlt" metal head friend brags about knowing is good enough for us. We leave the world-shattering to bands like Dream Theater, Between the Buried and Me, Opeth, or Coheed & Cambira. ^.=.^
ReptileCynrik pretty much said what I was going to say. :P The solo did not fit very well. One thing I did learn in Jazz Band in high school is to find the right starting note for the solo and really understand what key you are playing in. Really understand the scale, the possible chords within that scale, what notes are in the chords, etc. Eventually, the guitarist should see the scale, and instantly know everything about it. If you want good solos, I would perhaps learn the blues scales since they tend to help. Proper jazz instructors usually teach their guitarists the blues scales first before they go into anything else.
I never really heard to many issues for the drummer so I don't know what horndawg is smoking here. There is some slight deviations from the 4/4 timing,but nothing is overly noticeable at least from what I heard.
The bass, it is great. A lot of power, a lot of depth, and not overpowering which is awesome. The bass player did his job as the backbone of the group.
Tonal issues, I heard just about none until the solo, since there was a few conflictions. But they were so quick, it takes a really good ear to notice them. I would recommend though that the all the instruments, except the soloist, back off a bit on volume when the soloist starts. He's the star everyone wants to listen to in that section, not the bass. Say if you guys were playing at fortissimo, play at forte while the soloist stays at fortissimo.
Overall sound, the balance is great. It sounded flat, as you mentioned before so I would definitely improve on rounding out the sound in the recording. Make sure your playing can do that, and anything else via the recording can be improved later.
Keep up the good work. I can tell this group already has major potential.
I never really heard to many issues for the drummer so I don't know what horndawg is smoking here. There is some slight deviations from the 4/4 timing,but nothing is overly noticeable at least from what I heard.
The bass, it is great. A lot of power, a lot of depth, and not overpowering which is awesome. The bass player did his job as the backbone of the group.
Tonal issues, I heard just about none until the solo, since there was a few conflictions. But they were so quick, it takes a really good ear to notice them. I would recommend though that the all the instruments, except the soloist, back off a bit on volume when the soloist starts. He's the star everyone wants to listen to in that section, not the bass. Say if you guys were playing at fortissimo, play at forte while the soloist stays at fortissimo.
Overall sound, the balance is great. It sounded flat, as you mentioned before so I would definitely improve on rounding out the sound in the recording. Make sure your playing can do that, and anything else via the recording can be improved later.
Keep up the good work. I can tell this group already has major potential.
You're welcome. I've just been taking the grass-roots approach to spreading awareness around, one shoutbox at a time. If you like it enough to stop by again, we'll eventually have finished tracks with vocals, and other sites featuring the band profile, not just my personal FA page, but we're sorta holding back on that at the moment until there's more completed work.
Holy F, it sounds even better now. I so want this in my playlists when it's finished. The melody and counter melody (when that part comes in, or is called accompaniment? I'm no music major, lol, but I took a class once) comes out better and the mixing is way more pleasing to the ears this time. You're almost there, dudes.
Thanks man! Everything we've composed so far has been strictly by ear, as those versed in music theory have noticed (sometimes to our chagrin). I appreciate the enthusiasm you've shown for us, and maybe I can grab some art from ya when the cash flow is a little better to return the favor. We're ready to work on vocals for this one soon, and I'm excited to get back behind the mic for song in what seems like the first time in years. :D
Although last.fm isn't the only way I share or chat about music, it's the easiest way to casually keep up with what somebody is listening to and give or get recommendations without talking to them directly, since not every has time or interest in direct conversation about music.
that sounds epic its got the dark, dirty, loud and heavy mood pinned down perfectly and the guitar fills and solos do such a great job of adding that depth and atmosphere . its almost too good to put lyrics too! it sounds like something growing, evolving, creating and destroying. i love it!
I really appreciate that dude. I lose track of people sometimes, and as you can see, I've had a change of faces too, but I always meant to come back around and check up on you. In fact, I'm gonna send a watch your way. If you want, check back if you like what you hear, because I'm going to be finishing these songs with some vocals once we nail down some lyrics.
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