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Desktops / Animal related (non-anthro)
Species Vulpine (Other)
Size 800 x 600
File Size 85.3 kB
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More from odious
If anyone wants to delete this note me instead and I'll be happy to replace this submission file with my own entirely original quick fox scribble suitable for the scraps folder (which prevent it appearing on your watch list or the FA main page). Though I think that begins to miss the point.
I didn't really set out to create a talking point as I just kinda did this and posted it but since others pointed out to me that I was (unknowingly at the time) risking deletion without warning by doing so it has become one.
Specifically passing blame to the artist for posting work that the majority of FA doesn't want to see when browsing or checking their watch list. The cub art debate is another similar instance of this issue.
While it's been cited this is an originality issue I don't think that's the case as coloring another artist's line work with permission is accepted practice here on FA. We should be encouraging collaboration and sharing ideas. Some of the best work like
Blotch's is collaborative.
Neither is the quality of your work the issue as there are people here of all skill levels and the "anatomical correctness" of their work varies greatly. If need be I could draw a similarly feral wolf entirely from scratch and replace that submission and it'd not look as nice considering my skill level but wouldn't get deleted for poor execution.
The real issue here is that it's not what the majority of people want to see and anyone can do it quickly and easily, post it, and it'll show up on the front page and displace other things that people have put a lot of work into and it clogs up people's watch lists and the FA front page for those browsing for what they want to see.
These are technical issues and they need a technical solution rather then a policy one. A new code base is currently in development though on no specific timetable to my understanding so these issues will likely be resolved at some point in the future.
These same issues are why me and others who work in SL rather then a more mainstream 3D studio feel singled out by the policies regarding that as well. Just because it's easy to take a screen shot doesn't mean that my avatar I spent two years developing is any less art just because someone can buy an av and take a snapshot in 2 minutes. Especially when I'm considerate and combine my angles into a single character sheet to prevent derivative-flooding the site.
It is my understanding that this does abide by the by you/for you rule of the AUP especially now that I've done some original work on top of it as this tool can be used (permission has clearly been granted) to create content specific to my own character.
Character avatar created via :
Kayami:'s Create A Wolf tool found at http://www.furaffinity.net/view/1045027/ . Additional work by myself in Illustrator. My foxy side. Those of you that know me from SecondLife would probably recognize this character even without all his tribal gear on. I'm normally not a meme sheep but I just had to do this one. It's just not me without my usual recognizable tribal wear though. I'm not the best with illustrator but that's besides the point.
It's sad people can't have a little fun at all here without people getting bent out of shape.
I didn't really set out to create a talking point as I just kinda did this and posted it but since others pointed out to me that I was (unknowingly at the time) risking deletion without warning by doing so it has become one.
Specifically passing blame to the artist for posting work that the majority of FA doesn't want to see when browsing or checking their watch list. The cub art debate is another similar instance of this issue.
While it's been cited this is an originality issue I don't think that's the case as coloring another artist's line work with permission is accepted practice here on FA. We should be encouraging collaboration and sharing ideas. Some of the best work like
Blotch's is collaborative.Neither is the quality of your work the issue as there are people here of all skill levels and the "anatomical correctness" of their work varies greatly. If need be I could draw a similarly feral wolf entirely from scratch and replace that submission and it'd not look as nice considering my skill level but wouldn't get deleted for poor execution.
The real issue here is that it's not what the majority of people want to see and anyone can do it quickly and easily, post it, and it'll show up on the front page and displace other things that people have put a lot of work into and it clogs up people's watch lists and the FA front page for those browsing for what they want to see.
These are technical issues and they need a technical solution rather then a policy one. A new code base is currently in development though on no specific timetable to my understanding so these issues will likely be resolved at some point in the future.
These same issues are why me and others who work in SL rather then a more mainstream 3D studio feel singled out by the policies regarding that as well. Just because it's easy to take a screen shot doesn't mean that my avatar I spent two years developing is any less art just because someone can buy an av and take a snapshot in 2 minutes. Especially when I'm considerate and combine my angles into a single character sheet to prevent derivative-flooding the site.
It is my understanding that this does abide by the by you/for you rule of the AUP especially now that I've done some original work on top of it as this tool can be used (permission has clearly been granted) to create content specific to my own character.
Character avatar created via :
Kayami:'s Create A Wolf tool found at http://www.furaffinity.net/view/1045027/ . Additional work by myself in Illustrator. My foxy side. Those of you that know me from SecondLife would probably recognize this character even without all his tribal gear on. I'm normally not a meme sheep but I just had to do this one. It's just not me without my usual recognizable tribal wear though. I'm not the best with illustrator but that's besides the point.It's sad people can't have a little fun at all here without people getting bent out of shape.
Category Desktops / Animal related (non-anthro)
Species Vulpine (Other)
Size 800 x 600px
File Size 85.3 kB
Really, that's interesting, I'm pretty well versed in the AUP here and it's my understanding that this would contain user created content as it requires the user to create the character. I really don't see how that's different then using SL's tools to create a secondlife avatar as that requires using their interface tools and bodymesh.
The last thing I need is another gallery with another username and password that I'll likely never log into again nonetheless will still have to keep track of. I have more then enough accounts and it's a real hassle trying to dig up the info for them all when I do need them. I have an FA account to host my content on and I don't host anything that isn't at least in some way of my own specification. If this is a problem then why aren't we pitching a fit about the flappy winged flash avatars that everyone has that look extremely standardized to me?
Well, I think it's a little silly that you can't post something like this to your own scraps folder honestly. FA wants to be a universal furry content hosting service for artwork, music, stories, and photography (hey, you didn't create the stuff in the photo!), and has categories for screen shots, desktop grabs, allows one or two photos of the artist and SL screen shots of your avatar (only if you made it all yourself, of course you can't replace the body mesh only draw on it.) yet seems to be rather discriminatory towards other art forms. Mostly I think it's about flooding the front page with non-furry non-art content which is why there need to be separate feeds and filters for all this. Putting it in scraps resolves the front page issue but I would say it's a failing of the code base to properly handle the diverse nature of the content here in a way that users find agreeable then to blame the users for not conforming to the majorities idea of what is and is not acceptable art. This is supposed to be a place where people come together as a community and collaborate. If I took this into illustrator as I plan to and added my own graphical objects to this then you really have a blurred line about whether this is original or not as it then contains both my original art and content generated by user with a flash tool.
I think a more important question to ask is what kind of moderators are we bringing on staff anyway? I didn't even know we *had* moderators because my friends have been policing their own work thus far when others copy it and try and take credit for it. If we have moderators certainly this is in their job description and more important then some silly flash tool.
I think a more important question to ask is what kind of moderators are we bringing on staff anyway? I didn't even know we *had* moderators because my friends have been policing their own work thus far when others copy it and try and take credit for it. If we have moderators certainly this is in their job description and more important then some silly flash tool.
Further point, what if Kayami was using illustrator (a vector based drawing program) and taking commissions to make these for people in this style? Such work would abide by the for you clause. Style wise sonic style characters are rather recognizably vector art as well. The point is there's a lot of gray area and overlap in art, it's not a black and white topic and we can't treat it like it is.
Kayami was using illustrator (a vector based drawing program) and taking commissions to make these for people in this style? Such work would abide by the for you clause. Style wise sonic style characters are rather recognizably vector art as well. The point is there's a lot of gray area and overlap in art, it's not a black and white topic and we can't treat it like it is. 
That's funny, my SL avatar is really my claim to fame here if I had one. It pulls more page views and favorites then any other submission I have up by a factor of 10. I am rather proud of it because it represents two years worth of my modeling work and is completely and totally designed by me as much as SL can allow.
The SL debate is even more rediculous and I believe quite frankly discriminatory as such work done in Maya, 3DStudioMax, Lightwave, Blender, Softimage, or any other 3d studio would be allowable and some artists I know such as
Deezlberries work nearly exclusively in 3D. SL I feel is equally allowable if your content is your own work and doesn't make excessive use of public domain textures as the main subject of the work. More to the point, nobody has *ever* given me so much as any reason to believe that my 3d artwork which is honestly where the majority of my skills are is unwelcome here and quite honestly if such were to become the case I'd be getting in touch directly with 
Dragoneer on the issue because everybody that's seen my work knows that I do all my own modeling and to a large degree my own texturing as well but I'm not primarily a texture artist and honestly can't be bothered to paint every brick wall I ever built. As it showed up on the submission page for desktop/screen-shot I did actually read the AUP thoroughly and it was my understanding that my work conforms to both the letter and spirit of the AUP.
This is how the industry itself functions. Again, it seems more an argument to those not wanting to see it on their submissions or front page more then an objection to the artist's work. It just needs it's own filter tag and feed so people can subscribe to the types of things they want to watch. I don't necessarily want to watch the journal content of every artist I watch either. It's rather immature to pass the buck for your lack of organization features in the program's code base (which I understand is under development) and instead blame it on the artists themselves so it's not your problem. Own up to it, people understand it's coming down the line.
No wonder some of my friends have packed up and left.
The SL debate is even more rediculous and I believe quite frankly discriminatory as such work done in Maya, 3DStudioMax, Lightwave, Blender, Softimage, or any other 3d studio would be allowable and some artists I know such as
Deezlberries work nearly exclusively in 3D. SL I feel is equally allowable if your content is your own work and doesn't make excessive use of public domain textures as the main subject of the work. More to the point, nobody has *ever* given me so much as any reason to believe that my 3d artwork which is honestly where the majority of my skills are is unwelcome here and quite honestly if such were to become the case I'd be getting in touch directly with 
Dragoneer on the issue because everybody that's seen my work knows that I do all my own modeling and to a large degree my own texturing as well but I'm not primarily a texture artist and honestly can't be bothered to paint every brick wall I ever built. As it showed up on the submission page for desktop/screen-shot I did actually read the AUP thoroughly and it was my understanding that my work conforms to both the letter and spirit of the AUP.This is how the industry itself functions. Again, it seems more an argument to those not wanting to see it on their submissions or front page more then an objection to the artist's work. It just needs it's own filter tag and feed so people can subscribe to the types of things they want to watch. I don't necessarily want to watch the journal content of every artist I watch either. It's rather immature to pass the buck for your lack of organization features in the program's code base (which I understand is under development) and instead blame it on the artists themselves so it's not your problem. Own up to it, people understand it's coming down the line.
No wonder some of my friends have packed up and left.
*waves a paw* Heya Odious. Its been a while, and Dragoneer did post his stance on the subject of "Create-a-character" byproducts.
http://www.furaffinityforums.net/sh......php?tid=17807
http://www.furaffinityforums.net/sh......php?tid=17807
Honestly, this is really isn't so much about create-a-character (which is admittedly point and click though check back here later tonight and I'll have my illustrator layer replacing the above submission which really begins to demonstrate how blurry that line is) as much as it's about what I've heard from a lot of my friends especially those working very hard in SL like myself or other digital tools that they feel unwelcome here not because people object to or feel what they do is unoriginal but because the majority of the community here wants to see more traditional artwork when they look at their watch lists and the front page. FA is redily tollerant of traditional media artwork with similarly distributed or collaborative content Blotch is a collaborative effort and Ollie and Fisk are currently borrowing each others' styles and universe which is great to see.
FA's stated objectives is to cater to a diverse audience (currently including art, stories, and music) where I believe people developing in 3D or flash or taking photographs (within reason, say of their fursuits) can exist alongside the prominent traditional/digital 2D community without interfering with each other (why this is filed in scraps). Dragoneer's own comments on the matter do point to a primarily site-functionality issue and I do admit it's a lot of data though this site already generates a tremendous amount of daily traffic. I can understand not wanting the main page flooded with pre-generated content (though I've often wanted to filter journals from many from my own watch lists). Most importantly, this is a furry community and not only do a bunch of photographs bring the site to it's knees fast but dilute the focus of what FA is about: furries. This is, however, admittedly a primarily technical shortcoming which has an upcoming solution in the works with the new update when it's ready.
What I don't believe is that the technical problems in the system are worth alienating people to the point they are leaving before the fix goes in because you wont' get those people back and it's detrimental to the community as a whole which is honestly the biggest asset FA has and what makes FA different from all the other galleries out there including those with currently more flexible code base. DA alienated the furry community there and many came to FA from there. I would hate to see such a wonderful and diverse place go down the same path.
Basically, I guess what I'm saying is that I'd like to see more honesty and tolerance in the community. Somethign that's come up a number of times of late and I feel really needs addressing in a big way.
FA's stated objectives is to cater to a diverse audience (currently including art, stories, and music) where I believe people developing in 3D or flash or taking photographs (within reason, say of their fursuits) can exist alongside the prominent traditional/digital 2D community without interfering with each other (why this is filed in scraps).
Dragoneer's own comments on the matter do point to a primarily site-functionality issue and I do admit it's a lot of data though this site already generates a tremendous amount of daily traffic. I can understand not wanting the main page flooded with pre-generated content (though I've often wanted to filter journals from many from my own watch lists). Most importantly, this is a furry community and not only do a bunch of photographs bring the site to it's knees fast but dilute the focus of what FA is about: furries. This is, however, admittedly a primarily technical shortcoming which has an upcoming solution in the works with the new update when it's ready.What I don't believe is that the technical problems in the system are worth alienating people to the point they are leaving before the fix goes in because you wont' get those people back and it's detrimental to the community as a whole which is honestly the biggest asset FA has and what makes FA different from all the other galleries out there including those with currently more flexible code base. DA alienated the furry community there and many came to FA from there. I would hate to see such a wonderful and diverse place go down the same path.
Basically, I guess what I'm saying is that I'd like to see more honesty and tolerance in the community. Somethign that's come up a number of times of late and I feel really needs addressing in a big way.
As for my SL character, I've linked it to Dragoneer himself one of the times I caught him on IRC. The originality of it has never come into question neither has anything Whinge (whatever he's calling himself now) has posted of his rather famous avatar lines though the fact that he also does 2D digital artwork and holds a visible position in the community helps I'm sure. That's because many of us on SL that post our work here do work very hard to be as original as we can.
Dragoneer himself one of the times I caught him on IRC. The originality of it has never come into question neither has anything Whinge (whatever he's calling himself now) has posted of his rather famous avatar lines though the fact that he also does 2D digital artwork and holds a visible position in the community helps I'm sure. That's because many of us on SL that post our work here do work very hard to be as original as we can. 
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