Wait...how the hell is that male?

It's called the magic of art. ;3

Which means I can draw whatever the hell I want, to be whatever the hell gender I want. It's maaaaagicaaalll.

:| It certainly doesn't look male...in any way...shape...or form...and I don't know if I should be frightened by that or what

Doesn't have to. XD
I draw my fair share of males with realistic builds. Mear is my indulgence. I drew him as feminine as possible. And I love it. thoroughly.

he's a joy to draw.

Do you draw women by any chance? That's what Val likes in pictures of this nature

Oh yes, quite a bit. I love the female figure. I just don't post them often.

I have a feeling you clicked on this assuming it was a hot chick. Very deceiving, so sorry. 8D

I saw no cock and a feminine form. I clicked it hoping to find a beautiful woman. I did not.

Yeah. Val is a straight dog. Very very straight

Val does not need to be broadcasting his sexuality over my page. ;3
I never assumed you were, in fact, gay. Don't worry, you made it very clear otherwise. -patpat-

As I am not going to come pounce you, because of that, you should have nothing to fear.

*scratches head, confused* guh?

It just seems you are going out of your way to proclaim your straightness. XD

I am? and what does that have to do with pouncing me?

Me... being gay... you being straight.

I mean, that is the only logical reason you're making it so clear you're straight, obviously afraid of some wayward gay attack. So I am reassuring you it is not going to happen.

I did not know you were gay. I would have guessed bi sense you basically siad you are turned on by females up there :| unless that means you are female?

Ah, bi, gay. Either way I like both men, and women.
Although I sway more towards men.

I guessed that was what caused you bout of fear, there. :)

I didn't know, and if it was a bout of fear, I wasn't aware of it

Oh, well, then I have no idea why you had to be so blatant about it.

Really, I have no idea why any straight man feels the need to proclaim how straight he is when faced with a gay drawing. It isn't as if I'm going to gallop over to a straight drawing and proclaim my love of men.

I was jsut saying I am straight *shrug*

I think it is called Straight Pride.

Ahd I have had a number of gay furs completely ignore that I am straight and ask to yiff my fursona or worse

Ah, well. Then we'll go to this:

I never did, nor would I ever. So you should show a small amount of respect to me in return.

I don't do straight, or gay pride. I am a firm believer in like what you like without announcing it to the world. Because I'm not overly interested in hearing it. :3

I was not intending to be disrespectful to you and I am sorry if it came across that way.

IF you are bi, why wpould you do straight or gay pride?

Throwing around ones sexuality on anyone's page before they know if they are gay, straight, or bi can come off as very disrespectful. ;3 keep that in mind.

I was just using it as a reference. XD

I wasn't meaning to be disrespectful. Sorry that it came off that way. My fault. Maybe I shouldnt have been so hastey

I was only joking with that second part anyway

You don't have to be hasty.
It's just, you don't have to post for the sake of letting me know you were disturbed by my character. XD

And I know. XD

I didnt say disturbed :|

Also. There's no side boob.

Could be flat chested woman. That can be hot...especially with lizards. Mamerless lizard girls can be very very sexy

You acted disturbed. XD

Meh. Turned off more like it

I hate to break it to you buddy, but my mate has a butt that is very much like that. Men can have feminine looking attributes. So tell me, what is your deal about fucking trolling artists? You really go out of your way. Are you addicted to pissing people off? because y'know, opinion is NOT fact. Get it through your head.

It's not my fault that that turned you off. It's also not my fault that it happens to please other people.

I don't go to your submissions and tell you whether or not I was disappointed/turned off by anything. And your fursona hardly does anything for me, so I could go on and on.

I show you respect, you show me respect. Really, that's the end of the story.

Some people just don't understand they don't need to announce every thought that comes into their thick heads.

In his own little homophobic mind, his opinions are facts. I think he's mentally ill. (I'm not slandering, I'm serious)

IF every person I met like him was mentally ill, then we'd be in trouble.

It's not illness, it's arrogance, really. Oh, and lack of life. And probably any sort of love life, as well.

yeah, close mindedness is really quite pathetic. And the thing is, its not like "oh, i don't like it, I'll move on" it's going out of his way, commenting and slandering artists, and believing his opinion is fact. Its alot of work, and a total waste of time. Quite pathetic. Sadly, you're not the only artist he does this too. That's what makes him such a sorry human being. If he doesn't like male rears, then this isn't the site to be on.

Wnose trolling? I'm not. Males should look it

Considering that you are male, I am GLAD my fursona does nothing for you. That is a good thing.

what you're doing IS trolling dipshit, and I hate to break it to you, but not all males are "masculine" dumbass

You think I shouldn't be on a furry art site just because, for some unexplainable reason, the majority of furs are gay? That's close mindedness right there. Ignorance at it's finest. Get this through your skull: Fur Affinity is NOT a porn site. I come here because I am a fur and I like to draw. Seems like a logical place to be seeing as how this place exists for furry art and artists. Your statement would be less ignorant and close minded if you had said something like the male section of fchan. Atleast that is strictly porn

On your first suggestion. Many males in reality don't look male, and it's not their fault. So don't be insensitive.

I didn't say it was a BAD thing, so don't get snarky with me. I was stating that I'm not going all over your page or submissions saying it. So feel free to do the same for me.

By do the same, I mean shut the fuck up the next time you want to explain in depth how straight you are, because really no one is interested.

What I am doing ISN'T trolling, dipshit, and I hate to break it to you, but males may not have to all be muscled as hell and shit like some cheesy 80's action movie, but they should atleast look male

Certainly isn't. XD
This site if so full of girlyboys it's pretty interesting.

Seems most people these days never learned the 'if you don't have something nice to say, say nothing at all.' rule.

Tell that to crossdressers and whatnot.

And there are plenty of actual artists here as well

do I dare prove you wrong, though you wont care. Your opinions aren't fact asshole. they're exactly that, OPINIONS!

I am not talking about the crossdressers. There are more examples than simply the ones that fit your needs.

There is /no/ set body type, for any gender. You just think there should be. And you're wrong. Get over it, move on.

My facts are facts, however. You shoudl learn that

Are you saying that someone who draws a feminine man is not, in fact, an artist?

There are definite male and female looks though. Common traits for each sex that the other typically doesn't have

Really, because your facts are only half of the equation. You fail to see the entire circle because only half of it suits your needs. And that is sad.

I am saying porn aint art

I see the whole circle. You appear to noit though

the statement "but males may not have to all be muscled as hell and shit like some cheesy 80's action movie, but they should atleast look male" IS AN OPINION! For fuck sake dude, you're stupid as hell.

Like, penises, and vaginas. 8D

But otherwise, no. I've seen men who are girlier than my sister, yet not playing it up at all. It's a common game in my family 'guess the gender.'

becaus epeople are ambiguous nowadays . Just because you THINK there are physical guidelines, doesn't make it so.

That's funny coming from you

Oh buit you know I am right about the common traits thing

I appear to see more than you do. And that can prove you wrong. Which would be the end of the world.

People like you don't believe in other peoples opinions. And never see how wrong you are. So I'll bring an end to it. kindly stop posting on my submission, or I will contact an admin and tell them about your harassment.

amazing how you just make yourself look more and more stupid. get with the 21st century and modern public views and opinions you homophob. Deny it all you want, you're afraid of males looking like females because it makes you insecure.

No, you're not. Sadly.

You are yet to prove me wrong.

I believei n other peoples opinions. The problem lies with you not believing facts

already did

Yes. I am. there are looks that are definitely male and there are looks that are definitely female, so yes. I am right

What's a homophob? lol. You cannot spell, and you want to call others stupid

I know. You already did not prove me wrong

looks alone are a matter of opinion dipshit

I don't see you posting any true facts. When you find scientific proof of what you're talking about, that is fact.

Otherwise, you're arguing for the sake of saving face. You're wrong, somehow you know that, but you will refuse to acknowledge it. Even though everyone who looks at any of your posts just admires how much of a closed minded idiot you are being. You really don't care.

So go back to your empty life, and I'll continue to enjoy my lovely one.
Feminine males and all.

But there are still looks that are defintiely a male look or definitely a female look, dipshit

want me to spell it out, okay then HOMOPHOBIC dipshit

Yes. But there are still males with female looks, and females with male looks.

Just because you enjoy a very feminine woman, and a very masculine male, does not mean everyone around you must conform to that mold.

Then you just aren't looking.

I'm not wrong. As such, there is no need to aknowledge it. that would be lying to myself. I am many things. A liar is not one of them.

I'm rather not close minded you know. You are quick to judge, and it is sad.


My 'empty' life is quite full and fun

by your standards, THIS IS FEMALE http://www.furaffinity.net/view/2199192/ Same curve and obviously a femme pose

Wow. Did you have to look that up to spell it? It still does not apply to me

No no and no. ARe you really this ignorant? Val is, in no way, shape or form, feminine

Your empty life involves hours of pissing people off for the hell of it.
That does not insinuate a 'full and fun' life. That insinuates hours of free, alone time with nothing better to do than annoy people, and take some sort of.. odd, sick pleasure from it?

you didn't even know what it was, look who's talking

Enjoy? I don't judge people by their physical appearance you know. Personality is what you fall in love with. I'll get me a wonderful woman with a great personality and be happy.

Oh... wow... Val, I thought that was a woman.

Maybe your problem is you're scared that you thought Mear was hot.

if you didn't judge physical appearance, you wouldn't have posted on here. At all.

You are judging that based on a bit of arguing when it was over to begin with because I had apologized and we were ready to move on. You, however, expressed wish to continue by arguing with me some more. You say my life is empty? Based off your actions, you live to argue on the internet

No. I clicked it because it is well drawn.

If you thought it was a female, you just aint paying attention. Maybe feminine males have melted yhour brain to the point that you can't tell a feminine one (your drawing) from a quite male one (Val)

oh, now you're one to talk. You do this on every male butt shot, claiming art is wrong (which is wrong in itself, art isn't "wrong," it's art)

Meh I enjoy leaving comments

wow, what's that smell, smells like Bullshit

I do not live to argue. However. I do not put up with this sort of thing. In the beginning, I was nothing but polite, and you kept pushing it.

But this is another trait for people like you, trying to twist it around so you become the innocent party.

You are not paying attention. I said porn is not art. That picture would noit be classified as porn and yeah. Val will pose for the ladies. So what?

Indeed. You spew it.

I apologized. I was being polite. You pushed it from there.

Porn is art. People spend hours and hours of time and effort into drawing two characters. That is art.
I'm sorry that you don't have the ability to draw, therefore you lack the capacity to comprehend it.
But you need to realize, at some point in your life, that what you think is not fact. What you think is simply an opinion, yours and yours alone, and other people view things in different ways.

When you have more than one person telling you that what you're saying is not right, then maybe at some point you have to step back and realize that it may, in fact, be wrong. Considering you think that if you, and you alone tell someone something is wrong, you believe yourself to be right.

I have a hard time even believing that you're that much older than me, and haven't learned that yet.


Oh, and Val posing /for/ the ladies and posing /like/ a lady, are two different things.
That picture you have fully classifies as a girly picture, especially the hip to should ratio, it's very effeminate.

I found you a while back, and when I saw that I thought it WAS a girl. However when I found out it was a man, you know what I did? Oh, right. I didn't say a darned thing, because I was being respectful.

Porn is not art. A drawing? Yes. That does not make it art. Something can be art and have nudity, but when you start getting into smut and whatnot, there is none of hte elegance, depth or beauty that would make it art.

I can draw. I am not the best artist in the world, but I can draw.

I know what I think is not fact. What I know is fact, however. You need to learn this.

Considering how many dumb people there are in this world, you cannot put too much credit into two people telling you that you are wrong, especially if it is over the internet.

I have a hard time believing that you haven't learned that yet

That pic is Val posing for the ladies, not like one.

That picture does not classify as girly in any way, shape or form. Such a statement is just pain ignorance to waht is and is not girly.

Don't lie

Anything anyone wants to draw, is art. A drawing IS art. No matter the skill behind it, or the focus it is on.
This is not something you know, this is something you /think/ it is not fact.

You simply have not learned to differentiate between opinion and fact, and no amount of my explaining it to you is going to change the ignorance that is so deep set within you. You will continue to believe that everything you think is correct. Because in reality, you don't /know/ any of this, you just /think/ it.

I'm not lying. I am simply saying exactly what you said about /my/ image.
I believe you stated that it could not physically be a male? I simply stated that your picture does not physically /look/ male. It's my honest opinion, and pretty blatant, to everyone I show it to.

Don't be a hypocrite.

Porn is not, never has been and never will be art, no matter how you say it. By the same token, you could say any picture taken is art. It's not true, but you could use your logic to say that it is.

It is something I know

I differentiate between opinion and fact just fine, thank you very much. That pretty much devoids your point there. The ignorance is coming from you, not me. I admitted to being wrong up there. I apologized and was ready to move on. You decided to drag it out, though, which shows the ignorance you are claiming that I am showing.

What I said about your picture cannot be applied to the picture Kix drew of Val, which would mean you lied.

What I did was question how the picture is male actually.

My picture DOES look male though. That's a fact.

If it's a fact, then why does it look feminine to me? because, after all, it's my *opinion*

Because you are seeing what you want to see instead of what is actually there

I see a man bent over going "fuck me" and that sir, is gay

Nope. You see a man bent over looking over his shoulders inviting women to grope him

Like I said, you are seeing what you want to see instead of what is actually there

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/fact

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/opinion

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/art

You want your facts, there you go

You see? Again, this is all your opinion. In your opinion, porn is not art. That is fine. In my opinion, porn is art.
My opinion is not fact, and neither is yours. /especially/ when it comes to ar. Anyone can perceive anything they like as art. Art is /based/ on opinion.

You apologized, yes, but continued on your rant of straightness.

See? Right there, you did it again. x3
Which is just so much fun.

You are one of those people that believes he can say whatever he likes, but then simply will not accept someone saying the same of his own post.

I stated the same thing that you stated about my image, and I truly, whole heartedly believe it. It's not a lie. In my eyes, that picture looks like a girl. And as a male, it looks gay. /extremely/ gay.
The arch of the back,t he feminine rear, again, the hip to shoulders ratio. It looks like a woman.

I do not, in any way, see how that picture is masculine. Leaning forward, arching your back, looking lustful, much like a girl, with your overly feminine but, thin waist, wide hips.

Look, I just said the same thing you said about Mear, only in a constructive way. not a lie.

I know what they all are dude. I've taken 4 art classes you know. 2 in middle school. 2 in high school

I could lso say you are seeing what you want to see.

He wants to see it as a guy telling someone ( another male ) to fuck him.

You see it as a guy wanting a girl to grope him.

Personally, any of my girl friends, would steer away, because they thought you were gay.
I know this, because I asked. :3

pffft, and your mind is stuck in elementary. You took 'em for easy As obviously

oh, and to confirm, I'm about to graduate with an Associates in Design. I've taken the real classes, and yes, porn is art. If you want me to scan my text books talking about such things, I will.

Maybe it is an opinion that porn is not art. I know tasteful nudes can be art. A lot of people would consider that porn, which I do not understand. I jus dont see how hardcore smut and whatnot can be called art.

I apologized and that should have been the end of it. You chose to keep arguing where there was no point.

That shows that you don't know me

You stated somjething that is 100% incorrect about my image. That makes it a lie. It is extremely straight. IT is not extremely gay. All you are doing is being ignorant and close minded and trying to be a troll and piss me off by saying it is gay or looks like a girl even though you know beyond all shadow of a doubt that that is not true. It looks like a straight male.

HE was posing for women. How is that not masculine? A male trying to get women? Oh wait. that happens every day. Guess it is masculine and not feminine at all.

My miund is stuck with my age. You khnow. Mature. No wait..you don't. that's why you are arguing

Porn is not art

Yes it is! :D

Greetings stranger

There you go. See? Opinion. To me, it is art. to you, it is not. very simple.

To me, he looks like a woman. To me, there is no possible way in my mind that he looks like a male, other than the fact that he lacks breasts. That is 100% correct, and I am not trying to piss you off, at all.

To you, Mear looks like a woman, and there is no possible way in your mind he could be a male. You even explained how he /could/ lack breasts.

Yet you say I'm just trying to piss you off, and you're.. not just trying to be ignorant and piss me off before? Really?
This isn't hypocritical in any way, huh

Men posing for men also happens every day, too.
And you did not elaborate in the comments what he was doing, leaving anyone free to assume whether it was a man, or a woman he was indeed posing for.

Khnow? lol you cannot spell.

Did that seem mature to you? ;3 because I just mimicked what you did before.

Then you are looking at that picture of Val wrong. He looks male in it. To suggest otherwise is to insult my pride as well as my character. You have to be trying to piss me off because he doesn't look female. Nothing else makes sense.

mmm....mammarless lizard girls....sexy scaley legs...so hot

Anyway, it's male so I see it as male now *shrug*

I was never being ignorant, nor was I trying to piss you off. Infact, quite the opposite is true. I was trying to apologize so we could move on. You chose not to drop it

If you pay even a little bit of attention, it is painfully obvious who Val would be posing for.

I cannot possibly look at it 'wrong'.
I didn't say you were looking at Mear wrong, did I? Nope, not once.
So far I have asked five people if they thought it looked male, or female. And all of them have said female, or gay.
Do a poll, I believe you would get the same results.

And I did pay attention, a lot of attention. And no, it's really open to interpretation. And most of the pictures where a male is posing like that? Gay. That is just painfully obvious.

Porn is most definitely art. It is an expression of emotion, even if it is sexual in nature. Shut the fuck up.

You are seeing something that isn't there.

No. If you just look at myu profile, you know Val would not pose for males. Bam. Research done. Wow. That was hard. It only looks female or gay to the truly ignorant

Shut the hell up. Porn isn't art, and it isnt the expression of an emotion

WOW

Sorry asshole it most definitely is, sorry I have more talent in my own shit than you do in your entire fucking body.

Oh, my sister agrees. That looks like a woman.
So that will be six other people who believe, at first look, with no prior history at all, that that image looks like a female dog.

I'm not saying for any research. As someone who stumbled upon that picture a while back, without knowing you at all. I thought it was a gay male dog. In all honesty. I thought it was a gay dog, and moved on, never even looked at your lookup, had no interest in researching you.

Porn is an expression of a deep emotion. Passion for another person that can only be expressed in that way.

You just haven't had a deep enough relationship to understand that.

Porn for the hell of it is not passion, but there is deep, meaningful porn. any time anyone makes love, it is porn.

And just because you say otherwise is not true.
Although I don't think that you needed to be snapped at like that person did.

Speaking of things you are full of...

IT ain't art

I appreciate the effort... but this is not helping. 8D;;

Porn isn't about passion. It exists for the sole purpose of getting people horny. That's not expressing emotion. Not in an artistic way. Therefore, it is not art.

I have had a deep enough relationship. Was with the same girl for more than 2 years. Loved her with all my heart. We never fucked or had sex. We made love.

Porn, by definition, is neither deep nor meaningful.

THANK YOU.

And look, he's being a dick to you and to everyone else in this thread, I will snap at this asshole if it's needed, and it is because it's ridiculous and he's not getting the point.

6 ignorant people and counting. That's all that means

I am getting the point. You aren't

Any image of two people having sex is classified as 'porn.'

Why can I draw two people holding eachother and that is deep and meaningful.
But I can't draw two people holding eachother during sex, and have it not be 'not art'?

Sir, the fact that you call an entire city block of people ignorant, does not make them ignorant anywhere other than your own mind.

My country is based on democracy. Six against one. the one loses.

You're the ignorant one that can't see that porn is art. And love making vs fucking? Like whats the difference? Did you like "thrust your penis into her vagina slowly and carefully"? God lol this is so stupid.

I wouldn't say that. If it is done to be a man and woman deeply in love and actually making love to one another, and not just a dirty drawing for the purpose of getting people horny, I would not classify it as porn

The fact that 6 people think that picture looks liek a female or a gay male makes those 6 people ignorant

What abut a man and a man, or a woman and a woman, deeply in love and making love to one another?

Passion and emotion is the difference. IT can be expressed well in a well drawn piece of art. Otherwise, it is porn and, therefore, not art

Only because you think they are.
When in reality a hundred people could look at that picture and believe it to be a woman, or a gay male. Yet you are so insecure you will still call them ignorant.

The one against the majority. that doesn't make you right.

I was giving a fucking example. Back the hell off

Then hundreds of people would be ignorant because it is painfully obvious that that is neither gay nor female.

Lol go take some college level art classes you poor soul.

I thought we already went over this?
That is your opinion. Anyone can believe a crumpled up piece of paper is art. And it's art.

You believe, in your /opinion/ that t is not.
They believe in their opinion, that it is.

Opinion. Do not state it as fact.

I'd recommend you learn the difference between porn and art. LOL. You poor, ignorant soul

That is a sad, twisted view.
And you won't get far in life like that.

Believing something is art and something actually being art are 2 entirely different things

wow, two art majors telling you facts based on studies that say porn is art, and yet you're still "waaaa, no no no"

It's gotten me extremely far and worked well for me thus far. Guess you're wrong

Porn isn't art. That's the only fact here

ily Kuro :U

Saying something isn't art, doesn't make it not art.
That is your OPINION. Not someone elses. Express it as an opinion. not as fact.

the world does not revolve around you, what you say is not law.

if you knew anything about art, you'd know that by definition, art is in the eye of the viewer, thus everything in the universe can be art. That's why there is "natural beauty." no one made it, it just is, and is thus artful

YOU SO FUNNY WITH YOUR INSULTS, YOU MAKE ME LAUGH SOOOOO MUCH!

The fact that it isn't art makes it not art, however. You seem to be missing this. I dont know how.

I don't know how you can go on believing that what you think makes it fact.

Truly, art is in the beholder. You may think it's not art, but it IS art to someone else. There is no fact there. There is only opinion.

I know plenty about art. Do you think any arg museum would accept porn? Of course they wouldn't. I'll tell you why. It ain't art

Glad to do so :)

sooooo, people who have taken classes on artworks and the production of art know less than you? wow, you really need to get a better understanding of the world. Knowledge is power, and your lack of knowledge is amazing, so you make up your own logic

Hahah there's tons of museums that display art containing sexual themes. Why don't you go check them out, since you seem to be SOOOOOOOO educated in this field? :'3

I don't believe what I think is fact. I just happen to know that what is fact is just that. I don't understand how this concept escapes you. Facts are facts. Is that that hard to grasp?

Art is in the eye of the beholder, yeah, but there are limits on everything you know. Porn is, in fact, not art

actually, there are museums of erotic art and porn

Sexual themes dont make something porn. lol. Ignorance

One museum will deny it, another will accept it.

there are entire art classes devoted to pornography. Pictures, and drawings.
There are entire fields of business, for it. And there are entire studies based on it.

You simply have to google to see that.
You're all about research, kindly do some.

art has no limits, that's what makes it amazing and is able to be enjoyed by all

When they assume that porn is art, they are displaying ignorance on the subject. Someone should correct them. IT might as well be me. You really need to get a better understanding of the world. Knowledge is power, and your lack of knowledge is amazing. You make up your own logic (Haha. I even removed your run on sentence)

sexual themed pictures is the definition of porn you tool

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erotic_museum


Stick that in your pipe and smoke it.

Again, there are entire studies devoted to porn as an artform. It has fascinated man for thousands of years.
You simply have to google to learn this, yet you want to present your own opinion as fact without researching at all.
Obviously too lazy to put any sort of effort into it, aren't you?

This is what you think, this is not fact. In art, there are no limits.

Porn isn't art though, which voids those classes of meaning and purpose.

wow, you just proved yourself wrong by repeating me. that's really intelligent

http://abm-enterprises.net/artgall2.....irth_venus.jpg



This isn't art to you?

No. It is not. A picture can be sexual without being porn, you tool. Artistic nudes are sexual by the fact that they are nudes, but they are not porn.

so tons of research are wrong and you're right? wow, hope you don't ever get into a career, you'll be sadly disappointed with the real world

I just proved you wrong by repeating you. It does not surprise me that you missed that. You aren't intelligent

You cannot void it simply because you state it, val. :3
that's the beauty of your half assed argument.

No matter how much you say it isn't so, it still, at the end of the day, is.

Indeed. Is it shocking when you take into consideration that the majority of hte people on this planet are stupid? That's the Dilbert Principle in fact. People are stupid

nudity is not sexual, it's classified as the human anatomy glorified, vs sexual themes which is porn and is a classification of porn

It voids itself with it's very existance. An art class for porn is an oxymoron

and you're the shining example

your whole argument is an oxymoron

Just because you say someone is stupid, does not make it so. :3

The fact that you believe everyone who views something different than you is ignorant, or stupid, makes you the ignorant one here.

If we go by your definition of what porn is, then damn near every show, movie and video game ever created would be classified as porn for having sex appeal. Lol. Ignorance

My argument is truth

http://www.artsandopinion.com/2005_...../steinberg.htm
http://www.amazon.com/Photo-Sex-Sex...../dp/0940208326


Just stop lol, you're making yourself look like a damn idiot.

PEople being stupid or ignorant (an example being anyone that thinks that the picture of Val looks female or gay) does make it so.

No. The fact that people have opinions that contradict a fact makes them ignorant or stupid

Indeed you are making yourself look like a damn idiot. There is a difference between something that is sexual in an artistic way and something that is porn

Again, you state something that is our own opinion as fact.

I just know, that some day, you're going to be proven so thoroughly wrong, in such a public, humiliating way in real life, that you'll realize how you've been up to that point.
No amount of texting at you is going to change your ignorant belief, and I am tired of devoting my time to such.

I have drawings to get back to. So if you would remove yourself from this page, and anyone on it now.
I'm ending this.

REPEATING YOURSELF LOL AND NOT LOOKING AT THE FACTS.

That's what you're doing :) You're not looking at the facts

you have all the links and facts needed to prove our point, your "facts" are all based on opinion, Everything is all set now.

I... Just... Showed you proof. Holy shit so the world is wrong and you're right. I end my argument rofl. Continue failing all over the place.


/conversation

So now you agree that what I state is a fact. Why are we arguing, then?

Never going to happen. In real life, I am actually very quiet and shy. I don't talk much. Chances are that I won't spark up a conversation with you if I don't know you and, sometimes, even if I do. I really am that shy. IF poeople talk to me and the person and I strike a common cord, that can get me talking. Not much else.

My belief is not ignorant. the sooner you learn this, the better off you will be.

My facts are not based on opinion, That's why they are facts. You're stating opinions, though. In some cases, they contradict fact.

You do that. I tried to stop you from failing all over the place and help you, but you chose not to be helped. You argued instead

I do not acknowledged any opinion you stated as fact, nor do I claim any of my opinions as fact. I seem to lack your eternal arrogance that makes you think you know everything.

I don't care what you are like in real life, nor would I ever with to know you.

And I am quite well off already, without having to conform to your ignorant beliefs.
Stop posting here now. after I have told you to stop, anything you post can be used against you as continued harassment as this is my page, not yours.

I'm done here. http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/9544/nuffsaid.jpg

hi Vorn

glad to see you're still a cuntpocket.

HAHAHAHAHA

I thought you were done. I stated facts as facts, and you should acknowledge them as such. You are arrogant, though. You just refuse to see. You would rather keep in living in ignorance than accept.

What does "with to know you" mean? Also, don't judge ones personality based on an argument that should have ended when I ended it last night when I apologized. You chose to drag this out.

There are no ignorant beliefs for you to conform to.

You said you were done, but you continued to reply to me anyway. After expressing that you, yourself, would stop, you continue to harass me like this.

until the almighty Vorn can submit proof he is a 'proper' critic of art, I see no other reason than ridicule him for soliciting nudes to minors.

I will never acknowledge the opinions you stated as facts. Ever. I am not the arrogant one of the two of us, you just choose to believe that. Feel free to do so.

One more post, and I will contact an admin. I am telling you to stop now. So stop. I am not harassing you, I have not posted on your page, not once. So stop posting on mine.

You are being arrogant as hell tough. My opinions are opinions, but the facts are stated are just that as well. I dont get why that is so hard for you.

You are continuing to post on my page after I have warned you not to.
I'm contacting an admin about your harassment.

I am contacting the admin about your harassment

I don't see that going very well for you, considering this is my page that you posted on. Good luck, though. :3

i am contacting the admin about your harassment

You are harassing me through your page. This ended last night, but you chose to keep arguing after it. I apologized. I admitted that I was wrong and took back what I said. I was being respectful to you. You replied to that by being disrespectful to me and, in doing so, were harassing me

translation: will somebody change my soiled diapers?

You never asked me to stop, therefore it was not harassment.

I have told you to stop atleast five times now, yet you keep going. This is harassment. Very simple.

"I stated facts as facts, and you should acknowledge them as such. You are arrogant, though."

Who the hell is the arrogant one here? Irregardless of the truth or fallacy of your statements, why is that you are allowed to force your words on others, and call THEM arrogant?

And you're full of shit, for the record. I'll go with the people who went to college for art, kthx.

It was harassment because I made an obvious attemt ot end the argument. I apologized., You had no reason to continue to argue, flame and insult me. You did anyway.

You know, I've gotta say. People like you make me laugh - and laugh hard.

People like you are the ones the purposely go out and look for trouble or something to victimize yourself with. I mean really, you sit at your computer and make page long arguments about how porn isn't art, and saying that it's a fact - yet offer no evidence other than the "I said so" defense, which - for the record - hasn't worked on any of else since the age of eight.

Yet, people who tell you that porn is art, and the backs up those statements and evidence such as college courses and things like that. And then faced with those true facts you turn around and go back with your "I said so" reasoning and then try to validate that by saying that because those schools and/or courses consider porn to be art (which by the way, it totally is), then those schools and courses are no longer valid because of that reason.

I mean, serious? Have you ever stepped foot in a college and actually spent an entire semester there? Actually show up every single day, take notes, do your course work, and learn something a little more useful than pulling out your e-dick at every since person who says something you, apparently, don't agree with.

In all honesty? Rather than spending your time on a furry community site, arguing with people who actually know what they're talking about - why do you go outside with some real life people and learn a little more about what's around you. Because the ignorance that you say everyone else here is showing - is really nothing more than you projecting your own upon them.

It would also be ill advised to continue arguing with people who've been around here longer than you. As in real life, people who have been around longer tend to know more than you do. Now I know that seems odd to you (and hey, if it doesn't, there may be hope for you yet), but it's the truth. Even people younger than you, can still be smarter and better than you at something they've been around for longer.

-Silver

Stop posting, you're only making things worse.
Your desperate need to continue this argument or get the last word in is very apparent now.

Stop. posting. It's simple. just stop.

I've a desperate need to continue this argument? But you are still posting. lol. Irony

I'm telling YOU to stop.
This is my page, not yours. So stop posting.

You could

That is /exactly/ what I was thinking.

I just keep thinking. 'wow, this is what racists are like.'

racism exists because there are ignorant people in this world. I can proudly state that I am not one of them.

I love this desperate need of yours o have the last post. :3
So go ahead, after this I'm not responding to your harassment anymore.

Posting after this shows just how sad and pathetic you are, and how you need that last post as some sort of justification. Your inability to take the high road and move on will be prevalent after that.

So go right ahead, go on, post last.

You are fiunally going to stop harassing me? good. This is the third time you have said that, though.

you called me a kike Vorn

yup, totally not racist.

you condoned Dissection frontman Jon Nödtveid's murder of a homosexual man.

you've insulted, belittled and haranqued people of differing opinions yet cover yourself in the flag of tolerance

cock.

In case you didn't figure it out, allow me to blatantly state it for you. Now I hope you understand that I can type this as slow as possible, but the text will still appear all at once. So I want you to take your time and read this carefully. It's not a trick, and I'm not double talking you. And please, if this doesn't clear it up, tell me, and I'll find someone who speaks fluent moron to explain it to you - though since it's a dying language, that person may be hard to find.

Rewlette was giving you a chance to show some maturity and allow things to end with his post, thus allowing you to have at least a little bit of dignity by showing at least a smidgen of maturity and ending things at that.

Now what you did, was completely opposite of mature. Instead, you took the post that would have allowed you to seem somewhat mature and turned it into yet another chance to victimize yourself, yet again.

So, going off that your FA page says your 24, I would like to thank you for giving me the evidence in order to prove my fact that you are, indeed, less mature than an 18 year old.

-Silver

Problem isssss...
You two aren't dating any more. Therefor you were never in love and you were fucking her. according to christian value and law, love is defined solely when a man and wife connect bodies for the first time. Were you married good sir?

Ba-zing

If you want a real ba-zing, check out the shouts back and forth between him and I.

Wow... Jesus Christ... does this guy think that all of life's problems can be solved by saying "I think that..." ? I mean, really, what the hell? He needs a serious reality check, because like Silver said, his reasoning is somewhere around the "BECAUSE I SAID SO" phase...

He deleted my shouts due to butthurt. I have them on screenshot though.

Awesome. Use them as a tool for MAXIMUM LULZ when the opportunity presents itself.

On that note, I'ma add you to my watches, because you've got some interesting things in that their gallery

Aw thanks.

there*

I agree! XD

Regardless of what your profile might say, if all someone saw was the picture, it could be taken as anything... There's nothing in the picture itself that says, "I'm a guy, and this is for the ladies."

That's rather slanderous to the mentally ill, actually. I am mentally ill, and not homophobic. Many of my friends are mentally ill, and they are amongst the most intelligent and open-minded individuals I have ever known. Please think carefully before using such a term as a slur on another's character.

ELLE OH FUCKING ELLE.

Animation major here. I'm going to say you're wrong about that, chuckles. It takes fucking talent to draw naked human bodies interacting with each other so intimately.

Then again, looking at the quality of your output, I don't think you're in any position to pass judgment on what is and isn't art.

Poorly drawn fanart of Left4Dead with slightly beefed-up stick figures and poor perspective is art, but a correctly proportioned full color painting of two human figures having sex isn't?

THIS INSULTS MY ARTISTIC SENSIBILITIES, SIR.

http://objection.mrdictionary.net/go.php?n=3131320


I just had to, sorry I didnt do this earlier :Y

This thread was stupid from the start. Valereth you are 24 years old and have the art skills of a highly functional 29 year old autistic.
http://www.furaffinity.net/view/2158535/
You will never be as cool as Rewlette or anyone on this site. I hereby deem you as uncool forrest of tiem. I've met some cool people and some uncool people like you. People that unnecessarily critique art for your own benefit. One day I was hanging out with some cool people and we all ran into some uncool people and I got in one little fight and my mom got scared she said 'You're moving with your auntie and uncle in Bel Air'I begged and pleaded with her day after day, but she packed my suite case and send me on my way. She gave me a kiss and then she gave me my ticket. I put my Walkman on and said, 'I might as well kick it'. First class, yo this is bad. Drinking orange juice out of a champagne glass. Is this what the people of Bel-Air living like? Hmm this might be alright. But wait I hear they're prissy, wine all that. Is Bel-Air the type of place they send this cool cat? I don't think so, I'll see when I get there ,I hope they're prepared for the prince of Bel-Air. Well, the plane landed and when I came out, there was a dude who looked like a cop standing there with my name out
I ain't trying to get arrested, I just got here.I sprang with the quickness like lightning, disappeared.I whistled for a cab and when it came near the license plate said 'FRESH' and it had dice in the mirror. If anything I can say this cab is rare, but I thought 'Nah forget it' - 'Yo homes to Bel Air ' I pulled up to the house about 7 or 8, and I yelled to the cabbie 'Yo homes smell ya later'. I looked at my kingdom, I was finally there to settle my throne as the Prince of Bel Air.

I never taken a single art class and draw art quite well o:

-reply to this post-
""by your standards, THIS IS FEMALE http://www.furaffinity.net/view/2199192/ Same curve and obviously a femme pose""

if ya look into the comments..hes cuddling with a male wolf :P

and then suddenly talks bout killing himself if a guy jerked him off to keep his "diginity" o:

according to society, there are certain "looks" that are masculine or feminine. boys wear pants, girls wear dresses, etc. gender isn't black or white though, there's lots of wiggle room in there. i am a female according to my chromosomes but i dress exclusively in what society would describe as male clothing. there is nothing wrong with this. i am comfortable this way. mear is a product of the artist's imagination and he can draw him in whatever type of outfit he'd like, and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. there is nothing wrong or bad about a boy with bows in his hair, just as there is nothing wrong or bad about a girl who plays with trucks. gender is not binary.

val, i hope that if/when you have children, you educate yourself a bit about this stuff. i have a feeling you'd be the kind of guy who would punish his son for playing in mommy's high heels.

I hope Val never breeds... we don't need more of that complete stupid shit stain logic.

Porn's art -- Anything that takes talent to render and make look good is art, gender and sexuality is entirely subjective, and that shot in particular of your Great Pyrenese character looked very, very feminine. Looked like a fem-boy to me. Soft lines, curvy butt.

Going on and on more than one artist's page about how straight you are makes you look like a closet fag who just can't accept his attraction to the cock.
If you are in fact straight -- Then, you're straight. No reason to announce to everyone just whom you like sticking your dick into. There are as many sexualities as there are colours in the world, as many bodytypes and as many mindsets as you can imagine. Calling everyone 'dipshits' doesn't do much for you character.

Just go around and enjoy the pictures you enjoy. Stop worrying so much about what's in-between their legs or not -- People are people, and art is imagination. So the artist says that picture up there is male. You saw it as female. So, see it as female, then! Imagine it as a girl if you want. That's the beauty of art.

probably because he himself had a father very much like that who enforced some collective idea of masculine personality to extremes and that's why he feels the need to go
II'M STRAIGHT I'M STRAIGHT I'M STRAIGHT I'M STRAIGHT I'M STRAIGHT I'M STRAIGHT I'M STRAIGHT I'M STRAIGHT on several different artist's pages.

Val, I wish you well, but you really need to chill out, dude.

EH WHY DID YOU BLOCK ME VAL I THOUGHT WE HAD SOMETHING SPECIAL.

Thank you, sensible post for this ^.^ "some" people cant do that

I shall oblige! *pounces* <3~

You are very rude.

Very nice ^ w ^

Ignore Valereth please, he just wants to cause drama over not being straight >.>

I am incapable of ignoring. :c

:<
He starts up crap on my submissions all the time because I'm a girlyboi >.>

It's okay - We loves ya <3

But girly boys are the most fun sometimes. D:

He thinks otherwise.

And he would be mistaken in his opinion. While HE might not have fun with girlybois, many people, NOT him, do. As long as one person has fun with girlybois girlybois are indeed fun =3~

hehe :3

Sabby > Val


See, math is fun!!

(That was a greater than sign, by the way just in case anyone didn't get the joke. XD)

People like that tend to cause problems that the rest of us want to distance ourselves from. Therefore, the hate begins.

Eh, if thats your prerogative.

I tend to be an asshole to those who deserve it.

It's okay, there are those of us in society that are well versed in "conversing" with morons. *He ignites fireballs in his hands.* Everyone understands the language of FWOOSH!

For pony?

FOR PONY!!!!!

FOR PONY!

.. wow this conversation did not sound intelligent. XD

*He chuckles.* It made you laugh though! Point for the wacky villain!

lol. XD yes.

Hehe cute!

WE BOTH HAVE SUBMISSIONS ON THE FRONT PAGE. 8D

You're improving so fast, this is awesome. The pose is like... omg so good. ;^;

hmm nice very nice

I know what you're looking at under those sunglasses. ;)

heh heh but seriously you a great artist

Thanks. xD

Bum~ <3

Oooo very nice Rewlette o:
>> -steals Mear-

B| I very much enjoy this picture.
Very much.
:C i just want to squish him.

Haha very cute xD and so frilly <3

Beautiful <3

well done, its a stunning doodle.

Thank you very much. <3

Although sadly, I have come to learn that he can in no way be male. :c
this disheartens me, you must know.

ah yes

our resident art critic Vorn hast spoken

shit if he says blue is grey, we better damn well pay heed lest he........

Call us ignorant and color blind? :v

WORSE!

PREJUDICED AGAINST DEATH METAL GRARGH >:u

OHNOES. D:
We must all bow down to his opinions, as they are fact.
And therefore law.

I love his desperate need to get the last word.

Very well done.
X33
And, I would suggest ignoring Val.
>W>
Even though he believes that it's impossible for males to look female,
even though I'm DATING a very feminine-looking boy.
XD

No, you're wrong. :v

He isn't feminine, that's IMPOSSIBLE. It's all in your mind. In reality he is a body builder.

You're just too ignorant to see it.

Oh my, of course. :V

How could I be so blind? Truly I am an insane prick that has no idea as to how male bodies are apparently supposed to look. :c

Yes, but that's okay, we all are. :c -patpat-
I only now know this.