Let me know if you'd prefer we didn't comment, in which case, I'll delete this. Not trying to steal anyone's thunder or anything. Especially since I agree. I'm not technically an Atheist though. I'm a Pantheist. The term God is subjective and has been applied to basically anything in history, and if they don't use the term God, they certainly act as though they did (ie Kim Jong Ill, Hitler, any Pope, etc.). Personally, I don't believe in an anthropomorphic personalized creator deity, but I feel that the universe itself fulfills any role that said creator deity could have done (made me, influences me, allows me to continue to exist). I feel that science is sort of our way of examining "God" and our way of seeing patterns in the universe. What I don't like is when people use science or religion as a crutch so that they don't have to think or question anything. That they "know" the answer and can bully people into believing what they do, making themselves feel superior. Stupid atheism, and stupid religion create bullies. There aren't religious people or irreligious people, just open minded-people and close-minded people. Thank you Kalegarrison for writing this, and for being open-minded.

Please, I encourage people to comment on this, as long as they stay civil about it.

Thank you for your thoughts.

Glad to. I'm always willing to offer my two cents, so holler if you want to contribute and I missed you. As a side note, how does your group feel about me joining?

Scratch that, I joined anyway. It's not like I disagree with you guys on basically anything.

This. All of my feels, all of my likes. Especially the end statements.

We don't need Antitheists screeching about how religion and "its" hate are counterproductive when that is just intolerance as well.

We don't need men of faith screeching about how their religion is the One belief and all others will burn.

Wanna know what we need?

We need unity and cooperative effort. United we stand and fight our threats. Divided we die. The silliest of arguments keeping us apart is whether or not a greater power exists and what it is called.

Thank you. ^^

I belive as long as you do good to others or at least try to do good god will accept you it doesnt matter what you believe he will accept you and when something bad happens thats just one rock god missed but hes taking so many others hits for people i ask no one to worship him nor believe in him just to hear what i say.

I agree pretty much with the title

Good point about the bible part. It surely is written by man. Names like John or Dave those are mens names. If God wrote the words, phrases, quotes, sentences, verses, and stories then why doesn't His name appear in the header or footer of a page in the bible?

One good essay deserves another. My response can be found at the link below.

http://symphonic-rp.livejournal.com/212346.html

Very interesting read, and some valid points. It's true that Atheism in of itself doesn't really lend anything to the mind and heart. But then again, I don't think it was ever supposed to. I think that's where concepts like Humanism come into play that are not based on religion or superstition but nevertheless remind us that we cannot devolve into soulless, heartless computers that happen to be organic.

Mind if I repost your response in a journal here?

I don't mind at all. Please do.

Uhh... you wrecked yourself up the moment you said you knew nothing about other religions and knew little, absurd pieces about Christianity.

I will say this. Go break open an encyclopedia, learn about Buddhism, Taoism, Jainism, and the ideas of religion aside from Sky Wizard (God). You should be surprised.

Religion is not a steaming crock of shit aimed at singing for a sky wizard with a beard, robe, and cane. Some don't even have God or gods.

Buddhism in particular, the Theravada sect worships nothing BUT human potential to achieve nirvana, or a state of no suffering through elimination of desires like greed, lust, hate, etc. which actually is similar to atheist postdeath oblivion. Mahayana is a less rigid and more popular school of thought. It states that enlightenment doesn't have to be a solo mission and that people and inspirations can guide you to finding happiness and enlightenment.

Not to mention, it hasn't picked any aggressive fights with other religions that I know of.

Taoism is about going with the flow of the universe, the way of things, rather than swimming against the stream, as that throws things out of balance and causes suffering. Very simple to follow and requires no God, also not counterproductive to science.

Ya know, I did not talk about Buddhism, Taoism, or the like because from little I do know about them does not cause me worry. In fact, I might have been a Buddhist if I hadn't learned about the concept of atheism first. I discovered Alan Watts a while back, and I find his views intriguing.

But the religions I did talk about - namely Christianity (and by relation Judaism and Islam) - are 'steaming crocks of shit aimed at singing [to] a sky wizard with a beard, robe, and cane,' because of the crap that's happening because of said religions. It's a demonstrable fact that wars have been fought over these religions; wars that continue to this day, I will add. The slowing of progress of science by these religions is also a demonstrable fact. I find it curious that you focus your criticism on my attacking religion in general when I mentioned in the article that I was focusing on Christianity, and I wonder why you felt the need to base your argument on such merits.

But curiosity and wonder aside, regardless of the history of whatever religion you bring up, my criticism will always be towards it's views of the supernatural and if it wishes to encroach on science and subject children to indoctrination. Religions like Buddhism? Not worried about. The Abrahamic religions? Very much opposed to such.

You continue to weigh the entirety of the Abrahamic faiths based on power whores.

Judaism's philosophy is Law. Honor, Obedience, and wisdom in order.
Christianity's philosophy is Unconditional Love and Acceptance of neighbors, friends, and even enemies. Sadly Paul fucked it up. "Apostle" Paul turned it into what it is now. He was the original hateful Christian.
Islam is about submission to Allah, knowing that we were created for a purpose and that we should fulfill it as best we can. Islam actually saved us back in the Middle Ages as they were, aside from China, the only people who gave a shit about science. What with Western greed and imperialism here in the past century, Western culture has made enemies. The fear created paranoia. The paranoia created hatred. The hatred created war.

The problem is not the problem. The problem is your attitude about the problem. Do you understand?

Spirituality can be the greatest thing on earth in the hands of one who uses it as moral and morale support to achieve beautiful things in life and seek out answers both spiritual or physically evident.

Religion can be the worst of things in the hands of the power hungry and the greedy. Greed and lust for control is the isue here.

Also a note. Science can be used for horrible, horrible things in the wrong hands. Lines never meant to be LOOKED AT are crossed and disasters occur. Holocaust/Nazi experiments come to mind.

OR, it can be a beautiful thing. We explore the stars, learn what makes the human mind tick, discover cures, invent machines and tools.

The sooner we all quit our bitching on both sides the sooner we unite to fight that which threatens us most.

You can sit there hating religion, doing sweet Fuck All. And we can remain divided. And we can all die.

Or you can put these differences aside, find the good in people, and make yourself willing to work with them.

Stupid people exist, buddy. Don't lump the entire community they leech off of in with them. Besides, do that, and fight about it, and the jackasses win, bring you to their level, and beat you with experience.

No reason to be upset or demeaning; we are having a pleasant conversation, are we not?

I do not lump the entirety of people who have faith in a particular god or no god into one group of spiteful, hateful theists. I know better than that, and I can see you know that too. I am not criticizing people, I am criticizing their religion. I (mostly) do not have a problem with people of faith, (though there are exceptions that I'm sure we could both find in the world) I have a problem with the intrusion of faith into the classroom and into our government.

I am aware that there are stupid people in the world, both theist and atheist alike. I am also well aware that many religions started out with peaceful intentions, and were corrupted later on. However, to remain silent and/or complacent to the stupidity of others is to encourage it and to allow it to spread. And I think the best way to root out stupidity and willful ignorance is through science and education, not religion and faith. Science has been used to do terrible things, yes, but only because we have not learned enough or reached a level of maturity and respect as a species. Religion, on the other hand, is an inherently flawed system of figuring out how the universe works, in that it really doesn't try to figure anything out at all. And I, for one, am not willing to stand by and allow religion to contribute to the suffering and evil in this world by not challenging its views.

So I fail to see why my attitude towards religious people is a problem, especially since my concern is with religion itself and not it's followers.

The problem is not the problem. The problem is your attitude about the problem. Do you understand?

Spirituality can be the greatest thing on earth in the hands of one who uses it as moral and morale support to achieve beautiful things in life and seek out answers both spiritual or physically evident.

Religion can be the worst of things in the hands of the power hungry and the greedy. Greed and lust for control is the isue here.

You didn't seem to get the point here. Spirituality, used correctly, isn't meant to find out HOW or WHY the universe works. That's Science's job. Don't ever assume I am anti-science. Sadly, a lot of idiots are incapable of reading an Allegory. Religion (the common Blanket Term) is used properly as a more right-brained, poetic method of understanding life, human nature, and ethics, not a source of Left Brained, cold fact.

In fact, the book of Genesis is fucking GENIUS if you can actually read an allegory.

And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. (KJV)

Chaos. Pre-Creation Chaos. In Egyptian Mythology, this Pre-Universe state was known as the Waters of Chaos/Ocean of Chaos. The Spirit of God (Creation) moved upon the face of the waters makes no sense admittedly, and the Ancient Egyptians would've died laughing at this. You can't move in a void. HOWEVER, for this to be possible a space had to have been created. The size of this space is not specified but I can equate this to a singularity. A single point from which the following occurs.

And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.

What creates light (back in this time, don't even say "torch" or "flashlight") better than an explosion? In both Biblical Creation and the Big Bang light was the first thing to be created.

God divided the light from the darkness. And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.

Between the Big Bang and the first Starlight? Sounds like a good metaphor. Night and Day.

I'm not going to spam Genesis. This is all I'm gonna post for the sake of not Bible Thumping. I think my point is present here.

Science is Left-Brained. It is analysis, it is fact, it is numbers, lines, and black and white.
Religion (As a Blanket Term) is Right Brained. It is feeling, it is speculation, it is creative thought, deeper thinking, and colorful.

However, because we Humans are so emotional, a lot of our NEGATIVE emotions can interfere with the positive, and anger, hate, and misery will leak into it.

I will admit. Because Science is so emotion-less the majority of the time, it is harder to fuck it up.
However, again, Religion is not INHERENTLY flawed. The only flaws it has are the fact that because it is so right-brained, all it takes is one emotionally unstable megalomaniac to become the reason We Can't Have Nice Things.

That doesn't mean it should be eradicated however. It has brought many people hope and joy, too many to selfishly take away because of what bad people will do with it. The moment that we stop blaming all of religion, the sooner we can weed out the problem and pull it.

Kinda like a rose garden. You don't pull the whole garden out because of some weeds, right?

And you don't seem to get the point that I am not talking about spirituality. I am criticizing religion trying to explain how the universe came to be and how it works because it fails miserably. That is all.

You also don't seem to get the point I made in the article about allegory vs. literal account either. If the Bible is supposed to be taken even partially as allegory, then why in the world should I use it to try and understand the universe? That's like trying to learn magic from reading the Harry Potter or Inheritance books. It's nonsensical. Allegory is not a proper method for describing origins or truths when investigating for facts and evidence. You don't use the Stork Story to describe the birth of a child, do you? Or the story of Atlas for explaining why the Earth is floating adrift in space in an orbit around the Sun?

And for that matter, what were you trying to get across with your little mini Bible-thump, there? (Cause you totally spammed Genesis) That Genesis could be describing the beginning of the universe as we know it? You're assigning meaning to something based on what you know, not what the people who wrote it knew. How could they have possibly known about the Big Bang, or that the sun is a star and vice versa, when they still thought the Earth was this vast, flat, plane of existence covered with a solid dome to hold the air in and the 'water above' out? The book of Genesis offers no information about the Big Bang or light when put into proper context because the people who wrote it didn't know.

Now, I'm not exactly sure what you mean spirituality, but you seem to associate it with contemplation, critical thinking, and philosophical discussion. I have no problem with that. I'll engage in philosophical discussion and thought any day of the week. But I maintain that religion is an inherently flawed system for describing the universe because it does not perform any sort of repeatable, observable test to find out how said universe works. That is what I said in my reply and in the article. And Christianity in particular is an inherently flawed system of figuring out how behave morally because it supports multiple viewpoints over the entire spectrum of morality. Again, I'm not talking about people, I'm talking about the religion itself and it's holy books. I don't want to eradicate religion because of the terrible things that have been done in it's name, (though it is a legitimate reason) nor because of the way it influences and drives seemingly smart people to do stupid and wicked things. (also a legitimate reason) I want religion to fall by the wayside as world viewpoint because it is a flawed way of looking at the world and a flawed method for trying to understand it. Do I think it will ever be completely eradicated? No, I am not so naive to think that. It is very, very difficult to destroy an idea. I just think the scientific method, good observation, and civil discussion are better ways to learn about the universe and ourselves than reading a book from the bronze/iron age written by desert barbarians.

...did you even pick up on the Left Brain Right Brain bit?

You are clearly left brained. Of course you wouldn't use art and poetry to convey factual ideas. You also equate the bible to mythology when, first of all, Greek Mytha were stories that were different depending on the cult of worship and no revelation was implied, neither did any of the heroes in the myths physically exist. Most Biblical books are universally agreed upon and we have evidence of the existence of the Hebrew People, of Jesus, of King David and Solomon, etc.

We have found Egyptian chariots in the Red Sea dating back to a reasonable time for the Exodus. Jericho's walls fell OUTWARD under siege, not Inward. Just as it was described in the Bible, we are beginning to find support in the Left Brained world.

I laughed at how much you underestimate ancient peoples. They were NOT desert barbarians and did not believe Earth to be flat. That is a Columbusian myth told to kindergartners.

"Have not those who disbelieve known that the heavens and the earth were joined together as one united piece, then We parted them? And We have made from water every living thing. Will they not then believe?? "[32][Quran 21:30

It is believed that they were referring to the Bing Bang singularity.

"And it is We who have built the universe with [Our creative] power; and, verily, it is We who are steadily expanding it."[Quran 51:47]

Expansion.

The Nasadiya Sukta, the Hymn of Creation in the Rig Veda (10:129) mentions world beginning from a point or bindu, through the power of heat. Big Bang was unimaginably HOT.

You seem to forget that the point of these writings were that they were given to us or we were told to write them. No doubt you will remain unopen to the poasibility and write off my quotes. You have to be willing to accept and review interpretations rather than ignore them. You don't have to believe them, but at least respect them as existent and plausible.

Muhammad was an illiterate. He wrote the Qur'an. To back this up there are five counted grammatical errors in the Qur'an's original arabic.

The hindis knew about atoms or at least tiny particles.

The Ancient World was REMARKABLE. You don't give it enough credit!

Just because something fails to work for you doesn't mean it is inherently flawed, buddy. This is a heavily biased argument you got rockin'.

..did you even pick up on the Left Brain Right Brain bit?

You are clearly left brained.

Yes, I read that bit, and it's rubbish. The left brain/right brain theory was born out of misconceptions of a study by Roger W. Sperry that grew into our pop culture. The theory has been abandoned since the early 2000's when it was discovered in one study that communication between the hemispheres contributes to better functionality all around, rather than one hemisphere doing one specific group of tasks. While certain areas had more activity during certain tasks, both hemispheres had approximately equal activity on average. Since then, multiple studies have confirmed this new theory.

Of course you wouldn't use art and poetry to convey factual ideas. You also equate the bible to mythology when, first of all, Greek Mytha were stories that were different depending on the cult of worship and no revelation was implied, neither did any of the heroes in the myths physically exist. Most Biblical books are universally agreed upon and we have evidence of the existence of the Hebrew People, of Jesus, of King David and Solomon, etc. We have found Egyptian chariots in the Red Sea dating back to a reasonable time for the Exodus. Jericho's walls fell OUTWARD under siege, not Inward. Just as it was described in the Bible, we are beginning to find support in the Left Brained world.

While I can't dispute the existence of the Hebrew people, no tablets, no inscriptions, no monuments, nor records that can be verified has been found mentioning Jesus, David or Solomon. All the evidence put forth so far has either been in dispute or has been outed as fake having been forged in modern times. There has been no evidence that Jericho was a bustling city in the time of Joshua, around 1400 BC. The man who 'found' the Egyptian chariots in the Red Sea was made out as a fraud by numerous organizations. You have not been able to provide a single shred of evidence that has been checked, documented, and verified by the scientific community. Stop wasting my time if you do not plan to do so. Oh, and there were plenty of Greeks who worshipped the Gods and revered the demigod heroes of the stories, considering the length of the span of its dominance in the greek empire. It didn't matter if the heroes or gods were real or not, people still believed in them for a time.

I laughed at how much you underestimate ancient peoples. They were NOT desert barbarians and did not believe Earth to be flat. That is a Columbusian myth told to kindergartners.

Simple Wikipedia search would have told you that while yes, the flat earth theory was not accepted in the scientific community at the time of Columbus, it was the accepted view in the Bronze and Iron age, between 3300 BC and 550 BC, about the time when the Old Testament was written. In fact, it is mentioned in Matthew 4:8 and Luke 4:5 where the devil took Jesus up a high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the earth. This wouldn't be possible on a spherical earth. And even if this isn't definitive proof of the views at the time, there are Christians and Muslims who still believe the Earth is flat to this day.

"Have not those who disbelieve known that the heavens and the earth were joined together as one united piece, then We parted them? And We have made from water every living thing. Will they not then believe?? "[32][Quran 21:30

It is believed that they were referring to the Bing Bang singularity.

"And it is We who have built the universe with [Our creative] power; and, verily, it is We who are steadily expanding it."[Quran 51:47]

Expansion.

The Nasadiya Sukta, the Hymn of Creation in the Rig Veda (10:129) mentions world beginning from a point or bindu, through the power of heat. Big Bang was unimaginably HOT.

You seem to forget that the point of these writings were that they were given to us or we were told to write them. No doubt you will remain unopen to the poasibility and write off my quotes. You have to be willing to accept and review interpretations rather than ignore them. You don't have to believe them, but at least respect them as existent and plausible.

You're assuming a deity exists or existed to perform this feat of giving us writings/telling us what to write. Yet you have not provided any evidence outside the holy books to demonstrate said deity. Again, by inserting your own knowledge into the interpretations and not considering what the authors knew or didn't know, you're only using allegory to prove it's existence, exactly what you said earlier in your reply to be nonsensical. You're either a hypocrite, or you don't know what you're talking about. From what I've read here, I'm guessing both.

Muhammad was an illiterate. He wrote the Qur'an. To back this up there are five counted grammatical errors in the Qur'an's original arabic.

If he was illiterate, how could he even begin to write the Qur'an?

The hindis knew about atoms or at least tiny particles.

The Hindus theorized about atoms. They did not have the means to test their theory, nor were they specific enough to mention different elements or the fact that those are comprised of even smaller particles.

The Ancient World was REMARKABLE. You don't give it enough credit!

Of course, the ancient world was remarkable. There was hardly any pollution, and science made many breakthroughs that led to entire fields of study. I give credit where credit is due. I don't think much, if any, credit is due to people wandering around in the desert writing down tales that are by all accounts so far fictional.

Just because something fails to work for you doesn't mean it is inherently flawed, buddy. This is a heavily biased argument you got rockin'.

Religion doesn't fail to work for just me and myself only, it fails to work for everyone because it has not provided us any knowledge about our world that we couldn't see with our own eyes. Because that's all the hebrews and christians had during that time. They looked around them and saw devils and mysterious forces that they mistook for god because they simply didn't know any better. If anything, you are the one with confirmation bias because you believe the truth and validity of the holy books seemingly without any evidence to support your views, other than the holy books themselves. You forget, I was shown all of this when I was little and knew far less than i knew now, and I was still skeptical because it didn't make much sense. It was only a few years ago that I finally understood why it didn't make sense to me. And between that time from when I went to church and when I realized I was an atheist, I could have been shown how it made sense and been converted. But no one could do it, because the religion is flawed. It's that plain and that simple.

Now, if you're hell-bent on converting me, please show me something demonstrable, testable, and repeatable that proves the existence of the Christian god or any other god, and I'll listen. Until then, good day.

Alright, alright. Time to break out the links. No Christian website bullshit or anything. Secular pages and hopefully Wikipedia will be taken as a valid source.

Nice shot, there, with the LB/RB myth. For now, though, just attribute it to personality. "Left-Brained" analysis, objectivity, and numbers. "Right-Brained" creativity, emotion, and subjectivity. For the sake of the argument, ignore the "brained" part of it. From now on I shall refer to it as merely sets of personality traits. (Only because of its importance in my half of the argument)

Found this earlier. Had a feeling you'd dispute the historicity of Jesus, David, Solomon...
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art.....brew-text.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historicity_of_Jesus

http://www.wnd.com/2012/06/chariots.....able-evidence/

I never said that they admitted they were stories. I said that they were not universally agreed upon. Some gods were more important than others and received bias in that city-state's spinning of the myth.

Fantastic use of the Bible to counter me. Although I do not deny Biblical mistranslation. What better way to weaponize a book than to mistranslate into a language nobody but the "trained" could read? I will concede this point.

You're assuming a deity exists or existed to perform this feat of giving us writings/telling us what to write. Yet you have not provided any evidence outside the holy books to demonstrate said deity. Again, by inserting your own knowledge into the interpretations and not considering what the authors knew or didn't know, you're only using allegory to prove it's existence, exactly what you said earlier in your reply to be nonsensical. You're either a hypocrite, or you don't know what you're talking about. From what I've read here, I'm guessing both.

Muhammad was an illiterate. He wrote the Qur'an. To back this up there are five counted grammatical errors in the Qur'an's original arabic.

If he was illiterate, how could he even begin to write the Qur'an?

Hear that? The sound of the point flying overhead. More on this in a minute.

I don't think much, if any, credit is due to people wandering around in the desert writing down tales that are by all accounts so far fictional.
...Medieval Muslims? Just... throwing that out there...?

Religion doesn't fail to work for just me and myself only, it fails to work for everyone because it has not provided us any knowledge about our world that we couldn't see with our own eyes. Because that's all the hebrews and christians had during that time. They looked around them and saw devils and mysterious forces that they mistook for god because they simply didn't know any better. If anything, you are the one with confirmation bias because you believe the truth and validity of the holy books seemingly without any evidence to support your views, other than the holy books themselves. You forget, I was shown all of this when I was little and knew far less than i knew now, and I was still skeptical because it didn't make much sense. It was only a few years ago that I finally understood why it didn't make sense to me. And between that time from when I went to church and when I realized I was an atheist, I could have been shown how it made sense and been converted. But no one could do it, because the religion is flawed. It's that plain and that simple.

Now, if you're hell-bent on converting me, please show me something demonstrable, testable, and repeatable that proves the existence of the Christian god or any other god, and I'll listen. Until then, good day.

This is my primary issue. Throw away everything else, write it off however. I don't care, I want to focus on this.

My issue with you here, is that you still view this in black and white objectivity. Religion (BLANKET TERM) is about subjectivity and personal experience that differs from person to person.

Science is for objective fact and demonstrable properties of the universe. Religion is for subjective truth and personal experimentation of properties of the self and soul, as well as the spiritual connection to the universe. SOMETIMES. stupid people try to blend the two to shoot for the goal of Science. It never works.

it fails to work for everyone because it has not provided us any knowledge about our world that we couldn't see with our own eyes.
Tsk, tsk, now there. You're not everyone. How can you tell it didn't work for someone else? (Aside from an atheist like yourself)

Let me tell you something, I am not "hellbent on converting you". What I do want from you is a little respect for the beliefs of others. No assumptions that it is inherently flawed and that we're all making mistakes by believing in something. That's just rude. If you want something that a billion people can watch live on Television that proves the existence of a Deity, you underestimate the intelligence of that deity.

If you want God to come down and say "I EXIST!" you are not going to get it. Because humanity is not prepared for that sort of thing. It would be INSANITY. Atheists scrambling to figure out what the fuck just happened, people of multiple religions fighting worse than they do now to find out which God just said "I EXIST"... If you were God, and you knew you'd royally screw over your children by coming out at the worst possible moment, would you reveal yourself or sit tight and watch until those children can quit their bitchin'?

Until that day, Religion is about personal experience of that deity, and of properties we don't have a grasp of yet. I'm going to tell you something. A few years ago I was in a hellish experience. No friends, only enemies. Depression and suicidal tendencies set in. Psycholo/Psychiatrists and medicine failed to make ANYTHING better for me if not worse. Science didn't save me. Knowing that there was some imbalance in my brain and that something WAS wrong with me... cold hard fact would've only dicked me over even more than my peers were.

What saved me was religion (blanket term). Christianity (the real kind. I don't like Christians but I love Christ. Christians are so unlike Christ >.>), Buddhism, Hinduism, Islam, among others, and the study of them, made me happy. It gave me hope, love, and faith. Showed me how to find a peace of mind, and I was careful to respect the faiths of others. It gave me more things than atheism could EVER have given me.

And now I want you to tell me I am a fucking fool for believing in a God when a God did more than humans could when I was in my darkest state. This was my experience, and guess what? I had more success than you with it! Does that mean I am gonna beat you up over it (verbally of course) and make you convert? HELL NO. What works for you, works for you. You seem happy. What worked for me, works for me. I am happy.

That's the bias I am referring to. You seem to think Religion's inherently flawed and can't give us nice things.

Now, I am not going to be that guy who puts you on block like a little bitch. I am not going to cover my eyes and scream "LALALA". But I want to end this for the sake of unity, to agree to disagree on these matters. I don't want to fight, and I don't want to carry this on longer than it needs to go. NO, not because I am
"running from the truth" don't you even start with that. That is just as zealous and impolite as the religion you seem to hate so strongly.

Have a good day, a better life. God bless. For the record, I'm not Christian. Figure out what my God is.