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A Growler apologist speaks --- Part 3!
16 years ago
General
General Dynamics shill, dlr71mi, has finally replied. In fact, he sent TWO messages (again), which I will combine into one.
Here's me rebuttal...
I meant mortar. I know where the engine comes from.
From another country --- as I said before, a bald-faced violation of the Barry Amendment.
American Growler is NOT a subsidiary of GDLS. And GDLS is not the developer. It's GDOTS. So stay deluded if you wish.
According to MANTA, General Dynamics "Also Does Business As... American Growler";
http://www.manta.com/coms2/dnbcompany_g71kft
They're ALL fronts for General Dynamics. Just like you.
It goes Highway speed.
Yet, the off-road speed mandated by EFSS was watered-down to 5mph --- 1/3 the off-road speed of an M274 Mechanical Mule --- after the Growler failed to move faster.
Nice try at a Red Herring, but CH-53Ks won't be dropping-off their payloads on highways in the middle of a shooting war.
I've driven them.
Citing your "own experiences" is getting old.
A final thought, and I'll make no furthur attempts to educate you, since your mind is made up. I NEVER trust information from an unidentified source. I assume you are bright enough to understand the folly of doing so
The Inspector General, Soldiers For The Truth, and CBS aren't "unidentified sources". Even if they were, that does nothing whatsoever to disprove the findings that one news outlet after another seem to find credible.
I am a retired Marine.
That's an Appeal to Authority Fallacy. It has no bearing on whether or not you are correct, but it does prove that you underestimated my intelligence.
Do you honestly believe the Marines would: 1) Buy a vehicle for $120k that is sold to everyone else for 30k...
Actually, no --- I believe that they would pay $380K for it;
http://defensetech.org/2010/02/02/c.....the-jeep-kind/
2) only goes 15mph...
It only goes 5mph, because the rubber-band requirements conformed to the Growler's impotence.
3) Is made with used parts. (I could go on.)
USA Today says otherwise;
http://www.usatoday.com/news/washin.....rps-jeep_x.htm
If you DID go on, you might have noted that the Growler doesn't pass the GAO's smell test;
http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d09189r.pdf
...nor the DoD Inspector General;
http://www.dodig.mil/Audit/reports/.....-041errata.pdf
What are the dates on the articles you use?
You could have read them.
Have YOU talked to any one that uses this vehicle? Perhaps you should contact the Marines at Camp Lejeune and ask them about its capabilities.Or are you just going to assume the Marines, whos very lives depend on the Growlers, are mis-informed and deluded too.
I *have* talked to Marines on the issue, and they've confirmed my findings --- including a Growler Driver.
What reason would I have to waist my time to write you...
The Reason is fear. That little racket you have going pays too well and the word is out, threatening your nest-egg --- as well as your reputation.
After all, nobody who was involved in development of the A-12, the Sergeant York AA Gun, or the MBT-70 gets bragging rights for it; they all got found-out.
...if I didn't have FIRST hand information? Are you willing to REALLY investigate this? I just told you how.
It's funny how this "first-hand information" doesn't seem to look anything like what EVERYBODY ELSE sees --- or is it that only fools can't see the Emperor's New Clothes?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Growler
http://www.capitaldefense.com/Ameri.....nGrowler.shtml
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Growler_(vehicle)
Note how this page refers to the M151 and that is how the company started.
Wikipedia pages created and edited by persons unknown are a rather weak source, and I predicted days earlier that you would link me to your OWN COMPANY'S website.
So would Enron --- if only they hadn't been caught!
Look, you raise some valid concerns, but if you will listen for a minute, apply a little reason, you'll find a few of said concerns have been addressed.
A little reason dictates that a financial interests in a given product, who denies all independent observations of said product, isn't a trust-worthy source in an analysis of said product --- no more than a fox is a trust-worthy guard for a chicken coop.
Alright folks, as you can see above, dlr71mi followed the following trends that I had predicted;
1- Further denial of failure
4- Repetition of the same claims
5- "You're just plain wrong!"
6- Links to GDLS brochures or press releases
8- A Red Herring
As noted in my previous Journal, * DireWolf505 and * AbleArcher both (accurately) predicted #1 and #4, and * Meyou (accurately) predicted #5 and #5.
Though all 3 of you got it right, Meyou's prediction was most accurate (he predicted TWO Fail Tactics, and got them both right) --- so the free commission goes to Meyou!
Here's me rebuttal...
I meant mortar. I know where the engine comes from.
From another country --- as I said before, a bald-faced violation of the Barry Amendment.
American Growler is NOT a subsidiary of GDLS. And GDLS is not the developer. It's GDOTS. So stay deluded if you wish.
According to MANTA, General Dynamics "Also Does Business As... American Growler";
http://www.manta.com/coms2/dnbcompany_g71kft
They're ALL fronts for General Dynamics. Just like you.
It goes Highway speed.
Yet, the off-road speed mandated by EFSS was watered-down to 5mph --- 1/3 the off-road speed of an M274 Mechanical Mule --- after the Growler failed to move faster.
Nice try at a Red Herring, but CH-53Ks won't be dropping-off their payloads on highways in the middle of a shooting war.
I've driven them.
Citing your "own experiences" is getting old.
A final thought, and I'll make no furthur attempts to educate you, since your mind is made up. I NEVER trust information from an unidentified source. I assume you are bright enough to understand the folly of doing so
The Inspector General, Soldiers For The Truth, and CBS aren't "unidentified sources". Even if they were, that does nothing whatsoever to disprove the findings that one news outlet after another seem to find credible.
I am a retired Marine.
That's an Appeal to Authority Fallacy. It has no bearing on whether or not you are correct, but it does prove that you underestimated my intelligence.
Do you honestly believe the Marines would: 1) Buy a vehicle for $120k that is sold to everyone else for 30k...
Actually, no --- I believe that they would pay $380K for it;
http://defensetech.org/2010/02/02/c.....the-jeep-kind/
2) only goes 15mph...
It only goes 5mph, because the rubber-band requirements conformed to the Growler's impotence.
3) Is made with used parts. (I could go on.)
USA Today says otherwise;
http://www.usatoday.com/news/washin.....rps-jeep_x.htm
If you DID go on, you might have noted that the Growler doesn't pass the GAO's smell test;
http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d09189r.pdf
...nor the DoD Inspector General;
http://www.dodig.mil/Audit/reports/.....-041errata.pdf
What are the dates on the articles you use?
You could have read them.
Have YOU talked to any one that uses this vehicle? Perhaps you should contact the Marines at Camp Lejeune and ask them about its capabilities.Or are you just going to assume the Marines, whos very lives depend on the Growlers, are mis-informed and deluded too.
I *have* talked to Marines on the issue, and they've confirmed my findings --- including a Growler Driver.
What reason would I have to waist my time to write you...
The Reason is fear. That little racket you have going pays too well and the word is out, threatening your nest-egg --- as well as your reputation.
After all, nobody who was involved in development of the A-12, the Sergeant York AA Gun, or the MBT-70 gets bragging rights for it; they all got found-out.
...if I didn't have FIRST hand information? Are you willing to REALLY investigate this? I just told you how.
It's funny how this "first-hand information" doesn't seem to look anything like what EVERYBODY ELSE sees --- or is it that only fools can't see the Emperor's New Clothes?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Growler
http://www.capitaldefense.com/Ameri.....nGrowler.shtml
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Growler_(vehicle)
Note how this page refers to the M151 and that is how the company started.
Wikipedia pages created and edited by persons unknown are a rather weak source, and I predicted days earlier that you would link me to your OWN COMPANY'S website.
So would Enron --- if only they hadn't been caught!
Look, you raise some valid concerns, but if you will listen for a minute, apply a little reason, you'll find a few of said concerns have been addressed.
A little reason dictates that a financial interests in a given product, who denies all independent observations of said product, isn't a trust-worthy source in an analysis of said product --- no more than a fox is a trust-worthy guard for a chicken coop.
Alright folks, as you can see above, dlr71mi followed the following trends that I had predicted;
1- Further denial of failure
4- Repetition of the same claims
5- "You're just plain wrong!"
6- Links to GDLS brochures or press releases
8- A Red Herring
As noted in my previous Journal, * DireWolf505 and * AbleArcher both (accurately) predicted #1 and #4, and * Meyou (accurately) predicted #5 and #5.
Though all 3 of you got it right, Meyou's prediction was most accurate (he predicted TWO Fail Tactics, and got them both right) --- so the free commission goes to Meyou!
dlr71mi is actually clueless enough to BRAG that he was part of the project that built the Growler golf cart;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PBA6j87NkI
Also, check out a new report that's surfaced since I blew the lid on the Growler;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=81NFmOob2mA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YGGg9njci0M
Free is the best kind of awesome!
But on a serious note, I think the marines would stand a better chance running around the battlefield in 20 year old suzuki's than they would in the growler. Especially with talk of an invasion of Iran on the books (At least, thats what the tories are planning, and chances are, they'll be running my country by the end of the year)
As for USMC heli-borne vehicles, it's woth noting that the UDLP and Rae-Beck competitors to EFSS *both* met all requirements, and *both* cost less than $60000.
They also both carried thier mortars on-board with all the ammo required, AND had doors, windows, roofs... and simple armor.
In fact, even the "2-year-old Suzukis" you mention are better-suited for the EFSS role than the Growler. As-is, they already meet every weight, mobility, reliability, and transportability requirements, AND they have more than enough room for 3 Marines, 1 Mortar, and 66 rounds of ammo. Meeting the rest of the requirements wouldn't take much work (if any).
Lastly, for the commission, PM me!
or a complete moron.
After all, he saw an endeavor to strong-arm a Golf Cart made from junk parts into a USMC competition for intended for helicopter-deployable ATVs, and said "Where do I sign up?!".
I also have a creeping suspicion that dlr71mi is the American Growler foreman seen in this CBS news report;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=81NFmOob2mA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YGGg9njci0M
Probably not, but it DOES show you the sort of "moral backbone" typical of General Dynamics management.