Well... It was nice knowing you Freedom!

whats sad is no one saw this coming. the occupy movement and the Protect IP bill had everyone distracted... all the way up till this hit us like a ton of bricks.

A well plaid fake out... and clearly it worked.

I'm sorry I read the legislation but it seems really vague and roundabout to where I can't full understand it.

thats the point Noah, it's vague so that the government can give any meaning they want to it. Letting them impression interrogate and kill anyone they want.

Eh it didn't mention execution. My only concern is with the meaning of on page 362: (1) UNITED STATES CITIZENS.—The requirement to detain a person in military custody under this section does not extend to citizens of the United States.

the bill allows military detention witch can include interrogation and extenuation. it puts the us under "war time" like laws.

I read the section you are regarding and I did not see the word execution anywhere.

It doesn't have to be there Noah. Combined with other laws already in place it becomes fact. If there is a liable threat of a terrorist the military has every right to execute them. this bill gives the government the control to tell the military ho is a terrorist and how they should react to it.

Oh well, America was already a dictatorship and this only reemphasizes it.

also allows the government to legally take out any opposition by labeling them terrorists.

yeah, dictatorship. Or the ancient Alien and Sedetion act.

But still the part about the US Citizens bugs me. It could mean that this detainment can't be done to citizens.

No, it definitely can. If you can't understand it then just trust me when i say it can.

I understand it, but it has two possible meanings, one good and one horrible.

Yeah, we're all fucked now.

Just another reason that America is dead. And why I want to start another country, that is more of a real democracy; because, apparently, even talking to our representatives does not work.

Honestly a Democracy is not what we should do. and no the US has NEVER been a Democracy >.> I hate books that label it as so.. we were a Republic, witch is a more Liberty based system. Democracy is a much more government powered system witch usually is used to describe certain dictatorships.

When I said real democracy, I meant more akin to twhat the Greeks had; An open government where the actual public has direct input on bills in the form of them voting on the bills.

honestly when I think a working Government system i think the Romans who had a true Republic. their republic lasted thousands of years. Greek's were on and off from war mostly.

but honestly it comes down to personal taste. I feel that for a large state culture like the US a Republic would work best. It's not the ONLY solution, just my personal one.

I'm hoping that horrible man gets what's coming to him if this really is what the case will be.

But still.. regardless of how bad this might turn out to be, at least we all have our closest friends and loved ones.

Oh my dear *sigh* a bill is not a law. It must now be reviewed further and voted upon once again, where it will crash and burn like the 1600 other bills we don't hear about annually.

Drewby, this passed congress with a 93-7 vote, it's duct-taped to the national defense budget for next year, if it doesn't pass then we have no budget for the military, and any politician would rather "play it safe" by letting it pass then anything else. honestly the only thing standing in it's way is Obama, and I doubt he'll do anything.

The terrorists have won...

IN a small way. But their goal is still to convert us to Islam or kill us, witch ever comes first. So this "victory" isn't a victory for them.

If anyone gains in this it's the fundamentalist Socialists who's goals have been for years now to rip apart the foundations of the USA so they can rebuild it as a "stable" socialist state. This is the next step for them, as it allows them to aggressively attack and silence anyone who can speak against their goal.

((WARNING: Fennec Goes on a bit of a rant here >w>))

Frankly I haven't found any of this surprising, it's been coming for years now, people just haven't been paying attention. They've been watching so called "news" that seems more interested in what evil things republicans have done recently and "Global Warming" (witch by the way i am sooo fucking tired of hearing about... it's been proven as having been a hoax... a giant fucking money sucking hoax... STOP BUYING INTO IT >_<) or the new name they have given it since "warming" doesn't apply anymore "Climate Change" (a natural occurrence that man kind will, in the long run, have little to no affect on) that they have no idea what has been happening to this country. Ether that or they are so sucked up in the idea of "change" that they have lost sight of what we are changing into.

All signs point to the US failing completely if something isn't done soon. And from the ashes we will become a slave state controlled by people who despise freedom simply because they think they know what is better for those below them. My only response to those people is this, We don't have kings and Queens anymore for a reason. Yes sometimes they can do good and help but the majority of the time they just take from those below them without giving anything back. That's what you'll become, in your own eyes you will be like a god, holding the fates of billions in your hands, but in truth you'll be a devil, ruining lives to continue your reign of terror. Eventually, it might not be in your lifetime or mine, your dream will fall apart, as it has so many times before, because it doesn't work. It has never worked, and it will never work. People will always crave Liberty, and there will always be people who fight for it, die for it, and one day, earn it.

http://www.reddit.com/r/politics/co.....7_subsections/

I'd like to point out that this does not say anything that changes this fact. the section they point out comes after a requirements listings and the wording is that a US citizen CAN be taken into custody without actually meeting said requirements.
And again the bill is written out very vague to the point where military leaders and government leaders can interpret and act on it in any way they see fit.

As for the possibility of it being overturned? Yes it's there. but if it is we loose anyway considering this bill is duct-taped to the back of the military founding for 2012, if it's overturned the military looses a substantial amount of founding and will be incredibly weekend until the congress passes a new founding bill witch could take 6-8 months IF they feel like it.

This opens us up to attack and the possibility on asking other countries for military aid in situations.

Weather this bill passes due process or is overturned we still loose.

You're still being sensationalist, and as much as I want to agree with you, I can't agree with the extreme conclusions you come to from these things.

They aren't extreme, i see them as realistic. This is natural progression following the extremes these groups have gone to already over the years.

So far every little detail of what has been happening was in fact predicted, they are following a KNOWN pattern and sticking to it step by step. I'm not pulling my predictions out of my ass. it's a logical progression based on what they have said and done in the past and the strategies they are using to get what they want.

Everything is explained in detail in two books, both books Obama is KNOWN to have read and in fact taught them in his classes when he was a teacher.

Rules For Radicals
By: Saul Alinsky

The Coming Insurrection
By: Anonymous

Just look up and read these books and you'll see I'm not just pulling this stuff out of my ass, it's written on paper as a valid strategy for collapsing the US system and rebuilding it as they see fit.

When all I hear is such absolute, unwavering distrust in the political system, no matter how warranted, it's extremely difficult to take your fear-mongering seriously. I'm not saying the bill is good, but I am saying that you're not providing a convincing argument by rolling down the slippery slope.

Let's not infer details to obscure the message however you want it to be.

Listen, i'm just giving my opinion, make your own by looking into this and getting all the fact together. if you don't come to the same conclusion as me that's fine, you don't need to.

But honestly I have an expect the worst hope for the best attitude in these situations and the government's recent actions have not helped that at all. In the end all I'm trying to do is get people to actually study these topics to make their own opinions, get them on the right track to seeing the situation around them without the filtered and biased Bull crap the "news" spews out.

I Gave you the names of books that will show you examples of what I'm talking about, if you don't even give them a glance then you are denying yourself the opportunity to open your horizons to ideas you might not agree with, but none the less have a possibility of having an impact on the world.

My goal is only to open as many peoples eyes the the situation around them. This bill wasn't even openly known about until it already passed and that is bull crap. Weather people agree with me or think I'm trying to panic others I only trying to get as many people researching the topics that I passably can, and letting people be informed enough to know where they ACTUALLY stand in this situation.

As I've said before, my goal is freedom over all else, and part of Freedom is choice, and the right to know the facts about your choices. I don't just want to tell people whats happening, i want to get them interested enough to look it up themselves and make an educated opinion, weather it's in my favor or against it.

Also your argument would make seance if the government currently cared about the civilians, but as i see from the Protect IP and this bill along with many choices directly against public opinion they have made, I honestly think none of them give a shit.