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About "Cheap" Art
13 years ago
For most of my internet viewing, I use firefox because it has a very lovely ad-blocker that I am quite fond of, however, when I brows FA, I like to do so with the ad-block disabled. Normally ads drive me insane and I would probably give up on the internet if I had to constantly deal with them, but FA ads are different. Ads posted by the community for the community with relevance to the community. It's quite nice and I love seeing what people I might have never noticed otherwise are doing.
Unfortunately, there is something in these ads I see quite commonly that drive me just as nutter butters as the Lysol cleaning supply video ads and that is this statement: "Cheap Art".
Artists do not lead easy lives and for the most part, there is very little respect to be had for us out in the world. "You like doing it so why don't you do it for free?" "Why are you charging so much? you're doing it for fun" "artist Y's art is so not worth what they're charging" etc etc etc. I will never be able to quite figure out why this mentality seems to apply exclusively to artists. No one in their right mind would ask some stranger to make an 8-30 hour delivery and expect to pay them dick all because they "love driving". I could write an entire essay on why I want to slap people who value an artist's years of work and training and study on a rare and unique skill's at $2/h because "art is fun" but this argument has been made before by people much smarter than I and I am sure you are all familiar with it. This journal is not about that, but I bring it up because this mentality and expectation carries over to young and inexperienced artists. The idea that their art will only be desirable if it's "cheap".
Artists, particularly young and amateur artists who don't quite understand the value of their craft or who genuinely are doing this for some fun and attention make up a very large amount of people here on FA. And yes, I am willing to concede that while there are a few around, people taking commissions on this site are not professional artists, not making their living on their art and are not looking to do so. Fine, I get that, I was there once too and I was also once charging $10 for a full colour picture. But I never advertised myself as "Cheap".
Are you selling cheap art? Is your art cheap? Is your art "of little account; of small value; mean; shoddy: cheap conduct; cheap workmanship." [dictionary] because if it is, that's really disappointing that you would take so little pride in your craft and have so little respect for your customers to be comfortable giving them something "cheap". No. Stop. Before you reach for your comment box with the argument "oh but Red, they mean "inexpensive!" and "affordable!". I know that's what they mean, but that is not what they are saying. While cheap can also technically mean these things, the word "cheap" is not read without the connotation of what most of us understand "Cheap" things to be. It's bad enough that non-artists are already implying that our craft is without worth or value, do we really need to be doing it ourselves? Even the most amateur work has love and time and effort. These efforts are not "Cheap".
Here is a short list of words that could easily be used without the implication that your artwork is without value: Affordable, inexpensive, modestly priced, conservatively priced.
Here is a short list of words that demean and devalue your work and craft: Cheap, bargain, discount
You can be inexpensive and still be quality. When you're selling yourself, don't imply that your artwork belongs in some cheap bargain bin. It is up to every artist to decide what their time is worth to them, but it is demeaning to artists everywhere when an artist decides that their craft is "cheap".
Unfortunately, there is something in these ads I see quite commonly that drive me just as nutter butters as the Lysol cleaning supply video ads and that is this statement: "Cheap Art".
Artists do not lead easy lives and for the most part, there is very little respect to be had for us out in the world. "You like doing it so why don't you do it for free?" "Why are you charging so much? you're doing it for fun" "artist Y's art is so not worth what they're charging" etc etc etc. I will never be able to quite figure out why this mentality seems to apply exclusively to artists. No one in their right mind would ask some stranger to make an 8-30 hour delivery and expect to pay them dick all because they "love driving". I could write an entire essay on why I want to slap people who value an artist's years of work and training and study on a rare and unique skill's at $2/h because "art is fun" but this argument has been made before by people much smarter than I and I am sure you are all familiar with it. This journal is not about that, but I bring it up because this mentality and expectation carries over to young and inexperienced artists. The idea that their art will only be desirable if it's "cheap".
Artists, particularly young and amateur artists who don't quite understand the value of their craft or who genuinely are doing this for some fun and attention make up a very large amount of people here on FA. And yes, I am willing to concede that while there are a few around, people taking commissions on this site are not professional artists, not making their living on their art and are not looking to do so. Fine, I get that, I was there once too and I was also once charging $10 for a full colour picture. But I never advertised myself as "Cheap".
Are you selling cheap art? Is your art cheap? Is your art "of little account; of small value; mean; shoddy: cheap conduct; cheap workmanship." [dictionary] because if it is, that's really disappointing that you would take so little pride in your craft and have so little respect for your customers to be comfortable giving them something "cheap". No. Stop. Before you reach for your comment box with the argument "oh but Red, they mean "inexpensive!" and "affordable!". I know that's what they mean, but that is not what they are saying. While cheap can also technically mean these things, the word "cheap" is not read without the connotation of what most of us understand "Cheap" things to be. It's bad enough that non-artists are already implying that our craft is without worth or value, do we really need to be doing it ourselves? Even the most amateur work has love and time and effort. These efforts are not "Cheap".
Here is a short list of words that could easily be used without the implication that your artwork is without value: Affordable, inexpensive, modestly priced, conservatively priced.
Here is a short list of words that demean and devalue your work and craft: Cheap, bargain, discount
You can be inexpensive and still be quality. When you're selling yourself, don't imply that your artwork belongs in some cheap bargain bin. It is up to every artist to decide what their time is worth to them, but it is demeaning to artists everywhere when an artist decides that their craft is "cheap".
TO FAVE THIS JOURNAL.
thank you for posting this
When I have to do those "inexpensive" drawings I keep minimum wage in mind. This requires me to know myself as an artist too. I can do X amount of drawings it X amount of time.
I'm willing to work X amount of hours today so I should charge $X to make the desired amount. Its a little bit of math but overall it keeps me from burning out too fast
and doesn't over charge people for the quicker more rough work I can produce.
One time I had to do sketches insanely below my typical price out of desperation for rent money. Someone came up to me and said "yay! an artist that doesn't over charge!"
I was working at about 2$ an hour. To me it was a huge slap in the face.
Any specialised job, in my eyes, should be getting it's well earned £10/hour for the work.
Especially when someone has a unique style, or some form of highly original flare!
I consider my art cheap. But I base that assessment on that exact definition you gave up there, not under the pretense of inexpensiveness. I love what I do, and I work really hard at it, but value is determined by the market, and the market has valued my art at little to nothing. It is "of little account" and "of small value", because nobody wants it. It is "shoddy", too, because compared to more experienced artists my work is trash.
People see a difference between "cheap" art and art with worth and value. More experienced and esteemed artists fall into the latter category, but those of us who are meager peons are pretty much forced into the former category if we want anyone to commission us. The market forces us to value ourselves in such a manner, because there are so many artists better than us.
And before someone replies to this with "oh, but all art is of equal value as long as you're putting your heart into it!" well yeah, in a lofty metaphorical sense of value that's true. But not in the reality of the market.
No, you don't. A list of alternate words was given in this journal. You can price your art the same way you did before ("cheap"), but ADVERTISE it as "modestly priced" or "inexpensive" instead of using the word "cheap". That's what this journal is about: Marketing and how others perceive your art based on the words you've chosen. Your pricing can still be the same, just use better words to describe it, that's all. :)
But I totally agree with the message of this journal. :| Underselling your art devalues you and everyone else competing against you, and disrespects yourself.
"Look getting a bargain shirt" - a cheap shirt
Art is one of those professions that you do because you love, and a lot of people love it. The fact that it's enjoyable doesn't make it less valuable. It SHOULD be valued highly! It's the fact that /so many/ people love it and want to make it a source of income that means the price of art will bottom out.
Just my thoughts.
This isn't a situation where 5 stores are selling the same product and trying to undersell each other, despite artists who don't know better treating it that way. Everyone offers something different and what it's worth isn't valued according to what someone else with a different set of specialties and skills offers.
I should qualify my argument to apply solely to the internet/fandom. The customers I envisioned aren't individuals or companies that intend to use the artwork commercially or as a part of a commercial project/development, but rather private commissioners that would like art for their limited, personal use. I'm not disputing the point that the rate for the two different usage-levels should be the same, but rather that the two groups are probably fundamentally different on the type of money that they are willing to spend based on what they plan on doing with it-- although this may not always be the case. Thus the differing price ranges.
Now, if you mean to argue that people should expect to pay the same amount for a piece that they want to make into sig images and avatars/icons (but nothing commercial) as for work done as part of a commercial venture where of course they would also be buying the rights to use the image in some capacity for monetary gain... I'm not sure that I can agree with that.
Valuing your art, and charging a fair price for it isnt stingy or greedy, its fair, and show self respect.
I know there's a lot of high bidders/buyers on FA but they don't make the whole community and how many rich folk do you know willing to pay for furry art? :I
I agree artists should be treated better but there's a line to draw when it comes to how much you can charge for your talent, time, and quality. Just like any other product, it's about who you're trying to sell to.
What if the people who are charging less for more quality work, are underselling?
I have a friend who draws much better than me, but she thinks I over charge.
While I'm just making $10 an hour.
Her work is certainly worth more than what she sells it for, but she doesn't charge more.
Does that make my work worth less because they don't want to charge more than me?
Just something to think about.
All I've got ask about are good friends who can't help but say, "It's GOOD, charge MORE!" Touching, sure, but far from unbiased. xwx
Seriously. Since when did loving what you do and/or having fun while doing it make it less of a job and therefore less of a paycheck? Oh wait *looks at society in general, and all the b.s. about things being "easier" these days and "cheaper"... right yeah nothing's cheap if you're poor. Or are you poor because your bosses are cheap? hm.*
I seriously hate how art is the super-bitch of the work world - while some folks will pull that bullshit "art's value is individual" cock, no one would argue that a house painter should make min wage. Min wage isn't a living wage even! But no one would argue taking that away from them, but for some magic reason people start acting like your skill and such matters as if you were an actor looking for a specific role (oh wait they get min wages too...) if you're an artist. What's the difference in painting a canvas vs. a wall or drilling holes into sheet metal vs cutting out paper shapes or constructing a business plan vs blocking out a composition? Nothing according to the clock : time still spent.
If you ever want to get a good perspective on how badly the artists of the world get it sometimes, check out ClientsFromHell - Many, many artists getting stiffed money wise even if the arrangement is met because "you're an artist" (seriously, CEOs have said that.).
I think people just don't know how to price art, nor do they know how to market themselves beyond describing their prices :(
should i ever solely do freelance, my prices will most likely go up.
I find that a lot of people are speculative of time-based payments, though, because who's to say that the artist isn't charging you for 5 hours of work when they only did 2? I feel like it's the most fair way to charge, and be paid, for art, but because there are people who would abuse it, it is understandably less popular.
This journal sounds like it's written under the assumption that:
1.) Every piece of art is a deep abstract work of beauty that the artist poured their soul into and/or worked hard on.
2.) That everything an artist draws is something they've done out of love or for the enjoyment of the activity.
Some people just doodle for fun or because they are bored. Some people just draw for money. Some people HATE doing commissions. Some people don't see art as a particularly difficult, special, or serious thing.
and there is nothing wrong with any of that.
It's their artwork, and they are going to feel however they want about it.
and it may upset you to see such 'talent' and 'hard work' be 'wasted' or treated like such a worthless thing, but
it's not really any of your business.. to put it bluntly.
That being said, this journal is still plenty relevant to those who are looking for actual careers in art or who take art seriously.
But please don't assume that all 'artists' consider themselves as such and don't in fact just need the money.
And no, this journal isn't assuming or even stating that everyone's work is deep or that everyone does what they do because they love it (hence the constant use of qualifiers such as "most people" and "often". This isn't at all the point or the message of this journal. There ARE people out there selling "cheap" art, but most of the people who advertise themselves as such, arn't doing it because they're trying to produce something they know is shaudy and fast. in fact, the people who ARE doing this are very careful not to allude to the fact that they are doing it because it's bad salesmanship.
This journal isn't really relevant for those who want to make careers in art, this would be a very different journal if it was. This journal is actually very pointedly about and for people who aren't looking for careers in art, who aren't charging career or even minimum wages for their work and who don't want to.
That might not be your intention, but there it is.
and I consider a 'career' to be anything you do regularly over a decent period of time to make money. Including commissions. Whether it's $90 an hour as a hired engineer or $1 a day as a self employed obscure commission taker. So when I said that your journal is relevant to those looking for a career in art, that's exactly what I meant.
But besides all that,
The art market is saturated. It's pretty obvious. Everyone and their mother does something 'artistic' nowadays. painting, drawing, sculpting, knitting, making music, baking, writing, performing, you name it. It's very rare I meet someone who doesn't have some form of artistic talent, hobby, what have you. And you can't expect everyone to make bukus of cash in that kind of high competitive market. Welcome to the world of capitalism.
Call it 'a lack of integrity' or say it's 'demeaning to artists everywhere' all you want.
But no matter how you look at it, it's a great way to get sales and be noticed. It's a very common tactic in business. The artist has to decide how badly they want/need the money. Would they rather wait a very long time and MAYBE EVENTUALLY get a $30 an hour commission? Or would they rather sell "cheap" art?
Just like you said, It's up to them what they make. and likewise, up to them HOW they make it. (as long as it's not something illegal, obviously.) The public reacts to the words 'cheap', 'bargain', and 'discount'. They don't care what the dictionary has to say. The end.
I'm sorry if it makes you "nutter butters" and you find this all very upsetting, but again, it doesn't really have anything to do with you. That's their way of manipulating the market. There's nothing wrong about it or right about it. It is what it is.
I'm sorry, but I don't really give a shit what you consider a career to be. I could consider an apple to be an orange, it's not going to make it so. When I was 16 I walked my neighbors dog on occasion and she paid me $5/walk to do it. it was not my career. People doing art for $1/hour are NOT supporting themselves on this unless they live at home with mom or are somehow living in a grass hut with an internet connection and electricity. The only relevance that this journal has at all to making an actual go at an artistic career is how to market yourself better by not calling your art "cheep". This is not some obscure brand of elitism, this is the real world and the first thing ANYONE with two brain cells to rub together and any experience in the art world will tell you.
I don't know where this myth that the art market is saturated comes from, aside from tunnel vision and ignorance, but I can tell you don't work in the real world. Saying some people with no training who's work is far from qualifying them from making art into a career (in the sense that the word actually means, not in the sense that you "consider" it to mean) is saturating the art market is like telling a professional landscape artist that some kids with their father's lawn mower doing their neighbors yard is saturating their market. It's just obviously not true, but people seem to think that art is some magical world that exists outside of the standards of any other job. You get what you pay for. When a gaming company comes to me and pays me money to design characters and paint art for them, they do it because I'm the person suited for the job, not because I was charging less than grandma who does needlepoint in her spare time and occasionally sells it at the county fair.
I also love you telling me what I'm calling things I'm not talking about. If my mechanic tries to fix my car by plugging a leak with bubble gum instead of ordering in the proper parts and installing them for me because he doesn't like his job, I don't think anyone is going to argue when I say that he lacks integrity as a mechanic. Except maybe you.
Or maybe what you're talking about isn't really relevant to what's been said here at all and you just want to talk about what you want to talk about, which is fair enough I guess but that's what your own journals are for.
I try to explain to you what I mean by "career" so you can understand. And instead of going "oh, YOU meant people who take commissions." You rant and rave about how it's NOT a career, YOU don't think it's a career in YOUR opinion, you walked dogs and didn't consider THAT a career, and how most people can't support themselves on $1 an hour unless they live with their mom or in a hut yadda yadda.
"People doing art for $1/hour are NOT supporting themselves on this unless they live at home with mom or are somehow living in a grass hut with an internet connection and electricity."
Okay so if someone is living with their mom rent free and makes a $1 an hour THEN is it a career? What?
So according to you, whether something is a career or not depends on your living condition. A "Career" is a job that supports you in your current living conditions.
So someone making $1000000 a month as a degree carrying professional that happens to have $1000000000000 a month to pay in bills isn't supporting themselves, and therefore doesn't have a 'real' career.
Um okay.
"The only relevance that this journal has at all to making an actual go at an artistic career is how to market yourself better by not calling your art "cheep"."
AND THAT'S EXACTLY THE RELEVANCE I WAS TALKING ABOUT LMAO.
First you tell me it doesn't have relevance to people with careers in art and that I am wrong.
and then you say "oh well the ONLY relevance is this:" the exact thing I was talking about.
Are you really just that intent on disagreeing with everything I say?
"I don't know where this myth that the art market is saturated comes from-"
HAHA OKAY STOP RIGHT THERE.....
Every year, More students major in visual, culinary or performing arts than in computer science, math, and chemical engineering COMBINED.
It's pretty clear that you don't care what anyone else has to say unless they are agreeing with you.
In case you were wondering what I meant by "sounds elitist"... yeah. That would be it.
-TG
NOT practical in today's freelance market -- graphic design or illustration-wise. And I'm not talking about the furry fandom (although I suspect 95% of the fandom would fall over if people charged what's recommended in that book...or we'd have some very rich artists!).
I work as a freelance graphic designer for an independently-owned company in the midwest. I ask what's fair for the market, which sadly is not anywhere near what the Guild suggests. That book, however, gave me the guts to quit my last job (doing the same thing for a different company) because when I consulted my then-boss with the numbers, I basically got laughed at.
Being an artist or graphic designer, whether you love it or not, is a career where you're judged more by how much you can put up with (emotionally AND economically) than your skills...at least, in my experience. And again, not even talking about the fandom. Heck, my experience with commissions in the fandom has been WAY better than my actual life career-related stuff.
The Guild book IS a great guide for not getting screwed over (the "ethics" bit it goes into), though -- I agree!
Oh and also, there are people that work just as hard making Lysol and those ads are instrumental in keeping their jobs relevant.
Also, I mute the TV when commercials come on. All of those businesses, down the toilets.
I've heard ONLY A HANDFULL of artists who agree wholeheartedly (for the most part) with what you've posted just now. I cannot agree more, and it drives me insane, as well.
Could not have been better said, and as much as I'd love to rant and rave to those who don't understand, I'd rather just link to this journal you've posted.
I hope the online artist community+art appreciators+society as a whole, realizes this "cheap art" issue.. perhaps in the future, we can better understand that we[artists] are people who work hard, just like any joe-schmo at Walmart, and should be treated fairly and properly, with the professionalism we provide. Whether we do this for a living or not ;)
So sure, I'll grab a good deal if I can, but I'm not going to bitch if I see somebody charging 60+ for a good product.
I will say though that this does NOT apply only to artists. What do you think video game beta testers are? They are QA that's not getting paid for the job because they enjoy what they are doing.
<--- works in QA
My bad for not reading all the way through before posting, BUT my point about the industry does still stand lol
This is so ture.
I totally agree with all of this.
I had someone tell me 'but that's too expensive' or 'I don't believe in by the hour for art' and I was like 'then I suppose you are against earning hourly at your job then, perhaps you should work for 5 dollars for a whole day' and got 'oh.. but I couldn't live on that' and I replied with 'Exactly. If you want someone who doesn't have time, care, love and labour put into their WORK and passion, then I am sure you'll find many looking to make a fast buck, I however am not.'
I mean I can use the money, but I feel I'm worth more then 10 or 20 dollars for an entire job that takes me an average of 8-10 hours to complete -.-; That don't pay real world bills.
I read comments about markets being saturated.. and I also agree that that is again FALSE. It's an ART site which attracts artists and people wanting their visions and/or fantasies put to life. If people wish for my quality or style, they will pay what I am worth neh?..
I approve big time of your original post.