like
rape allegations and FA staff protecting said rapist?

Though I dont understand how leaving FA fixes this situation at all?

because it implies that you're okay with sexual assault & abuse. continuing to use the site (once the project phoenix thing goes live) with full knowledge of zaush's history and behaviour falls under rape apologist behaviour which a lot of people (myself included) are not okay with.

leaving FA doesn't fix the situation by a long shot but it is an act that stands in solidarity with people who have been on the receiving end of such assault, which is extremely important.

My main question is why it's just now blown up. We've known Zaush is kind of a rapist and that Dragoneer covered up for him for literally years now (from when the note system got hacked and posted onward). I'm glad people are wising up, but we're pretty much in the "too little too late" with how much of the fandom's content and network we've allowed Neer to hold. This is interesting, though; we haven't seen a shift like this since the dA/SA/yG stuff almost a decade ago.

mostly because he wasn't directly working on the site until now. it's the nod of approval that nobody wanted to see.

Zaush wasn't, but Neer was (obviously). And he encouraged a rape victim not to go to the police. And most of FA ignored it when it came out. So I'm laughing at how idignant everyone is getting now; no one pays fucking attention, because if they did, they would have been done with FA years ago.

a lot of people were done with fa a few years ago. additionally, the crowd leaving now likely contains people who didn't leave back then due to being ignorant / uninformed on these kinds of matters, using myself as an example. rape culture sucks.

there also wasn't an alternative that many people wanted to use. Inkbunny was the "big thing" to jump to, but has the cubporn stigma attached to it. With Weaysl being a not-crappy alternative that's why people are jumping ship now.

that's an apt comparison to make, well done

Even without being at FC I'm clueless, some drama as usual but no idea which one

Because this - http://aspidelaps.tumblr.com/post/73550059208

Wow I cannot believe that... Makes me almost wanna slap myself for just having made an account here... This is bad!

though I'm agree with Dragoneer in the point on where the affected person should contact the proper authorities, more if she was "raped" if she's not contacting a cop it's either she's too stupid or she want to fuck people's minds, now then, if people KNOW that Zaush is a sexual predator why the fuck people look for him? oh let me guess, so he can be called a rapist, right? now if she tried to get away and he didn't get it from the start why the hell she didn't called for help? I think she has friends and she can call police to action, not just let him have his way on her and then shit storm on a person.

all a site admin can do is:
do you have proof?
visual proof?
do you have a way to say that he indeed raped you?
did you call for friends or police?
did you tried to get away?
did you call the staff on the con?
what you did?

and I think I'm missing many questions, but if she didn't do anything and just said yes but in her mind she was thinking "I don't wanna do it" I can't count that as rape if she just let it happen, unless she got drunk with the sexual predator, but that sounds irresponsible on her part.

or I'm mistaken? for the most part, I don't know how law works in the US, and I don't know how accurate is law and order series, but I think that it's the way you should act regardless the country (unless you are in mexico where if a female is raped is because she is female and males just can't stop their hormones!)

the jews just let the holocaust happen so they must have wanted it!

religion? if you are talking about Hitler, you can blame http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Academ.....ne_Arts_Vienna for that oh hey, maybe every artist is a little Hitler or a sexual predator or a psychopathic or rapist, every artist should be jailed because they draw!

uh

Yup . completely missed the point.

sad really.

You're missing the point.

You're basically saying that rape is ok if the victim doesn't alert the authorities.

You DO realise that going up to complete strangers and telling them that you're been force-fucked by another person is not exactly EASY?!

Victim blaming is retarded and absolutely wrong.

for the size this shit is already she could have told the police already, I'm not saying it's ok, it's retarded to not to call the police and make them do their work

I don't know either zaush and the victim, all I know is:
zaush is a pushy person and for what I hears she's a very small female
she's not calling proper authorities to solve her situation (you know that there's female cops, right?)
she, the victim is pointing out someone and calling him rapist "in the open" (or it was information leak?)
she seems to think that FA staff are cops in real life
(am I missing something?)

tell me how calling a person raper solves anything.
I know it's not easy to go to the police and say that someone is a rapist

if I'm blaming the victim is for not going to the police that is also wrong
what is she doing? crying on a corner? grinning at all this situation? talking to a cop?
I have no way to know what she say is true or false, I wasn't there and I assume you where not there either

tell me how pointing people will solve anything if the authorities are not investigating what's going on?
tell me how leaving fa will solve her situation?

do you have suggestions to solve this?

The word is rapist. Btw.

A rapper is someone who says stuff about hoes over repetitive music.

The fact is you're completely missing the point. People are pissed because not only is FA using a suspected rapist as a major figure on staff, but

1- they try to make excuses for the possible rape. Literally infering that being forceful agajnst someone in a sex act when they repeatedly say no is not necessarily rape (yes it is).

2- they ban or block anybody who disagrees with the situation openly.


This is fucked up and honestly, extremely unprofessional.

ugh, I keep typing that wrong...

I'm agree with you with those points

They didn't believe it would happen at first. Then when it was happening, many of them didn't know. When they figured out that it was happening, those that could do something about it did.

The two situations aren't the same at all.

it's a fucking analogy, don't be a pedant

You're putting the cart before the horse. It's awfully different.

pedantic sophistry, you know exactly what i mean you mongrel
here let's make it smaller than
an individual jew is forced into a gas chamber. they don't resist. they must have wanted it to happen.

It remains that they still have no course of action afterwards. But that's not to say that society didn't prosecute the Nazis, but they did so only because it was known that the Nazis had acted in a criminal matter.

omg you are really hung up on the analogy here
i can write an explanation of what they are and how they are used to illustrate a point but that would be incredibly condescending & i don't feel like it so like just never mind, bye

errybody getting mad

aint nobody know what the fuck is goin on

also the analogy here is that the holocaust never happened and neither did this rape. one time i got mugged though first thing i did was waited till the dudes mugging me got popular on some shitty animal people site then used that to harm their credibility and stir up a shit storm.

dogs will bark huh

That's all you really had, and it didn't really explain your point well, so if you do have more to say on the subject I think it'd be helpful for you to actually say that, despite your condescension, you've already got that covered.

go polish your guns

Whups, my mistake. Thought maybe you had something insightful to say about the subject.

Aaand now you've blocked me, as if to confirm that you actually have nothing to say at all.

"do you have proof?
visual proof?"

Seriously, dude?

I heard worse, believe me... how can you be certain that someone is a raper just with words? how I know you are or not a raper? with someone's words? sure, let's go and burn witches! let's just point people and burn them because we think they are rapers and witches all the like

The term is "rapist".

I'd agree if people wanted to throw him in jail. In order to do that one needs no reasonable doubt. But a lot less evidence is required to remove him from a professional position.

Witches don't exist, by the way. Rapists do.

oh, thank you for correction.

and that would be the right thing if he indeed raped her, for what I know... police should be the ones investigating

and how you know they don't?

Dude. Seriously?!

can you solve it? I'm all ears

I acknowledge that there are problems with Zaush and Dragoneer, and that the law should be involved in cases of rape. From on objective standpoint, this is a poor decision for PR and speaks ill of 'neer. However, it's hard to side with the people who are repeatedly attacking those two with lies and hostility. The actual events (sexual predation and the hiring of someone known to harass and victimize others) really do need to be called out, but the methods and manners shown here are pretty atrocious. The same thing is going on with Ren and Futret, right now. People are being vicious and hateful, well beyond an actual pursuit of justice and awareness.

Anyway, I'm glad more folks are moving to Weasyl, primarily because I think the site has a better design and Inkbunny became just "the cub place".

It's kind of a mess.

(X)

hello quote wall


goodbye context

Yeah. That post wasn't the first thing I saw on this whole dilemma, so it made a bit more sense.

Basically a lot of people are upset that zaush/Adam Wan is handling the update of FA "project Phoenix" after a woman brought a rape allegation on him. but never called the police or anything.

Oh yeah that rape thing was a while back so I was wondering why it was being brought up now... Now I know Ty!

Because Final Fantasy 6 got released on android.

Android's always had emulators donchaknow.
also this comment made me snort uncomfortably hard

I think he's referring to the horrendously bad official port....D:

I know :3c I just wanted to direct people towards better options

That's truly horrifying.

Aside from what the above mentioned, the admins went rampaging through basically every single journal talking about the topic and removing comments/journals that were giving more than vague information, including several bans.

i.e. people also are leaving due to the heavy censorship the FA staff is doing in order to cover up the controversy, though it's lead to a Streisand effect.

Here's the thing in question...was he convicted? This isn't a guilty until proven innocent place, the United States (where the servers are based), or at least it's not supposed to be. It's innocent until proven guilty. People spread rumors that we do not know 100% for certain are true, and people will call somebody guilty, even if it's proven they didn't do it at all. It's best to stop that problem before it rears its ugly head. This is coming from somebody who has moderated a site before in the past and had a similar incident.

Here's the thing in question ... why put somebody who you KNOW is going to be controversial into a position of power? It's a really bad decision for several reasons.

Whether the rumors are true or not, it's guaranteed that it will cause controversy by putting that person into front and center of the community. This selection shows that the administration clearly favors one side of this debate, over something that hasn't been proven or disproven on either side.

It also sends a shitty message to the community, since those who are openly criticizing it or even just provide information are getting silenced and banned, even though they should have the right to be concerned.

I never would've picked a controversial personality to be put into a position of power, especially not on a site as big as FurAffinity, where administrative decisions such as this one affect the majority of the community it was built for.

I would agree with you, but real life has proven that the majority of the masses do not give a flying fuck in the long run how controversial a person is going to be. Case in point, most of the politicians in power in the US. This is nothing new for real life or online, so it feels pretty stupid that people are getting in an uproar and wanting to leave the site over this. You don't see people leaving their states or countries over something like this, why should it be the same online? Until there is a gross abuse of power, this is not site breaking controversy.

On the other hand I don't see why Adam should be shunned because of an allogation. In her own Journal she stated she consented then spent the rest of the weekend with him. She drove 3 hours to be with him and could have left at any time. She never went to the police because I suspect she knew she had nothing to give them. I think Adam called it when he said she made a bad decision and instead of dealing with it, decided to cry rape.

So now journals are going around bashing Adam with no police record or any evidence except hearsay. If I were an admin I would also ban the posts and possibly the posters. Suporting and propogating 'guilty till proven innocent' is wrong'.

The last Pope wasn't convicted for War hate crimes and yet was in Hitler youth.

The fact he didn't get any sentence for it doesn't change it.

Your argument is thus invalid.

A rapist is a rapist . ESPECIALLY WHEN THEY ADMIT TO IT THEMSELVES!

Then here's a question, have you left your state, country, county, or district because somebody convicted of a crime is in power? If your answer is no, then you're nothing more than a hypocrite. If you don't do this irl, you don't do it online. Besides, has he abused his power to ban people he doesn't like, has he used his admin powers to find the addresses of people and harassed them, etc? If the answer is no, he has done nothing worthy of getting kicked out of his job as admin.

how does that make ME a hypocrite?! It's not like a have complete control over who's in power !

BINGO! So how do you think that leaving the site will help get a person out of power? It will not.

Maybe , but at least I won't passively condone these decisions by using the website.

And no , not bingo . your logic is extremely flawed.

I'm actually aware it is, but sadly it's less flawed then the logic of those leaving the site over this. Until he starts abusing his power as an admin, there's really no real reason for him to be fired or step down. Also, I hate defending such a douche like Zaush, but we need some actual logic around here when it comes for calls for him to step down and for people leaving the site.

its all a bunch of stupid shit and people with Tumblr Syndrome lol

This isn't a place to argue I just simply wanted to know the reason people are leaving. Take it somewhere else.

Apologies, I was in the middle of writing the comment I made before you posted. I will refrain from discussing the matter.

well this is a quite big thing I wasn't aware of....I thought people were leaving mostly cuz the servers are "crappy" in comparison to other sites and just got fed up with it, specially since around last month where the whole site crashed for what, 10 days? guess I was horribly wrong

Some person supposedly did a thing or said a thing at some time in history, so everyone is going all Oprah because their lives are so lame it becomes the only way for them to get excited.

The real shit isn't the alleged 'rape' which from my understanding wasn't an actual rape(but was a sexual assault which is no better) and also which the victim of didn't make public. It's that combined with the constant promises of a site rebuild for years, all of which have stalled out and gone nowhere while the site has constant stability issues, hacking problems, and shitty coding.

Putting someone with controversy surrounding them in charge is just the cherry on top of the shitstorm cake. And some people are concerned with the fact this guy is gonna have access to whatever personal info they might communicate through notes on here...

Some people are more reactionary, like 'omg he's a rapist burn him i'm leaving' but a lot of people also seem to be pretty disstisfied with dragoneer being a poot over the years and it's culminating.

So yeah, that's a bit more of a concise rundown I guess?

i think it's great, because the more the people on this site realize it is not the only and certainly not the fucking best furry art site the better other sites will get and more new ones will probably come along and this mess will languish and 'neer will be angry wondering what happened :U

yeah.

George Bush done cocaine... IMA LEAVIN' EMURICA!!!!!!! >="O

^ Truth.

I don't know myself.

people is nuts and loose their heads with just words, aparently

The problem here is not what Zaush did or did not. The problem is that people that talk crap about him are getting banned.

if talking crap of anyone solved something... man the shit that would be solved by now, isn't it?

Bitching about anything is a part of the fandom. If you start banning bitchers, the site would be quite empty.

sadly this is true :|

People have different levels of tolerance for certain behaviour. Back in 2009, the admins went ban happy because the servers went down from a weather-related outage, but accusations that hackers took it down and speculation about the massive bans caused more bans, etc. In 2010, underage porn art was banned. When FA merged with Furocity in 2011, admin were brought on board from Furocity and FA admin lost their positions without warning, which caused drama then. There have been numerous other issues with former admin, WolfBlade, Chase/Carmen, Scriggles, etc. that have caused people to leave as well. Each time things happen, people leave. And then some come back years later, or new faces show up. This migration of users is not unique to FA, only the reasons are.

This never has been a perfect website, and it is being run by people who are not and never will be perfect. Each time something different happens, people will leave. It has happened before and always will happen.

Thing is, I've heard people can't even talk about it. They'd often get their comments erased and banned from the site.

I don't even know really.

Is it just me or is this way old news?

Why are people kicking a dead horse

because he didn't have a position of authority before

Because he wasn't on staff before and because people weren't getting banned over talking about it.

Wasn't aware of that, thanks for the clarification.

*resume outrage

yet no one blows up at furs on here who post rape pictures, that seems a bit hypocritical

I've been so out of the loop. I honestly thought it was because FA had that huge blackout a while back.

This whole rape thing was news to me. How revolting.