And wasn't Starfox 64 sort of a remake of the first game anyway? So are we remaking remakes?

It is, actually. And SF64 already had a remake on 3DS. So....I find this shit kind of pointless.

Now I'm kinda glad I've ignored the game this whole time. XD

Oh believe me, the N64 game is pretty damn good and addictive....I just find it pointless to remake it over and over again.

Yeah, I remember sorta liking it back in the day, but it was nothing more than a rental for me. I want a new F-Zero way more than a new Starfox.

Actually thought this was completely Star Fox 2 but added a ton more features and remade sections cause they kept the other characters from SF2 but remade them to not show any similarities. Though the one thing they didn't add was the Real Time part where you have to move your ship around the Lylat System and defend Corneria while trying to reach Venom and defeat Andross. All I'm gonna say is this looks fun still but it still leaves questions to be answered.

It's Starfox 2, only released. What's the problem?

Starfox Command was the remake of Starfox 2, done by the original devs of Starfox 2.

It's amazing how badly they messed that up.

Oh dear lord. I never knew that.
And that's what almost killed off the franchise.

Yeah. Remember, the primary mechanics of Starfox 2 were the map system and the multiple playable characters, which were brought over to Command. Also, remember, Command was highly reviewed at the time, and got higher marks from critics and magazines than Starfox Assault due to "not having a ground portion."

Also remember that when people criticized the writing in Command, Dylan Cuthbert (the lead dev) said that "People care too much about these stupid furries."

So here we are, ten years later, finally getting a new star fox game that isn't just a graphical update, even if it is a reboot.

With Platinum, the game is in good hands. Platinum knows what they're doing, that team has handled a lot of great games and they love Star Fox. The direction seems more solid than the redone lines in 64 3D, and for anyone worried about Krystal, they've already said they'll put her in the next game if they get to do another one. Krystal would have been 11 at the time of Andross's invasion anyways, and was not even in the Lylat system at the time.

Yeah, it does. Plus the regress on the team roster and the little attention it's been getting and the pushed back dates... I'm not even really a fan of the designs they've chosen.

Its the Starfox 2 we always wanted.

I sure even when released they are gonna keep this game place in the chronology ambiguous

During E3 interviews last year, I believe it was stated as being a "reimagining" of the original Star Fox game, so yeah, it's just a fancy way of calling it some kind of remake while not doing everything the same way. For all the people saying it's "Star Fox 2"... It's not.

Yeah but lately when asked about it, Nintendo keeps dodging to answer, they just go "it's neither a sequel, prequel nor remake". Then what the fuck is it supposed to be, N?

It's a remake/reboot. They just don't want to call it that, as it won't be exactly like SF64. It's a completely redone Star Fox 64 as they would do it nowadays, with new features, completely changed levels, new levels, and everything redone from the ground up, and this time with assistance from the ever-wonderful Platinum Games.

Calling it a remake would give people the impression that it'll be just a graphical update like 64 3D, when it's not. It's hard to call it a reboot when the overall story will be the same. If Platinum gets to continue with the series, they'll probably remake Assault next and skip Dinosaur Planet, or do a Dinosaur Planet game with Bayonetta/Metal Gear Rising controls.

Wait....so what's Star Fx Guard

its like a tower defense game

Tower Defense where you play as Slippy and Beltino Toad.

For sure they said it was a reboot/remake of the series. But looking at it from face value, it really does looks like a mixture of SF64 and SF2.

Nope, I was also not impressed.

What's this? Fans complaining about the very thing they've been asking for? No wonder Nintendo tends to rely on a select few franchises, the fans of the other ones are outright UNPLEASABLE!!!!!!

It's the fact Nintendo DOES not make sure every franchise of theirs has a core game per console generation is what irks fans. They seem keen to make a Mario and Zelda game and then a ton of spin-off games, with them picking maybe a Donkey Kong, Metroid or Star Fox game to release per console. Aside from Smash Bros. Mario Kart, do we really need a new Mario Tennis, Dodgeball, what have you each generation? Seems like a no brainer since ya'know appeasing your fans means money.

Yes not every fan can be pleased, but there's a fine line between the butthurt 'unappeasable jackwads' who like to whine and bitch because the game isn't 'perfect', and there's legit criticism at Nintendo for not ensuring each of their franchises gets due diligence per generation.

What currently irks people about Star Fox ZERO is it's a remake when people were looking forward to a brand new game in both the story-telling and the mechanics/graphic capability. Not to mention the removal of Krystal a fan-favorite has not been a favorable move. Especially since many people know Miyamoto dislikes the character and may use the 'reboot' to boot her from the Star Fox franchise period.


Nintendo is not flawless; they make mistakes that fans legitimately have the right to call them out on. Their own toppling from the top of the mountain since the N64 era was their own doing and their subsequent 'dead last place' ever since. The Wii was a fluke in that it sold well for almost three years than tanked in the following two, forcing Nintendo to push the Wii-U out early in 2012. The Wii brand is now considered toxic to Nintendo, and it's half their own fault because that 'big sales break' with the first Wii was getting the right audience at the right time; but that audience moved to smart phones and tablets. Instead of trying to regain the gamer audience they left in the dust they tried for the same casual audience again... and it blew up in their face.

So if anything Nintendo could STAND to listen to their fans more, since their own small-mindedness has kinda been shooting them in the foot repeatedly for twenty years now.

I have yet to see anything saying it is a remake. Plus, let's be honest, the fanbase loved the remakes more than the new games, so fans only have themselves to blame if that's true. It's like the reaction to the new Metroid Prime, they hate Samus now, they love bland FPS games, so with a little thing called logic, they can deduce that the fans wanted Federation Force. Also, I notice a lot of buzzwords and out-dated bandwagon thoughts in your comment, and you seem to forget that the alternative is to be EA Sports. With that, I honestly can't take you seriously.

They've outright said Starfox ZERO is a REBOOT, they just haven't used the terminology due to the fact the words remake/reboot are double edged swords of late.

On the topic of liking remakes vs. new games; that's very subjective. The 3DS port of Star Fox 64 was met with warm reception, but people also disliked the lack of online multiplayer, and even before that Star Fox fans were clamoring for a new Star Fox game during the Wii's reign but only saw Command and we know the mixed reception of that game. That doesn't mean fans don't want new games and honestly while I agree fanbases can be very fickle, Nintendo hasn't been doing themselves any favors in regards to a lot of their decisions toward well a lot of things within the company.

Also hold-the-phone. The fans do NOT hate Samus!! You are way off; people hated how Samus was portrayed in Metroid Other-M, which was a piss-poor representation, and the other hubbub has been the seeming 'chickafication' with Samu's Zero-suit designs being impractical with combat heels when Samus has been portrayed as an action hero that DIDN'T need to focus on the fact she was female, and still be badass.

Federation Force is polarizing because Nintendo created something that nobody wanted; show-casing their ineptitude to check with the Metroid fanbase and get feedback. Metroid Fans wanted another Prime game, which Nintendo has shown they can deliver on what the fans want. However for some reason they seem timid to give the needed effort or are too afraid to approach the franchise after the backlash of Other-M. Yes Other-M was a disaster that's why you pick yourself up and make sure the next time around you do better. Which Nintendo HAS shown the capacity to do; but for some reason the company seems to be a mess in figuring out what they need to do, or fall back on 'what's safe and easy'. Capcom thought because Call of Duty was popular that they should capitalize on the fanbase with Resident Evil 6, and that blew up in their face spectacularly; not only was it a stupid move to chase after another fanbase when your IP is SURVIVAL HORROR, but showed how out of touch Capcom was with their franchises fanbase and what they wanted. Now look at how Capcom's reputation has started to pick up after the HD Remaster of the Gamecube Resident Evil, and the announcement of a Resident Evil 2 remake. Listening to the fanbase can be perilous but it can also pay off if you listen and find the right notes to play off of.

If I may ask what 'buzzwords' and outdated 'bandwagon' comments did I use? Honestly you're welcome to your own opinion but with a comment like 'how can I take you seriously' it makes me wonder if you actually read my comments and if you've also been paying attention to all the news following Nintendo and why there's a major divide with their fan-bases of late.

1. Reboots are different from remakes. This is a reboot, not a remake. That much should be obvious. And the fans aren't helping by complaining about the very thing they asked for. They want a new game in the series, they get it, they complain.

2. Really, they don't hate Samus? They don't hate the very idea of PTSD? They don't discourage characterization in favor of a warped perception of badassery? They don't want her to only ever be an object that does only what they want her to do instead of an actual character? They don't want her to be anything more than a suit with their waifu inside? Sorry man, but the hatred of Other M is actually very sexist, they are outright saying women absolutely have to be cold, unfeeling killing machines to even be thought of as cool in anyway. And believe me, they checked with the Metroid fanbase, they like Prime, they get Prime, now they hate Prime. Where were the complaint 4 games ago? Too late to make them now that you've shown that was what you wanted.

3. You said, and I quote,
"Nintendo is not flawless; they make mistakes that fans legitimately have the right to call them out on. Their own toppling from the top of the mountain since the N64 era was their own doing and their subsequent 'dead last place' ever since. The Wii was a fluke in that it sold well for almost three years than tanked in the following two, forcing Nintendo to push the Wii-U out early in 2012. The Wii brand is now considered toxic to Nintendo, and it's half their own fault because that 'big sales break' with the first Wii was getting the right audience at the right time; but that audience moved to smart phones and tablets. Instead of trying to regain the gamer audience they left in the dust they tried for the same casual audience again... and it blew up in their face."
So yeah, 2012 called, it wants it's childish mentality back.

1: I don't recall the fans asking for a reboot; but I do agree a remake and reboot are two different things. I guess my own grip and seemingly that of others is it feels like half remake, half reboot. But I'll concede this one.


2: The presentation of PTSD in Other M was not the best; not to mention the relationship between Samus and her former CO was not well handled; especially with how she DEFERRED to him when she was not part of the chain of command anymore. It felt at times I was watching a soap opera in between playing an action game and sometimes the story-to-gameplay segments felt forced like having to wait until Adam or what's his face 'OK'd Samus to use her own freaking equipment! I do agree however there was some overdone backlash of sexist commentary and in some ways upholding Samus to the 'ideal badass' imagery that some fans held her too, that didn't allow her to have a character past that is also toxic. None the less the game in of itself did not do exploring Samus's character that well. These are just my opinions regarding Other M. I'm not the most devoted of Metroid fans but I do enjoy the series and had high hopes for Other M and found myself unimpressed.


3: Childish mentality? Really? So, it's a childish mentality that bit Nintendo in the ass for chasing an install base that left them for smart phones and tablets when they pushed out the Wii-U? It's a childish mentality to feel like Nintendo left myself and other gamers who supported them for years when they went to 'chase the casual crowd' with the Wii; giving us a system that had more gimmicks than substance, and only a handful of games worth owning on the system? That I'm disappointed their support for the Virtual Console is lacking? Their online infrastructure is a joke?

I personally don't like talking ill of Nintendo, I'd love for them to climb back on top and innovate the landscape again. However I'm not going to be a fanboy sheep and ignore they've made bad choices in abundance over the years; just like Sony and Microsoft, and Sega even if the latter isn't in the console business anymore they're still the kings of bad business choices. I feel aggrieved that the company that saved the Western gaming industry, and innovated it with higher and higher bars is in place they're currently in.

So I call bullshit on my mentality being 'childish'. It's not childish to wish and hope that a company you support does right by it's fans and yourself. We can agree to disagree if you wish but calling me 'childish' when I have not hurled any insults your way.

1. You kidding? Fandoms hate change more than Republicans. How else are EA games and Call of Duty still selling?

2. Well, I'm glad you can see somethings my way, but let's be honest here, if you stubled onto a police investigation, you'd either have to A, get out of there because you were interfering, or B, on the off chance they give you special treatment and let you help (like what happened with Samus), you're going to have to follow some rules, and before you bring that lava thing or Ridley into this, remember that fight or flight responses are a very real thing, and lava is instant death when it touches you and that Prime is not canon.

3. And you lost me. Wow, just wow. I'd tell you how much of an unpleasable fan you're being right now, but you seem to have your head up your ass on this. You're basically saying that a company needs to cater exclusively to you and you are entitled to shit that they can't give you. That's childish mentality 101, you whine and whine and whine show now signs actually being satisfied ever. You want innovation, but you call everything that's not a generic dualshock controller a gimmick (buzzword), you want online play, but apparently think having it for free is terrible, you use the term "casual"(Buzzword) in a derogatory manner completely forgetting that Gaming is entertainment, and you think you're owed something you never even asked for because reasons. Listen kiddo, they're doing what they can, and if you ask me, it seems actually trying to please the fanbase is destroying them, no matter what, you complain. Acceptance is needed if you want to be seen as anything more than a whiner.

1: Hahahaha I admit you have a good point there; my mind is still boggled there and while I could offer theories, let's say I can agree to this.

2: *shrugs* Fair enough again, I still have some points of disagreement but you bring up enough valid points I'll go along with.


3: *rubs temples* Alright, I think we've both gotten off on the wrong foot here. I can imagine with how critical I sound, I sound like an not easy to please. I never, ever said a company MUST cater to ME, or it's fanbase. What I've been saying is in many ways Nintendo has not been listening to it's fans PERIOD. Maybe I wrote my words down wrong, I tend to do that and if I came off entitled I didn't mean too, but for all I know no matter how I try and spin it I'll be pegged as 'entitled' even when I personally don't see how that's so.

My points I was trying to make is that Nintendo could do with paying attention to their fan base. Of course not every fan is going to have a good idea, so it's pick and choose. That said if you want to keep your fans interested it helps to understand them; get a feel for what's on the pulse and then use that data to crank out some Nintendo brand magic.

I never said anything about Nintendo needing to make a generic dual shock controller, nor did I say free online play is bad, you're putting words in my mouth. I Regarding innovation, I want innovation not gimmicks; with controllers if you can justify and make the changes or new feature worthwhile then by all means, otherwise why not stick with a controller scheme that works? As for the online stuff; I agree it's BS Sony and MS make you pay; but Nintendo's online infrastructure sucks compared to PSN and Xboxlive; to each their own there but it seems to be a general conscientious that Nintendo really needs to up their game there.

I admit using the term 'casual' I put my foot in my mouth; and I fully accept that was both stupid and hypocritical of me. I personally don't care what kind of gamer someone is; and what I meant to go by, was a general term for the original 'audience' that Nintendo aimed the Wii brand at; a very receptive audience for the first three years until smart phones and tablets filled the void that made the Wii obsolete, and go from the sales topping darling to a dead last dust collector. It's common knowledge for some reason despite claims otherwise Nintendo seemingly tried to court this gamer crowd again (hence the tablet controller by Miyamoto's own admission) only to find out that said audience were not coming back for a 2nd helping of the Wii brand, leaving Nintendo with only their diehard fans bothering to buy the consoles.

All that said my miss-steps in dialogue aside I think we've come to an impasse, and perhaps we should 'agree to disagree, and respect the others opinions'. I do not want this to degenerate into an endless back and forth since we both seem to be firm in our mindsets for one thing or another. Sound good to you?

1. Thank you,

2. Also thank you.

3. Yeah, probably for the best. Honestly though, it really felt like you lifted your mentality out of the 2012 GameFAQs message board, peppered in with various click-bait articles that amounted to "LOL, Nintendo is dead". And while I agree that listening to the fans a little may help, I just feel like the fans should meet them half way. So yeah, let's just leave it there.

Disagreements aside it was fun debating with ya'. ^^

Maybe have DLC for stuff like Fara and Krystal, but the only way that would work is if the DLC stuff is not for the main story, maybe what if levels or arcs...

Fara could work, the timeline could link to her somehow, and Krystal...those portals, not just space bending but time bending as well, but the player will see Krystal maybe, just not Fox, he sees her the first time in SFAdventures...

Nintendo's been selling us the same remade games for the past eight billion years, not surprising that there seems to be very little innovation in this title.

This is one of the reasons why Nintendo is failing right now. They insist on endlessly remaking/rehashing all their old games and on the rare occasion they -do- decide to try something new with a franchise, they take it in directions none of the fans ever wanted.

Starfox... every game that isn't a reboot of 64 has either sucked or just been mediocre, so now Nintendo is SCARED to release a non-reboot of 64.