I smell flamewar! Why are there so many damned poor furs?
16 years ago
General
It all started with this...
(2:59:25 PM) Syphir: Haku have you noticed how like 95% of furs, I've noticed, are always in a rut?
(3:00:42 PM) Syphir: I go onto FA and all I see is "hey, I'm poor - please paypal me 20 dollars"
(3:01:44 PM) Haku (AIM): thats a loaded question, actually i should make a journal entry about it
So why does it seem like so many furs are so poor?
Reason #1: Perception.
Simply put, poor flurries tend make themselves more visible than "rich" ones.
The furries that need money, ask for money.
Furs that don't need money, don't ask for money.
What types of posts do you think you`ll you see on FA or LJ more often, "Im so awesomely rich!?" or "Im so poor that I ate my toenail scum"... likely the latter...
Poor furs basically put their financial status out here more often.
Don`t get me wrong, I`m not saying that all poorfurs bitch and moan all the time. That sort of information can come up as innocently as a standard conversation:
Haku: "Hey you going to super-expensive-con `09 this year?"
PoorFur: "Nah man, im poor."
Haku: "How poor are you?"
PoorFur: "Im so poor I cant afford Intern..."
Obviously, PoorFur wasn't complaining to me about their status, but I still learned about it.
Reason #2: Social Skills
Ok, Im going to tread on this one lightly, but I think I can get a pretty solid consensus here. There is a significant portion of the fandom that uh.... how to put nicely.... were not the popular kids in school.
There can be numerous reasons for this, but the fact remains... some of us come off as creepy, some of us come off as quiet, some of us come off as awkward. This lack of social grace translates into real life, sadly.
Many of you, are furry due of the ability of other furs to accept you. Our ability to accept others is a great aspect of the fandom, but like it or not, we are somewhat a dumpster of the "unpopular kids" as far as social groups go.
I have plenty of friends that never finished high school or college due to the fact they were pretty much ostracized in their classroom. Many of them left school due to the harsh nature of school. This in turn, led to little or no real job skills. For most, less education tends to lead to less pay.
Secondly, even if you are the most well versed person in the world in your field, if you cant get through a job interview like a normal person, you aren't gonna get the job. There are a few furs I know that interviewed at my place of employment. They are, in many ways, smarter than I am. They didn't get the job. Why? because they are cant talk to a stranger worth crap.
Reason #3: Demographics
Most furs tend to be under the age of 30. I`d even guess that something like 50% are under the age of 25.
This is due to the fact that the acceptance of the internet is much higher for those under 30 AND the fact that the fandom is centered strongly around an online presence.
Demographics for anyone (not just furs) show that people under the age of 30 tend to get paid less. Its just life.
Many under the age of 24, are often students... students are always poor.
Trends show, as you get older, you to get paid more. I suspect as the fandom gets older on average, you`ll start to notice more of your peers stabilize.
Of course, there will always be the poorfugs, and there will always be new "kids" joining the fandom, so the "issue" will never really go away.
So whaddya think? Discuss amongst yourselves...
Reason #4: Its your fault
...annnnd here we go. Its your fault. No, seriously. ITS. YOUR. FAULT. Ok, so this doesn't apply to everyone, but a lot of you. Get off your ass, stop playing wow, and go read a book. LEARN SOMETHING! For craps sake!
PS. The term "poorfur" is now copyright me! If you use it, PAY UP! Im poor, and I need the royalties. :3
(2:59:25 PM) Syphir: Haku have you noticed how like 95% of furs, I've noticed, are always in a rut?
(3:00:42 PM) Syphir: I go onto FA and all I see is "hey, I'm poor - please paypal me 20 dollars"
(3:01:44 PM) Haku (AIM): thats a loaded question, actually i should make a journal entry about it
So why does it seem like so many furs are so poor?
Reason #1: Perception.
Simply put, poor flurries tend make themselves more visible than "rich" ones.
The furries that need money, ask for money.
Furs that don't need money, don't ask for money.
What types of posts do you think you`ll you see on FA or LJ more often, "Im so awesomely rich!?" or "Im so poor that I ate my toenail scum"... likely the latter...
Poor furs basically put their financial status out here more often.
Don`t get me wrong, I`m not saying that all poorfurs bitch and moan all the time. That sort of information can come up as innocently as a standard conversation:
Haku: "Hey you going to super-expensive-con `09 this year?"
PoorFur: "Nah man, im poor."
Haku: "How poor are you?"
PoorFur: "Im so poor I cant afford Intern..."
Obviously, PoorFur wasn't complaining to me about their status, but I still learned about it.
Reason #2: Social Skills
Ok, Im going to tread on this one lightly, but I think I can get a pretty solid consensus here. There is a significant portion of the fandom that uh.... how to put nicely.... were not the popular kids in school.
There can be numerous reasons for this, but the fact remains... some of us come off as creepy, some of us come off as quiet, some of us come off as awkward. This lack of social grace translates into real life, sadly.
Many of you, are furry due of the ability of other furs to accept you. Our ability to accept others is a great aspect of the fandom, but like it or not, we are somewhat a dumpster of the "unpopular kids" as far as social groups go.
I have plenty of friends that never finished high school or college due to the fact they were pretty much ostracized in their classroom. Many of them left school due to the harsh nature of school. This in turn, led to little or no real job skills. For most, less education tends to lead to less pay.
Secondly, even if you are the most well versed person in the world in your field, if you cant get through a job interview like a normal person, you aren't gonna get the job. There are a few furs I know that interviewed at my place of employment. They are, in many ways, smarter than I am. They didn't get the job. Why? because they are cant talk to a stranger worth crap.
Reason #3: Demographics
Most furs tend to be under the age of 30. I`d even guess that something like 50% are under the age of 25.
This is due to the fact that the acceptance of the internet is much higher for those under 30 AND the fact that the fandom is centered strongly around an online presence.
Demographics for anyone (not just furs) show that people under the age of 30 tend to get paid less. Its just life.
Many under the age of 24, are often students... students are always poor.
Trends show, as you get older, you to get paid more. I suspect as the fandom gets older on average, you`ll start to notice more of your peers stabilize.
Of course, there will always be the poorfugs, and there will always be new "kids" joining the fandom, so the "issue" will never really go away.
So whaddya think? Discuss amongst yourselves...
Reason #4: Its your fault
...annnnd here we go. Its your fault. No, seriously. ITS. YOUR. FAULT. Ok, so this doesn't apply to everyone, but a lot of you. Get off your ass, stop playing wow, and go read a book. LEARN SOMETHING! For craps sake!
PS. The term "poorfur" is now copyright me! If you use it, PAY UP! Im poor, and I need the royalties. :3
FA+

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This is so true, but another way to put it as well is that they have very little work experience as well and they have often not put themselves out on the job market at a young age, most likely due to confidence issues. Let me tell you I sat for a good few months last year and this year unemployed. I was only in my previous job for a couple of months. Part of it was because it was because I hated the job and part of it was because my manager just didn't like me yeah the two are connected.
I started employment in a supermarket 3 months ago now. If I was being honest, I feel as though I am very lucky to have that job because I feel as though I was a nervous wreck talking to the manager who interviewed me. I guess I had some of these issues myself that you described at school but at the same time I also had alot of friends at school and college.
I am 20 years old. I don't care if I'm a 'Popufur' at the end of the day I am here to share an interest with everyone else and make friends with people as well, I don't care if I become popular, because in my opinion popularity is overrated, its not something I like because people would just harass you all the time if you where popular, not onlt that if you're popular, people use you as well...
I work with internetty stuff. It took quite a few small projects to gain pertinent experiance before I was finally picked up by a real company.
Whatever your field may be, just work at it, do some "hobbies" that contribute to your field.
For example, If you are a programmer, go contribute to some open source projects. For nearly any field, there is a way to get your foot in the door without actually being employed. Go volunteer, intern, etc.
Even without a job you can improve yourself and gain a skillset. Experience helps TONS and it doesn't need to be PAID experiance to count.
Also more or less correct... especially #1.
The majority of people I know real-life are doing decently for themselves, even if they're not going "should I drive the BMW or the Audi today, mmmm?". Most of the furs I know RL have a steady job, just like any other group of people. Even in the midst of the recession, no one I know personally is couch-surfing or basement-dwelling.
Im also seeing effects of my demographic... SoCal is harshly expensive, so I see more couch surfing than perhaps elsewhere.
also... Art = #4 Its your fault!
Keep buying art tho, I enjoy it :P
Of course I've had some pretty terrible financial issues. Right now, actually - money is extremely tight and we face some a very dire future if we can't get our shit together. That's often a surprise to people though because I very often... NEVER... whine, moan, or cry about it. Never publicly. And I most certainly never ask for handouts.
It's a matter of pride, and reservation. Reservation meaning... in the even that I DO ask for help - people realize how serious the situation is and is hopefully more likely to lend a hand. In other words... I don't cry wolf.
Most peoples careers tend to be closely related to their hobbies. Sometimes just following what you do best (not video games tho!) willl lead to success.
Also! Go lakers. :3
Get an education. Cant live off the dole all your life. Besides that, with your income level, it`d be damn near free anyway.
Although, it does bother me when I do see a lot of people that complain about being poor...yet they actually AREN'T trying to do anything about it.
I'm only twenty, I'd say that I legally apply for being in said 'rut.'
No Job = no money
No money = no car
No car = no ability to eearch for a job anywhere that's not nearby.
No money = no school
And apparently, a high school education doesn't account for squat these days. x3
As for school, there are loans and grants (and some really good grants depending on your state and income level) that can cover education.
I did my first 2 years of college pretty much free, and my 3rd year off of loans... so... its not impossible.
Obviously, location plays a big role in job and school and such, but its hard to give you exact advise though.
In the meantime, do what you love and get yourself really good at something. You`d be surprised where your loves can take you. I could go on about how damned lucky I am at where my hobbies took me, but it`d be considered bragging and i dont want to come off as a douche. :)
As for the transportation part, you're absolutely right. *chuckles* I do live in a suburban/upper class city, which relies on everyone to have their own Mustang G/T's by the age 16. There are hardly any sidewalks or bikeracks anywhere nearby, so yeah, you hit the nail on the head.
But go ahead, if anything it'd be more of an inspiration than anything to hear where you've gotten with yours.
1. Magic the gathering - I ended up working for Wizards of the Coast (the people that make M:TG) for 2 years because of this "hobby" - Long story short, I was very visible on the tourney scene and in the online communities, it eventually turned into "hey i think you should apply for ~this~"... and i got the job.
2. Video Games - I loved video games... my want to make a fun "pokemon battler" for AOL chat rooms back in like... 1998 got me into very serious coding and game design. I went from Visual Basic to C++ to PHP to Perl... blah blah blah blah. Pokemon battler eventually turned into a game that lets people play Yugioh Online (Yugioh Virtual Desktop)... Im actually 'internet-famous' in Yugioh circles...
Anyway, this in turn got a very good social network for me. I had advertisers throwing money to advertise on my yugioh site, and eventually advertisers asking me to do their sites.
I now run quite a few sites, most of them require minimal upkeep effort, and I get compensated pretty decently for it.
3. The website upkeep eventually got me into sysadmin-ery, where I now work for a internet-related company.
..... I took magic, yugioh, pokemon, video games and it all eventually let me to multiple jobs.... How this applies to calligraphy? I dunno....
Most artists (i`d consider you an artist) try to do something unique with their work. Maybe take your calligraphy... and do something not done before... I dont know what the heck that would be... but... once you think outside that box, you`ll find people with disposable income wanting it.
Also, if you do really good work, it`ll sell itself. Drop it online, market yourself a bit... throw that stuff on deviant art, on FA... wherever... Something that was in common with all of my successes, is that I made my skillset visible and made myself visible.
Unlike many, I know many of the rules of the game, but due to my lack of skill I can't really get to big in that area.
As for my other passions, such as coming up with ideas, such as enhancing current things or coming up with my own storyboards for video games. And even writing stories/novels myself. I have no idea where to even get my feet wet. That's where I'm stuck, I havevarious skills and no knowledge at all on how to apply it anywhere.
"Creative" things like writing stories, scripts, storyboards, etc etc, is pretty rough to get noticed. Most people dont like to read... its sad but true. You pretty much have to get it converted into a more marketable media. Find someone that is looking for a good story for a flash cartoon, for example.... or maybe find an artist that needs story ideas for their online comic. It does require teamwork...
If you find that you want to do something, but lack the skill to do it... try learning it. For example, maybe you wanted to make some fancy 2d style RPG... there are things out there that let you make those fairly easily.
If you find yourself with much sparetime, use it to learn new stuff... when you are interested in something, its much easier to spend the time to pick it up and get fancy-pants at it.
As for learning how to do a 2D RPG...that does sound rather...interesting. I think I will look into that actually. I'll start to delve into new skills once I can actually find some to learn.
The fun part is going to be getting programs. Dial up...is definitely outdated...and no good for getting big files. x3
Anyways
My opinion, i'm the HUGE exception to this rule. xDDD
"Simply put, poor flurries tend make themselves more visible than "rich" ones."
-I'm rich and i tell everyone to brag. xD Well, not really. But i show it off IRL with a different outfit everyday and buying every game i want (with my parents money, actually. On my own, i am poorfur xD). So everyone i know usually knows i'm rich. Lol.
"here is a significant portion of the fandom that uh.... how to put nicely.... were not the popular kids in school. "
-Well actually, all the furs at my school are the most popular. :o Not me, actually, i'm dating the popular fur. But his ex is also a popular fur. Mostly because they've got a huge sense of humor. Lol.
"Most furs tend to be under the age of 30. I`d even guess that something like 50% are under the age of 25."
-Weeeeeell i wouldn't put the numbers THAT high. Most furs i meet are over the age of 25. But that might be because i tend to fall into yiff rooms full of the sexually needy 30 year old fat men. xD But i almost never meet furs my own age. @3@ Only at school and in #teenagefurs on furnet. Otherwise, i see people like the ones i see at PS. o3o
"Reason #4: Its your fault"
-All the furs i know, too, are also anime geeks and etc. So they're also the all Advanced Placement classes kids who have 4.5 GPA and scholorships to awesome schools. xD Me, on the other paw, have a 3.1 GPA and am gonna go to a Cal State. But not bad.
But i'm the exception, remember. xD I think it just happens to be the first one you said. The poor ones tell everyone. And a lot of furs are in college and poor cuz everyone in college is poor (even me, some day... ;-;)
My opinion here. :3
Just different from fur to fur. :3
However, I still have a darn nice job for my age and a nice check compared to friends that I have... Though I am getting very tired of not having my degree, at the moment I am working to save back some money, pay off my vehicle and my previous student loans before venturing back to student status... I am going to attempt to try and finish my English and speech credits while working and also take up and prerequisite classes that I may need when I go for the degree and education I truly desire.
Its hard to get out after your in...
... MEOW!above all perception as you said already. Hell I myself am not in the best position but I dont go around bawwing about it. Gotta get off your ass and get out there to go forward in any venture.
*hides in his bomb shelter*
...
On a more serious note: I like this entry. You gave several, very good reasons, explained them all and backed them up. Yay for well constructed entries. You gets a brownie point.
...
I so hope I don't lock up at my job interview tuesday. D:
Even just getting a job this summer has been a bitch for me. I have 4 years of college experience and 3 years of WalMart experience and THEY wouldn't even take me this summer D:
Luckily my parents are well-off enough that I'm not going to starve or anything. 3 semesters left to go before I get my diploma but what until then? My parents make just enough money that I don't qualify for most financial aid jobs, making things that much harder.
Again, I'm not in a money crisis, I would just like to be more financially independent and not leeching off my folks so much :<
stopping crying babies
kung fu battles
fixing a broken car
making breakfast (YES, DJ YOUR BREAKFAST)
job interviewsmaking the line at the supermarket go faster
....... I wish all of these things were true :(
but wouldn't it be cool if somebody like naNaOn-Sha made a DJ game? ;3 ;3 ;3
All of my music and the DJ program is pirated. I would feel way bad making money DJing using that stuff
I mean I guess i paid for the external sound card and got the controller as a christmas present but still
But uhhh there isn't enough of a demand for a hardcore/darkwave/gabber/j-core DJ to the point where I could actually make money if I agreed to it
Certainly not here in Long Valley, NJ. In PA, maybe, but I dunno still
naNaOn-Sha did parappa, right?
idk I don't see it happening. Not without a special controller.
But DJ Hero looks stupid and IIDX is nothing like actual turntablism
But I will get DJ Hero anyway as soon as it hits the clearance rack because it's not guitar hero
The disc overlay would have a small "pie bite" which is basically a highlighted part of the record that the needle has to be over when you're at a fork point or else the wrong sound will come out. The more difficult the fork, the smaller the pie bite will be. The record will spin on its own during the song and you don't wanna mess with it until a fork point whereby at the very moment of it, you want the needle to be over the highlighted pie bite. You can mess with it earlier for style but if you fuck up the sound too much the game will get angry at you. I imagine that spinning could be slowed or sped up with an analog control stick, arkanoid flipper, or even a trackball/mouse once you're in the acceptable time zone.
Then after each fork, you have to press the fader down (to turn it off) and another button to bring in the next disc and the thing starts all over again :V NOW! Imagine a queue of discs on the hud in the "next" position like tetris blocks, each with different highlighted "pie bites" and you can see it would be mixed up quite a bit 8)
p.s. the most important part of making something like that work would be to not take itself too seriously, ie full of feasible scenarios for kids and young adults but with completely unrealistic solutions, ie: DJ EVERYTHING
That sounds really complicated.
I kinda think I can understand what you're going for, but if you make it too realistic then it becomes ungodly difficult and no one will have fun with it at all.
Make it too casual and it gets written off as a video game for people that don't play video games. lol shovelware.
Honestly I loved the crap out of Gitaroo Man. It didn't take itself seriously, gameplay was a good balance of fun and difficult without being impossible, and the music was -awesome-
Talk to the higher ups, pitch this idea or something, I dunno. Talk to MooglyGuy, he works for the branch of Activision that puts out Guitar Hero/World Tour, see what you can do.
Everyone's trying to milk the rhythm game craze and only a few companies are actually putting out fun, good, non-shitty games.
I love the style and silliness of shit like gitaroo man, parappa, lammy, etc. One with a DJ would be awesome ;3
Who's mooglyGuy? If I wanted this thing to see the light of day, I'd probably start doing prototypes of my own, since actions speak way louder than words to distributors. However, that being said, I come up with shit like this all the time, and really only got time to work on 1 project right now ;<
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Also,
I love you. <3
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You`re actually looking at a sample of 2 groups:
1. Webmasters who install the toolbar while trying to get stats for their own site
2. People who have no idea what the toolbar is.
What this doesn't show is how many people this is sampled from, I doubt its very many.
None-the-less, it pretty much backs up my "everyone is pretty young" statement.