You've spoken the truth;I have been feeling the same way. There's too many trolls within the fandom as well.

THIS indeed. I know of a few toxic child-minded troll losers now will probably cry because this all offends them and their cancerous kind, but just block them & left them cry like the children they are.

That really is all we can do.

I'm a Nobel troll but I only troll on cyberbullies and people causing trouble on social media. I do this to protect people that's includes furries.

Then you're the first troll I've met who does that. All trolls I ever dealt with are the trouble making kind.

To be honest I have been very disappointed in this generation... And now the fandom is starting to fall apart... What are we all gonna do now!? :(

agreed, its sad to watch it and see it flooding Twitter and facebook like a disease.

I wonder if you were frowned on by older furs upon joining the furry fandom back in those days?
I joined in 2004 and I remember fursuits started to become a huge thing in the fandom and back then this was hugely frowned upon by old "veteran" furs and look where we are now. It's safely said 70% got a fursuit, at least 30% of those have more than one.

Each new generation brings new things, change, that the previous generation has a hard time adapting to. I believe This phenomenon has it's own specific term... *googles* "The Generation Separation Phenomenon"

Also nostalgia plays a huge role in this and is often an over romanticized memory of something that in reality wasn't as great as it seems now, looking back at it without any bias.
The fandom grew immensely over the past decade and so did the amount of troublesome people in the fandom, but that doesn't mean they never existed back then. Drama was always huge in the fandom, you probably just started to pay attention to it much more.

Generations come and go. Young ones are inexperienced and stupid, will do mistakes and appear generally rude to the old generation, but eventually they grow up and will think EXACTLY the same about the generation coming after them while we enjoy our furry retirement and "watch the world burn" from afar", to overdramatize it a little bit ;3

back in 1999 when i found the fandom it was really different than it it now, it was completely inviting by everyone regardless of age, and there was literally none of the current mindsets we see now. Your correct on the fact that there is a large influx of spoiled, entitled, emo arrogant thin-skinned childish young brats coming to the fandom and bringing their idiocy with them, but fortunately not all you new furs are that way. I know so many who are great happy friendly people, they are like the majority of the good who been the fandom years ago, its just the higher percentage of the toxic twats have sharply increased in the last year or two.

I think this is happening globally and is just a cultural phenomenon... Currently it's trendy to be cynical, rude, edgy, etc... *shrugs* I could be wrong, tho.
I don't think it will last, tho. Those people soon or later will realize this behaviour won't get them very far in life.
aka "It's just a phase". I'm doubt the fandom is going anywhere.
We're not based on a show or a franchise. Our fandom is based on an idea that will never die. This idea is as old as mankind and it will continue existing generations on. I'm not worried the fandom's gonna fall apart anytime soon.

I agree with everything said from the OP to this. Maybe we just need some understanding, everything changes, one way or another and that's just part of life. I will continue to teach younger folks that you don't have to be someone you aren't just to "fit in" with the popular crowds. I will still do my part when it comes teaching the best I can without pushing. Some younger folks do care what people around them think, to the point of isolation. I know when I started in 2005 I started in chat rooms and on forums. I didn't start because I saw something on social media, I saw something on the news that peeked my interest, did some research and found some websites. Its been a learning experience, though and I've seen drama from the beginning all the way up until now. I doubt it will ever change, maybe the method to that end might differ but the outcome will remain the same.

Anywho I hope you all have a good week

I agree there, it seems in some cases the younger new furs coming in the fandom are getting ignored & shunned by the increase in the elitists, popufurs, showboaters, & those who believe the world revolves around them attitude.

"... ignored & shunned by the increase in the elitists, popufurs, showboaters, & those who believe the world revolves around them ..."

Um, meaning who? How?

I've been the fandom since the early 1980's, BTW.

I'm curious as to what the fandom was in the '80s.
I was in college at the end of the '80s, and never once heard of a furry fandom. "Online" activity was basically just some 'bulletin boards' you could connect to if you had the phone number to dial into.

So, I'd be interested in knowing how furries were able to get in touch with one another, in order to form a fandom. Or was it merely some local friends getting together?

You would be amazed just how much activity was taking place on line once modems started becoming more readily available. And lots and lots of people in college started getting nascent Internet access through their schools.

But even without there, there was already a vast network of fanzines, underground/independent comics, resources like The Fandom Directory (an annual publication), and convention flyers just among FANDOM, never mind furry fandom. My husband and I just piggy-backed on those when we started advertising the first furry-themed convention in 1988 (after we had been putting on furry-themed parties at science fiction and comic book conventions for a few years, so people had already heard about us).

>but that doesn't mean they never existed back then. Drama was always huge in the fandom, you probably just started to pay attention to it much more.
My take on this sentiment is that often, it's not someone saying "there was no bad back then", they're trying to say "the good from back then is no more". Obviously, there are different good aspects that come with any change, but I find no reason people shouldn't be allowed to find that loss of what came before lamentable.

More specifically to what's happening now, I see the "drama" from back then just being people being immature, which in an ironic kind of way showed how accepting the fandom was - that immature or damaged people were allowed to stay around. Today this drama is very actively destructive, and often intentionally malicious and vindictive. Again, in line with my first paragraph that's not to say there weren't assholes doing the same thing then too, but I definitely see it as worse today.

Source: Am youngish furry who found this in 2011 and dug deep into old discussions while old websites were still online, and has watched things unfold from the sidelines since.

Nowadays with the evergrowing presence of the internet, people have access to drama more than ever. "back in the olden days" drama still happened but there weren't thousands of people able to access and share that drama at a single click. Yes, immaturity is without a doubt the cause of the drama that happens, but the internet and the ease of accessibility is the catalyst to the issues we face today. Back then you could do a lot of stupid stuff and no one was there to snap photos and post them to a place where literally the entire world has access.

On the other hand, those who cause problems are really just looking for attention, even if it's bad attention. Attention is all the craving these days everywhere and not just in the fandom, so it sadly comes to no shock that people do the craziest things to get attention, even if it means creating rifts and tearing others apart.

I also had FS6's experience. When I joined, I was embraced by the likes of JBadger, Bradhound, and some of the more seasoned furs. I was also befriended by many who were in their 20s at the time, and have remained friends with many of them, with very little drama, if ever.

By you're logic, all fandoms are dying because many of these cyberbullies are interconnected with countless sites. Good luck with joining anything else. There's a reason why site and convention rules exist, and people get banned and blocked. I don't see a complete collapse happening unless many other communities go with it as well.

Very true. at least Fur Affinity has some great strict rules to keep their kind under control, unlike the mess that is Twatter and Facebook.

Yeah, the overall vitriolic toxicity and witch hunting is way out of control. Most of what drew people into furry and especially helped grow the community was along the lines of tolerance. Nowadays you're expected to be perfect, which no one is, and never make a mistake, which everyone will.

A fair number of furs are lacking in social ability, not being given an opportunity to grow is not going to help them learn these abilities. Being toxic about it, most will not even try nor see the true positives that have been the core of furry since it's inception.

THIS indeed.

I’m now in boycott furry mode until the direction shifts back to reasonable levels of tolerance.

http://www.furaffinity.net/journal/9222718/

Well... A-Hem. Nice to see someone else has noticed the restraining nut on the top of the spindle of the "Merry Go Round" is working itself loose. Things change. They have to. I still love and appreciate "Furry" fandom even though most the folks I was fans with have died, gotten sick of moved on. I would say that it was the expenses of "Conning" that drove me out, as the costs of travelling, renting a hotel room, meals, souvenirs, and those "One of a kind" original drawings and prints just became too much for my modest budget. I really, really miss it, but I'm afraid that if I now go to a con, I'll most likely not recognize anyone there.

true indeed.

it is sad that it's gotten to this point. you have to be very careful with what you say. accusations of "nazifur" are thrown around quite mindlessly. usually by people who simply just don't agree with you. i'm tired of seeing the "fuck off nazifurs" pendants at cons. why do we have to focus on this toxic negativity?

I've noticed a lot of people are leaving the fandom because they couldn't exploit it for their own selfish gains. people you think are your friends, but will then go and start fawning to someone they don't know, all because that person is a career artist, popular fursuiter, or a staff member for MFF, so they can get room in the hyatt and not have to stay in an overflow hotel. I can safely say if I was one of the aforementioned, I would be getting a lot more out of this community. but I cant' even draw a stick figure, my fursuit is an animal that nobody's ever heard of, and i'm not staff for MFF. so my level of importance is limited to the masses.

THIS definitely. it seems if you don't agree with a certain mindset, you instantly called-out & labeled as a nazi, a racist, a bigot, a fascist, etc. when most of themselves are some of the worst fascists & bigots ever. The Hipocracy & blind arrogance they display is laughable.

Very much agreed. It's something you see in and out of the fandom. You get called all names possible if you don't have the same opinions and views as they do, and it's a fact that they're the ones who are the most intolerant, and who also want others to think the same as them. The real fascists are the ones who call others fascists.

but I cant' even draw a stick figure, my fursuit is an animal that nobody's ever heard of, and i'm not staff for MFF. so my level of importance is limited to the masses.
I don't even have a fursona and I therefore de facto don't exist to most furs. With the way things are now I have no interest in making one, either, I don't do things just to fit in. There's no point to it when most people buy a randomly generated adoptable for tenbux, and no one thinks up a real character in their mind for themselves anymore.

Sadly folks like me are the last real furs left and once we're gone, this fandom is going down in flame and disappear for good cause of stupid young, and toxic furs that ruin this and turned it into a joke.

It's why i never date anyone younger than me cause their level of mature is deadly low. Even the SJWs and nut jobs as well.

It was fun while it lasted but I'll keep fursuiting till i die. Cause the fandom may fade away, but our joy and happiness will never be gone.

indeed, I will do the same, enjoy the friends i have, enjoy the good things of the fandom, and keep blocking & ignoring the parasites eating the fandom. attention only feeds them what they want, and ignoring them sometimes makes them worse because of their child-minds, but its better to starve them of their attention crying than pay attention to their toxic radiation.

Don't go anywhere Joe. There are those of us who hold you in high regard and enjoy what you have to offer.

I won't go anywhere. I'm going to keep drawing and suiting. Cause a few enemies that are artists and some are ass muffins want me to go, but me staying here pisses em off, and be side I'm not going to stop doing what i do till die.

And thank you Harley.

Agree completely, it makes me sad.

I agree, I have a simple solution to remove some of the negative issues of the modern era. It wont stop what's going on but will at least partially insulate myself and my mate form those shenanigans. I simply don't use twitter, skype, telegram or any other social medias. The security is non existant, and the malevolent crybaby/political jerks are swarming like ants on a turd. Any crap of the sort of hostile activity on FA is an instant ban and complaint.

Good points, if i could abandon twitter, telegram, and other out-of-control social media sites that have no rules or enforcement i would in an instant, but in my case i have to depend on them for some communications with commissioners & fursuit related stuff. Telegram is easy to control though and keep just to your circle of friends within.

Absolutely understood. You have a business to run and communications are paramount.

While i agree with 95% of what was said, I disagree with the final point.
There is hope for the furry fandom still, social media is a largely contributing to the problem though.
As useful as a tool it may be to be social and make new friends, it's also extremely volitile and ruthless.
When all that is set aside though, it still has an incredible amount of good in it that (in my opinion) outweighs the bad with supportive individuals and groups everywhere. It's easy to get caught in that mentality that everything is going to hell, but there is still hope and it can bounce back.

I have hope too it can change for the better, but some of the toxic mind-set has to go for it to work..

i've only just started out in the fandom an only 2 cons under my belt, its sucks thats its on its way out now

Hugs* i know it seems bad fro some new furs coming into it now because of the social media mess. but i do believe there are ways you can still enjoy what the fury fandom was formed originally for.

I can remember several times when "the end" was here.
When the burned furs popped up around '00 or so, and was going to cast out what was wrong with the fandom. Which strangely what was wrong with the fandom kept changing. The frozen furs. Wet Furs. Crispy furs. Etc.
I can remember when the fursuiters were taking over, and pushing other groups out. Having one seemed like it was almost mandatory in some places.
I can remember when the plushie lovers were bringing bad attention. Then the fursuiter humpers. Zoophiles. Baby furs. MLPs. Bronies. Nazi furs. The gay factions were going to kill off the fandom for a while. Same with the weird fetish groups.

I have been in the fandom since around '89. I have heard the wails and gnashing of teeth more than a few times. I am not concerned. If the fandom does somehow finally dies off, it will not be by my hand, er paw. But I don't see how it can die as long as it is alive in me.

There are always going to be some "new kids" coming into the fandom. They are always going to have problems in adjusting to what existed before they crawled in. They are always going to try to make things "their way." But you know what they are going to have to do at the same time? They are going to have to figure out how we old guard furs built this fandom up, and how the ones who came before us built the foundations that we got to stand on. They maybe toxic now, but eventually they are going to see what happens when they drive away those who stood before them, and have to learn how to network, build, learn, etc to replace what they will lose.

All I know is that the one constant in this is going to be change, for the good or the worse.

oh boy... i remember the "burned furs" that were followed by the rest you mentioned. its funny and good that many of us veterans like you & i understand & see these things. (but remember, now we have the new pissy children coming into the fandom telling us that any fur 30+ like us should leave the fandom.

I have been in this fandom fully since 2013, and I have had trouble.

Megaplex 2018 was my latest I attended and I had a bad experience. And it turns out they mentioned 2016 and 2017 as well. But yet, I wasn't called out for doing anything bad, until 2018. But even then, I didn't re-call doing any of what they claimed, but I did make a few hiccups here and there, but minor compared to what they claimed.

This fandom needs to fix itself, if anything.....I really thought I was this well behaved young adult....But I fear as if, my reputation is being tarnished.
What's the real issue here, if it's not the person by those that give nasty looks or have secretive nasty things about them?

I can tell you that I've blocked and reported my share of toxic people within the fandom such as pedophiles, zoophiles, neo-Nazis, and hipsters. In fact, I've blocked 98 neo-Nazis on Facebook alone.

I do that too constantly.

I forgot to mention that SJWs and anti-SJWs also add to the fandom’s toxicity. The biggest problem with SJWs is the fact that they are constantly bitching about every single thing, especially when it comes to the entertainment industry. I’ve heard a lot of people say that anti-SJWs are actually worse because they side with the alt-right bigots. That’s because they are alt-right bigots.

Imean If you focus on just THIS then sure but theres a bunch of other things you can focus on too. Went to a con for a day recently and didnt feel any toxicity and I met a lot of furries. It's more just the environment you focus in that makes you feel this way imo

That is true.

I been keeping track of things over the years, and all things alter as time changes, the ups and the downs, and ins and outs, as things get bigger, more things develop within, like Rome, eventually things fall apart and scatter about and become a new with hints of things before, but it will never return to the state of which it started...

I seen people leave and new faces dive in, I have seen people pushed out and all pulled in, even the "underground" where not much realize is a moving force but have a hand in something of the recent actions over the past few years...

It is the existance of social media of which most of the alterations and corruptions take place, where I even see average people turn into things they were not before due to the forced nature of the outside world, even people of power turned into things of warped ideals due to there exposure, and as for us, concentrated and pinpointed manipulation over time breaks us apart even more, and the truths you find along the way make reality more daunting as you seep further into torment, if you cut off the thing that's pulling you down, you will rise up and thrive...

To perceive of what is ahead, you must recognize the signals of that what warps and torments the mind, all things you know turned against ourselves, even my eyes fester with the burden of knowing too much, and too much to see and know makes life boring, or that to my experience...

We all move on, choices to stay or go, bands break apart and members reform into something new, its always changing, like society, though the same thing is, the fear of society dying along with everything else due to our own creations and knowing what lyes in the dark for people to find to share with the world for all to see...

Heh, I guess time will tell...

Honestly, it seems to be a trend with overall society, and not just the fandom. As somebody who came from another country looking for "acceptance" and "freedom", I have honestly found not much of that, and lately, even less. I haven't had too many bad experiences with the fandom myself like you have, but I do notice that what you're describing seems to be also happening on "normie society" as well.

Maybe the fandom is just getting polluted by the world that surrounds it...

(And honestly, the words "thicc" and "smol" irritate me so much that I'd gladly rip the fingers off of whoever uses it)

it is overall society that is collapsing indeed, not just the fandom.

Well said. I'm seeing way too much of this too.

i said some time last year that the fandom was beginning to become mainstream. this has benefits, people outside the fandom are generally going to be more accepting of us, for example.

however....

It also means we get an influx of new people. and not all of it good. You pair that up with people within the community beginning to generally get riled up and overly political and shit begins to go crazy.

To make it worse though, I dont think this is a furry thing specifically... people as a whole seem to be falling this way of late, since the back end of 2016 in fact I've noticed an increasing downward trend where people are actively more hostile to one another online

There are children running around at cons with dudes walking around in diapers and full fetish wear.... And that was in 2008!

That was my "Welp! I'm done with this shit!" moment.

I might go to a con again if they make a clearly "ADULT ONLY" con as they either need to be "100% Family Friendly" or "100% Adult Only", you cannot mix them both together.

I've seen and heard it has only gotten worse, especially with the SJW segregationists and overly political cringe inducing far left and far right idiots. Though that is cringe-funny in and of its own considering Nazis and Communists alike would kill gays/furries on the spot.

Sadly, many furs have abandoned the concept of what furry used to be about, having fun and escaping the human world and all of it's faults and drama. Now too many focus on popularity, profit (monetary or otherwise), and using the fandom as a political platform to preach their particular flavor of politics. I found the fandom in 1999 as well, and yes, it has changed a lot. I guess that's why I've drifted away from it over the years.

i've got shit tons of examples coming from my head to tell u why it became hight toxic cancer since years.
but not sure u will believe or understand me.
just look throught my journals and u'll see only a part of what went wrong here

*passes you his rose colored glasses*

Dunno where you are getting all of this from... I had a great time at AC'19!

When I got into the furry fandom as an active member 11 years ago, I found it to be the exact same way you did: inviting, happy, friendly, enjoying the shared interest of anthropomorphics, etc. My first con of AC 2008 was a life changing experience because it showed me a big family I could be a part of where I could be myself and open up to let others in. Now, due to deeply inset social anxiety keeping me from meeting and talking with a lot of people and financial constraints preventing me from attending anywhere near as many cons as I'd like to, I don't get around as much as you or most other people do. So as a result I really haven't seen these negative things affecting the fandom all that much. About the most I've seen that comes to mind is a handful of whiny little bitches calling out 2 Gryphon as a "nazi" (no, he most certainly is not) and getting him banned from stages or from conventions entirely, simply because they disagree with his opinions or don't like his comedy.

Thing is, the furry fandom will only fall apart and become a toilet of infighting and political bullshit if we allow it. Too many people remain too silent about that handful of whiners, haters, SJWs, or whoever who attack and drive away good furies because they don't want the negativity directed at themselves as a consequence. But what always happens when a hate group runs out of their current target? They find another target, which could very well be any of those silent individuals who didn't speak up when they had the chance.

We need to speak up and speak out against the hate and the infighting and any I'm-better-than-you-are-because-I'm-popufur mentality if we are going to retain the furry fandom we know and love and take back those parts that were lost. One of the things that brought all of us together in this fandom is because of all the rejection we received from the rest of our respective environments growing up and even into adulthood from people who treated us like shit just because we liked cartoon animal characters, or because we liked computers and science and "nerdy" things, or simply because we were a target to be beaten down into the shadows like the bottom class of people in some third world country. We've had to put up with enough of that shit in our lives outside and/or before the furry fandom; we do not need and do not want to put up with that shit inside the furry fandom. When some individual or group is senselessly attacking another individual or group because they don't like their ideas/opinions/preferences/lifestyle/whatever, rather than sitting and talking together like friends over a nice pizza to gain mutual understanding and either see each other's viewpoints or simply agreeing to disagree and still coming away as friends, we need to speak up and say that is unacceptable and unwelcome in this fandom.

Back in AC 2008 at the masquerade, the most powerful thing I saw was a skit set to the song, "We're Not Gonna Take It". Unfortunately I didn't have a camera that could record video at the time and of course that's the one skit from the entire show that I can't find on Youtube (probably because of copyright or something). The main message of the skit was about how the rest of society tells us we can't be who we are and do what we want and that we must conform to what they tell us, so of course we furries say no, we're just fine as we are and we're not gonna take that crap. The skit moved me to tears because of its powerful message. That's exactly what we need now IN our furry fandom, telling people who want to play SJW and bring their politics into the fandom and make us conform to what they want and agree to only their opinion that NO, we're not gonna take that shit, divisiveness like that isn't welcome in our furry community, and they can go fuck off until they learn to live and let live. And those who only have the goal of being "popufur" need to be reminded that that's not what we're here for and that popularity does not make them better than anyone else.

I get it that not everybody is going to be compatible as friends. That's life. I also get it that not everybody is going to be in total agreement with the next person's opinions, beliefs, interests, lifestyle, or whatever. But what we can and must do as a furry community is to recognize that we all have our differences and that we can and must be accepting of those differences. All else fails, it's very easy to avoid someone whose opinions you simply can't accept, or whose personality is downright scary (I've had to avoid one or two people like that over the years). I imagine there's a few people who would prefer to avoid me because they can't accept what makes me different. But that doesn't mean any of them should be silenced or driven from the fandom just because they're different.

We need to work hard to retain the furry fandom and community we originally discovered and loved. If that means starting up new fur meets or entire furry conventions because other meets or conventions got too politicized bowing to the whims and whines of a handful of people, so be it. The new meets and conventions can tell the whiners that they can either not look at or listen to the things they don't like, or they can simply stay the fuck home. The rest of us are too busy having fun to put up with a bunch of childish bullshit.

I was just going through some older journals I haven't cleared out of my Inbox, and saw your post.

I believe this is AC 2008 Masquerade sketch you were looking for.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iLO1W6ZsooM

That's it! Thank you so much!

Completely agree with you sadly...I recently had this conversation with a few other people and pointed out these very things. I've been in the fandom since 2003ish? and I have noticed a massive change. I don't think it is the furry fandom persay, though. I think it's every fandom, as in society...I've never been this uncomfortable in society, ever until the last few years. It's very sad that this has become a huge chunk of the furry fandom...Back then it was nice to meet someone who was gay so that i didn't feel alone when i was younger, back then it was nice to meet new furries so i wouldn't feel alone...Now both groups are fighting against each other...Furries vs furries, gays vs gays, groups vs groups, race vs race, it's so sad :(

I have a friend who lost friends in 2016 when he said who he had voted for.

This journal post is not about the American political agenda, its about the hate, toxicity, and childish, entitled kids who are flowing in and infesting the fandom with their spoiled, emo degeneracy.

I heard a line that I thought was relevant to this....

Bad manners is not the child's fault, it's the parents....

So teach those young, up-in coming furs how it's done or they will never know!

Thank you, finally something that needed to be said, respected and needs to get into peoples minds on whats going on. I 100% approve this.

More and more people are speaking their mind on the direction the fandom is going, especially those of us who enjoyed it for many, many years, unlike the toxic children who is infesting it lately with their diseased mindset.

Yup I agree again and I seen that change in the cons and fandom itself and in today's world. Today, it's hard to even make new friends, that's way I came to furry, and it made me more friends that I ever hope for. I don't want to give up...but I am with you on this.

Nowadays, in order to become acquainted with younger furs [NO, not ALL OF them,] you have to do research... and carefully create a list of attributes of likes, dislikes, triggers, pronouns, species, which artists they like and dislike, what music they like or dislike, political views, and a myriad of other things that WE MUST CONFORM TO AND ACCEPT, or else we will be labeled a "Nazi," a "Clown," a "Boomer," or anything ending in "-phile" or "-phobe."

We must put up with them having sex in the hotel lobby... because ENTITLEMENT and FREEDOM and MUH RIGHTS! We have to stand silent while they push and shove us out of the way because ENTITLED LITTLE SHITS. We must turn a deaf ear to them screaming "I WANT TO FUCK YOU" to random other people in the public plaza outside the hotel, with children present... because FREEDOM OF MUH SPEEEAAACH. We must put up with their dirty diapers on the sidewalk because MUH RIGHTS!!! We must put up with their profound, shitfaced drug and alcohol use because otherwise, "NAZI! NAZI!!!" and then Bewares, and Call-outs, and Doxxing.

Mingling in the public at cons has lost almost all of its charm for me. Because it's been reduced to waiting for the next sloppy, drunk, entitled embarrassment to do something profoundly stupid.

THIS so much!

100% AGREED!

Couldn't have said it better...

I've been in the fandom for 15+ years now (I was 22 when I joined, 16 when I discovered it), and in the past few years it has really began to plummet. This past weekend at AC was absolutely terrible in regards to everything being mentioned here.

most of us who been around the fandom for a number of years can see the decline and bad change.

Lots of political stuff like those nazifurs fuck off stickers, uh?

I vehemently disagree with most of what you have mentioned.

Certainly, there are a few outspoken individuals who may take call-out culture too far. But do they represent a large portion of the fandom? Not in the slightest. What I happen to see here in the comments are people complaining about the "Dreaded" SJW's because their unconscionable opinions will no longer be tolerated. We live in a changing world, and as a result, many simply refuse to accept how people want to live their lives. It really all comes down to a lack of respect for others and elitism.

The fandom is better than it ever has been. The community and convention attendance are growing, people are still loving and open, and the fursuits and art have been top quality.

So please just relax, and just live and let live.

I don't see any of that at all. What I see is a majority of young'uns who have a false sense of entitlement. These types are the majority of everyone I encountered at the con. "Here's my opinion, but if you don't agree with me, you will be labeled a Nazi or anything ending in -phobe or -ist."

"Their opinions will no longer be tolerated?" That somehow doesn't seem to fit with a lot of these people yelling about "MUH RIGHTS" and "MUH EXPRESSION." That sounds more like communist censorship to me.

And "elitism" is truly the definition of "I feel I'm different so I want to force the rest of the world to treat me differently."

I think there still are many who are loving and open. Their numbers are dwindling.

If people are being labeled as Nazis, then they're probably doing something egregious which warrants that.

Please, do explain what you mean by "feeling different"

Nope, that's my point, the things that have been done which I have seen, have nothing to do with being a Nazi or a supremacist of any kind. And "feel different" can mean a myriad of things as well. I think we're all familiar with the types, and I do not engage in splitting hairs.

Well if you're not going to be specific, then you either do not want to mention what it is for backlash, or there really is nothing and it's just complaining.

Again, agreed.

I agree with you 100%. When I joined the fandom back in 98 I think it was nice. People helped others out in the time of need and did not ask anything in return. When I went to FC 02 (Mt very first con.) People made me feel welcome to the group. Now almost every time I see a posting it is drama about this person doing this or that and if you like this person then we cannot be friends anymore. The worst is people still bring up stuff that happened long time ago and just seem like they cannot let the past be the past. Also when I first joined if there was drama it was taken care of very quickly and swept under the rug never to be seen or heard of again. What this fandom needs is a huge purge of the toxic people that think they are better than everybody else or the people that jump on a bandwagon without knowing the full truth about the issue. I have seen way to many times about rumors going around that somebody did something bad. Only to find out later that it was all untrue and started by somebody that wanted to be in the spotlight. Then not seeing anybody saying sorry to that person for keeping the drama going.

Yep so very true. Just looking at uncensored furry twitter as an average daily now is stress inducing shit-show.

Also I do not think I will go to another big con again. It just seems like all the big cons are nothing but drama, what room has the most booze, who can yiff who the most. It just seems the younger furs take pics of the booze in the room. It is people like you me and a few others that seem to take pics of other fursuiters that are at the con.

How dare you critique the furry fandom! It’s perfect here, what’s wrong with you!? /s

I’m just gonna copy & paste my remark from another journal.

I don’t think it’s a furry thing. The society in general is going straight to hell.

Thank the fucking psychopaths and sociopaths that run our major institutions and social media for turning greed, pride, lust, and excessive consumption into virtues for the masses to emulate.

We live in Social Darwinist hell. Where everyone is at best an asset for getting stuff from and at worst another rival to fend off. Where mental illness is weaponized by the elites to subdue the masses. And nothing we do has any meaning anymore.

God is dead.

yep indeed, society in general is falling into despair festering sore.

"but from the ashes WE SHALL BUILD A BETTER ONE!" Heh sorry couldn't help that :P

Yeah I joined back in '99 as well and it was so much more warmer back then. You literally could just walk up to anyone you didn't know and they would be happy to hold a conversation with ya. The funny thing I've noticed as well is a lot of those friendships that I made back then have held over time where as some of the newer ones have faded too fast. It's just so hard now a days to even reach out to people specially if they think their furry popular. Shit some won't even answer a direct question if you got a low follower count. I gave up trying now myself. Now I'm just a fringe fur. And yeah this call out culture is some fucked up shit. It's like every week now it seems. Every time I see this all I can think is man these people need to have some real world shit go wrong in their life so they can understand what doesn't fucking matter.

marf sorry ranted a lil myself there. Anyway yeah I feel what your saying n think your right and since we both have 20y and have ran in different circles gotta be something to it yah. Be well hun *snugs*

Yep, Most all of us see the bad change, except for the one post above who has a different mindset and seems to support the sickness infesting the fandom. its not what it used to be, and will get worse, far worse.

Eh, Nowadays if you try to have a conversation or meeting new furs, online, you may get blocked because they don't know you

At cons, if you don't own a suit you may get ignored all the time or don't get recognized as a furry and then shunned

As another member of the old guard...I had a great time at AC.

Its sad that not everyone did.

Have I noticed a change in the fandom since I joined back in 98? Sure, some bad..but also some good!

I have voiced my opinions on the toxic nature that some (many?) people seem to have nowadays, but I (like so many others) think its more or less just how society is right now, its not a furry thing, its a youth thing.

And thats OK.

While its easy to be doom and gloom one needs only to look at history to see that things like this happen AND...it passes and we move on, with effort obviously.

So I disagree, the fandom will continue what it looks like in ten years depends on us, the fans.

John.

Preach brother!

100% agree with this!

Whatever is happening in society is reflected in the fandom.

We don't need a reset. We need a reality check for the grown up children who believe they can go around and be moral arbiters/idealists rooted in narcissism and egotism.

It's the job of a realist to smack the idealist back into reality, of which is currently happening.

I dunno if it's because I've joined Instagram in 2015, but I've been noticing that it has increasingly become worse to me. The furry drama. Some people make the drama into Memes which perpetuates it. I understand it's funny and all sometimes, but funny or not it drives the drama... I miss when I was completely oblivious to it towards the beginning when I first joined.

I couldn't agree more with all this.

And it's even worse when you remember that this is happening all over society as a whole. Nowadays, everything is problematic, and just quick glance at someone now can end up being "offensive".

The reality is that everyone is being separated from each other. Too many "groups", too many "bubbles". And that's one of the main things that's causing society to ruin more and more. People need to be together, support each other and accept the differences. No one is equal to no one, and they shouldn't be. If one person likes or supports something another disagrees with, as long as it's nothing extreme, they just gotta respect it. They shouldn't try to "call them out", or post screenshots of their conversations on Twitter inviting a hate mob against them.

People are becoming less and less tolerant of each other. More and more people only want others who think exactly the same as they do near them, and if just a single person has a different or contrary opinion, they're already out of the 'group'. There is just no respect for difference of opinion unless they are exactly the same, or at least favorable, to the ones they have. The most self entitled "tolerant" people never tolerate others who don't agree with them.

Years ago, a furry con would be one of the events I'd really want to go to. To see all the cute fursuiters, see my online friends, take lots of pics and videos... But nowadays, my will to go to one just keeps dwindling down more and more. I don't want to go to a place where people will be militating all the time, protesting, and shaming on others who have different views, opinions and political leanings. It just seems you can't discuss about anything nowadays without being called names, "phobe" this and that, and etc.

And from what I've seen, most of the time, all of these behaviors always come from people who lean to the left side of the political spectrum. The "woke" kind of people. God forbid you have someone reveal they are a right-wing next to them. For them, there's no "right". You're either a leftist, or a alt-right'er, or from the extreme-right.

Honestly, maybe it wouldn't be such a bad idea to end up leaving the fandom one day. We already have what's really important to us, which would be our friends, our sonas, our fursuits, etc. Why stay at a place that's already burning to ashes with intolerance and hate?

well said.

well said.. I knew had left the fandom as i never heard from you in years, and with your relationship i knew you had more important priories. I do miss you and Scarlet, we had so much fun at Condition that year! same goes for the SSC NYE events that been running now for almost 12 years.

We have gotten old and the young people seem to be poorly potty trained. Instead of open parties we have invite lists. I have faith that a few peeps are learning compassion, Yes sir and yes ma'am.

sends hugs*

Is that difficult to be furry in the US?

Ok probably i dont have a say into this since i joined 2015 but

Every community is set to decline and furry fandom makes No exception to this rule, is a natural and social process

Furry is a very old community, it started up in the 80's sci fi cons with the furry parties or skunkfucker parties for Hardcore scifi fans and now? it has Big Conventions with more than 5000 attendants

Lots of things happened in the history of this community

The birth of the first very furry convention

The birth of MUCK for Roleplay purpose and newsgroups like alt.fan.furry for chatting and Exchange opinions

The spreading of the fandom from the us to Europe with the birth of Eurofurence

the Disasters of CF8 and the relative creation of the Burnedfur movement

The end of Confurence and the rise of Anthrocon then and Midwest Fur Fest now

The furry civil war between Burnedfur and their Opponents

The bad press campaign against the fandom with that Vanity Fair article and then the Infamous CSI episode

The spreading of furry hate due to Aforementioned bad press

campaign with groups like Something Awful and YT trolls

The birth of Furaffinity which is nowadays most popular and huge furry art gallery, So much is true that the site is frequently targeted by DDOS conducted by trolls or haters and Consequently the start up of the furry popularity contest

The Death of lemonade coyote, an hero into and outside the fandom for his work, i think it was the most shocking Death in the fandom

The infamous chlorine gas incident at MFF 2014

The downfall of Rainfurrest in 2015

The rise of Furry Raider and the shutdown of Rocky Mountain Fur Con which started up those political stuff we are talking about.

Kerothewolf vs furry fandom

Now i think the fandom is at a stalemate, it could become better or worse, and it It's up to us to decide the next move.

Oh yeah the nazifurs lol besides I was about to make a WW2 furry story about allied forces and axis forces fighting.

Damn it's been years since 2014 about the gas attack on a furry con.

I'll personally be glad when this terrible, prideful community is finally dead: nu more seeing idiots label everything Anthro "Furry".

Or they label my characters furries even though they're not furries at all.

The cancel culture is bullshit and everyone knows it. What ever happened to freedom of speech if you have a different opinions they're cancel you. But the truth is that the democratic and the republican party are basically the same. This is why I hate political parties because they're divisive. The leftists likes to label people like christians isna rich white mans faith but in reality it's never has been. Christianity is for everyone that's includes the LGBTQ too. The rightwing has LGBTQ people too and people of color. But this is where the leftists hates. I don't support white supremacists or any racial supremacy group in that matter. The media is a tool to brainwash people like the leftists and the rightwingers too.

I agree.

Well Only artists who are Furries who made the art can count as the Anthro animals being called Furries.

the Furry Fandom Is Dying Of Dementia let it become a burning memory

The fandom is becoming politicized in a bad direction, becoming the worst of the current sociey's political insanity & collapse. The once open, all-welcoming, community that once shared common interests of anthropomorphic art costuming, and sharing a like interest where evereyone could feel happy, safe, and welcome, is long dead & gone.

"The journal you are trying to find is not in our database." O rly?

because it was deleted to cover it up.