Sometimes I feel rude and dumb for asking o.o I don't want to be the umpteenth person at the con who asks the same question. (Also, I am afraid people will think "How could you not see I am XYZ?")
Is it okay to say "they" when I am not sure?

yep! it can definitely be difficult sometimes in irl social situations because a lot of cis people aren't accustomed to being asked and may take it as an insult. "they" is a good neutral pronoun for when asking could cause problems.

i tend to introduce myself with my pronouns ("hi, i'm charlie, i use they pronouns") to open up the option for the other person to state theirs. however, i do avoid saying anything in situations that are likely to be risky (e.g. at a church with a bunch of old people...) and just try to go for neutral pronouns where i can.

it's definitely easier online because a lot of people have their pronouns listed, so you can just check their profile ' v '

Amen

I definitely agree with this. I 100% agree. I refer to everyone neutrally until they tell me their preferred pronouns or make them obvious.
That being said... Most people in society just don't get it. I'm glad that LGBQT* individuals are getting more attention / recognition by the media today because it makes it easier but, like... People who don't get it will just look and assume. it's really sad

and, like, as someone who is agendered and prefers to be referred to neutrally I can definitely understand the frustration that comes with assumption. in those situations really I just try to explain it, yknow? some people get really aggressive and I feel like that turns people off of asking for pronouns

yeah, totally!

tbh i was talking more about online stuff and situations that are specifically meant to be queer-friendly... it's really annoying when there's a "lgbt safe space" but everyone there assumes pronouns all over the place. or when my pronouns and gender are specifically stated but people still assume i'm a girl because of how i draw my fursona

ohh yeah. well in that case yeah it's PRETTY HARD TO MISS online but I guess people will just be close minded.
favorite part is when people get angry at you, when you just tell them what you prefer to be called by

yeah its. not great ;;

My personal opinion here is that it is acceptable for people to initially assume that another self-identifies in the appropriate majority (of any identity label) if they politely accept when someone says they would prefer to be addressed in some other specific way.

i think there are certain situations where that isn't true, though. for example, in the furry fandom, people are significantly less likely to be cis and straight than the general population. additionally, there are a lot of people who identify as one gender but present as another through their fursona. because of this, i think the furry fandom has an especially strong obligation to not make these assumptions - although queer, trans, and gender non-conforming people may not be the majority, they are still a very strong minority within this community.

also, i think it's important to note that being referred to by neutral pronouns does little harm to cis people, but being misgendered can cause intense distress and anxiety for many trans people. because of this it seems worthwhile to check pronouns or use neutral pronouns, as this is the easiest way to do the least amount of harm to others.

I think it might be important to have some good measure of the furry fandom's demographics if we are to make an argument that it is a statistical exception to the general population. It might be, but i'm pretty ignorant here of the statistics for both so its not like I can really say that I know either way.

I don't think it is merely enough to say that assuming gender labels is wrong just because, when spoken, they may have the potential to cause distress. Gender identity is probably not significantly different from any sort of other potentially distressful statements or terminologies, is it? I some ways I don't feel like it is. That principle applied elsewhere doesn't seem right. One would have to continually ask permission before discussing any sort of potentially stressful topic or use of terminology, and there are a fair few there. And additionally, I think its important to note that assuming gender labels based on appearance isn't malevolent or antagonistic. I don't even think its fair to say that the assumption is (in general) sufficiently recklessly negligent, although I can see where someone might disagree with me there and that's fine. Either way, prima facie, it doesn't seem like a robust argument against assumption to me.

Also something to note, as strange as it might seem it is certainly possible that neutral pronouns could be distressful to cis-identifying persons, or other groups. My personal opinion here is that neutral pronouns are fine though, and I can see the value in their use this way.

Lastly, I don't mean to start an argument or cause any fights in the comments. So just as a safeguard, if you'd rather not have this conversation go on further I understand! Just let me know if you'd prefer that, I'll respect it.

ye, we obviously disagree and this is a subject that's caused me a lot of trouble in my life so i would prefer not to continue since i'm not sure i can keep from getting frustrated and upset

thank you for sharing your thoughts!

this is so important!!! also your character is really adorable!!! <3

ahh thank you!

p r e a c h

Yes, ask every single person you ever meet - no matter how insignificant the interaction will be - if they were a quad-gendered demi-fox queen of the lizards.

i've heard a lot of transphobic bullshit, but "demi-fox queen of the lizards" is a new one

you don't have to stop random people on the street to find out their gender. but if it's socially appropriate/expected to know someone's name, it's appropriate to also find out their pronouns. for strangers you can just use neutral ones ("they" is usually good)

stop trying to make it out like it's such a difficult thing to do, it's really not.

This is super cute omg. Though honestly people who are assuming genders are trying to be polite, and that's
the socially correct thing to do. As a genderqueer (for the label's sake), I've seen far too many tight asses who would
even get offended by this question. When people are okay with being called a cuntboy, but not a woman on accident,
I don't think people would handle this question as well...

yeah, it's a little complicated since it's a new social convention

that said, it's almost always acceptable to ask online! people are relatively anonymous and even an uptight cis person probably wouldn't be surprised by the question since most of the time we don't even know what the other person looks like. tbh when i drew this i was thinking specifically about online interactions, like on FA

generally i've found that the best strategy irl is to just introduce myself with name and pronouns, that way it opens things up for the other person to do the same but isn't too rude or invasive.

When I said uptight, I meant uptight trans people. Most other people with GID I meet are incredibly
rude towards white cis men or anyone who doesn't support LGTB (and incredibly hateful). Obviously we aren't like that,
our main difference is that you go by they/them and I go by any pronouns.

On another note though, I've noticed going by your biological sex makes it easier on both parties, even accepting it
online. I like to share this with people because it was really helpful to me. I go by girl online and offline, I say I accept
any pronouns though and prefer she/he. It keeps your head in the game, and it always helped me know where I belong in a
sense.

i've actually never had anything but positive responses from trans people when i ask about pronouns.

tbh i can be pretty rude to people who don't support queer folks? idk, i'm not sure why i have to be infinitely patient and kind towards people who consistently dismiss me and say awful things. i try to educate people up to a point, but beyond that... i'm not going to be nice forever to people who dont think i deserve to exist. i don't have a problem with cis people inherently, but cis people who refuse to be respectful do kind of piss me off (it applies to everyone, but cis people are a lot more likely to treat me like shit for my gender)

i'm not exactly sure what you mean by that last paragraph, but i can't go by my assigned sex. it's really not an option except for in cases where i have to for safety, like with certain family members. i spent a long time trying to pretend i was the gender everyone assumed, but after becoming increasingly dysphoric & suicidal i decided to just be honest. it's not worth it for me to pretend for other peoples' convenience at the expense of my own mental health

huh, not for me.

Um, well if someone says something like gay marriage is wrong but they aren't rude about it, I'd be the asshole to snap at them. Not everyone
supports everything and honestly it's different that few people don't even know about it.

You're telling me you can't go by your biological structure? Your biological sex is just that; physical features of your body in which says whether
you will be a male or a female. When someone asks who you are, do you go, "Oh I'm ___ and my eyes are xe-blue. Please refer to them as xlue and xaqua" ?
Because that is transgender put into transeyecolor. What I'm saying is, you can go by your biological sex. It's not "assigned," no one gave you your sex, it
is a biological trait that could have been anything just like your eye color, hair color, skin color, height, and all that jazz. So - looking at it at a scientific level, ignoring
an entire biological trait like that might prove less than helpful. Your biological state is permanant, your mental state has to be fed in order to continue on.

uhhhhhhhhhhh

eye color is not like gender. gender is considered an important part of mental and social identity, while eye color is a minor one at best

the whole concept of being trans means your gender doean't match your assigned sex? and i say assigned because people can (and do) change characteristics of their biological sex (hormones, genitalia, secondary sex characteristics - all the things we use to decide what sex someone is), so a trans person's current biological sex might match their gender even if their original assigned sex did not

the only things you can't really change are chromosomes and the actual reproductive parts of the system (uterus, ovaries, testicles). chromosomes are irrelevant to the social concept of sex. hardly anyone has their chromosomes tested, and there are actually intersex conditions that can cause an XY person to be born with a vagina and go through typical female puberty and stuff like that. there are also many cis people who have their reproductive parts removed for various reasons, as well as people born with "defective" reproductive systems, and we still classify their sex based on their visible genitalia (when a baby is born with a vagina, doctors don't check to see if it has ovaries before declaring it a girl).

i understand that you're trans and that that you are comfortable being perceived as a girl and referred to by any pronouns, but please understand that a lot of trans people are not comfortable with being treated as something they aren't? just because you're trans and it doesn't bother you doesn't mean you get to decide that all trans people should just accept whatever pronouns people assume for them

honestly you should probably stop talking to me unless you want to fight about this

it doesn't matter what your gender is, it's incredibly rude to tell me i should just accept any pronouns because it's biologically "correct." my biology does not "correctly" represent my gender, and i'm not interested in being misgendered for the convenience of others

like, im glad your pronouns are working out for you, but you don't get to tell me what pronouns i should or shouldn't accept?

i kinda wish they had a "like" button or something for the comments and such. :/