Umm well i think you just defined friendship in that way cause you were treated as an option or something... so umm friendships are supposed to be a bond not about the longest time you and another guy were with one another... but with the moments you and that guy made .?. Friendships were not meant to be used just as a label... but it must be used as a term on what kind of bond you and that guy made... :3

If you were to take a look at my usual social activity, you might say that I have dozens of friends. Yet I still frequently feel completely alone and empty. These 'friends' are just people I interact with in non-negative ways, and their bond towards me is likely stronger than my bond towards them. Even when I might otherwise try to open up to one of them, in this day and age they remain closed off. I even try to get some of these people together to do things like private board gaming and video gaming, but without any success 95% of the time I try. Eventually, I just stop trying.

Meanwhile I have a few close friends. People I've learned I can trust. People who have earned my respect and effort. I have precious little to give, and I make sure to give it to those few who deserve it most. But even those friendships can have struggles and need breaks. And right now, every one of my close friends is needing a break. I no longer have anyone with which to have regular contact with, and I haven't made a friend on that level in 5+ years due to trust issues as well as repeated failures when I DO try to let someone into my heart.

Yup you got trust issues... this is the right time to do some trust exercises :3 teambuilding :D

just never give up and keep trying ... no offense but i think you need to find more real friends who can help you when you fall and can help you stand up and succeed ... if they no longer have constant contact with you....i suggest to find more friends ... meanwhile in my life ... we made a group in fb and still having contact with eqch other even after graduation in highschool and stilll we are friends who help each other in times of need ... i feel ya on ur second paragraph... sometimes people need breaks and all and you didnt suspect that you wont have contact with them in a couple of days ... i think in your situation youll just move on.. forget about the past .. if it means to delete all those people in you lives and try to find new friends in which they are the type of people who can help you all the way :)

The key to friendships are regular, frequent, unstructured, interactions, of the sort we normally get from sports events, church groups, the workplace, and sometimes with neighbors or the parents of a child's friend.

As furries, we operate most like a church group, but talking to someone once at a con to assess compatibility and then skipping straight to one on one interaction isn't enough to bond the old fashioned way. It's too difficult to sustain. Online or distance friendships form best when there's a regular hangout such as a skype chat, MMO, or other activity, around which a group gathers regularly, 3-5 people, who are online every night or almost every night at the same time, so you can all talk to each other and begin to track and care about each other's lives.

If you move straight to direct interaction, you will run out of things to talk about before having figured out the limits of what is and isn't appropriate to share about yourselves. (Not just limited to politeness or political correctness. People don't discuss sports with me and I don't discuss books or work with some people because I/they don't have enough context to find it interesting or meaningful.)

That might be your experience but it's definitely subjective and dependent on each person. Some some people thrive by having wise and varied friend groups, while others need a much more structured setup.

Regular unstructured interaction is the friendmaking process according to modern psychology.


The application, of course, is personal, but don't knock the whole thing as an anecdote based on one experience. I researched and then implemented a method because I wanted help making friends, not the other way around.

But what if that type of interaction is too intimidating? What if it's too alienating? In groups, I'm either too busy to do anything but be an organizer, and cannot spend the energy to form bonds, or I feel isolated by today's reliance on intoxication to have a good time and be regularly social, or the topics are simply such that I have nothing to contribute. Not to mention anyone in that situation of the opposite sex will already be confident and happy and taken. Someone who is flawed like me stands no chance of appealing to someone in such an environment, because those flaws take a lot of effort to see past.

I can talk almost endlessly in one-on-one, but that ends up being a negative thing. Too much at once through online contact and people's already limited free time causes me to become this odd liability and then those people get stressed and just stop talking. Or they switch from being quick and enthusiastic in their contact to replying once every two weeks and I end up stressed and unhappy and untrusting.

I love doing things together with those I care about, as well, but one of the other problems I have is that my life goal cannot be furthered from where I am at. Even if I found someone locally, the chance that my dream would win out over theirs is unlikely with the economy being what it is. I may have stable, albeit weak income, but it is completely flexible in terms of where I can get it at. Most people need to be in a larger city or tech region these days because they have dreams of working with certain types of companies. That's part of the reason I frequently pursue artists as friends is because those that make their income through their work have more flexibility, but when those people end up succeeding at that it seems to consume their lives to the point they can do nothing else. :(

I don't know... You have good points about how such things are normally formed, but with the issues I have, I feel out of place in those scenarios. And the hobbies that I do have, I tend to be around people that I don't seem to want to have much to do with outside of those activities. :| It really sucks that my area has such a crappy furry scene, one that I no longer trust or relate to.

You made a REALLY interesting point that I think is worth repeating: This idea of talking AT friends, not talking with them.

You've put into words something that's been gnawing at me, but which I couldn't put my finger on. Most popular social media today involves indirect communication through the public sphere: Twitter, Facebook status updates, comments on posts on things like Tumblr or forums. And yeah, as a person who was a HUGE MSN Messenger fan back in the day, I've definitely noticed this trend: you don't have hours-long conversations with people so much as prolonged back-and-forths through social media, one sentence or post at a time.

It's worth noting that, at least in an evolutionary contexts, our "social networks" consisted of the group of people with whom we interacted on a daily basis, who lived geographically near us, and with whom we shared mutual interests (all of us had a vested interest in finding food, fending off prey, collectively raising offspring, etc...) Now, fast forward a few thousand years, and "frienship" in the context of fandoms such as the furry fandom has changed: We try to make friends with people who are geographically distant, with whom we may only have physical contact once or twice a year, and who may share next to none of our same ambitions, goals, or interests. Moreover, we're overwhelmed with the sheer NUMBER of social contacts we've got: hundreds, even thousands of friends on social media makes it tough to have a meaningful relationship with many of them.

Of course, this doesn't mean that it's impossible to have friendship in this day and age, nor does it mean the concept is dead! It just means that the people who are likely to be your closest, most meaningful friends, are likely to be those you see the most, those who live near you, those you have the most face-to-face interaction with, and those with whom you share mutual goals. In other words, if a person spends all their time online interacting with a multitude of people over social media, they may find, despite having hundreds of "friends", that they feel lonely or out of touch; in comparison, a person who has two or three friends who live nearby and who they see once or twice a week because they live nearby is far more likely to feel that they have a more fulfilling social life (I can attest to this!)

That said, it's also worth noting that what constitutes a "fulfilling" social life is completely subjective: some people think "wow, I've only got one really close friend", and feel like they should have more. But if one or two really close friendships makes you happy and fulfills one's need for social interaction and social support, there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. We have this false belief that everyone should have dozens or hundreds of friends, and the reality is that very few people can sustain that. For most of us, a small handful of close friends and a broader circle of more casual "acquaintances" is the norm, and that's fine. It may sound a bit hokey, but in the end, it comes down to quality of relationships, rather than quantity.

So, to bring it back to your initial post: I wouldn't lament if some or even most of the folks you've met at cons or online don't wind up being super-close friends. If you have even a few folks you know more closely and with whom you have a decent relationship, that's a pretty good state of affairs. And, if not, it may suggest that perhaps you're looking for close friendships in a place (e.g., social media, the internet) that's not necessarily conducive to that sort of relationship.

Just my two cents!

With so many people at your fingertips to give you the things you need, you don't need friends. When you have a job to eat over half of your free time, the rest of the time is easily spent being a consumer and talking 'at' the world. Social media is only half of the problem. The other half being the social pressure to indulge in all of the popular media. I consume heavily of various gaming and television to the point that I actually struggle to find something to watch or play with which I haven't already done so. And I'm someone who has nothing BUT free time. When you translate that into a person with a job, the outcome becomes fairly obvious: Give up consumption of entertainment, or give up structured social contact. The majority of the world these days chooses the latter, it seems.

Unfortunately, as listed above, I've been continuously unsuccessful in finding people to relate to locally. I either get intimidated by group events, or otherwise alienated and uncomfortable when attending them. I don't do well in a lot of group settings anymore, because I start to feel alone and panic. If I had with me one of my actual best friends, such situations would lose all of their intimidation. But reaching the point of having someone at your side can only be accomplished through such activities in the first place. It's... very frustrating.

Additionally, with my extremely minimal income, I cannot afford to continuously leave the house and spend money to seek friendship. Nevermind the social concept of dating inequality in spite of gender equality. Males still have to approach females for relationships. And let's just say I suck at that.

Someone recently suggested to me to look up the 'straight-edge' group. I've always disliked social groups where there is a reliance on a substance to 'make the event fun'. Drinking, pot, etc. I stay far from that stuff, and as a result I tend to be uncomfortably isolated. Supposedly however that's the term for those who avoid all of those things and socialize in a natural way.

For me, fulfillment is a best friend who is also a girlfriend and someone I can be mutually supportive of. Someone who I can adventure with and enjoy life with and share in the new experiences that would otherwise be incredibly challenging for me on my own. Someone who may be a little on the shy side, but who tries as hard as me to do new things. From there, a few stable and wise friends who can be there when I need them (and heck, I'm always around) and I'd be incredibly happy in life. Oh, and a fox pet, of course. :P

But currently, things are as far from that as possible. While I do still have people that I consider best friends, every one of them is taking a break from social stuff for real life reasons. They don't have time or energy to be social at all, and that's even taking into account that I'm about as important to them as they are to me. Right now, I have no one to talk to on a daily and close basis. Nevermind anyone to be affectionate towards even in a digital sense.

I leave the house for grocery, and for Werewolf events. I don't seem to come across people to be friends with through that method either. No one has the time to invite new people into their life, nevermind someone with flaws that require a large amount of effort to work past. To be close to me, to gain my trust, effort has to be made, and it has to be something that someone wants. But I'm past the age of being able to be friends with kids who have that much free time to make bonds, and with dating conventions being what they are, I'm expected to be the one to take the initiative for anything involving romance.

And it's paralyzing. :(

Have to agree with the first poster in saying that you already seem to know what friendship is to you, and much of what I have to say about it has already been said.

A lot of people that I know simply don't reply to things I say or ask even when directed at them specifically, and similarly the last time I tried to host an event (that, prior to the fact was met with "Yeah, that's be great, we're really interested) I was forced to cancel it due to all but two people failing to RSVP.

People kinda suck sometimes, but beyond that? I can only really say two things - I wish I had the wisdom to have something poignant to say on the subject, and I can sympathize with this; sorry to hear you're being put through it.

Social media can be a way to stay in contact with people you see every week, and find out what or how they're doing. I don't personally put any real energy in social media outside of local friends but it's still very useful. It's more essential with long-distance friends but it's useful for local ones as well.

Drugs and alcohol are a big thing for a lot of folks, but neither me or Corb touch either and that doesn't get us excluded from much. You always feel it, though, since people have a hard time talking about social times without talking about alcohol. :/ But there are other people who don't do either who have a fine time (and are social nexuses, even!) -- it's really reassuring to see that.

Honestly, the people who insist on getting stinking drunk any time they're around people are not interesting anyways. The ones who can moderate, I can generally find common ground with.

Hmmm...this is a tough one. There are several great comments above that cover most of the salient points, so since I'm on a tablet with an e-keyboard I'll try to be short.

You do seem to have a pretty well defined meaning for 'friendship', and no one can tell you you're wrong. Though I have a different view, I can sympathize with the reality of the situation not matching your ideal definition. I'd advise patience - things change constantly, and eventually your friends will have more time to be around again. In the meantime, perhaps look at the current situation as a method of growing - go try doing new things to practice stretching your boundries. Growth is good, but not always easy nor comfortable.

For instance - I have the exact opposite problem you do. I am the type of person that needs my own space to be 'whole', and for the last 5 years I haven't had that. No matter what I've done, I can't seem to get it to where I have space and time to myself without others around. I've been at wits end for over a year, and it got to a really uncomfortable point back a couple months ago. I had to step back and look at the bigger picture, and try to find a balance point, and thankfully was able to. I'm still not entirely OK yet, but at least I'm not viciously angry all the time anymore.

The point of all of this is to just be patient - it's a learned skill, and practice helps. And oh, on the lonely thing - I can sympathize, but other than "don't try too hard" I don't know what to offer for advice. I'm also still alone, and given my current lifestyle and living situation, prospects are very grim indeed. I practice my patience just as I advise others to do, though I do have my bouts of wishing I had that special woman to share my life with. Haven't found her yet, and honestly don't know if I will at this point. But life goes on, and there's still a lot worth doing even if I never find Ms. Right.

TL:DR You're not the only one, but it eventually gets better (or maybe just easier to accept).

K Fox

A very interesting point, and one that is... sadly all too true. We're living in what could probably be considered a transitional phase. Prior to the Internet, technology provided only moderately quick and convenient ways to talk, and usually to ONE person at a time. Post Internet though, we have this incredible plethora of choices for instant (or near instant) digital communication either by text or by video/audio. Long Distance become a purely physical thing as it no longer stifles communication between friends, and the exposure to like-minded people that you want to be friends with has increased dozens of times over what it was before.

What it's created, however, is a weird new hyper-social environment for humans while lacking in tangible social contact. People associate with way, way more folks than they would have in the past, but their closeness to any of them tends to suffer as a result; particularly because it's harder to form a meaningful bond when you don't have direct contact with someone.

In time... I think society will figure it out and it'll settle into a more happy, balanced setup the way things did when the telephone was first invented. But how long that will take... I have no idea. I'm old enough that my generation sorta had one foot in each word - pre/post Internet, so I can certainly see and appreciate the difference, and mourn the loss of close friendships. But I also appreciate the vastly expanded ability to find friends in the first place.

There are still good people who are wonderful, close and caring friends. Truth be told, even in the days before the Internet, you'd only ever have a couple of those in your life if you were lucky. As the old saying goes "Good friends are hard to find." But they are out there. You'll find more, don't worry.

To be completely blunt with you, you need to find someone who feels the same way about games as you do. Who also has that same single-minded drive about them. I feel bad that you and I have not been closer over the years but I just don't have the same passion for gaming anymore, and card games just make me uncomfortable. I've tried. I'm smart, but I am not a fast thinker. So its not very fun for me to feel stupid every turn. You are really intense about what you love. I think that makes some people shy away, or tires them out. But I know its not the whole problem.

I feel very much the same as you do. Lots of stuff in my life that I want to share with others but everybody is tied up with their own friends or spread too thin already. It doesn't get better having a mate. I have Sdocat and we are extremely close but we are both very edgy in social situations(especially as furries do seem to be getting younger and younger xD) so its like double the chance we will avoid a gathering if we are too nervous/tired to go. I don't think we've been to any furmeets in half a year or more. You get tired of trying and then feeling left out of every circle in the party. And then with "normal" people.... Sdo and I don't do alcohol either so that singles us out too.

It feels like sometimes, "You look cool, let's be friends!!" should be enough but it just isn't. People just don't want to make an emotional investment, or even an investment of time, unless they feel confident it will be worthwhile. know that's how I feel when a stranger is suddenly friendly with me. They don't know me so I immediately get nervous wondering exactly what they want with me. That kind of worth can only be proven over time, even if you're the kindest and more faithful person in the world, its not like its something people can smell. People won't pair off with you on a hunch... but they will walk away from you on a hunch.

What Springdragon said is correct. The most stable friendships and associations form after having repeated, non social contextual meetings with others. People can observe how others behave from a distance. You eventually learn enough about someone to become comfortable with them without the emotional pretext of demanding a give and take friendship right off the bat. A shared experience forms a bond. And if you are lucky, that bond will then lead to a friendship or more.

I'm up the same creek as you. I really have no idea how to get to that point. I draw, but on the internet I am one of thousands, probably millions of artists. I've made a few acquaintances through my work but all they want to talk about is art or the subject matter, or try to get me to RP...and even if it got deeper they are hundreds of miles away. Every bit of progress I seem to make with a new person that shares a common interest turns out to be heartbreakingly superficial.

The conclusion I've come to is that this is my life... I do value my alone time. Other people do tire me out and I only have so much to give. I get clingy too when things start picking up with someone so I feel hurt and rejected easily even when I know someone likes me and I read too far into their actions. Maybe there is something I could be doing differently but it would make me leave my comfort zone to the point that it may not be worth it. Just gotta keep doing what I am doing and hope I get lucky. Always take a chance whenever there's an opening but try not to force things. Because while people can't smell your worth, they can smell desperation.

Thank you for taking the time to write this post. :) It's interesting to hear these things from someone I knew growing up, from my same generation. I'm still really not sure what to do, and just because I enjoy playing games doesn't mean their my only passion, but I do really like adventure. So. *shrug*

If I could give you any advice in return, make it to the 4th of July party here. I won't be here, myself, but show up, and just relax. Don't worry about accomplishing anything in particular. (PS: I can give you a comparison on the feel of the local furry scene after I get back in around a month. Heh... vs Dallas.)