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It's been a while since I had a good rant...
7 years ago
Responding to The Tattooed Theist's video...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KdEIHld6_aM
Answering Atheists 3 | Christian Responding to Atheist
He's responding to a number of points by another youtuber called Atheist Voice. In fairness he agrees with many points, but some of his objections are head-desk worthy.
So up front this is a bit of a rant, though I've tried my best to be polite as he did seem to be trying his best to do the same.
# # #
I get the impression that you are sincere, but feel you are failing to tackle some of the finer points of Voice's arguments, and also seem unaware of some of the other aspects of atheist view that Voice skipped over for brevity.
"I was fine with being abused for my lack of faith."
This is one of your weakest arguments. And a rather crass and callous one too; albeit probably not intentionally so.
Firstly because what you experienced was abuse, and they should not have been doing that. But also and mostly because abuse is a scale, and just because you could cope with the level of abuse you endured, doesn't mean others can cope with, or should be subjected to, other levels of abuse elsewhere on that scale. Being kicked out of your house as a child, or fired from your job is not okay. Some atheists (though not Voice presumably) also live in nations where atheism carries the death sentence. So this kinda translates to "I survived being punched once, stop complaining someone hit you with a crowbar and broke multiple bones."
"How do atheists justify the big bang?"
We don't know the cause of the big bang. We also don't know for certain there was a cause for the big bang, since the principles of science and logic we are familiar with seem to break down within a few millionths of a second of the big bang. (Likely due to a flaw in our current knowledge.) Going out on a limb and say that you do know the answer, and the answer is essentially an immortal wizard with such and such characteristics, because of a book written by people who got everything they wrote about the universe wrong, takes more faith than simply repeating the best of our current scientific knowledge. A specific cause also takes more faith than the big bang itself, for which there is overwhelming evidence.
"...and then the fish grew legs and walked onto land..."
There are plenty of resources online that explain how evolution works, and what the evidence is for it. At this point the only way you can hold a view contrary to this is by refusing to look at that evidence. And yes you later criticise this very thing, but you still do it.
"If you come from nothing, then you are nothing and have no value."
And now you're basically expressing a variant of the second thing he complained about. That is not morality works, nor is it how value works. If people can be moral without Christianity, then they can have value without Christianity.
"Why pick on someone of a different faith?"
Because beliefs inform actions. For example, your belief that no christian would ask 'Where do mountains come from?' leads to the false conclusion that such things don't happen, and then to the action of you dismissing it. But have you ever actually meet a young earth creationist? Because they tend to be christian, and tend to ask questions like that. (Including the reverse. Where did the grand canyon come from?!) No, seriously, they really do. Faith can lead to false intuitions and false conclusions if you are not careful. For example the common and false conclusion that global warming isn't real (because god promised he wouldn't flood the world twice) and that the foolish action of voting for politicians who pander to their ignorance, and who pass laws that screw everyone over.
And that quote about not flooding the world twice? That was from an elected member of congress. Do you really want people that stupid writing and passing laws that may affect you negatively? Can you honestly endorse or approve of people voting for someone that profoundly ignorant, and placing their fellow citizens' well-being in potentially serious jeopardy as a result?
If Christians didn't do that, if you acted like trekies or bronies or furries, then no one would care about what you thought. But trekies don't campaign to end all aid to africa because of the prime directive. Bronies don't campaign to release all prisoners because forgiveness always work on the show. Many Christians by contrast keep trying to apply false intuitions and conclusions to the real world, and put their faith into the law - or keep laser focused on that one objective, and ignore all the harmful things politicians are doing when they aren't saying god in public. Because apparently, to a significant and christian voting block in america, if you say god in public, then it doesn't matter what horrible laws you pass, or what horrible effects those laws have.
And sure, 'not all Christians' but enough to put (frankly) stupid and (frankly) sometimes evil people into office, where they can and have done a lot of damage. Criticising and objecting to such conduct is not 'being a child'.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KdEIHld6_aM
Answering Atheists 3 | Christian Responding to Atheist
He's responding to a number of points by another youtuber called Atheist Voice. In fairness he agrees with many points, but some of his objections are head-desk worthy.
So up front this is a bit of a rant, though I've tried my best to be polite as he did seem to be trying his best to do the same.
# # #
I get the impression that you are sincere, but feel you are failing to tackle some of the finer points of Voice's arguments, and also seem unaware of some of the other aspects of atheist view that Voice skipped over for brevity.
"I was fine with being abused for my lack of faith."
This is one of your weakest arguments. And a rather crass and callous one too; albeit probably not intentionally so.
Firstly because what you experienced was abuse, and they should not have been doing that. But also and mostly because abuse is a scale, and just because you could cope with the level of abuse you endured, doesn't mean others can cope with, or should be subjected to, other levels of abuse elsewhere on that scale. Being kicked out of your house as a child, or fired from your job is not okay. Some atheists (though not Voice presumably) also live in nations where atheism carries the death sentence. So this kinda translates to "I survived being punched once, stop complaining someone hit you with a crowbar and broke multiple bones."
"How do atheists justify the big bang?"
We don't know the cause of the big bang. We also don't know for certain there was a cause for the big bang, since the principles of science and logic we are familiar with seem to break down within a few millionths of a second of the big bang. (Likely due to a flaw in our current knowledge.) Going out on a limb and say that you do know the answer, and the answer is essentially an immortal wizard with such and such characteristics, because of a book written by people who got everything they wrote about the universe wrong, takes more faith than simply repeating the best of our current scientific knowledge. A specific cause also takes more faith than the big bang itself, for which there is overwhelming evidence.
"...and then the fish grew legs and walked onto land..."
There are plenty of resources online that explain how evolution works, and what the evidence is for it. At this point the only way you can hold a view contrary to this is by refusing to look at that evidence. And yes you later criticise this very thing, but you still do it.
"If you come from nothing, then you are nothing and have no value."
And now you're basically expressing a variant of the second thing he complained about. That is not morality works, nor is it how value works. If people can be moral without Christianity, then they can have value without Christianity.
"Why pick on someone of a different faith?"
Because beliefs inform actions. For example, your belief that no christian would ask 'Where do mountains come from?' leads to the false conclusion that such things don't happen, and then to the action of you dismissing it. But have you ever actually meet a young earth creationist? Because they tend to be christian, and tend to ask questions like that. (Including the reverse. Where did the grand canyon come from?!) No, seriously, they really do. Faith can lead to false intuitions and false conclusions if you are not careful. For example the common and false conclusion that global warming isn't real (because god promised he wouldn't flood the world twice) and that the foolish action of voting for politicians who pander to their ignorance, and who pass laws that screw everyone over.
And that quote about not flooding the world twice? That was from an elected member of congress. Do you really want people that stupid writing and passing laws that may affect you negatively? Can you honestly endorse or approve of people voting for someone that profoundly ignorant, and placing their fellow citizens' well-being in potentially serious jeopardy as a result?
If Christians didn't do that, if you acted like trekies or bronies or furries, then no one would care about what you thought. But trekies don't campaign to end all aid to africa because of the prime directive. Bronies don't campaign to release all prisoners because forgiveness always work on the show. Many Christians by contrast keep trying to apply false intuitions and conclusions to the real world, and put their faith into the law - or keep laser focused on that one objective, and ignore all the harmful things politicians are doing when they aren't saying god in public. Because apparently, to a significant and christian voting block in america, if you say god in public, then it doesn't matter what horrible laws you pass, or what horrible effects those laws have.
And sure, 'not all Christians' but enough to put (frankly) stupid and (frankly) sometimes evil people into office, where they can and have done a lot of damage. Criticising and objecting to such conduct is not 'being a child'.
