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Furries are Toxic - What to do about it ☣️
7 years ago
More creators now than ever have spoken out against what the furry community has devolved into in 2018. The finest example of which being 
kothorix's new video The Furry Community Is Worse Than You Can Imagine
kothorixAs a content creator that has collaborated with over 100 artists, attended multiple conventions and interacted with the communities leading personalities, I absolutely agree. The furry community has hit it's lowest point since it's inception. It has grown so toxic that many need to second guess creativity out of concern in may offend someone, ANYONE and incur the mob to attempt to ruin their career.
One needs only to follow the money to decipher why. The target demographic has become jaded college students. Major furry platforms such as the one we are using right now have abandoned responsibility for Identity Politics. It no longer matters what you do, but the group you belong to. Ironic considering the main appeal many have to join is to escape that kind of rhetoric. Just enjoying the art, making friends and jacking off without some smug asshole breathing down your neck about how shameful it is.
I've been in the community for around 6 years now and the amount of genuine people I've met is disturbingly low. Most 'Popufurs' will stab you immediately in the back if you ever challenge them. They just want ass-licking, obedient 'yes' men. Even upcoming artists immediately abuse their power once you give them a plug. It becomes borderline impossible to organize competent teams as everyone is only in service to their own pursuit for fame and status.
The amount of creators I consider good, genuine people with no agenda is equivalent to the amount of fingers I have on each hand. The very same people that far too often have an endless stream of smear campaigns trying to ruin their lives out of spite. The same can be said about conventions, too afraid to upset the vocal minority that they will never feature a GOH that isn't subservient. I haven't enjoyed the last few conventions I have attended, as it always devolves into highschool drama.
I'm already getting blamed as being the inspiration for the above video, birthing these ideas and views on Cuckshack. I don't consider this offensive, as the more eyes I can open on the state of the furry community the better. I have tried being a thankless Martyr, someone creators can walk all over to rise up the ranks at my own detriment. As soon as people milk either money, plugs or artistic favors out of you, they are immediately on social media to cry how terrible of a person you are for the maximum amount of attention possible. It's shallow, self-centered and the kind of behavior I'd expect out of a sociopath let alone a furry.
I need to embrace my shadow instead of trying to be the absolute good example all the time. More content in service to just me, put my career first and anyone with a problem with anything I make can suck it. Only with that harmony can I actually get stuff done around here. What good is a role model if they surmount to little more than a doormat for toxic assholes?
I'll still be a furry, but it will be my own version that puts a heavy emphasis on personal liberty. The furry community in it's current state does not represent me and I'm no longer going to wait patiently for it to do better.
The one thing we can agree on is that when a community grows more popular, it includes those who are toxic types of people, you can witness that in any group with a games playerbase or forums for certain tv shows. Toxicity spreads quickly because humans have a tendency to focus on, and be bogged down by, negativity, and in a place where anonymity is a thing, and generally speaking, people that come to communities like Furries, are societal rejects of some kind, and being that type of person makes them spiteful towards something in some forms, like towards the popular, or towards particular subsections.
It really does just come down to size. The percentage of shitty people has stayed the same, but the fandom is absolutely effing massive compared to back then.
And that said, the furry artists i knew drew back then were complaining about people trying to get free art. And most of them were many years older than i was.
You're right though, we have nothing more to speak of because you're too ignorant of reality to be worth speaking to.
Asae believes a 2 year old toddler is as mature as a 20 year old, and there is no link between age and maturity.
Such a childish comment.
I think the recent social justice trend has simply infected the fandom as it has pretty much everything else. It's now cool to publicly attack people painted to be bad guys, because it makes you and your friends feel that you're being cool people. With the internet growing in recent years and bringing more folks together, instinctive group mentality has sadly grow too.
So many younginz comin' in, and i dont think they know what the fandom is really about.
They come in assuming what really it is about but just taking it as a guess.
Yes, plenty are now getting older (like me, artists I know, etc.).
Plenty of younger furries are also coming in.
The begging for free art nonsense coming from any age group has always been ignorant nonsense.
The problem in the "younger zone" lately is an increased amount of lying and apparently also dying for attention more than, at least, I can recall seeing 5 years ago.
Seeing people literally say "I'm only 14" in NSFW over 18+ only clearly stated rules and then going and apologizes expresses honestly pathetic naiveness, or intentional nonsense. Or literal idiocy that nobody over the age of 14 should be doing. Having fun, being silly, childish, etc, is life, have fun, don't act like an old fart whose grumpy for god sakes haha. But c'mon, no 6 year old behavior is needed in the fandom.
Now, I do have ONE big issue with the younger furs. Learn how to have a conversation. "Ah" and "oh" are not answers in an ongoing conversation. "Ok" "sure" like one word responses. And if you type out even a phrase let alone a sentence, you'll get that, or a response saying "You must be older just you type all regular like" as if this is a negative thing.
And god forbid you give two sentences or your "typing too much" like so much FU on top of like, do they have attention spans, or just want fav's over cute pics fur or irl, etc and that's good?
There's problems there for sure, and it's not isolated entirely to the younger crowd either, but it's very real and causing communication in the fur community to devolve when there is no need for that.
Artists are not greedy for wanting to be able to put food on the table.
Some people dont even want a real conversation, just slamming you with a nickname and spouting it about like its some schoolyard.
Only thing you're doing by bargaining with your child when they're like that is empowering their behavior.
The parent says 'no' once, then almost immediately back-pedals on it the second their kid starts throwing a tantrum. And let's be honest, once a kid spots that weakness.. it's guaranteed to only get worse.
If she takes a swing at me though? Yeah, spanking and grounded.
For one, I am Autistic and have mild ADHD and I still can create much wittier things than this lousy excuses of insults they spit out. Disabilities have no hold on your abilities as an individual
More importantly, though, I created a fanfic despite my disabilities, and people LIKE it. That is enough for me to say that what I am doing is a good idea. So, keep trucking man!
That, and teaching them that if someone pisses you off you should attack them.
Don't agree? Go look it up, it's cited, heavily studied and you're objectively wrong on the matter. Encouraging beating kids as a solution just means you are shit at parenting.
Thanks for being sensible and educated on the subject, unlike so many people I run into.
Our world is already a mess as it is, thank you very much.
Though there was a furry that was in the same server as me and I felt bad for him XD poor guy
i have many mental things and i hate when people use that as well i did it cuz i have "so and so"
i dont talk to many furries as i hate that so many are toxic
The growing toxicity has put me off from even trying to attend conventions anymore, and that's depressing as hell to me. There's some artists I like that do exactly what you've described, they're very nice and 'open' as long as you're worshiping them, but the moment you point anything out, even a constructive criticism, or GOD FORBID you disagree with them, it's over. You get quietly removed from their Discords, blocked, etc.
I don't give a fuck about "popufurs" I could probably only name 3 that I'd consider to match that moniker. I care about good art at reasonable prices, and I enjoy seeing all the lovely art that gets put out. Some of my favorite art cost me between $10-25 from relatively unknown but immensely talented artists that were humble, while I'll get art from a popular artist that takes forever, costs too much, and then if there's something you'd like adjusted/changed on your commission, well fuck you, you're a terrible human being for not 100% loving their 'masterpiece' that they've graced you with.
I love your work, I've gotten my rocks off to many of your animations, don't ever stop. Fuck the people who don't like your work, they don't matter. The only thing you need to do if you don't like something is N O T L O O K A T I T. I know, novel concept.
Not everyone gets to grow up in your cushy "safe spaces" and frankly I'm glad I didn't, so that I didn't end up a raging ignorant asshole jumping on a new furry who just opened up, looking for acceptance and inclusion in a community LITERALLY BUILT AROUND THOSE VALUES.
That being said, my four or five friends make it much better and I’ll stick around until they leave.
Amen.
Sure your rude, crude and have an attitude but your the kind of person that is 100% correct on this whole thing, and
I AM NOT AFRAID TO SAY IT!!!!!!!!!!!!
The fandom loves to roll around its own trash and turn blind eyes to its own inner shovel-garbage while everyone else suffers for it and trys to not think about how much people get used and abused. Oh, and if you speak up, you better sit your ass back down or your shuned, shamed, and called names back to prepubescents.
this problem has been knawing at the roots of this community like a festering wound since before I "joined" myself, and is precisely the reason why I've always kept my distance from this fandom, always at arms length or greater.
I only have any contact with the furry community for porn now and that's pretty much it, the community itself can get fucked with it's intolerant bullshit and drama fuckery.
The best way to "be special" to people is to just be you.
But now people want to be "everyone else" it seems.
Bit thankful that I've always been kind of a loner and really only here for art and porn.
What's around my age is just.... WOW... Hard to believe these people are real somewhere out there. So many spoiled man-children, with no souls whatsoever.
Honestly, I prefer just sticking with people from the office. Sane folk that actually come home to enjoy free time.
A poem by Croc O'Dile of TigerMUCK which captures a bit of what it is to be furry.
If the true meaning of furry you wish to understand
You must think in terms of paw and not hand
You must release your mentality from society's cage
For furry prefurs no race, sex, persuasion or age
You must sort through the hype and the exploitation
Because to be furry needs no justification
It is to reach out and embrace the unknown
To be surrounded by friends and yet still be alone
It is not a gimmick or a political movement
It's nothing so pretentious as a method of improvement
It's only to seek solace in the presence of friends
For when one is furry, the search never ends
It is sometimes to be controlled by one's emotions
It is to often be unsure of depths of devotion
It is the sweet pain of impossible dreams
It is never quite as close or as far as it seems
It is feelings being known without words being spoken
It is the inevitable occasional heart being broken
It is the type of love that now seems cliche
It's experience gained from having learned the hard way
It's a smurgle, a fuzzle, a rumble or purr
It's scales and whiskers and tails and fur
It's what we are, not outside but within
It's the binding force that makes us all kin
It's a howl in greeting to friends held dear
It's a bristling growl when confronted by fear
It's a friendly lick or scritch to show that we care
It's a deep understanding, a compassion that's rare
If what it is to be furry you still don't comprehend
Then consider this advice, my curious friend
If you're willing to respect that which you don't understand
Then come take my paw and I'll take your hand.
-- Croc O'Dile - 6/95
Still, thank you. It's always good to know I'm not the only one remembering some old things.
Let's dance the happy dance
Ego and righteous indignation are the timbre of the day. Compromise and negotiation are viewed as weakness at best.
Like what a couple other comments are saying, this isn't just a "furry" problem. This is a "society" problem that has existed as long as society has been a thing as it will always be a thing, and the most we can do is reconcile that these things exist and do what we can to mitigate or eliminate the problem.
The up keep that "friends" require now a days is mentally stressful or emotionally damaging.
Which is kinda of sad when you think about it because when you are in a "community" its supposed to be empowering and uplifting and i find that few and far between.
I think this is the thing - the main demographic has always been college students, but the college students of today are the intolerant brats who grew up on social media. Social media is toxic, and thus these people are toxic. This has little to do with furries.
Because there is not just 1 whole solitary factor. I see this from the "battlefield" that both sides just keep saying "This one thing is the cause" when nobody actually realizes that "its things upon things upon things upon things" that is the real cause, that 'one thing' is just the trigger of the smoking gun.
Obviously I don't mean going after random people and causing shit for no reason but the simple fact no one says shit when someone is doing something incredibly wrong.
I've already discussed this very same topic countless times and I'm still mind-boggled about how difficult it is for people to understand what exactly is wrong with the fandom as a whole.
The fandom has grown a massive amount since the 90's and early 2000's and of course with that comes more bull shit of all kinds.
As someone above also mentioned, as a simple user/watcher that doesn't draw to grab attention, this rarely happens to me.
It also helps like someone again mentioned, to stay away from toxic locations or simple IGNORE what hate comes your way.
The best way to deal with a pos is to block and ignore them.
Sensitivity has also increased 10fold not to mention giving literally every human being on the planet a way to talk to each other around the world.
People just need to learn to grow the fuck up.
This fandom desperately needs "cleaning" too.
i say fuck everyone you can offend someone for breathing the wrong way, its not just in the furry community its everywhere.
Rousing an angry mob makes someone the leader of the angry mob.
I'm glad you're speaking out about it. I've been a furry for 22 years. I've seen all these things play out in cycles, each generation of new furries going through the same frustrations, as you are.
In my perspective, it's getting worse. But perhaps to someone older than me it's just par for the course.
BTW, there's a class of toxic creators who I don't know if you mentioned, the artists who only care about keeping people fucking and masturbating. Am I wrong? It seems like there's a huge number of people who believe if they keep people having as many orgasms as possible, that somehow they'll get to reap some kind of heavenly reward down the road. I think someone should explain to all of them that when you die there is nothing. Perhaps I'm imagining it, but I've seen a lot to suggest this is a real, and ugly thing. Because it turns people into livestock. And for what? And for who?
I'm glad you're speaking out. I wish more people would.
Send me a note instead?
- Basil Exposition, Austin Powers 2
The fandom has given up one of the things that made it special: Being an open minded and accepting group that dared to think outside the box. Today it is as bad as the mainstream: You're lynched for your beliefs, anyone who isn't in line is the enemy, and if someone doesn't agree with you then you must be blocked at once to signal what a horrible person you are. I'd argue that furries are still more accepting on issues such as transgender... this would be correct, however non-furries have caught up and are about as accepting of that now.
I've seen what the fandom has become more clearly at the beginning of the year, when people turned on Zaush after he *gasp* used some stupid photos of kids from a swimming pool commercial as reference for designing some characters which *double gasp* he drew porn of. Explaining that it's something insignificant in his own privacy which cannot logically affect anyone else has quickly put me under the line of fire, because reasoning doesn't have its place at a morality party. As is usual in those cases, private chat logs were conveniently leaked during this incident, suggesting he sexually assaulted someone which was of course never actually proven. If this all sounds familiar, that's because it's pretty much the same thing we're seeing in political wars in the media.
Don't even get me started on how I'm literally having to defend furry artists I follow from the persecution of furry art sites (we're on the biggest offender here) mixed with a few other nutjobs, because in the year 2018 it's still too ideologically sensitive to draw certain types of porn. Even important artists have been temporarily banned, not even for posting stuff on the site in cause but because there were links to it for other websites. At this point I'm wondering who's going to be next in line and where I can keep following artists safely... often times it's dangerous to even comment on some matters as merely saying something you aren't supposed to say can get you banned. Once more, this is the true face of the fandom's so called openness and respect toward others.
I'm still going to remain and call myself a furry. I can joke that for better or worse, they draw good art of my peoples. But in all honesty, I'm about as pissed with the fandom as I am with the majority of society... the fandom is barely any different at this point. So here's my ramblings on the whole matter.
Saying the community is toxic is not helpful, though. It's your soap box so say what you want, but I remain certain you're making a mountain out of a molehill.
You are high profile. A lot of people see you and your opinions, more than you could ever reasonably meet and talk with. Whether you ever meant to get popular isn't really important.
The issue with popularity here is, as you and Kothorix put forward, most people who get into furry tend to get here because they deviate away from other communities. Even now there's still not as many sex-positive communities out there as furry is. So avoidant or individualistic people such as yourself and Kabier become popular despite not meaning to, and some others thrust you into some position of authority or responsibility you don't really agree to. "A community figure-head", or that you have more affluence than others. Codswallop like that.
The way I see it, you're both still who you were since before you became popular. Which is fine. I would be pissed off and indignant had I been put through the same nonsense you have.
However I do disagree with you when it comes to speaking of or for the community vox populi. We're a lot of different people, furries. I've met a few delinquents and deviants like myself, but I've also met a lot of business owners, entrepreneurs, family folk, the mental, the altruistic, and the socialite. Furry is a motley of a whole lot more than just some high-opinionated self-righteous twits and no amount of nay-saying or cynicism is gonna nudge me on that.
That said? I still never, ever want to be in your shoes. Having people come up and disrupt my little sub-culture mini-business of furry erotica would be enough to have me snap.
Things really aren't that black and white, though. For everyone you piss off over nothing, there's people ready to share solidarity with you over the morons. For me? What it boils down to is one simple rule. I don't lead my life based on hate. I don't get anything out of complaining, bitching, belly-aching, or making a stink. Call it "denial" if you want, but eventually you'll finish up your ranting, raving, and groaning and you'll swing back into wanting to build up something. I'm sure of that.
Until you do, I'll still be keeping my eyes on you. I've enjoyed what ventures you and Kabier have made. Cuckshack is one of the only furry-centered bits of media out there I've been really impressed by. Not because I agree with everything you or your guests say, but just that you make a good entertaining show of it.
There's a place in the community for you, for how hard you work and how much you give. Don't give up because some morons make you feel like a pariah. I just don't much care for these kinds of broad strokes like you're ready to take the piss on all of us for being "toxic".
Not all Furries are toxic, but that group is shrinking.
Not because of the rising number of toxic "Furrs".
But because they're leaving the fandom altogether.
It's both infuriating and disheartening.
It also doesn't help when site Mods aren't bipartisan and use Political Identity to mete out site rules.
There was a rash of bans not too long ago.
It just, well, it hurts to see the fandom I grew up with burning to ash because of something as stupid as Politics.
The who you blame or the idea that people are leaving. Or that the people who are coming into the fandom represent just one interest group.
The community gets people of all stripes coming in.
Also, I haven't seen a single person whose interest in furry art and media decide to suddenly vanish because of some unpleasant conversation.
It's really weird to say you're against politics and within 100 words make a lot of bold political statements.
I'm going to level with you. I'm tired of the politics, I truly am.
But it's like you can't turn it off.
And you're right, people don't just suddenly vanish because of one or two unpleasant conversations.
It builds up.
Also, I apologize for the hypocrisy of my initial post, it's sort of hardwired atm because it's everywhere and I'm basically burning out.
I don't disagree with you, mind that.
But the core aspect of the fandom is dying.
I wouldn't mind the change, but I really don't like walking on eggshells and I'm certain artists feel the same.
And I'm a nobody and this has affected me.
Sorry.
I'm having a bit of a hard time thinking.
Been arguing all day >.<
If I may suggest that if you're this anxious over discussing politics, perhaps don't.
There's no need to panic.
Nothing is dying. The world's not in anarchy. There's nothing threatening you.
Have confidence in your own values. Recognize the boundary that your values do not have to extend to me, or others.
Fatigue isn't an excuse for behaving unreasonably. If you're tired, take time to rest.
Thank you.
Keep on Rocking.
Seriously, keep on keeping on.
When radical left-wing politics has an issue with nearly everything to do with modern society, that subject is often an inevitability. Furries are more intolerant of others now then they have ever been.
I have nothing but dissent toward society. I've always been, my whole life, an individualist.
The boundaries of "society" are also invasive as hell. What you do in the privacy of your own home is your own business, but there's plenty of people who feel they've got a right to snoop and criticize you for it. That's neither here nor there.
I do disagree that it's an inevitability, though. When you anticipate problems, you're more likely to bend your perspective to see them. That kinda fatalism's a real drag. Even if someone has complaints, it doesn't mean that they'll retaliate for not getting their way.
It is obvious that the vitriol you've experienced has gotten to you, though. It's not so wrong to have complaints, really. Honestly I enjoy Cuckshack in part because I am not the kind of person who entertains much complaining. Having others do it relieves some of the tension for me. I just don't agree that things are as grim as they seem.
Haters gonna hate. I'm glad you do not buckle to them. It would be disappointing to see you become someone who thrives off the antagonism though... It will be entertaining.
Either way, you do make things more lively around here.
lol
Just the other day I was watching a stream where someone was flipping the fuck out because someone had the nerve to say they liked WW1/WW2 history and thought an old German Stahlhelm would be a cool piece of memorabilia to have. Certainly there's nothing bad about that, but you would've thought they went around chanting one of Adolf's speeches with how upset this other person got. That was kinda the final straw for me.
I've always enjoyed your work Jason and I look forward to seeing where you go from here. If I ever get to a position where I can get out of my own Cuckshack, I'll be sure to throw a few bucks your way.
Love you man, stay safe.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKc.....ature=youtu.be
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p8M2tg2RkIQ
I was leaving college right around the time all this SJW crap was coming in to the point that the college was threatening to withhold my geology degree until I had taken 1 full year of "studies" classes, women's studies, black studies, Hispanic studies, LGBTQI+-BBQPUPPIEZ!!11!!ditty!!11! studies, gender studies (not sex and gender studies, just gender, because apparently SCIENCE and BIOLOGY are OFFENSIVE now).
I had to keep filing petitions, and pointing out my college "contract", constantly seeing the dean to point out how ridiculous it was to force these classes on someone in their last year for bullshit that had NOTHING to do with my degree... And they kept pushing it all until I mentioned I was gay at one point then it was ALL waived like fucking magic and never mentioned again, I shit you not! Now I really feel sorry for straight people that are forced into these brainwashing "classes".
>pedophile
>zoophile
>close group
>drama
>self-centered popufur
>forcing E-roleplay
and the list goes on
it's all true, we're toxic AF
There isn't any Equal Rights or Standards, it's all bullshit and lies and when you call it out, you get smeared immediately.
Try being a card carrying Conservative Homosexual Male, who identifies as Male because I was born said gender.
I get bashed for that.
I get bashed for being White.
I get bashed for being GAY<=(I FUCKING KNOW!!!)
I get called a Nazi, Uncle Tom, Traitor and a "Fake Homosexual"(I've only been with men, and I'm male, so how the fuck does that even compute?)
It's all a sham to push political agendas.
It's destroying the fandom because the newer people joining don't care about anything as is.
Ranging from person life, outlook, tastes or others for that matter.
The fandom is being treated as nothing but a temporary fad and fetish, nothing more.
Just like I got flamed because I pointed out that more and more and more people are joining and going to Cons to only get laid.
Fuck the Dealers Dens or Artists Dens, PUSSY! COCK AND ASS! That's all.
IT's DISGUSTING.
And thanks to identity politics and the self-loathing bastards with all of their emotional baggage.
The fandom has become the stereotype we had worked FOR YEARS to disprove.
But. I'm a damned Furry and I'll always be a Furry.
And when the going gets tough.
Grit your teeth and ball a fist.
Life doesn't stop for pussies.
Keep on Rocking, Jason.
If you leave the fandom, know I'll still be a fan and I'll still be here with my memories of a better fandom
with a better community.
\m/ >^.^< \m/
I’m only on a few social media and the furs I talk to are always friendly and supportive
Hope the best for everyone
So many younginz comin' in, and i dont think they know what the fandom is really about.
They come in assuming what really it is about but just taking it as a guess.
I may have to remove my personal event "Free Sketch Day" because i get a shit load of people but no one wants to buy commissions. It was only to offer kindness, and opportunity for those who are broke or want to try my style and maybe commission something in the future.
Nope. As soon as i opened slots, no one wanted one. Eventually 2 people came forward asking but i used to get like
10 people asking. Now its like 1 or 2.
If i dont sell art, i dont pay the bills. Finding work means no time for art.
I get a lot of furs getting offended easily by the lamest shit. I post a specific type of fetish and i get a harassing comment or opinion. Its like, if you dont like it, why look at it? Just look for what you like?
When going to the Cons, some are fun but i find weeeird peeeeople....sometimes. A lot of them are young, hyper, and bouncy. Others are old, weird, and look like they want to say, Stay away from me... so i wonder about the Young vs the Older.
I am the older, 37. I notice a LOT of people have some sort of Medical or Mental health issues. I am also guilty of that.
So i wonder sometimes when someone snaps for something tiny, i end up looking in that direction, and question it.
Also if you dont draw what the majority likes, you wont sell, you wont really get much. 2 individuals once told me, separate times, they are trying to get the most out of their money. Sure! of course! but that leaves others in the dark, and its like being tooooo frugal.
As for artists, yeah ive seen some good ones, really nice people. Then there are some specific artists who will be rude with you if you ask something that might piss them off. Like if you were forcing them to go out of their way for you.
Its like customer service how they get. There was one artist that yelled at me because i asked if He/She is open for commissions lol. The artist said in a rude manner, I wouldnt have the link up if i want open for commissions! Some artists have a page up where you fill out the info and submit it for a slot. Well i didnt know because sometimes slots fill very quick. Well this artist was on my shit list and this is a reference in what Jasonafex saying about artists if you give them the plug for power. This person was a talent artist but it feels like someone who has a cocky ass ego. I know the name by heart but i wont say but i have a small list of egos. One other artist was streaming and a guest came in and rant for no reason and it pissed him off and he banned him but a few minutes later he raged quit and left everyone asking wtf happened. He just left and said you know what fuck everyone and left.
Yeah i can understand what Jason is feeling.
As more newcomers come in, as the older ones leave or move on, the fandom changes a bit. If only there was a way to show them what the fandom is meant to be and info. Yeah its porn is popular in the fandom but theres more to it than just porn but it seems its only what furries is interested in so it turns into a fetish. People will now start to think the fandom is just for fapping. Thats it.
I almost left the fandom because of all of my experiences but i refused to leave because i dont quit. I just hope for more nicer, respectful, and sane people. I learned not to feed in to what people want now because it feels its not enough. Cant make everyone happy.
One thing is for sure though is yeah you have to be careful what you say in the fandom because furries can get offensive and defensive very very easily. I have been in the fandom for 18 years and i do notice the change. People are getting more touchy on subjects now a days than in the past. When i was a furry in the early 2000s, it wasnt like that.
If you talk about religion or a fetish that people sneer at, watch out. Also gossip moves very quickly too.
Be careful out there. Its a jungle out there. Watch out for them traps.
A new site needs to be made for..... well......
Our generation of Furry.
I joined the fandom when I was 13, I'm 27 now.
I joined because the art was cool and at the time I was trying to draw, sketch and so on (Obviously didn't take off)
The erotic side came a little later. I always knew I was different and when I found the Fandom, it clicked.
But its all degenerated.
IT used to be fun.
Parties and social gatherings.
Now it's walking on thin ice every time you log in or go to a Con.
And I'm raised old school, you get in my face and pipe up, I'll do the exact same thing and I feel for the person who decides to swing lol
But I miss the old fandom. Where I could join and see Arts of illustrations, writing and music. Not just NSFW.
It used to be a stress relief for me, now it's just another ideological battlefield.
But I digress. A new fandom needs to be made and a vetting process added.
As sad as that is.
Power, regardless of type, is corrupting.
Give all those abilities to people on their own accounts and only on their own accounts.
Create a "platform" instead of a moderated "publisher".
I got bulliee at dutchfurcon
All becaus i was sexual related to the pup comunity and i was there only to relax and have fun it ended up being a place where i could get dildos for cheap and the rest of the entire con spending in a hotel or bed becaus of harrasment
The fandom Got woke and is going broke.
-sad laugh-
By holding a hardline narrative, refusing to give an inch on it, and maintaining a heavy enough presence to lock things down UNTIL the other party gives (see: the Obama administration's shutdown), they shift policy in such ways that are impractical to repair even if congress and the house were to unanimously flip. This strategy is very good for achieving their goals (getting richer, preserving their wealthy investors, maintaining the welfare system as a trap-net rather than a safety net, using xenophobia to control immigration and preserve the healthy offshoring business) and also very good at breaking voter apathy in an uneven manner.
This strategy has social consequences, however. It is no longer possible to be a Republican and expect your congressman to compromise with a Democrat- out of necessity, the party MUST lie, shift the truth, and abuse media neutrality bias to imply that the other party has taken a similarly extreme stance to justify their lack of compromise. (Look at the coverage of the Obama shutdown- it was a purposefully orchestrated Republican power play to assert 'yes we will'. The news cast it as Congress acting like a bunch of children, rather than one side refusing to attempt reasonable compromise in favor of making a show of power. This is called Neutrality Bias, and it's still present in CNN not making easy comparisons between Trump's rising cult of personality and that of many past dictators, despite that being accurate and SERIOUSLY RIVETING news.)
Anyway- this affects the furry 'fandom', which is a very massive and loose community with hundreds of subcommunities entailed therein. The deep message society is adopting is that 'compromise is not acceptable'. More and more, this trend in politics is bleeding out into the rest of the world- making millions of very nuanced and complex issues black and white. In the upcoming generation, this translates to.. Get your way, or the other guy is the bad guy. In other words- if you want the WORLD- not just the Furry fandom- to stop being toxic and divisive and vicious, you have to deal with the rhetoric causing those stances. If you're a Republican, kindly ask your congressman to stop emulating the Nazi party and vote based on the needs of their constituents, not the whims of the party. If you're a Democrat, educate yourself on why your party is so retarded that people with real brains still vote Republican. Then both of you, vote independent and show some individuality.
But its more or less everywhere.
TBH i wonder how long it might take till the US ends up in another civil War...
Or how long it might take since Guys like Trump and Puti have polarized their people so much that they're willingly going into another World War sice the otherside is controled by 'terrorists' 'Far leftistst' or what ever term comes into their mind to drive the masses Mad...
Intelligent, self thinking peoples are highly unwanted by those who are into charge.
The Toxic lewels of comunities, like our or others just represents that.
The Root of all the probles is just the Greed and jealousy of people, specially those in charge but they also just use this feelings of the masses together with the mixing of paranoia to turn the majority into their puppets, to feed their own greed.
Humanity itself could be doing so much more great things, even greater as things they had done so far if they would just start to work together, for the greater good of all... But no, they love to be naive and narrow-minded cattle... Atleast the majority of them.
Another US civil war? Possibly in another millennium or 30. One thing that has to be understood about the war between the states is that even though it was long ago it was devastating to this country, so much so that although it may be lightly bantered about "Oh we're gonna riiise up!' the actual act of rising up and such is not going to happen. Because this devastating war is a part of who we are and what we fight to defend, an ingrained reason to NEVER let this happen again, because it was so terrible. It literally was, brother against brother. It would probably take horrific circumstances to set things like that into motion again. As is, well if you don't like the way things are going, you can just wait a few years and vote the folks who were a part of it out of office if they were that bad and they will change whatever went wrong. Well in theory anyway. In actual practice, things are never that simple and some things become too comfortably in place for change to be brought to bear, so it never happens.
But that is just here, for everywhere else in the world, well they ain't the US, so as they say... 'Your milage may vary.' and one can't expect for what happens out here to reflect on what happens out there. Even in this modern age of information where someone in Tokyo can watch a car chase happening in real time in Boston, there are some things that may be accepted and others that are not. As you well know although some instances of common ground out there, the laws and customs of two different countries are their own, and say the mayoral race of candidate X and Z for the town of Dustville out here is not gonna have a bearing whatsoever on the mayoral election of candidate Y against candidate W in the prefecture of Hoo-Ha in the Great Republic of Green Mountain or somesuch. What a people accept and do not accept is dependent upon them, where they live and the circumstances in which they live. If some aspect is not liked, well then one has to legally and civilly try to change it. You gotta look in your own back yard, not pointing fingers here, there and everywhere else saying 'Them! They're to blame for our woes!' That is shifting blame from where it should be going to somewhere else which you have no power to affect. Forget about what is happening in country X, and work to try to fix your own country up so that it is a shining example of goodness for the people.
We Europeas said that soo much after so many wars in the past here... and what happened?there was no century here without major wars and without big sufferrings because of it here... Even the Great war, the WWI was titled as the war to end all wars at some point.. and what did it just brought up? an even more terrible second World War. Did people have learned from it? No... the Majority not otherwise we would not ore into political happenings of the 1920's and early 30's here again... and surely you also have highly militant groups of people in the US that want 'the Old ways' or what ever back and are ust waitign for the right moment to Rise their Arms.
It's everywhere the same... might be clothed differently in other regions but in the ed its all the same Dumbness of Mankind...
Nobody feels like they have to be held accountable for their actions and that everybody should bend to their own whims. Anybody who dares ruffles the delicate petals of their fuckwit flower are mortal enemies and an existential threat. I'm seeing this in how people talk, how people treat service/retail workers, how people use social media, and most terrifyingly enough how people DRIVE!
Everybody should be respectful of each other as the default first response. But that doesn't mean allowing people to walk over you - assholes should be called out as assholes and shamed until they behave. People need to realize that you can still disagree with people without being an absolute twit.
IT HAS ALWAYS BEEN THIS WAY not that is wright nor correct but honestly its the same shit of the burn furs from ages ago and it keeps repeating and repeating it self destructs and restart again till it breaks apart and do over and over and over.
I seen endless whining and bitching about how perverted the furry fandom is BUT NO ONE GIVES A SOLUTION! they all say they leaving (they never do entirely) and leave it at that, I honestly don't give a dam any more thanks to that, I know the fandom has problems I know that just for 1 furry fucking up, all other furries are stigmatized into been that same or equal to that 1 furry who fucked up.
And sadly I have no solution either since I don't want to be that guy who wants to destroy freedom of peach nor expression, but I observe it for a very long time and had it simple reduces itself and dies then raise up again and falls ones more, like an endless cycle as I seen it maybe 5 times been done in since the beginning of the Internet and it will happen again it seems it self correct itself to just do it again and restart.
So it self corrects so there is no real solution as the ban and forbidden of some forms of expression in the furry fandom just makes them stronger when will they understand that the provision of what ever will only make that more desirable!. thanks to that we got gagsters and mobs just cause drinking was illegal and since its no longer they moved on to drugs.
Not that a person who commits a crime must not be held accountable for his actions, but it really ticks me off when people always bitch about stuff but never really search or look for a solution or worst tell them not to do some thing themselfs enjoy or do!, the "do what i say not what i do" double moral, i did try to find a solution to it and I did and fail miserably, cause yea people won't stop doing what they do if they like doing it just cause it makes me uncomfortable, how ever we do need to address them cause that is where the downfall i talk about starts so it can restart itself again, each generation of furries will have its what I like to call 4 stages to perversion.
The rainbow stage (its all cool for shits and giggles)
The ok its hot (where its getting kinky)
The point of no return (shit got real)
The Down fall on its face (it crash it burns and restarts)
I could say we may be to inclusive and to accepting but that is silly to say.
in the words of Kurrel the Raven "There's all kinds of furries, No matter what you've heard, We all find our own place in the furry universe, For some furries their space Is kinky or perverse But it's not always that way Cause furries are diverse"
So from all I had learn in the fandom all this years I just had learn from all, and that made my slogan
and sorry if I wrote to much.
Keep it up and keep it kool
Sad also to shame is the site you went to, Gab is gone.
I was waiting til next month to sign up in December.
If Everyone Thought as you did, the entire world, not just the furry community, would be a better place.
Stay true to yourself and never lose that spark, that fire, that very essence that makes you who you are.
I'm talking late 1990s and early 2000s where I'd meet people of all types, colors, political affiliations, ideologies, and for the most part, they could all get along in general.
Sure there are always going to be overly loud and annoying people in the fandom, but for the most part, everyone got along.
It was a very "Don't label me, bro!" and "Live and let live." and "I agree to disagree." time in the fandom.
Diversity of people, and diversity of thought, ALL COMING TOGETHER to celebrate furry in general.
...
Then around the advent of mainstream social media, and what can only be called "identity politics", around 2007-2009, people started splitting off into EXCLUSIONARY TRIBAL GROUPS more and more, and were less likely to make friends outside of these groups or social media, to the point they just cluster up with their social media circles at the exclusion of any outside people or thoughts.
In short it went from "Don't Label me, bro!" and "Let's just agree to disagree on this issue and change the subject." to "I ONLY identify with people that also only identify with my ideology, and FUCK YOU if you don't agree with me 110%, I will fucking RUIN YOU for not agreeing with me! Do you know how many social media FOLLOWERS I have, you fucking pleb!"
It is pretty damn hard to be in an artistic community when you have CENSORSHIP OF ART AND THOUGHT, and the control freaks come out of the woodwork to push their bullshit on everyone else and threaten or even attack anyone they disagree with.
-There are people with uniform fetishes (sexual and non sexual) that are TERRIFIED to show up at cons in their re-inactment gear for fear of being labeled as a part of that uniform.
-There are comic artists that have left the fandom because someone may have disagreed with something political in said comics and threatened to ruin said artists.
-You got people afraid to voice their opinions or create discussions and debates for fear of "the ban hammer" or being part of some SJW "witch hunt".
-Many people can't even make jokes or a sarcastic comments without being screamed at by some control freak "school marm" type.
-Intellectual debate and commentary in journals and such is dead, again for fear of the ban hammer or rubbing someone's fur the wrong way, now replaced with "STREAMING" and "YCH COMMISSIONS". I mean I know a lot of furs are socially awkward, but ever since the advent of so-called "social media" people have become either so freaking introverted or so freaking narcissistic that trying to drum up a conversation with someone new in the fandom is like trying to deal with a physically abused animal that pulls away or bites you every time you try to pet it.
-The identity politics: you are either a communist or an evil nazi, you are either LGBTQIBBQPUPPIEZ!?+-$@# or an evil straight cis-person, you are disabled in some way or an evil able-bodied person, and if you don't want to pick either side of those, you are even worse than both extremes combined somehow. @_@
-You will get shunned, banned, kicked out just for not agreeing 110% with some tribal group or another. Like if I say I wouldn't ever have sex with a "trans male" because I'm not into women, I get kicked out and banned from multiple "gay" groups. Seriously, it is that crazy, where a gay guy will be kicked out of a gay group just for saying he doesn't want to have sex with a surgically altered or crossdressing female... Let that sink in a bit.... Hell "2 the ranting Gryphon" got banned from multiple conventions because the control freaks and SJWs in charge didn't like his style of dark humor or dry comedy.
-ENSHRINED HYPOCRISY... This is one of the ones that pisses me off the most in the fandom. Back in the late 90s and early 2000s, before the gay marriage ruling, I had to deal with crazy religious nutjobs on the right that would say shit like "I love all people, and everyone is equal, but gays are the scum of the earth and need to be purged." Now they have turned into the far-left control freak nut jobs saying "DIVERSITY AND EQUALITY AND TOLERANCE ARE WONDERFUL!!!!!... unless you act or think outside of our narrowly defined ideals of what diversity and equality are, in which case YOU ARE THE PROBLEM, AND A NAZI, AND CIS-WHITE-RACIST-SEXIST-O-PHOBE-IST AND WILL NOT BE TOLERATED!!!! Reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!"
-Cons have always been a place for people to get sex hook ups and drunk off their asses... But they were also places to meet new people and find art and talk about nearly ANYTHING open and freely like religion and politics and literally anything, and be exposed to new ideas... But because of the FEAR of opinions, and FEAR of diversity of thought, cons have become almost exclusively for sexual hook-ups and drug use and drinking. I've had multiple people tell me how DEPRESSING furry cons are now compared to even when I stopped going to cons around 2008-09, to the point that the only way to have fun is to be drunk or high off your ass.
I can honestly see why there aren't that many 30-40+somethings in the fandom anymore, because of the college age politics constantly coming into the fandom, and closed off to any and all outside ideas or opinions from what they have been taught or brainwashed into thinking is right and wrong without putting any critical thought into anything or even willing to hear realists let alone opposing viewpoints or people with life experience.
Its hard to find genuine people these days.. even amongst the popular people here..
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When it comes to Kothorix's problems with the furry community, I very much agree. However when it comes to the numbers of delinquent furries, I cannot relate. It really helps that I became a furry at the age of 20. Furries were not on my radar during my teenage years.
Problems can also be a factor of popularity and activity, new or delinquent furries appear to be drawn to people with notoriety, I've personally experience this. I keep my circle of friends rather small and thankfully had only one experience in my many years in the fandom, of a friend I care for, actually betraying my friendship. Joining the fandom at an older age might have helped, when my gallery started to get traction, I could easily identify with people who I can befriend and identify people who are delinquents.
That said, I believe new and unpopular people in the fandom have much, MUCH better experiences than most of veteran furries because how the system is designed.
My opinions are also forged by my limited interactions with people in the furry fandom. I'd say my experiences are drastically less than a lot of veteran furries being in the fandom since they were teenagers. It also makes it harder to relate as I never been to a con despite being a furry for about 8 years, in fact, MFF this year is going to be my first. Mainly due to I don't see the appeal to it, I'd much rather spend $500 on other things. The only exception this year is a good friend of mine is letting me stay in a room for free.
As for Kothorix's claim about how the furry mindset creates a childish ungrowing haven is definitely possible. I personally have not been around it, but I can see how the behavior is a problem. I can think of people who are woefully immature for their age, are still in their early twenties. And no, 18 is not an adult. 21 is not an adult. I personally consider 25 the age of achieving maturity. That being said, yes, childish attention seeking behavior is rampant, but then again, I always ask myself the actual age of the people. 30 is definitely a behavioral problem, 20 is an attention seeking kid.
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One thing for certain is how hate filled the community has gotten. Maybe because I'm using social media more, maybe because I have a larger following. Those facts aside, the amount of political hatred is downright staggering.
There was a twitter post about posters in New York, that is very politically hate filled, encouraging violence, very similar to WW2 Nazi propaganda. The amount of people, including furries, stating how it's cool, nothing wrong with it, blew my mind. I can imagine those same people that complied with the posters, in 1939 Germany civilian attire saying the exact same thing to anti-semitism WW2 propaganda. At no point encouraging hatred and violence is okay by any means. It always leads to chaos and disaster in history, always.
If that isn't conformation of how backwards and twisted people have gotten, so extreme their philosophies they've gone in a literal full circle to becoming the very thing they hate, I don't know what is.
I will say the amount of mindless hate filled furries has drastically increased.
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As for your opinion on popufurs Jasona, my personal experience must have been significantly better. Befriending several people with notoriety, one of those people, now my best friend, even shares opposite political ideologies than me, however, it's easy to talk about difficult topics to her, due to the fact, we treat each other as equals.
That's the main problem with high school furries, the only people they treat as equals are people they like. Everyone else, is below them. It doesn't matter if you have 20000 watchers or 2, it does not change a persons attitude.
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As for the claims that the community will never mature, I wonder if it was ever at any state of maturity. FA is a porn website. I legit, would not care for the furry community, if it didn't tend to my sexual desires. The very foundation of furries is sexual delinquency. In my opinion, the furries community has never been mature and will never be mature because the foundation is not there. If you want maturity from a furry community, you will never find it. Truth of the matter is, furries are not designed to be a healthy community.
Is that a bad thing? Yeah, but it's nothing to get upset about. League of Legends is a good example of community creating it's own problem all because of a bad foundation. Is it a problem with me? No. I'm not looking for a mature community, I'm here for porn. My social life, in my opinion, is really nice. Got several real life friends I hang out with on a weekly basis and several great internet friends I commonly chat with. A healthy furry community is something I would want, but don't look for.
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It's easy for me to say I don't have a problem with the furry community, mainly because it seems like I am much less involved and invested than others.
I can'T say much over this topic anymore, since it all spoken out and all public by now, but noone really seems to care or has his eyes open enough for it or they're just naive it seems...
And about FA, yeah for me personally FA is an furry themed Art site/plattform with its strongpoint on Furry fetish Porn, it has still alot of SFW themed art aswell but its mainly an NSFW Site. If i want to get deeperinto the community or things behind that i would choose other sites, there still alot of forums where just the general topics of the fandome are discussed, meet ups are organised to just hang out with each other and have fun and talks, suitdances and all that.
FA is just an Art plattform for me to visualize my SFW/NSFW thoughs, not for my thoughs/standings of or inside the community.
Cal me a pessimist but i dont have high hopes for anything from the hands of humanity anymore... its all just degraded to greed, hate and jealousy atm...
I agree, the foundations for a healthy community aren't here. There is absolutely no incentive to be civil and there are far too many opportunities to be toxic. However, that doesn't mean we can't put those foundations in place with a new platform. Dedicated community leaders can absolutely steer their audience in a respectful direction. Lack of effort has caused the opposite. Free speech and open discussion is the first step, then action can be taken or those with drive can go their own ways.
Hateful people are quick to judge, aggressive and surround themselves in an echo chamber. They'll use excuses to be intolerant and mean, which drives the point of hypocrisy even further. I'm shocked at the number of furries, even popular ones, has gotten so far to deem you the enemy of mankind if you don't share their own beliefs.
Hell, people are encouraging harassment, bullying and aggression to other people. Calling those aggressors heroes. Even right now on my Twitter, there is a post about someone throwing cups of milk at a person. The person throwing milk was charged with harassment. The girl being harassed was called a crybaby, because she was a republican and deserved it. While the person making a fuss, is being called a hero. Look at the comments and you'll see 40 people saying there was no crime and the person is a hero.
The extremism is so scary, it makes me wonder the reaction would be if the girl was raped, would she still be a crybaby? Would the rapist be called a hero? Is throwing milk the limit of what is acceptable harassment? Or do people really want more terrible things than just throwing milk? What do your enemies deserve?
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We can make the first step, but that behavior absolutely must be shamed and ridiculed. A good community is impossible with people who actively create and praise violence.
We have arrived at a point where the toxicity of some parts of the furry community are becoming less and less tolerable, as the people who entered some time ago have grown up and matured.
There are very good people in the community, but you only get to know who they are, and separate the grain from the bran, after you spend some time with them. Once you find them, keep them; the rest, do not feel guilty of ignoring them once they show their colors. It's not the number of friends that counts, it's their quality.
The Goods:
The furry community as a place for anyone to express themselves and a creative, motional or even social environment and soul purpose is to bring people together. And work all communities and has its good and bad though it does have issues bad people are just people and we need to remember that.
I love the artists and interacting with new people and I have made some really good friends and I even have a furry Discord of trying to introduce people to the good side of Furry fandom.
It’s very easy to fine people that are interested in the same things that you are like rp or comic or whatever else I’m interested.
The bad:
The very disgusting fetishes are disturbing and often deviate certain people into doing bad things like Beastiality, Incest or pedophilia, or anything else disgusting that I don’t wish to talk about.
Women ascetically are always been harassed by very horny individuals that I call “yiff attics” and from personal experience I already had three people message me out of nowhere and start sending me very nasty Messages and saying very detail things of what they want to do to me that made me feel very uncomfortable.
People are super sensitive or not enough about other people and often treat them as nothing more by sex toys or just objects as well as sometimes toxic behavior jumps on one person to another very easily.
So far that’s all I have at the moment and sorry I’m not very good at this... I love this community but it does have its issues like everything else it doesn’t have to be a perfect community, it just needs to know what it wants to be and how to fix the more toxic side of it side so it doesn’t have to keep happening....
It is surprisingly easy to get hate for not being a gay/bi fetishist on this site. It's as if the furry community is a religion; The followers are which are blind cultists who discard normal societal values to sate their degeneracy.
I think that the toxic waves would just grow higher in the near future... if i look how world politics are going.. in which direction they turn again...
It would not take long till 'Everything different than the norm' would be harrassed and worse..
*puts on his aluminium hat*
It all feels like its a big masterplan to keep unwanted movements away from influence to end up making some change in better directions for humanity itself. to keep the status quo of easy controllable masses. binding them in narrow-mindet actions to keep them from using their brain indipendently...
a) be admitted to having
b) find solutions to those problems
c) act upon those solutions
Not just zoophiles, pedophiles, predators and other degenerates, but also behaviour. The lack of civility and the sheer shitty behaviour I see from some people are quite frankly astounding.
My recommendation would be to be consistent on your moral/ethical standards, no matter what they may be.
I've seen it all. Rape apologists, pedophilic discord groups targeting younger furries and promoting it freely, corrupt staff members here [and on other sites] (personal experience abundant there), artists who get a quick leg up and they cast aside all morals and dignity to promote their own status and fame (cited from seeing mimic artists get leg-up/jump starts here on FA/other sites), people use one form or another of personal life habits / upbringing to be discriminating and racist towards others (cited from con-goings and online interaction). I've gone to cons and met online friends in person where "the masks are off" and find they're not who they claimed they were, been groped up in fursuit by greasy mouth breathers who think I am male/female (the suit makes me look androgynous)(cited from Anthrocon 2012/2013 and other fursuiter's experiences), been in my own fair share of drama circles, had to deal with shitty accommodations on/off-line and at cons or just in personal furry association at meets or hangouts. I've been in con rooms and watched people get so blackout drunk or stoned off their rocker that they need escorts to get them back to their rooms, and seen just about every dick and boob, vag and ass you can unsightly imagine because some have no shame (cited from Furlandia 2017).
Do I agree that the "fandom / community" has degraded over the last 20~30 years? Sure.
Do I agree that the "fandom / community" has changed in the last 20~30 years? Absolutely.
However, despite the negative experiences I have had among claiming to be a part of this so-called group, I have met some rather amazing and close-knit friends that I do sincerely cherish my personal interactions with. Some people may have negative things to say about them, but that's life. But I care about each individual friend I have made, and a lot can vouch for me on a few things that I won't put out here. Not the place. But you're going to hate, or dislike something, while liking, or loving other things. Some jedi-whimsical b.s. can be thrown at you like 'harboring hate in your heart makes you a spiteful and hateful individual,' and you're not wrong, but a melting pot like this has enough room for everyone's individual, special ego as the next community like … hell … baseball or MTG, etc. Each and =every= community or group you stick a finger into is going to have a good, and a bad side to it. The drug-addicted and peer-pressured individuals and the animal abusers and pedos gave this group it's initial rise of claim that "they just bang animals / each other, do drugs and drink, and touch little kids." Am I wrong? Hell no.
The point is, the furry land of confusion is going to constantly change, for better, or for worse, because the thing is: everyone is going to have different experiences, no matter where they're born, or what day/era they're born into, and will be molded by every single inch of 'data' that flows into their spongey little cortexes. Through those experiences and what they have absorbed is going to be brought here, and added to the pot, stirred up, and fed to others. But the choices you have are to mold with the 'community' as it changes, or continue doing what you want to do and just be you, an individual, your own free-will, free-minded person?
But still, there are people that use their own status to claim they're better than everyone else merely because of their popularity. That's just going to happen, whether or not you, or I, or the next Johnny Boy or Sassy Sara next to us likes it or not. Just because you're good or skilled at something doesn't excuse you for being a shitty, callous individual towards others, but alas, that's just how shit rolls in this world. On all accounts, and on all fronts, topics, and subjects. Some people just allowed themselves to be melted down and molded the wrong way with the rest of the pot.
In the last several years I, personally, have stepped further and further away from it. Do I love fursuiting? Sure, I'd love to get another one made despite the 10 year old suit I have being in fantastic shape still. Would I still go to cons? Sure, locally enough and within a decent driving distance. Art? You bet'cha because artists got to eat and breathe just like me.
We're all molded by what life throws at us, and life is molded by what we throw back at it. This 'community' no less affected by it either. Something Something, Lemons, Lemonade.
That's enough soapboxing of my own variety.
Like a happening I saw on the Guild Wars 2 forums. A developer being too careless with her words and ticked off a howling internet mob that launched a vicious online lynching that resulted in her and another developer whom came to her assistance getting fired. I dont have much respect for arena.net now since they went to appease the internet mob, was such a sad thing to see. Sure I dont condone what the dev said, but the whole internet witch hunt, it was absolutely despicable to see. So many feels empowered by the anonymity of the internet to do what they feel like, and being completely unable to act with any sort of decency or rational sense.
To sit there and crow over getting someone fired and wondering what developer they could hit next that they didnt like. At least that storm has died down, though its clear the internet have some serious growing pains in this age.
I know my comment will probably be looked over but i agree with ya jason whole heartedly but also FA has to take blame for this too for taking sides politically and pushing out the others creating thier own personal echo chamber if you will. Its happening all over with younger people being indoctrinated into these kinds of grouos that have no idea how to be an adult or a good person but they know how to scream racist and fascist till the cow comes home not knowing what those terms really represent.
But then again ... so it is in todays Society. Humans devolve into something that they themselves said they are not going to the "dark ages" where a single Person can be hang up for things he didnt do and so on. Well today you just need to call someone out on Social Media and the ones with the biggest Drama / Mob behind them usually wins. Kind of ironic that the Furry Community acts as a some sort of Mirror to actually see whats so wrong with this Generation and the ones that come after us. If you dont get depression from that kind of shit you are really immune to that.
Anyway, thanks for stating what me and couple of friends already see and probably will get worse and worse with each year passed by.
This problem is not limited to only the Furry community. What Kothorix is describing is what society has devolved into nowadays. Social justice and political correctness, which now go hand in hand, have poisoned many circles of it, and now they're infesting this community too. It's become completely acceptable to get behind the mob mentality and viciously attack anyone who even remotely disagrees with them, and not stop until they've completely broken them or wrecked their reputation. They know they can do this because it's all too easy to hide behind their anonymity and escape ever being held accountable for their actions.
What doesn't help is that children are not even being taught right from wrong any more, or indeed any of the skills they need to be able to navigate society without having to always rely on others. Instead, they're taught that they're special and unique, and are pampered instead of being taught the harsh lessons of life. They often aren't even being punished for misbehaviour any more, and now you've got younger people who expect the world to give them everything on a silver platter without having to work for any of it, giving rise to the term snowflake. And if they don't get everything they want, they do nothing but spew their venom in a way that makes Veruca Salt look like the sweetest person imaginable. I know this because I see this on a near continuous basis in my real life job, and one of my former colleagues was just like this. Fewer and fewer people are taking any responsibility for their own actions, and even fewer people seem to know what common sense is let alone have any to speak of.
On or off the Internet, I refuse to engage myself in political discussions of any kind, simply because I know what they will devolve into. When I'm reluctantly roped into them, I try and remain as impartial as possible and look for ways to bow out while causing as little of a scene as possible. It's also reached the stage where I fully expect to get absolutely ripped apart when I make a story that features a female character as the main antagonist or otherwise committing terrible deeds. Everything has to be labelled 'sexist', 'racist' or what have you.
Seeing how out of control this whole identity politics thing has become has led to me becoming much less social on any of the websites I'm active on than I used to be, and now I'm on these sites simply to show off my writing, accept more business and post about my experiences at conventions. I even avoid getting into long conversations with people other than my friends. I've loved every convention I've been to so far and have always come alone, but I think the time will come when these politically correct imbeciles will find me at one of them and look for a reason to add me to their already laundry list of targets.
Probably because of one of the earlier points, I've been coming across people who cannot even tell the difference between fantasy and reality. A good example of this is what I saw happen to an artist I follow a few months ago. She was ripped to pieces all over Tumblr when she made a comic intended to poke fun at a ridiculous argument on Twitter about whitewashing human characters in relation to how a scene is lit. Then again, it's all you can expect from a vile website like Tumblr. Sometimes I question how mentally sound the social justice brigade are.
I do agree with what he says about what is termed as popufurs. Some of them are great to be around, but I've seen some who are among the most arrogant people I have ever come across. I remember seeing one such person lay into one of my friends during a stream, all because he wanted one of the sketch slots he was offering. He could have just turned him down, but he instead went on the attack, insulting his characters and encouraging his audience to attack him. Hell forbid if you give even the slightest criticism or go against their grain, since they'll set their fans on you if they don't go after you themselves.
Seeing the way that some younger members of the community behave makes me glad that I did not discover the Furry community until just under four months before my 19th birthday. In my adolescent years, I didn't even know this community existed. It's sad, but the way things are, I sometimes think of all the trouble I avoided by not knowing about the community until I got older. Some get into the Fandom much younger, and do so without understanding what it is, why it's so big or what it does. That's when you get them begging for free art or stealing it from established content makers when they're not attacking people.
Younger people might be open to more unusual things than the older generation were. But this means nothing when they haven't got the maturity to handle it.
Yes, it got toxic and disgusting overall, reason for me to stay at the border and watch while enjoying the content made by wonderful artists, animators, suitmakers and others as well as have nice conversations and discussions with other as normal BUT without making real connections to people.
It was bound to happen again and again, more people attract more wierdos and more trouble, which is why i prefer small groups in fandoms i enjoy and if i end up in a larger group, is stay more quiet and more distant.
Better safe than sorry, since i am not a chatter anyway.
That said, i am a furry because i want to as well as because i choose to be, the community does not force ma hand to anything of word or act.
Some people need to learn what context is and actually read whole sentences.
I just watch some art / porn every now and then, and let the dramaqueens fly by.
Ignorance is bliss. Getting involved turned out to be nothing but a drain of energy / mood.
So much different people together lead to a lot of different thoughts and that isn't even bad from my experience. The problem are all the arrogant popufurs, their boot lickers, the drama queens and exploiting idiots, who know no common sense and forget to use their brains. It is important to focus on yourself, especially with the negative experiences you made and I grant you just the best in your future.
Waiting patiently for change in the community doesn't change anything, I agree with that. I will try to do what I can to improve the fandom for the people who deserve it and I know they are there and deal with the same problems. It's unfair and I don't wanna sit on my butt and watch people suffer who don't deserve it. We all have good arguments and it's important we live our lives like we want and not like others want it. This fandom can be great, if we do what we can to save what is worth to be saved.
In my personal opinion I think it's just the same as with anything niche and nice. Once it gets too big there are going to be more annoyances, which only makes sense.
I think a big problem is how it's even easier now than before to throw shade with the help of social media.
The one really toxic thing I noticed about the fandom is the same thing I see everywhere else, the witch hunt mentality.
I remember when I tried to say I didn't really care about what, well, you did to come off as a 'bad person' because it didn't concern me but I was almost felt like I was shunned for not agreeing with how horrible it was. I still don't even remember what the drama was about but I guess as soon as a popufurs have a regular fight, everyone has to get involved like it's some damn schoolyard.
I lost my train of thought but to summarize my thoughts. I honestly don't think it's that bad and if it is... I'm glad I am way more focused on my real life and I hope things get better so people can enjoy what the fandom is supposed to be about in some form of peace.
But this journal (and Kothorix's video) just proves me more right. You guys are finally starting to see my point, whether you realize it or not.
For everyone GOOD in this fandom choosing to leave or distance themselves because they don't like the toxic people in this fandom, I have only disappointment in them and their cowardice. We could have and SHOULD have been forcing those toxic and criminal minded people OUT of our fandom as we should never have allowed them to be here in the first place. And I'm the ONLY one who's been saying this from the start.
I don't hate those who won't stand and fight for what's right and good in this fandom, but for those who are abandoning the fandom I have nothing but shame towards them. Kothorix included.
As a reference, I had the following to say to Kothorix after seeing his video saying he's leaving the fandom:
"I'm sorry to hear you've decided to remove yourself, someone who is a good person and a good thing in the fandom, from the fandom itself due to your dissatisfaction with those who are not good people and are not a good thing still being a part of the fandom themselves.
I agree with everything you've said in this video, but to be honest, those good people abandoning the fandom because they think it's too far gone to save are only killing the fandom faster. I've seen these types of people as a plague on our fandom for over a decade now, and I've ALWAYS said these people that are ruining our fandom should be removed by the rest of us, by force if necessary. And now those bad people are WINNING and getting exactly what they want, because good people like you are leaving and letting them have their way.
I've been argued against by so many furries that "You can't say someone can't be a furry just because they don't follow your ideologies", but this video and waht's been going on is just proving how RIGHT I was from the start. You CAN and SHOULD ostracize people for not following the greater community's greater good. We SHOULD have removed these toxic people from the start, but NO one would listen to me. EVEN you once said that anyone can be a furry no matter how bad they are, as long as they don't commit a crime. And what did we get for it? People committing crimes against nature and against humanity and they HAVEN'T been removed from the fandom, and you just RUN AWAY from it.
I'm sorry if this sounds like I'm mad at you or blaming you, and it's not your fault specifically. But I AM mad at US and blame ALL OF US for LETTING it get this bad. We could have, as a community, together constantly shunned and ostracized those who are toxic, but we've not been ballsy enough (well, everyone BUT me anyway) to outright say 'Those people are not FURRIES like us. Those people are criminals or would-be criminals and we do not support their actions. Those people are psudo-furs as much as trolls in disguise are not really furries or nazies cannot be furries because their strict idiology is strictly speaking OPPOSITE to our own.'
Frankly, if you want to run away from your responsibility to stand and fight against the toxic people in the fandom, then go ahead. But you should know, you're only helping the toxic people win."
It wouldn't be pretty, but it would be necessary.
I'm a solutions person, but those solutions require hard work and personal sacrifice to achieve. How dedicated is our core community?
And exactly! Giving up when others move in and try to take over has never worked in history for anyone, why should we as a community start now?
While I do feel like I was a bit harsh to call him a coward and say I have nothing but shame to him (I'd still like to have been his friend, not that he ever noticed me to start up a conversation!), the harshness of my words do not make them any less truthful.
I try not to be "brutally honest" most of the time, as I'm the type to try and focus on the upsides of life, but when I feel it's necessary to be brutally honest, I won't apologize for that brutality, because it was necessary.
nothings worth it at the dentriment to ones self.
Honestly if all goes to shit I can just say my fursona is like a mascot or a cartoon character I created. It was my excuse for a long time when I was too embarrassed to say I was a furry and wanted to show a drawing of mine.
Not hard to simply state "hey, that's not what I was implying, so please understand and correct this. Also you not listening to what I meant is aggravating me so I'm gonna go now bye" would be way better and simpler than "Omg *foams at the mouth* You lying scumbag trolling INGRATE. kjsjdkjn --- is that really nessicary? nothing he said was even remotely triggering to any sane individual - albeit a bit cryptic and weird - I just see a casual discussion. I can see where his impression came from - and his opinion is valid. You could easily disagree without going rabid. :)
there needs to be balance, "Firm Compassion" not just down right cruelty or apathy.
(Money) <--There's the problem i know it also more to it the people being greedy
but money normal never helps with stuff like this
But whats the end goal of all of this? Why accumulate so much power? what purpose does it serve?
The thing with holding so much power is eventually it results in the holder becoming paranoid about losing such power and will try to accumulate more, again such power is also ephemeral because it requires the power of others to enforce. Ultimately power is an illusion.
So whats the end goal? more money, more power? where does it end? where is the end goal? Utopia? Utopia of what? What is the answer? This is not a simple question and I'm not smart or articulate enough to answer it.
But the thing is society is not built on a power relationship it's built on a competency and cooperation relationship, but as soon it becomes a power relationship everything stagnates and self destructs.
We have tons and tons of historical examples about this and everyone keeps ignoring them.
Like it's not just greed, it's many things, too many to list accurately. One such item on the list would be humanity's proclivity for infinite stupidity.
but i agree it not just greed as i said before in my post it just don't help the problem
My Home is Sofurry & over the year's there been like wars from each website "Sofurry vs Fur Affinity" that was stupid, we suppose to be a family, no matter were we come from & in each family has there, odd balls, Drama Queens & Insane ones"
What I have seen is a lack of patients, tolerance, civility & understanding, lets talk but really talk to each other & try to find a common ground, not only for are benefit but to others as well & future generations.
Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations. IDIC
What we see today is not the fandom at its worst. This current toxicity is not, in fact, related to the fandom at all. This is a toxic generation raised by an apathetic, confused generation and liberally nursed on untested transformative technologies. You'll see the same social oppression bullshit wherever you go.
That being said, within this fandom I've been frequently swarmed by narcissistic assholes' cliques for failing to toe their line—and have been that asshole more than once—for over two decades. There have always been politics and bad blood here, but 'here' has grown. In the early days of Furcadia (late 1997-early 1998), the total number of unique players was somewhere around 50 I believe. Looking at the bottom of this page, the number of registered users online at this site right now is 12,222. There are apparently over 750,000 accounts here, tough it's hard to say how many are abandoned or sock puppets. Furry convention attendance in 1989 barely registers, but as of 2008 that number hit 120,000 with consistent exponential increase. Point being that we've got a lot of assholes because we've got a lot of members (er... phrasing).
http://www.flayrah.com/3498/furry-n.....andom-any-more
That's not to say that we shouldn't try to do better, but I don't think we're ever going to manage that as an entire subculture. We need sub-communities, but sub-communities with... let's call them "sustainable values." Reasonable tolerance, personal responsibility for personal issues, expanding your headspace to consider others', conflict resolution and encouragement of independent thought, etc. We need to create new 'cool spaces', and we need to defend what makes them cool from newbie erosion by limiting flexibility. Yeah, we'd be intentionally creating cliques, but they could be cooperative cliques based on principles rather than a narcissist/minion dynamic.
# social reform school for the wayward furs -2022.
Wouldn't be surprised....
I'm not really a furry imho, I've never wanted to be or considered myself one except that one time, because I was led to believe it was the only welcoming friendly place. (I was dead wrong.) people assume I'm a furry because I have dominately animal art and animal sonas. But that's because its literally easier for me to draw them and express through them - as humans feel so dead and watered down, I feel like animals can show way more expressions than people. Especially ones with more limbs such as dragons. (their wings tails etc.) Its quite possible a huge part of that comes from always being around more animals than people growing up.
They are a lot more commonplace, and vocal in general, not just in the fandom. Every convention I have gone to, and every furmeet I have been to, there has been at least one or two talking about the protests they have been in, or their hatred of people that will not accept their agenda as "fact" like they want.
If you couldn't guess, I am talking about SJWs. They have become a real problem and it causes a lot of the greymuzzles to groan and roll their eyes, and a lot of the furs (typically) between the ages of 27 to 36 to lash back at their forceful, and immature, nature.
The fandom was always about acceptance, but this particular type of "person" does not allow acceptance unless its their own way. This can be attributed to many things, first and for most bad parenting, coupled with social media, lack of thicker skin, and statements/situations that are twisted beyond their actual norm...
They are still somewhat of a minority, but they growing at a rapid rate, unfortunately. The best we can do is try to distance ourselves from the problem children (young adults), or "attempt" to guide them and help them grow a thicker skin. The word attempt is in quotes because its likely not going to happen.
Note: What I said has nothing to do with politics, please don't reply with anything related to politics...
Well done for you and Kothorix who stand up to speak out about it!
I like to now be the old man who ruins any cry babies fun.
I just hope that things do eventually turn around for the better, if not? Well...I'm waiting for the next 'mysterious package guy' on the news, to be a furry who then blames it on autism from eating a vaccinated avocado who's gender the fur assumed.
They're NOT what we represent. Furries are about inclusion, community, finding a place no matter how fucked up you are or what you get off to. I've seen this community at its best, I've seen good furs all over, even now, and I'll be damned (well, again...) if we lose sight of what makes so many of you great. Furries are a freedom from reality, an escape from how fucked up this planet is.
I have faith that the real furs of the world can right the tide of wrong flooding our fandom with hate. We're all misfits and fuck ups, but we're family for that exact reason. Which is a hell of a lot more than you can say for the pricks corrupting our image.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3pvzA6-tSqE
I actually questioned if aol still existed so I googled it about a year or two ago.
glad you're alive, even in this mad world there's things worth living and fighting (or not) for :)
also, i'd like to meet your kind - cuz they don't seem real to me (at least anymore).
We're what people nowadays call racists, sexists, homophobes, boomers and many, many other things, despite us not actually being any of those (people just like to throw around terms when you resist their indoctrination. "Submit or die". Such is society). You can't find us so well because we get roped in with actual bad guys, and then tarred with the same brush despite having only offended one person's false beliefs. We're treated as monsters despite not being them, but we inturn become them to push back against those who dare condemn us.
Never give up believing in people fighting to free this world of mindless fools. Because even if all of mankind gets swept up in the corrupted morality you see today, there'll always be someone who fights back. There'll always be a demon in the shadows resisting the angels that put him there. Never give up on us, cos we never give up on you.
Never let the future disturb you. You will meet it, if you have to, with the same weapons of reason which today arm you against the present.
--Marcus Aurelius
http://www.judexjones.com/wp-conten.....08/Snoopy2.jpg
https://pics.me.me/sull-gazing-com-.....a-19898881.png
And i dont know what toxic furries are (how they behave, act,....) but one thing for sure is there are alot more furs (young or old) tried to commit there passion, there interest in furries by spread their love with some fur artist, musician.... (of course with credits :3) to everyone they know, try to created their own art....
As for me, ill try to perfect my drawing skills and commit my own art and my fursona to the fandom because its the best way to make me happy and destressed after a long day of study.
sincerely.
Ehder
'Adapt yourself to the things among which your lot has been cast and love sincerely the fellow creatures with whom destiny has ordained that you shall live.'
-- Marcus Aurelius
I feel that in some situations, the best recourse is to destroy/dismantle the problem organization or subculture because that is the only viable means of attaining reform, just as the great fires of various cities facilitated their rebirth as a far better and stronger cities to a degree not possible if it remained as it was. Colorado's furry convention drama is a more furry example of this.
I feel you would be an excellent instrument to use in the general destruction of furrydom. Once that has been achieved, its horrified and enlightened remnants may reconstruct a better and more rational version. Or not. *shrugs*
Then again, why get so riled up? Sounds goofy to me, there's never been a "high" point to the furry community, or a low point. It's always been a constant state of embarrassing behaviour and guilt by association. Only advice kiddo is stop whinging and whining if you don't want people to react negatively don't say polarising shit, and just live and let live. You'll be a hell of a lot happier if you do.
Start by cleaning your own house, then you can come and complaint about things being dirty. Just saying.
Personally I see this as a "Woe is me how is myself, a creative, ever going to deal with cunts being cunty?"
Not everyone likes their job and you happen to have one where you can express yourself creatively, count your blessings, at least you're not rotting in a cubicle.
Ive noticed situations like this for awhile, and not just in the community but the world itself. At least for me.
They'll call good people bad and vice versa. But we can only work to improve ourselves and not be like them, the more of us who work for change the better.
And we should really routinely check ourselves to see if we're full of ourselves or not. It never hurts tbh.
In the last year I have had multiple attacks on my character, my life, my family history, my hobbies, who my friends are, what I enjoy, even my job. Ironically all because I ended a relationship that was going sour and tried to keep a calm and adult mindset about it, no need for drama right? In the real world yes, in the furry world, people all seem to just line up to try and attack you over anything they hear about you or make up about you.
why even attack a character smh... they're innocent creations, its the owners who are bad/good (i mean villain chars exist but like they're not even real?) lol.
- When a show/movie/preference/whatever is created, the fandom is born. In the beginning it's a small but humble place with helpful people who share the same preferences as you do;
- Along the time, the fandom grows up, becoming more mature and gaining more resources and becoming structured;
- The fandom grows larger, their object becomes popular and even more people join. However, some of these people don't even know why they joined them in the first place, mostly due to the hype generated by both the fandom and the object itself.
- More people join. This time around we get some really suspicious, shady people who want to ride the comet of success too and cash in on both the object and the fandom through any means possible;
- Even more people join. This time around we get all sorts of people: the good, the bad and the ugly come in;
- Along the time, the fandom becomes a mixbag of people, and eventually those kind and generous people leave the fandom because it starts becoming a cesspool of drama, hate art, drama, complaints and all other sorts of negativity going on;
- More people starting to leave too, and the former humble place becomes a black hole which consumes everything it comes close to;
- Rinse and repeat.
Its like business/food etc.
always tastes great or well made products , or very fun game - till it becomes popular.
Pokemon go for instance was awesome at the start and the mods seemed to genuinely want to own up for their mistakes and what not, now? all they care about is limiting you and taking your money and pissin at ya if you dare challenge them, because they are rich and people are already so closely knite communities and addicted. its really becoming pay to play and the mods can't even back their shit up half the time. Denying they can possibly do what literally dozens of other companies ones often smaller than them are capable of. its a sham. one being door slam to the face. a ppsychos world we live in today..smh
There are certain cases where a product became popular and didn't become a cesspool but those are the exception, not the rule since they tend to have smaller but united communities.
I support equality for all by nature, and just think we should see people as people - and not judge them by anything other than how they individually act, I've always been this way. apparently that makes me a bad person because I think you should respect your fellow human lol.
let em have their fun. just ignore it, because being concerned only gives them power and more drive to do it.
I've been a furry for a long while, if you want to know how long I've been around, well let's just say I cut my coding teeth with programming BASIC on the ZX81. I've been around. And around.
I guess I'm what you'd call a greymuzzle? And unlike those who're self-diagnosed, I've been clinically affirmed as autistic. There's always a way as well where you can tell an actually autistic person from someone who's erroneously self-diagnosed it.
The medical community recognises this as a real issue, since because of the inaccuracies out there about autism that have since been challenged (autism has no empathy, no Theory of Mind, et cetera)? Many other types of neurodiversity get classified as autism.
Notably ADHD and sociopathy.
With Sherlock offering its pop-culture take on autism (essentially sociopathy), and other forms of entertainment mediums either painting us as lacking any kind of empathy, we often get straddled with people who actually do lack empathy.
The way to spot a real autist? They feel like an alien and they don't want to be normal, they just want their differential nature to be accepted. That's key to what this entire post is about, which is why I had to cover it first. Autistic people accept that neurotypicals will always see them as extraterrestrials.
Here's my take -- which, like perspectives, opinions, and sphincters, everyone has one -- on the situation.
The toxic element is those who're trying to be "normal." An autistic person understands that "normalcy" is an innately pathological thing as it invites a hierarchy of bigotry classified as most to least normal, usually defined by whom is most similar to or least similar to the most influential human tribe.
The most influential tribe at the moment is straight, white, cis-gendered, middle-class, neurotypical, and able-bodied people. Therefore, that's the classification of "normal" to live up to. Anyone who fails is considered a subhuman troglodyte. Which, as I've mentioned, is fairly well observed by autistic people.
This hierarchy of bigotry goes to some bizarre places, though.
I mean, did you know how much bigotry redheads experience? They're considered soulless, ugly, evil, always belligerent, and it's said of the women that the only work they'll get is as prostitutes because they're sexpots. This bigotry has lead to the erasure of redheads using black people to cover it up. More black representation is good, so that's what you use as a sly cover for removing something you find less desirable.
And black people are noticing and they're not amused. It's not okay. Why not replace some of those handsome blonds or black-haired people with blacks?
It's the same with Trans, for example. There are too many Trans people who're bigoted against genderqueer folks and use transmisogynistic arguments to invalidate and erase them because they feel that genderqueer people impair their validity to "normal" people.
The whole concept of "normal" is a very toxic, bigoted, and cancerously hierarchical thing.
Saw it happen to Jasonafex recently. And I very much sympathised because all they were trying to do was cater to people who're under-served within the furry community.
Let's continue to air my abnormalcy (which I have found no small amount of pride in) and say that I'm a hypnofetishist. The "normal" furry objects to this. If I had a penny for every time I saw "You wouldn't have to hypnotise me with that body." I'd be more affluent, more stinking rich, than both Zuck and Bezos combined by now.
The thing is? It's not like that. It's about the whole sensation of it. And for me it's about giving up your will temporarily to another person that you trust. It can be liberating.
Plus, with telepathy, it's easy to understand the thinking and emotions of another person. Empathy is second nature.
Good touch-stones here would be the Tok'ra from Stargate and the Liir from Sword of the Stars. References for the nerds. That's where I come from with it, though. The thing is is that our own will, impulses, and issues are very difficult to control so sharing of minds can become an erotic factor.
It's about another person helping you to trust yourself.
Sadly, for most furries it's just force and rape. So that's all they'll ever see, they won't grasp that for some the concept of giving up one's will to another that one trusts and admires for a little while is an appealingly intimate concept.
And if someone has been miserable for most of their existence for reasons beyond their control, if another has a means by which to allow them to be happy? That can also be very appealing.
It's not always about hard domination, it's about stripping away things that make you unhappy, uncomfortable, and allowing you to be yourself in the presence of another.
And some of us would be happy to do oddjobs and errands under the influence for such a favour. As such, the whole hypnosis thing can have very different connotations for those who're very into it.
So this is all of my cards laid on the table, now.
I'm old, I'm autistic, I'm a hypnofetishist, I'm weary, and I'm incredibly tired of disingenuously "normal" people.
The kind of people who make the fandom toxic are emphatically not those who're abnormal, it's specifically those who will push to be "normal" who cause all of these issues by impeding the happiness of others in their quixotic quest to define this "normality" for the fandom so that they can enjoy it and feel secure in the approval of "normal" people.
I can't say for sure, but I feel comfortably confident that the kind of people who're bothering Jason are, say, the parents of autistic children who feed their kids bleach to try to "cure" them and make them "normal," or the parents who deny their children vaccines and physically abuse them because they don't want their kid to be some kind of "retarded alien" (yes, I've seen that said all too often).
If you want to know how horrifyingly, hideously twisted this horrific rabbit hole goes? Look up the Judge Rotenberg Education Center. Something that all properly autistic people know about.
Because we care.
It's basically a gulag for autistic children where they're physically, emotionally, mentally, and verbally abused with the end goal of making them "normal." Where acts of inhumanity like electro-shocks or making them vomit are considered justifiable because, for them, the end of creating "normal" children justifies the means.
This is what "normal" is when you're able to pull back and look at it objectively outside of the homogeneous circlejerks neurotypicals seem to enjoy so much.
The influx of "normal" furries has made our little fandom very ill. I remember the early days of Tapestries MUCK way, way back in the very early '90s. No furry was so concerned with being "normal" then. We were all hapless, happy weirdos and we loved it.
Seriously, what kind of ill do you have to be to consider beating "normalcy" into your children anyway?
Yes, it's bad for anything illegal to happen in our fandom, but it's intellectually dishonest means of equating abnormalcy with illegality. To the contrary, the most "normal" of people are often the most criminal of all. The deniers are almost always the doers of the deed.
I mean, there aren't any really, openly abnormal Ted Bundy types out there, eh? And that's my point. The vast majority of the people who're openly weird are completely harmless and safe. I've been alive long enough to know that it's the deniers you should be very, very afraid of.
I remember furry from what seems like a lifetime ago now when the only "normal" came from outside of our fandom. Something Awful judging us for being so bloody out there. And we were just having a good time, hurting no one.
It was a very different furry fandom.
The insecurity about not being "normal" is very specifically what's destroying the furry fandom from the inside. And it's depressing to watch it happen and feel so utterly helpless about it.
(Its also not fair to immediately discredit those who can relate with certain struggles/disorders etc. That may be the best way they can explain what they are going through, which is valid imo.)
ASD = Spectrum. Varied. There's been found to be many unique forms of autistim and the way these people afflicted act, feel think etc. So many factors define the outcomes, like who that person is by nature, what they go through, how they are raised, environment/culture, genetics, treatment, etc etc. There is literally no one solid way to be in anything, it all has ranges, shades.
I know quite a few atypicals who really hate functioning differently because they ARE so empathetical but just don't know how to show or express it in the same way and yes they were legally diagnosed over a course of time by licensed professionals. And anyone worth their salt who truly knows psychology would know there is never one solid definitive answer, just a stereotypical dominace/average/most reported cases etc. And there's always room for improvements and more discoveries. Also, you can't really tell if someones atypical all the time or not, that sounds very judgemental towards autistics/etc. And I'm sure most wouldn't appreciate this (some might.) some does not equal all , just cuz you and others you know are certain way or are noticeable etc doesn't mean others are and that kind of mentality has led to real people in real need being dismissed and invalidated. I am one of those people. And it really fricken sucks. Because I don't fit a certain text book image way of what people think me having certain struggles should be, because I don't "look" a certain way - I am treated as I don't have them. Which is the worst possible feeling imaginable. and I shouldn't have to whip out my legal private documents at every turn just to "prove" them otherwise. And, even some researchers /etc have found SOME people (not all as I'm VERY much aware of the over worried/fakes/atttention seeking people etc out there, and boy those people grind my gears but not EVERYONE is immediately that!)'s bodies/intuition what ever some how just know... and it turns out they were right once diagnosed. As my doctor said, some things , once you learn about them and yourself, become so obvious smack in your face and not hard to tell. People -can- become experienced with certain things through their lives without being doctors etc. Its how my dr became a dr actually, she had an innate knowing , talent almost, passion, and gained experience and decided to take it further. She has helped me more in MONTHS than ANYONE anywhere has in YEARS so that speaks VOLUMES. Idk what could be more legit and real and validating than that. You may not possibly understand. You're free to deny/disbelieve it all, but that doesn't inherently make you 100% right. - Fellow Atypical (with other things) here. Btw, many atypicals tend to have other things like OCD sociopathy etc, tied in with them. Professionals have found its very common where one has one, you're bound to have another. (not always though. its just very likely) it basically makes you more prone which makes sense considering its usually caused by a gentic line of unhealthy people and habbits/experiences/food. (etc.) so this COULD be causing a confusing overlap. But SOME Atypicals really do be struggling with understanding certain emotions and an array of other things, or feeling/responding in the same exact ways. The brain simply just functions different from another. That makes connecting between two differents very hard. it causes a lot of discourse isolation/alienation and pain. When you work so differently that people misunderstand you and immediately view the worst possible outcome, you can quite literally,, feel hopeless and alone. Not of this world or species even. Which could explain why many of these people turn to things like the furry/art societies, thinking it'll be more accepting but its not.
Remember: AN OLD DOG CERTAINLY CAN LEARN NEW TRICKS(Facts etc) and SHOULD! :) it can only do good.
-- And this is why most often than not , YOU NEED A LICENSED PROFESSIONAL who validates you listens understands the above and more, and knows truly what they are doing and REALLY take their time, cuz even so called professionals can be crappy and get it wrong. Take everything with a grain of salt, trust your guts, but know they could be wrong/etc. And nobody has all the facts. :) You'll become a lot more experienced and wiser, this way. ~best wishes, and good day.
- this. right here. the power of those words and that reality can't simply be put into words.
The damages it all has caused so many people, not just socially /business wise or even some going so far as to put people in deep crap IRL, but psychologically and emotionally too. Whole personalities have been changed. Once confident , outgoing, loveable people are now insecure, apathetic, reclusive or even aggressive. The amount of depression pstd and self harm these behaviors going on it causes are insane. I have to admit, I'll now discourage any youth from partaking in the social online community /convention aspect of it , for at least right now, because I legit fear for their health and safety in all ways possible. I actually admit I'm losing a bit of my interests for art and stuff because I like doing stuff where I can be communicatively involved, and these ones aren't looking too trust worthy or promising. That aside though, it seems as long as you just keep your distance and don't actually make anyone an official close friend etc, just short casual business style or something responses -focusing more on your work, generally lessens impact and isn't so bad most the time. But try to take it any further and you're pretty much doomed.. no matter what you do, what you say, what you meant or who you're with, someone will always find a way to beat you, anything u say or do can and WILL most def be twisted and used against you. thanks for posting this. More awareness and realizing the impacts we can all have on very real people which we often forget are cuz people think internet=not same as real life. (I've never supported nor understood this mindset, so its hard for me to see from their angle there.) maybe it will shift the views behaviours and reactions of at least some people, at least water It down and make them think twice. I hope things get better in the art/furry/rp/youtuber/fb etc communities, i really do. Bless to all, and try to remember we're all people with stories and struggles at the end of the day, and u never know what someones going through or why they're like a certain way or how your words and actions can affect them for better or often worse, and behaving poorly and aggressively does not make you a better person or even in the right. Be better.(not that your emotions are invalid, and its natural to wanna protect oneself when being unfairly treated, but there's a line.) You'll be a lot happier not stooping to others levels or engaging in drama. And if you truly feel someone is bad leave it to authorities, don't endanger/trigger others, or yourselves. Your post was really the kind of role model i needed, tbh. It reminded me of my old, confident, free, happy, better, powerful more successful self. How I've fallen since trusting toxic people letting them in and breaking (its messed me up. i feel like ruined damaged goods. words can not speak the psychological shift/damage its all finally done.) from all the abuse drama hostility gaslight guilt tripping twisting etc madness of all time, at some of the worst moments in my life IRL too... (that i wont go into.) I myself have neverreally been aa furry , it was pushed on me cuz i like and draw animals (because those are easier and i feel can be far more wholesome and expressive than people.) like not everyone who has animal sonas and what not are furries. lol. you're only if you choose to identify as one. you decide what you are --to me I'm just an expressive shape shifter/creative explorer. I don't do labels really. Only if truly needed. I come here for the art, not the furry fandom aspect of it all. Thank You.
Every community or fandom has its fair share of idiots who treat others poorly and expected respect after it. The Furry Community/Fandom isn't the exception and we can see it in any Furry Website like FurAffinity where we can see Greedy and Hateful individuals who treat anyone poorly.
They only join a fandom/community because they know they can make money because every fandom/community has people that will pay for a simple art. They also join for the sake to get attention because they have nothing going on in their life, so they just doing it to fill the void in their life.
So sadly some people only join a Community/Fandom for the sake to get money and attention because they have nothing going on in their life. They are arrogant since they believe that they are above anyone just because they have good skill in arts, or just because they are just Sore Losers that hates people who challenge them.
So, it's actually the minority. The vast majority of furries are really just civilians going about their daily lives and simply existing; they probably aren't even aware of online furry discourse most of the time because, they're typically more focused on having fun and enjoying cartoon animals and art, and labeling over 50% of the community as "evil" is an exaggeration; When I hear the word "evil," I think of someone plotting for world domination or desires to commit mass genocide while praising Heath Ledger's Joker
and/or time-skipping in Animal Crossing.You have to understand that Jasonafex and Kabier are very known for generalizing the entire furry community as bad people, hence why the title simply says "furries" and not "these types of furries," making it sound like they're saying all furries are toxic. Remember that podcast episode where they pretended to "quit" the furry community while they proclaimed that all of the negative stereotypes against furries are true, including stereotypes that they're all zoophiles, pedophiles, and just twisted degenerates who lack morals and engage in cyberbullying behavior just because? Well, they've been caught doing those very things themselves; multiple times, even. Kabier's zoophilia stems from a comic she made where a bunch of anthro characters engage in graphic sexual acts with a realistic feral dog that cannot give consent, and it's definitely something to question since the character resembles an actual dog they have, the pedophilia accusations come from Jason dating Kabier when she was a minor and he was still a grown man at the time, and they regularly engage in targeted harassment, especially towards people who are better artists than them who offer compensation for customers they've scammed. Not to mention the fact that most modern furries are children due to much of the older generation having moved on or passed away, most of which don't even own FA accounts.If you want to know more about their antics in addition to Peacewolf's involvement, I'd recommend giving this video a watch.
Deal
With
It