Woah, very protective, ain't he?

Overprotective in A way lol

Actually no, he's VERY justified. Gian clearly is a timid guy, and insecure people find it very hard to say "no" to what's asked of them. So naturally Jr. making him engage in dangerous sex in public places would make big bro furious, because Gian is not in his right mind and his oh-so-wonderful boyfriend should know better. These are things that could have terrible long-term consequences. I mean, they weren't even caught and Gian was still bullied just for being gay. IMAGINE what would happen if they were caught in that football field.

Eh, holding Jr. responsible for Olly and Mondo's actions is still unreasonable IMO. I understand Santino's position, but at the same time with the football field, Gian wasn't in a position to say "yes" or "no" since he was the one initiating the idea, not responding to it. That said, Junior, being the more extroverted one, should certainly be more mindful of being a good influence on Gian.

I think your final sentence pretty much says it all.

I can't speak for everyone, but I think the majority of the issue people are having isn't with Jr. forecasting future events and being an ever-present shield to Gian's physical well-being, as much as it is just wanting him to realize that he needs to take some responsibility in not letting Gian's love lead him into something dangerous.

If Junior's going to say he wouldn't let anything happen to Gian (as he did on the prior page), that must ring hollow given how close it came to happening anyway. Junior's making promises about things that might not be entirely within his control - and a promise broken because of what someone else does is still a promise broken; it's a promise that should never have been made.

It's all too easy to cross from there to blaming the wrong people, yes, but Junior does need to bear in mind that he can't be there all the time (and if he were, that wouldn't be healthy for either of them), and so he shouldn't be encouraging Gian to do things likely to get himself in trouble, whether by his own actions or merely compliance with Gian's.

Exactly. I admit to have forgotten that the football field thing was Gian's idea, but Junior should STILL have known better and said "no". He made a promise to protect him, and that should include disencouraging him from getting into dangerous situations. I'm not even talking about the incident in the bathroom, that's indeed beyond his control (although I agree with you that such a promise being made is a bit reckless considering reality), but accepting or refusing to do something dangerous with Gian was something FULLY in his control, and he has to take responsibility for that crappy decision, be VERY thankful that it didn't turn out bad for Gian or for himself, and endeavor to NEVER DO SUCH A THING AGAIN.

To clarify that I'm not holding Junior responsible for absolutely everything, I'd say that Santino needs to have a talk with Gian as well. After all, it was HIS idea to do a dangerous thing. His brother needs to remind HIM as well that it's reckless and stupid, so he doesn't rely ENTIRELY on his boyfriend's judgment for his own safety.

As I said in the thread just below, it's entirely possible, given that Santino knows about the incident in the shower room to begin with, that he has spoken to Gian and been brushed off. It'd be easy for people in Gian's situation to dismiss such concerns (especially if put anywhere near as bluntly as Santino has been here) as brotherly over-concern - not least because there'd be a grain of truth to that, but those concerns have some truth in turn that he might be less inclined to heed than he ought. BJ doesn't have that connection, and so might be more fertile ground for such cautions.

So long as Santino doesn't go so far as trying to split the relationship apart - which, despite how hyper-protective he's being, I don't get the vibe of here - Santino is dancing on the line but hasn't crossed it in my sight. Yet.

Edit to add: this is in response to RagnarFaerhir not Blaze_Ignitus. Dratted broken comment threading... thought maybe I'd replied to the wrong one the first around, but nope, it's just putting it in the wrong place.

I agree, hence my last sentence in my statement. That said, Santino should not be threatening only Jr. but also having a serious talk with his brother. Gian needs to be taught that he must take responsibility for himself. Laying all the blame on Jr. is still unfair in the cases where it was either A) out of his control or B) Gian who came up with the idea.

That said, it is an irresponsible promise. The sentiment is nice but unrealistic. A more reasonable promise would be for him to say that he would do all he can to protect Gian.

You're not wrong in that Gian should hear this... but would he listen to it, coming from his brother? It's very hard for most people to admit that there's anything wrong with their partner, especially when they're still in the thrill of a relationship's early stages.

It's also possible that Santino already tried to talk to Gian - after all, he learned about that attack from someone.

But yes. Santino is dancing on the edge of that line as it is, no disagreements there.

Well, it's been a year. I would hope that the honeymoon phase of their relationship will have passed by this point, haha.

The very early thrill, one would hope; I admit comic time is sometimes hard for me to keep track of. But even with that in mind, it's still the sort of thing that's harder to heed when it comes from someone too familiar. Especially if he's used to that someone being decidedly protective of him...

Ah, well. Santino's being a bit of a jerk about it, but I still think he has a valid point. I suppose what it comes down to is neither he nor BJ is wholly in the wrong here.

We must also remember that Junior was indeed called out by the coach and he had no idea that his boyfriend was going to then become a target of 2 bullies. There are going to be times when he can't be around to defend Gian.

My only thought here is Santino is extremely protective of Gian following the incident long ago when Gian got punched by a Donphan and his gang and he stepped in to the rescue.

After witnessing a relationship very much like this one turn abusive, I'm inclined to agree.
As I say down below, whenever one partner's ego becomes too overbearing, it can turn a loving and mutual "Daddy/boi" relationship into a "do what I tell you because I know better than you" one very quickly.

Naaaaaaaah! Definitly NOT JRs nature per say! Now if Sean, was his mate.........mmmmmmm I could see some relativity in that.

"INB4 GIAN'S BRO IS MEAN AND WE HATE HIM"

Great stuff man.

I looked up nii-chan and learned something new!

Santino

Am I the only one that finds Santino's protectiveness hot?

No you're not, it's hot lol

nope! love it myself.

Welp! That's Pure Brotherly love for ya! Looks like he'll thank TWICE on getting out A long relationship now!!

I know that Gian and Santino are really close, I wonder if their family lifestyle is somehow closer knit than others which is why he's so protective

They're actually twins, Santino being older by only a few minutes. Giancarlo also hasn't exactly had the easiest time of being gay. Read Dreamous' "Gian's first" It explains a lot of Santino's overprotectiveness.

I knew all that and I've read all of it too. I meant more about when Santino said there are things about their lives that he may not want to know but needs to know. Like if there's something we haven't been told yet

Yeah, funnily enough my mind went immediately to the Italian mafia.

Oh! I'm not the only one who thought that then!

Eh, I still call BS on this. Junior's being put on the spot over an incident that was completely out of his control to prevent.
I can understand Santino being over protective, but he's being very unreasonable. He has the best intentions, but yeah, I don't care for his attitude in regards to this. Past experience or not.

Dude needs to chill.

If it's out of his control to prevent, he shouldn't be promising it won't happen. Santino may be going too far, but there is a grain of truth to it.

And that's perfectly fine. Junior shouldn't be making promises like that. he can't be there for Giant all the time. he can't predict what will happen ( or what's currently happening right now while his back is turned ) He can just do his best to handle the situation as it presents itself.

Santino is a very hot headed person for sure. He reminds me of the 10 year old Ace from One Piece.

He's giving him an offer he can't refuse.

You actually got me to laugh with that. Such a great movie, that.

I actually rather like seeing Jr. dropped down a peg. I know he doesn't mean to be, but his cavalier attitude toward Gian and their love-life is supremely disrespectful and gives the impression that he is less serious toward Gian than he might actually be.

Having witnessed a "Daddy and his boi" relationship turn abusive that started out remarkably similar to this one, perhaps my bias is a tad skewed. But whenever one participant's ego dominates another, it's good have to have that balance restored by a healthy reality check.

Nevertheless, I still enjoy the comic. Looking forward to more.

lol "nii chan"

this comic is quite the amalgam of random shite

If I was BJ here, I would have been pretty offended. I probably would have said, "look dude, what do you want from me? Do you want me to be constantly paranoid about leaving him alone for a few minutes at any given time? It wasn't an excuse, it was things out of my control. I cannot be with him every second of every day out of paranoia. I obviously have more faith in him than you do. Shit happens, and I'll do everything I can to keep him from being hurt, but don't threaten me with your shit."

After reading this page I agree with everything you said. Gian is Jr's boyfriend not his child. When this comic series started I saw Gian as being very timid and insecure but over time I think he is becoming more confident with Jr's help. Santino needs to stop being the overprotective big brother and let Gian live his life. I am very curious to see how all this plays out and am of course enjoying the ride.

BJ is the one he said he wouldn't let any such thing happen, full stop. He was in time to stop it - that time. Next time he might not be. That was a boast that he deserved to be called on - for his sake and Gian's.

... Within reason. Just like in Finding Nemo, "you can't let nothing happen, or nothing will happen. Not much fun for little Harpo." Gian is not a child and I am sure he knew the risks on the field but some times the risks are worth it. I wonder what Gian would think of all this talk behind his back of him having to be coddled and protected ALL the time? Would anyone in this discussion be comfortable with being treated in such a way?

... and I want to see Santino taking a shower. He's hawt!

I never realized it before, but Santino and Diogo are kinda similar in the violent protector department.

C8

Just checking, is that a smiley face?

Yep!

Love that Arch Enemy T-shirt

Please god Jesus my body is ready for the next page pls

This is a mini review of the last few pages of the comic:

I'm a big brother, but I don't blame other people for my brother's choices, I let him know he messed up when he does. Santino strikes me as kinda like my grandmother, thinking his little brother is so perfect he just has to blame the other person involved because it's easy for him. He ignores everything that happened, the "excuse" as he calls it and cherry-picks he wants because he's too cowardly to place any blame on Gian himself. And spare me the argument about the locker room scene, Jr isn't a time god, nor is he a super hero. Gian chose to go along with everything, I'd say he's got just as much responsibility if not more since it's his body, his choice.

And that's what it all boils down to, choice. Let me try a simple example: If you've played any of the telltale games or until dawn, you'd realize choices can affect many things in the game, some good, some bad, the player is the who in control of the choices that are made, making their own decisions, should they not be blamed fro making a choice if it should turn out bad or should they just blame someone else because it's easier for them?

Now that I've burned the bridge between what I've said (which can be reinforced by simply re-reading the entire comic), and the weak arguments that Santino was in the right when it flies in the face of everything that happened throughout the comic, I'm done with my mini review, thank you for you're time. :)

I can't exactly say you're wrong. Scapegoating is a part o human nature. Yet I also have to point out that it is also partly BJ's responsibility to think with his head and not his dick. To think before you fuck as it were.

Yeah, their first meeting was way too fast. XD

Yet somehow they managed to make a decent relationship out of it.

Funny how that works out.

jesus calm your tits o.o
hes excuse was legitamite.

comic is getting good though.

I'm calm. sorry for not appearing as such.

oh no need to apologize. i meant the story XD no worries about it

It is getting interesting, that is true.

Arch Enemy shirt and a Behemoth poster? This comic just got way more metal \m/

Someone else realized this :D

i like him

It takes a special kind of someone to think having a boyfriend makes you their keeper and responsible for them as if he's a child that can't watch out for himself... It's also a very common cognitive distortion to blame yourself for something outside of your control or that you logically hold no fault in. Dick move...

Random insert of Japanese title...
Jr. is a weeaboo.

Um...it's not random. He's referring to Hanbei. Brazilian-Japanese Wartortle who was pretty much like an older brother to Jr. growing up. Hence his referral to Hanbei as "nii-chan."

Not everyone follows the side-stories (though they should. Good reads. ;P) so YuriMatsue can be forgiven for not knowing whp Jr is referring to.

Good correction Blaze, btw I hope there's a chance your OC's have a shot because I do like how your canine has red markings instead of the traditional yellow his species is based around and his hot roommate being an offspring of a legendary!

TBH, Santino sounds like me, when my parents aren't paying attention to my sibs.

A little too much don't ya think Santino? Well that's just overprotection for ya. I personally don't like it but I can understand the need. Still, to threaten someone who is kind to him because of something he couldn't control I feel is a bit much...

bowser seems to have developed puppy eyes all of a sudden!

He expect to coddle him his entire life? He got called away by the coach! He didn't know that would happen. At the time no one knew about there relationship and that guy just assumed he was gay from the earring.

Dat Santino. Kind of a dick, but we love him all the same.

He deserves a spin-off. Or at least a bonus strip or something. A day in the life of Santinto. hehehh

Hm, no. Santino's still being an unreasonable asshole.

Jr. has a valid point in that he was called away from the coach before Gian was attacked. Absolutely nothing he could have done about that and Santino dismissing that fact as an "excuse" is just way too similar to how idiots ignore facts and logic and insist "no, you're wrong." Not to mention that the incident was BEFORE Jr. and Gian were out about their relationship and their sexualty was unknown to their classmates. Gian was attacked because Ollie flipped out over a goddamned earring. Yes, he accused Gian of being gay because of the earring, but for fuck's sake, he freaked out over an earring! Not because of Gian and Jr. being obvious and risky in their relationship

Nobody could have predicted that someone would have that reaction in a roomed filled with people, even if it was the showers and nobody can constantly protect someone else. It is not reasonable to demand that Jr. protect Gian 24/7 and it is a seriously dick move to suggest that the relationship should end if he is unable to do so.

The reasonable thing would be to insist Gian learn to defend himself in case something like that happens again, not shit all over someone for things they can't control.

Santino activatet Man Mode...it Hits Critical,

Holy Crap im so sorry for BJ :(

Behemoth! Yes, very good taste in music!

Creepy Mafioso vibe going on. Hm.

Oh crap, you just made me realize a thing XD And I think that this was kinda foreshadowed to in Gian's First and Fresh Start too. It's kinda unlikely that this is the case, but here goes. (Also, I haven't read the source material in ages, so people feel free to point out mistakes or inconsistencies that I make.) At the end of Gian's First, Nathan's mother sent the poor Yosh off to a Christian boarding school and Gian was fucking heartbroken as a result. His parents and his brother all came to Gian to console him. Now fast-forward a while later to Fresh Start. It turns out that Nathan's mother was killed by a random burglar while she was all alone in her house.

Now comes the theory. The Gay Theory~ *shot*

What if Gian's family DID have mafia connections? What if they put out a hit on Nathan's mother for effectively breaking their little boy's heart? And what if the hit was conducted in such a way that made it SEEM like it was random, when in actuality, it was COMPLETELY intentional? I'm sure I'm probably grasping at straws, but it kinda makes you wonder 'what-if'. Also, this -could- be unrelated, but I'm thinking it syncs up just a liiiiiiiiiiiittle too well to be pure coincidence... On page 13 of The Last Wager Part 1, it's mentioned that Diogo is researching the Italian mafia. If Gian's family DOES have mob connections (which he seems to be potentially foreshadowing here as well), then methinks there's more drama bubbling beneath the surface of this comic than just this one moment~

Don't fuck with Santinos lil' brother or he will your children

Of course he would like Behemoth lmoa.

Yeah, I'm with everyone here. Sure, Jr needs to take a tiny bit more responsibility at times. And Santino is kind of admirable for wanting to look out for his little bro. However, Gian is not Jr's or Santino's BABY. He's a grown-ass man, ffs XD Jr can't realistically be with him every minute of every day because shit like this that happens out of Jr's control will still happen, of course. But you'd kinda have to think that Gian's a mature enough man now to be able to make his own decisions and handle himself to an extent (with a little help from his boyfriend if necessary, like in the locker room). And I would understand being overprotective if Gian was just completely naive and Jr was trying to take advantage of him. However, this relationship has been going on for a YEAR now. The honeymoon phase is over now, so I'm certain that if Gian was told something realistically, he would listen.


...Oh, and speaking of Gian, I'd like to point out the potential irony of the fact that while THIS shit is going on, Gian is being hit on in the other room, potentially causing some more shit to happen BEYOND JR'S CONTROL, WHICH SANTINO HAS -JUST- BEEN HARPING ON XD Ooo, da dramaz~ They ensue~ >:3

Well if that isn't a confession that Gian and Santino's family has mafia connections, I don't know what is.

I could be wrong here from what I see in the comments. But Junior saying he will always be there for Gian. Doesn't have to mean he will be there in person, for Gian, when something bad happens.
Being there for him, also includes being there for him AFTER an incident have happened. For Junior cannot know or always be there for Gian 24/7, much like Gian himself cannot be there for Junior 24/7.
Gian can very will be out on a simple trip for groceries and while that's happening, Junior could be at home, doing something like finding a job etc. Where he then gets jumped by someone.

I can understand Santino wants to protect his brother, nothing wrong with that. But he is being very over-protective and unreasonable with Junior, which is very wrong.
I'd say yes Junior should be careful with what they do, so neither one of them gets into unnecessary trouble, but aside from that. He's done literally nothing wrong.

Gian is an adult, he will be in many situations where he'd have to make his own decisions and there is many changes for him to get into trouble, by either putting himself out there or then it happening out of nowhere like being mugged.
Just my two cents on this. I know its badly formulated by English isn't my primary, so I apologize if I repeat myself to much or have worded things a bit weird.

Very well said on all accounts.

Awe, Junior and his big ole red puppy dog eyes.

As an Italian myself, that smells like "la famiglia" ;) I'm curious to see how a 'Veemon mafia family ' plays out. Bring on the "Don ExVeemon" in a suit, hehe.

Oh boy, Jr's face on the down panel, like a innocent creature that hasen't do anything wrong. Hahaha.

Behemoth \m/

did he just threaten to kill junior i'm scared for him

I think that Santino was implying that he would have beaten up Mondo and Olly himself.

I think further, in his bio pic ( http://www.furaffinity.net/view/2230613/ ) he is a fencer so he could do something about the problem. Also does anyone wonder what he ment by things you many no like comment?

Mmmmph, I really love how Junior's muscles expand his shirt in that middle left panel. <3

Story's starting to get very interesting! Glad to see that there's much more involved with the plot and characters than mere sex, which is what a lot of other popular artists do. Keep up the great work. ^^

Damn!

hark!

at least santino wasn't rejecting beej!



santie was.. ..just "aggressively" welcoming BJ into the fold..

..?

right?

Behemoth \m/

Justified or not, Santino is quite the drama queen. Lol

Wonder how Santino's going to react about hearing his dearest brother being hit-on by his class mate while lecturing said brothers boyfriend?

People here are taking Jr.'s promise, a very common AND NOT NECESSARILY LITERAL colloquial phrase, and using it as evidence to Santino being in the right here. That is just ridiculous. It's very off-base. Santino is being controlling and abusive towards Jr. here, literally expecting him to take responsibility for things out of his control. Regardless of anything Jr. said, ever, trying to make someone take the blame for something wholly and demonstrably out of their control is textbook abusive and manipulative behavior. There's no way Santino comes out of this looking like the good guy. He is essentially gaslighting Jr. and then keeping him aside while something happens under his nose, something Jr. can't prevent SPECIFICALLY because of Santino. Honestly it wouldn't surprise me if Santino orchestrated Sean's actions to coincide with this "talk" with Jr. specifically for that purpose.

Santino is so totally in the wrong here. It's textbook manipulative and abusive behavior, and the people defending his actions are honestly concerning to me, because to me it's not exactly subtle that Santino is supposed to be very much intentionally in the wrong.

oo hidden family secrets nice

2edgy. So which ones Sausuke now?

I was rereading this and came to that asterisk... I went back and read all three parts of the story and... omg. Santino just became my favorite

--JuV

Ya dun gonna screw up soon, DJ.

I love how cute Sal makes Junior look now.

Whoa, Santino suddenly with the mafia implications. Seems he might be 'hardcore' in more than just his musical tastes.

This is stupid but for some reason I always feel bad about myself when I see Santino.

This is a stupid confession but I actually have a lot of... not so great memories with this comic. I started reading the first arc at a difficult time in my life. I just got out of a bad relationship (my first boyfriend whom I came out to my family for) and see Gian and Jr find true love within hours of meeting each other left me... envious. Then came Santino. He's like in some ways everything I wan't to be; emotionless, physically and sexually perfect, willing to literally kill to defend someone and not seem to feel anything about it. I see these characters and I think "Perfection", something I'll never have nor ever be.

I've never said this online because I fear outraging the fans or WORSE, offending the creators! Their work is marvelous and a gem to the furry community, not to mention the crew themselves are great people. But because I associate this comic with a dark period in my life and therefore an extremely deep rooted self loathing I can disconnect and just enjoy the characters and story for the gem it is.

#EDIT: I'm kind of tipsy right now so I'll probably delete this later.